Deep Pockets After Johnson
March 13th, 2018
Cleveland in sights?
Browns general manager John Dorsey isn’t playing around.
Soon, it may be unfair to refer to the Bucs’ inability to win home games, find an edge rusher who can breathe on a quarterback, and their 15-year, playoff-win drought as “Cleveland South.” Why? Because the first-year Browns shot-caller is doing his best to turn things around in Ohio.
A guy who has been linked to the Bucs as a cornerback target now has another suitor. Top free agent Trumaine Johnson, per Mary Kay Cabot of Cleveland.com, is now on the Browns’ shopping list.
And Dorsey has a boatload of cash to throw around.
Uh, oh.
Depending who you believe, the Bucs either don’t have much cap space left, or have oodles of Team Glazer loot to burn. Joe is confident the latter is true.
March 13th, 2018 at 1:54 pm
Joeypoppems Says:
March 9th, 2018 at 12:19 pm
Wouldnt shock me at all if Trumaine Johnson isnt even a target for this franchise.
—————————————————————————-
I still stand by this
March 13th, 2018 at 1:54 pm
“the Bucs either don’t have much cap space ” Joe is confident the latter is true.
IF you were talking about Manchester United there would be endless loot to burn.
Can’t wait for the Glazers to sell this team.
March 13th, 2018 at 1:54 pm
And so does licht, but he is acting like he is throwing dimes that weigh like manhole covers while the winning GMs are tossing dimes like trash can covers, what a joke this organization is
March 13th, 2018 at 1:56 pm
Man the GMs of the Browne, Rams, Bills and Eagles are trying to win ASAP. I love all of the aggressive moves being made by everybody EXCEPT us lol.
Someone on here once said “I prefer if we were super aggressive with trading, signing and drafting. Even if we lose, at least you know Licht gave it everything he had”
I agree with this. If prefer that our GM is aggressive. That aggressive attitude will trickle down the roster. It all starts at the top.
March 13th, 2018 at 1:58 pm
Let’s prepare for the worst/reality, and then we can be pleasantly surprised if wrong.
Johnson, McKinnon, Hyde, Suh, and Jensen will all be signing elsewhere.
March 13th, 2018 at 1:58 pm
Breeland is who we should target. He is a lot younger
March 13th, 2018 at 1:58 pm
Joe there’s no way they ever seriously wanted this guy
March 13th, 2018 at 1:58 pm
if we don’t address the pass rush none of this matters
March 13th, 2018 at 1:59 pm
That second link to cap space has not been updated with the recent signings. $31m is about right…unless someone is cut.
March 13th, 2018 at 1:59 pm
Does Licht not have “The gift of gab”.Challenge T.J. to shine as the top CB by taking on 3 of the best in our Div. Cmon Licht. Sometimes he just forms the wrong thing to say sometimes and may be affecting his “negosh” skills with players nowadays. How often did he goof it with TB media.
Think about it. Lench did well.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:00 pm
And lets face it…we knew we’d have to re-sign players. That’s how good teams are built. May not be the popular move among some ‘fans’, but it is the smart move. In this case.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:00 pm
There’s wanting to win, and then doing something to win.
Doing something to win (see cap space available) is foreign to this ownership group.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:02 pm
“Depending who you believe, the Bucs either don’t have much cap space left, or have oodles of Team Glazer loot to burn. Joe is confident the latter is true.” – J0E
There is no way the later is true. Why? Because there is a cap.
And as I mentioned in my last post, the second link you provided did not account for the recent re-signings of Evans, Fitzpatrick, Brate, or Grimes. Or the tender to Humphries.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:03 pm
I use OverTheCap all the time, but they haven’t updated it since before the Evans deal. I think it’s just one guy that runs it when he has some free time, but if you use that OTC number, then factor in Evans, Grimes, Brate, Fitz, Hump, etc, all the deals we know about, and do some estimates based on the Bucs front-loading deals a bit, my estimate is that the Bucs have around $44m, give or take a couple million. They will also still have to sign draft picks, so I don’t know what that will be, but lets say $8m or so. Again, it’s all a guess, but an educated guess. That $31m number Jenna is saying is perhaps the number based on the entire roster (not top 53) and with draft picks factored in, still seems a little too low, but perhaps they really really front loaded Brate’s deal.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:03 pm
Cmon guys! Who needs Trumaine when we can always resign 57 year old Brent Grimes next year!!!
March 13th, 2018 at 2:03 pm
Here we go again!!!Another year of signing our own average players. Then bringing in second tier free agents. Blazers stink and so do our coaching staff. Fire them all if you ask me. No one has any guts in this front office.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:03 pm
Re signing guys who’ve won nothing…..
March 13th, 2018 at 2:04 pm
Here we go again!!!Another year of signing our own average players. Then bringing in second tier free agents. Blazers stink and so do our coaching staff. Fire them all if you ask me. No one has any guts in this front office.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:04 pm
I do not actually mind the other teams being so aggressive in free agency. It does things for the bucs in the draft.
1. They’ll be more likely to trade down.
2. They’ll be less likely to address those needs in the draft.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:05 pm
To be fair, the current Browns GM can thank the previous GM for accumlating so many draft picks and cap space. Who knew the Texans would lose Deshaun Watson to injury and lose so many games? Browns have a lot of good players and play in a tough division. The Browns are a case study why having at least an average QB is so important in today’s NFL. They clearly hoped Johnny Manziel would be that QB but his meltdown set the orgazination back.
Now drafting Brandon Weeden was unforgivable at 28 and Trent Richardson turned out to be an unfortunate bust but there is no reason the Browns can’t turn things around quickly this year. But like I said, you need at least an average QB for a full season or you will be drafting top 10 again and again.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:06 pm
The 31m is after draft picks…which is somewhere between $8m and $12m I think. And that’s if we do not trade up.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:07 pm
Chris Says
“Re signing guys who’ve won nothing…..”
So are you saying they should not keep anyone that is currently on the team? Hmmn?
March 13th, 2018 at 2:10 pm
Bonzai…….Didn’t we have close to 80 million last week? I think you forgot to carry a zero or something. I’m no math wiz.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:12 pm
After review, I’m underwhelmed with McKinnon’s highlights.. doesn’t outrun anyone or make anyone miss. He’d get gobbled up behind our OL.
Now Carlos Hyde on the other hand… yes please
March 13th, 2018 at 2:12 pm
Ghost
Man U is no longer an issue. When the Glazers first purchased Man U it was valued as one of the top sports franchises in the entire world. The Glazers leveraged their entire empire including the Bucs. So there were several years where cash flow was a real issue and it came out of the Buc’s budget.
But that was pretty long ago. In recent years Man U has been rated as one of the most valuable cash cow pro sports franchises in the world. The Glazers actually make money from Man U which they “could” invest in the Bucs. Of course that is totally unnecessary since the Bucs have their own significant cash flows.
I do not understand money at that level. I can at least imagine trying to make my 4th cousin removed a multimillionaire for life…the “family” fortune and all of that…but really…how many billions do the Glazers need? Not judging just questioning since I’ve never been in their shoes. LOL
March 13th, 2018 at 2:12 pm
Joe they have no intention of getting Trumaine. They believe they need all their cap space
March 13th, 2018 at 2:13 pm
We have around 61 million
March 13th, 2018 at 2:13 pm
Well what’s the deal with why the Rams dumped Johnson so they could trade for Peters and sign Talib?
Not sure he could be that great, sure seems like the Rams didn’t want him.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:14 pm
We can easily spend $$…
Grimes = $10 mill
ME extension = $5 mill hit
Brate extension = $5-6 mill hit
Hump tag = $2 mill hit
Barber = $700k hit
Nothing insane. ME was already on the books for $13 mill.
I think if we wanted we could spend like whatever we have left honestly or a vast majority of it:
Ayers/Sweezy/Djax/Grimes = $33+ mill we get back next year when we let them go. That’s extensions for Kwon/Marpet/Smith. Cap goes up $20 mill next 2 years + Gerald McCoy dump = Winston deal.
So I wouldn’t spend all of it but we are super flexible to re-sign our own by letting these older dudes walk + increased cap space.
I’ve made this point a billion times lol
March 13th, 2018 at 2:17 pm
Cmon defending the cap space WTF, browns and jets making it work and we were #2 with cap space, licht doing licht things and 3-13 sounds about the right moves
March 13th, 2018 at 2:17 pm
mike10…..I think I’m worried about the RB position the most. There sure doesn’t seem to be much out there. I’m not a fan of McKinnon either and not Lewis.
Hyde or Crowell sound like the only 2 options and haven’t heard the Bucs showing any intrest.
One problem I got is that Dirk doesn’t seem to like a committee backfield which sounds like the best approach considering the options.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:17 pm
whatever we have left minus draft pick signings* i meant
March 13th, 2018 at 2:17 pm
Carlos Hyde, that guy is trash, he stays hurt. We should target Cromwell or jeremy hill. Both much younger
March 13th, 2018 at 2:17 pm
I’m gonna reserve judgment until the end of this week to see what, if any, moves our clueless GM has made to shore up Dline, Dbs, Oline and RB. Bucs need to at least acquire a starting DB, Guard/Center and Vinny Curry but I’m not gonna hold my breath. It’s a Bucs Life! Notice what Coughlin is doing in Jacksonville.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:20 pm
I was hoping they would sign Kony Ealy, Daton Jones, or Poe by now. They would give the team some flexibility in the draft
March 13th, 2018 at 2:24 pm
The browns are going to have to win a game before I get too jealous.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:24 pm
Hey how bout we just stay patient. I think the Bucs are up to something sneaky here. No they are not signing Tremaine Johnson or Suh. I think a player they should seriously consider resigning is Kevin Pamphile and move him to Right Tackle or left tackle and allow Smith to make the move inside. They definitely need a guard though still but bring Pamphile back as a tackle move D. Smith to guard and draft a guard late and let’s see what else Sweezy can do before we give up on him. If you ask me though the o line isn’t the problem. They get something out of a running back then the offense will be better but that defense really needs Derwin James and the Bucs likely will draft him at #7 with the way everything is going down. That Cameron Brate deal ensured there will be no splash signing in free agency though. In fact once they let Sweezy walk next season when his cap hit will be significantly lower Brate contract will become a headache for them but they will get more from him than Sweezy though.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:26 pm
C-spann…..I don’t think they can sign anyone til tomorrow at the earliest. Of course that’s what they say but following the news quite a few players have signed with teams already. The free agent rules are confusing at best.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:27 pm
Might be worth it picking up 49ers DE Aaron Lynch to a short term prove it contract and bring back Adrian Clayborn. Make a big splash at DT such as Suh or Poe to play next to GMC and with Noah Spence at the other end of DE that line should be average at worst assuming all are healthy.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:28 pm
StPeteBucsFan
I want to see the Glazers commit to this team, this fan base the same way they do their soccer toy…I mean soccer team.
Spend money on this team like they did on Man U. I have yet to see that the last several years. It is highly frustrating.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:29 pm
If we only have $30 or so million in cap space….we simply can’t spend 20 of that on 1 player…..I like 3 at $10……
And the posters who are complaining that we are signing our average players to new contracts are absurd. Evans, Brate & Grimes aren’t average and Fitz is a very capable backup…..so….SHUT UP!, Please.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:30 pm
Jason Licht buys FAs from the dollar store.
Tier 3 FAs only please thank you.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:31 pm
Those of you listing players and extensions and how that eats at the cap, STOP IT NOW! It is best if you unrealistically think the Bucs have like 80M then you can complain about everyone not signing here.
And those who complain we won the last, meaningless game, I guess for you every game won by a team that didn’t make the playoffs was a mistake. How stupid are these NFL players? Do all the smart players and managers play for winless Cleveland?
March 13th, 2018 at 2:44 pm
SCB…..Don’t sweat the bandwagon fans who will root against our team at the drop of a dime. If two draft slots will do this two them it’s realistic to think they root against us for one draft slot….Where would it end? Would they root for us to lose so we could move up from 14 to 13? I don’t know. Let’s let the bandwagoneer worry about that. These are not issues for die hard fans.
TBBF…..I don’t know where this 30 million number is coming from. I almost certain it’s made up. Just last week we were being said to have about 80.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:48 pm
Chris – Signing Aaron Lynch to a prove it deal is a good idea, so long as the team is smart about it and really thinks about it as a prove it deal and isn’t counting on him being a starter. Then again John Lynch is a super smart guy, if he lets Aaron Lynch walk, then I’d be a bit wary. But on the surface, if Aaron Lynch is healthy, that makes a lot of sense.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:49 pm
I too would like an explinaition where this 30 million number keeps on coming from. Add up the contracts that total $147 million (Cap is $177 million).
Mike Evans has zero impact on this years cap becaus his option was already picked up prior to his new contract being signed. Are you telling me that Grimes, Fitz, Brate, and Adam Humpfries over the past couple days have totaled $50 million and we are now at $30 million. If so, please give me what you are smoking.
March 13th, 2018 at 2:53 pm
🙂 boy JimmyJack is tearing it up today! lmao. @MichaelEtze too…
And Jimmy, I’m with you on the RB concerns, however it will be short-lived, cuz Licht will relatively mortgage the farm for a mister Sa-quon, Say-gone Barkley, landing right here in Tampa Bay (for 5 valuable draft picks over next 3 years. Just watch.
So there’s hope JimmyJack. Just not yet.
And as far as the nose-picking, number-crunchers kicking it in the back corner of the library OBSESSING over the cap space this way or that, NObody cares! Especially if you’re (anyone) correct on those figures or not. Until Spotrac or OTC update anything for any team. This is why we have those websites, not you all. Calm the EFF down. NO ONE cares, if you’re right, or not 🙂
Go Bucs!
Go Bucs!
March 13th, 2018 at 2:56 pm
he’s too good and will cost too much….licht likes to bargain shop!!!!!!!
#NOEXCUSESIN2018!!!!….GO BUCS!!!!
March 13th, 2018 at 3:08 pm
The Bucs remind me of the movie Slapshot. Remember the cheap owner that acquired the Hansen twins for a bargain? Reminds me of our frugal operations. The only difference is it all worked out in a movie. In reality we all know how it works out with the Bucs.
March 13th, 2018 at 3:09 pm
I had a idea there is not enough money to go around. That’s why we have to cut or trade GMC
March 13th, 2018 at 3:20 pm
I think I’d rather take a chance on Kyle Fuller. PRobably cheaper ($13 mill) and fits this zone defense better with his skill set since Mike Smith won’t press his corners. Younger as well at 26.
Last year Fuller shut down like every top WR he faced.
March 13th, 2018 at 3:27 pm
Resigning of Grimes was super intelligent. CB with an AARP card that was injured last year on the worst passing defense in the league. Genius! Glazers sure as hell aren’t spending any money on any top notch or even good players in FA. Like usually. Especially with all these big bank resignings. They thought the one splash signing of DJax last year was going to get them to the SB. I’ve always liked Licht’s “Build through the draft”, but we also need to make some serious trades this year.
March 13th, 2018 at 3:32 pm
One thing to consider is that the Bucs could very well be targeting a corner in the draft. Maybe even round 1 depending how it shakes out.
If they got their eyes on somebody they are very high on that could change the landscape of needing a high profile FA at the position.
I’m liking the idea of E.J. Gaines, Grimes, rookie CB, VHIII. And continuing to work with Smith buried down on the depth chart.
March 13th, 2018 at 3:43 pm
My opinion is the Glazer’s do not have the money to reach the level of Cap space they theoretically have.
March 13th, 2018 at 3:49 pm
Rich…now that is an interesting thought….one I don’t even want to imagine is a real possiblity
March 13th, 2018 at 3:51 pm
Last time a Glazer opened his wallet a prehistoric moth flew out of it!
March 13th, 2018 at 3:58 pm
Speaking of the Browns, they’ll have a more talented team then us when we face them this year. Scratch that win off our schedule.
March 13th, 2018 at 3:59 pm
Cleveland will not be satisfied until they make the Bucs…the worst team in the NFL! Give’em credit. They are trying to upgrade themselves. And thus far are doing a good job of it.
March 13th, 2018 at 4:06 pm
OTC has the Bucs available cap space at $68.7M – this is before any new signings this year and hasn’t been updated. It included $2.625M for Joe Hawley who says he’s retiring because the Bucs weren’t picking up that option – so the starting point from their perspective (minus Hawley’s $2.6) would be just over $71M as of the end of 2017 fiscal year.
Spotrac has a more updated # of $59.1M available – which includes new deals for Evans(extra $5M), Fitz (3.3M), Glanton (1.04M), Barber (630k), Elliot (630k) – but does not list #s yet for Grimes (# is $8.5M inc. likely to be earned incentives) or Brate (# will be $7Mish this year).
Those deals done so far add up to about $11M (not including Grimes and Brate’s deals) – so Spotrac and OTC are within $1M of each other.
So we started with right around $70M minus $11M for the above listed new deal = $59M minus $15.5M (Brate and Grimes deals) = $43.6M in available cap space
Spotrac’s estimate for our draftees contract as per our current exact draft spots is $8.671M
$43.6M minus $8.6M = $35M in remaining cap space. There is also a $2M offer pending but not counted yet for Humphries – so down to $33M
There’s your bottom line as of this minute about 44 hours before the official start of free agency – Right around $33M in cap space available.
Look for the Bucs to try and re-sign capable back ups McDonald, McClain and Tandy before the start of free agency – that’s $5Mish between the 3. IMO – they should also re-sign Evan Smith for experienced and versatile depth at Oline interior – there’s another $3M.
With those expected moves the Bucs would be down to $25M in available space coming into the actual start of free agency on Thursday.
$25M still sounds like a bit to work with – enough to bring in 3 or 4 decent players one would assume.
But then there’s the other extensions that Licht wants to do this year as well – for Kwon, Marpet and D.Smith. (which does make sense as you will likely save a good bit of $ by locking them up now as opposed to letting them and their agents see what their “projected market value” # looks like heading into next year as UFAs) Guess what new deals for those 3 players will cost over and above the peanuts they are scheduled to make this year already…
About $25M
So much for having “the most $ to spend in the NFC”. Don’t expect any big name FA signings and any we do sign will likely be for value trying to fill a couple needs like CB and OG and DE with lower tier but hopefully capable players.
Don’t shoot the messenger…
March 13th, 2018 at 4:49 pm
pickgrin
that makes sense…..
the glazer wont allow licht to go crazy in FA because he’s on the hot seat…..licht was probably instructed to resign players on our roster first so that the new regime would have depth and cap space to work with next year…..
why let the GM bring in a bunch of high price FA’s if the person who brought them in wont be here next year……
like you said, don’t shoot the messenger……
#NOEXCUSESIN2018!!!!!!…..GO BUCS!!!!!
March 13th, 2018 at 4:50 pm
@Pickgrin
There’s absolutely no need to sign Kwon/Marpet/Smith right now. As I’ve said before; Ayers/Djax/Grimes/Sweezy = easily enough $$ to extend those 3 next year. Those 4 = $34 million we will clean off our books next offseason. We will also get $10 million in new cap space; and guys like McClain/McDonald/Tandy/etc are all guys we can let go as well. So think $40-50 million to extend those 3 guys / sign maybe other FAs/ draft picks.
Every time you do this analysis you don’t factor in future cuts or future added cap which is a huge variable in all of this.
So yes we can spend $20-25 million right now and have no issues at all next year.
Gerald McCoy + 2020 added cap will be enough to extend Winston. We’ll likely have other cuts by then as well; and the way we structure deals is to take larger hits now and have the cap hits de-escalate down the road.
March 13th, 2018 at 5:52 pm
813 – Licht is not going anywhere unless he totally bombs the 2018 draft.
LC – it makes sense to extend those players now if possible – because it will lead to more cap room availability over the next few years when $ becomes a lot tighter paying $25-$30M per to your QB each and every year.
Likely at least 2 of those 3 will be locked up long term this year – bet on it.
March 13th, 2018 at 7:37 pm
So who gets the $$$$$ not spent on team. Go owners….
March 13th, 2018 at 9:03 pm
StPeteBucfan,
Your right and the thing is that the Glazers have not maximized the value of Man U. Add to that is the fact that they have already pulled out of man u a billion dollars. They couldn’t possibly , unless they’re willing to sell, that kinda money from the Bucs.
To all those people who say they should sell, I ask…would you?