Todd Bowles Draws A Line In The Sand For Joe Tryon-Shoyinka
March 24th, 2023
It’s rare to hear head coach Todd Bowles roll out an achievement stat necessary for a certain position.
But hey, Bowles is much more open and engaging when he visits the Ira Kaufman Podcast versus when he’s at the One Buc Palace podium or on national radio. So Joe was not surprised Bowles went there when he sat down with Ira and Joe at the NFL Scouting Combine.
Bowles was asked about where edge rusher Joe Tryon-Shoyinka is in his development and what it’ll take for him to break through as a consisent impact player.
Bowels didn’t hold back.
“Joe, he has to finish at the top of his rush. You know, he’s got his hands on the quarterback a bunch of times, but he’s leaving his feet,” Bowles said. “As well as [on tackles for loss], he’s doing the same thing. He’s getting back there. He’s very active. He runs like a deer. He’s got all the talent in the world and he played hard. … He’s gotta finish at the top of the rush.
“Every time he gets close, he falls off. He probably had more missed sacks than he did sacks. And, you know, we’re not down on him. That’s just an area he’s got to get better at, and I think [new outside linebackers coach George] Edwards can help him with that.
“This was the first year since I’ve been coaching a 3-4 defense that the interior guy [Vita Vea] had more sacks than the outside linebacker. This defense is built for outside linebackers to lead the team in sacks and that didn’t happen this year. You know, once Shaq [Barrett] went down it became tough sledding. And we can blitz and do other things to get pressure, but that [outside linebacker] position has to come through for us with at least 8 or more sacks every year.”
So there you go, Tryon-Shoyinka fans. Your guy has to finish plays and he better be racking up 8 sacks.
Next month, Joe expects the Bucs to draft an edge rusher they hope can push Tryon-Shoyinka (4 sacks) and Anthony Nelson (5 1/2 sacks) while the team hopes and prays Barrett can return healthy from his blown Achilles.
March 24th, 2023 at 12:43 pm
Newsflash – Toad, if you fail to teach, if you don’t measure a player’s development with real metrics, if you don’t hold them accountable when they do screw up, they regress. Whether that’s JTS, Logan Hall, Diva White, or a talented secondary who fail to grasp your Calculus 4 pass defense and so often bust their coverage.
Toad, look in the mirror. I’d ask you to shave off the red tufts growing out either side of your head but you don’t see them.
March 24th, 2023 at 12:46 pm
Gotta get stronger in the weight room.
March 24th, 2023 at 12:47 pm
lol.. nobody is listening to Todd
March 24th, 2023 at 12:48 pm
Bowles didn’t say how good he looks with his shirt off. He’s like a Greek god! And you know what Al Sharpton says about the Greeks.
March 24th, 2023 at 12:59 pm
One certainly is that the defense will get a ton of playing time
March 24th, 2023 at 1:00 pm
The Bucs have nearly $5m in cap space now. I wonder why they’re freeing up the money? They normally would wait until they have to sign draft picks to get that last bit of cash.
Also, still interesting they haven’t done anything with Evans. I’ve always compared him closely to Vincent Jackson (if Jackson was a HOFer), who was a productive starter until he was 32 years old. Evans, I think will also still be a productive starter through at least 32. Evans only issue is that he’s never been all that fast and doesn’t have much speed that he can lose, however he’s so big and has such good body control, it’s not like he needs to be open to catch the ball. In any case, the Bucs can safely give him a 2-year extension, and I’ve have no issues if they just tacked on a 3rd year. They might be saving that for after the draft, to see how they trade around and so they know how much money they actually need to sign everything.
March 24th, 2023 at 1:09 pm
We have no idea what moves they may still be considering. The under the radar Gaines acquisition came out of the blue. Of course it was needed, but there was zero buzz about it. Not a flashy player but a productive one. If nothing else, this team is often good at surprises. Something or nothing could happen before the draft. But freeing up cash is interesting.
March 24th, 2023 at 1:11 pm
@ Rod
I don’t believe that $5M in cap space accounts for LVD or the Gains signings…
According to Over the Cap – the Bucs have $4.7M in cap – this includes the Succop release but does not include the LVD or Gains contracts.
If the Bucs need more cap space they will have to find it by extending D. White or restructuring S. Barrett or M. Evans…
Or trading D. White (which I doubt will happen at this point).
March 24th, 2023 at 1:19 pm
At least Bowles gave a concrete number for us fans to judge our outside backers on. My question is an If/Then statement: IF JTS doesn’t get near 8 sacks, let’s say only 4 once again, THEN what happens? Is JTS gone?
March 24th, 2023 at 1:30 pm
Marine Buc – Good catch, I was only half-a–ed paying attention and didn’t notice that. I checked Spotrac now as well, and they actually have the Bucs at $6m under the cap, but again without David, Gaines, Gill and O’Connor – I wonder why they’re not on that list.
With that said, David is still listed as $7m in dead cap space (on Spotrac) because of his void year, so I believe the way things work is that the void year is pushed to next year and the Bucs give him the $7m contract this year, unless they did more tricks with the contract and actually ended up with more cap space by resigning him (but also counting against the cap next year). In fact I wouldn’t be surprised if they use that David deal as a way to pay for the signings of all those guys.
I think with Shaq they probably want hold off on that if possible as his production hasn’t matched his contract, and for a guy with marginal athletic ability, to come off a major injury, I think they want to be really careful there. Then again they don’t seem to really care about future dead cap space right now, so maybe I’m wrong.
With White, he’s not going anywhere this year. The dummies who hate on him are clueless idiots. With that said, I think the Bucs want to wait on him as well and just see what happens with his production before deciding on a number.
The Bucs won’t need a lot of room for rookies, and just giving Evans a new deal would likely create plenty of space. So that idea, of waiting until after the draft to know that number, makes a lot of sense. Also the team likes to have a little money for during the season, so they’ll have to do something there as well.
March 24th, 2023 at 1:41 pm
He runs like a deer! Yeah but he also looks like a deer staring into headlights as a pass rusher.
March 24th, 2023 at 1:42 pm
Spot on Todd. Watching JTS miss all season drove me nuts. Glad to see you’ll be trying to develop his weakness. 50/50 whether or not JTS converts all that potential into production. Hoping the light bulb turns on for JTS.
March 24th, 2023 at 1:49 pm
In fairness to JTS, he was always a project player who didn’t play much in college and needed a lot of seasoning before he’d be ready. People shouldn’t write him off just yet, he still has a chance of putting everything together.
March 24th, 2023 at 1:56 pm
@ Rod
“I wouldn’t be surprised if they use that David deal as a way to pay for the signings of all those guys.”
I agree.
Julio Jones, Will Gholston and Akiem Hicks are still on the market – that would be another $10M in dead cap the Bucs could push into 2024…
I am not a big fan of this move – I would rather the Bucs continue getting cheaper, younger, faster and hungrier.
I doubt we see Hicks return but I wouldn’t be surprised to see Jones and Gholston come back on cheaper team friendly deals after the draft.
March 24th, 2023 at 1:58 pm
“Bowels didn’t hold back.”
Can we assume that was a typo?
March 24th, 2023 at 1:59 pm
I’m not convinced that we will drat an edge rusher early……most of the top ones will be gone by 19……I wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t pick the #1 Safety or the #2 TE at 19 or traded down. Then went OT, TE, S.
I’m not saying we shouldn’t pick and edge rusher…just that we won’t.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:02 pm
GF my friend, how many times have we heard similar things about Devin white. Bowles apparently can’t get players to adhere to his scheme. Not often enough anyway. I don’t think he commands respect. Otherwise, players would fear for their jobs and do what they’re told. It’s one thing if a coach has a lack of talent. Its another to be unable to properly motivate them.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:11 pm
The rest assured there are absolutely no JTS fans outside of maybe his parents. and when you draft a kid that sat out his senior year of college football because he was scared of Covid what do you think you’re gonna get other than someone mentally capable of finishing. He dives around and runs around adjusting his arm stockings like a diva baseball player stepping out of the batters box every pitch. White and JTS to much Gerald McCoy disease.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:33 pm
D-Rok, if JTS gets 4 sacks, it’s probably going to be up to the new head coach whether he is retained.
Redeemer, yes, hammer meets nail.
Bowels is one of those geniuses that understands everything he wants to do, it’s just that no one else does.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:44 pm
@ TBBF
Darnell Washington – TE – Georgia
– 6’7″
– 265 lbs.
– 4.6 – 40 yd dash
– tested at the combine similar to a WR
I really like this pick at #19. We could probably move back in round one 5-7 picks and still get him.
I believe the Bucs will go OT in round #1. But I wouldn’t be upset if they picked TE – D. Washington.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:44 pm
With all the money the Bucs saved by signing Baker at a discount, they can be aggressive in layin down the law to other players. Shape up, or ship out! We got the money to replace you with a quality player. The more I think about the Baker signing, the more I think it was a good move under the circumstances. Go Bucs! Shake & Bake!!
March 24th, 2023 at 2:48 pm
It’d be nice to hear of JTS taking up some form of martial art to align his hand-eye-foot coordination this offseason like Gholston did a few seasons ago. To me, his biggest hang-up is physical discipline and merrying all his faculties to actually beat his man instead of going the Jacquies Smith route relying primarily on a speed rush.
Don’t really trust him setting the edge against the rush as much as I’d trust Nelly, but athletically he’s got everything you’d want in an OLB in this scheme to be successful. Joe just isn’t putting it all together and like Frank Robinson said “close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades”. We’ll see how he’s looking in camp, but JTS in year 3 is on the clock now.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:54 pm
Another wasted first….just like Spence…smdh! And I was pushing for us to snag OL Landon Dickerson who went a few picks later, after JTS.
We suck at picking QB’s and edge rushers….is what it is.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:55 pm
Mr. Marine, thank you….ive been pushing him a lot on here.
March 24th, 2023 at 2:58 pm
Creating accountability is important
March 24th, 2023 at 3:31 pm
Also alot easier to rush the QB when the offense actually scores points.
I’m not saying JTS and the entire pass rush as a whole doesn’t deserve scrutiny, because they do, but this defense had to stand on its head alot last year to keep our offense in the game and to even give us a chance to win at the end.
@marine and madmax
Absolutely not to a 1st round pick TE. Historically an awful use of a 1st round pick across the entire NFL.
March 24th, 2023 at 3:47 pm
Don’t wait on Tryon. He is what he is. Draft a DE with one of our 1st 2 picks.
March 24th, 2023 at 3:50 pm
@ gotbucs
True.
Like I said – I think Licht will move back in the first round (pick up a few more picks) and pick an OT in the late first round.
Our Gm has shown a propensity to pick need over BPA… But I do trust his judgement with picking O-lineman.
But I am impressed with D. Washington – could be a big swing and a miss but the upside potential is huge.
March 24th, 2023 at 4:14 pm
Just Leave Trask a Bone says “Creating accountability is important.”
But even though Trask hasn’t earned it, you want them to start him. You think he’s earned it, coaches and management do not. Since they get paid for what they decide, and winning is the measure that matters the most, maybe the guy with the love doll’s name in his posts should look up the word “accountability” in the dictionary. Because all conspiracy aside, no one is going to leave your boy on the bench if they think he gives them the best chance to win. Keep believing though! Mike Glennon has a hot wife and has made ridiculous money, without getting his noggin scrambled.
March 24th, 2023 at 4:29 pm
I recall ten years ago Greg Schiano said that he expected Daquan Bowers to have ten sacks. I have a feeling JTS’s career is going to flame out like Bowers’ did.
March 24th, 2023 at 4:36 pm
Potential Addition(s)
Defensive Tackles:
• Mazie Smith – Height: 6’3 | Weight: 323| 40 Time: 5.08
• Keeanu Benton – Height: 6’4 | Weight: 309 | 40 Time: 5.08
• Jacoby Slade – Height: 6’4 | Weight: 293 | 40 Time: 5.20
Defensive Ends:
• Karl Brooks – Height: 6’4 | Weight: 303| 40 Time: 5.10
• Tyler Lacy – Height: 6’4 | Weight: 279 | 40 Time: 5.11
• Byron Young – Height: 6’3 | Weight: 294 | 40 Time: 5.00
RUSH Backers:
• Lukas Van Ness – Height: 6’4 | Weight: 272 | 40 Time: 4.58
• Keion White – Height: 6’5 | Weight: 285 | 40 Time: 4.69
• Zach Harrison – Height: 6’5 | Weight: 285 | 40 Time: 4.58
SAM Backers:
• Will McDonald IV – Height: 6’3 | Weight: 239 | 40 Time: 4.62
• Nick Herbig – Height: 6’2 | Weight: 240 | 40 Time: 4.65
• YaYa Diaby – Height: 6’3 | Weight: 263 | 40 Time: 4.51
March 24th, 2023 at 4:54 pm
PUT 10 ON THE BOARD
JTS put in a ton of offseason work last offseason and I expect him to do the same this offseason. He comes into the year with one full season of experience. He’s grown a lot and I expect great things.
March 24th, 2023 at 5:22 pm
THEY GOTTA DRAFT ISAIAH FOSKEY!
March 24th, 2023 at 5:41 pm
@LUVMYBUCS
You’re missing Karl Brooks and Felix Anudike-Uzomah. I like Van Ness, not at 13 but he’s got scheme versatility in Bowles D and our scouting department has hit twice drafting from Iowa in recent years so chances are strong he’s on our board. YaYa Diaby would be a nice late round addition to our pass rush rotation.
March 24th, 2023 at 6:13 pm
While it’s not unusual for a edge/linebacker to take a couple years to develop. What I find concerning is JTS is consistently half a step from making the play. It seems as if JTS doesn’t know what to do after getting in the backfield. Most players at the NFL level have developed an instinct. He just seems lost at times.
March 24th, 2023 at 6:19 pm
@ Dooley
Without a doubt, Felix Anudike-Uzomah and Adetomiwa Adebawore are two of the most promising prospects on the board. Additionally, Lukas Van Ness – is an absolute dog.
March 24th, 2023 at 6:22 pm
@ Dooley
Your thoughts on Jacoby Slade, Byron Young (ALA), and Nick Herbig!
March 24th, 2023 at 6:49 pm
Ohio St. OT Paris Johnson v. Iowa DL Lukas Van Ness https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8qcOSXzG9Q
March 24th, 2023 at 9:54 pm
Put some stickum on his gloves.
March 25th, 2023 at 12:01 am
@LUVMYBUCS
Herbig would be a project for us, he’s a bit undersized but Cam Gill isn’t all that big either. Short area quickness stands out on film he’s really good at beating tackles to their spots, but he’s also giving up a lot of size when he engages as a rusher and I wouldn’t trust him setting the edge. To make up for that Herbig understand sinking into zone coverages and plays angles well.
Idk, Herbig on day 3 would be a good deal. We’d have to let him get stronger in his base, but he’s already got a bit of a 1on1 pass rush move set that I admire for a guy of his stature. Stood out watching Wisconsin and he’s gotten better every year in his time there. 5th/6th round, let contribute on special teams year 1 so he can work on his strength. Then give him a shot to earn spot in the rotation.
March 25th, 2023 at 1:08 am
So, what i’m hearing is that jason light had yet another bust at picking during the draft. J just isn’t that good.
March 25th, 2023 at 8:46 am
@LUVMYBUCS
Actually just looked at Jake Slades’ high and low lights, the kid kind of looks like what Luke Goedeke would be had he converted from TE to 3-4 DE in college. Slade is a big, solid dude, doesn’t get pushed off the spot much, but he’s a serial leaner and doesn’t disengage well as it looks like his hands deactivate when he’s engaged. Not the two gap player we got in Greg Gaines recently but in the right situation after adding some bulk and working on his short area quickness could develop into a decent rotational player in the right environment.
March 25th, 2023 at 10:28 am
@ Dooley
I fully agree with your analysis on both prospects and I appreciate your feedback.
March 26th, 2023 at 10:53 am
Bottom line is JTS has all the talent but he needs to play in control and not get out of position.