“Play Jameis Winston. They Need To”
November 6th, 2018
The Bucs are in a pickle and there is no easy way out.
You have a head coach that has lost faith in the franchise quarterback and is watching his team circle the drain. Like anyone else who is fighting the quicksand, Bucs Bit-O-Honey-snacking coach Dirk Koetter is playing the part of a gambling (panicking?) coach.
A coach who would try a fake punt on fourth down and nine from your own-26 is also the same kind of coach who would turn to a journeyman backup to try to squeeze out a couple of precious wins.
In other words, Koetter is constantly checking his cell phone looking for that dreaded text message to come to a meeting upstairs at One Buc Palace.
So with Koetter, to hell with the future and screw the franchise. Not my problem now. Will cross that bridge when it gets near. My future is now.
On the other hand, you have ownership, with a decision on their hands that could cost them $21 million. Who is the real America’s Quarterback? The guy who went to a Pro Bowl his rookie year? The guy who damn near got the Bucs into the playoffs in his second year, giving the team only its second winning season in eight years? The guy who often gave the Bucs a lead in the fourth quarter of games only to watch this shameful defense vomit up the lead? Or the guy who after serving a three-game sentence from NFL strongman Roger Goodell looked more like Josh Freeman after he went mental?
Joe has seen this movie before.
In the late 1970s, Cardinals owner Bill Bidwill ordered his general manager to draft a quarterback out of Missouri named Steve Pisarkiewicz. He was a giant stiff. Had the body of Jim Kelly, the ‘fro of Dan Marino, the mobility of a park bench and the head of a cocker spaniel. He. Was. Brutal.
Bidwill, as he was wont to do, always liked to make a splash with coaching hires but rarely got one right. Each hire was, well, unique including Don Coryell who came from the storied football powerhouse known as San Diego State.
Coryell flamed out and Bidwill replaced him with Bud Wilkinson, the ancient Oklahoma Sooners legend. He was sort of a button-down, soft-spoken, Brooks Brothers, corporate version of Barry Switzer. Stuck in the 1950s, Wilkinson actually tried to run the wishbone in the late 1970s. In the NFL.
Bidwill wanted Pisarkiewicz to play. You know, to see what he had and to see if he was the proverbial quarterback of the future. Wilkinson refused because Pisarkiewicz was godawful. Wilkinson didn’t want Pisarkiewicz’s L’s hanging around his neck. The old coach preferred veteran Pro Bowler Jim Hart.
Bidwill fired Wilkinson for insubordination. Bidwill replaced the famed college coach with Hall of Fame safety Larry Wilson who had strict instructions to start Pisarkiewicz. The rotten quarterback, as it turned out, followed Wilkinson out the door at season’s end.
(Trivia: Pisarkiewicz only won two games in his three-year NFL career. His first came against a rookie making his first start in 1979. Some guy named Joe Montana.)
Koetter and Jameis and the Bucs’ current situation remind Joe exactly of Wilkinson and Pisarkiewicz and Bidwill in 1979.
Like Wilkinson then, Koetter is desperate for a win now. He is in full CYA mode and Joe can’t blame him. The only difference here is Jameis showed significant promise whereas Pisarkiewicz was flat garbage. After a hitch in the CFL, Pisarkiewicz doomed his football career by flashing a college chick.
If the Bucs lose Sunday to fall to 3-6 and Koetter remains stubborn and plays Fitz, would Koetter be forcing the hand of Team Glazer to make a move midseason so that Jameis gets snaps? Remember, Team Glazer has never made a head coaching move midseason.
At any rate, the NFL Live crowd on BSPN is unanimous that the Bucs need to play Jameis now so the powers that be can decide if Jameis is worth salvaging or if the Bucs need to start a hunt for a quarterback for 2019 and beyond.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:05 am
makes sense
but this franchise usually does the opposite
November 6th, 2018 at 11:06 am
Are you going to continue to bring down the organization in order to defend Mr. Magoo? I’m sure you have a great understanding of what this does to the team. Fans want wins, not garbage-time stats to continue his Marino/Manning numbers for Winson. No one is worried that Winston’s HOF numbers are waning because of his poor play except this website. You have no clue on pulse of the real fans.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:08 am
After a 3 game suspension for groping the Uber driver, on the heels of something similar during college, and an NFL history of bad decisions at QB, what more do we need to tell us that Jameis is not the future of the franchise? The NFL Live crowd did not, as I did, pay for season tickets to watch the Bucs flounder game after game. The NFL Live crowd did not, as I did, sit in sweltering 90+ degree weather to watch a team lose game after game. Draft a new QB in 2019, fire Koetter and get this team back on track.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:09 am
The alternative is to let Koetter play this out with Fitz. But as soon as were eliminated from the playoffs (which will be soon) start looking for the new coach.
The criteria should be whether there are credible experienced coaches out there, who have developed young QB’s, who believe in Winston and want the job. Then play him next year with the new guy.
Koetter may ruin Winston if he puts him back in, they have obviously parted ways. Even after the Cleveland win Koetter couldn’t wait to state that JW changed a play.
I think the Glazer’s are just giving him more rope. Let him try with the Fitzmagic show, throwing Jameis in now with this coach is a bad plan IMO.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:09 am
Dude if giving up 30+ points before the half in multiple games isn’t enough then what is?
November 6th, 2018 at 11:09 am
Play Jameis… to truly tank the season. If thats what you want to do. New regime could probably use better draft picks… so, I guess it makes sense.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:14 am
Newsflash: he’s not worth it. Leave him benched and uninjured.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:16 am
I 1000% agree that they need to start Jameis. THIS. WEEK.
And for the rest of the season. The Jameis haters are in hog heaven right now, but what’s best for the franchise is to start Jameis to see if he can work through these issues he is having.
Last year this time all the haters were making some bold predictions for the off season. None of them happened. So Koetter being gone is not 100%. Neither is Winston being gone.
In fact, I think it is more likely that Winston remains, and if that is the case, this ownership (and Licht who will remain) needs to make a decision based on up to date information.
And, Seminole Bill, the Uber thing happened three years ago. The suspension this year does not change that. Three years with no trouble tells us Winston has conquered his off field issues.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:17 am
“Remember, Team Glazer has never made a coaching move midseason.”
Considering that formula has produced pretty terrible results maybe we should change it up.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:18 am
Eric Says
“The alternative is to let Koetter play this out with Fitz. But as soon as were eliminated from the playoffs (which will be soon) start looking for the new coach.”
Well, I don’t think Koetter wanted to bench Winston. So you are talking about tying his hands and then firing him for not getting things done with his hands tired. Not really fair.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:20 am
I could go for returning to Jameis if the Bucs lose at home to Washington…..but as long as Fitz wins….he stays.
The Glazers don’t need to see what they have with Winston…..they know….they have had 4 years to know.
Yes he had a very bad game or two…..and yes he deserved to be benched and yes he deserves to play again….for the Bucs.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:20 am
So Koetter is desperate, here is a novel idea. The Rays took the league by storm with their “let’s just pitch relievers” rotation. Why not plan on mixing in Jameis and Fitz throughout the game? It would require coaches to game plan for two very different quarterbacking styles, and might cause defenses to get uncomfortable like throwing in a change up. I figure we really haven’t got anything to lose, why not try to do something different.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:21 am
Jameis is not going anywhere, so, they need to bring in someone that can develop him like Bruce Arians. The Glazers know that this staff is not good a developing players. Name one player in the past few years who has gotten better over time. Cricket, cricket.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:22 am
Jameis has had his chance. What more do you people need to see? I do not blame Koetter at all for wanting to roll with Fiz. Maybe he gets us to .500 and saves Koetters job. We blow up the defense. No one wants to see Jameis.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:24 am
JBF, to play JW and even consider that he may have a future with the Bucs is a clear sign that the Glazers don’t care about their fan base which has already been torn apart by JW and all his antics, on and off the field. Koetter knows he’s gone so why play the divisive, immature, coach killing QB. I’m sure there’s a lot more about JW that will never surface. It’s time to start from scratch again with QB and defense. Licht should’ve unloaded lots of players before the trade deadline but he too is in CYA mode.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:24 am
We can only hope that the Glazers decide to sell the Bucs too!
AROUND THE NFL STORIES
Glazer’s To Sell?
Published by Britbuc on October 21, 2018
…
News and rumours are often the same thing where the stock market is concerned. One such rumour to become public could be very interesting as it pertains to the ownership of English soccer club, Manchester United.
Currently the soccer club is owned by the Glazer family, who have often been accused of putting the soccer club before the Buccaneers by fans. If the rumours are indeed true as reported by John Robinson of UK news oulet The Mirror, Saudi Crown Prince Mohammad bin Salman is looking to launch a 5.2 billion dollar takeover of the soccer club.
Those who are either aware of the situation in Manchester, UK or that read my article “A Tale of Two Sports” will know that when the Glazer family took control over Manchester United they did by taking a lot of debt to fund the purchase, making them very unpopular with United fans. The amount being offered by Mohammad bin Salman would not only clear those debts but also present a opportunity for the Glazer’s to make a significant profit.
Forbes has the personal wealth of the Crown Prince estimated at over a thousand billion dollars, meaning an offer of such magnitude wouldn’t cause any financial burden to the Saudi royal. Additionally bin Salman has stated his desire to purchase Manchester United, who he considers “the most prestigious soccer team in the world.” With the share price of Manchester United escalating on the New York Stock Exchange this sale could be a real possibility, meaning the Glazers can return their sole focus to making The Bucs a contender.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:24 am
The Glazers took him down from the side of the stadium….That was a telling sign from the owners. Personally I don’t think they mind rebuilding….its more profitable to sell hope then to contend year after year.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:25 am
JoeBucsFan has a ton of money riding on the success of America’s Turnover Machine. Now they want the coach fired so that bet can come through for them, one problem, America’s Turnover Machine is the same QB he was in college and you can’t recover from that in NFL. #MOVEON
November 6th, 2018 at 11:25 am
Let Jameis start, except for his swallowers , who really cares at this point. I have complete faith in that he will fail and we will simply be in the exact same place 8 weeks from now. Needing a new QB and coaching staff.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:26 am
Bobby M.—
The Winston lovers don’t see the big picture, they think inside the box. They do not factor in off the field behavior, and the on the field play is abhorrent alone. Winston jerseys are 50% off right now, I’m not an economist or in marketing but that picture is clear.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:35 am
I’m on the other side of this fence. I really think the Koetter/Winston relationship which was strained is now broken. Only way I play Winston is if Koetter is fired in season, which I don’t recommend. Next season one or both needs to be gone. I can be talked into a year with a new offseason and year with Winston with a new coach. I have a hard time with any argument that Koetter returns.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:36 am
Jameis, don’t You ever hit that field again, stay on the sidelines and act like you are hurt, so You can get out of this Sh*t Hole! Let #14, keep losing for this losing franchise, don’t forget,#14, makes everyone better! But the team is still losing……LMAO
November 6th, 2018 at 11:36 am
We are just getting average players not extremely talented ones especially on defense is Spence really that bad that he can’t get 3rd down snaps, is Cappa so bad that he can’t rotate with Benecoch, I’m starting to think it’s coaching and schemes. We have McCoy, Vea, JPP, Spence, Alexander, David, Beckwith, Hargreaves, Davis, Evans, Whitehead a good DC can make this D respectable. Offense is loaded just need a running game and offensive line improvements.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:36 am
When the Bucs win — whoever the hell is the quarterback — helps all media covering the Bucs and that includes radio, internet, print and TV. Joe doesn’t see anything positive with Ryan Fitzpatrick starting, today, tomorrow or three years or more in the future. Joe has seen promise with Jameis. Sorry if that offends you.
Additionally, Joe has not called for Dirk Koetter’s head. Joe has pointed out the future for Koetter as Bucs coach is currently grim. Joe is *hardly* alone in that observation. That’s a far, far cry from “want the coach fired.”
When a head coach is fired, that generally means the team is having a sh!tty year. And yes when the Bucs lose, that is bad for business.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:43 am
Let Jameis start , the Glazers have a $20m decision to make and sitting him won’t help. Especially since the season is essentially over with no chance of the Bucs making the playoffs. From here on out he is auditioning for the next coaching staff.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:43 am
Jameis first year we had O-Line with Logan Mankins and he made Pro Bowl. Second year Doug Martin lead the league in rushing and team went 9-7 one win away from playoffs. Third year Martin sucks O-Line sucks D was nonexistent Winston declines 4th year same no running game, O-Line sucks, D is worse than last year doesn’t take rocket scientist to see Winston does not have the proper tools to succeed like he did in first 2 seasons. New coaching staff and we will see Winston move up the ranks like Goff with Mcvay, and Alex Smith also needed a new regime to become the QB he is today.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:45 am
Jameis is no more a turnover machine than Manning and Favre in their first three years.
I’m sure you geniuses would have run those guys out of town too.
Imbeciles.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:48 am
I love reading about how Winston has had his chance. Anyone think Koetter has had his chance?
Bonzai, I typically like your opinions as I think you are one of the few coherent posters around here. When I started reading your stance on Koetter returning, I really questioned why that should happen.
Its a tough argument to make. I can not make any argument that includes Winston and Koetter. I can make a strong argument for Winston and a lessor argument for Koetter but I just can’t find one for the both of them.
The style Koetter wants to play doesn’t suit Winston’s strengths and highlights his weaknesses. They aren’t a great fit. This disfunction has been covered up a little due to the imbalance of talent the Bucs have at the WR and TE positions relative to the rest of the team. Koetter’s style requires a “hot” QB. When the QB is just a little off, turnovers will come in bunches (happens for both QB’s)
November 6th, 2018 at 11:52 am
Jameis played in 2 and 1/2 games…has one really bad one…and the haters have seen enough after those 2 games. They go with that. They’ve seen enough to keep starting Fitz. Winston was lighting up the NFL the last 4-5 games of last season and this past pre-season…….BUT the haters saw that Bengals game and they’ve seen enough.
It’s the dumbest fan base in the NFL.
Fitz gives us the best chance to win they will tell ya….he’s never had this many weapons before….and blah, blah. blah….
The best chance to win what I ask you? The Super Bowl….cause that’s what they’re are playing for. It must be cause he’s came so close to one so many times mind his career.
Doesn’t matter….. this fan base is so dumb, I keep reading some wanting Griffin in there instead of wanting either Fitz or JW.
See what they have in Griffin, they’ll tell ya. Must be part of the Mike Glennon Mob.
The Glazers can run this team so poorly, cause they have such idiots for fans that keep hanging on anyways no matter what. THE TRUTH!
November 6th, 2018 at 11:57 am
It’s real simple. The best decision Koetter can make is to keep playing Ryan Fitzpatrick because he not only gives the team the best chance to win, but he gives the other guys on offense the best chance to put together good film for their next contract.
How many touchdowns has OJ Howard caught with Jay-Miss this year compared to Fitz? I’ll tell you. All of his TDs came from Fitz except for one. Every TD pass Mike Evans has caught has come from Fitz. Do you think Adam Humphries has a career day on Sunday with Jay-Miss throwing the ball? I doubt it. How about future HoFer DeSean Jackson. His numbers are better with Fitz than they have been with Jay-Miss.
Since 2015 every decision the Buccaneers have made has been to give #3 the best opportunity to win, and he’s squandered it with bad play on the field and bad choices off the field. For the sake of 52 other guys and the rest of the coaching staff it can not, and should not, be all about Jay-Miss anymore.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:58 am
Joe Says:
November 6th, 2018 at 11:36 am
Additionally, Joe has not called for Dirk Koetter’s head. Joe has pointed out the future for Koetter as Bucs coach is currently grim. Joe is *hardly* alone in that observation. That’s a far, far cry from “want the coach fired.”
Yes, nothing to see here folks. Move along. Did you listen to your own podcast yesterday?
November 6th, 2018 at 12:00 pm
I don’t think You find out whether Jameis is our QB for the future under Koetter.
Let a new coach evaluate Jameis next season under a new program. Looking at our schedule I see possibly..4 more Wins..If that. 7-9 finish at best. Regardless who plays QB for us. If you think Our Defense is gonna all of a sudden start performing miracles? You truly..beleive in Benny Hinn instant healing! I;ve question all along if these Glazers know what the hell they are doing..ever since the hiring of Koetter and pressbox Smitty. Something’s gotta give. Most fans now think a thourough housecleaning is in order.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:00 pm
Joe you sound like JW attorney…….what other evidence do you need to realize JW is not the future? Stats? Outside behavior? You want Koetter to play him with an injury risk? Come on Joe…… Vast majority including teammates don’t want him anyomore….. Time to move on councelor
November 6th, 2018 at 12:05 pm
I think Famous has been given ample opportunities to prove himself. So what the hell let him play he’s already proven that if he plays he’s going to throw interceptions which is going to lose you games. Then the Bucs will get a # 1 or 2 pick and the Glazers answer will be evident and they can use Jameis 21 Million and hire a damn Coach that has some big nads that can make some big decisions that will grt this orginyout of the cellar. Or you guys can keep procastinating and believing in Famous Jameis and stsy in the Cellar!! I may be wrong but Im not on this one…THE TRUTH IS TRUTH AND REAL IS REAL!!!!! Famous quote by the one and only TANDYMAN BUCS FAN!!!
November 6th, 2018 at 12:08 pm
Next time you go to the Den of Depression take a long look at the names honored on the upper deck wall of the stadium. Then remember the times (very recently in fact) one of them had to stand in front of a judge(s) and learn his fate. Then compare that to Jameis, who to the best of Joe’s knowledge has never been charged with anything, never had to stand in front of a judge and cop a plea.
If what Jameis was alleged to have done is such a stain on the franchise, then a certain someone’s name should be ripped down from that list of hallowed men at the Den of Depression.
So please spare Joe the faux moral outrage.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:13 pm
Horrible opinions and reporting like always
November 6th, 2018 at 12:14 pm
The other answer would be give Dirk the vote of confidence of at least one more year with the stipulation that this defense is completely rebuilt with an injection of talent. If Dirk knows he has another year guaranteed, then he may be compelled to play JW to see if he responds.
But let’s be real, if any of you were in Dirk’s shoes and needed to win to save your job, would you depend on JW? I think we all know the answer to that.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:18 pm
play him…I think we lose with Winston and fitz….its coaching and scheme not talent and players….
#NOEXCUSESIN2018!!!!….#PRESSURESONTHECOACHES!!!!…GO BUCS!!!!
November 6th, 2018 at 12:23 pm
I’ve seen what Jameis can do. Lots of stats. Not enough W’s.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:30 pm
If I were in Dirk’s shoes I would play Winston for sure.
As would any credible coach in this situation.
If you look behind some of the greats of the game they usually have a great coach behind him. Manning had Tom Moore, Favre had Holmgren, Marino Shula, Aikman Jimmy Johnson, etc etc etc.
Dirk is totally over his head. Its obvious. Not just at QB but across the board.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:32 pm
This is what I said about it last night:
My point is that every excuse being given to Fitz also applies to Jameis with the exception of some of that Cincy game. That was an absolutely terrible game from him.
But the other games have had all the same problems and issues you use to defend Fitz. That’s my point. Poor o-line, no run game, awful defense, receivers dropping balls, etc., it’s been the same chit for both of them.
Now should we expect more from Jameis as a #1? Yes, we should. And I do.
But considering most of his 3rd year was injured and missed half the games we’ve played so far, I want to see him play a little more before kicking him out of Tampa. 3 games is not a good sample size after an injury-plagued season, IMO.
Now if Fitz is playing lights out, that’s different… You ride the hot hand and win as much as you can. But the first 2 weeks have come and gone and his play has leveled out. He only had 2 INTs yesterday but easily could have had 2 more. (Same argument made against Jameis).
From a business standpoint and the future of the franchise, you have to get a better evaluation on Jameis.. and soon.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:35 pm
Joe if (when) the Bucs get a new HC would you rather it be a defensive minded one (who either retains Monken or brings in a new QB coach and OC) to fix up the D or an offensive minded one who might potentially want to try and fix Jameis?
November 6th, 2018 at 12:42 pm
How much more do you need to see with Jameis. I doubt anyone is going to pay Jameis 21Million the way he plays and his off-field antics. How about Derrick Brooks for GM. We need someone who can evaluate talent. Licht is the main problem with this team.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:45 pm
Jameis is a bottom tier QB1. It is just a fact.
Which starting QB situations are worse than Jameis? Arguably none, maybe the NYG. There is not a single team in the NFL that would want Jameis as their QB1 at $21m
That doesn’t make Jameis an awful player. He isn’t. He is a border QB1, elite QB2…and should be paid accordingly. Unfortunately we cannot pay him accordingly, we have to pay him $21m.
Additionally, it is VERY DIFFICULT to win titles when you have somewhere between the 25-35 best QB in the NFL. If we want to compete we need to upgrade. Again that doesn’t make Jameis bad, he just isn’t good enough to be a bona fide QB1.
Given that it makes perfect sense to play Fitz. He is just as good as Jameis (low end QB1, high QB2), and there is no $21m risk.
Obviously the defense is another huge problem.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:50 pm
Until the defense gets revamped it doesn’t matter who the QB is.. letting the opposing team to score at will we will loose every time..
November 6th, 2018 at 12:51 pm
Tandyman- Preach brotha!
Lets face it, either way we’re screwed. Fitz is not going to be here next year(?) and Jameis looks every bit the same QB we have seen over 3+ years. Koetter needs to win in order to keep his job. If the Bucs don’t, both he and HIS QB will be a-goners. End of story.
Now, I’m all for giving chances but, there’s an old saying that says something like if you have 2 QBs you have none. Meaning that going back and forth does no one any good.
What I have a hard time understanding is the level of ineptitude this defense shows week to week. EVERY week we find a new twist on how to suck! We need to start from scratch. What has/is being done is just not cutting it. There are times that I think we could get beat by a college team out there. It is really, really bad.
November 6th, 2018 at 12:56 pm
It will only take ONE off field indiscretion and Jameis is suspended for one whole year.
IF he stays then every day this off season the fans and JOE’s will nervously scan the news headlines to ensure Jameis has stayed on the straight and narrow. In this day and age all it takes is an accusation or a suppressed memory and Winston could be headed to a year long ban. After that anything else becomes a lifetime ban. To quote Clint Eastwood in a most famous Dirty Harry scene “You have to ask yourself one question, Do you feel lucky?”
November 6th, 2018 at 12:59 pm
You don’t bench a franchise QB
If he’s struggling in a system
Alter the system that fit his strengths
November 6th, 2018 at 1:00 pm
This system don’t fit JW strengths
November 6th, 2018 at 1:00 pm
If you have two QBs you have none.
Excellent point.
November 6th, 2018 at 1:08 pm
Why do people keep insisting that the Bucs need to give Winston 8 more games to show that he’s worth a $21M contract? Hasn’t the past 50 games proven that he’s not worth it? Even if he’s lights out for the next 8 games, what are you going to believe: the small 8 game sample or his complete body of work? Cut him loose and move on.
November 6th, 2018 at 1:22 pm
@tnew
As much as I like Koetter, I can’t argue your points. I would rather keep Jameis over Koetter.
To be honest, I have a really bad feeling that Norv Turner will replace him though. That;s never worked out for other teams.
November 6th, 2018 at 1:22 pm
Read a stat the other day. Winston is something like 2 and 12 in his last 14 starts and one of those two wins was a last second hail mary in new orleans last year (in other words Winston should be 1 and 13 in his last 14 starts…
WHAT MORE DO YOU NEED? The dude cannot think fast, has happy feet and simply is a bust. My position is: Bench him, DO NOT let him get injured and be stuck with him for $21 million!!!!! Unfortunately, the buc’s will have to find another QB. The upside is that there is major talent on offense so any decent, game management type of QB should get you plenty of wins IF AND ONLY IF the defense can figure a way to hold teams under 30 points. ACTUALLY, if the buc’s could develop a defense which can hold teams to an average of 23 points or less the bucs are talented enough on offense to win A LOT OF GAMES!!.. thanks much
November 6th, 2018 at 1:23 pm
We have seen enough of this over throwing turnover machine scumbag the past 4yrs nobody wants to see it anymore!
November 6th, 2018 at 1:23 pm
BobbyBucs Says:
“Horrible opinions and reporting like always”
—————————
Then why are you here, dummy?
November 6th, 2018 at 1:31 pm
How talented are we really on offense?
Running game ?
Oline is suspect in 3 of 5 positions.
Yep we’ve got good receivers, which is why we are playing sand lot football no matter who the QB is.
Not really sold on how epic this offense is…
Do know for sure that the D is historically horrible.
Oh and special teams blow too…
November 6th, 2018 at 1:37 pm
Mike in MO Says
“Hasn’t the past 50 games proven that he’s not worth it?”
Here’s the thing, Mike…if Winston had not provided us with a top 5 offense the last couple years, it would be different. Even in previous seasons when he threw multiple picks in the first half, he always led a comeback. Who is to say he would not have done the same in the last game he played?
The win/loss record you mention is not entirely on Jameis…in fact, only a fraction of it is. This team has lost because of defense, plain and simple, and Jameis has no control over that side of the ball.
When Jon Gruden came here, in his first year he challenged the defense. “Get me 9 touchdowns this season, and we’ll reach the superbowl.” They scored their 9th in the playoffs.
How many has this defense scored? None. How are the sacks looking? Horrible, except for JPP. Nassib shows promise for a rookie. Jameis only gets reckless when the team is behind and the Oline doesn’t block for him well enough.
You can try to blame Jameis all you want, but the simple FACT is that outside of a few games, the Bucs losing record is not on him.
Even this year. How many games has Fitz actually won? Two. How many full games has Jameis played in? Two.
Blaming Jameis is short-sighted.
November 6th, 2018 at 1:40 pm
John Says
“Read a stat the other day. Winston is something like 2 and 12 in his last 14”
There is a reason wins and losses are not listed in individual player stats…because football is a team sport. Jameis did what it takes to win on the majority of those games. The defense did not.
This last game against the Panthers. Who lost it? Fitz or the defense. If you say defense, then the same is the case for Winston’s games…because the defense played just as bad.
November 6th, 2018 at 1:46 pm
The NFL in 1970’s is not comparable to 2018 NFL….not in any way including the one above.
With that, I like this Buc site but its a week early on pining to see the Winston show, which most of us have seen enough to eval him now. I had a pretty good idea after last season but we must go through the NFL team motions.
I am not sure what you think will happen with Winston in there; the DEF is still giving up points at record pace. The OL is awful and WAY OVERRATED, a key for either QB. What do you think you will see some Joe Montana figure like revelation? Really? Its sad because I understand how major of a hit it is to miss on a #1 pick…its gonna take 3 years to fix.
Ask yourself this, does Winston bring this team back within a TD last week after the D gives up 35? No!
Does Winston QB play and win last week? No.
Is Winston a true above average NFL QB? No.
I guess some of you need more evidence on this QB issue; I do not as I know what ‘it’ looks like and Winston does not have ‘it’. The only thing coming is MAJOR change. I am looking forward to it.
November 6th, 2018 at 1:47 pm
Wow, virtually every comment above has merit, talk about a FUBAR situation,I agree the Glazers know what they have in Winston, I agree as Winston goes so does Koetter, I agree Winston should start Sunday. I Agree there is a lot of money at stake if Winston is not the face of the franchise, I agree for now it seems like we have a better chance of winning with Fitzmagic, and yes I agree with few exceptions (Receivers, TE’s. possibly LB’s) we need to tear this franchise down including coaches, GM, and coordinators. Only the Buc’s could end up in this situation.
I have a solution.
1) Play all starters who are consistently performing well.
2) Fire Koeter
3) Make Buckner interim head coach
4) Sit both Winston and Fitzpatrick.
5) Start Griffin
6) If team fails to win 7 games fire Licht at the end of the season.
7) Focus on 2019 exclusively and rebuild a team only with quality players and coaches even if it takes another 3 years.
PS Buy swamp land in South Florida.
November 6th, 2018 at 1:53 pm
What the hell is 8 more games of jameis going to prove. He can’t be trusted to not turn the ball over. We have seen that over three years now. We true fans now jameis is t the answer. There is nothing left for him to prove. He will always be a turnover machine. Like Brett Favre said you can’t coach the turnovers out of somebody. So just stop with this jameis nonsense. A veteran journeyman. Who has played for tons of teams is out playing him with the same exact offense. So he isn’t the answer. Enough already. Let’s talk about starters not the back up average qb please.
November 6th, 2018 at 2:12 pm
Joestang,
You want Derrick Brooks to run the Bucs? The guy who torpedoed the Bucs by highly recommending America’s Turnover Machine that also has serious off the field problems. I mean good grief, I read some of these comments of people wanting more time and it’s asinine.
P.S. Derrick Brooks has been mentoring America’s Turnover for nearly 5 years, including the offseason for the AZ incident.
November 6th, 2018 at 2:18 pm
Bonzai,
Jameis turns the dam ball over too damn much to be considered a contributing factor towards the pursuit of victory. I would argue the Bucs won in spit of Jameis. Looking back at his last two wins: Cleveland: he imploded at the end and OT, and New Orleans at home last year: forcing the ball to Evans and threw three picks.
Turnovers don’t matter enough to him for JW3 to be our QB. Too wreckless on and off the field.
November 6th, 2018 at 2:27 pm
I diagree. Play Jameis when he has a new coach and his best chance at success. 21 million is nothing for a QB for 1 year contract. Blake Bortles would cost around 17 mil so they can either spend it on Jameis or a Osweiler or Bortles type QB.
November 6th, 2018 at 2:33 pm
They already have a good roadmap the ATM from the last 4 years. Half a year is not going to change that perception. We the fans want wins, and ATM is not going to give us W’s being in tbe game. Hell he’s not even won 50% of the games he has started..
November 6th, 2018 at 2:53 pm
Having the conviction to move on from Winston is sort of like admitting that your losing stock pick is not going to come back. Ever. That’s why so many investors hold onto their losing stocks much, much longer than they should. They don’t want to admit they were wrong.
It’s time for the Bucs to admit they were wrong about Winston being a franchise QB and move on. The sooner the better.
November 6th, 2018 at 2:57 pm
The Winston haters bore me, they say the same thing over and over again and then think it’s true – if you engage them in any sort of conversation they then just repeat what they already said, then if you provide context, they just repeat what they already said – they have no interest in the truth, they have historical perspective, they are just have their bumper sticker depth of knowledge that they cling too. They’re just a message board lynch mob and that’s it, literally there’s nothing else to do them, they’re just the idiots that call sports talk radio and repeats what the host literally just said 10 seconds earlier, then pretend it was their idea and they’re not a parrot. No, you’re just a bunch of parrots.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:01 pm
If I’m the owner I let Dirk do whatever he wants to do. We all know the team has no shot at the postseason but technically they still have a punchers chance.
Dirk is up against the ropes here. He’s still my coach so I’ll let him get his try to fight his way out. If owners step in then they are basically calling the fight.
Be patient, give Dirk his last chance. And if Dirk has already given up then he should do so formally.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:01 pm
If Fitz had won, what should they have done next?
Only answer, keep playing him. The strategy was sound play Fitz until (if) he couldn’t carry the load. I live Fitz and think he could have gotten them well down the road and if he faltered bring Jameis back and see if he can take it the rest of the way.
Solves the mystery of what could have been?
Let’s Jameis continue to be an understudy in what plays are makeable and what plays are breakable.
Lets the team have a little consistency and rythym. (Much needed)
Let’s you determine once and for all both players worth to the team, and if you have a future in house or if you have to go back to work he drawing board.
I think Fitz could done what foles did (another “never was journeyman” who is now only Philly qb with a ring.
I also think Jameis can outgrow this phase.
Neither will happen if Bucs coaching keeps throwing crazy Ivans at the top and bottom of every hour.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:08 pm
Winston has his haters. He always will too, no matter where he goes because of the seriousness of his past allegations.
But here in Tampa I think a lot of people who are being called haters don’t hate the guy at all. They are just frustrated that our team is so bad. They blame the QB for a lot of the losing we have had in the past few seasons……..And guess what? In football, the QB is always gonna get blamed for losses. It has been that way since the game has existed and it will always be that way. Jamies Winston is not above any critism that every QB is exposed too.
Hell, I remember 3-4 ago when the Patriots started slow and Tom Brady himself was getting called out.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:16 pm
I’m not a Winston hater. I’ve rooted for him since he was drafted. But I’ve come to realize that he is not the long term solution at QB for this franchise. That’s it. It’s no more difficult than that.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:19 pm
Okay, here we go! I am a true Bucs fan that really wants to see my team win again before 2020!!! I will make no excuses for Jameis throwing picks or bad decisions; but wait there’s more! Jameis rookie year pro bowl, not bad! second year winning record no playoffs! Glazer’s fire Lovie, insert Dirk, and the TEAM along with Jameis HAS DONE NOTHING, AND LET ME ADD DIRK! decided to keep MIKE SMITH, and all you so called fans and Jameis haters! ALL YOU SEE IS A BAD QB ???? WOW !!!!
November 6th, 2018 at 3:30 pm
Sigh. I cant believe I have to point this out but I will.
The difference between Winston and the guy in the rafters you mentioned that had to stand in front of a judge is ONE of them (JW) got in trouble during his playing years (college and Pro) and the other (Sapp) did not. Sapp had already acquired a HOF career or earned credibility.
HUGE DIFFERENCE.
Second, spare me on the innocent until proven guilty or in front of a judge nonsense as that boat has sailed. The NFL, post Brady v NFL debacle, does not use the language in their suspension notice on Winston unless they have great confidence in the evidence. Winston does NOT take the suspension if he is not guilty. The old he didnt appear in front of a judge argument holds no water.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:33 pm
please stop calling him a franchise QB, he is not. That designation is earned, not given by the media.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:38 pm
The defense has enough problems. Inserting Jameis has put the defense in a
bind for years and this year has been no exception. Lets not forget that Panthers have a very good defense and Jameis has no signature wins against them. In fact he has two games that were signature wins against Atlanta and Philadelphia. He had wins in 2016 partially aided by great defense. During the five game stretch
opponnents were held to an average of 16 opponents by the Defense. That he has rarely approached success since then is Jameis hitting the wall and not improving.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:41 pm
Maybe the Owners have a issue with their #1 investment for not coming clean to them and the team. Not until he was fingered and then still tried to play it off. As nothing burger. It cost Winston 3 games and the “trust and respect” imo of the people who sign his checks. If I were them I would be hesitant in having him play again this season as next years $21,000,000.00 will be guaranteed if he is injured.
Go Bucs!!!
November 6th, 2018 at 3:41 pm
Favre was sending women pictures of his junk while he was high on coke and drunk while Manning was sticking his rear directly in womens faces.
Literally both of those, in 2018, are offenses that would get you thrown out football, but in the 90s it was just called boys being boys.
I liked the 90s a lot more than the millennial mindset where everyone is a victim and you all pretend to be outraged that men would act like men.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:43 pm
BOB’s logic…
#32 defense…
#1 offense…
Obviously it’s the offense that is the problem.
LOL!
Do you guys even read your own comments?
November 6th, 2018 at 3:45 pm
Should say Crab leg stealing, crotch grabbing, obscenity yelling, immaturity showing, w eating, interception throwing, non defense reading, never improving, former pro bowler shameis winston.
November 6th, 2018 at 3:48 pm
edit : average of 16
Seattle to 5 points,
Chicago to 10 points
New Orleans to 11
Thats no fluke, its good solid team defense.
What in the world did you do to that defense Jason Light,Hit the road Jack we don’t need your vision for this team No More, No More!
November 6th, 2018 at 3:54 pm
Sure Rod Mike was being critical of QB who was benched for……..wait for it………..poor play.
I just don’t understand why you get upset for critism about Winston’s play. It’s fair game. Like I said he got benched because he was playing bad. You do know that happened right?
November 6th, 2018 at 3:57 pm
Oh I meant bob not Mike.
November 6th, 2018 at 4:01 pm
We might as well lose the rest ..what pathetic fanbase
November 6th, 2018 at 4:04 pm
No one is looking at the bigger picture with Jameis being the QB in 2019.
Coaching and defense and GM is our #1 priority for 2019. Unless we somehow get into the playoffs, Koetter is gone in a swift minute with the rest of his coaching staff. We need a defensive HC with multiple playoff experience that knows how to put together a good coaching staff and knows how to select good players cus HCs have a huge part on that, it’s not just the GM. Pretty much a defensive Gruden for the 2002 Bucs. I’ve liked Licht over the years. I think he’s a good business man and has gotten us some good players (more than others think). But I feel we need to move on to a business man that knows football better and is going to have a bigger pair of cajones when coming to the Glazers on picking up good FA.
November 6th, 2018 at 4:04 pm
Jean…….Yeah we are so pathetic. Been rooting for this same loser team for the past two decades now and we actually still care.
I hate my self.
November 6th, 2018 at 4:10 pm
Yes Rod,
How do you explain a no 1 pick that has one TD through the air in two games.
To be a number 1 offense you have score the most points not yards. Jameis has only scored 5 touchdowns in his three starts and given the opponents 9 extra chances on offense and put a very bad defense in the hole those 9 times. No way to describe this as good QB play.
November 6th, 2018 at 4:11 pm
Good point SOE. I think it goes overlooked that the HCs input make a difference in free agency and draft.
D-Jax has Dirk’s grubby little finger prints all over it and was such a waste where we could have spent that money on defense or perhaps to help our running game.
And I betcha when OJ fell to us Dirk was all over thinking we would be just fine not getting a RB since we still had Douglas Martin.
Often times it’s not just the decision thats the bigger part of the problem. It’s how that decision was made.
November 6th, 2018 at 4:14 pm
We’ve seen enough from Jameis. He hasn’t improved since his 2nd season. His progression has stagnated. Time to move on. Go back to the well and draft another rookie before paying him any money and setting the team back even farther.
Love you, Jameis, but it is what it is.
November 6th, 2018 at 4:15 pm
edit: 5 touchdowns with passing and one running touchdown.
November 6th, 2018 at 4:18 pm
Seems like a lot of people are scared to see if Winston can succeed scared to seen him on the roster next year hmm wonder why. Even if a new coach get a first rounder at quarterback you don’t throw him to the wolves day one, you get trade value for Winston. You guys sound pathetic or like you expect Fitz to accomplish something long term
November 6th, 2018 at 4:27 pm
The Bucs will get rid of Winston
Draft another QB, ruin him
And the cycle will continue
Another 10 year playoff drought
November 6th, 2018 at 4:28 pm
It must be nice
Being a Carolina, Atlanta, New Orleans fan
November 6th, 2018 at 4:41 pm
Lakeland……At least our women are better looking here.
Ever been to Carolina? Woof
November 6th, 2018 at 5:06 pm
JimmyJack
Those 3 teams are stable teams
The Bucs are the only unstable team in the division
And people wonder why the Bucs are the division bottom feeder
November 6th, 2018 at 5:07 pm
It’s not that hard.
fire Licht and Koetter.
Keep Monkton and higher a defensive minded HC and give him total control.
November 6th, 2018 at 5:36 pm
“This team has the least talent in their roster than any team in the NFL
the complete wiffs in the 2016 and 2018 draft by Jason Licht has destroyed this franchise. The free Agents, Gump has brought in the last 4 years has been a travesty. All this mishandling of drafts and misguided FA signings and we are in salary cap hell. Its amazing the damage he has done to this franchise
It will take the new GM 3 years to somewhat correct this roster of busts and bums”
“Who whats to be GM and HC of this pathetic roster?”
Kobe Faker
November 6th, 2018 at 5:43 pm
Lakeland I know. But at the same time this coaching staff must be flushed which likely means roster turnover.
More instability but it must be done. This team is unprepared and unwilling to adjust……..How the f*** did we sit back in a shell all game instead of attacking Carolinas backfield?…….Sorry, went off subject.
This team runs plays that it didn’t look like they ever practice. Dirk’s team is just not on the same level as competent professional NFL teams.
Our only hope now is that the Glazers can find a savior to bring needed stability. That or sell the team…….Neither is likely unfortunately.
November 6th, 2018 at 5:45 pm
I don’t think the roster is that bad. Though I think Winston can rebound….take away the QB position and it looks a lol bleaker.
November 6th, 2018 at 5:51 pm
You Winston hatrers lol, just saying the same ole crap and cant back up their claims
November 6th, 2018 at 6:32 pm
“Watchout…
If Wash blows us out at home, Glazers might force Gump to fire Klueless and to have Monken as interim HC”
Kobe Faker
***How the hell is Tampa a -3 betting favorite over Wash?
November 6th, 2018 at 6:35 pm
Inside scoop is Koetter and Winston hate each other. Koetter to be fired before season ends because the Glazers want to see Jameis play.
November 6th, 2018 at 6:43 pm
Both Buc QB’s leave fans with that sinking feeling far more often than not.
November 6th, 2018 at 6:44 pm
Washington -3? Hmm maybe the Bucs will win.
November 6th, 2018 at 6:49 pm
Don’t understand all the Jameis Hate. He’s a pro-bowl QB that’s led the Bucs to a winning season. Why isn’t Fitz getting blasted for blowing the Panthers game?? Fitz sucks.
November 6th, 2018 at 9:12 pm
Getting second-team snaps all training camp, going against second and third string during the preseason, and missing the first three games couldn’t possibly have anything to do with Jameis’ slow start could it…
A lot of you people posting are blinded by hate..Jameis is a young quarterback and young quarterbacks usually struggle with consistency…75 touchdowns against 54 interceptions is actually not a bad number for a 24 year old QB…
I think the bigger issue here in Tampa Bay is the front office decisions, the offensive line, the running game, the defense, and also the kicking game…
Lets fix those issues first before we run yet another young promising quarterback off…
November 6th, 2018 at 10:25 pm
trivia question:
Which of the following quarterbacks have the most touchdown passes in their first 48 games in the league?
Jamies Winston
Drew Brees
Cam Newton
Matt Ryan
November 6th, 2018 at 11:03 pm
Trivia question:
Who is top 3 in turnovers in their first 4 years in the league?
Touchdowns mean nothing when you give the ball away 1-2 times a game.
I thought winston was the truth, those passes against the Bengals prove he is not, but let’s let’s start him rest of the season to prove it to the rest of you winston loving idiots.
November 6th, 2018 at 11:51 pm
trivia number two
Which of those guys had the most turnovers in their first 48 games in the league?
November 7th, 2018 at 12:36 am
“Bob in Valrico Says:
November 6th, 2018 at 4:10 pm
Yes Rod,
How do you explain a no 1 pick that has one TD through the air in two games.”
LOL! Is this even a serious post?
Well answer me this dummy… how do you explain the GOAT Tom Brady only having one TD through the air in the last two games?
Huh!?! How do you explain that?
GOAT? I don’t think so – total bust, and I have a two game sample size to prove it!
You’re literally an idiot.
November 7th, 2018 at 12:41 am
Why no body never answer that question? When they bring up Bret Farve first 3 years and Payton Mannon, or Elie Mannon or how many 4int games that Andrew Luck have had more than Jamies all of them but no one never answer that question. We need to keep Winston and build a defense and running game like what Cam Newton has that’s how you help a young quarterback. You don’t tell him to throw 7 steps drop back every play. If they are smart you keep Winston and let him grow with another coach. Some body will pick him up and delvope him and win a super bowl and we will regret it trust me have y’all not learn from the pass Steve Young , Doug Williams and others keep Winston let’s stand behind him and support him like other teams with there young quarterback.
November 7th, 2018 at 12:45 am
@ATLbuc made a great point, really took me back…..who has this coaching staff ACTUALLY developed? In year 3, perhaps Marpet? Mike Evans, but he was drafted when Lovie was here. Can we name one impact player at any position that this coaching staff has developed? DB, LB, Dline, O-Line, QB, RB (Biggest miss of all).
I’ll wait for people’s response
November 7th, 2018 at 2:50 am
Kansas,
Winston is benched…..claim backed!
November 7th, 2018 at 3:56 am
And the man who benched Winston is about to be fired
November 7th, 2018 at 6:16 am
yes rod,
Name calling is one of your favorite tactics, Whats next
1 Jump off the skyway
2.Contract Ebola
3. Visit one of your favorite gloryholes.
I,m hurt. Ha!Ha!
Jameis is not playing at the level of any no. 1 QB in his fourth year with 9 turnovers in only 3 games