Will Joe Tryon-Shoyinka Get Another Shot?
February 19th, 2023
One thing that often gnawed at Joe was Bucs coaches repeatedly saying edge rusher/OLB Joe Tryon-Shoyinka was raw with a lot to learn because he sat out the 2020 season as a COVID opt-out.
Where’s the line between needing to learn and just not being special?
Tryon-Shoyinka has been weak against the run through his two NFL seasons, and he’s below average as a pass rusher as the final pick in Round 1 of the 2021 NFL Draft.
After 37 games and a hair under 1,500 snaps, Tryon-Shoyinka is worthy of praise for his durability, but Joe can’t buy that he needs more time to get used to the game.
Joe will point to Jaelen Phillips of the Dolphins, the first edge rusher taken in that same 2021 NFL Draft at No. 18 overall. Phillips is a shade younger than Tryon-Shoyinka, played in fewer college games, and he’s got virtually the same number of NFL snaps while playing for two head coaches.
Joe follows a lot of Dolphins football and hasn’t seen Phillips’ inexperience mentioned as a limitation in his quality game.
In fact, many edge rushers around the NFL had fewer defensive snaps than Tryon-Shoyinka in their first two seasons. Brian Burns of the Panthers, for example, had about 300 fewer snaps and Josh Allen of the Jaguars had roughly 450 less.
Around the bye week last season, Bucs defensive coaches Larry Foote and Kacy Rodgers talked about Tryon-Shoyinka needing to break through and hit a new level. He finished with half a sack in his final eight games including the postseason.
So where do the Bucs go from here with Tryon-Shoyinka? He’s inexpensive on Year 3 of his rookie deal, but is he a starter? Will the Bucs continue to invest valuable snaps in his development?
Anthony Nelson has been more productive the past two years in far fewer snaps, and Todd Bowles already has said publicly he wants to re-sign Nelson. Shaq Barrett is expected back after his Achilles injury and the Bucs certainly will give him plenty of snaps to get back into form. Joe also expects the Bucs to add an edge rusher in the draft and to sign a cheap veteran, perhaps re-signing Carl Nassib, who still has something in the tank and isn’t quite 30 years old.
On this fine February day, Joe’s wondering if the Bucs might shop Tryon-Shoyinka to see if some team might cough up a third-round pick.
If he stays in Tampa, then Joe expects Tryon-Shoyinka to get back to playing special teams next season, in addition to defense. He was a regular on fourth down as a rookie but only had 17 special teams snaps last season.
February 19th, 2023 at 7:40 pm
Another OJ Howard. Looks like Tarzan plays like Jane.
February 19th, 2023 at 7:44 pm
He’s not going anywhere.
He should get plenty more snaps in 2023, and since the team stinks anyways, there’s reason not to see if the lottery ticket eventually pays off or not.
But coming out of college, he reminded me of Tyji Armstrong. All I heard about was how impressive he looks, his sculpted body, and not too much about his production.
With that said, both him and Logan Hall seem much more like 4-3 DE’s than 3-4 DE’s and OLB’s. So if the next coach runs a 4-3, both guys might end up getting a 2nd look.
February 19th, 2023 at 7:45 pm
A Bucs Fan – OJ actually played really well and made big plays, when healthy. His issue was health.
February 19th, 2023 at 7:46 pm
Dude needs to step the **** up no doubt.
February 19th, 2023 at 7:46 pm
Hopefully he adds some girth in the off-season. He’s too light a la Dwight freeny, but nowhere near as slippery.
February 19th, 2023 at 7:46 pm
Very much a disappointment along with Logan Hall thus far……These two picks along with Trask thus far look to be questionable…..we will see.
February 19th, 2023 at 7:49 pm
Another JL playing scratch off tixs at El Cheapo gas
The kid was injured amid the Covid confusion and didn’t have much under his belt of playing on tape
Another Noah Spence
Lord knows he will get plenty of time next year because the defense will be on the field alot
February 19th, 2023 at 8:01 pm
Disagree SB~LV.
Noah Spence actually showed a lot before he got injured. And even showed stuff after his first injury… but the 2nd one did him in for good.
JTS has shown about 7 plays in 2 seasons… and he’s healthy.
February 19th, 2023 at 8:07 pm
JTS = Bust. Headless chicken. Apology to chickens.
February 19th, 2023 at 8:09 pm
Swing and a miss
February 19th, 2023 at 8:15 pm
Cut JTS, it is not about the dough, you got to have people with brains and fire. JTS has none. As a fan I’m disappointed was hoping for more and maybe it’s best for him too. Let him go!
February 19th, 2023 at 8:16 pm
Doubt we would be able to get much from him. Make him 4th string de.. he can develop in practice if he is gonna develop..if he ends up somehow being a good 3rd guy to rotate in so be itz but don’t count on jt
February 19th, 2023 at 8:24 pm
Maybe he can catch
TE
February 19th, 2023 at 8:24 pm
Ehhh I’ll give him to the end of this next season (barring an injury) before I slap a bust label on him. Has he been disappointing? Absolutely. It’s beyond me why we can’t find a good pass rush, but whatever. Hope that changes…
February 19th, 2023 at 8:26 pm
Another blown Jason pic
February 19th, 2023 at 9:02 pm
I really don’t understand some commenters labeling JTS a bust after 2 years. JTS only played TWO years of college ball (actually less than that) & here’s what his draft profile said …
February 19th, 2023 at 9:04 pm
Yeah maybe we need to watch his headless chicken act for another year before calling him a bust.
Right now he’s just a bust in the making.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:05 pm
‘Redshirt freshman in 2018, started 2 of 12 games played (20 tackles, 2 for loss, with 1 sack). Became a leader on defense the next year, with 41 tackles, 12.5 for loss, with 8 sacks in 13 games (12 starts). He didn’t play the 2020 season.’
February 19th, 2023 at 9:05 pm
IOW JTS really had ONE year of college ball as a starter before being drafted by the Bucs. He was green as could be. So what’s he done as a pro?
o 2021: 17 games (560 def snaps … 51.2% availability) … 27 Pressures (4 sacks, 6 QBKD, 17 Hurries), 5 TFLs, 3 PDs, 29 tackles (21 solo).
o 2022: 17 games (843 def snaps … 78.6% availability) … 22 Pressures (4 sacks, 9 QBKD, 8 Hurries), 6 TFLs, 2 PDs, 40 tackles (23 solo).
The rest of his draft bio added this …
‘He’s too obvious as a rusher and doesn’t have a myriad of go-to moves or counters when he’s facing off against a talented opponent. The key for Tryon will be learning to grease the edge and create angles of entry both inside and outside. He has high upside but could spend the first year or two as a rotational defender while adding more polish’.
Bottom line sounds like JTS was raw as could be when we drafted him, but still, if you look at his stats, I wouldn’t say that he’s been a bust. He stagnated his 2nd year it looks like, but so did a number of others on the Bucs’ defense. Good chance that he wasn’t anywhere near ready to become a starter, but got thrown into the fire anyways after JPP was not re-signed & yes after Shaq got hurt. Patience.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:21 pm
He flashed at times towards the end of the season, but to be honest he looks like a run of the mill fourth rounder who is trying to hang onto a roster spot.
The athleticism and speed are there in abundance, but he’s being held back by poor processing skills and being too much a one trick pony with the speed rush.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:21 pm
Whether he’s ready to make the next step or not, they need to target passrushers in the draft. Our D is in rough shape with all these free agents who we probably can’t afford to re-sign.
JTS shouldn’t be gifted the starting job. Make him compete with a rookie.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:23 pm
If he is bulking up for this season he might make a splash.
The NFL is a lot like bodybuilding, you have to have some weight behind you if you play on the line. JTS was still playing like a college guy, with a lack of upper body strength.
That lack left him a step or two away from making anything meaningful happen.
He will be here this year and the next because of his rookie contract, but right now I would put into the warm body roster role.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:27 pm
Bucs will give him more time to see if he develops.
Plus right now he is cheap.
He looks like a #2 rusher playing across from the #1 rusher.
He has all of the tangibles, maybe just needs better coaching
February 19th, 2023 at 9:31 pm
He needs 20 more pounds and better technique. He still gets pushed around.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:36 pm
With so many canceled college games, players at the bottom of draft were a crapshoot. They were trusting in Jimmy Lake’s recommendation, which had come through in the past. Players like JTS may need more time to develop. He’s cheap and he’s been healthy. He needs to earn his starting spot this year and play special teams.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:50 pm
Needs more to develop. Lol
Seriously, trade him, never had it never will.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:50 pm
Plan 9 From Outer Space is a bust. Nobody would give up a 5th round pick for him. Just cut him.
February 19th, 2023 at 9:55 pm
It is silly to just cut him. Let him cluck and suck, or maybe develop into a player almost as good as Gaines Adams or Noah Spence. As has been said, he’s cheap now and unless a bunch of newcomers come in and outplay him for a roster spot, he’ll be overrunning plays and getting blown out of gaps for the Bucs in 2023.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:04 pm
Trade Shaq Barrrett and JTS. Everyone is SO CERTAIN Bowles and the Bucs are 0-16 next season a week after the Super Bowl, what’s the point in keeping Shaq and not getting something very nice out of it.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:04 pm
I don’t see an option for the Bucs. Nelson is probably a cap casualty, and Barret may not return until mid-season. JT-S is just going to have to step up, or his next contract will be for less money…and another team.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:13 pm
SB~LV
Com on man, tightend, are u serious? Did u see the game against the Bengals when Joe Burrow was on the Bucs goal line in scoring position n he tossed a soft underhand pass right in JTS’s face for an easy int n potential score but instead JTS batted the ball down. He’s played losses n confused the past two seasons. JTS is not nfl material, he’s way outta his league. He’s a bust. He lacks the physical n mental aspect of the game. To no avail, our coaches have been wishing on a prayer for him since drafted. Watch his tapes, he plays like a confused kid. We waited too long for OJ Howard to bust out, which we failed to realize after year two, he was a bust. Let’s not do the same with JTS.I’ll take a 5th round for him, let’s move on.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:26 pm
The main problem with JTS is that he’s too finesse. Others will say he’s soft, and it shows up in the running game where he really struggled. In the passing game, he constantly wants to run around the tackle instead of using leverage and go “through” the tackle. Hopefully, Bowles sees and corrects this.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:29 pm
Ship him out. He needs to add mass/muscle. He gets manhandled.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:31 pm
Riddle me this: Nelson has less snaps and more production. Why isn’t Nelson playing more? This is poor coaching. JTS got more snaps because of where he was drafted vs. starting the better player who was was a later round pick.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:41 pm
Just another position like the QB position that would be nice to see the Bucs draft and develop. How many DE’s or OLB has the Bucs drafted and never turned into the needed beast. I really hope he takes it to the next level this coming year and becomes a much monster on the end. Had pretty good corner play last year, yet no pass rush.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:46 pm
Let’s be honest…which 1st round picks has Licht actually hit on? Evans, sure but any GM at that spot picking for the Bucs would have picked him. Literal no brainer. Vita Vea is a solid win. That’s it, right? He’s been here since the Lovie Smith disaster. The record speaks for itself and it is poor at best. Licht is why this team is not positioned better post Brady.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:50 pm
Wirfs was a 1st round pick.
February 19th, 2023 at 10:54 pm
JTS = NFG
February 19th, 2023 at 10:56 pm
Drafted a ton of whiffs. Try to draft a beast in the middle with Vea or a CB because I think if Jamel Dean resigns he will get the same type of overrated mistake money given to Carlton Davis.
February 19th, 2023 at 11:04 pm
While Light sometimes hits rounds 3-5ish his 1st and 2nd round picks haven’t impressed lately. He reaches often trying to look smart imo. Hall was 3rd round talent at best probably would have lasted until 4th. JTS was late 2nd rounder maybe early 3rd. Trask same thing 3rd to 4th rounder. At this point Kiper might be better at evaluating. Lmfao
February 19th, 2023 at 11:07 pm
He’s JAG
February 19th, 2023 at 11:15 pm
I think all the guys everyone is calling a bust deserve more time. Right now i don’t think JTS or Hall for that matter are strong enough to battle w the corresponding offensive linemen. I question JTS but Hall definitely deserves more time. And hearing Christenson and David speak out for trask, maybe there is potential there. I just get sick of all the Debbie downers on this site.
February 19th, 2023 at 11:29 pm
On a different note, I hadn’t paid any attention to the XFL, but was watching some highlights from games, and it looks pretty solid. Much much better crowds than they were getting in 2020 right before the virus hit, and the level of football looks quite good as well.
It’s a shame they killed the Vipers, I’d have actually gone out of my way to see some games this year based off what I see so far.
I hope they got paid up front by Disney, because if not, I could see them getting the quick yank if their ratings match their buzz.
February 19th, 2023 at 11:36 pm
Agree – you want to trade a guy after his 2nd year? What does that accomplish?
Let him play out his contract, see what happens. Unfortunately not every 1st rounder is immediately great.
February 19th, 2023 at 11:41 pm
Licht does have issues with overdrafting guys. With that said, it does sometimes work out.
For example, Cappa was ridiculously overdrafted. He had the physical profile of an UDFA, and was fringe on being picked at all, and Licht took him in the 3rd. He did nothing his rookie season, and in his 2nd season, in the preseason, he looked awful. Looked like a huge bust, then, suddenly, he was solid, a reliable NFL starter. It was a heck of a turn for someone who looked like a surefire bust. That’s a huge reason why people should wait and see on Luke, when it comes to offensive lineman, Licht, a former offensive lineman himself, knows what he’s doing.
JTS was overdrafted, was more of a late day-2 pick. After the Bucs took him, all I remember is watching his highlights and looking at his stats and wondering what in the world the Bucs saw … and then we heard it … did you see him with his shirt off? Hubba hubba. He still has time to figure it out, and he was a very developmental player coming out of college with limited snaps. He does have 8-career sacks already, so it’s not like he’s done absolutely nothing, but there’s no way you’d bail on him now since you wouldn’t get anything, and he’s still a lottery ticket, his future isn’t certain quite yet.
For Hall, it’s hard to say if he was overdrafted. The mock drafts and profiles were all over the place with him. He was going at the end of the first in some, and others where he’s in the 3rd. I think it has to do with his tape – it’s terrible, he’s beating up on really really low-level players, but his physicals skills are all there.
As I wrote above, both seem more like 4-3 DE’s, so that might play a role in whoever the next coach is and what scheme they run. For Bowles defense, my advice would be for JTS to slim down a bit and focus on speed, and for Hall to pack on the pounds and try to get to around 310 or so. Hall was listed at 283 at the combine, but doesn’t look that heavy, so I don’t know if he can put on that much weight or not, but if he’s only around 280, that’s really small for a 3-4 DE, but the perfect weight for a 4-3 DE.
February 20th, 2023 at 12:49 am
The Big Hair Boy Banders ( JTS & Hall ) are too “finesse” -lacking strength, “man” size and aggression ( unless rolling up Jensen in training camp). Perhaps they can be this generations fraud duo of Milli Vanilli. Joe calls certain QB’s “run around quarterbacks”. The boy banders are run around/tip toeing/disappearing dancers/prancers.
February 20th, 2023 at 1:01 am
Gholston took time to reach form. JTS might’ve been a reach but he could still become something
February 20th, 2023 at 1:12 am
westernbuc Says:
February 20th, 2023 at 1:01 am
Gholston took time to reach form.
—–
Fair point, but Gholston is/was a run stuffing DE, and a 3rd rounder. Big difference between that and two guys who are basically 1st rounders and considered pass rushers. However, as a point in your favor, pass rushers take longer than any other position to develop.
February 20th, 2023 at 1:25 am
There is definitely physical ability, I just don’t know how long it will take for the light to go on in regards to the mental side of the game. I think I would be pleased if he would learn to set the edge FFS! He might even benefit from a position change. MLB? Moneybacker?
February 20th, 2023 at 2:49 am
Give him to the Saints for free.
February 20th, 2023 at 3:10 am
Maybe where we go is taking another chance on drafting an edge rusher in the first or second round. The odds of hitting on a good one might turn in our favor finally if we try, try again. It certainly cannot hurt anything.
February 20th, 2023 at 4:30 am
WesternBuc … I agree. JTS has certain physical attributes that are noteworthy. I think he just needs to get stronger & play ‘under control’ better.
When I look at his stats from last year, he didn’t do all that terrible for a 2nd-year player. Got the 4 sacks (4th on the team behind Vea, White & Winfield) plus got 14 QB hits (only Devin White had more with 16).
It’s interesting is to look at the OTHER DE/OLBs who were drafted BEFORE JTS in 2021 (there were 5 others drafted before JTS). Roughly half of those performed better in 2022.
o Jaelan Phillips (Miami – #18 pick): 17 games (840 def snaps) – 7 sacks, 25 QB hits, 8 TFL.
o Kwity Paye (Indy – #21 pick): 12 games (546 def snaps) – 6 sacks, 10 QB hits, 10 TFL.
o Payton Turner (New Orleans – #28 pick): 8 games (171 def snaps) – 2 sacks, 3 QB hits, 5 TFL.
o Gregory Rousseau (Buffalo – #30 pick): 13 games (463 def sacks) – 8 sacks, 14 QB hits, 10 TFLs.
o Odafe Oweh (Baltimore – #31 pick): 17 games (634 def snaps) – 3 sacks, 11 QB hits, 7 TFLs.
o Joe Tryon-Shoyinka (Tampa – #32 pick): 17 games (843 def snaps) – 4 sacks, 14 QB hits, 6 TFL.
HOPEFULLY the light comes on in 2023 & JTS really kicks it into high gear. I doubt that the Bucs will use a 1st Rnd pick on another DE/OLB (more likely I think to draft a DT to pair with Vea or a CB to replace Dean if we can’t re-sign him). HOPE we draft a DE/OLB in the Top-3 Rnds though. Shaq may not recover to 100% & his contract is up after 2024 anyways (potential out after this year).
February 20th, 2023 at 6:51 am
Maybe just maybe it has something to do with Todd Bowles bad coaching job that still focuses on stopping the run on the way to the QB.
February 20th, 2023 at 7:12 am
JTS and Trask are both 2021 draftees – JTS first round, Trask second round.
JTS has practiced and played 2 full years with the first team.
Trask has never taken a single snap with the first team.
So much patience among the fanbase for JTS.
So much hostitlity among the fanbase for Trask.
Why is that? 🤔
February 20th, 2023 at 7:55 am
Doooshlarue- yes Wirfs, of course. I knew I was missing someone late last night and he was probably the best of them all along with Godwin. I give Licht a ton of credit for Wirfs and Godwin. That said, his drafts are terrible overall and why we don’t have the depth to contend now post Brady and all the expensive FAs.
The next lost decade is upon us.
February 20th, 2023 at 8:19 am
You might get an XFL third round pick for Jill.
February 20th, 2023 at 9:23 am
Excellent posts. You all summed up JTS very well.
Put up or shut up season Joe.
February 20th, 2023 at 10:55 am
Licht picked JTS with Landon Dickerson and Creed Humphrey on the board. smh