Trading Brate Not Smart
March 25th, 2019
Keep him.
Yesterday, goofball but future Hall of Fame tight end Rob Gronkowski announced his retirement. That leaves the Belicheats down a massive tight end.
All of a sudden last night on Twitter, Bucs fans sprung alive asking Joe if the Bucs could trade backup/part-time starter Cam Brate to the Belicheats for draft picks.
Whoa, take it easy!
First, we don’t even know if Belicheat wants Brate. Belicheat seems to like tight ends who can block. Brate is not a good blocker.
Second, right now it would be unwise to trade Brate. Folks may not have noticed, but stud tight end O.J. Howard has yet to be able to finish an NFL season through two years with the Bucs. Each ended with him on injured reserve.
Joe doesn’t believe the Bucs should be so hellbent on unloading Brate until or unless Howard can demonstrate he can stay healthy for a full season. It sure would be nice if Howard can suit up for games in December.
Besides, Joe isn’t fond of getting rid of young players who produce. Call Joe a weirdo for that hangup if you wish. Additionally, Brate is coming off hip surgery. So if you trade him now, the Bucs would be selling low.
If the Bucs need to shed salaries or acquire picks, why not start with guys on the wrong side of 30?
March 25th, 2019 at 8:09 am
The bucs have been 5-11 back to back years, it seems to me everyone on the team except OJ and ME13 should be available for the right price, the bucs can sit on their hands and do the same ol broken way they have been doing business and continue to be a last place franchise or make moves
March 25th, 2019 at 8:10 am
Also we lost Hump a Go to guy for Jamies
Don’t think we should lose Brate Jamies other go to guy
March 25th, 2019 at 8:11 am
Fans are so desperate for salary cap space they will trade anybody. This does not make sense when you realize that Anthony Auclair will now be your backup TE. How about we just drop some dead weight…Like Gholston, this guy has some dirt on J Licht or something : )
March 25th, 2019 at 8:13 am
“More important than to find out if OJ gets hurt , which any player can at any time…
If we can get 2 FA defensive players, linebacker and veteran corner with Brates 7 million salary plus a 3rd round pick (oline/rb)…
We must do it”
Kobe Faker
March 25th, 2019 at 8:13 am
Say
March 25th, 2019 at 8:15 am
is only we hadn’t payed the idiot 20 mill
March 25th, 2019 at 8:17 am
We wouldn’t be in this position but the Glaziers throw money away like it’s biohazard material and Licht just nods his head in agreement.
March 25th, 2019 at 8:18 am
Correct JJ
Salary cap space does not win you football wins, players do.
It’s a passing league and Cam Brate has shown that he has the ability to be a productive player in the pass game…we can not afford to lose pass catchers.
March 25th, 2019 at 8:19 am
I wonder if the prior regime placed OJ on IR because when he got hurt the season was over. If the Bucs played meaningful games in December he may not have been placed on IR
March 25th, 2019 at 8:20 am
Is Arians going to utilize one TE, let alone two in his offense? You cant pay your #2 TE $7 million a year to ride the pine. That was an asinine contract.
March 25th, 2019 at 8:22 am
Brate like, but not to the extent of Hump has become a go to guy for Jameis. I love having dual tight end threat and Brate is a plus in the red zone. But! I have heard that BA is not a multiple TE enthusiast so maybe Cam will find a home with a formidable team.
March 25th, 2019 at 8:26 am
You wouldn’t get any cap space till next year. His salary is 7m and his dead cap number is 7m , dead cap goes to zero after this year
March 25th, 2019 at 8:27 am
And neither TE has started a full 16 games
March 25th, 2019 at 8:46 am
@gotbbucs
A good coach like Arians will develop an offense around the talent on the roster. I’m sure that if Arians has both Howard and Brate available to him, he’ll find ways to use both of them. No decent offensive mind would allow a really good player to sit on the bench and just say that they couldn’t find a way to get him on the field. Just ask Jon Gruden.
March 25th, 2019 at 8:46 am
Trade him if you can get anything better than a 4th round pick. Yeah OJ hasn’t played a full season but that doesn’t matter when we don’t make the playoffs!! Silly Joe’s lets stop holding on to guys for silly reasons like that. Trade him and draft another one with this deep draft full of serviceable TE’s. Why pay a back up 7 million when you can pay a rookie around 1 million?
March 25th, 2019 at 8:46 am
trade OJ for 2 firsts
March 25th, 2019 at 8:47 am
Arians doesn’t even like Yes and I’m sure if we were in the Playoffs a lot of these so called IR players would play. I’m not worried about OJ if we are any good.
I do understand the concern, but feel the time to trade Brate has passed, unless the Patriots or any other team give us their 1st rounder and we can get a starting RG/CB out of the deal.
March 25th, 2019 at 8:47 am
TEs
March 25th, 2019 at 8:49 am
My goodness we have the dumbest fans on the earth……
March 25th, 2019 at 8:50 am
This shows clearly the Joes are opinionated and absolutely nothing about building a team. What team in the nfl has a backup tight end making 7 million? Classic fools talk to even explain this away. Backups are backups because they aren’t better than the starter so there’s supposed to be drop off in production. Easily this is a situation where a winning franchise would trade this player, develop the third guy and draft someone.
For some reason the fans of this team are afraid of the unknown
March 25th, 2019 at 8:54 am
Patriots need a tight end.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:05 am
On the contrary, not there, what team in the NFL has one of the best TEs in the league on 2-3 million dollar salary for this season? I’ll wait.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:06 am
I understand what you are saying Joe, and i agree to a certain extent.
Imo Brate is expendable. The TE position isnt a featured position in Arian’s offense.
To me it makes more sense to trade Brate for a 4th or 5th round pick (being realistic here) and then sign a guy like Jermaine Gresham to a cheaper deal.
Then you have extra cap space, extra pick, and still security behind OJ if something were to happen to him.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:07 am
Ndog Says:
“My goodness we have the dumbest fans on the earth……”
(((((((((((
You mean Robert?
March 25th, 2019 at 9:08 am
Getaclue Says:
March 25th, 2019 at 8:27 am
And neither TE has started a full 16 games
^^^Very astute point above. Gronk didn’t start 16 games, Kelce, Ertz, Reed….on and on and on. Get over the “must start all 16 games” crap. None do, none that matter, barring an outlier.
Joe says:
“Joe doesn’t believe the Bucs should be so hellbent on unloading Brate until or unless Howard can demonstrate he can stay healthy for a full season.” Well @Joe’s belief is wrong. (See above) plus Brate himself is coming off the labrum hip surgery, AND….this draft is fairly deep at TE, SO…if Belichick has more faith in Brate’s past tape versus taking in chances in the draft for a STARTER at the position, you jump at the chance to unload the not-good-blocking-coming-off-labrum-hip-surgery-overpaid-$7milly-backup-TE…..or hopefully a 5th rounder, BEFORE the draft occurs.
Auclair can already block much better which is quite useful, and we can take a flier on one in the 7th to backup OJ. More prudent decision to unload him, to ANYONE.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:09 am
So let’s understand this logic… a guy (Gronkowski) who in 9 years has won 3 Super Bowls been to the AFC championship game almost every year he has been in the league helps kids in Massachusetts and beyond whenever he is approached is an awesome role model Joe calls him a goofball. But a guy who wears a bathrobe to the start of training camp has a life size doll of Batman in his house has never made a game changeing play in his career is not even the 5th best at his position in the league but gets paid like he is the best Joe loves him! WOW!! SMDH!!
March 25th, 2019 at 9:11 am
On the flip side of the “Arians doesnt use TEs that much” argument, OJ and Brate are probably the best TEs he has had to work with.
So if BA were to utilize 2 TEs more because of that then yes, it would make more sense to keep Brate
March 25th, 2019 at 9:15 am
There’s 2 TE’s coming out of Tight End University. Noah Fant and T. J. Hockenson.
Bill will draft one of those anyways.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:19 am
Like all trades, it depends on what you get back. If the Pats offer a #1 for Brate should we turn it down?
Wayne Gretzky got traded. Anyone can get traded.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:22 am
@Robert … “is only we hadn’t payed the idiot 20 mill.” Hmmm, there’s that word ‘IDIOT’ again. I presume you’re talking about Cam Brate, the HARVARD graduate, who’s making $7 mil a year, more than probably any recent grad from Harvard. Yup, sounds like a real idiot to me. Duh.
The reason Brate is making $7 mil a year is because Licht chose to pay him $7 mil a year, for whatever reason(s). Same reason Unrein & Gholston were each paid $3.75 mil each last year, and why Grimes made off with $8 mil when his performance didn’t warrant it. Licht overpaid for them, and for a number of others. So if folks want to know why our current roster is circumspect at this point, and why we have some glaring ‘holes’, look no further than Jason Licht’s poor stewardship of the Glazers’ money.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:28 am
Down right stupid to trade Brate. He is a proving weapon and will be a major part of Arian’s offense.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:31 am
I know the common theme is if you are 5-11 your QB stinks and pretty much everyone on the team isn’t much better, but the Bucs have had terrible coaching and historically bad defense and special teams over the past three years to go along with a subpar running game.
The Bucs need to fix the coaching staff(hopefully they have done that), the defense, special teams and improve the running game.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:42 am
JPP?
March 25th, 2019 at 9:53 am
You might snag a 3rd from the Pats….Its the last pick in the 3rd rd but its a 3rd. They can likely add a more well rounded TE in the 1st that isn’t coming off of injury and is more cap friendly.
March 25th, 2019 at 10:02 am
Again , you aren’t getting any cap space moving him till next year cause of the 7m dead cap figure
March 25th, 2019 at 10:18 am
auclair blocks and has decent hands…..trade or restructure brate….i’ve seen nothing that suggest auclair would be in over his head……
#REALISTKNOWSNOTHING!!!!…GO BUCS!!!!
March 25th, 2019 at 10:23 am
ATrain:
Good point!
March 25th, 2019 at 10:42 am
those “go to guys” help win a total of 10 games in 2years…..if we’re afraid to let them go, GOD help us…..
#REALISTKNOWSNOTHING!!!!…GO BUCS!!!!
March 25th, 2019 at 10:45 am
The harsh reality:
OJ Howard is more expendable than Cameron Brate…and would bring better picks at this point.
We should trade…
…neither.
March 25th, 2019 at 10:50 am
813bucboi Says
“those “go to guys” help win a total of 10 games in 2years… ”
No offense, but that’s a stupid way to look at it.
So you’re telling me that because the team went 5-11 two years in a row, every player on the team is at fault and is therefore expendable?
That’s a recipe to remain in the basement for another decade. If half a team sucks, you don’t get rid of the good half and expect to get better.a
By your logic, Mike Evans should go.
March 25th, 2019 at 10:52 am
Bot only that…we just put up with a year of you blaming the coaches. You got your way and now you blame the players?
March 25th, 2019 at 11:02 am
Trading Brate would be the best thing to do free up some money
March 25th, 2019 at 11:29 am
7 mil is too much for a back up offensive player and we have too much invested in OJ’s future as is. Ship him off for a pick and open up some cap space.
March 25th, 2019 at 11:32 am
The “ dead money “ clause changes everything, it’s a 7 million cap hit and as of March 17th his salary for this year is fully guaranteed so unless we’re trading for a second round pick it would be silly
March 25th, 2019 at 11:36 am
I’m leaving trust in Arians. If we keep Brate then I expect a decent amount of 2 TE sets especially in the red zone.
Would be OK with whatever is best for the team
March 25th, 2019 at 11:44 am
With so much negative energy with bucs fans lately n understandably so I wanted to post a video of a great memory the day we broke th below 40° curse when Barber secured our ticket to the bucs only superbowl game but hey we’re 1-0 in the big game lol🤷♂️
https://youtu.be/iCHvKUzTK4k
March 25th, 2019 at 12:25 pm
As Bucs’ fans all we have is memories. Everything else has pretty much sucked.
March 25th, 2019 at 12:39 pm
He can’t be traded because his salary is guaranteed. Arians? You people mean leftwich lol.
March 25th, 2019 at 12:59 pm
I looked up BAs offenses when he was OC/HC and here is how the STARTING TE did each season by rec/yards/tds:
01 Browns – OJ Santiago – 17/153/2
02 Browns – Mark Campbell – 25/179/3
03 Browns – Steve Heiden – 18/134/0
07 Steelers – Heath Miller – 47/566/7
08 Steelers – Heath Miller – 48/513/3
09 Steelers – Heath Miller – 76/789/6 (pro bowl)
10 Steelers – Heath Miller – 42/512/2
11 Steelers – Heath Miller – 51/631/22
12 Colts – Coby Fleener – 26/281/2
13 Cardinals – Rob Housler – 39/454/1
14 Cardinals – John Carlson – 33/350/1
15 Cardinals – Darren Fells – 21/311/3
16 Cardinals – Jermaine Gresham – 37/391/2
17 Cardinals – Jermaine Gresham – 33/322/2
Again, these are the STARTERS numbers. Do these numbers make it look like a good idea to pay a BACKUP TE $7M? No.
March 25th, 2019 at 1:09 pm
So maybe if Joe does not like trading away young talent , he should have stood up on his soapbox and HOWLED LONG and LOUD about the buccos letting HUMP go to the Titans. The Titans have had 3 winning seasons in a row and they wanted HUMP and made it happen(smart). Preesh don’t say that the cap prevented buccos from keeping HUMP , because getting rid of a guy on the wrong side of 30 in GMC would have allowed buccos to keep HUMP.
Buccos overpaid out the wazoo for Brate knowing they stole the best TE in OJ. Just another of the many stupid personnel moves by LICHT BRAIN. Fire Joel and Bryan and you are off to a great start-oh right, they own it.
March 25th, 2019 at 2:16 pm
Its pretty obvious that BA and the offensive coaches are excited to have the level of talent at TE that the Buccaneers have.
They’ve studied the team and its individual players closely on tape – and that tape shows Brate squeezing TWENTY TOUCHDOWNS over the last 3 years. Some of which were fantastic plays on Cam’s part.
Aside from Evans – Brate is our most consistent point producer. His “chemistry” with Winston is at about a 9.7 on a 10 scale.
Brate shouldn’t have even played most of 2018 due to his hip injury according to coach K – but he gutted it out and despite losing a lot of snaps last year still managed to pull in 6 TD catches – same as his wildly talented counterpart OJ Howard.
Arians and his offensive staff are creative enough and innovative enough to take advantage of having TWO proven, excellent pass catching TEs to work with and exploit weaknesses in opposing Defenses with. Auclair has proven that he belongs in the NFL as well and will factor in if/when any injuries occur.
We’ve got OJ on his rookie deal for a minimum of 2 more years – and Brate’s salary is not at all out of line with his production – especially in the Red Zone.
So you utilize that dual TE advantage. In fact – if both those guys are healthy and playing well – you feature it!
OJ is a hell of a blocking asset up on the line at either side – so there’s no tell whatsoever there. And if you put Brate on the other side often enough – mixing up the run, pass and play-action out of those looks – then the Defense literally has no idea what’s coming whenever you line up in 2 TE sets. You basically force the opponent to play base most of the time vs that look and then start picking apart the mismatches in the passing game. One or both TEs will be covered by a Safety or LBer – and in either case, its usually a mismatch in favor of Howard or Brate….
BA said his offensive coaches told him – “just get us our guys back and we’re good”.
So particularly in Brate’s case – that’s what you are seeing. The Humphries situation could not be helped – as the market dictated an over-inflated value for his capabilities and there’s no way you can grossly over-pay for a #3 WR – especially with all the young talent this team has behind him. DJax was addition by subtraction.
The Bucs are loaded with receiving weapons and Cam Brate is one of them that the GM and coaching staff apparently value a good bit more than quite a few posters on this thread….
March 25th, 2019 at 2:20 pm
Could go either way on Brate. Boils down to what Bruce and Byron think. If Brate is a Buc next year he will be a big part of the offense. No way we are going to keep him here for 7M and keep him on the sideline.
This is why I wasn’t upset about Hump. This is a new offense and Bruce does not use slot WRs the same way. They may not have had a big role for Hump. You’re not going to pay somebody big money if they don’t have the skillset that your looking for. Hump has a unique skillset, he not a great fit for every offense if the league.
March 25th, 2019 at 2:22 pm
Also, Auclair sucks. I hope they replace that stiff.
March 25th, 2019 at 2:54 pm
bonzai
im not saying that…..
im saying if folks are willing to let kwon walk they should have no problem letting hump & brate…..
just as folks claim kwon was overrated and was head of a horrible defense, folks should realize hump and brate were part of an offense that racked up tons of yards and no TD’s……
mike evans is a corner stone player….you can build around him….you cant say the same about hump and brate….
#REALISTKNOWSNOTHING!!!!…GO BUCS!!!!
March 25th, 2019 at 3:04 pm
If he is traded, it is a cap Savings pre or post June 1. Not dead money unless he’s cut.
March 25th, 2019 at 3:53 pm
You’d have to find a sucker, Belichick would never pay 7 million for an average player, only Jason Gump throws good money after bad.
March 25th, 2019 at 4:02 pm
@BucsFanSince1976 … “Preesh don’t say that the cap prevented buccos from keeping HUMP , because getting rid of a guy on the wrong side of 30 in GMC would have allowed buccos to keep HUMP.”
Bucs right now rank #2 in the NFL in terms of total player CAP ($198.3 mil), of which the offense costs $112.4 mil (ranked #2), defense costs $79.8 mil (ranked #15) and S/Ts costs $5.1 mil (ranked #14). (BTW, numbers don’t quite add to total so I’m assuming that dead money represents the difference?).
So BucsFan, taking $13 mil AWAY from the defense (GMC) to pay for an offensive player (Hump got roughly that amount) would thrust our offense WAY into the #1 position (spending) and drop our lowly defense into about the #27 position (spending). Not exactly the way to improve our defense? It’d also leave us with TWO DTs worth having … Vea & Allen … essentially mandating that we’d HAVE TO use our #5 pick on a DT to compensate for the loss of GMC. Probably not a wise move BEFORE the draft. AFTER the draft is a whole nuther story IMO, depending on who we draft.
March 25th, 2019 at 9:52 pm
More screens to the rbs this season. Arians doesnt use the te poaition much and he isnt a good blocker. I would think trading him would be good if its good for both sides.