Does Sean Payton Think Lovie Smith Is Nuts?
June 22nd, 2014
Recent comments by Saints head coach Sean Payton run counter to Lovie Smith and Jason Licht’s approach to the rebuilding the Buccaneers’ offense.
Payton delivered an innocent yet stunning take that not only will make the Mike Glennon Mob rejoice but will further arouse those Bucs fans who wonder why and how Mike James and Bobby Rainey outperformed Doug Martin last year.
Former Tampa Bay fullback Erik Lorig is now a member of the Saints. (The Lovie regime, it seems, had no use for a versatile athletic fullback who was more than solid on special teams.) Payton was asked about why he sought Lorig in free agency, and the Saints head coach delivered an eye-opening response, via Nola.com.
“The last half of the season, they ran the ball as well as anyone in the NFL,” Payton said [of the Buccaneers]. “I don’t know statistically what their numbers were, but we felt like every time we put their offensive tape on, we saw a quarterback that was getting better, an offensive line, and a fullback. We really didn’t know much about him.
“We did our offseason homework like we would in free agency, and then you start going back and seeing that he was an outside linebacker converted to fullback.
“He’s a little bigger in stature, so when you watch him play he’s very physical,” Payton continued. “I don’t want to say there was a wish list, but it was (a thought that) let’s pay attention to and let’s see if we can get him on a visit.”
Wow! So the takeaway from Payton was that Glennon steadily was on the rise behind a run-blocking offensive line with a good fullback. Think about that assessment from a renowned offensive guru answering a casual question about his new fullback.
The Bucs closed the 2013 season in New Orleans, so it’s understandable that the Saints were dialed in to Tampa Bay’s play in the second half of the season.
If Payton is being honest, then he must be among those stunned that Lovie Smith didn’t roll with the “quarterback of the future” in 2014, and durable O-line fixtures Donald Penn and Jeremy Zuttah, and Davin Joseph.
As for the Bucs running game Payton alleges was good in the second half of 2013, Joe’s not about to believe that was some sort of beautiful component of the league’s 32nd-ranked offense. However, the Bucs did average 3.9 yards per carry after Doug Martin went down midway through the sixth game of the season against Atlanta.
That per-carry average includes Mike Glennon’s mostly anemic scrambles (positive and negative) and, overall, was a tick higher than the offense delivered with Martin. If the Bucs averaged 3.9 yards per carry over the full season, that would have placed them tied for 24th in the NFL.
Again, Payton’s comments were a mind-blower. Regular readers here can imagine Joe’s reaction when absorbing them with a Shock Top in hand at 1 a.m.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:06 am
It’s no secret that Sean Peyton, like a lot of coaches in the league, thinks highly of Mike Glennon. He was no Joe Montana at the end of games, but for a rookie, I thought he showed a lot to build on.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:07 am
He’s blowing smoke and giggling that he stole the only reason the Bucs ran well late last year, Lorig.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:16 am
What was the common denominator in last years run game? Whether it be with Martin, James, or Rainey. Payton knew what he was getting, and he got the better end of the deal.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:17 am
JOE KNOWS QBs!
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:18 am
I’m still scratching my head over the release of Lorig. Payton should have been suspended for multiple years for his regimes placing wanted dead or alive orders on opposing players. His smirk annoys me.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:19 am
What Payton didn’t say was that the Bucs were a 4-12 team and how much he enjoyed that. He should also do more study on players he signs. Lorig was a DE converted to a TE converted to a FB – not an OLB.
Sean has his hands full with his unhappy TE, his salary cap if Graham wins his greviance, how he’s going to replace Sproles, and what he’s going to do for a LT.
When he fixes those things I might listen to what he has to say!
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:31 am
Joe, you got all that out of his statement.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:33 am
Schiano knows talent, especially linebackers and RB’s.
His Rutgers teams always had an exceptional running game
even if the team itself was marginal.
The “improvement” of Glennon could just be kindly Grudem-speak.
Sounds like he’s more interested in Lorig.
It will be interesting to see if their run game improves.
They’re going to need it against the Bucs defense this year.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:41 am
Well he did sign that FB he liked in Lorig. He was a pure 5 tech DE in college, not a 3-4 OLB.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:41 am
I find it hilarious that some are lamenting the loss of Erik Lorig based on the statement of a guy who knows less about our new offense than the local beat writers and bloggers.
Lovie and Licht know what Tedford needed to run his offense and Lorig was part of the ingredients list. Glennon isn’t ready to run the kitchen yet. Calm down. Payton is nothing more than the peanut gallery.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:42 am
peyton and the aints’ suck !
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:43 am
Mumbles, actually, a TE converted to DE converted to FB.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:48 am
First off, Lorig was NOT a converted LB, he was a DE > TE > FB hybrid.
Initially, he lacked vision on his leading for the ball-carrier but clearly he developed. Second, anything praise-laden coming from this guy is smoke. He’s cocky and arrogant (deservedly so) as a play-caller – just see the 4th and 1s he dialed up on Bucs last year alone.
MG didn’t light up the league but based on what the Bucs were projected to finished after Freeturd collapsed it was a feat that MG played as well as he did. I’m sure there is gamesmanship in play here but I’m not buying it and that 2013 OLine was trash! A blind man could see that.
I would not put any stock into this assessment of the Bucs and MG.
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:57 am
I can assure youi….if we wanted to keep Lorig….we would have…..it looks like Tedford has gotten everything he wants.
If Payton liked our oline…he had a shot at Penn, Zuttah & certainly Joseph & passed.
June 22nd, 2014 at 10:07 am
Mike Glennon was a vast improvement to Josh Freeman. Glennon improved last year, like it or not Joe.
June 22nd, 2014 at 10:11 am
Brandon, I am a converted drunk. You are right. Lorig converted from TE to DE at Stanford. Then converted from DE to FB at the Bucs. Even played some H-back/FB at Stanford.
June 22nd, 2014 at 10:16 am
Payton was the coach that payed their defensive players to take out opposing players from games. Now with that in mind I believe everything he speaks to the media is planned BS.
What makes sense to me is him wanting to face a 2nd year QB this coming season rather than an experienced one. SMOKESCREEN
June 22nd, 2014 at 10:23 am
Not buying Paytons comments. He would love to put doubt in the Bucs players mind. Its going to be a long day for the Saints when they come to Tampa this year.
June 22nd, 2014 at 10:36 am
I was surprised they let Lorig move on. I guess Tedford’s offense will not feature a fullback often, but only on certain situations like 3rd and short.
June 22nd, 2014 at 10:40 am
Nope, Joe does not like that MG improved last year and that knownothings like Peyton said so.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:14 am
SteveK:
Help Joe out, please. How did Glennon improve when the Bucs had the worst offense in the league? That doesn’t seem to jive.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:19 am
There’s nothing mind-blowing about his comments, and there’s no story here. The Lorig fixation among some fans defies reason.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:22 am
“…Schiano knows talent, especially linebackers and RB’s. His Rutgers teams always had an exceptional running game…”
Yeah, thats how he won all those Big East Championships; oh, I’m sorry, that happened after he left.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:27 am
The Bucs were not the worst offense in the league under Glennon. Take away the 3 games your pet Freeman starred in and the Bucs were 27th in the league. Your constant obsession to over look the real facts has caught up with you. Your worst in the league argument has been nullified. Please try to use true facts when you discredit Mike “The Future Cannon” Glennon. Or there could be consequences i.e. no personal interviews when Glennon becomes the true face of the franchise. Memories run deep and don’t think for one moment that Glennon is not aware of your constant berates towards him.
Thank You
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:29 am
@Joe Says:
“…Help Joe out, please. How did Glennon improve when the Bucs had the worst offense in the league? That doesn’t seem to jive…”
MGM: ‘…no offensive line, not enough talented WRs, bad coaching, bad play calling, bad weather, stars not in alignment, etc…’
If The Cannon had the star power Freeman had when he started winning, like WRs Briscoe, Parker, Spurlock, Stoval, Stroughter and Williams, MG8 would be compared to B_rady and Manning by now.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:31 am
@ Harry
A far better gauge to show Schiano knows talent than Big East championships is to look at number of players drafted into the NFL during his time as HC there. You may be surprised to see how many guys from a small school like Rutgers are on NFL teams. This is no coincidence.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:31 am
Glennon will never be a quality qb. He is not accurate on throwing the long ball, can’t throw on the run to his left and is mobile as a tree.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:40 am
SACRO:
Might want to take up your argument with the NFL. The Bucs had the worst offense in the NFL. That is the only “fact” there is. If Glennon improved as SteveK claims, why didn’t he lead the offense out of the basement? Not even to the 31st-ranked offense?
There is no way of spinning that. The Bucs offense was the worst in the NFL last year. And Glennon was the starting quarterback for that offense in the final 13 games, over 3/4 of the season.
Don’t get mad at Joe. He wasn’t responsible.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:43 am
Glennon can’t do this, can’t do that blah blah blah. Let’s see how he plays when it’s his turn.
I hate wheat beer.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:43 am
Glennon got valuable experience last year. Is the the “answer”? Not yet, but he’s got potential.
Also, the Bucs passed on Johnny Football in favor of Josh McCown AND Mike Glennon.
“The last ranked offense” is only true when you add in Snake Boy’s first three games.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:51 am
Here we go again with our “Quarterback Controversy” with perhaps Payton stoking it a bit and definately Joe stoking it alot.
There is NO controversy. Mike Glennon is a very young, inexpensive, third round pick who has some NFL starts and it a “potential” starter. He is a very suitable backup to Josh McCown who will mentor him and buy him time.
McCown is our starter. As much as it generates readership and attention….the “Controversy” does not exist!!!
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:52 am
Ben,
How do you explain that our only two offensive weapons had the best year of their careers? Vincent Jackson not only had more yardage, but had more catches of over 20 yards as well as more catches of over 40 yards. Wright who was no one before last year had over 500 yards receiving and 5TD’s. Now maybe you can say he struggled rolling to his left (most right handed QB’s do) or hung on to the ball to long (most rookie’s do), but he was fairly accurate on his passes for the most part. Did Glennon have a worse game then the Jets game…..maybe, but doubt it. Did Glennon have a worse game then Freemans game with the Vikings? No Way!
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:56 am
A Shocktop? …ug, that stuff gives me gas. If I drink it, no more than 3 or 4.
June 22nd, 2014 at 11:57 am
@ToesOnTheLine Says:
“…A far better gauge to show Schiano knows talent than Big East championships is to look at number of players drafted into the NFL during his time as HC there.”
I don’t mean to completely diss Schiano. Its just when ppl make the comments they do that I can’t help it. Schiano wasn’t stupid; one does not become an NFL HC being stupid.
However, he was at Rutgers for 11 years – I would not say his record during that time was all that awesome, good maybe. He (not Dom) let Bennett go for some unknown reason, and as you know this great talent evaluator then promoted “Cheeseburger” Bowers as a starter before even one preseason game was played. So, I am not ‘all in’ on the brilliance of his ability to evaluate talent. Maybe Schiano’s problem was his ego – I really don’t know. But I do know he made some head scratching decisions.
June 22nd, 2014 at 12:04 pm
Easy to talk when you have drew brees as your quarterback
June 22nd, 2014 at 12:06 pm
@Buc89 Says:
“…Easy to talk when you have drew brees as your quarterback…”
That is exactly right. No HC is very smart if he doesn’t have a franchise QB
June 22nd, 2014 at 12:44 pm
Joe-
You hit the nail on the head.
“Might want to take up your argument with the NFL. The Bucs had the worst offense in the NFL. That is the only “fact” there is. If Glennon improved as SteveK claims, why didn’t he lead the offense out of the basement? Not even to the 31st-ranked offense?”
When NFL people evaluate, they look at numbers and stats and film. IT ALL STUNK AND GLENNON IS EQUALLY LIABLE FOR THE OFFENSIVE WOES.
Some homers will deny he was bad too but I saw missed reads and bad throws and more. Yes there were drops and sacks but Glennon is not out is the liability argument. Anytime you are the qb of the last ranked offense you are bad – period.
June 22nd, 2014 at 12:46 pm
Sean Payton is easily one of the top 3 offensive minds in the game so I’d be hesitant to simply dismiss his comments.
They watch film and they targeted Lorig because they think he was an effective lead blocker.
This isn’t a Glennon argument.
I have no idea whatsoever what Lovie and Tedford are planning to do for the fullback position. What I do know is that every single roster spot last year was scrutinized. If they thought Lorig fit what we are trying to do he wouldn’t have went to a division rival.
June 22nd, 2014 at 12:58 pm
@biff,
Yes, he is an awesome coach. But, Payton is known for running his mouth as is Bress. Lorig did a very good job – The running game was always much better when he was healthy.
However, where are you going to put him if Tedford’s offense does not utilize a FB? It seems pretty obvious Tedford plans a lot of double TE sets, IMO. Vjax and Evans split out wide, Wright and ASJ or Myers in a dbl TE set with one going into motion in the slot, and Martin or Sims as the lone back. Thats 11 players. The bucs have never had so many weapons in the skill positions. “If” we have a good OC, he should be able to do a lot with that with no FB. You can’t keep everybody.
June 22nd, 2014 at 12:59 pm
Lorig is a tough loss, but at least we have a potential BEAST on our roster right now in Javorski Lane…. I hope he & our RB’s & OLine can develop a good rapport quickly…. If so, we could be totally unstoppable when u combine that with all of our other weapons
June 22nd, 2014 at 1:53 pm
When NFL people evaluate, they look at numbers and stats and film. IT ALL STUNK AND GLENNON IS EQUALLY LIABLE FOR THE OFFENSIVE WOES.
—————————
Really? Is that why pretty much everyone from the O-line is gone? Is that why the draft was ALL offense except a QB? Lol clearly Lovie/Licht disagree with you.
June 22nd, 2014 at 1:59 pm
I see at least 2-3 huge run plays that the Saints will run on the Bucs next year because of the Lorig loss.
June 22nd, 2014 at 2:49 pm
Months go by and the same exact things are being said, no wonder I find other places to discuss things. On topic, I think Lorig is a big loss if we plan on using a FB at all. He could block and catch, that’s about all he was ever asked to do and he did it pretty well. Did he whiff every now and then? Yeah, he did, but he also lit up some defenders as well. Off topic, the whole Glennon thing is still funny to me. I’m cheering for him because he’s on the team, and I want the best player on the field. From what I saw last year, if Glennon is the best we have, I think we’re in trouble. Make all the excuses you want, lack of weapons (although other QBs have done more with less), the whole O-line is gone so it’s their fault (although we cut overpaid under-achievers for underpaid over-achievers), no run game without Martin (although the actual run game numbers were better), he was a rookie that didn’t get the reps in practice (although he did get significantly more reps in preseason and was only 3 weeks removed from that), it was the coaching (even though the offense performed much better under the same coaches the year before). For me, he’ll have to prove it by winning the job (he did not “earn” anything yet) and performing on the field. If he can do that, I’m behind him 100%
June 22nd, 2014 at 4:22 pm
” let’s see how he plays when he gets his chance”
Um that happened.
We got 13 games of Glennon.
Last in offense.
Last in passing.
Last in 3rd down conversions.
Last in 1st downs.
Lowest yards per completion.
Worst 2nd half offensive production in over two decades.
This is the Mike Glennon body of work.
The fact that some misguided posters believe he is the Messiah, just futher illustrates how uneducated some Buc fans are.
And yes, if I worked for another NFL team- i’d sing his praises to the heavens!
That’s the QB I want to play against, when I play Tampa!
It’s a automatic W in the win column!
June 22nd, 2014 at 4:26 pm
Lorig had developed into an above average Fullback.
We struggled badly to run the ball, when he was out.
As a former TE, he showed unutilized skill as a Reciever.
Peyton will make sure we are aware of this, 2 times a year, for the foreseeable future
June 22nd, 2014 at 4:45 pm
Well said Davie Jones
June 22nd, 2014 at 5:28 pm
Is it me or does Payton look like Colonel Winters from Band of Brothers?
June 22nd, 2014 at 6:19 pm
@walkdaPlank
Not as much as Atlanta Falcons head coach Mike Smith looks like GrandPa Munster.
June 22nd, 2014 at 7:12 pm
Enough with the 32nd ranked offense please.
June 22nd, 2014 at 8:56 pm
Sean Peyton’s comments mean nothing right now. He is feeling the heat and see’s that he may have another legitimate contender in the bucs coming up in the NFC South. Lovie’s got him sweating. Now he and breed are competitors and that may make them play harder….but with the loss of sproles and graham a little unhappy at the moment I think coach Payton is in for a good fight for the NFC south Champion Title. DAMN I’M READY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
June 22nd, 2014 at 9:06 pm
Saints play mind games with the Bucs.
June 22nd, 2014 at 10:45 pm
STRETCHED
June 23rd, 2014 at 12:47 am
1st 4 games we lost 3 of those games by 6 points. The 1st game was won and David got the bad call for hitting the QB when he was about to step out of bounce. So it wasn’t like the offense or team for that matter was getting blown out so there was no way to pull the offense out of a huge whole.
June 23rd, 2014 at 2:59 am
Shock Top? Joe, I’d love to have a beer with you sometime, but I think I’ll do the ordering. Lorig? Yeah, SP knew what he was getting: a team first guy, special teams beast, and outstanding fullback. Any team who needs his skill set will love him as much as we did. Really bummed it was the Saints though.
June 23rd, 2014 at 3:04 am
Though, I suspect that Joe may be easing his way into the world of real beer. Those fake craft brews from Anheiser Busch, etc. are a gateway drug.
June 23rd, 2014 at 6:21 am
I’ve never been able to stand that cocky Sean Payton or his equally cocky QB, Drew Brees. The hit Clayborn put on the little punk was perfectly legal and if not called, the mighty Bucs might have won that game. Let’s see how well Payton can coach if Brees gets injured and they trot out Luuuuuuuke McCown to the chants of “Who Dat?” because it’s doubtful Saints fans know the name of their back-up QB. Payton is thumping his chest over signing a “fullback” who never runs the ball and rarely catches it? And then to give accolades to an offensive team ranked dead last and couldn’t do anything in second halves or convert a 3rd down. That and you told Rosanne’s husband his wife is cute. You might have a shot on Last Comic Standing Sean. You’re a funny guy.
June 23rd, 2014 at 2:24 pm
scubog You are a 100 % right . PAYTON knows nothing…
June 23rd, 2014 at 3:43 pm
Scubog, I hate to say it, but Drew Brees is a great guy and Sean Payton is a hell of a coach.
Now, back to hating both of them. LOL
June 23rd, 2014 at 4:52 pm
Our O-line flat out sucked last year. So did our defense as a whole. The team was just bad. Just got through watching Rams vs Bucs on NFL rewind and it was pathetic how many times the contain was lost on the edge and they just ran at will. Then Quinn was chasing Glennon around like he was invited through the O-line and escorted into the backfield before the friggin’ ball was snapped. When Glennon had time he was effective but you can see the total lack of weapons on our team last year. Defensively we just had horrible scheme. This year should be much better but for those who think McCown is better than Glennon….he’s more mobile but Glennon is more accurate. That’s going to become apparent once the season starts. Just my projection. I went back and looked at tape on McCown too and his receivers made him look better than he actually was. I believe he’ll be a great leader and positive influence on Glennon and the team as a whole but I certainly have reservations about his ability to pick up where he left off last year. I hope he can, we need him to be able to.