Defensive-Minded Coach Overseeing Defensive Collapse
December 2nd, 2023
Problems in the secondary.
Once upon a time, Todd Bowles was not just an NFL safety, but a starting safety on a Super Bowl winner with Washington.
But as a head coach in two different stops, he has seen his defense progressively grow worse during his tenures in New York and now in Tampa.
Follicly-challenged Billy Barnwell of BSPN summarized how the Bucs defense has become a train wreck if it cannot put the quarterback on the ground.
And — surprise! — the Bucs can’t put the quarterback on the ground often enough.
Cornerbacks Carlton Davis and Jamel Dean are on significant deals, linebacker Lavonte David was brought back for yet another season and linebacker Devin White is playing out an $11.7 million fifth-year option. Safety Antoine Winfield is still around in the final year of his rookie deal, so on paper, this looked like it would be a strength for Todd Bowles & Co.
Instead, teams have been able to throw on the Bucs. They rank 10th in QBR allowed when they get pressure on the opposing quarterback, but when the pass rush doesn’t get home, they are 29th. Only the Bengals, who underwent an offseason rebuild in the secondary and lost multiple starters, are allowing more yards per attempt when they don’t create pressure. Rookies Calijah Kancey and Yaya Diaby have flashed up front — and Vita Vea is still an excellent player — but opposing quarterbacks have been able to beat Tampa Bay’s pass defenders. Those two starting cornerbacks have each missed a couple of games, but Davis notably allowed three touchdowns in the loss to the Texans.
Well, Joe knows Team Glazer, when mulling a decision to bring back a coach or not, used to like to say they study “arrow pointing up” or “arrow pointing down.”
What Bucs arrow is pointing up right now? Other than more losses are expected than wins this year?
When a defensive-minded coach has his defense collapse, that’s a terrible sign. Also a bad look is Bowles likely wanted Carlton Davis and Jamel Dean back, otherswise hey wouldn’t be on the roster.
Davis and Dean have regressed (though Davis played good ball last week in Indianapolis). Is that because of how Bowles is using them (likely) or because their skills have eroded so quickly (unlikely)?
If the secondary doesn’t improve quickly, it’s not going to look good for an old safety.
December 2nd, 2023 at 10:08 am
Total Trainwreck because: players that never developed, second string players that should probably be on the practice squad, poor secondary play with almost no INTs and poor tackling, D line unable to get pressure on the QB, coach that does not adapt. Maybe the 3-4 no longer works here.
December 2nd, 2023 at 10:13 am
He is just a lousy coach who was forced on us by Ariens. The organization is a mess top to bottom. This week may be their last win of the season. Posithink will have them on to the Super Bowl after beating the Panters. Worse than even the Bucs. It will be Glorious. The Battle of the Bums…2morro.
December 2nd, 2023 at 10:29 am
It starts up front. Pressure the QB. If the QB has time to order a pizza from Domino’s and have it delivered, he will find time to throw to an open receiver. Coverage can only hold up for a short time. Get edge rushers!
December 2nd, 2023 at 10:35 am
All good things will end at some point!!!! That is TB’s issue! OCs have caught up to his mods operandi!! He likes to rest his defense by playing soft zone, teams march down the field by picking it apart which keeps his defense on the field longer so they are either more tired or bored or both. Then they give up the big play!
TB also likes to blitz! Teams now use 1 or 2 quick outlet receivers to counter this!
TB has not figured out how to adjust to these things. If he has, he has made the adjustments so complicated that his players need to think to hard instead of just reacting and making plays. End result…the defense doesn’t get off the field fast enough!!
Then there’s his idea about using extended offensive drives using “run first” to keep his defense resting on the bench. That’s a whole nother issue!!! It’s very hard to score enough points to keep up with the other teams “pass first” mode especially when your defense isn’t getting off the field on third downs.
December 2nd, 2023 at 10:48 am
I really hope that the Glazers are doing some secretive behind the
December 2nd, 2023 at 10:50 am
That posted by accident.
I really hope the Glazers are doing some secretive behind the scenes wooing of Jim Harbaugh
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:00 am
Todd was probably mentally fired by the Glazers after the Texans collapse.
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:00 am
This is the same listless kind of team put out by Bowles last year.
Like it or not, I hope Jim Harbaugh, who has won in the NFL, and College is behind the podium in Jan 2024 having a press conference as the new Head Coach of the Bucs.
GO BUCS!!!!
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:04 am
I really hope we lose this game. Can’t believe I am saying that, and this is the first year as a fan that I have wanted to tank…but we really need to.
So far as Interceptions…they are exciting to see, but shutdown CBs work too.
Unfortunately, Defense is not the only week spot on this team, and Bowles is at fault because of the choices he has made and the lies he has told.
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:07 am
Jim Harbaugh would be a dream come true for Bucs fans. For Tampa to be the team that lures him back to the NFL would be great.
That said, he has been very reluctant to return to the NFL in the past. While I think if he ever does so, this would be the year because of his suspensions in college ball…there are probably going to be several teams vying for him.
So, if Jason Licht were able to land him…Licht should get a ten year extension.
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:11 am
Yep, something has changed schematically, and not for the better.
Bucs LB’s and DB’s are so out of position, so often.
Bucs had a good system, but someone decided to re-invent the wheel.
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:29 am
Bonzai
Tanking won’t help. First round picks lose more than they win statistically. You run the risk of a prima donna like Fameis. If you get your wish and Harbaugh came…we can let him make that decision. IE Seriously. Who in the Buc’s organization do you trust to throw a dart at the board in the first round? I’m getting too freaking old to was any years much less another 3-4 to get even a talented QB like T. Lawrence to win games consistenly.
The defensive collapse is the reason I have given up on Bowles. That was HIS speciality and should have been the strength of this team. If they had been even 70% as good as the last SB defense the Bucs would be 7-4 right now!
I’m not saying those seven wins would have been to Baker’s credit, but the losses are not his blame either.
Someone like Harbaugh perhaps Ben Johnson (also going to be in huge demand) might actually want a season to see what they have at QB. Johnson turned Goff’s career around perhaps he can do the same for Mayfield or Trask.
As for the CB’s their talent is irrelevant at this point. They can’t stay on the field! They are injury prone, Dean has been since he missed all the time at Ohio State. Dean does have measurables as in a 4.3 40. Davis is not even fast for a CB a 4.5 at the Combine 4.44 at Auburn pro day.
Together they have missed almost 20 games already in their 5 year careers.
Neither one of them has EVER played a full season! Save the big $$$. Hard to earn that money from the bench!
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:31 am
It’s a Chinese fire drill most of the time – people running to no where leaving huge gaps of field wide open
Uncovered right down the seam, 10 yards off on 3rd & 2 to go, etc
Aw2 has saved maybe 5 tds by himself in spite of how bad it already is
A complete and total joke of a job being done by this staff
It is time to clean house of this foolishness
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:38 am
The Bowles Pep Talk pre game must be somethin else. Can u imagine?
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:42 am
When we sweep the Panters we will get our predicted six wins.
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:45 am
When Bowles first got here, it was all Jameis’ fault for turning the ball over and putting his defense in bad positions. Remember a couple seasons removed, and its Brady and the offense being too efficient that time of possession becomes a problem because the defense takes too many snaps. He is always going to have excuses because he continues to approach the game backwards from the wrong side of the ball. You win by score more points. Bowles says he can win by creating turnovers and playing tough with his defense, while making the opponent pay for its mistakes. Besides one incredible playoff run, when has his defense really been the difference maker? I have seen a top flight offense struggle to run the ball, and now trouble scoring over his time here. Under his influence our team is horrible at what it used to do best.
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:48 am
Fully expect to get beat this week, much as I have since before the SF game.
We are not going to have to tank if they leave Todd in place
We might win 2 more games, tops
The insanity that we are forced to watch is called Todd flipping Blows
Clown show
Complete farce
Pathetic excuse for a HC
Makes Perkins, Williamson, Bennet, Schiano, Koetter, Smith(L&M) all look like HOF coaches
I can do this all day
Stevie Wonder and Ray Charles both refuse to watch
Primetime won’t let Todd anywhere near the portal
USF won’t take his stadium donation money in fear his lack of skills rubs off on the building
Let us count the ways Toad needs to get run
December 2nd, 2023 at 11:49 am
Bucs adjustment this Sunday: Bowles will carry his “lucky rabbit’s foot”
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:11 pm
Licht won’t hire Harbaugh because he would want total control as most good head coaches. Arians was the only good coach Licht has ever hired and he was talked out of retirement. So lord only knows where our next head coach comes from. Probably Dave Canales reboot of welcome back Koetter!!!!!!!– Bwahwahwahwah.
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:27 pm
Buc4evr Says:
December 2nd, 2023 at 10:08 am
Total Trainwreck because: players that never developed, second string players that should probably be on the practice squad, poor secondary play with almost no INTs and poor tackling, D line unable to get pressure on the QB, coach that does not adapt. Maybe the 3-4 no longer works here.
^^^^^^^^^
What, no mention of one of the worst seasons ever by a Bucs player, Devin White? This, plus ZERO accountability from Bowles, is one of the biggest reasons for this sh!t show.
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:31 pm
Overseeing the tank!
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:38 pm
Unfortunately, it’s obvious the Bowles is just not a good head coach. At what point in time do you throw in the towel and accept that fact? I believe that point will be at the end of this season. He’s done nothing in two stops to prove that he’s a good head coach. His specialty is the defense and they’re the worst part of the team.
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:38 pm
This headline reads like The Onion.
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:48 pm
Repus Bowl
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:52 pm
Fun fact:
Bucs defense is 4th BEST in points allowed per game in the NFC.
Bucs offense is 4th WORST in points scored per game in the NFC.
With Bowles, he was broken by that last play vs the Rams in the playoffs. Since that game, the Bucs have been almost exclusively a zone defense, and were up to running zone around 95% of the time as of a few games ago.
I will say, in terms of limiting points, the zone has worked – per the stats above. However it is purely a ‘bend don’t break’ defense, to the point of not stopping anyone unless it is in the red zoe. Also, because they’ve become nearly an exclusively zone defense (a soft sloppy zone to be sure), they don’t seem to be able to play man that well – which is expected if they rarely do it.
Overall, Bowles, as a head coach, is completely overmatched. I have a feeling if he was demoted back to just being the DC, we’d see changes for the better across the board, and it would happen pretty quickly. And that comes from someone who HATES Todd Bowles — as head coach. I still think he’d be a top flight DC if that was his only job and where he put 100% of his focus.
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:52 pm
Buccaneer Bonzai: Your true colors have finally shown you as a traitor to all real Bucs Fans. You hope that the Bucs lose? How crazy is that? How foolish is that?
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:55 pm
Capt’n Munch: You and Bonzai should form your own Bucs Haters club. But from your comments, you already have.
December 2nd, 2023 at 12:55 pm
GIVE HARBAUGH TOTAL CONTROL=WIN IN YEAR 1
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:10 pm
WyomingJoe – hey serious question, since you’re such a hard core Bucs fan and only want what is best for the team, why don’t you tell us about when you became a Bucs fan and why, who your favorite players are, how many games you’ve been to, etc.
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:23 pm
The 1-10 Panthers rank 5th in D
They have given up over ONE THOUSAND less passing yards than Toads D has given up So far this year
1,000 yards less
They are 1-10
We are lucky to be 4-7 – if we played MN and or CHI now, we would lose very likely – they have gotten better, we have regressed badly
It’s more like 2-9 vs 1-10 tomorrow….
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:27 pm
I’ve been rooting for the Bucs since I became a Floridian in 77. I want what’s best for the team, and have to agree with some of the other hardcore fans that losing right now would be best. This team doesn’t deserve the fans support, because they haven’t earned it.
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:42 pm
stpetebucfan Says
“Bonzai
Tanking won’t help. First round picks lose more than they win statistically.”
That doesn’t mean we should not try. In my book, the only reason we have not gotten an elite franchise QB is because we rarely draft one in the first round.
Those teams that end up with elite franchise QB draft picks keep trying until they get one, and then they are set for a decade or two.
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:42 pm
It’s a shame that even after Bryce Young puts up 350 yards a 4 tds tomorrow, we’ll still be stuck with Toilet Bowels until after the season.
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:44 pm
Hodad Says:
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:27 pm
I’ve been rooting for the Bucs since I became a Floridian in 77. I want what’s best for the team, and have to agree with some of the other hardcore fans that losing right now would be best. This team doesn’t deserve the fans support, because they haven’t earned it.
———-
The team literally won a SB a couple of years ago.
Have some perspective.
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:47 pm
WyomingJoe Says
“Buccaneer Bonzai: Your true colors have finally shown you as a traitor to all real Bucs Fans. You hope that the Bucs lose? How crazy is that? How foolish is that?”
Call me what you like…but if we are in the same boat the next few years, don’t complain that we do not have a franchise QB.
I’m getting old. I don’t have the time left to watch another 15 years of losing. I want to see my Buccaneers become reliably great again.
Traitor? For wanting what is best for the team? I don’t think so. If we cannot win in the playoffs, there is absolutely no reason to even go. There are too many cons to it.
It’s reality.
This team is in crisis. We need drastic change. I’m not saying we should just start from scratch everywhere…but we need some strong moves. One of them is a franchise QB and a suitable bridge QB.
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:50 pm
WyomingJoe,
Also, I get it. I used to feel the way you do…so I won’t hold that against you. My views have matured in recent times.
December 2nd, 2023 at 1:50 pm
stpetebucfan Says
“First round picks lose more than they win statistically.”
——–
Have you bothered to look at our record this year?
Also tanking in 2014 is DIRECTLY what lead to the Super Bowl win 2020.
The team built an offense around Winston, and it was that offense that brought Brady here.
Saying the team might lose 12 games next year, instead of 11 under Baker, is not a legit argument for just continuing down the same loserville course.
Part of getting Brady in 2020, and in particular bringing him back in 2021 and keeping the core today, was the understanding that once he left, you were going to need to rebuild. The Bucs tried to squeeze one more year out of this team, and it failed, mainly due to having a terrible head coach and a loser quarterback.
It’s time to hit the reset switch – and literally everyone, at least everyone with an IQ over 32, knew this day was coming in the near future. Personally I think they should have done it this year, with Bowles as your head coach it’s not like you ever had a chance to do anything, but as I pointed out numerous times all summer, all Baker was going to do was make this team just good enough to get not a top QB, and would be a 6-win team, at best.
December 2nd, 2023 at 2:03 pm
Buccaneer Bonzai “my views have matured” or have they just gotten crusty?
December 2nd, 2023 at 2:05 pm
Tomorrow at 4. It will be bigger than the Thrilla in Manilla!
BATTLE of the BUMS by the BAY. BBB
Can’t wait it will be Yuuuuge!
December 2nd, 2023 at 2:14 pm
The team vastly overspent in 2020 and 2021. They literally mortgaged the future. And they did it to win the Super Bowl. Most would be willing to make that deal. But right now, the Bucs are paying those bills. The cap was in horrible shape this year. It gets slightly better next year. But it won’t be till 2025 when most of the dead cash is off the books. So for now you have to rely largely on cheap free agents and attempt to develop young players.
Bowles has made a lot of mistakes, but he’s also been put in a very difficult position of having to navigate through a period of re-adjustment where he’s got a team in cap hell, and also when he just lost perhaps the best QB to ever play the game.
December 2nd, 2023 at 2:17 pm
The REPUS bowl is back!
December 2nd, 2023 at 2:40 pm
Capt’n Munch: Why, you’re my favorite player, but you know that already, right? I followed your career with the Bucs very closely. In fact, your seat on the bench is exactly where Trask is sitting now. Go figure…
December 2nd, 2023 at 2:52 pm
Trask is battleing Bench Sores, awful. Worse than Turf Toe. He may be questionable for the Bum Battle.
December 2nd, 2023 at 3:18 pm
The beauty of playing man to man, is that everyone can see who exactly is doing their best ‘toast’ impersonation, and who is doing their job.
Man to man holds players accountable for their preparation or lack there of. I believe this is where Bowles loses it. The secondary far to often goes into that hybrid zone lawnchair coverege where everyone on the opposition is running wide open. Sometimes by 20 yards or more. It will remain a complete mystery to me long after he is gone why he didn’t have his secondary’s play much more man to man tight coverege more often than he did/does. Especially those 20 million dollar a year cornerbacks.
December 2nd, 2023 at 3:22 pm
Battle of 2 NFL teams with interim HC’s
December 2nd, 2023 at 3:23 pm
WyomingJoe – of course you can’t answer the question, because you’re just a Baker Boi, a stalker type who spends his Sundays trying to sneak into the Bucs locker room so you can meet Baker and let him know how you defended him against cyberbullies, and how your love is real, not like all those other people.
Bonzai, this is why it’s a waste of time to try to hold any sort of intelligent conversation with these idiots. They don’t care two cents about the Bucs or what is best for the team, they’re just nut jobs who saw Baker doing TV commercials and they think he’s their friend, their only friend.
When you’re dealing with the mentally ill, the best thing to do is to just call them out for being insane. I read that in a book.
December 2nd, 2023 at 4:38 pm
Rod,
“Also tanking in 2014 is DIRECTLY what lead to the Super Bowl win 2020.”
Rod I’m sure I’m in your pantheon of “these idiots.” Or perhaps just “mentally ill”.
But I’m truly curious as to what that DIRECT CONNECTION OF DRAFTING A 28-42 QB who never reached the playoffs had with the SB win? DIRECT? Really?
December 2nd, 2023 at 4:39 pm
Rod Munch Says:
Also tanking in 2014 is DIRECTLY what lead to the Super Bowl win 2020.
The team built an offense around Winston, and it was that offense that brought Brady here.
—————————
This is the biggest reach. Justifying a no. 1 overall pick who failed to earn a second contract because they guy who replaced him won a Super Bowl.
“That Gerald McCoy pick was great, wasn’t it? Remember when Suh replaced him and we won a championship?”
December 2nd, 2023 at 5:02 pm
Such garbage. It’s Bowles fault that Dean and Davis have ‘regressed’. D White is playing poorly, must be on Bowles. He’s not ‘using them correctly’. How about these guys are making a ton of money, they all have rings and they just have their heads up their respective a$$’s. Traffic on Dale Mabry is horrible. No doubt it’s on Bowles.
December 2nd, 2023 at 6:48 pm
Carolina 23 Clueless Todd 10
December 2nd, 2023 at 7:24 pm
stpetebucfan – So, I’ll give you a legit response, no name calling (even though on a men’s site, you should be free to call everyone names, because words don’t hurt, and we’re not teenage girls).
So how did tanking lead to the SB?
The Bucs wanted to get everything they could out of Jameis – which is why they spent all those draft picks and money building the offense. After the offense was established, they finally got around to fixing the defense. Amazing how the anti-Winston crowd always leaves out how he literally had the worst defense and worst kicking game in the NFL from 2015-2019 – not my opinion, those are the stats.
Anywho, Arians came here because of Winston, because of all the offensive weapons, and regardless of all the fake news nonsense about the team wanting Teddy Bridgewater, if Brady wasn’t available, it was Winston that was coming back.
But, because of the offense, and a young defense that was finally, in the last few games of Winston’s time here was finally coming around, Brady choose to come here.
Without Winston, you don’t have a top 3 offense that Brady is setting into, and you don’t have Arians, and Brady goes to the Chargers.
December 2nd, 2023 at 7:28 pm
Bucs won SB in 2020 because of Tom Brady. He elevated the team by his sheer presence. He brought in Gronk, AB and Fournette.
December 2nd, 2023 at 7:30 pm
UKBuccaneer – What happened to you exactly that turned you into a full fledge Baker Boi than cares more about Baker than wanting the Bucs to win? You didn’t always throw in your lot in with the nutjobs, but now, you’re wanting the team to fail and burn, just to stick with your man no matter what. Your only response to everything is to say everything is always just to say every other opinion is worse, even as the team crashes and burns.
I get it, you thought that this team is actually good, and should try to win. But now you have all the proof you need to know that this team is not any good. I get that you wanted Baker to be the answer – but he’s proven he isn’t the answer, unless the question is, “what’s the best way to go 6-11 every year.”
Compared to the other Baker Bois I’ve gone very easy on you, because I think you’re actually a fan of the team. However, as time goes on, that doesn’t seem to be the case at all. It’s kind of sad to see.
December 2nd, 2023 at 7:33 pm
Colonel Angus Says:
December 2nd, 2023 at 7:28 pm
Bucs won SB in 2020 because of Tom Brady.
———-
That is correct, without Tom Brady they don’t win the SB. Instead they got 11-5, probably lose in the 2nd round of the playoffs to the Saints.
However, Tom Brady doesn’t come here unless you got a great offensive line, and great WRs. Gronk came here because of Brady, as for Fournette, he was cut by the Jags, and needed a job, that had nothing to do with Brady. But Brady did get us Antonio Brown, which was a great fit, since he did a ton to help with our constantly injured WR core. If Brady had been having to start Justin Watson and Perriman down the stretch, well, just look at KC right now, and how drops are literally costing them games.
December 2nd, 2023 at 8:08 pm
It’s easy to say it’s Bowles and call for heads to roll.
Unfortunately the one’s that make the decisions will make the call based on what their expectations were going into the campaign.
Looking back at the Expected Wins for all NFL teams odds makers had the Patriots at 3.5, Texans at 9.5, Panthers at 2.5 and those odds were made before two Rookie QB’s ever took an NFL snap. Looking pretty much right on. Most of the projected wins for teams in the league predicted are pretty much spot on. None to be more than 2 over. No surprises. Giants sit at 4 and need me more and maybe the Nobody they brought in could win them 1 more to cover. Doe#n’t look promising though.
Glazer’s had to a field a team on the cheap and are owner’s and not fans. When they saw Bucs @ 6.5 they didn’t say or these guys are nuts, go down the schedule and count win win win loss… and come up with an 11 and 6 record and a number two seed. Sure a lot of fans did.
If Bucs win 8 games that is a success based on expectations. It’s a lot easier to go from 8 wins to 10 or 11 in one season than it is to go from 2 or 3 wins to an 8-9 record in one. Need a lot to of luck there.
Glazer’s saw how the 8-9 last season could have easily been 6-11 without some late game heroics. Can’t see them expecting the Moon from Bowles this season.
Jets need 3 more wins and if tomorrow is not one of them then week 14 might be a last stand for the Bucs against the Falcons. Certainly week 15 will as the Packers are not going to get to week 17 and hope one team loses and have to beat a team on an 8-1 win streak.
December 2nd, 2023 at 8:27 pm
Hey Bonzai, I’ll bet I’m older than you. In fact, just from reading your comments on here over the past several seasons, I know I am. I am a genuine Bucs fan, long suffering and all. That’s why I’m not negative. I’ve seen the Bucs win 2 Stupid Bowls, one in their own crib. I’ve been around during all the long stretches of double digit loss seasons. You say you’re getting old, huh? Really? Prove it.
December 2nd, 2023 at 8:59 pm
Rod Munch Says:
UKBuccaneer – What happened to you exactly that turned you into a full fledge Baker Boi than cares more about Baker than wanting the Bucs to win? You didn’t always throw in your lot in with the nutjobs, but now, you’re wanting the team to fail and burn, just to stick with your man no matter what. Your only response to everything is to say everything is always just to say every other opinion is worse, even as the team crashes and burns.
I get it, you thought that this team is actually good, and should try to win. But now you have all the proof you need to know that this team is not any good. I get that you wanted Baker to be the answer – but he’s proven he isn’t the answer, unless the question is, “what’s the best way to go 6-11 every year.”
Compared to the other Baker Bois I’ve gone very easy on you, because I think you’re actually a fan of the team. However, as time goes on, that doesn’t seem to be the case at all. It’s kind of sad to see.
———————————
I believe that Baker gives te team a better chance to win than Trask right now, which is why Baker should be starting. That’s based upon a couple of factors, like the fact that the organisation has had 3 years to assess Trask and still decided to bring in Baked, and also the fact that Trask is basically a rookie with 10 passes to his name and a 30% completion rate. Show me a rookie who doesn’t take his lumps, through stupid int’s and make mistakes. I don’t believe Trask will be immune to those rookie errors, do you?
I’m happy to see Trask play once we’re eliminated from playoff contention, I’ve said that repeatedly.
I don’t believe in tanking for picks, I’ve said that repeatedly – mainly because it’s not the way to play the game, but also because tanking just doesn’t work in the NFL. A team has never, ever purposefully tanked and taken a franchise calibre QB.
Finally, this team’s problems don’t begin and end with QB. We have no running game, a bad o-line, bang-average tight end play, and a defense that doesn’t know which way is up. Putting Trask in is setting him to fail – he’s facing (as Baker is facing) odds that one man can’t overcome alone.
December 3rd, 2023 at 9:07 am
Rod
I’ll try and respond as you did without name calling.
You theory is specious at best. The Bucs decided to build the best offense they could just because they drafted Fameis. That’s a DIRECT connection.
Heres DIRECT connection for you. JW cost the franchise ‘bigly” in draft capital.
It’s actually just the opposite of your “reasoning”.
Walter Football posts the chart of draft pick value expressed in points created by NFL people who actually participate in the draft. I would post the line for you but I respect Joe’s legal liabilities so I don’t do links anymore but it’s an easy google…Walter Footballs NFL draft chart.
Top pick in the draft 3000 points. Last pick in the first round 590! Not sure how good your math is but expressed in statistic analysis JW cost the Bucs five 1st rounders if they traded with a team picking last. What are the odd eh. NONE
But when you extrapolate the entire chart you can see that the Bucs could have traded JW’s pick for 6 second round picks in the middle of the round or TEN 3rd rounders at the top of the round.
I’m not a stats freak. I think they have some value but the bottom line here is no matter how you quantify it the principle remains the same. The Bucs would have had 3-5 picks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds minimum.
So no Rod…the DIRECT connection of tanking for Jameis or any QB going forward is that you spend a TON of draft capital that can set the REST of the team back. So it’s actually the opposite of what you said.
NOW if JW had turned out to be Burrows, or even Purdy, much less Mahomes that draft capital would have been worth it!
I’ve had a lot of careers including as a businessman. I always paid attention to “potential” but I only paid for “results”, unless of course I made a mistake evaluating that potential!
December 3rd, 2023 at 10:47 am
orlbucfan Says
“You say you’re getting old, huh? Really? Prove it.”
That’s stupid. How am I supposed to prove it?
I can say I’ve been a fan since the very start…because my father and I became instant fans when the team started.
But it really doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter if you are younger or older. It doesn’t change a thing. We can both be getting old at the same time. It’s not a competition, lol.
If you are as old as I am, or older, congrats! We’re both still alive!
December 3rd, 2023 at 10:50 am
Rod Munch Says:
“even though on a men’s site, you should be free to call everyone names, because words don’t hurt”
On that we disagree. Words start wars.