Freeman’s Arm Tells A story
October 8th, 2012
In recent days, Joe’s brought you various takes, including those from former Bucs Shaun King and Booger McFarland, who disagree with how Freeman has been handled by coaches.
Joe checked in with former Bucs quarterback Jeff Carlson (1990-1991) on the subject after the Redskins game, and Carlson weighed in saying Freeman is having mechanics issues and Bucs coaches are waiting too long in games to have Freeman go to his strength, pumping balls downfield.
“It’s those short [throws], the square-ins and the curls, and the other types of routes that the backs do that he’s going to throw in front of them a little too far and behind them a little too far. He’ll put them on the money sometimes but he’s going to be inconsistent. And that’s his issue. That does come down to mechanics. But the reason he’s bad is because he’s unsure of what he’s doing, ” Carlson said.
“You can see the way he pulls his arm back. The quarterback should extend his arm out to the receiver. He kind of flicks it and pulls his arm back to himself. That just means he’s not confident in what he’s doing.”
Joe wonders along with everyone else about what is really driving Freeman’s inconsistency and apparent lack of on-field confidence.
One thing Joe does know is that Freeman would benefit greatly from a sound running game. The Bucs are averaging a terrible 3.6 yards a carry, 24th best in the NFL entering last weekend.
October 8th, 2012 at 8:44 am
Jeff Faine is doing GREAT with Cincy.
Imagine if we had signed him back and shifted Zuttah to guard.
We would be a totally different team right now.
Also, Vontaze Burftict is now STARTING for Cincy.
Anybody wish we had drafted him instead of ‘Drake Dunsmore?’
October 8th, 2012 at 8:58 am
Jeff Faine would have made this team totally different? He wasn’t some pro bowl talent. He wouldn’t have helped this team much at all in this situation. Zuttah is playing fine at center and Joeseph is our starting guard, he just got Injured.
And not drafting the troubled Burfcit was a sensible move. A new coach trying to instill discipline doesn’t need a, by all accounts, troubled and undisciplined player.
October 8th, 2012 at 9:03 am
Jeff Faine is NOT doing GREAT with Cincy.
October 8th, 2012 at 9:16 am
Freeman has a unnatural look to his throws for sure. Is this self induced or over coaching? I’m not sure but it is possible, for a new coach especially, to come in and try to “fix” a problem and make it worse.
October 8th, 2012 at 9:17 am
This is pretty much what I have been saying all along. Carlson hit the nail on the head this time.
The confidence will come as Freeman grows comfortable with the new mechanics he’s being taught (also what I have been saying).
Listen…I know this is hard on fans who want results right away, but patience is the name of the game in this instance. Josh is 24…a month older than Stafford.
Sanchez turns 26 next month.
There is plenty of time left for Josh to grow and become elite. When he reaches the age Sanchez is right now, well if he’s not doing very well by then I can understand getting a little panicky.
But, as I’ve said, he’s young. He’s got 10-14 years of playing time left.
October 8th, 2012 at 9:22 am
Send freeman to the chiefs for a 2nd rounder and draft Geno Smith next year..
October 8th, 2012 at 9:28 am
Amen nate, let someone else figure out whats wrong with him, After four seasons, I dont think he will get it right anytime soon, there has to be something in him, does he have the talent, sure, but he cant put it all together,
October 8th, 2012 at 9:33 am
The furthering of the Fantasy Football mentality to the real game, just get rid of your guy and the next one will do great and when he fails, just get another one… Fortunately our new staff understands that this is not how to build a sustainable winning franchise, patience, practice and more patience. New systems take time to install, and please don’t point to RGIII or Luck or even Newton, RGiII is still not running the full Shanahan playbook, he is still using many of his Baylor read-options, Luck is running the same exact offense he ran at Stanford and we all see the regression of Newton as they ween him off his Auburn playbook and onto an NFL one.
October 8th, 2012 at 9:36 am
jfro sux. end of story.
October 8th, 2012 at 9:43 am
RGIII’s Baylor-read option got him a concussion in yesterday’s game. This is a different level folks!
October 8th, 2012 at 9:51 am
I’m of the opinion of letting Free feast or famine this season. Let him play and if he doesn’t improve then move on in the offseason. I don’t really care if he’s 24, he’s had four years in the NFL and shouldn’t be having to rework his terrible mechanics by now. He seems to have regressed further from last season and he’s actually been coddled compared to other QBs. They already have Sanchezs replacement waiting in the wings. San he’s has to actually compete for his job while Free has no competition.
He needs to get it together because Schiano isn’t going to hitch his wagon to a guy who after 4 years, still has bad mechanics, can’t go through progressions, and has a hard to reading defenses pre snap. Freeman has all of those issues plus he is hesitant in the pocket, stares down receivers, and now people are saying he only feels comfortable throwing deep. Sadly you can’t come out in the NFL and be successful at QB if you cant complete short and intermediate passes.
It’s time to put up or shut up. Can anyone really make the argument of sitting around waiting for 6 or 7 years hoping that the terribly inconsistent, quarter to quarter Freeman gets it together? That’s not realistic. Developing players is key in the NFL but part of development is improvement. I don’t think anyone could describe Free as improving. Performance wise he appears to actually be regressing. He’s got 12 more games in my opinion. Play well or he should be riding the pine next season.
October 8th, 2012 at 10:03 am
@Jbrooks8604
I agree to a point, I have said all along that we probably won’t see any real improvement in the offense until the second half of the season, it’s going to take at least that long for everyone to understand their role within this new system, as well as what works and doesn’t work, just because it looks good on the whiteboard doesn’t mean it’s going to work on the field.
October 8th, 2012 at 10:29 am
I read the comments every time I come on here about how much Josh Freeman sucks, we should trade him and draft Geno Smith. I watch Geno Smith game against Texas, and he had all day to throw the ball. Only a few times I saw him pressured and he handled it pretty well sometimes. The fact that he is doing great in college, but there is no way that he will have 5 seconds in the pocket to make the throws that he’s making college in the NFL.
Trading Josh to Kansas for a second seriously?? I would consider it if we had a chance to draft Geno. Geno will most likely be a top 5 pick and I’m pretty sure that Oakland or Kansas City will have that pick by the current standing. The top QBs will be either Matt Barkley or Geno Smith with the next QB not far behind so for the Bucs to have a chance they will either have to lose the rest of the season or trade the following years first and second to get into the top 3.
If Cleveland continue to lose you will have to break the bank to get that pick out of them and we all know how Oakland and Kansas City are desperate for a good QB. See how Jacksonville is playing I wouldn’t be shocked to see them trying to get a QB if they are sitting up there.
October 8th, 2012 at 10:33 am
Can people stop saying he’s been in the league for 4 seasons, he’s been in the NFL 3 seasons with this one being his 4th which he is only 4 games into.
October 8th, 2012 at 10:37 am
Freeman isn’t going anywhere and he will be re-signed. The only question is for how much and how long…he determines that with his play. No way do the Bucs rid themselves of a 6’6″, 235lb QB with a cannon for an arm, fairly mobile, with excellent work ethic and whom stays out of trouble.
That doesn’t mean they can’t draft a QB to push him and co-develop, but who are they going to draft that steps in right away? Another read-option QB? Please, because Cam and RG3 aren’t exactly lighting it up. Where’s the Cam love now…dude sucks like I said he would.
October 8th, 2012 at 11:02 am
anybody thinking we have a conclusive read on this team before the tail end of the season is jumping the gone. coaches are figuring players out, players are figuring systems out, everybody is being asked to do things they’ve never done as a pro. if you use the last wave of newbies (2009 bucs) as a benchmark, the quality of what we are doing on and off the field is simply worlds better. as far as the guy who says we should’ve drafted burfict….shall we recap how many starters and playmakers the bengals have lost to the legal system over the years? how many seasons have been damaged by undisciplined or me-first players? i don’t think cincy is the model for anybody
October 8th, 2012 at 11:05 am
Everyone forgets that Freeman is still young. The Bucs have a history of giving up on young QB’s that have gone on to do great things. It’s not uncommon in this league for a QB, especially a QB to mature and develop. AMany Hall of Fame/Pro Bowl QB’s took years to develop. Terry Bradshaw for one was terrible his first 5 or 6 years.
October 8th, 2012 at 11:08 am
Chicken Joe,
Just to confirm, you are talking about the same Freeman that had the Bucs up 14 points against the Giants in the fourth quarter and then tied the game again at 34 after 58 minutes correct? And unless the satellite was on the fritz, there was a guy named Freeman who also walked off the field with the lead against the Skins the last time I saw the Bucs play. Is that the same Freeman that you are referring to post after post after post? I hope not. Because if so, you are certainly in the class of fan that Trent Dilfer was referring to yesterday when he talked about how dumb NFL fans have become. Times have really changed. Used to be the case that under the loss scenarios I just mentioned, the average 3 year old would see that the QB played well enough to win and the defense did not. Chicken Joe, here’s my conclusion, you either have no idea what you are watching, or you’re a really sophisticated two year old.
October 8th, 2012 at 11:09 am
wow, multitasking fail….i meant to say “anybody thinking we have a conclusive read on this team before the tail end of the season is jumping the GUN.”
October 8th, 2012 at 11:12 am
NjBuc
Vick had the eagles up against Pittsburgh yesterday. Do you think he played well? Was it because of Vick they were in the game?
October 8th, 2012 at 11:26 am
Carlson is saying the same thing I’ve been saying for weeks now: LET… no, MAKE Freeman take the top off of these defenses by throwing the ball deep and do it EARLY. That’s the only way he’ll build some confidence — by playing to his strength!
It’s hard to fit a square peg into a round hole. Not saying that he won’t eventually come around, but as for now, let him do what he does best. It’s not like we don’t have the receiving corp to make it happen.
If it’s done more frequently, then the only time we should see 8 men in the box against our offense is in obvious situations. Throwing deep would provide more room for Blount & Company to work.
October 8th, 2012 at 11:49 am
@Jbrooks8604
Well Josh do not have the luxury of a running game like Vick does and a good defense. They give up random big plays on defense and bad clock management which is more along the lines of coaching issues. When you give up 100 yards rushing to rookie running back and 325 yards passing to a rookie QB in the SAME game there are some serious issues with defense, which cannot be blamed on Josh. Yes his play may be inconstant, but so is the whole team.
October 8th, 2012 at 12:30 pm
In a sober moment look at the Bucs upcoming schedule, mix in a few key injuries and think about the Little General’s infamous halftime siestas and stubbornness, do you really think they win another game?
I watched the Brownies play on Sunday, they’re not bad, sure to win at least 4.
Besides possibly setting the All-time NCAA Touchdown Per Season Record (61), Eugene Smith won a oratorical contest for reciting the works of the poet, Langston Hughes. He’s also a competitive chess player and a perfectionist. Much too smart for the Tampa Bay offensive non-scheme.
In a nationally televised interview he explained how he considers each and every game a chess match. He has certainly has demonstrated his superior intellect and physicality week after week.
He currently has 24 TD’s to 0 ints. He would never say it himself but his receivers dropped a couple sure TD passes on Saturday. Dropping his TD average per game below 5.
Mark Dominik will be able to command a king’s ransom for this highly sought draft pick. Maybe some desperate team that wants to win now will offer a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th to move up a spot or two. That’s the growing trend and Geno might just be the finest QB in NCAA history.
October 8th, 2012 at 2:58 pm
Joe here,
@NJBuc – First, insulting Joe is a great way to be banished from the site. Second, Joe is taking pity upon you since you are so reading challenged. In this post, Joe delivered an analysis on Freeman from a former Bucs quarterback. The only opinion offered here by Joe in this post was an aknowledgement of Freeman’s inconsistency and that he could use a better running game. So you’ve assigned opinions to Joe that don’t belong.
October 8th, 2012 at 4:57 pm
Michael Vick has 14 turnovers already but the Eagles are still above .500. If we had a winning record none of this would even be discussed. People act like we have had a long list of QB greats that have played here. I think Freeman will be fine and eventually get it. The kid works hard. I have faith he will become who we need him to become. Some of you need to chill out.