Open-minded Coaches
January 31st, 2016
Brainstorms with a Bucs legend.
As we wait for the Pro Bowl kickoff on this lazy Sunday, as Joe is in the air on his way to San Francisco (Joe’s first visit to California), Joe thought he’d bring something cool to you.
Now we all know Lovie Smith was a scheme-first guy. Can’t play in his scheme? You can’t play for him (well, hello Darrelle Revis!).
New Bucs defensive coordinator Mike Smith is not that guy.
Over a week ago, when John Lynch was announced as the next inductee into the Buccaneers Ring of Honor, Lynch dropped a cool little nugget. Smith was at One Buc Palace meeting with his new staff, preparing for not just the draft but OTAs, trying to determine how to best utilize current talent, not shoehorn them into a closed-minded fit.
Well, Smith smelled an opporunity and pounced. How many times does Smith get the chance to brainstorm with a possible Hall of Famer and very smart dude like Lynch? So when Lynch arrived at One Buc Palace, Smith invited Lynch to sit in on defensive meetings.
There, Lynch noted, Smith picked Lynch’s noggin’ for input.
That folks is not just a smart coach, but that’s an open-minded coach. Props to Smith for jumping at such a rare opportunity.
As Broncos defensive coordinator Wade Phillips once said, “I don’t understand the people that say, ‘Hey, this is our scheme and that guy can’t play in it. The guy can play. He’s a good player, but he can’t play in our scheme.’ Well, to me, there’s something wrong with your scheme. You adapt the scheme to what the players can do, not what you can think of.”
January 31st, 2016 at 12:08 pm
Do not forget, that not only is John Lynch a ring of honor, but also as a network announcer. He get to sit in and learn alot from all the team that he got to broadcast!!
January 31st, 2016 at 12:24 pm
With Koetter and Smith one thing seems certain. This team is taking a 180 degree different approach.
Yeah Mike we’ll save you the time…they’re on the clock and you’ve put them on notice that you’ll be here to rip them if they don’t win early and often.
January 31st, 2016 at 12:41 pm
Note to StPeteBucFan: A different approach does not equal WINS. Hell, I gave my 2nd marriage a different approach and still ended up dumping her!! Just sayin….
January 31st, 2016 at 12:45 pm
@Mike Johnson
Sheesh, MJ…I defended you the other day to SPF…but after several days of reading your posts…you really are being extra negative.
Who were you before you switched names?
January 31st, 2016 at 12:52 pm
Finally some coaches who aren’t stubborn like lovie and willing to adapt to the strengths of their players instead of forcing a scheme down their throats, things are started to look up for the bucs.
January 31st, 2016 at 12:53 pm
@MJ
Sorry about your second marriage…been there done that. But face it…..it’s a lot harder to select the right mate than a football coach!! LOL
Most organizations..business…institutional..sports…believe that the best predictor of future success is past success.
That’s hard to do with a wife!! Unless you are lucky enough to find a really hot, smart, wealthy widow who had a great marriage until she lost her hubby.
Lovie OTOH could have followed that logic but didn’t from day ONE!! He brought in Jeff Tedford? What did his resume include that would give anybody confidence that an HC with defensive chops could trust as an OC. We won’t even discuss Marcus Arroyo…even as QB coach…did he have the same resume as Bajakian. NO.
And then there are Lovies kids…what did their resumes look like.
Leslie Frazier had some success so that hire could be justified.
But overall Lovie never followed the best predictor for future success…past success. This current coaching staff as a group have resumes that totally blow away Lovie’s group.
Will that mean they’ll win? I think so. It’s all we can go on right now. You’re going to have to wait 8 months until the verdicts start coming in.
January 31st, 2016 at 1:18 pm
StpeteBucs Fan…Hmmnnn I never mentioned Lovie in today’s posting. But since YOU brought it up..I still think he deserved another year in his system and a defensive draft. Having said this..Its over..done. I also thought Schiano deserved another year as well as Gruden and Raheem. WE.. have a history of dumping coaches and players who come back to bite us hard. A big history.
So now its on to the next…2 yrs hopeful wonder. That’s our MO. Lovies firing was all on him though. Had he presented the Glazers with another plan..namely firing some folks, he would have had his 1 more yr. I’m done with it. However and by the way? I will not give this new regime one iota, ounce of credit until I see a winning product on the field. I give Koetter credit for having done his job last yr..that’s all. Produce some wins and I’ll be the 1st back on the bandwagon. As a Bucs fan of 40 plus yrs, I’ve seen and heard it all from our list of..SPINMASTERS. As Lombardi once said, WINNING IS ALL THAT MATTERS!! Just win…by any means necessary.
January 31st, 2016 at 1:27 pm
MJ
You are arguing against yourself. You correctly point out that continuity is a desirable thing…that a series of our past coaches deserved at least another year…yet you’re ready to pull the plug on Koetter if he doesn’t win early and often?
What about the continuity of Koetter?
January 31st, 2016 at 1:33 pm
Mike Johnson sounds like the realist- just being negative for the hell of it.
The facts are Smith has had extremely successful defenses and Dirk has had the same on the offensive side.
Going by that, I am inclined to be optimistic that they are heading in the right direction, and definitely not inclined to take seriously some negative poster in this website.
I like Smiths attitude of just using the players abilities, not fitting a scheme. Don’t get me wrong, sone schemes are great and work very well, but the notion that s player can’t play in one is ridiculous to me.
I like grudges but remember when he couldn’t figure out how to get Galloway and Bryant on the field together in his schemes? Ridiculous.
Lovie can’t use Revis?! Sure.
Tampa 2 was a scheme. 46 was a scheme. All that means is great players can make it great and average players who can excel in that scheme have a chance to prolong a career and seem better than they may otherwise be.
January 31st, 2016 at 1:51 pm
MJ is the new Buc Realist
January 31st, 2016 at 1:57 pm
Mike Johnson = Troll If were all spinmasters MJ what are you?
January 31st, 2016 at 2:05 pm
But but Realist isn’t Lynch a part of your self named so called Tampa2 mafia???? He did cut his teeth in that scheme that some of the greatest football players won the Bucs a super bowl with you know?
January 31st, 2016 at 2:07 pm
Mike Smith is open minded? Great, but let’s pull the reigns back a bit. The guy is not some type of 5star genious the NFL has never seen and Lovie is the the one way thinking dinosaur he’s being painted out to be….. Darell Revis(mentioned above) is a perfect example, concerning Lovie. He wasn’t released merely because he didn’t fit a scheme. He’s a man corner and Lovie ran a lot of man coverages in his defense, surely Review would have fit. Revis’ release had much more to do with freeing up cap room to get talent in other areas that Lovie found more important, primarily pass rush.
Lovies downfall had more to do with his free agent having voids of talent(or you could argue poor coaching of said talent) and less to do with closed mindedly requiring player to be of a certain mold that fit a scheme,……….the ball was simply dropped by Lovie in getting players that made an impact. Again, you could argue that we had impactful players but the coaching set them up for failure.
In either case the whole premise that Lovies system was to blame is overblown. When you look at the product on the field our defense simply did not make enough plays. Our players just were not good enough. Give Lovie Smith better players and his scheme looks better, I guarantee it. Nobody was complaining about his scheme in Chicago when Urlacher was dealing havoc and peanut Tillman was making splash plays weekly.
January 31st, 2016 at 2:22 pm
Another thing that hurt Lovie is that many times his players on defense were unprepared. The best example I remember was when Danny Lansanah came off the bench vs New Orleans. He was never in the right place on the field. I highly doubt the defense called for Danny to be directly behind LVD on a passing play. He was running into teammates, it was awful to watch………… You go back and look at some of our red zone defenses. Which red zone D requires a corner to line up, basically, 5 yards deep over center and his responsibility is to cover the sideline?.,……… Our defense was running zigzags out there way too many times.
You can’t have your players this wildly unprepared and expect any good to happen. Our defensive coaches really did a poor job last year. Mike Smith can get our players better prepared. If he does he will be a major improvement over Lovie but it won’t be due to a mere scheme, it will be due to fundamental coaching.
January 31st, 2016 at 2:29 pm
@davidbigbucsfan
I think I’ve only said that Lynch might be, although he was not crying in the media the lovie was stabbed in the back!!! Still, hopefully he words to the “real Coach Smith” were true!!! but we will keep in eye out! (trust but verify!!)
Also, I have not seen him in the Tampa2 mafia meetings, I sneak in from time to time. As much like their Defensive scheme there are way in and out all day long, Its like I just slant my way out everytime!!! You would think they would adjust but then they would not be the Tampa2 mafia would they!!!!!
@Dave
not negative at all, Was just trying to fix the biggest problems around here!!! sorry it takes you way longer to figure that out!!! and here is another tidbit for you, The “real” reason Galloway and Bryant were not on the field was because Galloway had a broken foot!! they were trying to out trick other teams to prepare for Galloway!!! But seeing as you probably only get your misinformation from bad local sports talk radio, you would not know that!!!!
Google is your friend dave, use it!!!
January 31st, 2016 at 2:39 pm
I understand why Mike Johnson is the way he is. It has seemed to me that the guys who have been the hardest on Lovie are white guys. I know most of the posters up here are white but the worst ones even get down and dirty by questioning his intelligence even though he has never come across as a dim whit stupid or incompetent individual. I’ve put out that his past coaching experience proves he isnt any of those things but the guys up here don’t care. Then this white guy Koetter gets the job picked by the white guy Licht who was supposed to be in Lovies corner. History has proven many good former coordinators do not make good head coaches and Koetter has yet to even oversee an NFL practice let alone coach a game and many of you guys up here are hanging on evety word he says like it means anything yet. Oh he’s a straight shooter or he’s a tough guy and you jump through hoops singing his praise. Me on the other hand will reserve my judgement for what takes place on the field. I think/hope Koetter will make a good head coach because he has been successful where he has been and what he did with our offense inside of one year but on the same token I want to see if you guys will crucify him if the Bucs suck for the next two years the way you did Lovie. I’m with everyone else that it was time for him to go and Koetter was a good choice for Jameis because I would much rather have him succeed so the Bucs become great than for him to fail and prove a point. Mike Johnson you should be more like me.
January 31st, 2016 at 2:46 pm
David-One thing about Koetter……He was chosen by Licht. That’s one thing he has in his favors compared to our former coaches. Lovie was picked by the Glazers, Schiano and Rah were picked by Dominick…….. To me that’s a major difference, that is if your are a Licht fan. Our HC was actually picked by somebody who knows football. Hey, I’ve been a Bucs fan during this past decade. You better believe I’ll find something to give me hope.
But I do agree with you, Koetter has to prove his worth before I sing any praises. I’ve actaulyy saw some of these Jags call him a great HC. Can the guy hold a clipboard just once please?
January 31st, 2016 at 2:48 pm
MJ… is negative no doubt, he’s right though.
He still ain’t got nothing on you Realist. smh
January 31st, 2016 at 2:49 pm
Well Realist there’s nothing wrong with the scheme but the coach who runs it. The slant can kill any scheme if the players don’t play right and I’ve never known the Bucs to always run it 100% of the time. Tampa2mafia meetings??? Are you serious??? Give it a rest! There’s no such thing. I will say you are knowledgeable but you constantly crying about your fabricated Tampa2 mafia crap shows your maturity level.
January 31st, 2016 at 2:50 pm
DavidbigBucsFan…”white guy”???
Those same posters were just as harsh on Schiano as they are on Lovie your “black guy”. One could easily say Schiano was called a lot worse on JBF than Lovie ever has.
Take your race card with you when you leave.
January 31st, 2016 at 2:57 pm
David….we need less of people like you in America, not more.
January 31st, 2016 at 3:01 pm
lynch also covers the NFC South closely for Fox Sports, meeting with players and coaches before the games he covers. he will be a fountain of good input
January 31st, 2016 at 3:06 pm
Some people just like to complain.
Relentlessly. Continually. In. Every. Post.
And, it’s not about whether I disagree or agree with their sentiment. It’s just that naggers and complainers are the worst.
Moaning about the same thing over and over again isn’t going to change anything. They’re just miserable people, and they want to share their miserableness with everyone else.
January 31st, 2016 at 3:18 pm
Hey Warrick, its what helps make the world go round. Gotta have people rocking the boat. It’s more fun that way.
January 31st, 2016 at 3:18 pm
There is no possible way out defense ends up being ANY worse than they were the last two season…
January 31st, 2016 at 3:47 pm
If we can’t win more than 6 games then why am I happy again geesh just make the playoffs talented players stand out Duh.. offensively and Defensively
January 31st, 2016 at 4:15 pm
“Most of the posters on here are white”
Idiotic posters on here man I swear jajajaja
January 31st, 2016 at 4:21 pm
@Joe…this is is your first time in cali???? Is that even legal???
January 31st, 2016 at 6:17 pm
DavidBigBucsFan – Did your really spend a whole large paragraph calling all us white guys racist only to end your paragraph with “I’m with everyone else that it was time for him to go” WTF?
January 31st, 2016 at 6:37 pm
STPeteBucFan..Continuity of Koetter? He has never been a HC in the NFL. NEVER. Yes, he did his job as an OC. I give him credit for that. Jameis can make any OC look good. I want to see 1st what Koetter can do before I..heap the sweet gravy on him. That goes for DC Smith too. As for the racial thing mentioned here, I’m a white guy who no longer lives in Tamap. Lived in Temple Terrace back in the day and went to Tampa Catholic. 15 yrs removed from HS, I went west and followed the money. At the time with wife and 2 kids, 90 grand was a lot more than the 38 I was makin in Tampa. I will always be a Bucs fan. We are everywhere. Even way out west here, there are about 40 of us who gather every Sunday and watch us…win or lose. But racially, we do tend to pull the plug quickly on our black players and coaches. Check out our history from Doug Williams all the way to Lovie. Not sayin it was racial..But..its there for all to see.
January 31st, 2016 at 6:42 pm
I don’t post often, but read every day. Guess I never knew that race affected my love of the Bucs. Some of you are articulate and on point. Some others…not so much. Any who, Go Bucs! Is it okay that I’m white and married a black woman? Am I on Drudge?
January 31st, 2016 at 6:59 pm
Lovie was fired cause the defensive guru’s weakness turned out to be his defense.
Plain and simple. Not because he was black.
The Glazers who have hired more black coaches than white coaches when looking at our last 5 hires are making decisions based on race and not job performance… right ahahaha.
January 31st, 2016 at 7:47 pm
Mike Johnson
I have been watching the Bucs or listening on the from the beginning.
dungy the most winning coach in our history-but conservative offensive approach did not get us to the Superbowl.Glazers knew it,as many fans
did.Much like lovie,he wouldn’t change,so they fired him.
In comes gruden and he wins us superbowl,but has a sub .500 record in the following years. doesn’t like players that rich Mckay brought in so he pushes him out the door.Brings in Bruce Allen who brought in players that much like lovies free agent failures.salary cap ,ageing players and less focus on good drafting.Not sure of exact reason for his firing.Maybe it was paying Keyshon to sit on benchor go home.
Rah started out with a bang.Fired Derrick Brooks and still won 10 games.but that success fizzled and he lost both the team and control of his coaches in London.
Schiano started out better than he finished Toes on the line style lost respect of team and fans.Only coach to have a billboard in his name calling to be fired
Lovie Smith_inherited same stubborn conservative offensive philosophy as
Tony.Did not know how to go for win and score touchdowns.FG’s might
help you but if you are only making 75% of themthen not so much.Poor defensive coaching staff,poor free agency roster moves inability to properly utilize players already on roster are just some reasons.
my point is that there was a logical reason to let all the coaches go whether they lasted 2,5or7 years.if you are not improving then that cancels out the need for continuity.
January 31st, 2016 at 7:58 pm
@Bob in Valrico
Coach Jon Gruden is the most winning coach in Bucs history!!! With his 57 wins ( 60 if you count playoffs) Dungy only had 54 ( 56 if you count playoffs)
January 31st, 2016 at 8:11 pm
Now I am really LMAO. So us white guys are racist. David do you want to know how stupid that statement is. If that was true, we would be on every site calling for all black players to be replaced with white players. We are backing a team made of mostly black players. And the best part? Our star QB we support is BLACK!
January 31st, 2016 at 11:11 pm
Dreambig that’s why you didn’t understand what I was saying. You’re saying I said something that I didn’t. No where in that post did I call any of the posters here racist I simply mentioned that most up here are white. See I haven’t been up here as long as others this season is my first and this is the first time I’ve seen your name. I guess I should have spelled it out for you that I was a Lovie supporter before maybe that might have cleared up for you when I said it was time for him to go. It seemed Mike Johnson thinks Lovie got a raw deal and and all this unfettered love for Koetter is uncalled for and maybe because of Lovies color. That’s all I was talking about.
January 31st, 2016 at 11:18 pm
1987 it’s because we have too too many people like you in this country why things are the way they are today. Go stick your head back in the sand along with your one black friend. That’s where you belong. I never took the time out to post about your ” my best friend is a black guy ” comment. You don’t even know how ridiculous you sound with that. It’s what your kind does to justify they aren’t racist. Hilarious!
January 31st, 2016 at 11:25 pm
Hey PRBuc sorry I insulted your intelligence with my statement but if you’re going to tyoe in English ha ha is spelled with an h not a j. I know the j in Puerto Rican Spanish is pronounced like an h but come on amigo if you’re gonna diss or clown someone get your English right son!
February 1st, 2016 at 12:12 am
@ realist
good try, but he would also hold the distinction of having most losses
at 57. of all above named coaches averaging over 8 a year.Ouch!
if you look at won loss % that where I made that statement.But at 60 wins you would also be right.
February 1st, 2016 at 6:17 am
Hey Joe….
If you’ve never been to Frisco before, check out the Stinkin’ Rose on Columbus Ave. in the North Beach area. Great restaurant. Ya gotta love garlic to enjoy this place. It’s fun, a bit noisy, and they put garlic in EVERYTHING. Try their garlic ice cream.
February 1st, 2016 at 10:29 am
DavidbigRaceFan …once again never even addressing the fact that these same posters bashed Schiano a lot harder than they did your “black guy”. Perhaps it’s because Schiano was a “white guy”.
David…there’s nothing ridiculous about having only ONE friend that happens to be black. I don’t like people in general, hence why I have no friends. Just the one, that happens to BE black. Guess what? He thinks just like me. Oh wait that might make him an uncle Tom or act too white so he’s not really a black guy when he doesn’t toe the line is he? He gets me and agrees with me 100%.
You on the other hand are simply a race baiter.
The disclaimer’s going to have to come back out Bucs fans. As long as MJ and davidbigproblack are on site talking about “white guys”.
February 1st, 2016 at 5:17 pm
1987 I can’t comment about your comment about Schiano because I wasn’t up here at that time didn’t even know about this site if you must know since I bruised you sensibilities by not commenting. Man you must have been hanging on that reply for it to bother you.
What the heck is a race baiter? I love how you guys who lean to the right always put words together to make them sound so bad or something like reverse discrimination because some dude like you can’t get some job because someonel else gets it instead. It’s called reparations clown for the sins of this country that wouldn’t even let your friend live in your neighborhood a short 50 years ago in your lifetime. Just because you have your head buried in the mud don’t pretend you can tell me anything about a subject you know absolutely nothing about or even care to know about.
Oh your friend gets you huh? You guys must make a cute couple. Do you have a website called Ebony and Ivory with that famous song as your theme song? Ask him how he feels when people tell him he speaks so well or he’s so well spoken. If that back handed compliment don’t bother him then no he’s not black.
Since you felt the need to give the history of you and your lil homie let me give you the Cliff notes on mine. Contrary to your and others popular belief based upon my post I am not black but my wife and kids are. I am Korean and white. I grew up in the 70s & 80s listening to people like you call me to my face every racist name in the book made up for Asians it didn’t matter I was a nice person or my father was just like them. I then learned about what your lil buddy’s parents and grandparents went thru and equated my experience at your hands with theirs so yeah I became very “pro black” as you so racistly stated, but after 30 years I’ve learned many of them are almost as bad.
There’s only one group that will outright wear their hatred on this board if they would even bother but most of the “regular” guys aren’t man enough to say what they really feel instead hide behind inuendos and double speak so they aren’t labled. I called out one guy who I felt was fitting that mold and as to be expected a bunch of others panties got twisted by it.
1887 you don’t like me bringing up race? Well too bad so sad. Just like your type say don’t tread on my gun rights? Don’t tread on my freedom of speech rights . This is America jack!