Josh Freeman Not A Leader?
April 8th, 2014
Much was made last year when leaky, sleepy Rip Van Freeman was not retained as a captain of the Bucs. It is highly rare when an established starting quarterback is not a captain of an NFL team.
Of course, someone (Freeman’s camp?) threw out the notion that the vote on team captains was rigged by then-Bucs commander Greg Schiano. Joe will not discuss the exact conversation Joe had privately last year with Schiano, but trust Joe when he types that Schiano was completely outraged by the suggestion that he loaded the ballot box to have Freeman dethroned.
Well, here is some evidence that points to Schiano’s innocence. Today, select Bucs players are being made available for interviews and the second player was Bucs kicker Connor Barth. When asked about what is different this season with the new coaching staff and over a dozen new players (so far), Barth said “I can already tell there is a different demeanor in here.”
Joe then asked a follow-up about what was different about the demeanor and Barth responded with the following quote:
“You can just tell,” Barth said. “Having a veteran guy in like Josh [McCown], he brings more of a leadership role. You can just tell the difference in that perspective because you want your quarterback to be a leader. It’s great seeing the guys come together. It’s just different around here.”
Imagine that, a quarterback being a leader; your starting quarterback being a leader. How about that?
Yes, Schiano caught all kinds of hell from fans, and some of it was justified, just look at his record. But it sure smells like Freeman was all but forced on Schiano and it got to a point where Schiano just could not tolerate the monkey business any longer.
And people wonder why Rip Van Freeman is still unemployed?
As far as Barth’s health, he said he is just fine and hopes to have an even stronger leg than he had before his torn Achilles suffered at a charity basketball game prior to last season.
Barth said he is already kicking 60-yard field goals back at home.
April 8th, 2014 at 12:53 pm
Got your kickers crossed Joe
April 8th, 2014 at 12:53 pm
I think you mean Barth???
April 8th, 2014 at 12:54 pm
Okay Joe, who did you talk to, Koenen or Barth? Koenen wasn’t injured, Barth was.
April 8th, 2014 at 12:54 pm
Joe says:
As far as Koenen’s health, he said he is just fine and hopes to have an even stronger leg than he had before his torn Achilles suffered at a charity basketball game prior to last season.
^ Wasn’t it Barth with the bball/achilles? Koenan played last year.
April 8th, 2014 at 12:55 pm
Schiano knows talent, and that’s why he didn’t like to see Freeman waste so much of it.
April 8th, 2014 at 12:55 pm
Coach Schiano, could never win with roster he was handcuffed with. That is why Lovie demanded the “rockstar ” gets fired before he took the job. Now he has sent most of that garbage roster packing!
April 8th, 2014 at 12:55 pm
Figured it out, highlighted quoted text was Barth, then somewhere near the end you switched your two kickers…. which BTW, Koenen WAS the long range FG kicker for the Falcons when he was there. Hopefully, Barth’s leg is strong enough that he can kick off and we can clear out another $3 mil in salary cap space by dumping Koenen.
April 8th, 2014 at 12:55 pm
Hopefully he can learn kickoffs or take a pay cut.
April 8th, 2014 at 12:56 pm
Too many too early joe? Who did you talk to Barth or Koenon?
April 8th, 2014 at 12:59 pm
Correction above – Barth, not Koenen.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:00 pm
Who cares about the got dang kickers… its a freakin kicker.
The point of the story is Josh Freeman is a non leader… aka a loser.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:02 pm
Connor, Koenen, honest mistake especially when speed-typing. I think we are all very aware of who had the Achilles injury…
April 8th, 2014 at 1:02 pm
Too Many MW/Cave Man Gang parties and mattress.
It’s having adverse effects on your stories.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:09 pm
Got Barth and Koenen mixed up Joe, but good article
April 8th, 2014 at 1:12 pm
He led them to the club!
Just shows that you can have all the physical talent in the world, but, if your head and your heart aren’t there, you won’t go far as a QB in the NFL.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:17 pm
Geez, if only someone like Boomer Esiason had told us Freeman lacked the leadership qualities two years ago! Even if he had told us, he would have been dismissed as just waging a baseless smear campaign.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:21 pm
Joe, don’t just take it on Freeman. Mike Glennon was the hand picked QB and “Leader” by Greg Shiano. I just won’t say Freeman was the consummate mature leader, but Shiano set the wrong enviroment in that locker room.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:22 pm
Kelvin:
Have to remember, Barth wasn’t on the team when Glennon was the quarterback. He was hurt. Barth’s only frame of reference to a Bucs quarterback was Freeman.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:25 pm
@lightning
“Joe’s had enough of the Freeman smearing. Esiason should be ashamed.”
April 8th, 2014 at 1:25 pm
Nothing will ever top the lowlight reel.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000267791/Week-7-Josh-Freeman-highlights
Why would anyone sign him as a backup? Clearly he doens’t come in and learn the system.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:28 pm
That video is hysterical, it’s just over and over; over thrown, under thrown, intercepted….
Shiano got the shaft. really stinks for him, we’ve clearly upgraded but Team Glazer didn’t do him right.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:29 pm
Josh Freeman is no longer the Bucs starting QB and Schiano is not the HC; Schi accepted the HC job and the mandate that came with it. Just as JF5 was shown the door by the HC and the former rockstar after a performance based decision, so too was Schi and rockstar shown the door after the Glazers made a performance based decision. It’s time to move on from JF5 and possibly move on to JF2.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:29 pm
ODB,
Oh, I’m well aware of how the Joe(s) smeared Esiason. And nary an apology or admitting that Boomer was right since.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:30 pm
Back ups are expected to be accurate… well actually, any NFL QB is expected to be accurate. Otherwise, they will be off the roster.
Free only hung around because he was a 1st rnd draft pick and Dom’s and Raheem’s first pick.
Imagine Dom going to the Glazers requesting to sign Jay Fro to an extension this time last year???
April 8th, 2014 at 1:31 pm
Meh, this kind of stuff was pretty obvious to those reasonable fans that were able to connect the dots. Unfortunately some media outlets refused to acknowledge the elephant in the room. Or even worse, they knew the problem but were so hell bent on getting Schiano out of town that they were willing to help Freeman with his dirty work. They as much as anyone contributed to Freeman’s flameout.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:32 pm
Actually, it is not time to move on.
A very big reason why Lovie Smith is here and why the team is gutting the roster is, in part, whatever happened with Josh Freeman and Greg Schiano. It is irresponsible to just wave a hand and say, “Oh, that’s in the past.” It is not. The very recent past is directly influencing the present.
If Freeman had repeated his 2012 season last year, and the Bucs were .500 or over, it’s very likely Lovie Smith would not be here.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:34 pm
Mr. Duemig should realize that just because someone does something ONCE it is NOT indicative of a trend. It is more indicative of luck. Here are some other illustrious members of the 4k passing club: John Kitna, Elvis Grbac, Scott Mitchell, Don Majkowski. Enough said…
April 8th, 2014 at 1:37 pm
The host of the sports talk show should realize that just because someone does something ONCE it is NOT indicative of a trend. It is more indicative of luck. Here are some other illustrious members of the 4k passing club: John Kitna, Elvis Grbac, Scott Mitchell, Don Majkowski. Enough said…
April 8th, 2014 at 1:46 pm
Joe, I agree to a point. BUT, IF Lovante hadn’t pushed and IF Conner hadn’t gotten injured and we missed a couple of crucial field goals and IF Doug hadn’t gotten hurt and If Nicks hadn’t gotten MRSA
we may have been a .500 club and no one would have been fired. SO WHAAT!? We still would have had the Rockstar with his great drafting abilities and Dennis Hickey with his great scouting and of course our great coach and probably two or three more Rutgers players. I am glad the vGlazers had the guts to pull the plug. While I have been not as optimistic as others about this year, the future bodes well for the BUCS!
April 8th, 2014 at 1:50 pm
SchlomieNudnikStein …ya see you should know that Joe filters out his buddy’s name by now.lol
April 8th, 2014 at 1:56 pm
Frees trying out with the Bears. I hope he gets a backup job. He could turn himself around, he’s still young.
April 8th, 2014 at 1:58 pm
3600 yards 22 td 5 Int the year before and 3500 yards the year before that, on pretty bad teams too. You can hate the guy all you want but before he wasn’t shopped around by a coach that didn’t want him he wasn’t the problem. Stop trying to rewrite history.
April 8th, 2014 at 2:04 pm
He must have a big yard…
April 8th, 2014 at 2:11 pm
It’s about the here and now. Remember there is a certain talk show host that always quotes Bill Parcells; “You are what your record says.” What was Freeman’s win-loss record btw? Keep in mind, you need to be the catalyst to make your team good even when it is bad. Freeman is void of that ability.
April 8th, 2014 at 2:28 pm
Boomer was right. The flip side of that is obvious to everyone who reads JBF. Joe should stand up and do the right thing. Retraction, correction, apology.
April 8th, 2014 at 2:35 pm
Josh”Bust In Waiting” Freeman. Never been more true words spoken on this site. Haha
April 8th, 2014 at 2:49 pm
How was Boomer right? If he wrote ” In two years the Bucs will hire a under qualified coach who will shop him during the off season he and Freeman will become pissed and handle it poorly” then he would have been correct. At the time Freeman was a team leader and didn’t have any troubles until a new coach came in and wanted to bring in his own guy. It’s the new coaches right but to act like Boomer was right all along is just not the case, sorry.
April 8th, 2014 at 3:00 pm
stanglassman – you’re the one rewriting history, quite convenient of you to leave out the fact that Josh Freeman couldn’t make it to practice, meetings, games, or even a stupid kid’s camp on time.
April 8th, 2014 at 3:30 pm
What about him being late to meetings, etc. in Minny? That wasn’t his fault either, right?
‘According to Pelissero, four people “with knowledge of the situation” said that Freeman was late for multiple meetings and one player said that Freeman was often among the last players to team facilities.’
It’s always someone else’s fault.
Let’s see how the rest of his career goes. Probably someone else’s fault too, right?
April 8th, 2014 at 3:55 pm
Man. I really had high hopes for JF5.
April 8th, 2014 at 4:23 pm
@Bucs_Sam;
Thanks for the video. A good reminder of when “bad Josh” would show up on a Bucs Sunday afternoon and ruin the day.
April 8th, 2014 at 4:27 pm
Esiason was partially right…. in regards to meetings and work ethic. Although he wasn’t fully informed as to the cause of some of Freeman’s issues. Nowhere did Esiason mention ADHD or that Freeman was taking Adderall (or Ritalin, mistakenly?) as a possible reason Freeman was struggling with meetings or film sessions. So, I wouldn’t anoint Esiason as some sort of psychic seeing the future, but probably just a reporter of a story that was half right (the other half was JF5’s side regarding ADHD)
Not that this excuses JF5 in any way. That would be like excusing the carpenter for cutting his own fingers off because he was an alcoholic or the bus driver for killing his passengers because he has narcolepsy. Either figure it out or find another career. If JF5 figures it out, he can be a good QB in the NFL. If he can’t, he’ll be out of the NFL sooner rather than later. Who knows, maybe he doesn’t really care if he’s out of the NFL, maybe he doesn’t have the desire to play in the NFL anymore.
As for Schiano, I will still put it on his shoulders for leadership failures last year. He let it be known multiple times that Josh wasn’t his guy, so how does anyone expect him to come in and “be the leader” when the coach is saying he isn’t the guy. He said it before the draft, then he drafted Glennon (the guy he really wanted at Rutgers out of high school), then he only allowed Freeman 26 pass attempts in the entire preseason (not exactly a vote of confidence from the coach or fuel to build his “leadership” with the team). Schiano made it clear Freeman wasn’t his leader and he’s the coach. What was Connor Barth supposed to think? Of course there was no leadership because the Coach didn’t allow it from the guy they had at the time.
April 8th, 2014 at 4:47 pm
Bam Bam did you see the horrible 3 weeks of Freeman last season? I don’t blame Schiano one bit for pulling him. While not official (yet) it certainly seems like Freeman responded to adversity like a spoiled toddler.
Freeman will most likely flame out of the NFL and Schiano will probably return to have a successful second stint coaching/coordinating in the NFL after his son graduates next year. Putting it on record now
April 8th, 2014 at 4:53 pm
No one truly knows if Freeman has ADHD or is using ritalin. That was his explanation. He might be honest, or he might be taking advice from his agent.
Since the collective bargaining agreement doesn’t allow them to identify why a player is in the program, I take every player’s excuse (ritalin, over the counter supplement, etc) with a grain of salt.
April 8th, 2014 at 5:43 pm
ADHD is an” ailment” created by drug companies to sell product. Plain and simple. There is no concrete evidence that one who feels a sense of impulsiveness or distraction has ADHD. Furthermore, the “condition” has now evolved into an excuse for one’s inability to adequately execute tasks in life.
April 8th, 2014 at 5:52 pm
Nothing will ever top the lowlight reel.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000267791/Week-7-Josh-Freeman-highlights
Why would anyone sign him as a backup? Clearly he doens’t come in and learn the system.
————————————————————-
lol, Josh hadn’t played since week three, and it was a completely new system (his fourth system in like five years). Gruden even said Freeman wasnt ready and to pull him at 10-7 during the second quarter. Some of those “lowlights” were overthrows, but there were some where the receivers should of caught the pass (we saw that here in Tampa), and pressure in Josh’s face. The Giants are known for getting pressure on the qb.
April 8th, 2014 at 5:55 pm
As far as Barth….he’s a kicker that was on IR last year so how involved with the team was Connor? Even when healthy, they’re not in the same meetings, and don’t practice drills with the first team units besides special teams which Freeman wasn’t involved in. Plus Joe is assuming he’s referring to Freeman, when he could of been talking about Glennon.
I think some of it’s misperception with Freeman, and it’s possible he’s being black balled (pardon the pun).
April 8th, 2014 at 6:58 pm
4000 yards in the nfl today Is nothing .average at best. not impressed.
April 8th, 2014 at 7:55 pm
ToesOnTheLine – Yes, I saw those horrible 3 games to start the year last year after throwing a whopping 26 passes in the preseason. Seems like he had tons of opportunity to get in sync with those WRs in preseason with all those passes (compared to 70 attempts by Glennon who actually had 170 snaps in preseason). In an offense where the WRs run option routes and the QB & WR must be on the same page, it sure seems like they set him up to fail far in advance of those 3 games. Even then, we lost on a last second FG set up by a bogus late hit out of bounds call against LVD, another a last second FG immediately after the great Lindell missed a 47 yd FG. And the Pats game that we got blown out the passing yardage was good for 3rd most in a game last season for the Bucs (Glennon had 257 & 249 as the best, then Glennon and Freeman both had 226 for 3rd. Altogether pitiful numbers for a QB by both of them).
A staff that didn’t sabotage one QB for a “favored” one might have changed the start of the season. Add in a bad penalty and a hurt kicker and we start pretty bad. Yet if we were 2-1 instead of 0-3, Glennon never gets the start, the Freeman fiasco never happens, and we may have been a 6-10 to 8-8 team, Schiano keeps his job for another year. But talking down your QB that had nearly 4000 yards and 27 TDs the previous year before the draft, drafting a guy you’ve had a crush on since high school, and minimizing any chance of a rhythm or sync with WRs in preaseason are all signs Schiano threw Freeman under the bus long before those 3 games. Freeman wasn’t good, but Schiano made it that way.
April 8th, 2014 at 8:18 pm
bucray1 – Average? Is that why only 5-11 QBs per year since 2006 have gone over 4000 yards? Out of 32 teams? Average? Seems like only the top 1/3, and the QBs in the bottom 1/3 more than drop the average well below 4000 per season, much less the middle 1/3 dropping that below 4000. The league average has never gone over 3769.6 passing yards per team in a season (last year). So, a QB throwing for 4065 yards is not trivial, that’s well above “average”. Just because all BSPN and other networks ever talk about is the future HOF QBs and the occasional surprise QB of the year doesn’t mean 4000 is an easy feat, it just means those 4 or 5 guys do it repeatedly plus a couple of extras.
April 9th, 2014 at 12:15 am
JOE take down the picture of Freeman in our Bucs uni. If you must display your favorite Quarterback besides your man crush Johnny Pot Football, at least put him in his own colors(Purple).
April 9th, 2014 at 12:54 am
wilber42 …I for one who used to be one of the biggest Freeman supporters there is…one of the 1000’s I might add agree with you, but since Freeman played the majority of his career with the Bucs, maybe that’s why Joe puts up pics of Freeman in a Bucs uniform.
Like I said I don’t like it either. It is what is though. I don’t even like Joe posting articles about him. I’d like to forget about him if possible. For Joe on the other hand it seems impossible.
For the rest of you. Freeman STILL remains an enigma to me. That’s what I called him looooong before Jaworski uttered that word about Freeman.
It’s almost like he knows he has the skills and the potential, but doesn’t care anymore and is only in it for the money.
April 9th, 2014 at 12:57 am
Joe as for you. I hope that some day on JBF the word Freeman is filtered like Dooomig, Br-ady and Br-ad Johnson are.
Exactly why are those names filtered anyways? It always seemed a bit communist to me as I’m sure others as well.
April 9th, 2014 at 1:15 am
SchlomieNudnikStein Says
“ADHD is an” ailment” created by drug companies to sell product. Plain and simple. There is no concrete evidence that one who feels a sense of impulsiveness or distraction has ADHD. Furthermore, the “condition” has now evolved into an excuse for one’s inability to adequately execute tasks in life.”
Sorry, kid, but you are wrong. I have a son who had ADHD. We chose alternative treatment instead of drugs. This incuded homeschooling him myself until 7th grade, and then using special methods in school that helped him overcome it.
Refusing to drug him was the best thing we could have done because he learned to overcome ADHD and is now considered very advanced. ADHD is real.
The drugs are just a means to keep kids under control for the teachers to exert minimal effort. My kid has always been well mannered and well behaved as well.
April 9th, 2014 at 1:27 am
On topic, Josh Freeman had zero issues until his last year with the Bucs. I don’t think he liked Greg Schiano, and told his agent so, then his agent probably said, ”Here’s how you get out of Tampa. You’ve got interest, so we’ll land you on a better team.”
Remember, at the time Freeman was widely viewed as an up and comer.
It al just backfired on Freeman and his agent. A good agent would have told Josh to play out his contract and look good doing it, then refuse to resign.
I agree with BamBam. Several things, like that first game, were due to a lack of reps in the preseason.
I NEVER felt Glennon was the one Schiano wanted to replace Freeman with though. I think he was denied picking a QB in his first year, and then the Bucs didn’t have a first rounder in his second year, so Schiano had to settle for Mike Glennon.
You do not draft a 3rd rounder at QB with the intent of starting him. Usually, a 3rd round QB has to impress enough to earn it. And Mike Glennon did not. He was handed the role by default.
April 9th, 2014 at 1:32 am
BuccaneerBonzai ..in my experience you are correct sir. Although I have a daughter with autism, it has been said by many people and family members of mine that I might mild ADHD. Sometimes if I take a step back and look at how I perceive things and focus on things I start to believe them. I’ve never been diagnosed though, but some of my family members are convinced of it. Oh well I’m 43 yrs old. No one knew what the hell ADHD was in the 70’s when I was born. Hell autism was 1 and 5,000 or so births in the 70’s now it’s 1 in 85 or so.
Please note that I’ve never mentioned to anyone on JBF about my daughter before, in fear of someone saying that the apple does not fall from the tree as if I’m clueless and it’s not Buc related as well. Nor to I look for sympathy from it, in fact I loathe sympathy because of it.
April 9th, 2014 at 10:32 am
he proved everything he needed to prove last year. you can make excuses for every bit of what happened, but the common factor in josh’s decisions last year is they were all about himself and they were all about his immediate gratification. mark sanchez, in my mind a less talented QB, has a job today because he handled much worse (years of ridicule in NY Media, having his season ended playing behind 4th stringers, the geno smith pick) and was a solid team player & mentor to his replacement in the face of it. he proved he won’t be a distraction if he doesn’t get the playing time he hoped for. sanchez doesn’t have the best mental makeup on the planet by a longshot, but if freeman were even at sanchez’ level of maturity & professionalism he might have signed a long term deal for over $8-10 million a year here in tampa and possibly outlasted greg schiano.
April 9th, 2014 at 12:55 pm
note to next Qb do the poodles golf tournament and you will get wall to wall excuses made for you…anybody notice this? you think Vinnie Uhhh uhhh Lecavier was gretzky the way the poodle to this day still defends that mediocre player….
April 9th, 2014 at 10:54 pm
Did moron Joe ever stop to think that Conner Koenen may have been referring to Glennon…?