“That’s All Separate Money”
March 1st, 2020
Another end zone visit for Chris Godwin
Bucco Bruce Arians appeared to offer a glimpse into on how the Bucs will prioritize their own free agents.
It came during a side chat with Joe and other assembled media away from the bright lights of the NFL Scouting Combine podium last week.
Arians was asked about Chris Godwin and his desire to re-sign Godwin now even though he has a year remaining on his paltry rookie contract. Arians was firm; yes, he wants to get Godwin’s new deal done now.
A quick follow up question asked whether getting a Godwin deal done would affect the team’s approach or ability to re-sign Jason Pierre-Paul, Ndamukong Suh and the other beasts along the defensive front whose contracts are up, too.
Arians replied twice saying, “that’s all separate money.”
It was an intriguing answer because it strongly implies that the Bucs have separate buckets of cash allocated for their offense and defense.
In recent years, the Bucs have spent far more on their offense than on defense. But everything coming from One Buc Palace suggests that’s about to change. So if the offensive bucket shrinks a bit, and a fat contract for Godwin is a priority, then how much will be left at quarterback.
It’s just something else to consider as you obsess about the Bucs on this fine Sunday. Of course, Joe realizes everything tied to a team’s priorities is a very fluid situation.
March 1st, 2020 at 11:08 am
That speaks volumes!
March 1st, 2020 at 11:19 am
The Bucs will have more money if the let the interception king walk. Use that money to sign free agents and then get a decent QB in free agency. almost anyone would be better than Winston, the turn over machine. Winston is what he is. He hasn’t changed since college. He won’t change now!!
March 1st, 2020 at 11:23 am
Godwin > Winston
March 1st, 2020 at 11:33 am
I couldn’t be more aligned with how the Bucs are approaching this offseason.
JW is getting a heavy dose of accountability. He’s earned it.
Players who produced are getting affirmative comments and attention.
Shaq, Godwin, Suh…
It all has to fit, ability, production, cap space…
In BA I Trust!
March 1st, 2020 at 11:33 am
Sign all the defense, Godwin and then at the end of the day, when you are down to $2.59, offer it to Jameis. Let him see if his agent can get him more.
March 1st, 2020 at 11:39 am
Well said Larry! I don’t get all the Winston love? I was at the stadium draft party when we got Winston hoping he would be the answer. But after 5 years and over 100 turnovers I personally have seen enough. As far as a prove it year for me that was last year. Maybe he can backup Big Ben or something like that but I don’t see anyone paying him big money to be the starter.
March 1st, 2020 at 11:40 am
No Jameis PLEASE
March 1st, 2020 at 11:46 am
When BA says he can win with any quarterback sure sounds like he’s serious. Have to leave money for Godwin but seems they’ll likely franchise winston over JPP and I’d be fine with as long as we got one of the top 2 pass rushers in the draft.
March 1st, 2020 at 12:05 pm
D.R.
Or any other capologist here. I realize by the time we sign all we want it’s going to be very tight.
But I really like this “separate bucket” view. That is what I’ve been saying all along…if JW’s salary hits the cap it should all come from the “offensive bucket”.
So sign #12 and then dump Perriman and Brate’s salary and add that to what JW earned last year…and you have the cap money for JW. He has no leverage other than to sit it out…he’ll have to accept what the Bucs offer.
Sign all of our FA’s on defense!!! Then select a monster RT in the first round…
swapping a draft to move up a spot or so to get the tackle we want…then draft Edwards-Helaire from LSU at RB in the second…grab a QB in the 3rd…just in case JW lights it up in ’20 then wants too much money or in case he fails in ’20…we must have a plan for a potential life after JW even if we resign #3 for next year.
Hope the QB is the next coming of Russell Wilson…perhaps Jalen Hurts?
Then draft the big pounder from Boston to complement our two quick guys.
This team is not that far from the playoffs if we field the same D we had in the second half of last year and enough positive ratio of “good” JW versus “bad” JW.
Add the tackle and RB’s and work harder on the running game and we have balance.
March 1st, 2020 at 12:16 pm
If BA could win with any quarterback, couldn’t he win with Winston? Seems like sour grapes. BA is just as accountable as Winston for last year. It is his job to put the right players on the field in the right plays. If he doesn’t want to accept responsibility for repeatedly ignoring the running game and putting the ball in the hands of the “turnover king” than he is a terrible leader. Sounds like he is just in Tampa for the tax incentive and saving for retirement. After an off-season of bashing his qb that he raved about for 14 games he certainly does himself no favors of attracting quality free agents.
As for Tom Brady coming to Tampa, that is the ultimate white flag. The best organization in sports with a great o-line had to rely entirely on the defense last year with TB12 at the helm, in an offense he has spent nearly 2 decades running. To think TB12 will beat his paltry 60% completion rate from last year as a statue behind Tampa’s olé line is nuts. That would be a move to sell interest only, not wins. Not to mention costing at least the 30 million Jameis’ agent floated. That’s a first offer with an expectation of counter for Jameis, and just a number to generate interest from Brady. Signing a guy at 42 who has shown obvious signs of decline for 3 straight years for a boatload of cash is a sure recipe for another lost decade.
March 1st, 2020 at 12:22 pm
@Joe … “It was an intriguing answer because it strongly implies that the Bucs have separate buckets of cash allocated for their offense and defense.”
I agree with you Joe, it’s an ‘intriguing answer’ and I sure hope they actually do have separate pots for the offense and defense (and Special Teams which is already under contract for $4 mil for 2020). With the guys we need to re-sign on defense AND those currently under contract on defense, I just can’t see us allocating any less than $90-$92 mil to the DEFENSE (upper limit IF we add a veteran Safety in FA). And we’ll be lucky to get away that cheap.
Assuming that the salary Cap comes in at $200 mil, plus our rollover from 2018 ($10 mil), we’d have $210 mil in salary Cap to play with. That leaves roughly $115 mil for the Bucs’ offense PLUS whatever reserve Bucs opt to keep for ‘contingencies’ during the season (like injuries?). So reality is the Bucs’ OFFENSE will probably be allocated someplace between $105-$110 mil MAX.
I personally can’t see any way for us to make even that unless we cut Brate and don’t re-sign Perriman (assuming that we do transition tag Jameis plus draft a RT to replace Dotson & draft a RB to replace Barber, as well as draft a WR & TE to replace Perriman & Brate). That approach would put us between $105-$110 mil for the OFFENSIVE roster. And oh ya, forgot to mention … That’s without doing a new contract for Chris Godwin this year. THAT’S another smokescreen.
March 1st, 2020 at 12:24 pm
our new helmet will be white…a simple design of one tom brady’s smiling mug…on both sides of the helmet…
gizelle is in negotiations with brass to rename the team the tampa bay bradies…
she also suggested the “brandon bradies” sounds better too…
toms foundation banner at bray jay will be “the brady bunch”…
yes if tom signs ray jay will now be “bray jay”…
changes are a comin’ folks…
March 1st, 2020 at 12:24 pm
Perhaps it could mean they intend to trade Mike Evans? A tell?
March 1st, 2020 at 12:28 pm
Jameis hasn’t earned a big contract much less a small one. Jameis will be lucky to have a job. Probably should have cut him loose after the Uber fiasco. Who else throws 30 interceptions, 7 for pick 6? How is that even possible? How bad do you have to be to do that? Time to admit mistake and move on.
March 1st, 2020 at 12:32 pm
what if:
no one signs jameis and he’s out of the league next year…
wouldn’t that be some wild sheet…
March 1st, 2020 at 12:33 pm
Not to mention the fact that many of the completions were in spite of Jameis because of great receivers making hard catches. Rarely does Jameis ever put the ball on the money. He’s a joke and acts like a child. Go away please.
March 1st, 2020 at 12:50 pm
Separate money…….BA’s BS…….
There is really no such thing….it’s all the same pot……if your telling me that the amount for the offense & defense is a fixed amount…….BS….
March 1st, 2020 at 1:19 pm
Could the separate bucket be by free agent year rather than off/def?
March 1st, 2020 at 1:24 pm
Some of you ask why I post defending Jameis so much. Well it cause of idiotic comments like the below, which is a flat out lie. So next time you wonder why I get so fired up please remember this comment below and how ridiculous it is.
BigMacAttack Says:
March 1st, 2020 at 12:33 pm
Not to mention the fact that many of the completions were in spite of Jameis because of great receivers making hard catches. Rarely does Jameis ever put the ball on the money. He’s a joke and acts like a child. Go away please.
March 1st, 2020 at 1:24 pm
Yes Bobbo that is how I read it as well.
March 1st, 2020 at 1:33 pm
Vary intriguing scenario playing out this week Joe..
GM speaking in Indy this week spoke volumes regarding the future..
Braintrust @ 1 Buc Palace has assembled a roster of playmakers on both sides…
IMO this roster needs only a QB ~ Tackle on Offense & keep the D intact…
GM has improved,did not agree in 2015,felt L.Williams was way to go…
Liked the K selection in round #2,took large cajones to invite the Heat..
2007 Boston Patriots presented TB#12 with a First Class WR named Moss..
#81 only caught 23 TD’s & helped them to 18-0 record going in to SB..
Thank You BB for such a large EGO & not resigning R. Moss…
Do any of you really think with the WR’s here TB#12 does not throw 60 TD’s????
March 1st, 2020 at 1:47 pm
They using that separate “jaboo money”….
Ndog, what are you gonna do when JW#3 is gone from Tampa? I hope you go pester that teams boards.
March 1st, 2020 at 1:49 pm
TBBF
Yeah, I agree 100%. If Brady became receptive and available for the Buc’s bucks would come from any bucket within arms length.
March 1st, 2020 at 1:49 pm
If BA could win with any quarterback, couldn’t he win with Winston? Seems like sour grapes. BA is just as accountable as Winston for last year.
——–
The hell? Miami dolphins and New York jets have the worst o lines in the league not the bucs, one team threw 18 picks between 2 QBs the other threw 16 total. How the hell is the coach accountable for winston doing what hes done for his entire 5 year career. You nut hugging fans kill me thinking we cant win without winston.
March 1st, 2020 at 2:04 pm
Mr. 5,000 > any BUC
March 1st, 2020 at 2:08 pm
Next year a new QB in Bruce system = a lot of INT. So having someone else instead of jameis =INT. So why move on from jameis= int
New qb = learn system
New QB= learn /play with wr
Possibly Arians will go with Blaine gabbert. For next year. And make all you folks wishes come true and throw all money to dline.
Rivers. Indy
Teddy. Chargers
Tannehill. Titans
Mariota. Bears
Brady. Patriots.
Cam Panthers
March 1st, 2020 at 2:18 pm
I agree with BA that we need to extend CG12.
Chris probably wants to get married, buy a house and start a family.
Offer him $5M for 2020, $10M for 2021, $15M for 2022 and $20 M for 2023.
He and his agent will come back and say if they guarantee the money, it’s a deal.
Win, win!
March 1st, 2020 at 2:19 pm
St Pete. If you move up to get your RT you are going to have to give up either your 2nd or 3rd to do that.
March 1st, 2020 at 2:21 pm
Actually we need two QB’s . Its also rumored that BA loves Gabbert and wants to bring him back. Better take some dollars out of that there bucket for a quality backup also,IMO. Especially if some of our frequent posters are correct and they bring Jameis back.
March 1st, 2020 at 2:47 pm
“If you move up to get your RT you are going to have to give up either your 2nd or 3rd to do that.”
I disagree. There are 6 monster OT’s in the draft. If the Bucs trade #14 back with Philly for their #21 and #53, the Bucs will still be able to grab that OT (Jones Houston), a top dog RB (Akers FSU) and a pass rusher like Gross Matos in the first two rounds.
March 1st, 2020 at 3:05 pm
I suspect many teams are waiting for the approval of the CBA.
I understand the revenue split goes up several %, and that has a significant cap effect upward.
If the CBA is approved and the cap for 2020 jumps up, maybe the entire D can be kept together.
I suspect this is why you’ve heard almost nothing about teams extending their own FA’s.
Nobody wants to jump the gun without a clear understanding of where they are against the cap.
Patience, grasshoppers…
March 1st, 2020 at 3:16 pm
The pots of money actually usually divided and subdivided five to six times, if not more. First there is the big pot of money. Then you have the “must have” group. Players you must keep. Next there is the
won’t have” group…often older or non-performing players, only some of whom may be overpaid. That goes right back into the big pot, so that pot is constantly emptied. They know who are they are already for the most part. So the “must haves” get divided into “under contract” and “not under contract.” You divide the “must have not under contract” group into two pots…”do now or lose” or “do later.” The most important category believe it or not, are those you “must have” who are under contract…that is the bulk of players but you must keep them, don’t need to work new deals (yet) and they are considered a fixed cost. They are the highest priority. The NEXT highest priority are those who are must have, contract needed. Two pots here: If you are not sure if you want to keep them for mulitple years, but they are top tier players you must keep, you put them in a bucket (their possible cost) as “tag” candidates. Then there are those you must have but know you want long term. The point here is either way, Barrett is in one of these two buckets. It doesn’t really matter if he is the ONLY tag candidate or not, because he is staying. The question is if the Bucs have Jameis in either of these buckets. If there is no CBA, they will only have the franchise tag, not a transition tag. My point here is they probably have enough to sign Shaq Barrett with our without any tag, and he is coming back. If they tag him, that opens up some future money for a Godwin contract now. But they don’t have to rely on that. Is JPP in one of these buckets so far?Next there is the “nice to have” bucket. Suh, Nassib, Perriman…maybe JPP is in here (but I think he is a must have). There is a “set aside” bucket next for draft picks and some money for contingency FA hires. If this pot gets low, you can talk about restructuring the nice to have or must have pot of people contracts, but you want to avoid it. Next is what is left. These are might haves.
It is not based on people as much as positions. And here is where you likely find Winston, Howard, Jones, etc. Positions you want to upgrade, positions that cost a lot, or both. QB has the sticker for “both” on it. Most of the other positions have guys in their rookie contracts. If they are are performing to a minimal standard AND the GM and HC sees promise/development, they stay…they are cheaper because of their rookie deals. So there is likely about $20-45M left for all the might have players. And the QB position is the priority in this category but only when a candidate to fill it fits within the left and right limits. If a guy like Brady came along (don’t think so), he would immediately go into the must have earlier category and things would ripple through. Are there FA QBs out there, including Winston, who can be paid from this last pot? Probably, including Winston himself. And this is why Winston is probably out of luck. And this is why if guy like Birdgewater can be had, he not only takes the amount of “might have” money planned for the QB but also siphons off some from other categories as he gets placed into the “must have” category. And again, the ripple effect starts. Does this mean the Bucs don’t value the QB position. Not at all. It just means until there is a candidate worth putting into the must have category they will not overpay. Again, here is where Winston gets less. This is where he may find himself wishing he had not have balked at the tag. If Winston is on the roster, he will be there at somewhere less than $24M, and probably less than $20M. That is why we heard Dominik say he’s not tag him, and would not pay him ore than he’s paid now. Winston is still riding the coattails of being drafted first overall…that is what got him to $21M. But he has not lived up to that even. So guess what? All that said, it is why Arians talks about different pots of money. The pots are not divided by offense and defense…get that out of your head. Godwin is in the must have while Winston is in a might have. Winston has not earned more money…period, and he should consider himself lucky he got his fifth year at the price he did. Again, that only came based off of who he waa in the draft, not what he’s done in the NFL.
March 1st, 2020 at 3:44 pm
Yeah, trading up when there are a ton of good tackles in this draft would be idiotic. I agree with Ghost, trading back is a solid option if they can find a partner
March 1st, 2020 at 3:46 pm
So far so good this offseason. It would be nice whoever the QB is if the Bucs had an Oline of massive, road-grader-type maulers. Every team that went deep into the playoffs had that type of offense. If the Bucs do that, then, the season will be amazing.
March 1st, 2020 at 4:04 pm
Adrnagy, in your scenario Dalton needs a home and would end up here.
I used to think all the QB noise was just noise and Bruce “I love Jameis” Arians was yanking our chain. After all the trash talk at the Combine I now believe BA has seen enough of JW and feels he needs to wander out of town to better appreciate what the rest of the league thinks of his stat sheet. The tone of some of the comments (we know what we’re going to do at QB but Jameis doesn’t) were surprisingly caustic.
March 1st, 2020 at 4:21 pm
Damn Im drunk again….so got to give my 2 cents l.o.l . Jameis (I think) wants to be here, we all want him to be the best, no?? I think we need to give him another year(maybe not a whole year… three or four games maybe?) sign him to franchise tag.to get this thing either right or wronged.. I definitely think we need to draft another QB, and keep the pressure on Jameis, if he cant take pressure? then he isnt worth keeping anyways.we need a quarterback that when the going gets rough/tough, he comes through… lets all of us hope that he can be the Q.B we need to lead us to future championships. all this crap we talk about on websites mean nothing really.. we know nothing…..(just opinions some right, most wrong, we are just Fans) listen,Im a Big fan of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers…. not the players. ( although I do have my favorites) if he messes up in the early going,,, bench him and start whoever is on the bench. I hope everything works out for the best what ever is decided.I hope we have our Q.B on the roster already ( Winston), but if not, I hope we draft one that will lead the team to a better future. GO BUCS
March 1st, 2020 at 4:54 pm
We really gotta be careful what we do with all this money. As well as Godwin, LVD is FA in 2021. If we have the opportunity to get Kinlaw I wouldn’t have a problem dropping JPP and/or Suh and his fat deal. LVD is a leader on and off the field and will still be jetting across to crack skulls till he is at least 35. I just don’t feel the same about JPP or Suh.
March 1st, 2020 at 7:10 pm
My question is, do the Glazers really think that Buc fans want to see Jameis back. Will he sell tickets? The last 3 years the seats get redder and redder, plastic that is, not new Winston jerseys on the backs of kids.
My expectation is JW is a consolation QB. I think the film on him staring down receivers and that extra millisecond it takes for him to make the read has made him the quarterback most good DB’s want to see. He will put it up for grabs.
The smart money is on getting a veteran who wants to “prove it” like Barrett and Perriman did, at a discount instead of overpaying Winston.
March 1st, 2020 at 9:17 pm
I remember when Gruden thought he could win with any QB because of his offensive genius. It was a failed experiment by an overarching coach
March 1st, 2020 at 10:26 pm
Does Foles fit the Bucs system? The knock on the guy is he excels ONLY in a narrow format, and JAX seems they want to stick with the cheap rookie. Foles has a 4 year, $88 mil contract, but I bet a deal could easily be made
March 1st, 2020 at 11:59 pm
Ndoggie, you take this way too seriously. Get a life bro.
March 2nd, 2020 at 11:58 am
Blaine Gabbert FTW