BSPN On Bucs Edge Rush: No. 32
August 17th, 2024
Edge rush woes.
Sometimes, Joe swears some of these stat guys don’t watch games.
Joe understands that is a vile indictment on them, but really, when someone doesn’t watch games, it shows in analysis.
Mike Clay of BSPN, a spreadsheeter, is overall not wrong about the Bucs’ sack production from the edge. However, invoking how the Bucs will miss Shaq Barrett is a big giveaway that Clay is a Red Zone kind of NFL fan: content with offensive highlights, not games.
Because anyone watching Bucs games last year knows how much of a non-factor Shaq was.
Shakiest: Tampa Bay Buccaneers
This position is in flux after Shaquil Barrett (45.0 sacks in five seasons) departed and replacement Randy Gregory ghosted the team during the offseason. Tampa Bay will now turn to a combination of Yaya Diaby, second-round rookie Chris Braswell, underperforming 2021 first-rounder Joe Tryon-Shoyinka and Anthony Nelson as its core at the position. None of those veterans played more than half of his team’s snaps in 2023. This is a rough situation for a team that finished 17th in pass rush win rate last season (40.4%).
“In flux?” Shaq was invisible most of last season with 2 1/2 sacks in his final 12 games. He finished last season with a total of 4.5 and nothing in the playoffs, not even a tackle or an assist. That’s less production than Joe Tryon-Shoyinka.
However, the overall focus of Clay’s take on the Bucs is not crazy. The Bucs have a shaky pass rush off the edge. Clay ranked the Bucs dead-last, No. 32 in edge rushers).
Anthony Nelson is good off the bench and against soft teams he can produce. Physical teams? Fuhgettaboutit.
YaYa Diaby has the Bucs excited about what might be. We shall see if he can take the proverbial next step.
José Ramirez has been flashing in training camp. Perhaps he can graduate from the weekday warrior level to make the final-53?
Joe Tryon-Shoyinka, Joe believes, has a short leash to demonstrate he has the NFL figured out, maybe six games to show he’s a different player than he has been so far in his three-year career.. If not, Chris Braswell will replace him.
As for Braswell, the Bucs like his pass rush so much that the Bucs haven’t made that a focus for him in training camp. He’s spent a lot of time on other aspects of the game. Joe isn’t expecting much if anything from his rookie year. That’s not a slam, rarely do rookie pass rushers not drafted in the first round blow up their rookie seasons.
Markees Watts, Joe has barely seen him in training camp. He showed some promise last year in very limited play.
And, yes, MIA Randy Gregory is still on the roster (reserve/did not report list).
So yeah, that’s banking on a shaky bunch of young guys despite nobody demonstrating they can produce double-digit sacks.
As Joe likes to say, until you’ve done it, you haven’t.
August 17th, 2024 at 6:38 am
In hindsight JL should have switched bust-JTS and unknown-Trask in the 2021 draft … Trask first round and JTS second round … That way we would have a 5th year option on Trask which we could use depending on how this seasons pans out but instead we’re going to lose him to another team 100%.
August 17th, 2024 at 6:44 am
Joe … ‘that’s banking on a shaky bunch of young guys despite nobody demonstrating they can produce double-digit sacks. As Joe likes to say, until you’ve done it, you haven’t.’
Obviously a true-statement bottom line Joe, but our primary 4 DE/OLBs … JTS (Rnd 1), Braswell (Rnd 2), Diaby (Rnd 3) & Nelson (Rnd 4) … aren’t bereft of talent by any means & they ‘fit’ Todd Bowles defense very well.
Last season our Top-4 DE/OLBs (substitute Shaq for Braswell) provided 20 of our total 47 sacks; I’m convinced that our Top-4 can exceed that this season. Last season our Top-4 provided 54 of our 136 QB pressures and 29 of our 91 TFLs; again, convinced that this season’s Top-4 can exceed that. And probably quite convincingly. The bad news is that they’re young. The good news is that they’re young.
August 17th, 2024 at 7:24 am
Anyone mentioning Shaq (or Devin White like I’ve seen) in their analysis of why the Bucs will be bad are immediately dismissed by me.
It’s exactly like last year’s “expert analysis” of “They only won 8 games with Brady…….Baker, 4 teams in 2 years…”. With the national people, whether it’s written or the squak shows, you get two choices. They can only talk about 5 teams and will beat the same subjects into the ground (Is Dak elite? Let’s discuss it for the 47th time). Or, if they talk about your team it’s Googling their name and scanning the headlines.
August 17th, 2024 at 8:20 am
Based upon last year’s numbers and players, I agree, Bucs are ranked at the bottom of the NFL. I know “potential” is a dirty word, but based upon this year’s edge rushers, one can’t help but to be excited. I doubt we’ll be in the top ten but my feeling, we will be somewhere in the middle of the pack.
August 17th, 2024 at 8:34 am
Horrible! This will keep the Bucs from getting to the SB. YaYa looks like he is injury prone, JTS is a total joke that should have been a UDFA. Braswell is a rookie that may or may not develop. Ramirez has a motor and is a better player than JTS by a mile. Nelson flashes on occasion and is a good backup. Bottom line is that we don’t appear to have the next JPP or Sim on the roster. Bucs need veteran help and maybe tonight’s game will show that.
August 17th, 2024 at 8:38 am
Why give Plan 9 6 games? Just get him out.
August 17th, 2024 at 8:44 am
Plan 9’s pic above plays ..I mean looks like a nun.
August 17th, 2024 at 9:04 am
Bucs ranked 8th in the league in sacks per game @ 2.8! Good thing our coach is able to apply pressure from other parts of the field.
August 17th, 2024 at 9:17 am
Let’s give Simeon Rice a shot.
August 17th, 2024 at 9:46 am
Licht will look super smart or dumb in regards to the edge rusher situation this year.
August 17th, 2024 at 9:50 am
The edge rush will come from Diaby, Braswell (by November) and occasionally Kancey-
Shoyinka, Ramirez and Nelson provide depth.
Bucs may add a player before the season starts- they have some cap room
Bowles will design some safety blitzes to make it interesting
Past production is only an asset if the player is still physically capable
August 17th, 2024 at 9:51 am
The Bucs should start the great and powerful Trask at edge rush since he’s the best football player to ever put on a pair of cleats. At that point they would probably be ranked number one overall.
August 17th, 2024 at 9:57 am
Licht was pretty honest in saying that after free agency and the draft this year there would still be weaknesses on this team. Edge rusher is one of those areas. Bowles is pretty good at masking his deficiencies on defense for the most part so right now I’m not too worried about it. Best Bucs fans can hope for is that one of the young kids develop quickly and help to create formidable pass rush this season.
August 17th, 2024 at 10:10 am
Ok so we don’t have an absolute monster on the edge, Shaq did nothing last season, but we still had a good sack number on the season. And and we went into the playoffs. And what sucks the most is, once again, paying people to sit on the sideline and watch. If anyone should be upset it should be the coaches and the front office. So everything else is just a bunch of Crying for what real reason ?? NONE. I for try to look at the positive side and hope for the rest to get with it or get down the road. All the excess blah blah blah about something JL and TB are content with makes me want to go find someone’s office and let them know they sound a lot like one of my EXES, so take a midol and play judge jury and executioner at the house. It’s bad enough that the whole NFL hates us, all my life, and yeah I was eight years old when they gave Tampa a team.. Let’s Go Bucs!!!!
August 17th, 2024 at 10:23 am
We still won’t know tonight because not many starters are going to play. Maybe next week.
I’m not going to focus hard on any particular thing tonight. It’s a big pain in the butt. I’m just going to watch the game and enjoy.
August 17th, 2024 at 10:27 am
They are not wrong and the whole shaq angle is irreverent. I think it was kind of foolish to think José Ramirez and watts Nelson were the answer to compete with a rookie. Even worse damn Randy Gregory was his anger to bringing in a veteran. He deserved that ranking.
He’s clearly not to compete for anything other than winning the nfc south title.
August 17th, 2024 at 10:43 am
I would say ranking the Bucs pass rush at #32 before the season starts is accurate. They have not had a chance to prove differently yet. That means they have the opportunity to surprise teams.
August 17th, 2024 at 11:03 am
Calijah Kancey is our best hope for a consistent pass rush, every real Bucs fan knows this.
August 17th, 2024 at 11:25 am
Really glad Todd the masturmind is trying to help Braswell be well rounded by not having him hone his pass rush against NFL competition. Nothing like never practicing something to get better at it. At least Rachaad White isn’t even running the ball in practice, given how everyone expects him to improve behind a real OL.
#AsToddSameOldSameOld
August 17th, 2024 at 12:37 pm
When your best edge rusher has 7.5 sacks and the next best sack guy is your safety with 6 then your edge rush is absolute garbage. Don’t have to watch a single game to make that determination.
August 17th, 2024 at 1:52 pm
Hard to argue against his reasoning.
August 17th, 2024 at 3:21 pm
Ring of honor GM?
August 17th, 2024 at 3:58 pm
Meanwhile the Falcons go get Judon from the Pats. The Bucs have money to spend, they need to make a move
August 17th, 2024 at 4:00 pm
You know how you keep Gregory from spending any of his money?
Hide the money in his work boots
August 17th, 2024 at 4:16 pm
bucnjim Says:
Bucs ranked 8th in the league in sacks
^^^^^
Beat me to it.
Ranking the Bucs top 10 pass rush 32nd is as bad as ranking our WR #15.
August 17th, 2024 at 4:23 pm
If you just look at a depth chart, it’s hard to make an argument the Bucs are in good shape, and all national guys do, who aren’t watching or pay close attention to things are doing is looking at the depth chart.
But in any case, why people get so hung up on this stuff, I have no idea. I love rankings because it gives you a baseline to compare things to – and a general idea of the perception of the team. If YaYa becomes a star player – like I expect, and some combo of edge rushers on the other side play well enough to not be noticed in a bad way, then the perception will change and they’ll go up this meaningless ranking chart.
August 17th, 2024 at 6:27 pm
Imo lb has been the strength of the franchise, no draft c as vital needed. Always tpp to elite.
Inversely edge has been a sunk cost.
We have been a great defensive franchise and have always invested in edge. Yield is cursed.
Wally chambers trade cost us dan hampton
Lee Roy’s back.
Keith mccants
Broderick thomas
Chili
Curry
Gaine
tge iowa guy
3 lucky trades including Shaq, Simeon
Not much yield.
Joe us right but I still hate to hear it.
Not the coaches,
Just one of those things I guess
Maybe dave pear knows
August 18th, 2024 at 9:10 am
what about all the draft pics ?
August 18th, 2024 at 3:50 pm
Time for a poll on head couches.
Bowels, number 38.
August 18th, 2024 at 6:41 pm
I’m shocked. The pass rush is bad. Why don’t we pick the usual scapegoat? The pass rush is bad because of Baker Mayfield? Thanks, Joe for putting a story out there that discusses other aspects of an NFL team. Here is another bulletin: unless Bucs defense can get the other team off the field instead of giving up 8.5 minute drives, it will be difficult for any QB –including the beloved Trask—to produce points. Bucs defense has to get 3 and outs for the overall team to thrive.
August 18th, 2024 at 9:10 pm
JL has had 10 years to draft a pass rusher…… still waiting