Tanking Is Good
December 26th, 2018
Result of a meaningless win.
There is much to lose and little to gain with a win Sunday.
That’s the way Joe looks at it and it’s also the same winning philosophy shared by jet-flyin’, kiss–stealin‘, data-analyzin’, Bucs-film-studyin’, limousine-ridin’, why-man Thomas Bassinger of the Tampa Bay Times.
Bassinger this week documented how meaningless wins help keep teams in losing cultures and non-playoff droughts like the Bucs are currently in. On the other hand, losing now sets up winning tomorrow.
The difference in value between the fourth and 10th picks: 30 percent. Imagine turning that down. In five months, you’re going to wish you hadn’t. So if you know you’ll want it then, why wouldn’t you want it now? Why are we even arguing about the validity of tanking? It’s just cold-blooded long-term strategy. The Bucs simply have more to lose by winning.
Case in point: Tampa Bay’s Week 17 win over New Orleans last season. Jameis Winston’s last-second 39-yard touchdown pass to Chris Godwin with nine seconds left was cool, wasn’t it? It signaled the arrival of Winston as a franchise quarterback and helped the team rid itself of its losing culture.
Actually … it did neither.
Who is the most popular player on the Bucs? He’s also likely the worst starter on the Bucs, both offensively and defensively; his name is Caleb Benenoch.
Joe is guilty of the following: Joe was ecstatic when America’s Quarterback, Pro Bowler Jameis Winston, connected with Chris Godwin on a bomb to beat the Saints to end the season. The sad thing is, that pass meant the Bucs were eventually stuck with Benenoch at right guard instead of Pro Bowl rookie Quenton Nelson*.
(* – It is unclear if Nelson would have been on the Bucs’ roster had they lost. Remember that the Colts traded down with the Jets. Would the Colts had still picked Nelson at No. 2 and not traded with the Jets had the Bucs lost to the Saints and ended up with the No. 6 pick? One could argue the Bucs would have picked defensive end Bradley Chubb who has 12 sacks for the Broncos.)
Joe likes to point out that in 2006, the Bucs beat the Browns in a Dec. 24 matchup that Joe is confident Bucs fans from Clearwater to Cape Canaveral remember every morsel of detail about, and have banners hanging on their walls commemorating the feat.
Because of that win, the Bucs missed out on players at two great positions of need, wide receiver and offensive tackle. The two players the Bucs missed because of that legacy win? Calvin Johnson and/or Joe Thomas, both bound for Canton.
Instead, that immortal win over the Browns set the Bucs up to draft Gaines Adams.
Imagine if then Lions-general manager Matt Millen, just before he resigned late in the 2008 season, had called Chucky and offered him Johnson straight up for Adams and Chucky turned him down? That’s basically what Chucky did with that worthless win over Cleveland.
Chucky might still be coaching the Bucs had he drafted Johnson or Thomas.
Tanking is the football equivalent to going to the dentist. It stinks and is a pain in the mouth. But by avoiding the dentist, you set yourself up for much greater pain at a much bigger cost down the road.
In baseball in recent years, both the Astros and the Cubs have proven tanking works. The Cubs mailed it in for two or three years but that allowed them to stock their organization with quality young players, which led to a World Series for the first time in over a century. The Astros won their first World Series as a result of tanking as well.
You think a Cubs fan would give up those cherished World Series moments to instead brag, “That two-bit Jeff Samardzija finally got one of his cheesy sliders past Albert Pujols and the Cubs won today! Now let’s go drink some beer and blow up some fireworks for the Fourth of July.”
Tanking is good. Banking on Gaines Adams and Caleb Benenoch as pillars of your franchise is only a reminder of how bad the Bucs are.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:06 am
Hey if we didn’t tank in 2014 we would have never gotten Jameis Winston.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:08 am
If they’re smart (if that is possible) they’ll bench Winston and a lot of other starters. Start Ryan Griffin and let him play a real game, along with other marginal players. Let’s see what they can or cannot do.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:15 am
I just want them to compete and lose.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:15 am
I doubt they’ll tank as Koetter isn’t going to want to go out with a lose in his last game as HC.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:16 am
If you are a professional athlete and you have it in your heart to tank then I want you off the roster
December 26th, 2018 at 10:21 am
Licht needs to be gone for hopefully better draft results !
December 26th, 2018 at 10:22 am
Lose to ATL and draft a real franchise QB. Don’t screw up this time with another JayMiss.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:23 am
The Pittsburgh Steelers are loaded with young talent on their roster
And they drafted over 90% of them
In my opinion it doesn’t matter where you draft, but who you draft
The Bucs won their last game last season against the Saints
And it may have costed them a few draft spots
But they still had a opportunity to get a solid pick
They made the trade with the Bills for more picks
So they had a 1st and two 2nd round picks
They had a better value with these picks than they had with the 5th pick
They could have picked a Derwin James with their 1st pick
Traded two of their 2nd round picks and draft a Nick Chubb
You get a whole lot more value with Derwin James and Nick Chubb
Than you would get with a Quentin Nelson and Bradley Chubb
December 26th, 2018 at 10:23 am
Don’t think you can compare how well a first round pick is doing on a different team. Yes there might have great mechanics of their own, but what does everyone say?…It’s a team sport. And this team has had $hitty coaching for rookies on offense and defense for the last four years and beyond.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:24 am
and cue lil jimmy in 3, 2, 1…..
But yeah, tank it baby! If anything its a trade down option if the right one isnt there (Oliver or Hakins, imho). it could return our 3rd that was used to get JPP (which was awesome, worth more than that, we got lucky)
Is GMC done? If so, then we need a DT….Oliver or Wilkins! Then hopefully Haskins falls into the 2nd, doubt that though…..look at QB’s lately, they go high.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:25 am
Players don’t tank that is up to coaches. Your either better than the other team or not. Pulling starters is the only assurance. Players don’t tank to draft a guy that could replace them and dirk is gone so he just wants to win. So do I, just can’t lose to the falcons who lost key pieces to the defense and offense is where we are strong
December 26th, 2018 at 10:26 am
**Quentin Nelson OR Bradley Chubb**
December 26th, 2018 at 10:30 am
The real game is on Monday. If I hear anything other than Licht and Koetter are gone I am going to be very unhappy.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:31 am
No need to tank, just go out there and play normal Buccaneer football. The result will be the same.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:31 am
Tanking perpetuated losing culture. Look. I further than teams that royineky pick late in the it’s round (or trade out of the late 1st round spot). Winning even meaningless games instills the right mentality going into the next season. Let’s be real…competent talent evaluation finds quality the right players that fit into good coaching schemes. Bad talent evaluation wastes high draft picks on players that may be good but don’t fit the coaching system. Plus tanking often means purging a roster the following year so the new coach/GM can start the rebuilding process anew…more losing 🙁
December 26th, 2018 at 10:33 am
Sorry for the horrible grammar…hopefully the numerous typos can be interpreted lol
December 26th, 2018 at 10:33 am
They could have traded the 53rd and 63rd to trade back into the 1st round. Then draft Sony Michel or Nick Chubb, and still had their 38th pick.
This is not hindsight but scenarios
December 26th, 2018 at 10:34 am
Bucs are tanking again? Lol
It’s like deja vu all over again!
December 26th, 2018 at 10:37 am
Jameis haters who the hell are all these QB options to replace Jameis in the first round you’re talking about? You all want to get rid of GMC also when the first round is stacked with DL. And what the hell is the point in bringing in a new rookie QB to play behind our bad oline, which is a position that will very likely addressed in the first or second round.
“Draft a QB in the first and keep Jameis for another year.” Hahahahaha. Get the f#ck outta town.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:39 am
You can say that Vita Vea and Nick Chubb or Sony Michel
Has more value than a Quentin Nelson or a Bradley Chubb
December 26th, 2018 at 10:41 am
@DeweySelmon:
You got that right.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:43 am
The Bucs won’t tank on Sunday. Why would Koetter make decisions on the sidelines to help an organization that is likely going to fire him on December 31st? A coaching staff can only get away with tanking if there is job security. The biggest reason why the Bucs ended up 2-14 in 2014 is because they were tanking and every key staff member had job security.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:46 am
Ooook obviously someone talking as if Licht will be drafting next year. You think it’s some kind of anomaly that a new coach could come in and want his own quarterback? Yea I want Geraldine gone, people act like it’s easier to replace a quarterback versus 30 tackles and 6 sacks for 13 mil, he’s trash. I want Winston to step up be the franchise qb but that’s on him. He’s the reason why there’s such a negative spotlight towards him. I am the ultimate Winston supporter but not going to praise him for losing or blame him for everything. He’s been average and for the #1 pick that’s not good enough so yea I can see a new coach wanting to draft someone not saying it’s what I want. I want to see wins and when your a quarterback drafted that high we are supposed to be winning because of him. It’s happening all over the league in case you haven’t noticed
December 26th, 2018 at 10:48 am
SOEBuc,
I wasn’t hating on Ed Oliver, but I seen some laziness from him against Texas Tech. With that said I still believe he can be a solid NFL football player. But I think his best fit will be a 3-4 DE, because of his quickness and explosiveness. But Houston was playing him at 1-Tech NT. He’s either a solid 4-3, 3-Tech or a explosive 3-4 DE.
Houston was playing him out of position. So his play wasn’t as good as it should have been.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:51 am
The Bucs are going to tank. They already started last week in Dallas. Do you really think Winston or Klueless are so inept they forgot to watch the game clock? Come on Man. They have been playing/coaching most of their lives and to suddenly just forget about the game clock. ppppffffffftttttttt
December 26th, 2018 at 10:54 am
You may ask, why would Klueless tank, he is outta here. Well, it could be that the Glazers laid it down and promised him one more year. Why would Winston tank? Maybe he feels like he owes Klueless after torpedoing the season with his suspension. Just sayin. I have to go straighten my tin foil hat now.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:57 am
As I said earlier…
If that type of mentality continues in sports to the disgraceful degree that it has…. the NFL & NBA will eventually just go to a TOTAL LOTTERY system that is not even based on W-L record any longer. That is the only way they can truly get rid of this loser mentality.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:01 am
No.
Sorry, but no.
Just no.
The Bucs have missed the playoffs for 11 straight seasons. In that time they’ve drafted as high as #1 overall and it simply hasn’t mattered. They’ve lost the games at the end of the season to get the higher pick and it simply has not mattered.
Look at the past 7 years and you can quickly see where teams that got higher picks have not fared much better in following seasons than the ones who won late and drafted lower.
It’s jist something we say to pin our blind hopes to. “If we get a higher pick, we will be better!!”
Nonsense.
What changes any business, program, orcteam is always the same. A wise hire at the top who is innovative enough to implement the right mindset and plan for an organization and also hire the right people to implement it. The Glazers need to focus on one hire: a head of football operations who has won consistently in the past that can come in and then hire the right people.
Ironically, Cleveland was on the right path with Sashi Brown who accumulated all the resources and picks that are allowing Dorsey to rebuild the team the right way.
The Bucs cannot just hire a retread ciach and expect z urging to change. The organization and its philosophy is flawed. That has to change first.
The rest is just doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. If the Glazers are going into this with the mindset of, “this is what we look for in the Buccaneer organization” then they are doomed – because what they have been looking for has led to futility.
The entire mindset and hiring process must be changed.
What draft pick we achieve is t even remotely important compared to that.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:05 am
If the Glazers aren’t going to sell the team then the first order of business is to fire Licht & Koetter. Up in the air about JW. If they do keep him for 2019 he will need to show significant improvement before signing him long term. Next fire Warhop (horrible). Then get rid of all the high saleried players not earning there keep. Do not sign D. Smith unless its for maybe 6mil. Release Bennoch. The Bucs over the years seemed to have a knack for hanging on to crap players & releasing the good ones. Last but not least sign Hump. Like now. Best receiver on team as far as being reliable.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:11 am
lakeland
that would mean nick chubb would be running behind this lousy o-line….and everyone would be saying he’s a bust….lol….
imo, its not all about drafting, its about development….
value is worthless if its doesnt produce or isnt developed……
i’ll take trench play(nelson & chubb) over skill play (james and chubb) any day….
imo, we’d be in slightly better shape with nelson or chubb…..
#REALISTKNOWSNOTHING!!!…#ADIOSDIRK!!!…GO BUCS!!!!
December 26th, 2018 at 11:15 am
“Tanking” perpetuates the losing culture NOT the other way around.
Had the Bucs drafted wisely IN the positions they had, we wouldn’t be having this conversation. It’s not about what number you draft at, it’s WHO you draft.
I am adamantly opposed to even the idea of tanking. It is the definition of a losing culture. Only losers care where they draft.
If we play hard and still lose, OK, not great but we tried. But to straight up go and lay an egg on purpose is absolute garbage.
On this Joe, I vehemently disagree. To use your own argument, the Bucs shouldn’t even attempt to improve unless they can reach 10 wins due to draft position.
It’s WHO you draft, not what number you draft them!
December 26th, 2018 at 11:22 am
What a loser mentality.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:24 am
If you are for tanking to “get the better pick”, you are then glossing over the fact you have the wrong GM just making bad picks!!!!!!!!!!!!!
December 26th, 2018 at 11:24 am
@Joe you just TOTALLY contradicted yourself in the post. Way to go.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:25 am
Bucsfanman Says:
“It’s not about what number you draft at, it’s WHO you draft.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Perfectly expressed, my friend.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:25 am
Tony LA
Nailed it because a higher draft will change something. If anything fans and local media talking about tanking at the end of the season is the one big change that needs to happen. You can’t say tank at the end of this season to help you get to the playoffs next year, how is that not pathetic. That’s not changing culture to say let’s lose this last game because it helps us. They need to fight and play if for anything the next coach that will watch tape.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:25 am
Patriots, Eagles, New Orleans don’t seem to have a problem drafting mid to late rounds every draft.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:26 am
I’m pulling for the Falcons this week.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:26 am
@Jean Lafitte
Exactly. This is the media that covers the bucs. They like it when they lose and profit from it.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:27 am
@waterboy = DRONE
December 26th, 2018 at 11:29 am
@Jean Lafitte
Right again. There are so many holes in the Joes logic here this post should be called swiss cheese
December 26th, 2018 at 11:29 am
Waterboy
So all this time you’ve been trolling this site. Go hang out in an Atlanta blog
December 26th, 2018 at 11:31 am
Howards going to be brutally honest here:
Howard thinks that the Bucs should start tanking in Sept next year. Just do it! Embrace who you really are and realize you can be good at something. WE can be the best team in the league at getting high draft picks! To Howard that is a substantial achievement. Dreams of winning are too rich for Bucs fans and they should embrace something realistic……High draft pick CHAMPIONS
It feels good huh?
December 26th, 2018 at 11:34 am
we got tanking covered.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:34 am
@SOE, go fk yourself you triggered lil snowflake lol
December 26th, 2018 at 11:36 am
“…losing now sets up winning tomorrow.” – J0E
Yeah, sure. Because it has worked so very well for the Browns, right?
December 26th, 2018 at 11:36 am
Joe,
You can say that Buc win over Cleveland cost them Calvin Johnson or Joe Thomas. But the Minnesota Vikings drafted a RB 3 picks later.
And 12 seasons later that RB has rush for over a 1000 yards
Adrian Peterson is still going strong
December 26th, 2018 at 11:38 am
as a season tkt holder i’m hope the bucs loose… makes the draft more fun to speculate about a qb,etc.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:39 am
John Sinclear Says
“If they’re smart (if that is possible) they’ll bench Winston and a lot of other starters. Start Ryan Griffin and let him play a real game, along with other marginal players. Let’s see what they can or cannot do.”
Given that it takes about half a season to a full season for young players to get the experience they need to be productive, what you are suggesting makes zero sense. One game will not show us anything.
And aside from that…we KNOW what we have in Griffin. A player who is almost 30 and has been so bad that no coach has given him an opportunity to even play in a game, let alone start one…and a player who lacks the personal drive to try to earn a 1st or 2nd string role with his skills.
You people need to move past Griffin. He is nowhere near any good.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:40 am
Even though the Bucs didn’t get Calvin Johnson or Joe Thomas
They were still in position to draft solid football players
Include future Hall of Fame players
December 26th, 2018 at 11:40 am
And THIS is why this org has a losing culture.
YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME – Herm Edwards
How about we instead hope some of the teams in front of us lose.
I hate the idea of laying down for a draft pick.
Maybe we should do a better job with the draft picks we end up with.
How many 1-3 rounds picks have we whiffed on since Licht has been GM????
Those are the players that should be the core of out team right now.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:41 am
the only time a team should ever not worry about winning is when they have already clinched a playoff spot and want to rest players before the first round. The Bucs should not be trying to lose.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:45 am
Only a gutless punk would tank
December 26th, 2018 at 11:45 am
^^^Well put Bonzai. It’s waaaaay too late to start Griffin. If the Bucs were remotely interested, he would’ve seen the field much earlier. Besides, he’s a FA. AND 30 years old! AND, never seen a regular season game!
The Bucs would be wise to draft a developmental QB (given the right staff) and sign a veteran with game experience, even if they retain Jameis.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:45 am
rhenry Says
“Do you really think Winston or Klueless are so inept they forgot to watch the game clock?”
Actually, you are missing a few things there.
Throughout the game, the Buccaneers were snapping the ball at the 1-2 second mark on the play clock. Go back and watch the game again. So Koetter saying he thought Winston would get the ball off is actually the right thing to say, because Winston had been doing it all game in the last second or two.
Also, the play clock ran out twice is a row, right? But when the first one was called, the clock manager did not restart the play clock…therefore the clock was actually running faster than it should have on the second one. The clock manager should have stopped the play clock when the first penalty was called, and then restarted it when the refs signaled. He didn’t.
So it looks like you are Klueless in this case.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:46 am
Yea boys let’s tank!
That will really help get rid of the loser mentality that had run rampant through this organization for over a decade.
🙄🙄🙄
It’s not where you pick, it’s who you pick. Simple as that.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:46 am
Great points Lakeland… These guys write an article about a “losing culture” then write an article about tanking… Tanking allows losing to become acceptable.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:54 am
Denny
There’s many good players available in every draft
It’s up to the teams to draft them
December 26th, 2018 at 11:55 am
And some teams does a better job of drafting than others
That’s why some teams are competitive every year
And some teams are not
December 26th, 2018 at 11:56 am
Doesn’t matter if you can’t develop talent. The Bucs took Winston with the FIRST OVERALL PICK and failed to develop him properly. If anything, tank for a new coaching staff. Although I’d like to see Buckner back, but that’s just me.
December 26th, 2018 at 11:58 am
That’s why Licht has to go. Drafting has been wretched for 10 years. There’s been many comments about the guy’s the Bucs have drafted that aren’t in the league anymore… Nevermind they’re on another team – they’re completely out of the league. That’s bad.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:01 pm
This is a purely disgusting philosophy…..and it’s stoked by an organization that has “Fan” in it’s name.
How do we know at this point that VV along with the 2 CBs in round two won’t outweigh Quenton Nelson? We don’t. It is purely speculation based on a losing culture’s attitude about “losing now to get better”…..
DISGUSTING!!!
December 26th, 2018 at 12:05 pm
SC Bucs Fan Says:
December 26th, 2018 at 10:16 am
If you are a professional athlete and you have it in your heart to tank then I want you off the roster
well said sir….. surprised but well said
December 26th, 2018 at 12:06 pm
Hey Bonzai, no need to be a rude a$$hole about it. Merry Christmas you filthy animal.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:27 pm
LOL! So, by this logic, the Bucs have been “Tanking” for around 11 seasons now.
The coaches have tanked coaching, game prep, in-game adjusting, coaching-up players and scheme.
The GM has tanked draft picks and signing loser FAs.
We should have won the SuperBowl at least 9 times now with this logic of tanking to get higher picks.
The real problem is Coaching and GM talent evaluation.
We CAN”T PICK or SIGN Quality players.
And we CAN”T COACH them.
So what good is tanking, no matter how high we pick, we CAN”T pick the RIGHT Player.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:28 pm
Christian Wilkins Walter Football Draft Profile
Strengths: Strengths:
Excellent athlete
Fast at the point of attack
Instinctive
Dangerous interior pass-rusher
Closes on quarterbacks in a hurry
Disruptive
Strong hands
Uses hands and feet at same time
Good rip move
Technically sound interior defensive lineman
Repertoire of pass-rushing moves
Splash plays
Quick feet
Good get-off
Ability to shed blocks
Rare athletic skill set
Strong at the point of attack
Agile
Can bull through offensive linemen
Quality run defender
Not easy to move at the point of attack
Good vision
Carries weight well
Successful against good competition
Ready to contribute quickly
Extremely versatile
Can play a variety of techniques in a 4-3 or 3-4
Durable
Team leader
Weaknesses:
Lacks speed to be a full-time defensive end in the NFL
Can have some quiet stretches and games
December 26th, 2018 at 12:29 pm
@rhenry, go fk urself….leave Bonzai alone…
yall some petty arses acting like we hate the team and want us to lose every game just because we want us to lose the last one for a higher draft pick…..PETTY PETTY PETTY you lil nancy boys!
December 26th, 2018 at 12:34 pm
^SB, yep, love me some Wilkins…..reminds me of Sapp!
December 26th, 2018 at 12:42 pm
Tank City here we come.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:49 pm
Such a stupid and simplistic column.
Players will never not give their best effort, it is on tape for everyone to see and if they want to remain in the NFL, they play hard every snap. Whether they remain with the Bucs or not.
So, that means that the coaches should not play the best players? Or should they run plays they don’t think will work? Again, these coaches all want to continue with your career, and not putting forth best effort in not how you stay employed. It also goes against the nature of everyone who is involved at this level of sports competition. It is ingrained in their makeup.
So, should the GM or owner step in? Again, Licht is on thin ice as it is, getting blown out at home,by a rival team currently in last place that has owned us is not great for the resume either.
Joes, I remember well the game that cost us a chance at Calvin, but if you also go thru the drafts you will find studs and duds all over the first round. Not an exact science.
Finally, trying to lure prospective FA’s to Tampa would go over much better if the current QB (a number one pick by the way,… how is that working out?) would play better and show he is the future here. Don’t we want to see that?
You play to win the game period. That is what athletes do.
I am never going to root to fail today for some potential reward in the future.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:51 pm
no offense. But they should sit. Jameis , he will most likely be back but if you are the glazers you can’t risk injury and then have to pay Jameis 20 mil. The new coach and new gm may not want him as their face of the new franchise. At this point the glazers have to get best coach and GM for team cause they have missed for to many years and people are no longer going to games anymore. So they will be at mercy of hopefully a quality coach /GM
Play Ryan griffin
And winning a meaningless game at end of dog crap year will cause the Quenton Nelson missed out scenario. I’m not rooting against bucs but anyone who thinks let’s win and start a winning steak in week 17 (going into next year ) is on drugs.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:51 pm
@Max yeah he also catches TD passes and runs for TDs in goal line situations.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:53 pm
jerseybuc says
“I am never going to root to fail today for some potential reward in the future.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Well said, man.
I am relieved to see that there are still a lot more fans with this mindset than I was beginning to fear.
December 26th, 2018 at 12:58 pm
Atlanta coaches do have job security. They are going to tank. If they get a lead on Tampa, they’ll probably start punting on 3rd down. If Tampa wins the coin toss, I hope they defer the kick off until next season. Instead of kicking extra points, punt instead. Decline every penalty, after all, Atlanta didn’t mean it. Use your timeouts on the first three plays of the half’s. Jameis should audible every play, in pig-Latin. Every time Atlanta blitzes, the offensive line should stand straight up and yell “Ole” as they run by. If by chance a runner breaks free, make it more sporting by dribbling the football. If a receiver forgets and actually catches a pass, share the wealth, pass it downfield to someone else. There’s just no reason to win this game and inexcusable if we do.
December 26th, 2018 at 1:01 pm
If the GM and scouting staff are picking players but the coaching staff is absolutely incapable of developing anyone into anything that resembles and NFL player are we still blaming the GM? Same O-line coach for what? 5 years and they’ve moved their best lineman’s position 3 times? Anyone remember the NFL Network draft coverage from last year? The question was who will the bucs draft and Mike Mayock said something like first they need to draft a coaching staff. Ownership will be picking the new coach because they consider it more important that the GM position, don’t be surprised if Litch doesn’t get canned with the rest off them.
December 26th, 2018 at 1:09 pm
It doesn’t take courage to disagree with the Joes and some “fans” tanking philosophy, it takes character.
December 26th, 2018 at 1:12 pm
It is the principle, the idea that cheating pays off, hopefully a concept you don’t teach your kids. So what if Atlanta decided to tank also? 2 teams trying desperately to lose, what would that look like? 0-0 at the end of overtime. A coin flip for the higher draft pick? The only merit I see to tanking would be in the case of WAR, nobody wins, eternal peace.
December 26th, 2018 at 1:13 pm
jerseybuc says
“I am never going to root to fail today for some potential reward in the future.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Well said, man.
I am relieved to see that there are still a lot more fans with this mindset than I was beginning to fear.
Tampa Bay Demon I am right there with you. If you have it in your heart to tank a season, game, or even one play then you have it in your heart to quit, and that is unacceptable. I am always going to root for the win no matter how down we are!!!
December 26th, 2018 at 1:14 pm
the bucs have basically beaten no one since the first two weeks of the season…and in those 2 wins they sort of caught teams sleeping early in the year…teams weren’t in full football mode…by week 4 teams are beginning to grind…
– they beat a browns team that was a mess – it didn’t even feel like a win…browns coach fired a week or so later…another win that was barely a win…
– they beat the 49ers who are a total mess this year…they played a complete game against a useless team…barely a win…
– the beat the panthers who went from a 6-2 start to like the bucs, one of the worst in football…also barely a win…
#FeelsLikeWeHaveBeatenAlmostNobody
December 26th, 2018 at 1:18 pm
“Drafts by me is like a box of chocalates. You never know what you gonna get, but it will always be a Bust”
Jason Gump
December 26th, 2018 at 1:19 pm
Herbert back to Oregon. And the plot thickens!
December 26th, 2018 at 1:40 pm
I thought the Bucs were already in the tank. Seriously, its not like they even have a chance to win the last game. Even if we draft a few positions higher next year, Jason Gump will screw it up. I’m sure he already has some Div 3 players he wants to draft in the early rounds or maybe another kicker.
December 26th, 2018 at 1:42 pm
Bucs must lose on Sunday. I love Godwin and think he has potential to be a #1 receiver, Just think, if he didn’t catch that pass and Bucs had not beaten NO’s last season, they would have ended up with either the 3rd, 4th, or 5th pick in the draft instead of the 12th. Here is what could very well have been:
3-Sam Darnold QB – NY Jets
4 – Denzel Ward CB – Cleveland Browns
5 – Bradley Chubb DE – Denver Broncos
And if the Bucs had been awarded the 3rd pick, who’s to say they couldn’t have worked a trade to move one slot up and take Saquan Barkley, RB Penn State? No doubt Licht would have taken any of those 4 players over Vita Vea.
Please Bucs, just one more Christmas present, I hope you play well, show promise, but PLEASE loose another close one.
December 26th, 2018 at 2:10 pm
LMAO here! Our Bucs are not smart enough to Tank. They don’t think that far ahead! Had they tanked against the saints last year/ Chubb would have fell into our Laps. Nahhh they ain’t tamkin against the dirty birds. Hell, they might lose anyways. Nothing is for certain with our Bucs. Noth..ing.
December 26th, 2018 at 2:23 pm
TANKING IS FOR LOSERS!!!!!
December 26th, 2018 at 2:45 pm
Amen to that.
December 26th, 2018 at 2:55 pm
Hey madmax, you re a rude a$$hole just like bonzai, probably share the same bed.
December 26th, 2018 at 3:05 pm
The only thing Lovie Smith did right was to lose against the Saints in the last game.
There is no such thing as a moral victory. Beating the Saints last year on the last play was … well … a moral victory.
December 26th, 2018 at 3:13 pm
The Coroner Says:
“Beating the Saints last year on the last play was ….. a victory.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
CORRECT! And that is all that matters.
Yes I took you out of context, The Coroner.
Sorry, but it made the point! LOL
😉
December 26th, 2018 at 3:17 pm
Derwin James Jr… but Licht Blew it and the second round. Fireeeeee Licht!
December 26th, 2018 at 3:19 pm
Glad Jameis won the game! America’s QB full of integrity winning a game full of meaning.
December 26th, 2018 at 3:22 pm
RIP Gaines Adams. Benenoch was a crap pick. Fireeeee Licht!
December 26th, 2018 at 3:22 pm
Don’t tank, we wouldn’t want a losing culture around here….oh wait.
December 26th, 2018 at 3:35 pm
What if the Falcons decide to tank and we play to win, my guess is the Falcons still win
December 26th, 2018 at 3:53 pm
^^ Worse yet, what if we BOTH try to tank?… lol
Guys running backwards on punt returns….
Falling down on purpose….
Tackling air…..
Whiffing on punts….
That is what y’all want, right?
December 26th, 2018 at 4:19 pm
TB Demon- I pondered that last week with a family member that’s a Falcons fan. Then the Falcons had to mess around and win last week. This still could be the blunder bowl with both teams playing young inexperienced players to mask their intent of tanking.
I can’t wait for next year!
December 26th, 2018 at 5:13 pm
LOL, no doubt, Alaskan. Can you imagine the nightmare that would be to watch?? It’s sad that we have to so often look forward to next year, but yes I do too, sir!
December 26th, 2018 at 6:21 pm
Tanking is not good because it tears away at pride. Players in this league have pride. They have pride it themselves and their own game. It is something very special when those players feel pride for the uniform they wear and the city they represent. That pride is the foundation needed to build a Championship Team. You are asking these players we have to quit and to sit down. You’re asking the players we have to not care. For Pete’s sake Joe you wrote a earlier article about the players we have not caring enough about winning home games…..Then you write this telling them that losing at home and tanking is good?
We need the players we have now way way way more then we need this one(unnamed) rookie you are talking about tanking for. If this orginazation is not going to invest themselves into building pride into the core of our team there is no rookie on Earth who can change that. You wanna act like tanking doesn’t come at a price but it does. It does effect things like confidence and mentality.
Believe it or not some fans feel pride too. We get embarrassed by losing. We have seen teams quit before. It’s tough to watch and hurts our pride. The embarrassment has gotten old(not to mention that all the losing has proven good draft position makes only a small difference). We have also suffered through the embarrassment of tanking. I’m am so tired of these franchise giving me nothing but disgust. I wanna see a article talking about how this team finally got a winning record in their home games. Maybe the players will then finally see how much winning at Ray Jay means……..How about 3-3 in our division? Haven’t we been embarrassed and swept by our division foes enough over the years? We need a team that is going to demand a 3-3 division record & be hungry for more next year……….We need a team that was pissed off that Dallas effectively killed
our 2016 season. But we didn’t get that. We got a team that really didn’t seem to care who Dallas was.
I’m sick of a team that doesn’t care. Tanking is not going to help. Tanking is bad.
December 26th, 2018 at 6:22 pm
The only thing that I take solace in is that our team will not be quitting on Sunday.
December 26th, 2018 at 6:34 pm
JJ- I’m sick of a team that doesn’t care as well, but does week 17 of a losing season really seem like the time to start?
How about when their new leader stands in front of them and tells them that there will be a new culture and standard for the team. I would say that is when it is time to shape up or ship out.
Winning this game will not numb the sting of this season and no matter the outcome we are still losers!
I always root for my team to win but if we lose, I will celebrate as if we won. If we win I will celebrate as well. The only difference is if we win the Bucs will be kicking themselves in 4 months.
December 26th, 2018 at 7:12 pm
Caleb Bennenoch was not a 1st round pick. Tanking has nothing to do with him. It’s Jason Lichts Incompetence that has something to do with him but keep spreading this loser mentality Joe. The Bucs don’t already have enough of that.
Ask some of the greats what their opinion on tanking is and I bet they have they have the same collective opinion that tanking I’s for scrubs, especially when it’s not even for a 1st round pick.
Keep contributing to the Bucs loser culture Joe, your doing a great job.
December 26th, 2018 at 7:21 pm
World of Tanks!!!
December 26th, 2018 at 9:12 pm
Alaskan yes it’s a great time to start winning. The goal is to build a team of driven & motivated winners. Quitting is counterproductive.
You may ask when is a the best time to start winning and Im here to tell you it’s never a good time to start quitting.
As I said quitting has consequences. You may choose to believe that things like confidence, motivation, momentum or winning attitudes cannot be built upon but you would be wrong.
December 26th, 2018 at 9:23 pm
And no Buccaneer should be kicking themselves for winning. Nor will they. If they beat Atlanta that should be a motivating factor for them next year.
Only silly fans kick themselves with buyers remorse over draft choices. They will cry about draft choices no matter where we pick anyways. Happens every year.
Meanwhile Vita will be a probowler next year if he continues his performance. And when happens they can complain about the next draft.
December 26th, 2018 at 9:39 pm
No little henry, im in your bed, your wife wont let me leave….
December 26th, 2018 at 10:23 pm
JimmyJack, somewhere along the line you have confused fans wanting the team to lose for a better draft pick with players giving no effort and trying to tank. No player would ever try to tank. Why would they? They’d be tanking for thier own replacement. No fan that wants the Bucs to lose this week wants it to be because the players just laid down. They want to see them play there a$$es off and lose. I understand both sides and won’t judge anyone ass less of a fan either way. A team could lose thier last game and still pick the wrong guy, or, like last season, a team can win thier last game to give the fans false hope. That’s what happened to me. That last drive gave me hope that we were on the cusp of great things. Didn’t happen. I just hope we don’t look back on this last game and thinking we missed out on another great player at a position of need.
December 26th, 2018 at 10:43 pm
@Jimmy, we won that last game last year, and like you I thought that was good…but look what happened. You and yours have your opinions on tanking and we have ours.
Losing a meaningless last game for a better draft position that could possibly be a difference making player is loser mentality according to you peeps….ok then, fits us so fkn well!
December 27th, 2018 at 12:46 am
Mad max
Dude, what happened was that we were in prime position to get the NFL rookie of the year in Derwin James but Licht traded down and got a run stuffer. Our draft position had absolutely nothing to do our bad season, it was the drafting.
What don’t you get???
December 27th, 2018 at 7:55 am
JimmyJack Says:
“Tanking is not good because it tears away at pride. Players in this league have pride. They have pride it themselves and their own game. It is something very special when those players feel pride for the uniform they wear and the city they represent. That pride is the foundation needed to build a Championship Team.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Very well said, man, and 100% agreed.
December 27th, 2018 at 8:32 am
Hey madmaxine, that is cool!!! I owe you a six pack, even though my b*tch is your mother.
December 27th, 2018 at 12:04 pm
Na she has standards and would only be with a real man, not a little boy like you lil henry….
Tbbucs3, as always the draft is kind of a crapshoot. Theres hits and misses. Im not giving up on Big V though, as long as hes healthy, I think he’ll end up being a solid pick. We did need D line help along with Safety help. Cant draft all the stars though.