A Winning Center
March 7th, 2024
Free agent center Mitch Morse.
This is for the blame-Robert-Hainsey crowd.
The Bucs’ two-year starting center is not popular with fans. Joe doesn’t know how popular Hainsey is with the new offensive regime or Bucs shot-callers in the front office.
Joe does know Hainsey had strong, vocal support from former Bucs assistant coaches now with Carolina. So Joe has no idea if new offensive coordinator Liam Coen has the same high opinion of Hainsey.
Joe has seen Hainsey open up enough holes to know he’s not horrible. But the Bucs’ run games stinks. Joe doesn’t care that Rachaad White nearly had 1,000 yards. His yards per carry is sorry; worse than in 2022. And White’s yards-after-contact-per-attempt ranks a miserable No. 50 in the NFL.
But, people are quick to absolve White and blame Hainsey. No, Joe doesn’t get it, either.
Now last week in Indianapolis Joe point-blank asked Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht if Hainsey is to blame for the underperforming run game or White. Licht sort of danced around the question but did admit that the Bucs may need new personnel up front. He wasn’t specific.
This brings Joe to a guy thrown to the pavement yesterday – former Buffalo Pro Bowl center Mitch Morse.
Since Morse was drafted by the Chiefs in 2015, he has been a starter. He’s only played for two teams: Kansas City and Buffalo. He’s been in the playoffs in each of his nine seasons.
After signing as a free agent with the Bills in 2019, Morse has missed only five starts. And Morse has also blocked for two future Hall of Fame quarterbacks (yes, Joe thinks Josh Allen is that good).
Now here are the negatives: Morse is on the wrong side of 30 and he basically is the same size as Hainsey.
Morse probably won’t be cheap; Hainsey is entering the final year of his rookie contract.
So basically it comes down to this for Joe: If the Bucs have Hainsey graded in the ballpark of where the Bucs’ pro personnel department has Morse graded, then they may as well save Team Glazer loot and keep Hainsey.
Again, how does Coen grade Hainsey> Remember: Hainsey’s biggest supporters are now in Carolina. Time will tell what Coen thinks of Hainsey.
March 7th, 2024 at 4:09 am
Hainsey is serviceable but in the long haul, he’s too light in azz. We should sign veteran center and draft an interior guy.
March 7th, 2024 at 5:23 am
I think Licht believes in 2nd and 3rd round lineman but he has shown he will go out and get an Elite guy like Jensen. IM thinking they may even trade for a better prospect than Morse and draft another in round 2 or 3. I like adding Huff in FA and a bargain ILB and S. Trade Carlton and add either WR or CB in round 1.
March 7th, 2024 at 5:43 am
Joe … ‘But, people are quick to absolve White and blame Hainsey. No, Joe doesn’t get it, either.’
Here’s another possibility: It’s BOTH. And oh ya, possibly our LG also. Realistically though, you can only fix so much in a single year due to salary CAP constraints.
Fix 1: Hainsey had some good plays, but he also got thrown into the backfield far too many times. MAYBE he’d do better at LG? If that’s the case, find a new Center and move him to LG. Mitch Morse made almost $10 mil a year under his latest contract with the Bills; not sure the Bucs would want to invest that much in a new Center.
Fix 2: Add a quality bruising RB to complement Rachaad. I like Chase Edmonds, but he’s not the bull inside runner we need for short-yardage and goal-line situations. The Packers’ AJ Dillon would be my preference (6′ & 247 lbs with 4.1 YPC average, solid receiving skills & excellent availability). Market Value listed at $3.5 mil and I’d say he’d be worth that.
March 7th, 2024 at 6:01 am
Hainsey is the 34th ranked Center in the NFL.
I wouldnt say throw him away. He looked good a Guard.
He didnt look comfortable at Center.
Let Hainsey fight for a backup guard Job.
Sign Morse, as I suggested yesterday.
Then Let Jason Licht find us a small school center to groom.
Obviously our run game was bottom of the league. If we give Mayfield a running attack, it will greatly improve our offense.
Morse and a New Guard would be a huge step.
March 7th, 2024 at 6:18 am
So in your logic Joe, what’s the difference between 20/21 season vs 22/23 seasons regarding our Oline? Our entire interior got re-worked, right? It’s the primary reason for Brady’s last dreadful season. Call it the eye test, but since Jensen’s been out this Oline in run and pass protection has not been the same. Yes, Marpet was a huge loss as well.
That being said, if they do decide to replace Hainsey, then that truly answers your question on whether it was Hainsey and/or interior Oline or White, and perhaps not a little a both. My money is that White has been playing more years at RB than Hainsey. The center position just might not be the strongest position for Hainsey.
March 7th, 2024 at 6:36 am
Hainsey is a great guy but we need an upgrade at the position desperately.
Add left guard to that as well.
March 7th, 2024 at 6:40 am
“Blame Robert Hainsey crowd” aka “the oline got pushed around all season and couldn’t run block for sht leading to the worst rushing attack in the entire league….again”
I feel seen!
March 7th, 2024 at 6:56 am
Pass…..Licht has an eye for linemen, he finds solid players under small school rocks. No need to sign another 30+ yr old.
March 7th, 2024 at 7:11 am
Watch the 1st Philly Game.
Watch the play the Bucs got a Safety. The DT pancaked Hainsey. Hainsey isn’t strong enough. Great backup but a liability as a starter.
What can a strong Center do for you?
Rewatch the Philly game. Watch Philly’s “Tush Push”. A play was created because the Center was dominant.
Not rocket science, Joe. Just open your eyes and watch the game.
March 7th, 2024 at 7:14 am
Blame Hainsey crowd or is it that they have eyes and have seen the run game for 2 years stink
March 7th, 2024 at 7:14 am
Get an established G or C in FA. Draft the other position and a DE in the 1st and 2nd rds along with a power RB in the 3rd and a TE in the 4th.
Hainsey is a very good backup G/C or low end starter. Bucs should always be looking to upgrade less than average starters.
Salary cap is limited for the Bucs so you may only get 1 or 2 FAs. Also should be looking at TE, RB, ILB and #2 S. Needless to say FAs we get will impact who we draft.
March 7th, 2024 at 7:31 am
Just draft the best C prospect this year and move Hainsey to LG.
When’s the last time we ever drafted a C?
I’d say it’s time.
March 7th, 2024 at 7:41 am
@Bucsguy. I totally agree with you. Go Bucs!
March 7th, 2024 at 7:42 am
If they get a shot at JPJ then there’s no excuse for not taking him at 26. I’d also take Barton if JPJ is gone
March 7th, 2024 at 7:44 am
Tyler Biadasz and Lloyd Cushenberry are younger and possibly better options, but will probably cost more.
March 7th, 2024 at 7:45 am
hainsey has grown into the position as serviceable center…
only problem is his lower half can’t really grow any more…
let licht and crew sniff out a small school center in the 3rd or 4th, and hopefully grow into the position without dumping cash on morse or anyone else right now…
upgrade at LG, and with mauch hopefully settling in, it should make hainsey look even better,,,
also as the 2 bookends settle in even more, the line can hopefully stabilize…
and so what if hainsey is the weak link for a season…rachaad can’t see a hole anyway lol…
March 7th, 2024 at 7:58 am
We r in perfect position to draft one of the top e Centers, which will be a mainstay for the next 8 years. Simple solution, don’t overthink it.
March 7th, 2024 at 8:04 am
We need some SEC linemen. Generally speaking, you get what you pay for. So if Licht only wants to spend a third round pick on a guy, well we got a third round guy. Might be time to get a first round guy in there.
March 7th, 2024 at 8:07 am
Buddy is an Eagles fan, worships the grond Jason Kelce walks on. I think he’d give Kelce one of his kidneys should the need arise.
Thing is, Kelce and Hainsey are nearly the same size and weight. (Reid, coach at the time , saw something in him) Kelce was horrible for his first 5 years or so, didn’t become a dominant center until after he turned 30. Did he get stronger? Did he learn better techniques? Dunno
March 7th, 2024 at 8:14 am
Joe must have not seen Rachaad White get hit before he could even cross the line of scrimmage enough times to know our run blocking is horrible
March 7th, 2024 at 8:26 am
we need depth pieces on both side of the line and edge rushing… get that and keep or FAs in house and lets ride
March 7th, 2024 at 8:40 am
Man I’m excited for the draft. There seem to be a lot of solid O-line and rushers that fall in mock drafts.
Hell Jared Verse was in a CBS mock to us today at 26. I would freak out lol.
I’m beginning to think my dreams of Powers-Johnson at C may be unrealistic tho. I won’t be surprised to see that guy go like top 15 based on the hype around him.
March 7th, 2024 at 8:48 am
Not a bad signing if they wanna draft a OG in round 2-3.
March 7th, 2024 at 8:56 am
Hainsey could be better if he put on muscle weight.
Mitch Morse is what? 31 at present? He will be very expensive. Center is the biggest need on the offense though.
Personally, I’m 50-50 on signing him if we can afford him. For once, I would like a first round center that will last a lot longer.
March 7th, 2024 at 8:57 am
If someone else signed him, that’s one less team drafting a center, forcing a shift in the first round.
March 7th, 2024 at 8:59 am
Hainsey may be a great guy and he may have improved over past two seasons but he’s still an avg at best C and avg is NOT GOOD ENOUGH… to me he’s a backup and just a backup. Bucs have to address C and OG if they expect to improve run gm. I would like to see a good FA pick up at one of these positions and draft the other… if they have the money. Bucs need to trade one of their overpaid brittle CBs.
March 7th, 2024 at 9:30 am
No to spending big money on a Center! We are still paying for Jensen. Draft more young linemen on both sides of the ball.
March 7th, 2024 at 9:33 am
Draft Powers-Johnson or Barton
March 7th, 2024 at 10:56 am
Morse probably won’t be cheap; Hainsey is entering the final year of his rookie contract.
-there’s your answer why Bucs will draft an interior OLineman in 1st 2 rounds
March 7th, 2024 at 10:56 am
Joe saw Hainsey open holes. Hahahaha. I’m pretty sure I saw them holes opened for him whether he wanted it opened or not.
The cascade for the OL should begin at center. Grab a big ugly mauler for C and If Hainsey can make a decent OG then push him over. But I’m dubious about his ability to generate the needed power. Tricks of the trade can help, but, tbs.
March 7th, 2024 at 11:28 am
Only read the first and saw how ridiculous this is.
No rb will succeed when they get the ball and defenders are there at the same time. Except Sanders)
The interior of the o line sucked. RG is a rookie and gets a pass.
C and LG were horrible
March 7th, 2024 at 11:48 am
And Baker Mayfield was the 19th rated quarterback.
Behind Russell Wilson at 18 who was just cut.
March 7th, 2024 at 1:24 pm
Hainsey is a backup. He’s a big liability as a starter. Get manhandled on the reg. Lacks athleticism. Lacks power. Lacks anchor. Consistently gives up pressure in the middle, which is hugely important for Baker. He’s the biggest need for upgrade on the line, not the LG.
March 7th, 2024 at 3:14 pm
Depends how much zone they want to run.
Had to laugh when Canales wnated to run zone & they had Feiler & Wirfs on the left side.
Wirfs can move pretty well, but you can get 300lb or less OL in the 3-5th rounds for zone.
Big guys can get winded/ toasted by the 3rd or 4th quarter
^^mtnbucman^^
Since ’76
March 7th, 2024 at 3:19 pm
This is easy, we signed ME to a two year deal, David is year to year. We need to sell out our picks this year and next to get the players we need to be in a Super Bowl window for the next two to three years.
March 7th, 2024 at 3:28 pm
Hainsey is the type of guy GMs love. Flexible, can play any spot on the line. Fills 2 roster spots that way. Is he a starting caliber center? They could upgrade. Is he gonna get kicked to the curb? Never
March 7th, 2024 at 4:06 pm
I like Hainsey more than most – but he’s not a good fit at center for this offense. He’s a much better pass blocker than run blocker – and even at that he’s still a lower end starter.
But, good news, if you do sign a center, you slide Hainsey over to guard, where I think he’ll be a better fit, including in the run game. We heard how hard Marpet said the move was to center, and like Hainsey, he was a college tackle. I think it’s a big ask to take tackles and move them to center only when they get to the NFL.
In any case, Hainsey will be fine one way or another. If you can be a tackle, guard or center, and can start without killing your QB, you’re going to have a long career in the NFL.
March 7th, 2024 at 4:51 pm
“Rod Munch Says:
We heard how hard Marpet said the move was to center, and like Hainsey, he was a college tackle. I think it’s a big ask to take tackles and move them to center only when they get to the NFL.”
That’s why Barton is a bit of a risk @26 if you want him as your starting C.
^^mtn^^
Since ’76
March 7th, 2024 at 5:52 pm
If the Bucs pick a lineman with our first pick…u guys want a D lineman or offensive? I know we need both…but with round one?
March 7th, 2024 at 6:08 pm
Barton played one season at center for Duke. That is why scouts think he will be able to play it in the pro’s. They have a whole year of college tape.
That is different than either Hainsey or Marpet.
March 7th, 2024 at 10:51 pm
“geno711 Says:
Barton played one season at center for Duke. That is why scouts think he will be able to play it in the pro’s. They have a whole year of college tape.
That is different than either Hainsey or Marpet.”
That’s true, but that was his 1st year at school. That’s why I said “Barton is a bit of a risk @26 if you want him as your starting C.”
Think he’d be a better fit at LG.
Either way, they usually cross train OL guys
^^mtnman^^
Since ’76
March 8th, 2024 at 12:47 pm
Unless you can sign an elite center, it’s best to draft a center. Has anybody considered Mauch as a center? Not sure he has the brains for it.