Twin Terrors
August 14th, 2023
Strong.
One bright spot for Joe in a grim Bucs offseason was a signing made by AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht.
And that was somehow finding nickels and dimes in-between the seat cushions in the lobby of One Buc Palace to afford cornerback Jamel Dean.
Good young corners are hard to come by. So Joe was about to puke thinking of Dean escaping One Buc Palace for some other team.
A lot of folks, for reasons Joe is not quite clear on, don’t think Carlton Davis and Dean are anything worth bragging about. Don’t forget that only one player has had more passes defensed than Davis since Bucs coach Todd Bowles took over the defense.
And if you believe the words from Scott Spratt, typing for Aaron Schatz’s Football Almanac 2023, Dean might be catching up with Davis.
The Bucs retain their top two outside corners Carlton Davis and Jamel Dean, and both make compelling cases to be considered a No. 1. Davis held that unofficial title thanks to a now silver-medal total of 60 passes defensed since 2019—the Eagles’ James Bradberry passed Davis in 2022 thanks to an All-Pro season with 17 passes defensed. But Dean has shadowed plenty of top receivers as Davis missed time with myriad hip, quad, and shoulder injuries the last couple of years and maintained a standout 60% coverage success rate both seasons.
Joe has a hunch people don’t think Davis or Dean are that greatbecause they don’t get a lot of picks. Maybe it’s just Joe, but Joe would rather have a corner (or two) regularly locking down No. 1 receivers rather than a corner that isn’t so great covering receivers but can get a pick once in a while.
Picks are great. You know what’s greater? Playing strong defense and keeping the other team out of the end zone.
August 14th, 2023 at 12:20 am
Ok, just want to make sure I got this right.
August 14th, 2023 at 12:59 am
They gotta start intercepting the ball. They get their hands on enough of them that they should both be getting at least five picks a year. But they bat down a lot of balls they should be trying to catch. Picks are the ultimate drive killers, and we’re going to need them.
August 14th, 2023 at 1:16 am
The Davis and Dean signings are probably two of Licht’s best. That position has been a weakness since Revis and Talib until now. I think we have the best cornerback duo in the league. It would have been great had we been able to keeep SMB.
August 14th, 2023 at 3:01 am
It’s a good thing those guys are getting coached up against real receivers on real teams while at the same time learning how tackle better.
Oh, wait.
August 14th, 2023 at 6:16 am
Well that’s Not us for us for sure…Teams score on us Whenever they need to…we may look good for a quarter or half but Money time…we ain’t sh…….
August 14th, 2023 at 7:27 am
Can’t remember the guy from Dallas, had 11 picks or something year before last. Surrendered TONS of yardage. (Last year he had maybe 3)
August 14th, 2023 at 7:56 am
Lock down an opponent’s top receiver versus picks. Why can’t you do both? That’s all-pro play.
August 14th, 2023 at 8:00 am
@ Beej: Trevon Diggs – 11 picks in 2021. He is the guy Joe described in this sentence:
“Maybe it’s just Joe, but he’d rather have a corner (or two) who regularly lock down other team’s No. 1 receivers rather than a corner that isn’t so great covering receivers but can get a pick once in a while.”
August 14th, 2023 at 8:17 am
Why not end a drive with a pick whilst simultaneously getting a pick-six and flipping the game score by +14 within seconds?
I know there’s been some great corners in this league, but Deion Sanders may be the best CB to ever play. That guy could win games by himself. Wish there was a Sanders-type in the league now – I’d watch/follow that player no matter the team. I was following Edwards after he had that 2 pick-six game – that was darn exciting, but he hasn’t done much since.
I like our current CB duo of Davis N Dean. They are good. Start getting a few picks each, toss in a pick-six and they’ll be great.
August 14th, 2023 at 8:58 am
A great pass rush makes the dbs look really good when the games are for real when the season begins. The Bucs have respectable talent in their pass defenders but they need a dam good pass rush to be really great. No pass rush is a killer for the dbs. Not convinced yet the Bucs will have a killer pass rush (especially JTS but also the knee injury to their best rusher). So yes the db group looks very decent, but they will be hung out to dry if the pass rush is weak.
August 14th, 2023 at 9:26 am
When you are paid money you need to generate turnovers at some point. That is how the NFL works.
August 14th, 2023 at 9:45 am
It just stuns me how so many fans expect every player at every starting position to play like an All-Pro and every backup to play like a solid starter, all with zero mistakes. There’s only so much S-Tier talent that even exists, and it’s 2023, not 1973. That means there’s 31 other NFL teams now, all with front offices being paid tens of millions of dollars to find a very specific blend of A-Tier, and B-Tier players, plus a few S-Tier players, whatever the salary cap will allow you to get under contract within a set of rules insane enough to satisfy the NFL owners AND the NFLPA.
The fact that we have both Davis and Dean, AND both Evans and Godwin, AND both David and White, AND both Wirfs and Jensen (despite the injury) is legit ridiculous. Licht (and the FO he’s put together) is World Class. To attract Tom Brady, keep him here for three seasons, and STILL have the essential core on the team after Brady leaves that attracted him in the first place? I’m telling you, no one involved in the business side of the NFL could have imagined it; even after watching Licht pull off keeping every starter from a SB-winning roster, they couldn’t have imagined it.
And some of y’all look at what he’s done and say, “Yeah, but no QB1 now; Yeah, but no RB1 now;” and, “Yeah, but our dominating DBs don’t have picks, too.” And in preseason, no less!
Tell you sniveling geniuses what, next time you’re in the paper goods aisle in your local grocery store, after you grab the paper towels you wring your hands dry with and the TP you wipe your hurting tuchus with, grab a few extra boxes of tissues. You can cry snot into them as you read every JBF article about our second-round picks that fail to outplay first-overall picks, our brand-new offense that might need more than half a training camp and one preseason game to gel, and our pickless DBs as they bat away pass after pass and prevent big plays all over the field.
Nothing galls me more than people who have it good that have no clue how good they have it. Shameful.
Go Bucs!
August 14th, 2023 at 9:58 am
I like the Bucs starting 4 DBs of Dean, Davis, Winfield and Neal. After that? It’s a horror show. Zyon is the current version of Ryan Smith. Maybe Delaney isn’t a complete sewer trout but I’m not sold. When the Bucs are in dime, the opponent is converting the 3rd and long. Fortunately the Bucs have a head coach who knows how to coach them up.
Oh, wait.
August 14th, 2023 at 10:11 am
I totally agree with you -blanketing receivers will win more games for the bucs.
Interceptions are a bonus too.
August 14th, 2023 at 10:27 am
Sorry according to Joe theses “Meaningless Games” tells nothing about how this defense and specifically the secondary will play.
UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE the Last game played, the secondary was observers to the action. Up and down the field, giving up 1st down after 1st down and overall not very competitive.
So sorry, until the whistle is blown in week 1 means absolutely zilch.
August 14th, 2023 at 10:49 am
Thanks for the hilarious imagery, “Maybe Delaney isn’t a complete sewer trout” Now that is a line that never made it to the Tribune (to my knowledge…though it could have been in one of Tom McEwen’s country breakfast specials)
Sounds like a few of the UDFA’s are doing well in camp and may make the team.
One of the Joe’s did an article a few months ago about Bowles’s inability to develop pass rushers. Pretty accurate so far hope that changes this year. However, Bowles and his coaches do a decent job getting DB’s up to speed. Maybe there is hope for a few reserve players in the secondary to develop.
August 14th, 2023 at 11:24 am
Anybody that doesn’t think these two are fantastic, don’t deserve to comment. Dean has actually been better than Davis the last two years but they’re both terrific. No. Not a lot of picks. They also don’t get challenged often. When Davis wasn’t in the past two years, Dean would rarely get a ball thrown his way. Their numbers with completion percentage and opposing QB rating are excellent.
August 14th, 2023 at 11:32 am
The starting corners and safeties will be fine if they don’t get injured and aren’t handcuffed by way to much soft zone! The backup dbs still need some work. IMO.
August 14th, 2023 at 2:12 pm
Decent corners but not elite in any way. These two were given long term contracts to make Light’s draft resume look good. This was a deal done by the GM for the GM. Decent players. Just nothing special by NFL standards.
August 14th, 2023 at 5:01 pm
It’s great to have them, but they burned a lot of money on those guys who are miles away from the ball every play.
Corners tend to be a finishing touch on great teams, not the cornerstones they’re built around.
August 14th, 2023 at 5:04 pm
Dean > Davis
August 14th, 2023 at 10:31 pm
Pass Defense
2002 TD 10 INT 31 PD 102 FF 8 FR 3 SK 43 (Super Bowl)
2020 TD 29 INT 15 PD 70 FF 15 FR 8 SK 48 (Super Bowl)
2022 TD 29 INT 10 PD 59 FF 12 FR 8 SK 45