“I’m Moving On From Jameis Winston”
November 28th, 2019
Jameis Winston got a not-so-nice Thanksgiving present on national radio yesterday evening from a former NFL quarterback who has done his homework on the Bucs.
The hosts of arguably the greatest football show in the land, Movin’ The Chains on SiriusXM NFL Radio, told the world that America’s Quarterback should be a former Buccaneer in just a handful of weeks.
Jim Miller, the ex-QB who bounced around the NFL for 10 years and won a Super Bowl as Tom Brady’s backup, joined forces with ex-Bucs scout and Jets assistant coach/personnel chief Pat Kirwan to say Jameis is a poor starting quarterback that will/should move into the realm of QBs competing for a starting job or serving as backups.
“I’m moving on from Jameis Winston,” said Miller, who was on the fence about Jameis earlier this month. “I don’t think you can win with the amount of turnovers.”
Turnovers and past off-field issues cost Jameis playing time, so Jameis has been his own worst enemy, Miller said.
“But it really is just about the turnovers for me. Yeah, he puts up big numbers, 300 yards every single week; we get it from that standpoint. A lot of it is because they’re playing from behind. He has tremendous weapons to throw to. You take those weapons away, I wonder what his numbers would truly look like,” Miller continued.
Kirwan wondered aloud what Ryan Tannehill would look like if he had Mike Evans, Chris Godwin and friends to throw to.
Perhaps the Bucs would be smart to offer Jameis a take-it-or-leave-it contract for $10 million in 2020,” Kirwan said, adding that maybe Jameis’ agent would think Jameis’ best shot in the NFL is to stay alongside Bruce Arians one more year while Tampa Bay drafts and develops a quarterback.
For those who don’t listen to Miller and Kirwan, they are not anti-Bucs. They were at One Buc Palace during training camp, and they are fans of Arians and extremely well connected in league circles. So Joe finds it interesting that both are ready to launch Jameis and see him as a starter incapable of winning.
Derrick Brooks Talks “Designed Four-Man Rushes,” Matchup Zone, Evaluating Devin White & More. It’s an all-new TAMPA TWO! Presented by Caldeco Air Conditioning & Heating. Another production from The Identity Tampa Bay and Joe. Enjoy!!
November 28th, 2019 at 7:32 am
I’m surprised it took 5 years for them to come to this conclusion.
November 28th, 2019 at 7:34 am
5 years, no improvement, he wont get better….and he put this team through enough bullsh*t with the off the field stuff…Unload the bank to him? I don’t think so…….GOOD RIDDANCE!!!!!
November 28th, 2019 at 7:46 am
Racist coming out of the closet …some would cry
November 28th, 2019 at 7:49 am
But of his 100 turnovers, only 20% are actually winstons fault, so I’ve been told. Wrong/poorly ran routes by the wr’s, no run game, offensive line issues, early snaps, Bucs secondary, no pass rush, poor play calling, refs, Erica Kinsman, Uber, ball boy/water boy… ALL excuses I’ve heard. Am I forgetting any?
November 28th, 2019 at 7:50 am
I agree with everything they said. But I also believe they should offer jameis a one year deal. 12 mil tops. If he won’t take it then let him walk.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:02 am
I’d move on too. What good is a quarterback that WILDLY swings back and forth between genius and idiocy? The trust is gone. Its just gone. Even when “Good Jameis” shows up and is tearin’ it up, I know that some boneheaded play and/or complete unraveling is right around the corner. How do you win when you don’t know which Jameis will show up each week?!? I’d take a CONSISTENTLY mediocre quarterback over our Jekyll and Hyde. Cut ’em loose and rebuild.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:03 am
I was so torn on this decision but the facts are what they are
Dan Marino threw 21 or more Int’s in a season 4 out of his first 8 years in the league -Marino had the Killer B’s defense, Don Shula and multiple quality RB’s, Marks Brothers were their version of ME13 and CG12
Brett Farve threw more than 21 picks 8 times in his career, his highest year was 29!!!!! Farve had Mike Holmgren and Reggie White on his side
JW – with BA’s new offense being installed, he has thrown more picks than any of his prior seasons…….and on pace for more yards, and for most TD’s and has two 1200+ yd receivers with a very average running game..
His head coaches prior, Lovie and Dirk….any semblance of Shula in either of those two?
His D support? two words – Gerald McCoy
Unless he implodes in the last 5 games, you almost have to tag him for a year, draft a 2/3rd guy and give him and the ENTIRE offense a chance to get clicking at full capacity -we are such a win now society, we forget this is an 11 person a side team game
The guy makes throws very, very few can – makes mistakes no one should
Penny wise, pound foolish?
Do you throw that talent away at 25 years old and watch a savvy veteran coach turn this guy into a Rich Gannon type revival while Justin Herbert goes 5-11 here as his replacement?
I think they believe BA is that savvy veteran coach that can turn JW into a super bowl caliber QB
A few more wins to end the season, 7-9 doesn’t look impossible and is right where most thought we would be this year
Probably a 2 game improvement over back to back 5-11 with D gelling, finally
and Remember we are 5-6 right now but for one missed, easy FG….
How do you just cut bait?
November 28th, 2019 at 8:05 am
I’ll support the Bucs deciding to move on from Winston, but not right now. Those that have always wanted him gone are all about it but is that really the hole we need to fill on the roster right now? New qb is goin to have a rough time back there too. Go use this draft to build the trenches. Look long term at building a stellar oline so we can block and run consistently. Jameis has been a leading rusher at times and that shows what’s wrong. Build that defensive line, get someone who you hope to stay for long term then get some secondary help. Build those trenches. Don’t slam our head against a wall thinking a qb outta college will fix things.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:09 am
If his numbers were 22 TD’s, with 5 INT’s, instead of twenty he’d be worth keeping. Those 15 extra picks no doubt are a reason we have a losing record. That jump pass to Dare that was picked, those are the type of things he can’t seem to stop doing. You’ll never win consistently with a QB who turns the ball over that much. Five more games to go. If he can’t show he can protect the ball down the stretch, he never will. It would be time to move on.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:17 am
Who the hell cares what he would do he doesnt work for the bucs. He loses all credibility anyway wondering about Ryan Tannehill in this offense. Winston will be franchised. People keep talking about the last 5 years but dont realize everyone including the head coach only cares about one and it’s this year. Draft a quarterback but fix you’re team first. No one really cares that you all are angry about turnovers you aren’t the deciding factor neither is Jim Miller or pat kirwan so wasting time being angry. If you don’t like Winston I suggest rooting for the jags you’ll be even more upset when you realize they ain’t letting this guy go
November 28th, 2019 at 8:21 am
It just comes down to wanting to win or wanting to get paid. No matter what his choice is, he’s already set for life. Money for him isn’t really an issue at this point. Demanding top dollar with his turnover problem isn’t gonna fly either.
A team friendly deal means he wants to win, giving the team money to invest elsewhere. The ball is really in his court.
And don’t expect to see this team tanking for a higher pick. That’s not happening either during this critical stage for BA, BL, and JW.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:25 am
The team seems to be jelling.No excuses Jameis.JUST WIN MY MAN AND YOU GET A ONE YEAR 15 MIL PROVE IT CONTRACT.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:26 am
Jameis’ M.O. is to play well the last 4 or 5 games, just enough to keep him hanging around. And it’s the worst thing that can happen to the Bucs.
Licht and BA are gonna have to grow a set….
November 28th, 2019 at 8:26 am
The turnovers give me cold feet too.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:28 am
12 mil is about right. Put the pieces in place in the trenches.
Win the division next year and maybe he can have his face on the stadium again and get another nice contract. Or the pieces are in place for a different QB, whether vet or rookie.
It would also be nice to see what we have in our backup who has yet to throw a pass. Imagine making the playoffs after JW gets injured and having your backup throw his first pass in a playoff game. Nightmare sht right there.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:28 am
An overall #1 pick shouldn’t be getting a “prove it “ deal in YEAR SIX.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:30 am
“A lot of it because they are playing from behind.”
Miller bringing up the famous garbage time stats.
If the NFL gave an award for like ‘the garbage time MVP,’ America’s QB would get lots of votes.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:31 am
Agree w you jmarkbuc!
If it hasn’t happened in five long years then cut bait.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:33 am
Garbage time stats is a legit point. No entirely on the QB as to why we are in garbage time, but the turnovers. Oh the turnovers. Can’t win with that many. And Jim Miller say some it best “they are too many to overcome”.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:35 am
“Because they are playing from behind” is a bad take. In the past you could probably say that but not this year. The guy is in nfl elite in yards per pass attempt.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:35 am
Yep let’s cut him, every QB can stand in the pocket holding the ball for 3 seconds waiting for the LONG routes to develop, stare down the gunbarrel knowing they are going to get blasted and throw a seed for a 71 yard TD strike, or avoid pressure and make a 20 yard run on 3rd and 10, or on 2nd and 21 throw a perfect seam route down to the 1 yard line. That’s right there are a ton of guys out there that can do that. For example just watch today I’m sure we will at least 6 of them in today’s games.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:37 am
Dog, I’ll take all of that from him, if he can sprinkle in a bit of game manager.
Even game managers get their chance to to light it up.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:39 am
And people can make fun of JW when he runs, but they guy has made some great plays with his feet. There’s a lot of good and a lot of bad.
More good and less bad, please.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:40 am
I love it when people are realistic.
Jamies
Winston
Sucks
November 28th, 2019 at 8:42 am
Since every game we have played has pretty much came down to the last possession how exactly is that “garbage” stats? In fact if you want to talk about garbage stats how about the only games we did get beat handly in is where quite a few of his TOs came from (Carolina and Saints). But I guess we are just going to spin things the way we want for the narrative. Jim Miller was a hack player and is actually worse at his current job. And yes I thought this for a very long time and Kiwan is about as clueless as they come. But yeah man cutting him now we be such a Bucs thing to do as it looks like we might have a decent defense for the first time in his career and just when that happens let’s blow up the offense. Yep sounds about right to me.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:46 am
I have an idea how about everyone else does their job THEN let’s evaluate the QB. How about some good routes, how about some good blocking, how about a good gameplan, how about a decent defense, how about a good job kicking performance!
No matter who the QB is I am so sick of this fanbase holding the QB to the standard of perfection yet EVERYONE else around them can just crap themselves and it’s like well he threw a pick and we can’t win with that. Meanwhile he got hit 13 times, we ran for 20 yards, the defense gave up 30 points and the kicker missed two kicks. But yep it’s the QB people get a CLUE!!!
November 28th, 2019 at 8:47 am
The sports commentary world is built on saying controversial things. If you don’t agree with the statement, that’s life. If everything they said was boring and didn’t warrant clicks, they’d be out of a job.
Same as JBF. You can clearly see differing statements by the Joes that generate clicks.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:50 am
Jameis Winston, threw for over 300 yards this past Sunday, he not was playing from behind. What a stupid statement to make, ” If you take away does receiver wonder what his numbers would look like.” Wonder what Winston’ numbers would look like if he had the Cowboy’s offense line and Zeek in the backfield. What if Winston, had one head coach and offense coordinator the past five years, what would he look like. If Winston move on and have success the same writer would be writing what a dumb move to let Winston leave. Do not bad mouth our Quarterback, jerk.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:53 am
Picks thrown on the first pass of the game cannot be pinned on the defense buddy. First two possessions against the Saints and the Falcons, if I remember correct, the defense held for field goals. How many stops do you think a defense can get when they are on the sidelines for two plays, then thrown back on the field in the red zone and told to get us another stop?
If you want to spread the blame around equally, that’s fine. But to say we hold what is supposed to be our franchise QB to a higher standard is wrong- well then by that measure pay him like he’s a journeyman safety.
No money mo problems. You want the money? Then you get the blame.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:54 am
He may have moved on but the not the Bucs. Ever consider that Evans and Godwin might look like Moe and Curly with another QB? As many mistakes as JW makes he also made them what they are. The Bucs will give another year to JW and BA. But they will also take a QB in 4th or 5th round too. Just watch.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:54 am
Ed, it’s just the popular thing to say. By the time this kid is 30, his numbers, hopefully with another team, will be unbelievable. He’ll be one of the best for years to come.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:56 am
Pay the fool 100 million for 5 years and lets all hope he will become Jim Plunkett one day…
I just don’t care anymore. The Glazer babies deserve to lose that money.
25-40 and 100 turnovers since 2015
1 million per turnover. Good deal.
November 28th, 2019 at 8:58 am
@Don,
very well said. I agree completely. JW, although his own worst enemy, has been at a disadvantage the entire time he has been a Buc. In ’88 & ’89 when marino threw a combined 45 picks, the Dolphins D was 5th and 7th worst D in the league. Sound familiar? (we wish our D was that good, lol)
November 28th, 2019 at 9:01 am
This isn’t the Brett Favre era or the Dan Marino era.
ALL of the winning teams’ QB’s this year DON’T turn it over! That’s the way winning football is played today. Offenses are too good and the rules favor offense, so teams have to limit opponents’ offensive possessions .
Turnovers give the opponent more possessions.
Let’s see how Jameis finishes up the season….
November 28th, 2019 at 9:02 am
Haha. Evans and Godwin – morning and curly.
Yeah sure buddy. You know that those guys made it to the NFL having never played a snap with Winston right?
What’s next? Big Ben made AB what he is? Julio would have been mediocre without Ryan? Just an asanine take.
Evans and Godwin would put up those numbers anywhere. And with 10 less pick, they’d most likely be at 1200 each with 2 more TDS each.
Rethink that whole statement you made buddy. Not your best
November 28th, 2019 at 9:04 am
Winston went 9-7 with much worse weapons when we had an average competitive defense
Defense >>> Skill players for winning football
November 28th, 2019 at 9:06 am
This is about the stupidest take I have read in along time and clearly someone who doesn’t watch Bucs game. And I get to say this again (although we will have to stop using this comparison next year) that Peyton Manning three 100 interceptions his 1st 5 years. That is 100 turnovers that do not include his fumble. This is not about comparing the 2 as much as it is applying Jim Miller logic because manning also had lots of yards and tds too but with miller’s logic the colts should move on.
On here we go another tv/radio guy who doesn’t pay attention to tampa bringing up Jameis recent issues. Aren’t we about to approach 4 years since whatever (nobody knows) happened in Vegas. Does Jim Miller bring up big bens past when he slobbers over him going into the hall of fame.
Turnovers… please …. if anyone thinks the Bucs are going to move on from the Qb who is #2 in yards and #3 in Td while getting sacked and hit the most they are crazy- Jameis deal with Bucs is going to be about money like anything else. And it makes sense to get it done before the new cba and the cap explodes
I am tired of this bull about people thinking Jameis is killing his receiver. Mike Evans if he gets 1,000 yards next year will stand alone! Only one in history! Ever to do it! He will also be in the top 5 for most yards in his 1st 7 years in the history of the nfl. Chris Godwin was a 3rd (THIRD) round pick that was literally only talked about by joebucsfan well before draft panning for Bucs to get. Now he has exploded as a elite receiver. The Bucs just don’t have 2 wide receivers, they have the 2 most dominate duo in the nfl in a long time. That doesn’t happen with Jameis and the list of quarterbacks playing in the league who wouldn’t produce those is way longer then the ones who could produce to this level with those receivers
Oh, and Jim Miller. The Bucs have not been behind by large amounts and getting fake yards and tds at the end
November 28th, 2019 at 9:09 am
If the bucs have Jameis return they are not going to draft a QB BS says he don’t want Jameis looking over his shoulder. Thats about the stupiest logic I have ever heard. Hes not looking over his shoulder this year and is throwing more ints than ever. Great logic BS.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:16 am
10 or 12 mil. and draft a QB high. I can see that. If the light goes on for Jameis, you trade the other QB. And if not, his replacement is in the wings. Frankly, it is the only thing that makes sense, unless you really believe the only answer is to cut bait.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:16 am
The pick six to Sherman was not a throw where JWwas under duress. Every interception didn’t come because of pressure. They were just bad throws. Bad decisions. A franchise QB would know that.
I don’t blame every interception on JW. This is the NFL with the greatest athletes in the world. And that includes the players people call garbage.
So perfection is not expected. But to expect the rest of the team to to remain positive after giving their all, only to be once again put in a no win situation drive after drive, what should we expect?
And then turn around and break the bank and the cap, for that?
November 28th, 2019 at 9:25 am
In my circles the discussion came up of what does a good backup QB make; what would a team be willing to pay Tannehill, Winston, Mariota, and RGIII. The number was between $8-10M. We use the litmus test that a backp QB should have at least a few years of experience of starting in the NFL, and be able to win half of the games (or more). That is where Winston is. He is halfway between starter and serviceable backup. And it was agreed his off-field issues will keep him from ever being a fan idle and face of the franchise. I like Kirwin’s idea of $10M take it or leave it. But I also like drafting another QB with that and making the offer to Winston just $9M. In fact, maybe the Bucs will do just that.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:35 am
Long overdue time to move on.
Happy Thanksgiving to all and to all a good night.
Peace, out
November 28th, 2019 at 9:36 am
I start with a question. What team in the NFL is ready to pay him $27M-$38M to be there starting QB? Ans: No one. Who would like to have him as their backup QB? Many, many. Backup pay: $1M to $12M, give or take.
One thing that so many people miss, is the fact there is such a wide range of fans who want to keep him, and who want to cut him. Think about that for minute. Then remember this is his fifth year and he is still hot and cold. We know what we have…period. It’s not good enough. Period. Those who want to keep him again say he may get better….
That is not realistic. This is what we were saying going into year 3. Now we are going into year 6.
Add to it that I just pointed out teams don’t want him as their starting QB. Add another one: He’s not selling tickets here. He’s divided the fan base—which is worse than not selling tickets.
He gets a cross being starter and backup money, or he can go elsewhere. But he won’t be anyone’s “starting” QB. He’d be very enticed by $9-10M and a chance to compete with who they draft or bring in.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:38 am
The ONLY way I’m ok with keeping JayMiss one more year is if we draft a QB in the early rounds.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:39 am
In my circles we considered what Winston would look like if he did not have Evans and Godwin. And we agree it was mistake to let “check-down plus” Humphries go because he also made Winston than he really is. Had Evans and Godwin not been there to haul them in this year–that is, had Winston had average receivers, his INTs would be about 25% higher.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:41 am
Good luck to our “next” QB with that defense.
Saw a stat that said the Bucs are 3rd is MOST points scored. 3rd!
But keep telling me that Jameis is the problem.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:47 am
We’d be 6-5 right now I’d not for a missed chipshot field goal and a botched call against the titans that wiped a scoop and score off the board.
That’s with the 31st ranked scoring defense in the league.
Getting rid of a QB who is 2nd in the league in passing yards and 3rd in touchdowns thrown who is 25 years old, would be asinine.
Carson Palmer threw 24 TDs and 22 picks his first year in Arians scheme. And he didnt have the added variable of playing under Byron Leftwich in his first year as a full time playcaller.
Jameis should and will be the starting QB for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers in 2020.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:47 am
If* really phone?
November 28th, 2019 at 9:49 am
Miller and Kirwin are both 100% correct
November 28th, 2019 at 9:50 am
AwShbucs let the losing continue. HAHAHA.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:52 am
If they let Jameis go he’s not getting 25 million plus anywhere
Most teams have a QB better than him, a recent highly drafted QB or will be looking to draft a qb who would be cheaper than 100 turnovers and counting Jameis
Bucs should offer 2 years 15-17 million a year, 1 year guaranteed
He hasn’t earned more
November 28th, 2019 at 9:59 am
$5 million one year take it or leave it. Sign Bridgewater or Dalton and let the starting position competition begin.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:59 am
LOTS of good arguments, pro AND con, for keeping or not keeping Jameis. When I watched Jameis in the London game against the Panthers (6 turnovers), I was ready to move to Ryan Griffen, the faster the better … that type of performance was inexcusable. When I watched him this past Sunday against the Falcons, I saw a QB worth re-signing … at the right price of course.
And THAT’S the problem with Jameis IMO. You never know which Jameis is gonna show up for any given game. He can be elite one moment, and in the next he can drive you bonkers with his deer-in-the-headlights antics. Bucs have spent a veritable fortune to surround him with decent offensive players. We’re getting the offensive production in terms of yards & now points, but the turnovers are game killers.
At what point do we fish or cut bait? Don’t forget, Jameis is making $21 mil right now, and a franchise tag would cost $27 mil or so. Offering him a 1-year, low-cost contract may sound optimal, but as soon as we put that offer on the table, as many as 31 other teams will start chomping at the bit. Offer Jameis $12 mil like several proposed and it wouldn’t take but a few minutes I bet for HCs like Chucky & others to offer him $15 mil and upwards, just for the opportunity to see if they can FIX JAMEIS. And of course there’s always the “What does Jameis want to do?” question that still needs to be answered (Jameis may have already decided it’s best to move on from Tampa Bay).
In the end, i still believe that the Bucs’ approach will come down to money. It’s humorous when some say “Oh but we’ve got the 3rd most salary Cap space next year; we’re good”. Not so fast; we’ve got major problems. Several of our high dollar players (like Jameis, JPP, Suh?) are FAs and aren’t included in our Cap space. Several others (like Barrett & Nassib?) aren’t making very much this year & will cost a bunch more to re-sign. Several positions desperately need to be upgraded as we all know, and that’s big bucks for quality performers. And of course there’s always the issue of insufficient DEPTH (which costs money too?).
To pay any one player, given our current circumstances, $27-$30 mil would almost certainly condemn us to another non-playoff season. It’s all about TEAM-BUILDING and spending huge amounts of money on just a handful of players doesn’t look like a winning TEAM-BUILDING strategy to me.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:02 am
Lord corn. Great point. Also some of those guys comments are not correct. Most people even analyst who haven’t played the game don’t know about the game. Why is it wen Winston plays great our defense still loses the game. Sorry Winston haters it’s bin like that for 5 years he’s never played with close to average defense. Yes his turnovers are a problem but wen we have to pass 50 plus times a game an put up more than 30 pts cuz our defense won’t go close to the offense like they have a plague is not winstons fault if anything the dude is trying to be Superman an win every play because of our garbage defense
November 28th, 2019 at 10:03 am
I don’t see him winning a must win game either. Or leading a last minute drive to win a playoff game.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:07 am
D.R you hit the nail on the head. TEAM BUILDING. it’s a TEAM sport every area of the team needs to play better an play consistent wen the whole team plays good disciplined football we win games even with a bad defense. We need more consistent an better blocking , pass rush , pass coverage , kicking an lass turnovers
November 28th, 2019 at 10:09 am
Jim Miller a has been.
Everybody is on it.
2nd in the league in yards, lot of games playing from behind
3 coaches in 5 yrs, terrible defense
Who can replace him.What is the plan?
I don’t see anyone in the draft class that can
BTW LSU kid damaged goods old tweets took care of that.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:11 am
How many years does any Player have to show how good he is? 1, 2 at most?
Winston has shown who he is & what he brings to the game for 5 years. While many fans like Winston, he is “not” a starting Quarterback. Just how many years does Winston get to show what he has shown for 5 years? Are the Buc fans so used to losing that they just fall in love with their favorite loser? Winston seems like a nice guy. But the NFL is a business. And no business would keep anyone that is “good” at less than 50% of their work product. It is time to move on from the Winston Saga.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:20 am
With all the hoopla around Winston’s turnovers this team is two plays away from 6-5 and that is with a bad defense and a below average running game and an OC who isn’t really setting the world on fire calling pass play after pass play.
Missed FG vs Giants
Special teams TD nullified by a quick whistle vs Titans
Another is because the Bucs defense couldn’t keep the Seahawks out of the end zone in OT.
They should sign Winston to a 3 year team friendly but a legit offer.
Scoring 27+ points a game is a good thing.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:25 am
Don’t forget the 4 pick sixes, and 24 turnovers from the QB that left the D with a short field.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:29 am
5 seasons that’s all I have to say. This was supposed to be his make it or break it year well he broke it send him packing
November 28th, 2019 at 10:32 am
Jim Miller, the ex-QB who bounced around the NFL for 10 years and won a Super Bowl as Tom Brady’s backup
——————–
Those who can’t talk on the radio.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:32 am
Franchise him and draft a qb early. If he can’t take someone looking over his shoulder in his 6th season, then he truly is worthless. Every player on the team has someone else on the team trying to take their job. Why not the “fragile” quarterback. If a backup isn’t trying to earn a starting job, then he’s useless also.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:34 am
Fans stop saying this team was robbed of beating the Titans
If the scoop and score counted the Titans still had almost 4 minutes with the ball to score and the defense wasn’t stopping them
November 28th, 2019 at 10:35 am
http://pfref.com/tiny/4UFSO
This table is from the great folks at ProFootballReference.com!
If you read the search terms, it is a list of all the QBs drafted since 2015 on, ranked by the number of TD passes thrown in a single season. (at least nine games started)
All of the columns are rankable to look for yards, TD%, INTs, etc., so you can reorder the list to find your favorite statistics to bolster your argument, either pro or con.
As you can plainly see there is ABSOLUTELY NO CHANCE that the Bucs could draft a new QB who could do as well as Winston.There hasn’t been even one player drafted since him who has done as well, in even a single season since 2015.
tickrdr
November 28th, 2019 at 10:40 am
Winston is our QB now and next year sit back and watch.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:42 am
After another losing season. We can look forward to another year of BA’s BS how everything is totally fixed.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:44 am
There are too many INTs this season, bit anyone expecting that JW (or any other QB) would throw a low # of INTs in this scheme is not ring realistic. Yes, this is the modern NFL where the passing game is the emphasis, and QBs and WEs have more protection than ever before. BUT, this scheme is not set up to take advantage of the modern game. It is based on long developing routes (huge stress of O-line and increased QB hits), long throws into tight windows (“no risk it, no biscuit”), and vertical routes that do not use misdirection and space to create separation. It is not a ball protection concept. It is a high risk/high reward scheme. JW is going to throw pics in this scheme – almost any QB will.
Here’s the catch, though, and the reason you can’t easily walk away from JW:. Not many QBs have the arm talent, anticipation, and Moxy (courage?? Let it fly attitude??? Carelessness???) to push the ball down the field the way this scheme requires. In other words, it takes a gunslinger’s mentality, and most QBs that have grown up in the spread-style schemes where the passing game is nothing more than an extension of the run game simply could not run it.
JW is second in yards, third in TDs, and is leading the third ranked scoring offer as in the league. His “peers” in these categories are undisputed franchise QBs and MVP candidates (L. Jackson and R. Wilson). JW is not because of the TOs and W/L record. IMO, you have to give him and the team a chance to correct the flaws before you throw away the production.
And, for those that say Winston is not improving, the fact is his production is on another level this season. The TOs are still there, but he’s never been as productive from the pocket as he’s been this season. The offer as has never put up more points.
And it’s the second youngest team in the league.
You have to keep building on the success before we decide to tear it down. In a year or two, this young core on defense might be ready to really take off. You’d hate to be grooming the next Mitchell Trubisky when that happens.
Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:46 am
SteveK give it up bro just accept the fact that Jameis is not why the defense has been horrible. Our defense is #31 in yards allowed this year, how does that equate to short fields exactly? That means they are giving up more passing yards this year than every team but one. If they had so many short fields then how would they have so many yards given up? Your argument holds no water bro, in fact the opposite is mainly true. Cause the defense has been so horrible often our offense is put in predictable situations which lead to more pressure on the oline and less favorable matchups for the WRs considering the defense can get better drops into coverage. But I know I’m wasting my time cause you have proven you don’t understand any of this detail. All you see is TOs and assume it’s all on the QB.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:50 am
“Under ancient outdated prone for INTs BA/BL Twins scheme
JW will throw and continue to throw INTs
BA and his outdated scheme will be bounced out of the NFL end of next year
After stubborn Grandpa Smurf is gone, there will be no team playing under that outdated scheme
Kobe Has posted and it shall be”
Kobe Faker
November 28th, 2019 at 10:59 am
Loyaltotheend Section 312 Says:
November 28th, 2019 at 10:34 am
Fans stop saying this team was robbed of beating the Titans
If the scoop and score counted the Titans still had almost 4 minutes with the ball to score and the defense wasn’t stopping them
*****************************
That is true.
And I want to thank you for making the point that the defense is the main problem because if they weren’t this team could easily be 6-5 with an easier schedule the last 5 games.
November 28th, 2019 at 11:04 am
Get rid of Jameis and he will become a SB QB for another team. It’s happened three times already to the Bucs. In the meantime our D sucks so bad it’s not funny, but let’s ignore the fact that they give up third downs and TD’s more than about anyone in the league.
November 28th, 2019 at 11:04 am
Mike Says:
November 28th, 2019 at 9:06 am
This is about the stupidest take I have read in along time and clearly someone who doesn’t watch Bucs game. And I get to say this again (although we will have to stop using this comparison next year) that Peyton Manning three 100 interceptions his 1st 5 years. That is 100 turnovers that do not include his fumble. This is not about comparing the 2 as much as it is applying Jim Miller logic because manning also had lots of yards and tds too but with miller’s logic the colts should move on.
——————————————-
In what universe is it logical to compare Jameis Winston in any way to Peyton Manning?
You are cherry picking some stats from over 20 years ago (league rules were slightly different then ya think) from a 5 time league MVP and one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time which I believe is an insult to intelligence everywhere.
November 28th, 2019 at 11:15 am
For all you 10m people, sure TB could offer 10m but his worth is minimum 20m probable 28m a year, so another team will come in and offer that kind of number m.
Then all you Jameis sellers can finally live in and enjoy a QBs like tann coming in and throwing for 2500 yards
November 28th, 2019 at 11:16 am
Slugglife Says:
November 28th, 2019 at 8:21 am
And don’t expect to see this team tanking for a higher pick. That’s not happening either during this critical stage for BA, BL, and JW.
——————————————
I wish the Buc blogs would point out the instability caused by having 5 HCoaching changes in 12 years. Not. one of the playoff teams, including the 49ers, suffers from this problem. The team has 11 (count ’em) regular season games under a new HCoaching staff. These players, a lot of them stellar talents, could care less about the draft with 5 games left. They are among the best athletes in the world. That means they are fiercely and proudly competitive.
BTW, the schmuck (being polite for Turkey Day) who called ME13/Ungodly “Moe and Curly” needs to get its/his head examined. Already got enuff flatulence on this board.
November 28th, 2019 at 11:18 am
Spot on DR. The rest of the team has been ignored for the sake of blindly maximizing JW’s talent (weapons for Winston) so really the optimal blame goes to Licht and Bryan Glazer. I sense this team is turning the corner defensively with the help of Arians and Bowles ( who I believe essentially hand picked current defensive backfield and got rid of Licht’s mistakes). They have to pick up a left o tackle probably in the draft, sign Nassib (notice how much better the line played with him in there), Barrett, draft or sign an interior lineman, add CB depth and possibly another rb.They need money for team building and can’t afford to pay a turnover prone, unpredictable qb top tier money. As long as they can take cate of primary needs and can afford to pay Winston a one year prove it deal (max 12 mill) I’m cool otherwise not worth it.
November 28th, 2019 at 11:35 am
A qb that is guaranteed 2 turnovers a game (and 6 isn’t rare enough) and struggles to win 2 games in a row is not worthy to be a starter in the NFL..
That is NOT the qualities of a winner..
Take away those 2 highly talented Receivers and he likely would have more ints and way less TD…
JW was a horrible choice and an extremely bad investment… The Bucs (if truly wise in business) should cut their losses, NOT compound their poor investment by offering any more…
He isn’t special and the Bucs NEED a qb that is special at qb position if they ever are going to get beyond being a losing team!
November 28th, 2019 at 11:46 am
Bculaw I agree this scheme is generally vertical but there are West Coast elements as well. I believe they adjusted the scheme somewhat last Sunday but I disagree that anyone would throw 20 picks. Palmer didn’t. JW’s picks are often on poor or late reads, when he’s not decisive, when he becomes tense/anxious in the pocket.
November 28th, 2019 at 12:02 pm
There are still 5 games to go, albeit an easy schedule from here out, I want to see Jameis go on a run. So far he’s not done this in his career to this point.
November 28th, 2019 at 12:07 pm
If the bucs get 7 or more wins keep him for a year if not see yah!
November 28th, 2019 at 12:15 pm
JOE – how do you leave out of this article the fact that Jim Miller WAS A BUC the season before that Pats season? 🙂 He’s a former Buccaneer.
Ndog,
As usual, your excuses for Jameis don’t add up. Fitzpatrick was able to be productive with much of the same Offense, so that clearly proves Winston isn’t the only way that can do it.
This “holds the ball for long routes to develop” is NONSENSE.
The Bucs aren’t running a Madden-esque “All Streak” or “Hail Mary” play where ALL available WRs don’t just go deep down field.
You know that right?
On EVERY PLAY, even ones with longer routes for some of the WRs, there is ALWAYS a TE, RB, or slot WR running a shorter route. That’s how NFL plays are designed… FOR A REASON.
So Winston holding the ball (and leading to sacks, fumbles, and other dumb mistakes) *IS* his fault because if he’s not seeing the long route develop yet, and realizes the pocket is holding up…
IT’S THE QB’S JOB TO OPT FOR ONE OF THE SHORTER ROUTES.
GOT IT?
That’s how football works.
Man… your ‘defend Jameis at all costs’ thing is so tiring. No matter how bad he plays or what mistakes he makes you ALWAYS have some sort of excuse for it and rarely (if ever) criticize him for it.
November 28th, 2019 at 12:15 pm
Again Arians likes Jameis. He’s gonna call him in and give him one more year.
November 28th, 2019 at 12:18 pm
At the news: The Buccaneers have released Jameis Winston
Many bucs sites will be flooded with one similar sentiment – GOOD RIDDANCE!
November 28th, 2019 at 12:20 pm
Bandit it really is sad with how little you understand the game, my friend. Happy Thanksgiving giving brother, I’ll let you live in your little, every thing is one guys fault world for today. And yes all hail Ryan Fitzpatrick, SMH
November 28th, 2019 at 12:34 pm
Totally disagree with this article. But the fact is bucs are awful every level. You see “signs” of improvement and what can we become but One fact is coaching hasn’t been stable and accountability until now. Waiving Noah , bond. Hargreaves is a s good sign . I should say give Winston this remaining games and next year. And this draft hit impact players on every round.
I’m impress with Janis stats. His top 5 in all categories in what a new system ? New coaching staff. There one one thing he needs to correct.
I see us very close to being competitive.
November 28th, 2019 at 12:38 pm
Draft who Herbert , eison or trade picks like the bears for a Trubisky ? We will be set up for a qb maybe in the 3 round. And then What ?? Start this project qb,or go with a glabbert, tyrod Taylor ? Pls you guys are joking.
November 28th, 2019 at 12:42 pm
Winston ain’t going nowhere, don’t try to send him nowhere, don’t look for him to go anywhere because he’s not going anywhere.
November 28th, 2019 at 1:02 pm
Dapostman…what an idiot you seem like…So two plays away from being 6-5? Also two plays away from being 2-9. ARI and first CAR losses. This team is a long way from being anything. Stop the dunce logic. They have beaten one decent team this year…and that’s the Rams…and they are not GREAT this year. The other teams they beat…losing teams…were mostly close games. The Falcons win was the most solid…and thank God, or Winston’s picks would have doomed them from the first quarter.
November 28th, 2019 at 1:32 pm
If Jameis played in the 70’s or 80’s his td/int ratio would be pretty damn good. With all the sissy a$$ rule changes over the years directed towards the offense, his touchdowns to interceptions is unacceptable for a franchise qb. If he’ll stay for 3-5 million per year, I’m cool with it. Let’s not make the same mistake the Rams did with Jared Goff since they are screwed for the next 3 years.
November 28th, 2019 at 1:58 pm
Not true, Joe. They have held FSU activities against him since day one. They have been anti Jameis
November 28th, 2019 at 3:32 pm
Miller and Kirwan have never been Winston fans anyway.
Nor have they ever had anything good to say about the Bucs.
November 28th, 2019 at 4:25 pm
Alex Smith for 2020!
November 28th, 2019 at 4:35 pm
Okay Joe Schmo Bucs fan, tell me a better option? Dalton? No. An injured Tua? No. An unproven Griffin? No. Please enlighten me. You’re full of it my dude. I’ll listen once you have a real argument. He knows the offense. Bruce didn’t come out of retirement to rebuild. Unless you want to legitimately start from scratch, which when you’ve missed the postseason 11 years running, is not an option. Build around him more. O line, etc. he’s youndlg and still years from his true prime. Enough with this nonsense.
November 28th, 2019 at 5:12 pm
2 yrs 36 mill
November 28th, 2019 at 6:35 pm
Honestly I don’t think Winston is the biggest problem. That being said I as well am done with him! He’s still young and I’m sure he’ll have a bright future. I just don’t see it being with the buccaneers
November 28th, 2019 at 7:30 pm
Hof Qb Fran Tarkenton threw 32 picks in 1978.
Hof Qb Peyton Manning 5 years into his career had turned the ball over 120+ times.
No single rule has had more of an effect on the increase in passing production than the infamous Mel Blount rule. Which was implemented prior to the 1978 season.
If you remove the name from Jameis Winston’s stats to start his career in comparison to others, you would no doubt see that he is on a Hall of fame trajectory.
The only year Jameis has had a semi respectable defense the majority of ththe year, he went 9-7 and missed the playoffs due to tie breakers.
People that want to get rid of him, perfectly personify the typical dumb Tampa sports fan.
November 28th, 2019 at 7:54 pm
This team is a Safety and a true #1 shutdown corner away from being a contender.
I predict Jameis will get a new contract around 20 mil per year and will continue to be the Bucs QB.
November 28th, 2019 at 9:08 pm
Why does this radio guy see Jameis differently than Payton Manning. Manning had more turnovers. I do not remember any journalist giving up on Manning. What is the difference Joe? I would think as a journalist Joe that you would address this when appropriate.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:41 pm
MirrorMirror,
SIMPLE…
The answer to your question is WINS.
Manning had many turnovers but produced many WINS for his team.
Winston hasn’t… IN FIVE YEARS.
November 28th, 2019 at 10:44 pm
Ndog,
I understand that game 100X better than you and in more detail.
Anytime you want to actually debate the true details of football, you let me know.
For now, you just use every excuse under the sun for Winston and his massive stockpile of turnovers and piss poor play.
November 28th, 2019 at 11:38 pm
Winston’s agent will be negotiating with the Bucs for a 1 year contract with his hat in hand
November 29th, 2019 at 3:56 am
BucsBandit Says:
November 28th, 2019 at 10:41 pm
MirrorMirror,
SIMPLE…
The answer to your question is WINS.
Manning had many turnovers but produced many WINS for his team.
Winston hasn’t… IN FIVE YEARS.
You are confusing. I thought it was the interceptions. Hypocrisy!
November 29th, 2019 at 7:08 am
Go ahead and draft a quarterback.
November 29th, 2019 at 10:38 am
For those saying Winston has not been getting better every year, well, the FACTS actually don’t back that up.
He had been improving every year in percentage completion (up to 65% last year, which is GOOD no matter who you are), as was his passer rating, and he was averaging only about 1 INT per game.
It was this year under Arians & Leftwich where Jameis really took a step backwards in both completion % and INTs. This is MOSTLY on Leftwich/Arians and the loss of a strong outlet receiver like Adam Humphries.
The numbers speak for themselves and anything else said is just emotional bullsh*t from a delusional fan. Winston CANNOT THRIVE under Leftwich, SO EITHER ONE (or both) must go.
November 29th, 2019 at 5:56 pm
Yea then I heard them make excuses for QBs doing the same thing that Jameis is killed for lol.
It’s so funny how the media, once they make their mind up they usually stick to it.
Miller goes “I wonder what Jameis would be if he didn’t have those WRs to make those plays for him” 🙄🙄🙄 yea, I wonder what Montana would be w/o Rice or Bradshaw w/o his 2 stud WRs or etc…
Like ppl will say ANYTHING to try to get their point across in their favor!