Paranoia Running Rampant
August 22nd, 2012
In a perverse way, Joe is enjoying how many Bucs fans are still reacting to a preseason loss. Why, Joe even had a fan Twitter him last night adamant that the preseason game Friday against the Patriots is a “must-win game.”
A preseason game, no less!
Joe vividly recalls the first team defense having three three-and-outs to start the game against Tennessee. How much better could they play?
And the first team offense left with a touchdown on the board. Not so bad, right?
Apparently, wrong. It seems after the second- and third-teamers got worked over, Bucs fans were racing to the Sunshine Skyway Bridge and re-upping their memberships with the Hemlock Society.
In fact, new Bucs coach Greg Schiano is already having some fingers pointed at him, and he has yet to coach his first regular season game with the Bucs. Alan Dell of the Bradenton Herald has yet to be won over by Schiano.
It proves something we already knew: Discipline is like fool’s good, and talent and heart are a lot more important.
Schiano’s Napoleonic method of coaching still has his players’ attention, but if the team doesn’t show an improvement in victories they will tune him out.
We don’t want to panic. This is only the second preseason game, but the Bucs’ psyche is extremely fragile. It won’t take much to send them back into the abyss.
Hold up! Yes, we are just halfway through Schiano’s first preseason and just one week after training camp broke. Time to ease up.
From many of the veterans Joe has spoken to, it appears all have welcomed Schiano’s attention to detail. Shoot, Aqib Talib and he are buds now.
Let’s see what happens come November before diving into the mouth of Tampa Bay.
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:15 am
First string defense allowed 7 points, 28 yards passing, 32 yards rushing, had constant pressure, caused three 3 and outs, and had an interception ran back to the 1 yard line.
The in came Orvlasky, turned the ball over twice in our own redzone with a fumble and an interception and the game got out of hand quick. Plus the Titans left their first stringers in for the entire first half against our 2nd/3rd stringers.
Many fans, and sadly some sports writers just don’t understand what preseason is all about.
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:24 am
Team is still in a 10-game losing streak, last I checked. Needs a couple of confidence builders, especially with a new head coach. It doesn’t take much to lose the team (ask Raheem who had a team of quitters).
Besides, team needs to sell tickets as well. Good showings in preseason will bump up sales for the regular season.
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:25 am
I’ll admit I made the mistake of overreacting to the loss against the Titans before I looked at the replay of the first quarter a few times. I’m reserving ALL judgement about where we are as a team until Sept. 9th around 7:00pm. I just hope there’s plenty of positives to focus on!
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:30 am
I try to be objective about preseason games realizing that they don’t count and at best it’s just individual player evaluations under forced or intentional situations to get an idea of how players respond. As fans it is sometimes difficult to see that because we’re accustomed to real game performance.
Having said that, I’m not really concerned about the final score, but I do get concerned about individual performances under fire. That includes the 1st team, back-ups, and players hoping to make the squad. And after 2 evaluations (not real games), I came away with this conclusion.
We have talent on both sides of the ball but it’s not deep and we’re new, really new. We have new coaches, new schemes, new starters and new attitudes. This is simply a matter of time and maturity – learning to play together. So my advice is to not panic, but to set realistic expectations. This is going to be a good team but it will take some time.
My final observation is whatever we do this year will be determined by our offense and primarily Josh Freeman. At this point I have no reason to believe that Freeman can’t do it this year, I simply haven’t seen enough to be assured that he can. Schiano said that a few things went askew when they tried to get the ball deep to Jackson and the Titans were playing a 2 deep zone. Rather than forcing the ball to Jackson, which he caught, I would have preferred Freeman come back to the sideline and said “I tried to get it to Jackson, but it just wasn’t there, coach”.
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:32 am
On the hot seat before he even sits down?
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:37 am
It is silly to worry about the Tenn loss so much. As pointed out, the first teamers did pretty good. Not perfect, but pretty good. And we already knew our depth was very poor. It is a huge problem with this team and will take a few years to sort out imo.
Frankly, I think we’re ahead of where I expected us to be right now. Real games will be the test.
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:41 am
Dude, you write for the Bradenton Herald, you’re never going to win a Pulitzer, calm down and just be happy you get a media pass.
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:10 am
But this guy is in tune with the team’s “psyche”. He must know what he is talking about!
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:10 am
Im going to just flat out say it. Whoevery thinks Schiano is being to “tough” on his players, your just a little b**** and you’ve never played sports before. This isnt some f****** pee wee football league or soccer, this is the NFL. Man up or shut up. GO BUCS!!
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:16 am
Joe, you and Jessup hit the nail on the head. If we wanted to win, put the first team in the fourth quarter, but we wanted to evaluate the players to see who to keep and who has to go, plus what do we have and need.
It is just like the Titans keep their 1st team in the entire 1st half against our 2nd & 3rd teams. If you want to see how a 2, 3, or whatever teamer plays, put him in his position with the 1st teamer so the person is being evaluted. Some if not all of Orvlasky’s turnovers were due to the OL. He was hit before he finished leaving the center, but we saw how he did under pressure and can fix things with him.
So the game did what it was suposed to, have situations and see what happens. Even the coaches learn from it.
So until after the first real game, we will not know what we have or need for sure, after the first four games, we wil know what we have and need.
I think some of the fans need practice and coaching also so they know that whoever fires first doesn’t always win, it is who fires last.
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:17 am
Im sure Schiano could leave his starters in for extended periods, run the best plays in our playbook and blitz like hell on defense. Kind of of like Spurrier used to do in the preseason when he coached the Redskins. Remember when Spurrier ran it up in preseason winning games like 45-10? Funny how that didnt happen when it counted.
Schiano has a plan. He obviously wants to see our backups get plenty of work now so when they are called upon in the regular season they are somewhat ready. Quit taking a glorified scrimmage so seriously.
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:30 am
FLMIKE,
Those were my thoughts. Isn’t the Bradenton Herald the newspaper the homeless sell at intersections to get around the “no begging” law?
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:40 am
Our team is good except for the dline. There is a serious problem there.
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:40 am
We can’t win every game….and who cares about pre-season wins. The fact that Schiano can hold press conference without sounding like an idiot makes him a winner in my books.
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:16 am
I really don’t know why Alan Dell has a job. Living in Bradenton, I can tell you that he only occasionally writes on the Bucs (maybe 12-14 opinion pieces per year) and they are always negative. I believe he is a fan of a division rival.
I live right down the street…I can’t tell you how many times I’ve considered applying for a position to write about the Bucs there. It shouldn’t be hard to replace a guy that bad.
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:20 am
Only in Tampa Bay, where wood screws have more intellect than the local media and a majority of the “fans”.
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:32 am
The first reply to this post by Jessup sums it up. It’s the preseason, the first team is looking solid, not perfect, but not at all bad and certainly not panic inducing.
I’m looking forward to the Pats game, blowout or not, I think the Bucs will come away learning a lot about themselves as a football team having gone up against a team that appeared in the Super Bowl last year (a team that also looks to be better than last years Super Bowl appearing squad as well).
Let’s just relax. I want to see Freeman throw for 350+ yards and hook up for long TD’s with Vincent Jackson as much as any Buc fan, but I’ll wait to see the performance in week one before I start thinking about pressing the panic button. For now, I hope the team makes it out of the preseason injury free and ready to roll against Carolina.
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:49 am
Pre season is all about fans overreactions. I’d like to see the team play a lot better since the taste of a 10 game losing streak is ingrained in my memory but the starters have looked good in limited action. No depth is a telling sign of a GM who doesn’t know how to draft and construct a solid roster.
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:50 am
Hell, it took the Great Tony Dingy 2 seasons to get it going. I expect nothing but constant strives at improvement. The ship was simply out of control the last couple of years. Even that 10 win season they still seemed to win by the seat of there pants. That season just proved to me that they had misused talent. Get over the paranoia people. If you expect anything more than a few extra wins this year you are setting yourselves up for a let down. These same nuts will be calling for Schiano or players heads by the end of the season if the
Bucs aren’t leading the division. Stupid. Give the boys a chance to put it all together at leasta full season before we start freaking out. Go Bucs!
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:55 am
An Alan Dell column isn’t even suitable for fish wrap let alone anything else. How the man is employed as a columnist is beyond me.
August 22nd, 2012 at 10:59 am
Nah its good enough for fish wrap. Also good for starting a fire and packing dishes. That’s about it.
August 22nd, 2012 at 11:09 am
I think Alan Dell is just early in his assessment, others will flock to his argument. First let me correct his and Joe’s miss-print.
“It proves something we already knew: Discipline is like fool’s GOLD, and talent and heart are a lot more important.”
My concerns started a lot sooner than Friday’s 2nd half. When I first saw the Little General’s Napoleonic Complex, I gave him that name. Dell has now correctly identified that condition. A Napoleonic Complex is not a good thing to have especially when you need a true leader in a position of great importance, instead you have a little mini-tyrant posturing in front of the mirror (media).
“Schiano’s Napoleonic method of coaching still has his players’ attention, but if the team doesn’t show an improvement in victories they will tune him out.”
I wish I could remember that new Buccaneer motto, I think it was, “Honesty, Integrity and Accountability.” Sorry, I’m just not seeing it. The players aren’t seeing it and now we will all start doubting it as the team gets dis-mantled game by game.
They are in the midst of a double digit losing streak and coach has ever won in the NFL.
There is a lot of dis-honesty and no common sense being applied.
A) Donald Penn was a little over weight and out of shape. Common sense would dictate that you would bring him into camp at the first opportunity, take control of his diet, exercise and weight lifting program. By the time camp was over, he would be well on his way to another Pro Bowl season and would have gained a valuable lesson in professional life.
Instead, they threatened him with impossible 110×16 sprints in the Florida heat. The worst thing that could happen, did happen, he tried to become a 375 lb sprinter and injured his calf. That kept him out of camp, supposedly, but not really.
He was the starting LT, he was given special consideration, and allowed into the practices and classrooms but did not have to do the hard stuff. Then, when the NSO saw that they needed him on the field, they gave him a clean bill of health and waited for just the right time, to sneak him through the torture tests when no one was looking and now, he is the starter.
B) Stocker- The handling of his condition certainly lacks honesty, integrity and accountability.
C) Price- Ditto.
D) Briscoe- Ditto
E) Winslow- Ditto
I could go on and on, but I won’t bore you. I wish I could rest my case with the Bradenton Herald’s confirmation but, in truth, this case is in it’s infancy. It’s a tiny spitball beginning to roll down Mt Hood’s snowy slope, gaining momentum and mass as it rolls.
Belicheat’s timing couldn’t be worse. He actually rested his top players for this spanking of his protege like it was the playoffs. Playoffs??!!
August 22nd, 2012 at 11:10 am
Ok il agree with the premise.
However, I must remind everyone that the Joe(s) and others spent weeks explaining that last years preseason debacle against the Pats was due to no game planning.
As it turned out, it was a measure of things to come.
August 22nd, 2012 at 11:11 am
never won in the NFL.
August 22nd, 2012 at 11:30 am
miguel pequeno,
you keep acting like you know what is going on behind closed doors. you are a nobody to the bucs’ organization. you poor, little man. shouldn’t you be off driving that clown car?
August 22nd, 2012 at 11:56 am
Jockstrap Grande
Wah, Wah, Wah, he’s never won in the NFL….Wah, Wah,…Guess what? He’s never LOST in the NFL either! Give the friggin man a chance!
August 22nd, 2012 at 12:02 pm
Michelle Pequeno is just like Thomas 2.2, making predictions that will never come to pass and then focusing on something else when that happens in order to draw attention away from the failure of their predictive skills. Out of one side of her mouth she implies agreement with the fact that the preseason is not predictive, but out of the other side she then proceeds to make predictions.
I’m to the point now where I will treat Michelle just like 2.2: skip right past her posts when I see her name since nothing worthwhile is written nor ever likely to be.
August 22nd, 2012 at 12:13 pm
You’re right Joe. I only paid attention to the 1st quarter of those 2 games. Then the 1st half of these next 2. Everything else is testing for the final roster….and other plays to see how they will come together.
August 22nd, 2012 at 12:39 pm
[OK, Joe’s done playing around. LightningBuc, that’s twice in two days you claim some illegal act by a former Bucs player. Three strikes and your out. And if anyone refers to something happening untoward at the Bucs Super Bowl — too many know what Joe is referring to — it will be an automatic banishment. Just don’t go there. Period. — Joe]
August 22nd, 2012 at 3:36 pm
Miguel,
Napoleonic Complex? General George Patton had that look and look what he did to Germany in WWII. True Leaders of Men have a Napoleonic Complex and leaders of Children have the Big Bird Complex. What would you rather have in dealing with Men, the Napoleonic Complex or the Big Bird Complex?
LMFAO…
August 22nd, 2012 at 6:53 pm
Miguel,
First of all, you are 100% wrong about Donald Penn. He was not hurt doing the conditioning drills. He was hurt 2 days prior. He passed the conditioning test on the first try and he is much slimmer than normal. Players aren’t allowed in the building until camp opens, so they couldn’t do those things you suggested. So basically you are completely full of sh!t.
August 22nd, 2012 at 7:33 pm
Joe,
My post yesterday was something the Tampa Bay Times reported on several months ago. I didn’t claim it as you allege, I thought it was common knowledge. Sapp owes almost a million dollars in child support(at least at the time of this article) ACCORDING TO A NEWSPAPER YOU REGULARLY QUOTE as well!
http://www.tampabay.com/sports/football/bucs/the-play-by-play-of-warren-sapps-59-page-bankruptcy-filing/1225135
August 22nd, 2012 at 7:58 pm
“A) Donald Penn was a little over weight and out of shape.”
First… Penn was injured B4 the test
Second… Every other lineman offense & defense passed the test
(some took 2 tries, I sure, but they passed)
Third… No one complained about it, except those were long gone , at the time
they spoke up
Forth…Penn has a history that suggests attention to his weight is in order, and
to HIS credit, he’s evidently responded well. I doubt, seriously, you’d
get Penn to complain about Coach’s ‘Napoleonic Complex’, nor could you
get him to thank you for standing up for his poor, pathetic , little but.
The last was sarcasm, he can & will stand up for himself, when he feels
The need.
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:03 pm
@Eric,
Yes and no. If you look at what happened against the Patriots and how our season ended up, then yes that is true. However, we started out 4-2, beating both the Saints and the Falcons. Even by your own admission, we weren’t terrible at that point. Something happened after that and it was all downhill from there. It has been proven time and time again that preseason success, or failure, has almost no correlation to what will happen in the regular season. The Redskins beat us 40-10 in the third game of our preseason in our Super bowl year. The Colts routinely went 0-4 every preseason, usually getting blown out in each one. I don’t care if we beat the Patriots by 50 or lose by 50, it doesn’t mean jack when it comes to what kind of a season we are going to have.
August 22nd, 2012 at 8:21 pm
Joe here,
@lightningBuc – You essentially made Joe’s point. Much of the stuff you wrote may not currently be true and it was written as fact. We don’t know who the bankruptcy court may or may not have paid, or who Sapp might have reached a settlement with, or paid directly.
August 22nd, 2012 at 9:24 pm
Got it Joe! Love the site! Didn’t think I was doing anything worth censuring as it pertained to the Sapp article and just having fun with Miguel and his story. Point taken and will abide by your wishes!
August 23rd, 2012 at 12:12 am
The only thing that worries me is Freeman. He still is throwing the ball in double coverage, still telegraphing the pass, still checking down on passes and hasn’t completed a pass over twenty yards. If I’m not mistaken, I think v-jax has one pass this pre-season? I’m starting to lose hope JUST IN FREEMAN, not the team as a whole. I know it’s only the second game of pre-season, but free looks very much the same….
August 23rd, 2012 at 12:08 pm
@houstonbucs
I think what happened last week was they were trying to rectify the previous week’s lacks of passes to VJax by trying to get him the ball. But we know from experience that when Freeman is trying to get someone the ball (ala Kellen Winslow) he ends up forcing things that aren’t there as well as looking too intently at his primary receiver.
They need to stop worrying about getting any particular player the ball. Hell, if Mike Williams ends up with more yards this year than VJax I’m totally fine with it. Whoever’s open should get the ball, and Freeman shouldn’t have to worry about any particular receiver one way or the other. What I noticed against the Titans was a focus on VJax and that’s just unacceptable. Those old habits need to die, and die fast.