Another Jason Licht Measuring Stick
July 4th, 2018
Ex-Buc chimes in
There will be many intriguing ways to judge general manager Jason Licht this season, some more obvious than others.
Joe’s got favorites, such as judging the performance of the sackmaster the Bucs did not trade for but Miami did, Robert Quinn, versus the output of Jason Pierre-Paul. The Mariota-Winston debate is alive and well, of course, and Joe will enjoy seeing how three ex-Bucs guards under 30 years old perform, Kevin Pamphile (Titans), Patrick Omameh (Giants) and J.R. Sweezy (TBD), compared to what the Bucs put on the field.
Another measuring stick rarely considered is manbeast rookie defensive tackle Vita Vea, the No. 12 overall pick, versus Alabama space-eater rookie Daron Payne, selected just one pick later by the Redskins.
A guy Licht inexplicably booted from the Bucs roster in 2015, 26-year-old Redskins safety D.J. Swearinger, has his eyes on that defensive tackle comparison. Via USA Today, Swearinger said he’d put his money on Payne over Vea.
“I was vocal about him,” Swearinger said. “I know the guys were telling me about Vita [Vea]. I got an eye for an athlete … and I just felt [Payne] was an athlete first. You can teach any athlete X’s and O’s. So I felt he was a great pick for us. Seeing him out here is unbelievable. They can’t move him up front. He’s very solid. He’s got an NFL body already.”
Joe is firmly in Vea’s corner. He’s the more freakish athlete and appears to have more upside. Still, Payne is nearly two years younger and thrived against manly competition at Alabama.
For Bucs fans’ mental health, Joe sure hopes Vea outplays Payne.
July 4th, 2018 at 5:27 am
Two things:
1. The Mariota-Winston debate is alive and well,
—————–
Why? MM is stacked with huge offensive lineman and even bigger backs. 6 pro bowlers on the team.
Check the stats (I know I know) more yards,completions,tds, in 2.5 less games higher competition percentage, qb rating the whole nine. Give Jameis bookend tackles 2 pro bowl running backs, a pro bowl safety and a pro bowl DT better yet DE and let’s see how many playoff games he can win.
2. Payne
Told you on draft night Payne was the pick but in all fairness A’Shawn Robinson isn’t exactly lighting it up so, idk, le’s hope vea can beat the heat, big if.
July 4th, 2018 at 5:33 am
He won’t because Vita won’t be asked to start right away hopefully. GMC sucked his first 2 seasons and was being called a bust before he broke out I guess that’s what you call losing seasons with probowls. As long as he shows he’s a key to the future and pushes for more playing time it’ll be a good season. Winston ruined a good off-season and once again there’s drama and the cameras this year will be more distracting than hard knocks
July 4th, 2018 at 5:38 am
Joe: LOL “ Mariota Winston debate”. There is no debate. Mariota did win a playoff game last year for the Titans. Winston has little to zero respect from his teammates, Mariota’s teammates truly look up to him for leadership. Winston deals with “transgressions” and cannot even spell the word progression…..much less go through them during a play. The Bucs won 3 out of 15 games with Winston starting last year, the Titans were 9-7 with Mariota
July 4th, 2018 at 5:45 am
Any coincidence that Mariota’s win total from last year is 6 more than dumb as a bag of hammers JameisNOT? It’s the same difference of their Wonderlic scores….6.
July 4th, 2018 at 6:09 am
“Mariota has GM Jon Robinson…JW3 has Forest Gump…..Huge Difference”
Kobe Faker
July 4th, 2018 at 6:27 am
Personally didn’t care whether we drafted Vea or Payne, they’ve BOTH got tremendous upsides. How well they turn out depends on a bazillion factors beyond their control; factors such as coaching, scheme, teammates, injuries, etc. Father Time will figure it all out; until then I guess we’ll just have to rely on the media to tell us who’s better.
Same way with the Winston-Mariota comparisons. Ask the Titans fans who they’d rather have as their QB right now and odds are vast majority would say Mariota. Ask the Bucs fans who they’d rather have as their QB right now and odds are most would say ….. hmmm, bad example to use (no longer sure about the answer).
July 4th, 2018 at 6:41 am
What weapons are we talking about for mariota? Sure I will concede oline. Yup there tightend thinks he is the best in nfl after doing some paint chip lines.
Yah. Mariota is stacked with receiving options? Can you name one? and henry started most of year cause the other running back had hammy issues entire season and is still unsigned to this day as free agent.
Please people. Not even close. . Plus db55 thought you weren’t fighting the good fight on this one. Thought you were done with Winston ?
July 4th, 2018 at 6:44 am
@Joe
Who cares about if the Bucs got the right DT!!!!!! The questions for years will be, While the League office held the Bucs hostage, did they miss out on drafting a Franchise QB in 2018????????
July 4th, 2018 at 6:46 am
The Buccaneers have been lacking leadership at ALL levels for years. Licht does not seem anything special in his job so far…So Far… Go Fitz!
July 4th, 2018 at 7:00 am
@Buc Realist…yup, the NFL had to work in dealing with an a-hole, Jameis Winston, who, in his very first stretch of time unsupervised, went out and created the very same type of controversy that got him in trouble at FSU. Wouldn’t it be nice if Winston acted like just the most average law abiding citizen and followed the law and basic no-brainer rules of common decency. From grabbing a strange woman’s genitals while she worked, to developing a web of lies and deceit, this went on so long because of Winston. While the Bucs don’t have time to draft a QB this year (don’t think they would have anyway), they do have time to put another game-experienced QB in place before camp starts to complement/backup or compete with Fitz. If the Bucs don’t do it, that’s on them.
No matter what, the lesson here is don’t ever trust Jameis Winston, and don’t ever count on him for anything. And never, ever, leave him alone with women who do not specifically ask to be left alone with him.
July 4th, 2018 at 7:08 am
Back in Lovie’s first year, many gushed over the defense the Bucs assembled as they announced being “Tenessee ready.” I remember T-Kraz proclaming (and reasonably so…many thought) “I don’t know how the Titans are going to even score a touchdown on this Buccaneer defense.” That one haunted me for weeks, and reinforced you can never go on what you seen on paper. Too many factors and variables. I just hope the solution mixed up this year for the D is right. Of course, it didn’t help that Jameis Winston’s first pass as an NFL QB was a pick six. Maybe that was kind of ominous of what was in store for the Bucs with Winston’s own meaning of “hot hand.”
July 4th, 2018 at 7:28 am
With fans like these, who needs trolls?
July 4th, 2018 at 7:29 am
Lovie wanted Swearinger gone. If I remember correctly he started either questioning his playing time or DB coaching staff.. One of which was Lovie’s son.
July 4th, 2018 at 7:47 am
Even with the Winston most recent issue, the Mariota debate is now stupid to me. Mariota had probably the best RB combination in the league with Demarco Murray and Henry. I’ve watched 90% of ever game that he has ever played in the NFL and he’s decent but nothing special. He beat Denver while only passing for 88 yds in that game, the Bucs couldn’t beat Cleveland if Winston only passed for 88 yds. Not to mention the AFC South is the weakest division in football and Luck being out the past 2 yrs hasn’t helped. Jacksonville may be on the rise after last season but historically they’re awful too.
July 4th, 2018 at 7:51 am
Licht has made his mistakes….but he is light years ahead of the disaster Dominick……absolute buffoon of a GM.
July 4th, 2018 at 8:15 am
Yup, we should have been looking at a quarterback in the draft but those of us who mentioned this before hand were labeled, not as perceptive but, as J-miss haters! However, we did get the best two-down DT. Swearinger is likely correct, Payne is probably a more well-rounded player. They also got a complete running back later than we got our not-so-good-on-pass routes RB. Licht is better than Dom but, so is anyone else with a pulse.
July 4th, 2018 at 8:20 am
Mariota?????? You people are crazy, y’all must not watch football, he is one hit away from being out of football for good. They guy got lucky and won a playoff game, he didn’t take them there, it was the TEAM, coaches & play calling. WE WON A SUPER BOWL WITH BRAD JOHONSON!!!! I’ll give it to the fact that titans were better organized and run as a team, but Mariota Vs Jameis, get the F&@k outta here and go home, Mariota can stay in TN. Y’all haters will see what happens this season.
GO BUCS.
PS ALL YOU HATERS STAY OFF THIS SITE, it’s for FANS not contestant negativity
July 4th, 2018 at 9:02 am
I would’ve preferred to draft Mariota. He’s a safer bet to keep his team in the game… aka better chance to win. Winston is too careless on and off the field.
July 4th, 2018 at 9:17 am
Not J-miss! We can just call him Game-miss!! What a selfish,immature arse.
July 4th, 2018 at 9:28 am
Well one thing for sure…Mariotta will absolutely DOMINATE #3’s play the first three games this year. The rest is up for debate.
On the field I like #3 over MM but off…well what a stupid thing to bring up that’s beyond obvious at this point.
As for leadership…to be honest I do not watch the Titans every week and I certainly don’t read their fan blogs and check out their local reporting…I honestly do not know about MM’s leadership skills and his team’s reaction. He clearly is the opposite of #3 but there’s more than one way to get the job done.
I thought #3 was on the way with leadership the first two years but last year he seemed to simply try waaaaay too hard and IMHO took a step back.
Then came the 3AM drunken adventure with the convicted rapist and any semblance of leadership disappeared from #3’s resume. Leaders simply do not betray their teammates that way.
So which QB? #3 on the field MM off and for me…I don’t want either one.
In fact I’d just as soon root for Fitz at this point. Not saying he’s better but I’m tired of the Bucs having to carry baggage.
July 4th, 2018 at 9:32 am
“Licht has made his mistakes….but he is light years ahead of the disaster Dominick……absolute buffoon of a GM.” Again the bar is not that high then.
July 4th, 2018 at 9:34 am
Mariota is not a good QB – America’s Choir Boy is not a good QB – that is about the only thing they have in common.
July 4th, 2018 at 10:05 am
Mariota vs Winston comparison still going on? Fine! Let’s take the first 3 games of this season and compare the numbers between the 2. Oh, wait…
July 4th, 2018 at 10:06 am
DB Mariota has 2nd worst WR and the worst playcalkers/designs and the line declined sharply last year. Look it up. Additionally he had more picks than intercept able passes and even with a down year his td to turnover is better. Also no red zone turnovers which is ridiculous. He and Hameis were about even under pressure last year. But marcus is a guy everyone can like. His teammates adore him.
July 4th, 2018 at 11:51 am
Anonymous no, they weren’t even close when under pressure. Look it up instead of guessing. Jameis had the second highest rating in the NFL last year when under pressure. And Mariota also has a defense that is VASTLY superior to the bucs, a better line, and better running game. Those are facts, all Jameis has is a better receiving core. And I find it funny after Mariota stats last year that anyone can say hes better on the field. His teammates adore him, what are you a titans fan?
July 4th, 2018 at 1:25 pm
Ty cg saves me from having to type that. And I think Jameis only has 1 red zone int not certain though.
July 4th, 2018 at 2:23 pm
In the beginning I preferred Mariota over Jameis because of Jameis’s off the field redflags. But, I also said that whoever the Buc’s pick would be the guy I would support 100%. As our QB, I still believe he has the tools and the intelligence to be our franchise. I am angrily disappointed in him to say the least for letting us all down after his speech to the world about keeping his nose clean. Hopefully with his new baby’s mama, he’ll focus on football and keep himself out of those situations in the future. No more chances from here on out. In fact it may already be too late. For those who chastise Mariota for being successful have to remember he came into the league under huge scrutiny, and that he’d take longer to develop. Kudo’s to Mariota, and for his haters, wake up because Marcus is off to a great start.
July 4th, 2018 at 5:04 pm
Problem is Vita v ea is playing in a defense that gives away free 12 yards cushions like an al you can eat buffet. The dline is running around exhausted after the first quarter wondering how they can make.any type of.impact when the dbs are being coached.to.play back so far that a first down is almost guaranteed.
Play some press and.EVERYTHING will.change, even for the dline
July 5th, 2018 at 9:23 am
This debate is seriously funny. Some of you guys can’t really believe the BS you’re spewing right?
Yes Mariota is a cool, nice guy. You’re right. I’m sure his teammates turn to him for pillow talk.
But are you seriously going to sit here and tell me a QB with 12 TDs and 15 ints in an offense with one of the best olines, running backs duos, and tight ends in the game is better than Jameis?
Lmao man I like Mariota but you guys are losing your damn minds. This drama has got half of you spouting casual bspn “knowledge”.
Jameis is pissing me off sure but I’ll take him any day of the week over mm. Unless of course we’re going to a luiau.
July 7th, 2018 at 11:35 pm
My brother is a titan fan he goes to games every year an he live in Houston. Even he said mm was not better than Winston. He followe the team the same way I do the bucs. He rather have Winston then Marrito . That’s why he has the NFL ticket just like me so I can watch my bucs. I went flu to Tampa bay and watch when we played the falcons. We were oilers fans he left with them n I became a bucs fan. It crazy…. I have another brother a packers fan die Hart. He like Winston.