Jadeveon Clowney And The Bucs
May 26th, 2019
Speculation from Houston.
This doesn’t seem possible, but hey, who saw Ndamukong Suh playing for the Bucs two weeks ago?
Bucco Bruce Arians has been pretty blunt that the Bucs roster is a fluid thing. It’s not set in stone and very much can and possibly will change between now and September.
So with that in mind, could the Bucs still be looking for help on the defensive line? You know, a pass-rusher?
Much as people would like to believe it, just because Suh has stomped on legs and belted quarterbacks with a forearm to the grill and kicked linemen in the nads doesn’t mean he’s a pass rusher. He wasn’t last year.
Yeah, the Bucs still have Jason Pierre-Paul. But Joe wouldn’t bet $10 he’s on the roster come September. Joe loves JPP but a lot is unknown about JPP after fracturing his neck in one-car wreck in South Florida. Joe was sick learning of the crash.
And when JPP may be available (October at best) what kind of shape can he be expected to be in? It seems unlikely he’s pumping weights like a wild man while wearing a neck brace.
The Bucs already have paid JPP some $7 million for a roster bonus that kicked in before his accident. The Bucs can get out from his contract by releasing him (doesn’t mean the Bucs could not re-sign him at a discount given his injury) and save roughly $7 million.
With this in mind, Aaron Reiss of The Athletic linked the Bucs to Houston defensive end Jadeveon Clowney. Reiss believes Houston may want to unload Clowney, who is currently a no-show at spring workouts.
The Texans slapped Clowney with a franchise tag this offseason but he instead wants a long-term deal. July 15 is the deadline for Clowney to sign a new contract or be stuck with the franchise tag (unless he pulls a Le’Veon Bell and sits out the season).
Chris Mortenson of BSPN reported last month the Texans are open-minded about trading Clowney.
Greg Auman of The Athletic included an element in Reiss’ story on if Clowney and the Bucs may be a fit.
The Bucs could definitely use a pass-rusher like Clowney, but they have less than $2 million in salary-cap space, not even enough to finish signing their draft class right now. They swapped out Gerald McCoy for Ndamukong Suh this week, saving some cap room, but they would also have to decide to move on from the injured Jason Pierre-Paul — and somehow get out of the $7.5 million guaranteed to him this fall. Only then would they have enough room where Clowney would make sense as a new focal point of their pass-rush efforts. An expensive proposition on all sides.
The cost in draft picks would also be high. Would the Bucs be willing to part with any future first-round picks, knowing they still could be very high?
Joe isn’t so sure the cost would be that high, only because Clowney is unsigned. Look, JPP was had for a third-round pick (a steal by Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht) and JPP had three years left on his contract.
Dee Ford was obtained with a second-round pick by San Francisco and he, too, was franchise-tagged.
Also, Clowney has had a nagging knee issue throughout his Texans career with minor knee surgery in early 2017 and microfracture surgery in 2014.
The only way in Joe’s eyes the Bucs would have to cough up a first-round pick (or more) for Clowney would be if the Bucs also tacked on Will Gholston in the trade. You pretty much have to pay someone for a team to take him off the Bucs’ hands.
A front line of Vita Vea, Clowney and Suh? Yeah, that would make Joe’s weekend.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:16 am
Don’t give up the future for a couple 6-10 seasons. Plus the guy ain’t gettin any younger.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:26 am
Great thought, but really tough seeing the $$ working..
May 26th, 2019 at 12:26 am
I say go for it. He’s only 26 years old & the Bucs could use all the help they need on the D-Line.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:27 am
I say go for it. He’s only 26 & the Bucs need all the help they can get on the defensive line.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:28 am
Isn’t Gholston fully non-guaranteed? Why would they have to trade him?
May 26th, 2019 at 12:50 am
I gotta admit, with the new defense coming in, I’m still playing catch up.
If JPP gets back on the field for the bucs this year, is he gonna be on the line or is he an OLB? I’ve seen both projected. Is that because he is projected to play a bit of both?
Would Clowney (hypothetically) be filling the same role?
Honest question.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:56 am
According to OverTheCap, Gholston’s contract is not guaranteed. Then again they had Brate as not being guaranteed as well – so perhaps they’re wrong.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:57 am
OMG, but a 2nd round pick, that could be the next Roberto or Stewart or Jones. No way I’m giving that up for a guy with a proven track record. Same thing with the money. People are always telling me to buy something of value, and I’m like, no way stupid – I’d rather have a lottery ticket.
May 26th, 2019 at 1:05 am
I would love it if the joes or Ira could give us a breakdown of how the players we have on defense might fit into some of the different formations that Bowles is known for bringing.
It might be more obvious to some of you, but I sure would find it helpful.
It’s slowly dawning on me that this is probably a way bigger change than I was expecting.
May 26th, 2019 at 1:23 am
🙂
You forgot ASJ.
May 26th, 2019 at 1:54 am
I don’t see it happening, but as a South Carolina fan I hope it does.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:15 am
The consistency of the articles here are borderline embarrassing.
Clowney?
A #1 overall pick at DE who has played on stacked defenses and has never had double digit sacks even when healthy for 16 games?
This is just stupid click bait.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:15 am
If the offers for a 2nd, I’d take it in a heartbeat… not sure about the $ though.. if we cut the following:
JPP – 7.5m
Gholston – 3.75m
Brate – 7m
Clears up 18.25m for a possible extension… still not sure if its enough to finish signing our draft class..
May 26th, 2019 at 2:17 am
This is exactly what got us into salary Cap he11. And we’ve now seen how that limits our flexibility to build a TEAM. Not a good look. We can’t keep re-stocking with players developed by others. It’s cost-prohibitive. Besides, if Clowney’s dissatisfied with his contract on a playoff-team like Houston, think he might be dissatisfied when contract time rolls around with the Bucs?
Funny thing about developing some of your own players & capitalizing on their ‘cheap’ first-contract years … you don’t know if they’re any good UNTIL they’ve been developed. Let’s see first what these coaches can do developing some of our younger guys.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:20 am
I would love us to pick up Clowney if it can be worked out. But I also expect JPP back too.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:21 am
Really? Trading for good players to fill a need? Sssuuurrreee… the Bucs do that all the time!
Yeah, JPP was acquired in a trade but if the Bucs trade for Clowney, JPP is out and so is his salary.
JPP was a good trade.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:22 am
I am very grateful one J*o in particular is not the Bucs GM.
Talk about making #lichtmyb*lls look like a genius.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:31 am
Clowney isn’t very good. JPP is statistically twice as good and cost virtually the same against the cap.
You’d have to trade for Chandler Jones in order to upgrade the production.
Cut list: Gholston, Allen, VH3, =14mil
14mil plus JPP’s 7.5 gives you enough to pay Jones.
Cut list: Justin Evans, MJ Stewart, Evans Smith, Ryan Griffin, Ryan Smith, Beckwith, Benonch, Cairo Santos and Peyton Barber = 11mil
These cuts could theoretically free up enough for Chandler Jones and Patrick Peterson who is due 11m in 2019.
The guys who get cut, their replacements are already signed and on the roster:
Gholston = Nelson
Allen = Beckner Jr.
VH3 = Busting
Justin Evans = Edwards
MJ Stewart = Dean
Evan Smith = Earl Watford
Benonch = Nate Trewyn
Santos = Gay
Barber = Rojo/Wilson/Ellington
You could ask Brate, Evans and/or Marpet to rework their contracts to open a small safety net in terms of cap space nothing dramatic.
Or you could cut Brate and Dotson free up 12 mil and sign another decent RT at 5-6 mil plus Richie Incognito at RG. Boom!!! 3 pro-bowlers and a little cap space too.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:39 am
Honestly don’t see the problem with swapping out Clowney for a couple marginal players and a second that licht p!sses away every draft… plus, do we really need to see more of Gholston… not like the guy has been anything special.. now the brate loss could hurt.. however we do have OJ and I believe Auclair could be a decent replacement for Brate that BA could coach up… obviously this all depends on how much the Texans are willing to give up for Clowney.. but the guy is a stud.. we need more of those on our team, not mediocre talent.
May 26th, 2019 at 2:49 am
“JPP was a good trade”
no, cause we are 5-11 still. as a fan, a part of me wants the splash signings but i also know this just digs us deeper in the dirt. We should have started rebuilding 2 seasons ago. We need to get to where the browns are now. This can only be achieved by trading value for picks and go through some losing seasons looking for our next franchise QB on a rookie contract. No way around it.
May 26th, 2019 at 3:48 am
Yes Joe, JPP was a good trade, but an expensive one. Teams can only afford so many high-priced veterans before they end up in salary Cap he11. It’s not that Clowney’s not a good player. It’s not that he couldn’t benefit the Bucs. It is however that at some point you have to draw a line regarding how many expensive toys we can afford.
And we have to develop … and retain … some of our own talent. Bucs have been notorious IMO for not doing a good job of developing some top draft picks and then letting them walk after their first contract, only to see them later become excellent players, and in some cases superstars. Meanwhile we flounder in the cellar.
May 26th, 2019 at 5:55 am
Rebuilding,
We have been in position to make good picks, not as many as the Browns have had, but we have had multiple 2nd and 3rd round picks, we just failed to land the right picks. Then a JPP trade is a piece you need to get over the hump, but JL does a good job wheeling and dealing on draft day, but not so great with the picks he trades for.
May 26th, 2019 at 6:17 am
Let Gholston, Braves, and JPP go and get Clowney please
May 26th, 2019 at 6:53 am
At his price tag, is it at all concerning that he has yet to have a 10-sack season in five years?
May 26th, 2019 at 7:17 am
clowney is pretty good…but factor in he is jj watts side kick and reaps the benefits…
like say a culpepper or ahanotu, or tyoka jackson, or ellis wymms did when playing with sapp…
these guys looked great on a line with sapp at at times…
same goes for clowney lining up with watts
May 26th, 2019 at 7:21 am
Never trade your 1st round pick unless your like the pats or rams with 31 or 32 pick.
May 26th, 2019 at 7:23 am
they need a TE, I’d offer up Brate and Gholston and maybe a 3rd pick and see what they say
May 26th, 2019 at 7:24 am
So I am not saying that anyone is wrong about JPP not coming back until the earliest October. I just want to say again, that the JPP story came out from Adam Schefter (who is well respected) and the initial story was that he may miss the season because a source (JPP, one of his friends, his agent) said he may need neck surgery.
None of this came out from the Buc’s because JPP had not been seen by the Buc’s doctor yet.
The time line was that if he did need surgery, if would be a 5-6 month recovery. There was no support given for this medical time line of 5-6 months. It was just part of the same story.
The only additional details that seemed to come out after that 1st day was that he saw three different doctors and none of them said that he needed surgery. And that he had a non displaced fracture or he would not have even been released from the hospital initially.
I understand that the typical healing of the bone (assuming the fracture is non displaced) is 6-8 weeks mostly in a neck brace. Obviously people range in their recovery time – I.e diabetics may take longer – athletes may take shorter time.
Not sure where the dialogue comes from that he is out till October at best. It is not from anyone here specifically. If someone can point me to that as the probable time line, I would appreciate it.
JPP was very good for the Buc’s last year. His total of 58 tackles, 12.5 sacks and 16TFL seems pretty solid to me. Clowney total of 47 tackles, 9 sacks, and 16TFL was strong as well and he may be a better fit as a 3-4 OLB.
I will go with what the coaching staff wants to do here. I think I saw more of Clowney from his college highlights then anything in the pro’s.
I remember going to Houston for the Buc’s v. Houston game in 2015 and don’t remember Clowney as anything special against us then. That was when one of our knucklehead kickers (the ND guy) screwed us.
May 26th, 2019 at 7:28 am
and yes i know watts sat out a season with injury
May 26th, 2019 at 7:42 am
Brate, Gholston, A second or third round pick and a bunch of money…..no thanks.
May 26th, 2019 at 7:52 am
Okay, I’ll say it. Have Clowney sign a long term deal and swap Mike Evans for him.
Evans would be going home, Clowney gets paid.
Trade offense for defense. No cap issues.
I love clowns!
May 26th, 2019 at 7:55 am
Will Gholston has no guaranteed money
The Bucs don’t need to trade him if they want to rid themselves of his contract
May 26th, 2019 at 8:20 am
TBBF, You wouldn’t give Gholston, Brate, a pick, and money for Clowney? I don’t get that. Gholston couldn’t be traded for used jock straps to start. He wouldn’t make the team if they sign Clowney. Brate doesn’t have to be dealt in the trade but would likely have to go at some point. Brate could get us a 3rd rounder and offset some of the draft compensation for Clowney. TBBF, you’re not getting a pass rusher without giving up a pick whether you draft them or you make an trade. At least you know what you’re getting via trade. I wouldn’t worry about the money aspect. It will be a wash if Brate and JPP are gone next season. Also consider that the salary may go up as much as 50 million (by some reports). Clowney is an above average pass rusher with elite run stopping ability. I’d take that.
May 26th, 2019 at 8:40 am
McCoy used to be a pass rusher but he wasn’t one last year either. Lot of people taking shots at suh, 6 sacks ain’t really elite status especially when you suck at playing the run.
May 26th, 2019 at 8:46 am
Team Glazer should not allow any picks to be traded away from the New GM next year!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Intern Zach says: “Mr Realist”???
The Buc Realist says: ” Yes Intern Zach”!!!!
Intern Zach says: “Do sheep cry”?????
The Buc Realist says: “They do in Tampa’!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
May 26th, 2019 at 9:02 am
As a athlete myself pumping weights isn’t going to get jpp back into football shape. He will have to do a lot of conditioning an I mean a lot. I broke my c-4 vertebrae in my neck an the biggest challenge was sleep. You can not sleep in a bed were you fully lay down you have to sleep in a lazy boy chair for 6 months at least that’s what I had to do so conditioning without sleep I don’t think jpp will be Football in shape ready wen he comes back. So I think we need to look else where for help. I’m hoping nassib Spence Barnett an Anthony can get the job done but it’s prob not smart to bank on them
May 26th, 2019 at 9:07 am
If they trade away the farm for Clowney or anyone else for that matter and then proceed to win 6 or 7 games they need too clean house again.
May 26th, 2019 at 9:21 am
I will continue beating this drum:
Will somebody please tell me exactly why Will Gholston is still on this roster?!
May 26th, 2019 at 9:34 am
Trade Clowney for Brate? In a heartbeat. Keep Will though, injuries make a need to keep depth.
Go BUCS
May 26th, 2019 at 9:56 am
Yes, cut JPP and aquire Clowney for draft capital. Licht and BA are not in rebuild mode which means this is actually a possibility. Joe, you’d have to be a complete idiot not to have seen the Suh signing coming months ago. He fits their defense better, costs less, and offers a new voice for a defense in need of change. This was an obvious move.
May 26th, 2019 at 10:09 am
Clowney is a headache that the Texans can keep. He’s never had double digit sacks and his knee will never be 100% after microfracture surgery. If we could get him for a 3rd rounder and pay him less than 10 million a year, I’d be ok with it, but that is a pipe dream. I would have preferred if we had gotten that sissy (Dee Ford) that ran away from Frank Gore on the field! There is a video on YouTube if you need a laugh to brighten your day. 😉
May 26th, 2019 at 12:27 pm
Not a single peep about how Clowney might impact the locker room.
We are placing a lot of trust in BA to handle players who have been regarded by many as prima donnas. Did we not learn from DJAX.
I like the way this team is shaping up. I simply do not feel the need to make anymore dramatic trades. We have our stars in place we need to gain depth. Trading away Brate, Gholston, and VHG and others destroys our depth.
The ONLY place everybody is a star is in Sly and the Family Stone’s great hit song. In reality organizations need a strong supporting cast as well.
Some guys like Lord C and D.R. try to look at the big picture.
Who is going to take the snaps of all these guys we’re willing to dump so quickly.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:32 pm
Do the Texans appear to have locker room issues to you?
May 26th, 2019 at 12:35 pm
Man Goldson is trash. Why do we still have him on our team? He never even had a 6 or 7 sack season. He should have been cut 2 years ago.
May 26th, 2019 at 12:37 pm
Once upon a time Gholston was excellent against the run. Now, not sure that is the case. Certainly not enough to justify his salary.
May 26th, 2019 at 1:44 pm
Who will get cut to make room for a franchised DE…as well as the top of the draft class?
Not gonna happen without potentially putting the future cap in serious jeopardy.
Pleasant thought, though. Kinda like Rachael Watson suddenly wanting to dive in the male dumpster…
May 26th, 2019 at 1:45 pm
We got some trade capital VH3 and Brate combined with releasing VH3 and or JPP… if Clowney is the guy they want….don’t forget there are many vets that started last year that will be released or made available via cheap trades… ours is not the only roster in flux
May 26th, 2019 at 2:54 pm
I would trade for Leonard Williams. Clowney will be to much capital for us capt strapped teams. Moves like that are for contenders. Could Joe think where a few stud players away from contending?
May 26th, 2019 at 2:59 pm
Joe
I don’t know about Houston’s locker room don’t really follow them that closely. However he is threatening to go all Leveon Bell and is not going to play under a franchise tag which is why he is available. Is that a poor attitude? Perhaps not these guys have short careers and need to cash in while they can.
But Clowney’s reputation preceded him into the NFL. He refused to play against a poor Kentucky team because of strained ribs and a bone spur. This launched a series of quotes from first his coach…
“If he wants to play, we’ll welcome him to come play for the team if he wants to. But if he doesn’t want to play, he doesn’t have to. Simple as that.”
Spurrier is infamous for shooting off his mouth in the heat of battle but this led other college commentators to question Clowney’s attitude as well.
Kirk Herbstreit, ESPN: “If he is healthy and he’s healthy enough to play and he chooses not to, then I think a leader in that locker room needs to ask him to leave the locker room and not be a part of it.”
Paul Finebaum, ESPN: “His demeanor this year starting at North Carolina has been disgraceful. I think he is clearly the biggest joke in college football right now.”
May 26th, 2019 at 3:08 pm
Unless The Athletic and BSPN are both wrong, Clowney isn’t going to sit out the season.
You don’t have to follow the Texans to know if they have a cancerous locker room. How often has the team been to the playoffs or contended for the playoffs in recent years?
May 26th, 2019 at 3:13 pm
When have these Owners fired a coach after one season? Keep dreaming sheep herder.
May 26th, 2019 at 3:13 pm
*Very* little with VHIII. If Licht could somehow get a second-day draft pick for VHIII, he should pounce.
Love Brate but the Bucs are awfully sensitive about his hip rehab which, given the Bucs’ recent history of how they react to injuries, is a bit scary to Joe.
In the past three or four years, if the Bucs are tight-lipped about an injury like they are with Brate, it is usally for a good reason (but bad for the Bucs).
May 26th, 2019 at 3:16 pm
Gholston is on the team because he does his job. Not the job a poser on this site thinks (based on what?) he should do, but what the professional coaches asked him to do…at a reasonable price. “…doing well…about the steadiest guy we have on the DL”. Who could have said that? Also, for the self righteous crowd, why would we want another guy who didn’t show for OTAs? The selfrighteous posers said that was a showstopper a few weeks ago. Hilarious ! Keep em coming. Go Bucs!
May 26th, 2019 at 3:29 pm
Not showing up for OTAs does not mean the player is a cancer. JPP didn’t show up for OTAs. Tell Joe he didn’t earn his keep last season.
Joe isn’t a huge Clowney fan but where is the evidence that he has destroyed the Texans’ chemistry and locker room? Joe often sees Houston in the playoffs. If Clowney is a cancer, the Bucs need about a half-dozen guys like him and hope the stench of winning rubs off.
May 26th, 2019 at 4:13 pm
Joe, I agree. I was attempting to be facetious. I’ll try harder next time. Go Bucs!
May 26th, 2019 at 4:27 pm
Defense this is not at all how we got into salary cap hell. What big name free agents are the Bucs paying. The salary cap is an issue due to draft picks that are into their 2nd contracts. One of the only positive things Licht has done is sign free agents to cap friendly deals.
May 26th, 2019 at 5:21 pm
So the Clueless Joe wanted to trade for one year wonder Ford and now Clowney who has never had double digit sacks?
Glad the Clueless Joe is a blogger and not a GM
May 26th, 2019 at 8:32 pm
Joe
Clowney is listed as a LB in Houston’s 3-4 defense. I’d assume he’d do the same here under Bowles. Read up on Bowles scheme so your takes are more educated
May 28th, 2019 at 5:06 am
Second round picks mean nothing to Bucs with incompetent Licht being involved in the picks. Send 10 years worth for all I care.