Jameis Winston Has Improved
April 6th, 2015
The Bucs seem pleased Jameis Winston is losing his pitching-motion-like football delivery
Of course, Jameis Winston haters threw all sorts of mean words at him when the Bucs won the Chase for Jameis with the worst record in the NFL.
One slur was “Leftwich.”
That came because Winston had somewhat baseball-like windup in his release. Understandable because Winston is also a pitcher, and a damned impressive one.
Since football season ended, Winston has worked to refine his football throwing motion. It appears he has made quite a bit of progress toward this goal, and the Bucs, types Woody Cummings of The Tampa Tribune, are pleased.
During his 102-throw workout on Tuesday, Winston seldom dropped the ball past his chest before starting his delivery, and that greatly pleased scouts eager to see Winston develop a quicker release.
Winston also displayed improved footwork, particularly his ability to properly set his feet before the throw, and in his ability to properly step into his throws, which should improve his accuracy and velocity.
“It was good to see that he’s got some good work in with George Whitfield,” Bucs quarterbacks coach Mike Bajakian said, referring to Winston and his personal quarterbacks coach. “George has done a good job of coaching him up.’’
Winston has mentioned previously that he’s enjoying working on football year-round, instead of jumping into baseball every spring.
So, as Winston said, as good of a quarterback as he is, his ceiling may be much higher because he has never been a full-time football player.
Stands to reason.
April 6th, 2015 at 7:28 am
Woody Cummings is blind as heck. I did see improvement, but not to the degree that Woody Cummings claims.
The windup was shortened. Winston still dropped it below the chest often, but not much below. Woody Cummings, again is blind.
Footwork was horrible. Winston nearly tripped over his own feet several times. His lack of fluid mobility in the pocket added to the illusion that he was overweight. Woody Cummings, again, is blind.
I may agree there was improvement in his windup, but I’m not going to lie and say it is gone like Woody Cummings seems to be doing.
I enjoyed the Pro Day. Not because I was “hoping” for plenty of mistakes (which there were, and I was not), but because it was real. All other Pro Days are simply about putting on a show of safe passes. Safe. Winston showed, in my view, that he wants people to know his weaknesses.
With his off field issues, it may seem strange to say this, but it showed honesty. More so than any QB Pro Day has ever shown.
And that scored a lot of points with me.
April 6th, 2015 at 7:32 am
“Understandable because Winston is also a pitcher, and a damned impressive one.” – Joe
Blinded by the light. Winston may be impressive as a pitcher compared to you or I, but not at a pro level pitcher.
April 6th, 2015 at 7:35 am
If Demar Dotson is indeed the starter at left tackle, Jameis better develop the fastest release in football………
April 6th, 2015 at 7:55 am
I think the Demar Dotson move is a smoke screen going into the draft.
April 6th, 2015 at 7:58 am
His facial expression in this photo make him look like one of the muppets everyone else is naming our current QB. “Meep, meep”.
April 6th, 2015 at 7:59 am
To be fair, he may not be major league ready, but he was impressive enough to be drafted by the Rangers. We all saw his improvement with his throwing motion, but footwork? If that was improved footwork then his footwork must have been far worse than I remembered. It will be interesting to see how much more he can improve with devoting himself full time to football.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:00 am
I guess you know better than the MLB (Texas Rangers) team who drafted him out of high school at 17 years old. Stanford and FSU are two of the top College baseball programs so I’m sure he is much better now than he was when he was drafted.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:01 am
You forgot to ment on that others negative Bonzai! He was stating down those damn receivers in that pro day! Right? LOL!
April 6th, 2015 at 8:02 am
mention
April 6th, 2015 at 8:07 am
@Bucfan4life
He was, which I mentioned elsewhere. I also gave the reason for it, in this instance.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:10 am
This just in.
Jason Licht is working a trade with the Browns, offering Mike Glennon for Johnny Manziel and a 7th rounder.
Not actually true that I know of, but the thought of having two QBs that Joe wanted on the team at the same time, and both proving out to be busts…well, that’s just entertainment.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:15 am
Bonzai
That’s funny.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:22 am
I thought Jameis was pro ready day one. So let me get this straight. Jameis needs to improve his footwork, throwing motion and work on his nutrition/training. I guess they don’t teach that in today’s college football. Well at least he can huddle and call out plays. If Jameis had played for any program outside of Florida he would be getting torched by Buc fans.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:28 am
MM IS THE QB. MEDIA TYPES ARE NEVER RIGHT.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:30 am
The higher and shortened release Winston displayed after working with Whitfield for less than 2 months is very encouraging for the Bucs to see. it shows how coachable Winston is and how quickly improvements in his mechanics can come.
Whether or not such things will be seen on game day remains to be seen as players often have a tendency to revert back to what they have been doing their whole lives in the heat of battle with 300 lb linemen chasing them. But hopefully Winston will get enough reps between now and then that the improved throwing motion will become ingrained and stick.
Even if his throwing motion stays elongated – I would not be that concerned with it as Winston showed he can be very effective throwing that way.
24 days. Don’t screw this up L&L.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:32 am
I present to you all an example of stupidity:
Bucfan4life Says
Hmmm, much of and agenda there Bonzai? I kind of breezed through your post as it was just too long. However, did you really point out staring down receivers in his pro day as a negative?
Bucfan4life Says
You forgot to ment on that others negative Bonzai! He was stating down those damn receivers in that pro day! Right? LOL!
And what was this comment he saw fit to mock? Here’s the exact remark I originally made:
“Still staring down Receivers (I’m actually willing to concede a little on this one because it was only a Pro Day and he was focused on only one WR at a time anyway)”
Bucfan4life, don’t try to pretend you are something you are not. Smart, that is.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:36 am
@Bucfan4life
Outside the pro day, which I clearly conceded in my original post was understandable, you apparently refuse to acknowledge the fault even exists. Also apparently, his interceptions were just a random occurrence that had no apparent cause according to you. It must have been his WRs, right?
Grow up, little man. Winston staring down WRs and his ball placement are the reasons he had so many picks. Any truly intelligent man can see that. Any fool can not.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:38 am
Jameis Winston is a Buc no matter what anybody says on JBF, good or bad.
That’s my new motto fro the next 24 days.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:39 am
Jameis has improved his throwing mechanics…but he still has a way to go. He’s not Leftwich, but he’s not Luck or Brady either. If he’s the pick, I’m sure he will work on shortening his throwing motion before the season starts.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:53 am
Pickgrin
Good point on the tendency to revert back to what they know. Tebow showed at the combine an Improved throwing motion and footwork but definitely reverted back to what was natural to him once he faced an NFL defense. I am more concerned with his footwork than his throwing motion though. If he reverts back with his throwing motion he can still find success. Hasn’t held back Rivers too much. I hear the Leftwich comparison, but Leftwich didn’t have a horrible career and Winston is much more mobile and accurate than Leftwich was.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:54 am
Bonzai, you were criticizing his pro day and threw in that he was staring down his receivers. Simple as that. If you were saying he did that during game ok. I am not sure why I am stupid if I think that is an absurd criticism of his pro day when one receiver ran a route and no defense was on the field. Winston is not perfect and pointing out his sloppy footwork and some missed throws is fine. I do not think staring down receivers in a pro day exhibition is a legitimate critique though.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:55 am
(warning, Bucfan4life, reading is required, so you may as well not try)
Here’s the problem Winstonites have…they consistently try to deny the obvious, and it devalues their opinions.
For example, denying that off field issues should play a role. Even setting aside the Rape thing, there are enough things to at least raise valid concerns regarding his maturity and character.
Another example, of course, is the wind up. They think and say it isn’t a big deal, but that wasn’t their tune with previous WRs here that had the same issue. That makes it clear that they are less than objective.
Winstonites would be better served to agree on the weaknesses, and give the reasons they believe he can overcome them. Perhaps then they would have valued opinions outside of their own circle.
What is objectivity?
Well, in my view, in this instance it is wanting the best quarterback for the team. This requires a QB who will adjust to the NFL, make wise decisions, and who will be elite in the long term. What I do not want is someone who will be suspended for off field issues…because that doesn’t help the team at all.
So, to deny that this is a concern is foolish. It is a concern. Otherwise, even the Winstonites would not be talking about how he needs to be mentored off the field. If he didn’t have these faults, he would not need that sort of mentoring. He would only need mentoring regarding his skills, not his behavior.
There is a risk with Winston, just as there is with Mariota. They are different risks, but there are risks.
You think I don’t want Winstonites to be right? If he is the pick, I certainly want him to turn into an elite QB and role model.
Am I agenda driven? H3LL YES! My agenda is that I want the Buccaneers to become a true dynasty. I don’t want one Super Bowl victory. I want multiple Super Bowl victories.
To that end, I want the best QB for the job. I want a Tom Brady. I want an Aaron Rodgers. I want a Peyton Manning or Russell Wilson.
And I do not believe that the way to get that is a quick fix or to ignore issues in players. Expose the issues so they can be dealt with up front. Determine if said player can overcome those issues, and if not, move on.
Mariota has his share of issues to deal with. No one is denying that. Winston has his issues to deal with. EVERYONE is denying that.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:57 am
Nobody truly knows who the Buccaneers will draft with their first pick no matter what anyone says on JBF.
April 6th, 2015 at 8:58 am
I am curious as to who is flipping the bill for Jameis (and MM for that matter) flying out to Caifornia for ptrivate workouts with the QB Whisperer or does Jameis (or MM) pay the bill with their first NFL check?
April 6th, 2015 at 9:00 am
@ BuccaneerBonzai
Well done sir! Very well stated.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:02 am
Bucfan4life,
The way you practice has a tendency to display itself on game day. Even if working with only one receiver and against no defense he should be practicing looking off the defender.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:05 am
Bucfan4life Says
“Bonzai, you were criticizing his pro day and threw in that he was staring down his receivers. Simple as that.”
Sigh. You really are intellectually impaired, so I suppose I should feel pity for you.
Okay, here is the thing. I will consistently bring up weaknesses in his game until they are fixed.
Staring down WRs is a weakness, is it not? (don’t answer that, because you probably think it is a strength). Did he do anything…ANYTHING…during the Pro Day to eliminate that issue?
NO.
Even though I conceded that it was only a Pro Day, he could have still let his eyes drift over the field, because there were multiple WRs out there each time. He could have kept his eyes mobile, but he didn’t.
It is EASY to project where your WR will be when you never take your eyes off him…for the Quarterback AND for the defense (when there is one).
My point was that he did nothing to ease the concern during his Pro Day, but I was willing to give him a pass on it in this instance.
Unfortunately, in true Winstonite fashion, you feel the need to troll and make a fool of yourself. As a result, you made me elaborate on the weakness in you and in Winston.
A bit of advice.
It is better to be silent and let people think you are a fool, than to open your mouth and prove it to be so.
You are clinging to what you misinterpreted without truly reading my original comments (which you confessed to), and now are trying to save face by refusing to admit the mistake. Take responsibility. Admit you were in the wrong. That’s how you save face and earn respect.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:07 am
Correction:
“They think and say it isn’t a big deal, but that wasn’t their tune with previous WRs here…”
should have been
“They think and say it isn’t a big deal, but that wasn’t their tune with previous QBs here…”
April 6th, 2015 at 9:09 am
@Scotty in Fat Antonio
That’s a good question, and one I would like the answer to, just to learn something about how those things work.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:16 am
Winston is in fact the most pro ready. That does not mean he is perfect with nothing to work on. Guess what, all players work on improving their craft through the entire length of their respective careers. Brady, Manning and Luck all continue to work on getting better. Winston is no different. Slamming him for having some things to work on just shows how much a person knows very little about pro football and life for that matter.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:18 am
Over the course of his career at FSU, Jameis threw an interception every 30.3 pass attempts. He threw a touchdown every 13.1 pass attempts.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:18 am
I’m not positive but I believe the player’s agent foots the bill for those sort of things up front.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:21 am
Bonzai in referring to his mistakes during pro day you said “still staring down receivers.” Just because you put in your disclaimer “I’m willing to concede a little on this” doesn’t mean you weren’t criticizing him for it. You had it listed as a negative and you specifically said I’m willing to concede “a little.” What exactly did I not understand?
My reading comprehension is fine. I think it is your inability to articulate your position that may be the problem.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:22 am
@Bonzai and Character
Mariota has his share of issues to deal with. No one is denying that. Winston has his issues to deal with. EVERYONE is denying that.
I think that is a pretty fair assessment. And CM I can’t really fault anybody who simply can’t get past the off field issues. They are plentiful.
And so I shall not try to change your minds because I respect your opinions and you make valid points.
But in fairness IF you can get past the off field issues the rest has become pretty clear. The overwhelming majority of everybody connected to the NFL…not just JBF posters…believe Fameis is the correct selection.
Because of that HUGE CONSENSUS…and the fact that I respect Lovie’s character…I’ve switched over to signing Fameis. I’m not a Winstonite but I think he is the best choice on the field and if L&L after ALL their due diligence feel comfortable with him off the field, then I’m willing to take a flyer.
If it’s Mariota I won’t be upset but I now believe Famies is the choice.
IMHO Mariota has more upside than Fameis but he also has a lot more downside. And I do believe Fameis has a chance to be a great franchise QB.
If MM turns out to be better does it really matter at that point. Who would you rather have…Aaron Rodgers in his prime or Tom Brady in his prime? You could win a Super Bowl with either so why would it really matter.
If both Fameis and Marcus reach their potential hopefully it’ll end up being the same kind of choice…irrelevant because you can win a SB with both of them.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:23 am
I think many of Winston’s INT”s were the result of him trying to do too much, more so than staring down his receivers. Many of them came when he was pressured. Which reminds me of Brett Favre and I have no problem with that.
That can be coached out of him…if they even want to.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:30 am
StPete he is not perfect and will probably have some growing pains next year.
I don’t think Mariota has more upside, in fact I think just the opposite. I think all of the Winston supporters know his game well and know he isn’t perfect. However, he is the better prospect at this time and as you said, it is pretty much a consensus at this point.
Th good thing is that the OC and QB coach recognize his flaws and will try to help him improve on his weaknesses.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:35 am
The term “pro-ready” doesn’t really mean much when assigned to a prospect.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:44 am
Jameies may very well throw a lot of picks as he learns the pro game.
Manning had 28 his first year.
Favre 24
Even the great Andrew Luck had 18 and a relatively low QB rating of 76.5 as a rook.
Struggles are a given. As for throwing motion. Ole Marino and Favre used to keep that ball around hip level before busting loose. And Rivers throws side armed to this day.
All well and good to improve, but it sure has worked so far.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:46 am
“Scout vs. Scout: Is Marcus Mariota worth a top-10 pick?”
By Bryan Fischer – NFL.com
Bucky Brooks take :
“When you pick a player in the top 10, the expectation is right away he is going to give you performance and production. I don’t believe that Marcus Mariota is that guy. Marcus Mariota will need some time to develop into being a franchise quarterback. I love the athleticism. I love his ability to be a dual-threat playmaker, but he misses too many layups in the passing game. He does make full-field reads, but he doesn’t do it consistently. He reminds me of when Alex Smith came into the league, (and) needed some time to transition to a pro-style offense. I believe that’s what Marcus Mariota is going to need, and if that is the case, I believe you have to take him late in the first round. That is where I have him graded. I believe he needs two to three years before he is ready to play in a pro-style system.”
If Brooks is right time is NOT on the side of Lovie Smith.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:47 am
Matt Ryan had 19 picks his last season at Boston College.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:00 am
All the haters dissecting every little thing are laughable.
Just watch the games he played.
The guy can make every throw.
He is very accurate.
He has fantastic pocket presence and feel
He has vision and goes through reads
He wins
Yet you armchair QBs want to pick apart every little thing you see in a workout in shorts
April 6th, 2015 at 10:01 am
87
yes and Marino’s interception total went up his last year in college as well.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:05 am
23 to be exact.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:10 am
One thing I think is important to note about Jameis’ alleged int problem.
In the two ACC Championship games, and the 2013 National Championship Game and the 2014 Playoff game his TD/int ration was 9tds-3ints.
Pretty clutch in the biggest games of the year.
And in the biggest game of his life as a freshman 0 Ints vs. Auburn.
Objectively speaking, that’s pretty darn good.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:18 am
Dave,
Cannot the same thing be said of MM? That is what we do this time of year- dissect every strength and weakness of the prospects. We ARE getting our views of their weaknesses by watching the games they played just as you are pointing out JW’s strengths. You cannot however have a complete evaluation without recognizing his weaknesses as well.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:27 am
Everyone is denying Winston has issues? Where the hell r u getting this from. Even the staunchest Winston supporters know there’s a risk. We just say that we haven’t drank the negative media kool aid and did our own investigation. His immature acts were that, immature. I left home for the first time at 17, to go play b-ball in Juco..only lasted a year BECAUSE I was immature. I went to the military after that but I had structure alot more than in college, and some serious guidance I was able to serve my country and make it a career. I’m thankful. Now, if he did assault the young lady…he will have to answer at some point, whether with God or whatever, and I hope he goes down. But thstory and inconsistencies don’t allow me to believe otherwise.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:33 am
Bonzai:
You talk of devaluing other people’s opinions without realizing that with every word you type you are devaluing your own.
After reading your diatribes it’s clear you either A) haven’t watched enough tape or B) don’t understand the game of football. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and guess you just haven’t watched enough tape.
Stares down receivers?? Anyone who says this is just shouting their own ignorance. His accuracy and ability to make excellent decisions on second reactions or 2nd to third reads is extremely well documented. He actually throws receivers open—something Mariota can only dream of doing. He has the ability to place the ball in the perfect spot before the WR has even gone through his break–again something we haven’t seen from MM. MM hikes the ball, has only one throwing option and a run option–chooses and goes—and you want to talk about the ability to make reads??
I’ll going with Mcshay on this one–he has the best intangibles of any QB in the last ten years–second only to Luck. But if you really want to read some truth check out Prisco’s column this week. Even in a blowout head to head loss Winston’s tape looked better than MM.
As far as INT’s—this year was a perfect storm of risky throws in comeback bids, a porous o-line, inexperienced receivers (except Greene), and, yes, some poor decisions. However, there’s two seasons of tape on Winston, remember? If you compare the seasons, it’s about equal when it comes to poor decisions and then the second season is compounded due to non-QB errors. for example, check the Louisville game (yes you would actually have to watch tape) two iINT’s are pure WR route issues–this was a problem game game after game–understandable when your only options after green were Wilson, CG., and a freshman.
As far as off the field-
Cleared of assault 4 times, once by an unbiased former Supreme Court justice
The cursing—a high schooler wouldn’t have been suspended for this (laughable)
The crab legs—ah, the crab legs. A regular FSU hook-up gone wrong is what the people who work at that publix say, but who knows. Either way stupid decision. It’s one thing for an unrecognizable player to stroll in and walk out with free crab, it’s another for Winston–he should’ve known that all eyes would be on him. However, while its against the NCAA, it’s not against the law.
So you’re gonna not take a player for taking free crab legs?? Ok.
So, as Prisco’s says, everyone he talks to in the NFL, almost to a man, says Winston is hands down the better choice—so what’s more likely, that all of the who get paid handsomely to evaluate players are wrong–or that perhaps you haven’t watched enough tape to make a sound judgement???
Either way, he’s coming–so either get on the ship or walk the plank!
April 6th, 2015 at 10:34 am
charactermatters Says:
April 6th, 2015 at 10:18 am
Dave,
Cannot the same thing be said of MM? That is what we do this time of year- dissect every strength and weakness of the prospects. We ARE getting our views of their weaknesses by watching the games they played just as you are pointing out JW’s strengths. You cannot however have a complete evaluation without recognizing his weaknesses as well.
I agree but MM did so in a gimmick offense. He had receivers running open on just about every play. That’s what the spread is about. If he was in more of a pro style he would be more pro ready. But he looked the sidelines for checks and audibles and if he wasn’t so fast would his ceiling be higher than a guy who is younger, played less football, played two sports and won almost as many games? Hmmmm
April 6th, 2015 at 10:37 am
charactermatters …I’ve debated his strengths and weakness for over 3 months now. Continuing it any longer is equivalent to drinking an old skunky beer that sat out in the sun for 3 months.
I’m not going to drink it. You enjoy it though. Wish you were here 2 months ago making all your points, but I’m winding down now.
You may get a few others engaged, but the ones that have been defended him for the last 3 months are exhausted with it. I know I am.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:40 am
@ buccbonaza
You are clueless on many levels. The expert scouts says Winston is the best at manipulating coverages because of how he utilizes his eyes to freeze/look off the safeties/linebackers. Thats part of throwing someone open. He threw those many picks (which all were not his fault) because he tried to force the issue ie fit balls where he should not have. He and even the scouts call that trying to do too much. You may call it starring down receivers but you would be wrong. You can continue to make up stuff if you like though.
April 6th, 2015 at 10:55 am
That is the wonderful part of sports talk, people just make up whatever they want to think regardless of reality.
April 6th, 2015 at 11:38 am
Jimmy53,
Not against the law? ARE YOU SERIOUS? Please tell me you’re not serious. This is satire right? Not against the law SMH
April 6th, 2015 at 11:39 am
Every top tier QB is always trying to improve their fundamentals.
Amazing how dense some of the posters are on here.
Jameis has a chance to do some great things for the Bucs franchise and if you are a Bucs fan I can not see why that is not exciting.
April 6th, 2015 at 11:54 am
@Charactermatters….nit against the law for sum one to give u free stuff. If I go into a Walfreens and the cashier says hey I know u…u did that thing. Don’t worry that soda is free! It’s not against the law. However that cashier could get fired for not clearing this with her manager right? Exactly, that’s what Jimmy53 was trying to say.
April 6th, 2015 at 12:30 pm
Off topic, when I first clicked on read more for the comments on this article they came up numbered. I thought that is a good idea. Posters can refer to a comment with a number, in case you are late with a response to another post. The layout was different also. I clicked out after reading the comments, then came back and the numbers were gone.
April 6th, 2015 at 3:07 pm
Sorry Dave but that is still against the law. Having an inside guy that likes you and aids in the theft makes it no less theft. Now if the Owner of the establishment or someone given the authority to give away freebies did so that is another matter entirely. This is obviously not the case.
April 6th, 2015 at 9:58 pm
I dont think jameis is that good of a qb. Second to luck? Tell me how far is winston from the fundamentals n knowledge of luck? U winstonites are reaching. Carr n bortles will be good qbs better than alot of veteran qbs. So in what terms is winston comparable to luck? Luck has speed and accuracy. He manipulates defenses with his legs n arm. Arm first but he isnt afraid to turn the burners on at anytime. Everybody seen winstons 40. I think the anticipation throws are way too overrated. U can call it trying to do too much, u can call it horrible decisions. Were u trying to impress the scouts? He made mistakes in the beginning n middle off games. In tampa bay u won’t get a chance to recover from horrible decisions because defensive 3 n outs are just as rare as a 4 yard per carry rb. Mariota had more reads than just one n run now ur makin stuff up. Cam newton had the second best rookie year for a qb beat by luck. Jameis doesn’t seem to me like he is better than newton.
April 7th, 2015 at 6:19 am
What defensive schemes were used on pro day?