Johnny Football: A Modern Day Brett Favre
May 2nd, 2014
Former Bucs QB Jeff Carlson weighs in
Joe wants to crush a beer can whenever he hears someone compare Johnny Football to Tim Tebow. That’s like comparing Rachel Watson to Rosie O’Donnell.
Tebow flat out couldn’t throw the ball. He was a glorified wishbone quarterback. Johnny Football has better wheels than Tebow, and a much, much, much better arm.
Former Bucs quarterback Jeff Carlson, who runs “America’s Best Quarterback” academy, saw former Packers quarterback Brett Favre up close and personal when the Packers and Bucs were NFC Central foes. Carlson believes Johnny Football is the next Favre, and that’s both good and bad.
From a technical standpoint, [Johnny Football] throws the ball really well. He has the quickest release of all the [top] QB’s in the draft and has plenty of arm strength to be successful in the NFL. Manziel’s biggest problem is that much of what made him Johnny Football at Texas A&M is exactly what will make his NFL career an abbreviated one. Mike Holmgren recently said he is a lot like Brett Favre and I agree very much. Manziel’s “gunslinging” style makes for great watching, but for big mistakes as well.
I believe Manziel is a better, more pure thrower than Favre and will make less mistakes overall. It took Holmgren a long time to take some of Favre’s wild plays out of his game and to a Super Bowl victory. Favre continued to make great plays and some really bad ones as well, as his career continued on what seemed like forever. Unfortunately for Manziel, I think it is his overall style of play and lack of physical size (girth) that will give him a much shorter career than Favre, who played through much pain, but avoided the big injury that hit RGIII, the last phenom to hit the NFL.
I was wrong about Allen Iverson when he went into the NBA. He had a much longer and better career than I thought he would. But, I am not a basketball analyst and didn’t play in the NBA.
Here’s the thing: Favre was a stubborn good ol’ boy who wanted to play backyard football. Holmgren, his coach with the Packers, demanded Favre play in a very disciplined offense. It took years for Holmgren to sand off the rough edges of Favre because Favre was a knot-headed SOB with so much talent that Holmgren couldn’t bench him, which sort of reinforced Favre’s backyard ways.
Joe doesn’t get any sense whatsoever that Johnny Football will pull a Favre and basically tell his coaches, “F’ you, I’m just going to have fun.” He’s smarter than that.
Joe really believes Johnny Football will adjust. Willingly. That’s not to say he will be a Peyton Manning-like statue. That would be stupid. But he’ll pull back on the reigns and only use his feet when he needs to.
People like to bring up RGIII when it concerns Johnny Football. Joe places more blame on Mike Shanahan and his spawn of nepotism, son Kyle Shanahan, than RGIII. The guy was hobbled to begin with in the playoff game in 2012 against the Seahawks and Kyle Shanahan was calling quarterback options when RGIII was already hurt. That was moronic beyond words.
May 2nd, 2014 at 8:42 am
Will he send cheerleaders pictures of his junk also ??
May 2nd, 2014 at 8:50 am
Once johnny understands the pro game it will get fun. The thing with Manzel is he had a great o line and great revivers. It helps ask glennon who didn’t hAve those.
May 2nd, 2014 at 8:52 am
JF is exact the risk Lovie does not want to take on offense. Lovie craves turn overs on defense & therefore hates them from his offense. Would be very surprised if L & L go that way.
May 2nd, 2014 at 8:52 am
Joe for the love of God, why another JF article? We know who you are and what you want. Im actually starting to hope we dont get him just to crush your dreams cause your being such a tool with daily JF articles. You are bringing me to a new level of immaturity
May 2nd, 2014 at 8:54 am
In less than a week we can all visit Joe at Tampa General after the Baker Act has been invoked at a local pub. Hopefully, Joe will have a complete and speedy recovery!!!
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:03 am
Rehab and all?
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:17 am
Tebow did make the throw that won the playoff game in Denver over Pittsburgh.
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:19 am
Johnny! Johnny! Johnny! Johnny! Johnny!
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:21 am
Joe please find a picture where he is not making a sorority girl hand signal. I am trying to like him and that isnt helping his cause.
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:24 am
I don’t know how good he will be in the nfl for I am not a scout but it would be exciting to land him. If we don’t I think we still pick at 7 then trade back in round 2 to pick up more picks. 7 will land us a special player
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:28 am
the thing about johnny is you need a great and strong offensive coach to develop him. If you have that he could be like young in san fran or farve in green bay. If you don’t have and excellent offensive coach then you may have young in tampa and farve in atlanta. If farve stays in atlanta he retires after a few years, but in green bay guys like gruden , mooch, and holmgren built him. Idk if tedford can develop him and lovie does have experience on that side of the ball.
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:31 am
Read this on another site and thought it was interesting:
In a poll of 20 NFL personnel executives, eight predicted Texas A&M QB Johnny Manziel will be a “hit” in the pros, while the other 12 guessed “miss.”
NFL people have a hard time projecting Manziel with any confidence because there have been so few successful quarterbacks like him. At 5-foot-11 3/4, he’ll become just the eighth sub-6-foot QB drafted in the last 28 years.
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:01 am
I remember Southern Miss playing the Seminoles. On paper, a total mismatch. On the field as well.
I had never heard of Farve before that game. Afterwards, I hoped never to hear of him again.
Reminds me of JF and Alabama. And several other games. Geez, I recall his first half against the Gators in 2012 when he went off and could have won the game. ( settled for a couple of field goals between a TD and rocked a Florida for about 156 yards on the ground ). We were assured the Gators would adjust and shut down the freshman .
So I have reservations about JC but I cannot dismiss the Joe ‘s man rush. Have seen one like this before. And still have the scars to prove it .
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:11 am
Johny football = colt mccoy / colt brennon
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:11 am
Ha! 🙂
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:21 am
“It took years for Holmgren to sand off the rough edges of Favre because Favre was a knot-headed SOB with so much talent that Holmgren couldn’t bench him, which sort of reinforced Favre’s backyard ways.” – Joe
Exactly. Holmgren, during games, actually gave the order to bench Favre many times because he was so frustrated with him. But he always changed his mind before the command was followed.
He believed in Favre to that degree. It just took a LOT of growing pains.
It could be argued that if Holmgren had pulled Favre out of just one game, it would have humbled him enough to correct the issues sooner. That would not work these days, but it might have back then.
As to Johnny Football, I’ve been saying for months that he is very Brett Favre-like. That isn’t saying he will have the same level of success, its only saying there are many similarities. He may prove out to be as successful as Favre…or he may be the next Ryan Leaf.
Such is the gamble for every single pick in the draft…boom or bust. When you get down to where the rubber meets the rode. Watson might be the next Moss, or the next Dexter Jackson. All of the picks run that risk. There are NO sure-fire hits, no matter how much people claim otherwise. Just as there are no sure-fire busts.
@gatrbuc17
News flash genius. Creating a new user name just to complain does no good. Joe can see your IP Address. You cannot hide your identity from him.
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:22 am
Manziel had 13 ints most in SEC with the best o line and wr on SEC. Thats not lovie ball
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:23 am
On the topic of quarterback, I’m all for drafting any of these in order of preference:
Derek Carr
Johnny Manziel
Jake Bortles
I’ve said my reasons for each already.
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:30 am
Mathius Says
“Manziel had 13 ints most in SEC with the best o line and wr on SEC. That’s not Lovie ball.”
Actually, a QB like Manziel will require a lot of patience and a good turnover defense…that is exactly what Tampa offers.
Lovie is building a defense that will focus on turnovers to get the ball back if the QB throws a pick or if the offense goes 3 and out.
Lovie is one of the most patient coaches this side of Tony Dungy.
Wake up Tampa. The reasons we never had a true franchise QB are we never take the risk for a blockbuster one, and we never have the patience to allow one to grow and flourish. Manziel might throw 25 picks his first year. He might throw 20 his second year. We would have to accept that in advance, because he WILL get better.
Carr, on the other hand, is more of a brainer. He’ll get better from year to year, and will take instant command of the offense. His OC will grow to trust him to call his own plays, using hand signals.
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:35 am
Although I prefer Carr far and away above Joe’s JFF I wouldn’t throw a fit if the Bucs drafted Manziel. If he puts football #1 with whatever is #2 far below in importance, if he stays conservative in the frequency of his nights out in Tampa, if he humbles himself and accepts all the coaching the Bucs’ staff gives him, and if he learns how to play in the pocket 90% of the time and be very selective in his runs, I think he could be successful here.
But tell us honestly, Joe…what are the chances of all the points listed above actually coming to pass? I’m not holding my breath waiting for it to happen. That’s for damn sure.
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:39 am
Manziel has way better wheels than Favre. If Manziel plays smart and uses his ability to elude the pass rush he will be a smash success in the NFL. Manziel biggest adjustment will need to be able to throw the ball away when there is nothing.
Scouting quarterbacks in the NFL has become a joke. The same scouts thought Wilson was not worthy of a first round pick, Brees is too small, Kaepernick etc…
The prototypical pocket QB is a farce. The 2 best pocket QB’s P. Manning & Brady both lost the perspective “big” games this year partly because they cannot extend plays with there legs. EVER!
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:40 am
Farve was a 2nd rounder
Willson a third rounder
Why is manziel considered 1st?
Hype machine
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:47 am
I don’t see Brett Favre when I look at him. I see Jeff Garcia. Overactive feet in the pocket. Running around like a fiddler crab . Might win some games but will fall apart against playoff caliber defenses. They can both “pull.”
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:54 am
I don’t understand the idea that Tebow couldn’t throw….in college. I don’t think the Tebow and JF comparisons are outlandish. You can compare throwing motions and JF’s is much cleaner but they both were great college players with questionable pro skills. Joe says that Tebow flat out couldn’t throw but in college he threw the ball around the yard and ran like a beast as well.
Tebow as a sophomore (non NC year) threw at 66.9% for 3286 yards and 32 TD’s with 6 ints. JF as a red shirt sophomore 69.9% 4114 with 37 TD and 13 ints. JF had 79 more attempts than Tebow. JF averaged 9.6 per attempt while Tebow averaged 9.4. Is that not being able to throw? That same year rushing Tebow rushed for 895 yards and 23 TDs while JF ran for 759 yards and 9 TDs.
I also think the Tebow’s Sophomore year compares best to JF’s red shirt sophomore year because this was really the one year in Tebow’s time that the gator’s didn’t have a smothering defense and Tebow was asked to do much more as JF was asked to do as the Aggies defense hasn’t been good in his time.
I am not just looking at stats either, I am a Gator fan and watched every game. Tebow could make every throw but that’s in part because the windows are that much bigger in college. Throws that were TDs in college are ints in the NFL and Tebow learned that the hard way…right out of the league. I watched most A&M games and JF was as exciting as Tebow was in college and I saw numerous throws that he made that were TDs that would be ints in the NFL.
JF may be faster than Tebow but Tebow was a battering ram. You could say Tebow’s stats dropped after that but he wasn’t asked to carry the team cause the gator’s defense almost always had and held the lead. No need to throw the ball around the yard like he had to do as a sophomore.
This is not a Tebow love post lol, I don’t blame any team for not taking a flier on Tebow as he isn’t a good NFL QB and his crazy following makes him not worth the risk. Johnny is no doubt the better passer of the two but to say Tebow couldn’t throw, in college, is crazy. Obviously Tebow has NFL tape that says he can’t throw but JF hasn’t had the chance to make that tape yet so I’m just comparing college.
Again, both players were awesome college players with questionable NFL skills. The comparison is not that far fetched.
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:54 am
Uh oh, you’re going to get all the Glennon fans in a tizzy with that one.
May 2nd, 2014 at 10:58 am
Espo Says
“I don’t see Brett Favre when I look at him. I see Jeff Garcia…”
I liked Garcia when he was here. In fact, I think that if Gruden had him at an earlier age, he likely would have won more SBs.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:09 am
Tebow through a ton of bubble screens to Harvin who then made tons of YAC. No umbrage to Tebow, that was just a big part of the Mullen offense.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:11 am
Bucfan#37 Says:
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:17 am
Tebow did make the throw that won the playoff game in Denver over Pittsburgh.
____________________________________________________________
Pretty sure if he didn’t make that throw, he’d be confirmed as the worst QB ever. So difficult to throw over 9 (!!!!) guys in the box, which was Pittsburgh’s moronic strategy all game.
As to what gatrbuc17 said, well yeah that’s why all of us who don’t want to draft Manziel want to see the dream scenario: He’s on the board at 7, and the Bucs pass. And then of course Joe asks Lovie and Licht if this was because they didn’t get laid in college.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:12 am
#37- Still holding on to that ONE throw, eh?!
I wonder how many people would still take Winston over Manziel(and yes, I realize it’s different draft classes) given the recent “off the field problems”. I still see people pointing to Manziel’s “issues”. What issues? Signing memorabilia? Drinking and chasing girls?
Not looking so terrible now, is he? Not when compared to the great Jameis!
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:17 am
I’d take Winston all day of Manziel. Then again, my concerns about Manziel have everything to do with football and how he can play in the NFL.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:20 am
ODB, Harvin had 59 catches for 858 yards and missed two games. I also often saw Tebow hit Harvin down the side lines and up the middle. If bubble screens is the case is it far to say that JF threw a bunch of jump balls to Mike Evans for 69 catches and 1394 yards? I often saw JF throw balls up for grabs to Evans. JF dinked and dunked also. It’s all a part of the game. For every bubble screen tebow had, JF had a jump ball that his big receiver when up and got…it’s all a part of the game.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:25 am
@Crush,
Whoah, I hope you don’t think I’m rooting for Manziel. That is not the case. Sorry if I implied otherwise. Both were great college QBs. Both were great improvisors. I just think improvising in the NFL is not the greatest attribute that OCs want (primarily). They want you to follow through on the play they chose, not sandlot it.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:32 am
Drinking isn’t a problem…. According to chemistry – Alcohol is a solution.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:41 am
RGIII part 2.
May 2nd, 2014 at 11:48 am
ODB, I didn’t think you were implying to be a Manziel fan lol. I agree that although improvising can be good at times, that being your main attribute is not a good quality. I just wanted to provide a rebuttal to show that although Tebow had bubble screens, Johnny Football had jump balls so the stats can still be compared.
May 2nd, 2014 at 12:16 pm
Insulting Joe is not acceptable. –Joe
May 2nd, 2014 at 12:44 pm
Good Lord, Joe is biased. All we read about is freaking Johnny Football. There are other players in this years’ draft, you know.
Wake up. Scroll down. There’s all kinds of stuff here. Don’t make up stuff about Joe and Johnny. –Joe
May 2nd, 2014 at 12:49 pm
There’s only one Johnny!
May 2nd, 2014 at 12:51 pm
Look at all the comment totals for non-Johnny articles. Then look at the comment totals for the Johnny articles.
Anyone still wondering why Joe is powering these articles out daily?
May 2nd, 2014 at 1:13 pm
I think Johnny may be willing to change his style but will he be able to? He’s been playing that way all his life. It’s pure instinct and built info his DNA.
May 2nd, 2014 at 1:28 pm
@ODB- I’m glad that you recognized that the comparison was simply based on his off the field issues. I too think that Winston has a better overall skill set. His character issues are concerning though.
I think what Rick Stroud said sums up JF; “He’s going to drive a team crazy.” I agree. Same as Favre, the game this guy plays is high-risk, high-reward. If the Bucs do draft him, I hope he gets the coaching he needs.
One thing is for sure with this guy; he is fun to watch!
May 2nd, 2014 at 1:34 pm
Kaepernick ran the pistol at Nevada. Johnny will run the sex pistol in Tampa. He will be developed for a year. Lots of practice reps, progressions reading, watching Russell Wilson tape etc. Buc starter in 2015!!
May 2nd, 2014 at 1:38 pm
“There’s only one Johnny!”
Yah Joe and his last name was Unitas. The Golden Arm
Let Joe have his fun, he only has 6 more days left. Unless the Bucs draft Manziel, then you better get used to it and real fast. I hate PB&J’s.
May 2nd, 2014 at 1:59 pm
Manziel = Lovie’s job and possibly NFL career if he is a bust. If you were him and had 2 possibly 3 years to field a playoff team or get fired (again) would you seriously put that kind of faith in a young man who has do many concerns?
May 2nd, 2014 at 2:14 pm
Joe –
It’s your blog and you can write about or feature any player you want. I appreciate what you do for all of us. However, I contiue to be dumbfounded by the double standard that you apply to your ManZ Crush. You refer to Josh Freeman as “sleepy” and Rip Van Freeman (and justifiably so based on him missing the team photo) yet you seem to ignore the fact that your ManZ Crush set the bar on oversleeping. I’m specifically referring to the Manning Passing Camp when there were multiple witnesses who saw him out on Bourbon Street at 4 AM! Real mature. Yet instead of calling your ManZ Crush sleepy, you compare him to Joe Naimith! How do u not see this hypocrisy?
II don’t know if JF will be a great QB in the NFL or not. What I do know is that if he is drafted by the Bucs he will be on South Howard partying it up 6 days a week instead of preparing himself for the upcoming game.
First off, good luck finding anyone at Texas A&M accusing Johnny Football of letting his teammates down. The comparison to Freeman is silly.–Joe
May 2nd, 2014 at 2:18 pm
@Toes- You’ve got a good point. However, at some point, they’re going to have to take a risk.
We’ll see. Next Thursday can’t come fast enough, right?!
May 2nd, 2014 at 3:05 pm
Matt B:
Feel free to provide documentation when Johnny blew off his own football camp, blew off a team photo, blew off a team breakfast the morning of the season opener and was late to the team bus going to the stadium; all documented Freeman f’ ups. Then, Freeman had his captaincy stripped of him by his own teammates! And all of this happened in just in a span of two or three months.
Joe has personally spoken to three of Johnny’s teammates; face-to-face. Asked them each about Johnny. Each one raved about the guy.
If you can find any quotes of Johnny’s former coaches at Texas A&M ragging on him, Joe would love to see it. They have nothing to lose by being honest if he was so detestable. Johnny’s gone.
Freeman is about as opposite of Johnny as you can get.
May 2nd, 2014 at 3:10 pm
Point taken Joe but he DID let down the campers and Archie Manning. Did any other QB not show up that morning? I’m saying JF is immature whereas you seem to think his social reputation is charming. If he thinks he can just show up to practice and games and kick butt in the NFL, he’s got another thing coming. There is a risk that he WILL let down his NFL teammates if he comes to a game unprepared because he partied it up so much during the week. Am I the only one who questions his character after the Manning incident and also because of his general reputation? Heck no. And, like Freeman, the “sleepy” moniker still fits even if it wasn’t his teammates who were let down.
May 2nd, 2014 at 3:50 pm
Just one more thing – I’d like to take back the comment that JF “set the bar on oversleeping.” Joe, you’ve proven that Freeman’s oversleeping was a lot more egregious. I stand by the rest of what I said.
I still love JoeBucsFan.com and appreciate all you guys do.
May 2nd, 2014 at 8:36 pm
I would love to see Johnny Football playing for us in Tampa, but highly doubt he will still be there at pick number 7.
Clowney only had 3 sacks all last year, 3 freaking sacks! This means he can be taken out of games, and you want a number one pick to be a game changer.
There are big billboards all over Houston to draft the Texas boy, Johnny Manziel.
I see no way Manziel is there when we pick, but if he is, I think we have to take him.
He will pack Tampa stadium, and re energize the fan base in our town.
May 2nd, 2014 at 8:45 pm
3 Things that could happen to end this site-
1. Bucs don’t draft JF at 7 when available.
2. R.W. has junk.
3. Prohibition starts again.
May 2nd, 2014 at 9:43 pm
Rantings of a lunatic joe! Glennon Will be a super bowl QB try not to be bitter when it happens!!!
Go BUCS!
May 3rd, 2014 at 7:13 pm
Just like Favre…but about 4 inches shorter…maybe more like a cross between Brett Favre and Doug Flutie.
May 5th, 2014 at 4:01 am
LOLOLOLOLOL
All i gotta say
May 6th, 2014 at 2:28 pm
Considering all we know about Johnathon Manziel is his college stats… Tebow was better passer in all 4 years. So college success doesn’t translate to NFL success.
Tebow > college passer, much more powerful runner and far more durable.
May 6th, 2014 at 2:35 pm
Oh and more exciting because, you know, National Championships and SEC championships.
Biggest Winner in college football couldn’t hack it in the NFL. Which is why people are so confused why people crown a college player who has proven nothing on the big stage.