Licht: We’re Good On D-Line
April 27th, 2019
Defends position selections.
Last year the Bucs ranked 19th in sacks with 38, which in this lost decade was fairly impressive given the standard this team had established.
Two guys who led the team in sacks, Jason Pierre-Paul and Carl Nassib, are nearing the end of their contracts. Nassib, who had a career year with a staggering 6.5 sacks, is in the final year of his contract. JPP, 30, will see his current contract expire next season. He had 12.5 sacks in 2018.
Another stalwart on the defensive line, stud Gerald McCoy, is basically a homeless NFL player.
Yet in a draft loaded and top-heavy with defensive linemen including pass rushers, Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht doesn’t see the fire beginning. So instead, on the second day of the draft, Licht drafted three defensive backs. That’s six defensive backs drafted in the first three rounds in the past four years.
(Earlier Friday, Bucco Bruce Arians called “bullsh!t” on critics who said the Bucs were irresponsible for not drafting a defensive lineman in the first round. If an inside linebacker can get pressure on a quarterback like a defensive tackle or an edge rusher, the guy wouldn’t be a linebacker; he’d be playing on the line where he goes after the quarterback on every play and makes more money in the process.)
In speaking to the local pen and mic club this evening after the third round of the draft ended, Licht defended ignoring the defensive front saying he liked JPP and Nassib and Vita Vea. He didn’t mention GMC.
Licht added competition in the secondary is good. “Competition is a beautiful thing,” Licht said.
Joe is guessing Licht frowns on competition for the defensive line.
Also, Licht noted he was offered a trade back on the Bucs’ second-round pick, but he declined the offer saying he was scared there would be a run on corners. He did trade back in the third round, just when there was a run beginning at running back, a hole on the roster one could argue is just as deep if not deeper than at defensive back.
This seems to be a pattern for the Bucs. If a draft is loaded at a certain position, the Bucs look the other way. Meanwhile, the position they ignore turns out to bite them in the rear end a not-so-short distance down the road, like ignoring running backs in 2017 until they found a running back who could pass an illiteracy test.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:09 am
I just listened to the press conference …Joe what was the question late in the PC about ” you got our guy”..I could not hear the question
April 27th, 2019 at 12:11 am
Lol suuuuuuuuuure, whatever you say Meathead.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:12 am
Can we fire him already
I’m sick of my team sucking
April 27th, 2019 at 12:13 am
We’re not good at GM
April 27th, 2019 at 12:13 am
We could have had Sanders or Montgomery and yet we passed on both.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:15 am
This draft is hilarious because I think Joe has hated every single pick so far.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:16 am
Not sure. Was sitting second row and don’t recall hearing that.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:20 am
Beginning of 2nd round there were some offensive tackles but teams traded up to get them. Bucs were beat to the punch. If they were looking for a lot of depth at dB they sure stocked up the shelves
April 27th, 2019 at 12:20 am
Everyone acts like BA was lying when he said he likes Peyton Barber.
Or when Licht said Ronald Jones looms good.
Or that we gave up a staggering 78% Red Zone TDs.
Historically bad CB play.
Think it was easy for Licht to watch this?
Admit he screwed the pooch or Great Dane in his case, last year.
Added the fastest 3 guys on our defense and an absolutely sure fire safe pick at Safety, who is a master at the line.
Todd Bowles knows what he is doing and there are literally tons of articles speaking to the fact that he doesn’t value True Mold DEs.
Yet everyone is SHOCKED.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:21 am
Jason Licht folks–the venereal disease that keeps on giving! Thanks Lovie, you certainly know how to leave your mark!
April 27th, 2019 at 12:22 am
Outside of White this draft has been the best, of the worst of Licht. I’m stunned at the amount of draft capital we’ve spent on our secondary two years in a row.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:23 am
Licht must see something we don’t to draft all these corners. I hope they keep picking DBs into the end of the draft.
And start Alex Cappa.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:23 am
Clearly our secondary was our #1 NEED area, though, right?
I think everyone can agree on that.
While our pass rush may have been ranked like 19th (based on sacks) our overall Pass Defense was ranked 26th.
Now with Grimes gone (at least he contributed ‘somewhat’ last season) that 26th ranked Pass D is probably DEAD LAST IN THE NFL.
We had no choice but to draft a bunch of defensive backs to see if at least some would be able to be solid starters.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:23 am
Total dumpster fire draft. Are we going to play a 1-2-8 defense?
April 27th, 2019 at 12:24 am
There is not a GM out there a trust less than Jason Licht to select DBs and this is all we’re doing.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:24 am
Corner depth chart going into tonight….
#1 ??????
#2 Davis
#3 VH3
#4 ??????
#5 ??????
If you don’t get why the Bucs did what they did tonight, then you haven’t been paying attention.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:25 am
Exactly right Greg, Lovie Smith May be running a bad football team in Illinois, but his fingerprints are still all over the Bucs.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:27 am
And amazingly, the best player available EVERY time we picked tonight just happened to be a DB. Amazing how tonight just happened to shake out that way for us!
April 27th, 2019 at 12:27 am
@ROD – exactly. How does every Bucs fan in the world, including the Joes, not fully grasp how TERRIBLE our secondary is.
Sure, once can say we gave up a lot of passing yards because of a lack of a better pass rush, but ultimately our secondary couldn’t cover squat and got burned again and again and again.
Add to that us losing Grimes, who at least contributed at times last season, and we probably had the WORST secondary in the entire NFL going into the Draft.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:27 am
For once you’ll get no argument from me. There better be some majors trade discussions going on behind the scenes because this is criminal and I’ve been scarred by this draft. Hindsight it was pretty stupid to treat Geraldine that way if you weren’t going to trade and replace him. The only explanation is thinking Vea is that replacement
April 27th, 2019 at 12:29 am
I think the quote from Bruce speaks volumes when he says we don’t know his defense.
They obvisous wanted speed and coverage. Now they got it.
You give them what they need…….not what the fans think they need.
They got what they needed now get to work and fix this last place defense……..Y’all call it what you will. I’ll be excited to see what this defense can do.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:29 am
Is there gonna be a bullpen at Ray Jay for the Bucs corner rotation? Can we get Jim Hickey to walk on the field to pull one if their playing bad?
April 27th, 2019 at 12:29 am
Yah it’s not like we need a RT than can run block or a RG that can block a cool breeze. This was the most incompetent draft I’ve seen so far (and that’s saying a lot).
For those who say Gerald is staying, how the F&ck does that work? Where are we shaving 13M off our roster?
We have the highest paid oline so why the hell didn’t we draft a cheap future replacement for the future. This was not a BPA type of draft, we got a bunch of f)$@kin track stars.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:31 am
We have had a substandard defensive backfield since the days of Schiano and probably before. The new regime had its opportunity to evaluate our needs. It determined the Bucs’ secondary sucked. Hard to argue.
One has to prioritize the suckitude and handle the worst area first. That is what happened tonight.
Joe shouldn’t waste time bemoaning the picks. He should slap himself for not seeing —and not reporting — what management really thought. In fact I have wondered if the GMC melodrama wasn’t something of a smokescreen all along. Sure the team is in cap he’ll. But we want to see good football not good accountants.
For most of the last decade the national press has accurately predicted the Bucs’ first round picks. Local outlets have been less successful. Sometimes you just need to see what is right in front of you and ignore the noise. Keeps you more sane, keeps readers better informed and tells everyone where the coaches are coming from.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:33 am
So MJ is a 2nd round backup? VH3 a first round back up? Or is Bunting a 2nd round back up? Dean a third rd back up?
How many F$;kin backups do we need?
At some point don’t we need a starting RG, another DE?
If he didn’t draft White this would be Lichts worst f$(&kin draft.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:33 am
This regime is 1 and done that k God. I said it before and I’ll say it again , I’m sitting this season and Amy other season that Jason Licht is still a part of this front office out.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:36 am
Rod Munch is dead on. They needed a huge talent infusion into the secondary and they added 3 bigger and faster players in that area.
Once again, they have players up front and they have added speed at the LB position already.
My guess is they add some OL and DL depth within the next 3 picks and then we ride.
They are changing this roster into what these coaches want and need. It won’t be perfect in year 1 but you can see what they are doing and it makes sense.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:38 am
Alaskan…….They never played a down if football and you are calling them backups………..So dumb really.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:39 am
Snowman: What difference does it make as long as you get the best talent on the field?
April 27th, 2019 at 12:39 am
Well I’m disappointed. Hope I’m wrong
April 27th, 2019 at 12:40 am
We know how bad the secondary was. We also know how awful Benenoch, Cappa, and Dotson are. The right side of our O line needs an over haul too. Barber goes down we’re F’d, Henderson was there for the taking. Try to spread the up grades around the whole team, and the team as a whole will play better.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:41 am
Tbbuc, The bucs now have 4 corners that can (possibly) play. No bullpen required. MJ will go to safety where he is better suited. VH3, Davis, Bunting, Dean, are the corners. We have to have at least 3 in order to take the field every Sunday. We need at least 1 of the guys on the back end of the roster to make the team just to fill out a depth chart.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:42 am
Lol we have 3 bodies in the form of JPP, Vea, Nassib, an oft injured Noah spence, Gholston (when’s the last time he breathed on a QB)…and… Beau Allen??? And we’re content with that?? Unbelievable.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:44 am
Not mad at positions mad about players drafted no Greedy at 48 dude was rated as top 5 not later than top 10 pick at beginning we have shot at 48 48!!! and we chose CB from Central Michigan. I just can’t support this anymore. The nerve to say had trade offers to move down does not help situation at all!!!
April 27th, 2019 at 12:45 am
They are backups because you can only have so many on the field. Really you asked me that question? I’m not saying they all are but some of them have to be.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:45 am
Even if they found the right guys you don’t put that many young corners on the field in this division that’s just crazy. So now they are pinning their hopes on more rookies in the secondary? I’m so confused right now as to why they passed on any line help. I can see feeling like the o line can be coached up you have young players there but the d line?
April 27th, 2019 at 12:46 am
Alaskan, MJ will battle for starting safety. The other 4 will battle for 2 outside corner spots and nickel. That leaves one reserve/rotational guy. Competition is a good thing
April 27th, 2019 at 12:47 am
I thought the scheme sucked and that’s why the DBs sucked? So Licht is admitting he can’t draft DBs, so what does he do? Draft more DBs.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:47 am
You guys want to know the easiest way to have good secondary players? Get to the QB. So let me get this straight – we were about average at getting to the QB last year, we are losing our 6 time pro bowler, JPP is getting older and probably in his last year in Tampa, and we are really trusting Vita Vea and Carl Nassib to be the future of our pass rush? Oh even better, maybe we are putting our faith in Noah Spence. What if we have one guy go down? I mean, if memory serves that has happened once or twice in Tampa.
I’m glad so many of you can justify these picks. I’ve been in your shoes for so many years. But I’m simply blown away that in the deepest DL draft in memory, we don’t draft any. We don’t address the OL. Instead, we draft 3 DB’s. There is no amount of homerism that can blind me to the fact that we have done nothing to improve the trenches.
We clearly have no plan to build this team. We are just picking guys at the same position and hoping one or two turns out. That’s not scouting, that’s hoping and praying. I like Arians and think he’s a great coach, but he’s not a GM. Unfortunately, neither is Licht.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:47 am
*** it appears that licht has “dun fugged up” ***
April 27th, 2019 at 12:48 am
*** dude straight washed out the draft ***
April 27th, 2019 at 12:48 am
Also, I’m not saying our guys are bums or not good players. Just feel like we are so focused on the secondary we are neglecting other aspects of our team that we could’ve also improved.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:49 am
Hawaiian gets it!!!!! Well said brotha
April 27th, 2019 at 12:51 am
Licht, Arians and Bowles have determined that the secondary is the weakest link. What do you expect them to do? Keep the same players who aren’t even in the same zip code? I read somewhere the Bucs were #1 in QB pressure but last in qb completion %. That tells me that if the coverage was a little better there would be more sacks. Slow guys can’t cover in the NFL.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:55 am
This is a directionless team
April 27th, 2019 at 12:57 am
Rod Munch
#1 ??????
#2 Davis
#3 VH3
#4 ??????
#5 ??????
Agreed. People not paying attention were missing Isaiah Johnson play last year and Javion Elliot should of been gone a while ago. VH3 is much better in the nickel, but has missed 22 games in his three year career.
It’s a passing league these days and Bowels made his way to a great DC as a secondary coach. No doubt he had major influence on these picks. Got him some big, athletic DBs. This is gonna be good competition. Excited to see what happens.
April 27th, 2019 at 12:59 am
All of these picks have some of the same traits. Namely speed and leadership. The Bucs secondary has been a dumpster fire the last few years. Was it scheme or just lack of ability? Looks like both. People shouldn’t get mad that they are trying to improve it. The DLine actually put quite a bit of pressure on this past season but the back end was awful. White will turn out to be a great pick. Hopefully the DB’s can be at least an upgrade. Go Bucs!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:00 am
The sheep is saying that Gump is justified for picking 4 defensive backs because the secondary suks?
What do you think happens when you draft backups?
Gump drafts 4-6 round talent defensive backs 2 rounds too early
When is Jason Gump going to be finally held accountable?
Its still Lovie Smiths fault? Or BA or Bowles?
The day this Gimp gets fired is the day the Bucs get better
Im so frustrated I forgot to use quotation marks
Kobe Faker
April 27th, 2019 at 1:01 am
Hawaiian is spot on
Joke of a draft
Ignoring obvious needs to triple dip on a bunch of average talent in the secondary
Get ready for another season of a bunch of rookies pointing at each other after giving up another 69 yd yd pass
Our QB is going to get blasted for 50 sacks and we run for 2.9 yds per rush
Thanks
April 27th, 2019 at 1:04 am
Busting looks like a tall Brent Grimes where JoeJuan Williams looks like Xavier Rhodes.
Licht passed up Greedy Williams too, who you’d think would play well with Devin White, but what do I know?
Licht could have drafted Dalton Risner too, I would not have complained.
Took me a while to find a highlight tape of Busting where JoeJuan had 9 min tape and the first highlight was a tackle. He hit the rb so hard you heard it from the bleachers.
Busting first highlight was how nice he looks and all his swag. Weird that he only has one short highlight reel from his sophomore year.
Why did Licht trade down, give up a Rb (Darell Henderson), DE (Jaylen Furgerson) in the process and then draft 3 straight DBs?
Jamal Dean has 3 ACL injuries, wow! And he looks like a special teams players with all his holding and pa, but wtfdik?
Mike Edwards at least he can tackle.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:09 am
Hawaiian and you others do NOT get it.
Our secondary GOT TORCHED last season. No improved pass rush over what we had (which was middle of the NFL ranked) was going to stop so many of the quick slants, RB outs, and other plays that got the ball quickly out of the QB’s hands (like Brady does 90% of his passing plays).
Our DBs were TOAST again and again. Grimes had some good moments and bad moments, but he was clearly the best of our secondary last year and now he’s gone.
So one of the WORST NFL secondaries in the league got… well… WORSE with Grimes not coming back.
We didn’t have the cap space to sign a big cornerback free agent.
So here are… headed into the Draft with a TERRIBLE secondary. We have struggled with the quick interior slants and RB plays and so we grabbed the top LB to help with that, as well as add an awesome playmaker that can blitz often in our new 3-4 scheme which WILL put more pressure on QBs.
That left us with 3 other picks tonight… and we spent them all on trying to find A) Grimes’ replacement, and B) Others to compete for the DB rotation as well as a potential new safety that we just drafted.
What’s so hard to understand? Did you think we’d draft a corner in the 2nd round that would instantly replace Grimes and be a full-time starter, and then we’d move on to our 3rd round (which turned into 2 picks) and just draft a DT or DE and an OL and we’d be all set?
Before the draft we had a STARTING D-LINE (especially if they keep GMac). They’re not the best in the league, but they’re decent. You can’t say the same for our secondary. Before the draft we did NOT have a decent starting line-up and not even a mediocre starting line-up.
We had no choice but to go backfield heavy.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:09 am
You guys don’t know spit. Bunch of arm chair GM’s. You make this site unreadable sometimes!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:10 am
There’s not one of you defending these picks that actually think it’s going to make us better. If the Panthers, Saints, or Falcons did this, you’d be laughing at them. It’s commendable that you are supporting the team, but you all know the truth, and you know how this is going to end. None of you believes this nonsense about “competition”. Is there competition at MLB? Is there a competition at RB? Is there competition at QB? DE? NT? Competition is code for pick a bunch of guys and pray one works out.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:12 am
Kobe – first of all, you’re the biggest CLOWN posting on this site with your stupid & tired 3rd person quoting yourself schtick. LOL, what an effin LOSER you are for keeping that nonsense up for so long.
Secondly, you obviously don’t know squat about football if you think we’re just drafting backups. The DBs we drafted last year didn’t pan out. Stewart is being moved to safety and now we’re drafting hoping to find some new starters.
GET A CLUE! No cap space and the worst secondary in the NFL. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know the situation.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:13 am
@BucsBandit
Get off of JBF. You have a couple more DB’s and a WR to draft tomorrow.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:14 am
Hawaiian – not true at all. The previous DB crop from last year was drafted with a Mike Smith defense in mind. These guys are press cover, fast guys. Very different types of corners better suited for Bowles defensive scheme.
So, yes, excuse those of us paying attention to what Arians/Bowles/Licht are actually trying to do with these draft picks.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:14 am
Thing is, you guys will all be lined up tomorrow going ape spit about the next selections. I will say it again. You don’t know spit, so quit acting like you do.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:15 am
Lol @ BucsBandit- is our secondary was so bad why was Mike Smith fired mid season?
Also, Carlton Davis played better than Grimey last year.
The facts are they REACHED in the second and got a better corner in the 3rd. Second rounder could’ve been a cheap Oline guy to bolster the most expensive/worst run blocking unit in the league.
That or an aging DLine who just lost their 6x pro bowler and is switching schemes.
You win or lose in the trenches, football 101, elementary you Buctard.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:17 am
Bwahahahaha drafted for Mike Smith? Haha dude come on!
Carlton Davis-press corner
MJ Stewart- press corner
VH3- press corner
April 27th, 2019 at 1:17 am
Hawaiian – you also just named 5 positions (MLB/RB/QB/DE/NT) how on earth are we supposed to dress all of them through just 3 draft rounds so far?
It wasn’t going to happen.
They have to hope one of these corners can replace Grimes (because the guys from last year proved they won’t be able to) and they have to hope to other provides enough competition and positional depth to make the secondary better. And on one knows what VHIII’s health is going to be like.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:19 am
Alaskan,
I think I’ll trust the NFL executives on what moves they’re making than what you THINK they should be doing instead.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:21 am
CONTINUED…
Clearly they have a plan for the O-Line issues… either they know Cappa is coming along well and/or they have some prospects they’re planning to draft to address the issues as well. AND/OR they just know the secondary is a bigger priority right now and they’ve only had 3 rounds so far.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:22 am
@BucsBandit
First of all, you are wrong. Davis and Stewart were both press corners, as was Hargreaves. That’s the funny thing, they were terrible fits for a Mike Smith defense. I’m not trying to be rude, but clearly you are a very casual fan if you don’t know that. Nothing wrong with that by the way.
Second, our pass rush was decent last year at times, but we are losing McCoy. JPP is a year older. Vea has never played a full season. Also, they were very inconsistent. The games we got torched the most were games where the pass rush was nonexistent (Chicago, Atlanta, NOLA). The game we got the most pressure was Carolina at home. And what happened? 4 picks and a win with backup secondary. 3 picks by a 3rd string safety. Do you honestly think that’s a coincidence?
April 27th, 2019 at 1:26 am
@BucsBandit
So let me get this straight. We have holes in multiple positions. I think we can all agree there. So instead of addressing as many of those as possible, you think we should just draft a bunch of players at the same position and hope one is a #1 CB, and the others provide depth? Like seriously, that’s what you think?
April 27th, 2019 at 1:28 am
@Hawaiin – I said FAST press cover corners. Both of the corners we drafted tonight are a lot faster than those guys. Davis has some speed at mid 4.4s but Bunting & Dean are still both BLAZING FAST and even faster than Davis.
VHIII and Stewart are both 4.5 guys. A MAJOR difference.
And those guys, while not perfect, WERE decent fits for the scheme Smith played on running with zones and lots of cushion (less speed needed for recovery/races when trying to keep the man in front of you). Clearly these new speedsters are better suited for man-to-man. It’s not a big mystery.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:28 am
“Clearly they have a plan for the O-Line issues”
——————–
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:29 am
Yes trust the guys who had 7 picks in 2016 and came out with MAYBe a slot corner. The guys who draft a kicker in the second. The guys who also drafted 3 DBs in the first four rounds last year.
I get it dude, I’m a huge fan too and I don’t want to think my team is a$$. I used to rationalize and justify Licht’s decisions just like you but I’ve reached that tipping point where I’m just freaking done.
This draft was a HUGE opportunity to solidify the trenches AND get DB help. I’m all for the White and Dean picks but the bungling of the second rounds is a solid pattern of incompetence.
So yeah go ahead keep trusting these guys just like I used to trust in Winslow, Freeman, Dougie, Lovie, and Mike Williams… among others. Don’t worry you’ll get it one day.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:29 am
Bandit
5 positions, 3 rounds but 4 picks. Possible to address all of the positions minus QB. Actually, Carolina drafted Will Grier right after Mike Edwards so you can address 4 out of 5.
Tomorrow they’ll load up on oline hopefully bc Winston needs some help back there, for real!!!
So far, I give the draft an F okay a D- far arguments sake
April 27th, 2019 at 1:30 am
@BucsBandit,
Is this a joke? Are you kidding me? You really might be Licht, because you clearly have zero clue what you are writing.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:30 am
Hawaii – NO, I think they’re hoping all 3 of the guys they drafted can start or at least 1 be a big part of their rotation. Nickel is still a concern. No one knows how VH3 is going to rebound from injury. But the secondary is so important they needed depth.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:31 am
Alaskan with the mic drop!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:33 am
Alaskan – for the record, I’m not a big fan of Licht and his past draft choices at all. HOWEVER… with that being said I don’t have a major problem with his draft tonight as Secondary was clearly our #1 weakness, and being in Cap Hell the only way it’s going to get addressed is via the Draft.
And Hawaiian, yes, I do believe they have a plan for the O-Line issues or at least an “order of priority” in dealing with the OL and other areas.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:33 am
@BucsBandit
You said it yourself, “HOPING”. Good GM’s don’t “hope”. You’ve become so accustomed to incompetence that you are supporting it. Good for you.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:35 am
@BucsBandit
I ask again, did you think the Carolina game was a coincidence? How did our secondary look that gme? Don’t avoid the question, answer it.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:37 am
What’s funny is you guys act like Carlton Davis was this break-out, lockdown NFL corner this year. He was MEDIOCRE at best. So both starting corner spots are yet to be determined.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:37 am
Look, I am a little confused about the picks too, but they are what they are. I can live with them…I have to. Although I question the wisdom of drafting a player that’s had multiple knee surgeries.
I said months ago that we didn’t need offensive line because we had the talent we needed on the team.
I also said that we did not need a DE except for depth.
And last week, I floated the theory that the Bucs plan to keep McCoy, that the conflict there was a smokescreen. I suggested that because of his age, he was probably told to stay home the first couple camps. Stay healthy.
Now all of those tjings seem to be coming true.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:40 am
@BucsBandit
And what staff drafted Davis? What staff drafted Stewart? And you trust them to draft 2 more? What kind of backwards logic is that? How many drafts should we waste trying to get one starting caliber CB?
And you still refuse to answer my question.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:40 am
BucsBandit- if Davis was terrible, MJ was terrible, and VH3 is bad/unreliable, well, who drafted them?
Fool me …can’t get fooled again. -George W. Bush with Licht logic
April 27th, 2019 at 1:41 am
Hawaiian get out of my head!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:42 am
As long as I’m not in BucsBandits head, I’m in good shape!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:45 am
Hawaiian – those guys were rookies last year and could still develop into solid starters. But they didn’t shine in their rookie years and the team had no choice but to take a gamble in the Draft to try and make sure they had solid starters – and with no cap space, they needed some draft prospects that could battle for the job.
Again, not rocket science.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:47 am
CONTINUED…
If it were only Licht doing all the scouting and having the input on drafting more corners, NO, I obviously wouldn’t feel good about it after the big ‘misses’ last year.
But I’m willing to give Arians/Bowles (who clearly are heavily involved in this year’s Draft decisions) the benefit of the doubt that THEY know what they’re doing.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:48 am
@BucsBandit
I want you to read what you just wrote. Then read it again. Then take a second to realize the absurdity of what you just wrote.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:48 am
Just when I thought I couldn’t be any more down on the prospects of next season Licht goes and sh!ts all over any hope of improvement. Here’s to the 2020 draft and a new GM. Go Bucs!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:49 am
Alaskabuc where you at bro?
April 27th, 2019 at 1:53 am
Hawaiian – it’s not absurd at all. Those guys showed some promise (Davis most of all) and now they’re forced to experiment with them, like moving Stewart to safety since he didn’t cut it at corner.
We lost Grimes, a veteran, and our secondary has been terrible. We don’t have the cap space to sign a decent free agent.
SO WHERE DOES THAT LEAVE US?
We just “hope” those rookies from last year DO develop into great starters and not add more talent? The Bucs couldn’t risk doing that.
Again, not sure what you can’t understand about that. Does it suck wasting draft picks multiple years in a row trying to find guys to fill the secondary? OF COURSE. But that’s the situation the team was in going into the Draft — with major question marks in the secondary.
The NFL is a PASSING LEAGUE. The Secondary is critical. How is this hard to understand? So if you miss on previous years draft prospects at a certain position you don’t try again? THAT is what’s absurd.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:53 am
BucsBandit my brotha, are you even learning anything? If they can still be developed, how can that happen if they are sitting behind the new rookies!!!! Ahhhhhhh!!!! Dude, come on!
April 27th, 2019 at 1:53 am
@BucsBandit,
I’m sorry, remind me again what teams Bowles and Arians was GM for? Why pay scouts to do their job when you have a guy that was just last year a head coach in NY and another that was color commentary for NFL games? I feel so much better now.
You keep saying it, they gambled and are hoping. That’s the strategy you believe in? You said the guys we drafted last year may end up being good, but instead of letting them develop, we have to draft more guys at their position? Are you comprehending this?
And I’m asking you a third time about the Carolina game. Why do you continue to ignore the question?
April 27th, 2019 at 1:56 am
“So if you miss on previous years draft prospects at a certain position you don’t try again? THAT is what’s absurd.”
Not the next year! You develop them! You just said they can still be developed! So what if these rookies struggle again (they will because..wait for it…they are rookies!) do we just draft 3 more DBs next year?
Do you REALLY not see the flaws of your logic. You are trying sooo hard to justify this.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:56 am
Alaskan – my guess is they don’t have much confidence in those guys (outside of Davis) so drafted these new prospects to replace them. Stewart is being moved to safety to try and salvage him; if it doesn’t work he won’t make the team this year.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:58 am
Alaskan – I said they ‘might’ be able to be developed. Again, maybe they see something else. Clearly they made these draft moves for a reason. If I was the other guys I’d be panicking right now.
April 27th, 2019 at 1:59 am
Do we draft 3 more DBs next year if all of our rookies struggle?
I’m asking because I want to know your opinion.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:00 am
Bucs defensive line consist of Vita, McCoy, JPP and Nassib – that’s a pretty good 1-4. Just don’t do anything stupid like cut McCoy when you don’t have to and you’re set. McCoy/JPP/Nassib play the ends with a rotation, Vita hopefully lives up to the hype and is your 3-4 NT, and when you go to nickel 50% of the time, you put all four out there at once.
The Bucs didn’t lose because of the offensive and defensive line last year, they lost because the secondary was, by far, the worst in football. You have to fix that and it cost way too much to do that in free agency. Hopefully Licht picked the right guys – on that we’ll have to see.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:00 am
“The NFL is a PASSING LEAGUE. The Secondary is critical. How is this hard to understand? So if you miss on previous years draft prospects at a certain position you don’t try again? THAT is what’s absurd.”
——————
Do you know what’s even more critical than a secondary? A pass rush. That’s football 101. Why do the pass rushers make all the money? It’s the second most important position in football. Do you know what you do when you have enough pass rushers? You get more pass rushers. Giants won 2 Super Bowls with that philosophy. Name me a lock down CB that has led his team to a Super Bowl in this passing league. For every one you can name, I can list 5 with a pass rush. The saying goes “games are won in the trenches”. Have you ever heard “Games are won by guys who play CB and run really fast in their underwear”?
And for the 4th time, Carolina game?!?!?!!!!!!!!
April 27th, 2019 at 2:02 am
Hawaiian – what about their Carolina game? You talking about the 2nd meeting in December when they had a decent game? Both teams were out of the playoffs at that point (Carolina was 6-6 I think). Any given Sunday… any team (or Offense or Defense) can have a decent game every now and then. Doesn’t make up for the consistent body of sh*tty work for the other games.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:04 am
@Rod Munch,
So why did we win the games we got consistent pressure on the QB and lose the games where we got none?
And McCoy is gone. Don’t be ridiculous. We have to be able to afford all these CB’s, as well as Beau Allen and Will Gholston. Those guys are the future.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:05 am
You won’t get an argument from me that we need to improve our pass rush. White will certain help in the 3-4 and being able to blitz up the middle (allowing David to do the same). I also imagine Bowles will be doing quite a bit of corner blitzing too and that’s probably another reason for going with these speedsters.
BUT… while our pass rush wasn’t in the Top 10 it will still middle of the pack in the league. Our coverage, though, was TERRIBLE.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:05 am
Alaskan – Davis was good last year, Stewart was awful. VH3 is a nickel, until he gets hurt, and in any case unless he has a huge year he’s out after the season. Ryan Smith is God awful and shouldn’t be on the football. So you got ONE corner past this year on the roster. At safety I still think Evans will be fine, but with Whitehead, give competition and if wins the competition great – the safety we drafted tonight is basically a 4th rounder, just like Whitehead. If we end up with too many good defensive backs, well, that would be an amazing problem to have.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:06 am
Rod how do we afford to keep McCoy?
April 27th, 2019 at 2:06 am
@BucsBandit,
You’re not this dumb. We got the most pressure on the QB against Carolina. We were all over Cam from start to finish. And what was the result? 4 INT’s, 3 by a third string safety. Let that at sink in. Now before you type something stupid, think about it again.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:06 am
@Rod – stop using facts and making too much sense, these guys will crucify you for that in these comments.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:10 am
You two have the same backwards philosophy as Licht. And that’s the same philosophy that has gotten us nowhere. You can believe in it all you want. You just wait and see what happens. Of course you’ll disappear or change your name, but I’ll still be here awaiting our new GM to fix the D Line in a loaded secondary draft.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:10 am
Hawaiian – If you get pressure but guys are running wide open in the secondary, then what good is the pressure.
Also there is no good reason to cut McCoy at this point. Cut Gholston, cut Evan Smith, cut Ryan Smith – there’s $8m. If you still need more space give David a new deal. You don’t cut good and productive players, and regardless of what the angry anti-comic book crowd thinks, McCoy is still a good and productive player even if he’s not worth his full contract.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:10 am
Rod I agree with everything you said my dude.
That being said that good problem is negated by the bad problems of no Oline depth or even a starting RG. We are bringing back one of the top 3 worst run block lines without a shake up. McCoy is gone, Nassib is not an edge , he is a 4-3 DE like JPP or a 5 possibly with the immortal Will Gholston.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:11 am
Facts, lol.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:11 am
Hawaiian – to be honest I didn’t see that game and only brief saw the recap write-up. I was already ‘check out’ of the season at that point and frustrated (yet again) and especially after our hot start.
Of course, I hear you on the pass rush. I’m not arguing with you that getting tons of pressure on the other team’s QB will lead to more wins when that happens.
But if you don’t have a good secondary you’re going to be in trouble no matter what. We couldn’t tackle OR cover very well.
How did the Rams, with arguably the most talented D-Line in the NFL, do in the Super Bowl against the Patriots? How much pressure did they put on Brady?
Pass rush talent alone doesn’t always get the job done. Those quick slants and other fast passes can counter a big pass rush.
Our secondary got CRUSHED last year on BOTH types of passing… the quick passing plays AND the longer developing ones.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:12 am
Alaskan – Just posted it, cut Gholston ($4m), cut Evan Smith ($2m), cut Ryan Smith ($2m) – there’s $8m. If you need more space then give David a new deal, he just turned 29, and should play and be productive through 32, so that’s 4 more years in my mind – so extend him a couple of years to give some temp relief if needed. Bucs can afford it if they want to do it, and I’d rather have McCoy than those three worthless players and $5m.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:13 am
@Rod Munch
You know I’m the biggest McCoy fan, but he’s gone. The Bucs have made that abundantly clear. Of course they could keep him, but they aren’t going to. Do you know why? Because our genius GM believes that teams are built in the secondary.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:14 am
EDIT: Rams certainly held Brady to a mediocre overall game compared to his average, but my point is they that alone wasn’t enough, especially with the slant game being unstoppable.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:14 am
I agree Hawaiian, the best teams load up on trench talent in the top 3 rounds year after year. I think of Gettleman and how he built that nasty Panthers DLine, the Broncos loading up there, Seattle always had a pash rush which without it, there would be no legion of boom.
I agree, football 101.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:16 am
I don’t think McCoy is gone. I think it was a possibility based on potential trades, but when they didn’t happen I think they decided to just keep him.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:16 am
Rod help me out because I’m lazy, are you telling me we can cut those guys with no dead money? Also, who is behind Smith and Gholston, because they seem to be in line to be next men up. Ryan Smith can go f&($ck himself.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:16 am
“How did the Rams, with arguably the most talented D-Line in the NFL, do in the Super Bowl against the Patriots? How much pressure did they put on Brady?”
——————
This is the best comment of them all. The Rams absolutely shut down the Patriots. Did you even watch the game? They gave up 13 points to the greatest QB in the history of football!!! Wtf are you talking about? Just stop already.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:17 am
I wish the Bucs would load up on O-Line talent every year. We’ve NEVER had a dominant O-Line in our history.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:18 am
The Rams have a dang good secondary and still lost. It’s the patriots bro, they outcoach their opponents.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:18 am
McCoy is gone. It’s done. Don’t even entertain the possibility. Watch the press conferences.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:19 am
Alaskan – If you play a base 3-4, then you have McCoy, Vita and JPP on the field, with Nassib as a sub who gets a lot of plays – and all four when you play 4-3. McCoy isn’t an ideal 3-4 DE, but he’s worlds better than the other options – and as BA pointed out, you play nickel like half of the time anyways, so you still need four defensive lineman. Without McCoy in the 3-4 in the middle you have Vita, who averaged 3.5 sacks per year in college, and… nothing. JPP is a very good overall DE and should do fine in the 3-4 as a run stuffer and a rusher. Nassib, in my mind he’s still a wildcard, but productive. In any case if you dumb McCoy you’re saying Nassib IS your guy and you’re betting a ton on that.
I will say Gholston fits the profile of a 3-4 end, but he hasn’t shown any production in 2 years. After that, the depth chart is worrisome, and that’s why they should try everything to keep McCoy around. I understand that’s unlikely at this point, but I don’t know why anyone would celebrate cutting a good and productive player who is clearly the best inside defensive lineman we have – and it’s not even close, Vita will have to improve dramatically to even get close to what McCoy current is on a decline.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:19 am
Again I’ll say it… DLine is a huge need… even with an aging JPP, Vita Vea, and Nassib you still have NO DEPTH behind it. We’ve now invested 9 picks (7 of them from rounds 1-3) the last 4 years at DB and 2 on the DL (in rounds 1-3). The ability to in address it, in a draft rich of defensive line talent will comeback to bite us. Let’s hope they can find some late round gems tomorrow… not counting on it…
April 27th, 2019 at 2:20 am
I wouldn’t say the Rams “absolutely shut down the Patriots.” They certainly played very well.
Brady still threw for 260 yards and Edelman was unstoppable. They sacked Brady all of ONE TIME.
Either way, not the greatest example I gave and I admit that. But my point was more about the quick passing and how the pass rush doesn’t slow that down. We couldn’t stop a slant to save our lives last year.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:22 am
Alaskan – The only dead money is $148k on Ryan Smith, otherwise they’re free and clear. As for Evan Smith, he was the Ryan Smith of the offense last year, he was awful – there’s a reason that Benenoch kept his job. As for Gholston, I don’t actually completely hate him – but I’d much much much rather McCoy – in any case if you’re swapping them 1 for 1, the depth chart is the same behind them. I see McCoy playing DE in this 3-4 defense, just like Sapp did in Oakland. Yeah, it’s not ideal, but good players make it work.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:23 am
It doesn’t matter if the Bucs had the #1 pass rush in the NFL. If you had a starting secondary this year of Ryan Smith and Carlton Davis and sprinkle in a little VH3, you’d get SMASHED over the entire season.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:23 am
One guy goes Down on our DLine and all of a sudden we’re relying on Noah Spence, Will Gholston or Bo Allen to fill the void… and do you think JPP, VV, and Nassib are going to play 100% of the snaps? You need a rotation… and right now I’m not counting on the bucs resigning McCoy.. also wouldn’t be surprised if he’s in a Buc uni either…
April 27th, 2019 at 2:23 am
You can’t break on a quick slant when you line up 10 yards back. That was a scheme issue designed to not give up the big play but instead get shredded by short passes in the middle. I am so happy we won’t be seeing that $hit anymore!
April 27th, 2019 at 2:26 am
@BucsBandit
You didn’t watch the game, clearly. Holding a team to 13 points shoud win you every single game. You take that every single time. It sounds like you expect to shut teams out and prevent anyone from having a good game. You said it yourself, it’s a passing league. That doesn’t happen. Teams are going to get yards. Teams are going to score points. But pressure creates turnovers. The more pressure you put on the QB, the more mistakes he makes. How do you beat the Brad’s, Manning’s, and Rodgers’s of the league? You draft 6 secondary players? No, you apply relentless pressure. Even the best will eventually mess up and give you the ball.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:26 am
Alaskan – even during that scheme we got burned deep quite a few times too, so it was definitely a PERSONNEL issue.
Anyway… thanks for the reasonable discussion, guys, even if we don’t agree on the strategy Licht/Arians is taking on this Draft.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:27 am
Rod I love when you say I read comic books grrr I’m so mad lol. I’m not a McCoy hater, I feel bad for the guy that he’s had to be the face of some of the worst defenses ever. He is no longer worth 13 M and we don’t have 13 M even if he is. At this point I agree the smart thing to do would be to keep him because we completely failed to address the line but I don’t see it happening without sacrificing all depth for an overpaid starter….even if he is one of our better starters.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:28 am
Hawaiian – I actually watched every play of that Super Bowl. As I just stated, not the best example I gave. I was just trying to make a point about the underneath slants (same ones that crushed us all season since we couldn’t cover it nor tackle).
April 27th, 2019 at 2:29 am
Yeah bro I love the debate and I don’t have $hit to do…I think the big plays were miscommunications due to lack of quality coaching and also them being rookies. The big plays were complete breakdowns most every time which reflects bad coaching
April 27th, 2019 at 2:32 am
For the idea that the pass rush will fix God awful secondary players… I point to the 2003 Buccaneers.
After the 2002 season the Bucs are cap strapped, for real – not like the one now where they can just redo a deal and have plenty of room – but they had to let Dexter Jackson walk. They then took their pocket in the ace, the nickel Dwight Smith, and moved him to safety because they had no choice. They had garbage at corner after the move.
Well in the famous MNF game against Indy, Brian Kelly get hurt. They have nothing to play at corner, and with that all-time great defensive line getting pressure, Manning just again and again throws to where Brian Kelly would have been. Kelly is out for the year and the Bucs miss the playoffs because of one guy, Brian Kelly getting hurt. Sapp and Rice couldn’t get enough pressure on the QB to overcome having a single garbage player at corner. The 2018 Bucs had garbage at a lot more than one position.
Defensive backs matter, it’s why they make so much money. Yes, you must also get pressure, but you can have all the pressure in the world, it doesn’t matter if your corners can’t consistently give you 2.5 seconds of coverage – and the Bucs corners couldn’t do that.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:34 am
Alaskan – I wasn’t GRRRR’ing you actually, you at least make some sense even if we don’t agree on everything. The GRRRR’ing is just to trigger the morons on here that have an irrational hatred of McCoy and literally think he’s an awful player – and they just repeat what they hear blowhards on talk radio say. When you GRRRRR them they get very very angry.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:35 am
Hawaii – again, I’m not disagreeing with you on the value of the pass rush. BUT…
Clearly, drafting a corner was a priority in this draft, and after Kwon leaving (and our piss poor tackling), and adding to it us moving to a 3-4… White made the most sense at #5.
After that, corner was clearly a higher priority over D-Line with us being faced with a Smith/Davis/VH3 starting rotation. Can you agree on that?
So once we traded down in the 3rd, and maybe we did so because they didn’t see any D-Line guys they really felt strongly about, maybe there was more value and potential impact for the secondary by drafting a 4.3 corner with a lot of potential, as well as a safety prospect?
JUST REALIZED SOMETHING… was Jamel Dean also drafted to be a return man for us? Our return game definitely sucked last year.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:39 am
I know what the grr is.. that’s why I love it!
April 27th, 2019 at 2:41 am
Looking at OTC the Bucs had a rookie poll salary estimated at $9,754,088 – so it’s a bit higher than I was expecting – I thought it would be closer to $8.5m. Anywho, they could cut Evan Smith, Ryan Smith and Gholston, then they’d need to create probably another $4million and still keep McCoy.
To me, the place I’d start with that, is to go talk to McCoy and see if he’d take a $4m pay cut. I think he might since I doubt this late in the offseason he’s getting $9m. If he takes the cut then it’s a super easy decision. If the doesn’t then, as suggested, go to David, offer a new deal. If you can’t get that done, then I guess do what you have to do, but man, letting a good defensive player go on a defense that lacks good players, I don’t think anyone should be happy about that or writing early obituaries.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:45 am
BucsBandit – Is Dean a returner? I haven’t seen that anywhere. Based on all the knee injuries I’d think they’d keep him away from that, at least early on.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:46 am
Not saying DB wasn’t the focus, just they shouldn’t have been so narrow sighted in how they approached it.
Rd 2 came, Licht knew he wanted a DB and there was gonna be a run so he panicked and drafted Bunting who I suppose he had rated higher than Dean.
Then after trading down and missing guys like Winovich, Ferguson, and Saunders they were surprised to see Dean there. So despite drafting Bunting already they drafted another corner they really liked and passed on another lineman in Ximines.
The Edwards pick to me is the most puzzling, I won’t lie, I don’t know who TF this guy is but I know there was still trench help available and still might be.
I love the White and Dean picks and I hope I’m wrong about the other two. I just feel like why draft more young guys when we have young guys in developmental stages already.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:49 am
Rod there will be another wave of FA as well as other signings we will need to make during the season for inured players. So take that 4M and double it to probably cutting all those players and still having to cut another 8M to keep McCoy and still have emergency cap. Personally that is not how I would run the team (not my job though so that really doesn’t matter).
April 27th, 2019 at 2:54 am
Alaskan – I don’t disagree with you on who we picked, Licht has not done a good job at corner, but at safety he’s been OK with Evans and Whitehead. Hopefully whoever was scouting corners and giving Licht his info was fired and then set on fire, and in any case replaced.
As for picking 2 more corners and a S, that’s fine by me. Also we pick at the top of the 4th, so if we get a d-lineman there, instead of at the bottom of the 3rd, it’s not a big difference in value. However I’m thinking they go LB if there’s anyone left. Looking briefly over the charts the guy who, on paper with no scouting, looks to make sense is OLB Justin Hollins – he’s a 3-4 guy, runs a 4.5. The Bucs want speed, and adding a 4.4 and a 4.5 LB is doing just that.
Also no issue if they go d-line, but still have a big hole at LB, and the Bucs have done well with picking LBs recently. Plus if Beckwith did return, which I don’t expect, he’s an inside guy, so adding an outside guy seems smart.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:54 am
Hahah. 3 acl injuries
I’m so excited the day is coming to clean House
Worst GM ever
Total moron
April 27th, 2019 at 2:56 am
Licht works for Sean Payton
April 27th, 2019 at 2:57 am
Alaskan – The $4m cut on McCoy would be in addition to cutting $8m – and the Bucs right now I think have $1.5-2m in space, so that would give them around $4m in cap space for emergency. I don’t really see the Bucs doing anything in FA from this point out other than min salary guys who would be a wash against other min salary guys. Again, I don’t think all of this is likely to happen, but it’s a legit scenario worth considering in any case.
April 27th, 2019 at 2:57 am
Glazers are incompetent boobs
Drank the tard koolaid
April 27th, 2019 at 2:57 am
You guys do realize we have our best right? It’s actually way better than the alternative. Seriously!!!!
April 27th, 2019 at 2:59 am
Just Clean House
Trade the whole franchise to New England for a 7th rounder
April 27th, 2019 at 3:02 am
“ I don’t really see the Bucs doing anything in FA from this point out other than min salary guys who would be a wash against other min salary guys.”
Rod- I hope you are wrong about this because I really don’t know who our RG is going to be. Cappa who couldn’t beat out Benenoch? Evan Smith? There’s got to be a cap casualty somewhere who can help us because we sure as hell need it.
April 27th, 2019 at 3:50 am
You naysayers are pitiful. If you cant see that these picks were coaches picks you know nothing. We are changing the defensive scheme entirely and Bowles is geting the players he needs to do that. Our offense is serviceable at the moment. So focusing on defense is the smart way to go and retooling that defensive backfield which was oh so offensive is the way to go. Im beginning to believe that you naysayers would find a way to complain even if they drafted all the players you think they should have. Lol.
April 27th, 2019 at 5:09 am
To me this day 2 of the draft made it obvious, that JL is no longer in charge of the player personnel. Drafting just the same positions as last year would be insane, if it was the same guy calling the shots.
What I don’t get is that we regularly pick players which all analysts have around #10 in their position group, while #1, 4, 6 and 7 is still on the board. If you go CB instead of OL or DL why not Greedy Williams and his relationship to Devin White?
I would have liked Risner (T from Kansas State) or Jenkins (C/G from Mississippi State) at #39 to solidify the right side of our O-line and helping our run game – and I pray to be proved wrong!
Go Bucs!
April 27th, 2019 at 5:32 am
Interesting early-morning back-and-forth, but no one addressed what I still think is the major issue: TEAM-BUILDING. Jason Licht said when he was hired back in 2014 that we’d ‘build through the draft’. And I know every GM says that, but some actually DO IT. The Bucs aren’t ‘building through the draft’ … we’re continually FIXING PROBLEMS left over from the PREVIOUS administration. Musical coaches every 2-3 years has totally screwed us. Well that combined with meh GMs who lack vision for what a winning TEAM should look like.
And Rod, since you referenced OTC earlier, they’re the ones who said that we need to come up with $3.9 mil in additional salary Cap $$$ to sign our rookies (and that’s WITH GMC built into the roster). We could get real close to that by cutting Will Gholston’s $3.7 mil (don’t like that idea personally) OR by cutting Ryan Smith & Evan Smith. Might be mistaken, but we don’t have to make any of those cuts for awhile (we’ve got time IOW). So yes, Bucs can keep McCoy at $13 mil, and I hope we do, just not at $13 mil (Bucs now NEED a couple of FAs to fix the running game … a RG & a RB to complement Barber).
April 27th, 2019 at 5:54 am
I loved every pick once I figured out what they were doing. Our greatest weakness was pass protection and I believe last night they went a long way toward fixing it . One thing for sure, Arian could care less about our unprofessional opinions, he is going to fix this mess and I for one support him 100 percent. And trust me Licht has very little to do with it.
.
April 27th, 2019 at 5:59 am
Not what I expected, reserve judgment until week 5 of the regular season. Give Arians and Bowles a chance.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:01 am
Can we draft a GM in the fourth round?
April 27th, 2019 at 6:04 am
Funny how we strive every year for the race to the bottom only to not even win the draft. Seems we can’t even do that right. We use our premium top of the second round pick on an obscure DB from a 1-11 college. Another one of Licht’s “what?” moments. Bunting was not the BPA
NFL early grade: Day 2 grade: C
overall B- so far
April 27th, 2019 at 6:20 am
I just think its funny that for months we all said that BA and Bowles were running the show.
Now something happens that people don’t like and they call for Licht’s head lol
April 27th, 2019 at 6:21 am
If these guys is what Bowles thinks we need to improve the defense then good. Get your guys.
1 DB wasn’t going to turn this secondary around.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:29 am
Joey….why do we even have a gm?
April 27th, 2019 at 6:38 am
It seems Licht doesn’t understand how to build a defense. I thought Bruce was gonna have final say on who we pick, evidently Licht convinced him that you build the defense from the back end forward never bothering with the fact that if you have minimal pressure up front, it doesn’t matter how good your DB’s are when a QB has all day to get rid of the ball. This is one of the main reasons our record has been so bad under Licht’s direction. I imagine we’ll be signing numerous D Lineman off of waivers in the coming months.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:40 am
Terrible draft, right position but wrong players in the second and third. Our D-line is going to fall apart this year. Just wait and see. Gump should have picked at least one D lineman in the third. Worst gm in the nfl strikes again. Total waste.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:40 am
Im still hoping for Renell Wren. I would also like to see them take a shot on guys with upside who fell cause of injury concerns like Christian Miller and Rodney Anderson. Dru Samia is probably the best OG left. Charles Omenihu is another guy I wouldn’t mind.
Really hoping they address the trenches and get a value RB and WR with the last 4 picks. Maybe trade down and get an extra 4th or 5th.
There is a report out there that BA was targeting the WR that the Steelers picked at the top of the 3rd last night, Diontae Johnson. Im gonna guess a WR gets drafted by the Bucs today.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:41 am
2019 record 5-11 again
2020 record 5-11 again
2021 new GM, new coaching staff.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:42 am
Smh. This guy has no value for DE. Another year of bad defense and QBs having all day to shred us.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:42 am
Gotta say Im.not surprised much. The corners playing ofd and someone always being open, the lbs and corners never blitzing. With the new defensive scheme its obvious we will finally see these wrs getting hit at the line and blitzes uo the middle
April 27th, 2019 at 6:51 am
Grossly incompetent draft. Right position in 2nd and 3rd, wrong players. Should have picked at least one DL or OT. Gump strikes again.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:52 am
If it makes you guys feel better, the Packers have drafted 8 DBs in rounds 1 and 2 since 2015 lol.
April 27th, 2019 at 6:52 am
Where’s all the idiots claiming 10-6 or 11-5 lol?
6-10
April 27th, 2019 at 6:57 am
jb™️ Says:
April 27th, 2019 at 6:38 am
It seems Licht doesn’t understand how to build a defense. I thought Bruce was gonna have final say on who we pick, evidently Licht convinced him that you build the defense from the back end forward
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Yes, the evil Jason Licht convinced the 2-time Coach of the Year Bruce Arians how to build a team. The guy who has turned around every franchise he has been a part of doesn’t know what he is doing and needs instruction from Licht on how to build a team.
Some of you are ridiculous lmao.
Maybe, just MAYBE, Arians and Bowles got the guys they wanted?
April 27th, 2019 at 7:01 am
Whoever they pick today will probably run a 4.4 or better
April 27th, 2019 at 7:14 am
“When you draft for NEED you get Fired”. What happened to drafting the BPA?
April 27th, 2019 at 7:31 am
Licht didn’t make these picks…..Licht didn’t choose the draft strategy to load up on DBs……That was certainly a BA decision along with Bowles…..and Bowles selected the players.
Why can’t you guys see that?
Bowles essentially replaced some of Licht’s mistakes.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:39 am
When you draft for need you get fired, when does that happen? Can it happen now?
April 27th, 2019 at 7:44 am
Bowles defense will use alot of 5 secondary players with 3 down linemen.
There will be alot of disguised coverages and schemes designed to confuse the offense.
Speed and depth in secondary is very important to this plan.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:46 am
Remember when I facetiously said
trade each round picks in 2019
for corresponding picks in 2020 ….
it sounds like a better strategy than the “just the way our board fell” explanation from BACK stabbing Jason Licht that should have been fired with Koetter …say what you want about HC Koetter….it is clear he didn’t have a defense and Jason threw him under the bus to save his job…..
I saw the very FIRST preseason game
I saw the very first Bucs home game win
I have seen 250+ Buc games live…
I have never felt this hopeless and helpless
You do UNDERSTAND Jameis is still a ??????? and not drafting consensus QUALITY OL help only muddles the water
Gawd I am PIZZZZED
April 27th, 2019 at 7:48 am
All I am saying is that we got fleeced by the Rams. First of all you trade back with them and do not get their first pick in the third which was #79, you got their 94th and comp pick #99. First mistake, then they trade back into the 3rd round ahead of the 99th pick. The Glazers should be asking what the hell was that. That being said, I am a UM fan, they can make me feel better by picking Joe Jackson (edge) or Gerald Willis (DT). Both will be better pros than college guys, interesting through out the year the UM d-line was compared to the Clemson d-line and they played an attacking defense, why do you think the turnover chain came out so much the last two years.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:50 am
I see what you see, TBBF, and it reinforces what a piss poor job Licht has done.
Looking at this now, I believe when Jon Robinson left for Tennessee, he took our ability to evaluate/draft talent with him.
We are essentially replacing three 2nd round picks and a 1st.
I just don’t get why Licht did what he did. Did he have a damn plan? If we suck this year, fans will be so done with him.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:52 am
Yep. 6-10 at the best. 2nd and 3rd = throw away picks.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:52 am
I have never looked so forward to riding around on my lawnmower for 2 1/2 hours than today….
April 27th, 2019 at 7:56 am
What a pathetic number of armchair GMs here. If you act like you can grade a draft at this point you are a complete moron. Everyone chill the f*ck out.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:57 am
SteveK Says:
April 27th, 2019 at 7:50 am
I see what you see, TBBF, and it reinforces what a piss poor job Licht has done.
I just don’t get why Licht did what he did. Did he have a damn plan? If we suck this year, fans will be so done with him.
That’s just it….it wasn’t his plan at all….it was Bowles plan and these were Bowles selections……
Now….as far as the actual Bowles selections, it remains to be seen if they are good.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:57 am
Today we draft 3 kickers.
April 27th, 2019 at 7:59 am
So holding the very average Carolina Panthers to 13(which it was 17 and still gave up 300 yards passing ) points in one game means the secondary was okay? Because Cam is never holding onto the ball too long trying to make a play or that O line was anything special. By your logic the Saints defense was all world holding the Panthers to 9 points 2 weeks later. Makes sense right?
If trying to make a point we need DL help that’s all you need to say. Don’t try to sound like the smartest guy in the room when you aren’t
This is coming from someone who is just as frustrated with the draft as Chase Winovich was there in the third and we are on the clock and we traded out.
April 27th, 2019 at 8:07 am
have been saying on this site since 2016 jason licht is THE WORST gm in pro football… he will retain his trophy for another year as the bucs will be 4-12 in 2019
April 27th, 2019 at 8:10 am
joeypoppems you do realize the AZ Cardinals are neck in neck w the bucs as THE worst team in the NFL because bruce arians has no clue on building a winning team
April 27th, 2019 at 8:10 am
Gerald Willis III…today !
April 27th, 2019 at 8:13 am
The one thing I will say is our front office is nothing if not consistent! No one can win if you don’t have the players ( ex: Bucs ). Two nights in a row I have quit watching the draft cause I was sickened at the results, when so many good players were still on the board! As I said we are the most consistent drafting team in the nfl. Gotta love the losers again????????????????????
April 27th, 2019 at 8:16 am
By the way this is year after year after year! Do we even have a big board or do we go into every round with blindfolds on? Just curious cause that is what appears to be happening.
April 27th, 2019 at 8:19 am
Duthsty, I think you over rate this team. 4 -12? We will have first pick next year unless some other team tanks more than us.
April 27th, 2019 at 8:29 am
Old Time Buc, you are prolly right, this gm for 5 years has taken a last place team and built it into a worse team; the nfl sets it up so its ALMOST impossible to suck for this long yet jason gump is doing this with ease
April 27th, 2019 at 8:35 am
Yeah man I don’t have words…
Should have moved back in R2 not R3 per my / internet’s draft boards
No trenches… that’s not building anything. Bravo gump
April 27th, 2019 at 8:35 am
This team is obviously not going to win much next year. There are too many holes, the salary cap is a mess, and the talent evaluators stink. We are going to have to run through a few bad years to retool. The regime is obviously trying to put their best face on that.
There is no way this team gets anywhere near .500 next year. No way. Not in this division where everyone else is getting better. No wonder the Glazers had no problem sacrificing a home game to London this year. They know the team will be bad anyway.
Another wasted year.
April 27th, 2019 at 8:37 am
If the Bucs picked in the top 5 of the draft they will be ok. Oh wait, they did, and got worse. Fireeeeee Licht!
April 27th, 2019 at 8:40 am
Joe, time for a Fireeee Licht thread.
April 27th, 2019 at 8:49 am
Jameis Almighty thats gold!! Doesnt it hurt anyone to look around the nfl and see the moves winning franchises make and as bucs fans we are going into the season knowing the playoffs will not happen but maybe 7-9!!! WTF please glazers clean house start over because this is painful and pathetic
April 27th, 2019 at 8:54 am
never heard of an “illiteracy test”
April 27th, 2019 at 9:05 am
What the hell are we doing….? How many corners/db’s do we need to draft? Wasted so many picks the past 4 years on the secondary Hargreaves, Ryan Smith, Whitehead,Carlton Davis, mj Stewart, bunting, and these 2 now Where is the trench picks!!! Wtf
April 27th, 2019 at 9:08 am
2018:
Sacks per game.
Bucs > 2.4
Patriots > 2.1
Defense pass completion %:
*Bucs > 72.47% > 32nd
Patriots > 59.31% > 2nd
*No other team was over 70%
April 27th, 2019 at 9:31 am
OK, everybody take a deep breath………..wooooooooo-saaaaaaaaaaaaa…….
Feel better?
Alright, here’s a theory. We can agree that, in principle, Arians is a far better coach than Koetter and Bowles is light-years better than Smith, right?
Is it so foreign to think that maybe they evaluated the roster differently? Perhaps discovered that players were out of position or not given enough opportunity?
Maybe they think Cappa can play…with extra coaching. Maybe they think that their FA OLBs can rush the passer effectively enough in addition to the 3 down linemen we already have.
I say that to say this, we got a heck of a lot faster and deeper on the defensive side of the ball BOTH in FA and in the draft. It was a huge weakness last season that was addressed this season.
They’re not all names that we recognize or like, but we improved dramatically.
Ya’ll can jump off the wagon if you want. I’ll tell you this about my Hokie Alum, they don’t quit. They are family. Arians is not going to allow these guys to fail. I have hope, real hope for the 1st time in a long time. If you don’t believe me, find a Virginia Tech Alum.
We have COMPETENT coaching for the 1st time in decades. In that I take solace.
April 27th, 2019 at 9:38 am
I don’t kniow what is more enjoyable: watching the NFL draft where every player is destined to be an All-Pro HoFer, or watching casual fans and casual journalists melt down.
It’s funny how on one hand casual fans say “Bruce Arians is in charge of the draft”, and in the next moment it’s all “fire Jason Gump, the worst GM in football.”
I’ve never been a huge fan of the draft: too much hype, and nobody really knows if any of these players pan out.n The NFL draft has *always* been a crapshoot with as many successes as failures, where even “can’t miss” guys go bust.
The entire defense and ST’s are being completely re-tooled. No one knows how good many players on the defense are because of years of terrible coaching, especially on defense. No one knows how any of these players will fit into what will be the most significant rebuild of one side of the ball in Bucs history: going from years of soft 4-3 “Tampa 2-ish” zone to an attacking 3-4. No one knows how this coaching staff has evaluated players vis-a-vis fitting into the coming schemes.
Bellyache all you want about “Joe ‘Tarzan’ Sock’em was on the board and the Bucs passed. Fire Jason Gump!1!!11!!!” One common denominator in all the Bucs picks so far: ALL are very fast, and ALL have a story of hard work to get where they are, and NONE of them are questionable-character guys.
The defense and ST’s are getting a serious injection of speed and quicks. That is a great thing.
Imma wait to see how all this pans out. I don’t get my torches and pitchforks out until halfway through a season unless a player or coaches make obvious game blunders.
April 27th, 2019 at 9:42 am
I don’t know how many casual fans remember, but the lack of depth in the d-backfield last season was a killer when starters went down. In 2018, “next man up” usually meant signing some UPS driver off the street.
April 27th, 2019 at 11:01 am
Mr Licht ,
If you really think the Dline is ok I have a number for a good couselor you can use.
April 27th, 2019 at 11:19 am
Licht enough of your BS. I know the Glazers & BA fell for it, but the fans are a little bit smarter. Same crap year after year. The Stupid ass Glazer’s need to sell the team or Move it to London & put us out of our misery.
April 27th, 2019 at 11:32 am
Well I agree with whoever said we need to find some gems in the late rounds. As far as I can judge by the players we have selected we may have one at this point.
SB is up in the air at my judgement, I will give him a chance but we totally blew the trade back scenario in the third round, TOTALLY! We have not drafted the BPA method or totally for need which I heard gets you fired. There still are a few good players left and it would be nice if at least one of them became a Buc. Hard to be positive when you see how the other teams are drafting and sliding up or down for positive improvements!