Defensive Line Depth
February 2nd, 2017
#WeaponsForWinston the biggest need.
In Joe’s mind, there are no bigger needs on the Bucs than at wide receiver and running back. Hence the hashtag #WeaponsForWinston.
But, nnnooo… not the PFF tribe, aka ProFootballFocus.com. Maybe because they just have to be different, but John Kosko is of the mind the Bucs need more help on the defensive line.
Give the talented linebackers some good rotational players up front, and one impact player from the draft, and Tampa Bay should contend for the playoffs again in 2017—and get over the hump.
Look, defense isn’t the reason the Bucs missed the playoffs. Joe isn’t saying the defensive line is just fine. Joe has written about Calais Campbell a few times. Joe has also wondered aloud about drafting a defensive end early.
Still, the reason why the Bucs didn’t make the playoffs is because america’s Quarterback, Jameis Winston, had no running game to speak of outside of Jacquizz Rodgers, and no wide receiver threat at all aside from Mike Evans. The offense let the team down in critical situations late in the season — fourth quarter at Dallas and at New Orleans in winnable games to be more precise.
If the team will invest so much cash into Jameis — and it has already — then it would be irresponsible not to surround him with capable talent.
Notice more than a couple of times late in the season winning Bucs coach Dirk Koetter said Jameis needs weapons. You didn’t ever hear Koetter say the defensive line needs to be beefed up.
February 2nd, 2017 at 3:37 am
I can’t wait until March. Once FA gets going we can all get on the same page when it comes to the draft lol.
February 2nd, 2017 at 3:42 am
I don’t really want him, but I have a feeling John Ross will be our 1st round pick
February 2nd, 2017 at 3:51 am
Its possible that Corey Davis and Mike Williams are both gone before 19 – likely even. Personally, I don’t think John Ross is first round material. If the first 2 are gone I think that means that Derek Barnett and one of the two top OTs will be available – Ryan Ramcyzk or Cam Robinson. I would even be happy with Garrett Bolles (remember the problems with the right tackle position at the end of the year). That position has to be addressed either in FA or the draft. None of the three will be available in the 2nd round at 19. Cooper Kupp, Westbrook or Samuels in the 2nd.
After that….who knows?
(Disclaimer: this is all speculative BS and I know that. It’s fun BS though. )
February 2nd, 2017 at 5:15 am
@mesh
We’ve all been spitting out speculative BS about free agency in the draft as well lol. It is indeed fun
February 2nd, 2017 at 5:15 am
*and the draft
February 2nd, 2017 at 5:54 am
WEAPONS FOR WINSTON = BUILDING A WALL or my new mantra BRICKS IN THE WALL! But not in Mexico dumb ass!
February 2nd, 2017 at 6:24 am
I agree we need another weapon badly…..but the oline looms worse and worse the more I watch the replays. Jameis under cobtstant pressure, gis sack numbers woukd have went throught the roof had he not played hudini all season, and yhe run game was really bad. This oline is a top priority. He was missing wide open recievers wjile running for his life.
I dont understand how joe can possibly be comftorable going into next season without upgrades
February 2nd, 2017 at 6:26 am
Unless Jason drafts a long-snapper in the 1st rnd, we can’t miss. He could draft a RB, WR, TE, S, DE, DT, LB, G, T or C and we’d be filling a priority need. IF the talent’s there, would love to see us draft a top RB or WR at #19 however so that we can hopefully generate more offense. Beating the Panthers 17-14 & again 17-16, the Chiefs 19-17, the Seahawks 14-5, the Saints 16-11 was all nice, but that performance (giving up LESS THAN 13 PPG isn’t something we should count on).
February 2nd, 2017 at 6:48 am
Real talk man, what @Bighog said. The lines ARE the priority this year man. I would welcome a skill player at 19 but would love a lineman being chosen. Don’t care who it is.
#TRENCHWARFARE
February 2nd, 2017 at 6:53 am
What’s gonna happen with C. Davis now that he’s not running at the combine. Could he fall to the second, giving us a chance to MAYBE move up to get him then.
February 2nd, 2017 at 6:55 am
They need a beefy DT/NT cause teams run up middle to easily (watch cowboys game). However, they can get that in free agency-overpay for Brandon Williams around 8 mil per and the bucs defensive line becomes more like the Giants defensive line. (You will have Noah Spence in year 2 and hopefully jaquis smith’s injuries haven’t changed his get up). Gholston and ayers back. Good rotation. Bucs have miles and miles of cap space. This is good place to spend it.
February 2nd, 2017 at 6:56 am
If Alabama OLB/DE..Tim Williams is available at 19, I would have to pounce on him. He’s a beast at rushing the QB and getting into the backfield.
February 2nd, 2017 at 7:27 am
But Tim Williams could be around when we pick in the 2nd round, because of his off-field concerns and failed drug tests. Picking him at 19, might be a reach, even though he’s the best pure pass rusher in the draft. Therefore I would have to go WR, DT or OL at 19.
February 2nd, 2017 at 7:40 am
No need to be confused @JOE. No knock on Ayers but we NEED someone opposite Noah who plays how he talks… HOW LONG JOE must we go without a 10 sack guy? Hello
February 2nd, 2017 at 7:48 am
Bucs missed the playoffs because of Winston’s turnover problems in close games. Yes he needs weapons but he also needs to improve on protecting the ball
February 2nd, 2017 at 7:49 am
Although I like how much love pff gives Marpet, I’m not really a fan. They have a point about Bucs needing DL depth as McCoy is almost 30 and the other interior DL has little to zero pressures and have been mostly mid-level talent.
February 2nd, 2017 at 7:50 am
Lakelandbuc
That logic always gets me. First you say pounce in the first, then you come back and say it’s reaching because of off field stuff… Damn it if he’s there grab him. IF he’s the best pure pass rusher. I want him. Period. A freaking team like the Pats will grab him and BOOM. I’m tired of that Lake… While our D got much better in the second half, they don’t scare anyone. Hmm…
Noah
GMC
Poe
Williams
I like that lineup. Not knocking you Lake… Just that whole reaching thing. Don’t like it. Sounds like IF he’s there @19 he’s BPA. So yea I’d take him
February 2nd, 2017 at 7:57 am
WhatdaBUCisthis….I agree with you 100%.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:06 am
You sure Jameis needs a running game more than a dominant Defense?
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:07 am
LakeLandBuc… word!!!
Too many put too much in what the analyst says. There paid to have an opinion. There biased though. I’m not a stat nerd NY any stretch. Numbers don’t lie. The eye test is always the best way as Capt Dirk says.
As seen in every draft every year. MOST of the “experts”are wrong with there picks because…. Think about this… They are the ones TRYING to drive players stock up or down with there OPINION.
in Licht we trust…
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:09 am
DEFENSE still wins championships!!!!
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:16 am
WhatdaBUCisthis …hopefully Davis falls to 19 where they’ll take him.
I’m also a big in the trenches guy myself, but I don’t want them to pass up Dalvin or Davis if somehow they are there at 19. Like Howard at 19 too.
We all HAVE to wait until FA, but it seems we can’t.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:19 am
We need to stay disciplined and take BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE that also fills a need. If BPA is a QB, for example, we obviously shouldn’t take him. But drafting purely for need has been shown year after year to be the failure of many teams. Even if it doesn’t fill the most glaring need, the worst it will do is build more quality depth, which is always a need. Just because we need Weapons for Winston, which we do, it doesn’t mean you reach with premium high round selections. If our scouts and GM perform as I have come to expect, we can appropriately fill needs throughout the draft by taking the BPA. Sterling Shephard wasn’t a first round pick, but sure as hell could upgrade our offense. And unless we get Cook, RBs can be had later in the draft that would be notable upgraded/depth. GO BUCS!!!
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:19 am
Buc1987….Corey Davis and O.J Howard might be there at 19, but I don’t think Dalvin Cook will be there.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:21 am
I think at this point I’m gonna say if Dalvin is still there at 19, the Bucs will take him and NOS won’t stop smiling for a month.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:22 am
LakeLand…yeah but if he is there, do you think they take him?
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:33 am
There’s ALOT of reports out there that – Philly will draft Corey Davis “IF” he falls to 19.
Sounds like the pairing of two talented small school prospects – has them intrigued.
Carson Wentz to Corey Davis – seems like a good look on paper.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:34 am
My bad IF he falls to #15
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:36 am
Buc1987..If Cook is that at 19 I would draft him without hesitating.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:39 am
I hear you guys with the skill players BUT our lines needs the infusion of talent. We MUST get to the QB at all cost. Period. We MUST protect the franchise and open running lanes. We can fix so much this year if we address the issues. Need more MONSTERS. We now have our leaders on both sides firmly planted in #3 & #58. Now we a WR or 2, but to me that’s it.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:42 am
@kevin
while I agree that O line needs new blood and pressure up the middle affected both the run and pass game.I believe Jameis passes while on the run were
some of his best.(the 48 yarder to Evans is a good example).Why because
he plants his feet and throws.It is when he is in the pocket and his longer stride from his pitching days takes over and causes the overthrows at times.
It is something that Koetter wishes he could work on with Jameis in the off season but the collective bargaining agreement prevents it.
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:43 am
Oh yea, none of this will mean anything IF Jameis doesn’t improve his accuracy PERIOD
while I love his heart, if he has a similar year, I will call for his head lol
Seriously I will
February 2nd, 2017 at 8:56 am
I think now that Davis has that injury, he will fall. If he does, then we NEED to draft him, but only if we didn’t go hard at wr in free agency. Davis/Evans would be one of the best young duos in the league if not the best. The guy has the ability to be elite.
If for some reason we pick up some great WRs in free agency then I say draft as follows:
1. OJ Howard
2. Ramcyzk
3. Barnett
Either way I am confident a very good players will be there no matter what at #19 and Licht is getting ready to knock another draft out the park.
February 2nd, 2017 at 9:35 am
Poor oline play (eliminated rushing threat which in turn eliminated play action in passing game) and the dreadful aas puckering gauntlet of a kicking game led by AguaOh,no cost us a spot in the tournament. The history rewrite around here is something to behold. More running cover for epitome of mediocrity itself, the one and only do-no-wrong Jason Licht!
February 2nd, 2017 at 9:37 am
I’ve started to watch some of the Edge rushers that could be available in rounds 3-5 and one guy that I really liked was Derek Rivers from Youngstown. Smaller school so the competition he was up against wasnt very good, but he looks like a guy that can develop into a good player. CBS has him currently ranked (Their site has the most recent updates that I could find so I used them. Updated 1/30/17) as a round 3 pick. So say we do sign Calais Campbell as Joe has mentioned multiple times, which btw is an idea I like that is realistic (JPP, Berry, Jeffery, Pryor, etc are unrealistic to me) he and Spence can develop their games with 2 legit vets in Ayers and Campbell and hopefully take over as every down edge rushers when they are gone.
And I prefer, like Joe, to put Campbell next to GMC. Campbell can still help the young DEs tho.
February 2nd, 2017 at 9:55 am
Joe
Those “who know” (or think they do) say games are won in the trenches and great defense beats great offense (Bucs/Raiders, Broncos/Panthers).
First round: Malik McDowell? Taco Charlton?
February 2nd, 2017 at 9:56 am
Need to add Offensive weapons that add value. Also need to look st scheme. Hmmmmm how many pro-bowlers or all pros on Offense does the Patriots have? On paper should a team really be scared of Julian Edelman, Blount and Dion Lewis. I don’t think so… it’s TB12 and the their schemes ability to adapt to personnel and who they’re playing. That being said. I’m on the OJ Howard bandwagon at 19.
February 2nd, 2017 at 10:02 am
@Joeypoppems I would love Campbell too. FA will be big this year. I don’t think any player is off the table save for a franchise tag by a team. The sentiment around the league is the BUCS are gonna be playing at least 17 games a year for awhile. Elite players with heart and soul always think they can be THAT player that propels a team to the pinnacle. It will be interesting to see who wants to WIN the ‘chip in Tampa
February 2nd, 2017 at 10:27 am
In FA I think the bucs need to get hankins on the dline and if possible RT wagner to replace Dot. Hopefully we can get Kenny Stills or Robert Woods as well. That would open up drafting OJ Howard and get a DE in the 2nd. OJ Howard would also help the oline with run blocking and the fact that he can catch wont make the bucs look predictable on run plays.
February 2nd, 2017 at 10:42 am
I look at it differently than J0E.
I view it like this…defense has always been a strength in Tampa, no matter how many times we’ve tried to make offense dominant.
Remember when the Broncos went to the superbowl and lost because they had the #1 offense and no defense? They had to improve their defense in order to win it.
We need to add a couple more players to defense before it is truly good enough. DL and CB. The CB doesn’t have to be a starter this year, but Grimes will not last forever.
And so far as offense, I don’t care how good the RBs and WRs get. If the QB does not have time to pass the ball and the OL doesn’t open running lanes, that stuff won’t matter.
That’s the problem here in Tampa…we always want the flashy players (WR, QB, RB) instead of going after the guys that make those positions look good. The great teams know the right way to do it.
It ALWAYS starts up front.
February 2nd, 2017 at 10:43 am
That said, WR is the only position I don’t think we can completely address with a free agent (unless we get lucky with an undrafted one).
February 2nd, 2017 at 10:45 am
Oh, and I am not sold on Taco Charlton at this point. I have a bad feeling that he will bust.
February 2nd, 2017 at 12:20 pm
I still believe they go edge rusher early and big depth on offense with rest the picks. Running back is a big need but pass rushers cover up a lot of issues on defense and this past year there were multiple games where thr Bucs applied zero pressure. On offense they at least have a number 1 wideout a number 1 qb and a number 1 TE. Get a running back and a few good targets they are rolling.
Berry or Cyprien in FA anyone?
February 2nd, 2017 at 12:29 pm
That being said if Delvin Cook is not there at 19 then trade down and get another pick. This draft is deep on offense and at DB. Trade down and scoop a descent DE late first early second depending on trade partner. Harris from Mizzou looks good. I like his skill set not just a bull rusher. Use the rest of the picks and acquired pick(s) to address offense and DB
February 2nd, 2017 at 1:42 pm
Im telling you, DE at 19 Barnett or Solomon and then all Offense after that. If we go WR or TE @19, then hopefully CB Adoree Jackson will still be there when we pick 2nd. Then all offense afterwards.
February 2nd, 2017 at 2:27 pm
@Joe
Did you guys NOT see the Dallas game? Better depth along the D-line IS DEF a need…Hopefully enter Calais Cambell
February 2nd, 2017 at 2:33 pm
@Buc4lyfe79
We need depth on the D-Line. We need starters at WR and RB. Cant put depth ahead of starters which is how I took this article.
February 3rd, 2017 at 2:28 am
Love speculating on the draft!
Agree 100% Joe. Weapons for Jameis HAS to be a priority!
The lack of weapons he had, in the last 1/4 of the season- was horrible
Hard to predict the draft, without seeing who we get in free agency
We need a vet Wr, and a Vet DL. The bad thing about Drafting a Rookie DL, is it ussually takes a couple years before they become well rounded players.
We dont wanna wait that long, if we can get a good established player.
We then need a TE,Young WR, And a RB.
Everyone is kind of overlooking A TE, but Jameis loves to go to the TEs, and operates very comfortably in a 2 TE offense
Either way- I trust our GM, and our Coach.
Time will tell. Cant wait
February 3rd, 2017 at 6:40 pm
I’d like to sign Poe in FA if he becomes available. What do you guys think about moving Ayers to the inside, he’s very productive on the inside? That’s where he got most of his sacks last year with the Giants. Then use #19 on a DE