Two Bucs Needs Stick Out
January 23rd, 2018
Compared to NFL star.
One cool thing about attending East-West Shrine practices in St. Petersburg is it gives Joe a chance to talk to NFL folks for wisdom and insight.
It’s why Joe always goes to the site of the Super Bowl, which is sort of an NFL convention. It’s also why Joe goes to the NFL combine in Indianapolis annually, as it is sort of an NFL winter festival.
Last week, among others, Joe chatted with the great Mike Mayock, the uber NFL draft analyst for NFL Network.
In this final installment of Joe’s talk with Mayock, he judges two players as stand out studs from the rest of the field available in April’s NFL draft.
And it just so happens those two players play positions where the Bucs have a Grand Canyon-like hole: running back and defensive end.
JoeBucsFan: Is Saquon Barkley an impact guy, a home run hitter?
Mike Mayock: I think he is outstanding. I think they are the two best-graded players in the draft, [Bradley] Chubb and Barkley. I think Barkley is every bit as good as Ezekiel Elliott. Both on and off the field.
Color Joe sold.
Now if there was some way Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht can brainwash Colts general manager Chris Ballard to ignore Barkley in the draft, then there is a prayer he could fall to the Bucs at No. 7.
The Browns have two of the top four picks. Joe wonders what type of ransom Cleveland would want for their No. 4 pick? Even if the Colts were to select Barkley with the third pick, at No. 4 the Bucs would be in position to land Chubb.
For those who nearly fell out of their chairs or spit up their coffee reading the previous paragraph, you think the Dixie Chicks regret trading up for Julio Jones?
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:05 am
Would not mind at all trading to #4 for Chubb if the price is right.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:06 am
this team can’t afford to lose any picks, need to add picks…see how it plays out. A trade down to land a DE like Hubbard and picks might be better…
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:07 am
I really like to watch this dude play. But there’s a lot of Reggie Bush going on with him. And I expect a similar NFL impact. Not sure he’s worth trading for.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:12 am
perhaps if the QB was always a threat to connect on pass plays our RB would look like a stud. and if gmc had some nasty in him and a counter-part we would actually be a threat up the middle easing up room for the DE. we need DE, but RB should be picked up cheap.
just like Martin will probably go to another team (pats lol) and kill it for low $$.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:12 am
Every year there are player just ahead of the Bucs pick we’d love to have, probably true for every team….simply too many holes to trade up for the Bucs….trade down if anything !
However Brakley is the real deal and Walter Payton high character
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:18 am
“this team can’t afford to lose any picks, need to add picks…see how it plays out.”
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Here’s why I disagree: I would rather have 1 superstar player than 2 marginal players. For example, let’s take a look back at the 2016 draft. Let’s say we traded up to #3 and got either Bosa or Ramsey. Let’s say it cost us 2 seconds. Would you rather have just Bosa, or VH3, Noah Spence, and Justin Evans? Me personally I’d take Bosa over all 3 of those and wouldn’t think twice. Having lots of picks guarantees you of nothing. Get the guy you want, the guy you know is going to make an impact. It’s much easier to build your team around superstars, versus having a team full of average NFL starters.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:22 am
I just hope Licht drafts the player that our next head coach wants.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:23 am
Saquon is 230 lbs. Reggie Bush was only 200. That’s a big difference. Not only that, but running backs weren’t as valuable as pass catchers during Bush’s time in the league. If he would’ve been drafted 15 years later then he would have had a far more successful career because playcallers have begun to shape their entire offenses around running backs who can do everything. Barkley would be a dynamic game changer for the Bucs if they took him and used him correctly.
However, Tampa doesn’t need to go anywhere in this draft. Barkley or Chubb would obviously be great picks. But Tampa have huge needs at guard, corner back, and safety which could also be filled by Quenton Nelson (the next Zack Martin) or Minkah Fitzpatrick (the next Jalen Ramsey).
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:25 am
I would prefer we have up future draft picks rather than over pay in free agency. If we could come keep out pick and get the browns second pick that would be enough to keep your job licht. We have up picks for gruden and it paid off, only problem is everyone knows how desperate they are but I don’t care I think the way licht drafts he could lose a few top picks like Atlanta yet still hit in the later rounds
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:27 am
Barkley won’t make it past 4. Most likely he and Chubb will be off the board by 4. I wouldn’t be shocked if Cleveland doesn’t make Barkley the first pick, then circles back and gets the QB with 4. Cleveland has to guess a good chance that Barkley won’t make it past NY and Indy, but there is a better chance their favorite QB will. I think there is a much better argument that Chubb slips to 7 vs Barkley. Barkley, if his college workouts are anywhere close to accurate, will put up scores that might set a new benchmark for the prototype RB.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:34 am
If we would have just lost the last game we would be picking #4, sometimes you have to take a lost to get a win
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:34 am
Too many holes in the roster to give up draft picks to move up. Thats a no from me, dog.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:40 am
“this team can’t afford to lose any picks,”
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^^^^^^^ Ding ding ding ding ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:46 am
“Too many holes in the roster to give up draft picks to move up. Thats a no from me, dog.”
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When was the last time we traded up in the first round to grab someone we wanted? I truly can’t remember, so it’s obviously been a while. How exactly has that worked out for us? As Joe said, do you think Atlanta regrets spending a king’s ransom to get Julio? Do you think Philly regrets trading up for Wentz? Obviously there are examples that go the other way so you have to hit on the pick, but clearly what we have been doing each year hasn’t been enough. Do something different!
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:52 am
It’s still a long way till the draft, so I’ll play “Devil’s Advocate,” I watched a fairly well injury decimated Crew take it to the Saints in a game I feel NO needed to win. After a quick review of our IR list I realized that maybe we don’t have as many glaring holes as we think. Then I added in a lot of really close losses this year and came away far more optimistic and excited about 2018. A few more healthy key players could have made a difference, so yes I would trade up to get Grubb if he was there and I might do the Same for Barkley. From pick three on down is always a question mark, sometime you win sometimes you lose. I say go for the best for a change, get the number one ranked player regardless of the cost. Last year we waited it out and got OJ, but that is not going to happen every year. And if you think I am an idiot, wait till you hear how I feel about Pass rushers, Go to a 3-4 and blitz more.
January 23rd, 2018 at 9:57 am
@OrlandoJoe … “Barkley or Chubb would obviously be great picks. But Tampa have huge needs at guard, corner back, and safety which could also be filled by Quenton Nelson (the next Zack Martin) or Minkah Fitzpatrick (the next Jalen Ramsey).”
Don’t disagree at all that Nelson & Fitzpatrick will be awesome players, BUT … Bucs greatest need is at DE. If Bucs don’t focus on fixing the defense this year, then 2017 will play out all over again in 2018. Grab Chubb if he’s there at #7, but if he’s not then move on in our priorities list.
After DE, next greatest need is DT, then after that CB. Several very good Guards in Free Agency, and any number of very good RBs in FA & in the draft. DTs & CBs are a bit harder to find in Free Agency, but several are there. And there’s also several good ones in the draft it looks like right now. Fix the OLine in FA; fix the DLine in FA (to a degree) AND then focus on that in the draft. Grab a CB & RB someplace in the Top-4 in the draft.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:02 am
Just looking for opinions here. Say we stay pat at pick #7 and Chubb/Barkley are both gone. What then? Really think Nelson is good value @ 7? Draft Minkah? Trade down and try for another DE? What you all think?
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:06 am
Trade up for Saquoan.Him and OJ in the Backfield on pass protection?!man we wouldn’t have to address the oline at all!
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:08 am
@Defense Rules…..actually if you get Saquoan and become a top 3 power offense and can actually score points then our defense could stay put!this past season we lost 7games by one score or less.if you get a running back that’s legit and score more points per game than last year we’ll be fine.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:09 am
I could see us trading up, despite holes all over the shop, if they can trade 2019 picks plus a couple of third days picks.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:22 am
The Bucs simply need too many players to give up the pics needed to jump up high enough to get Barkley–and probably Chubb too.
There’s just too much to fix.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:23 am
I sincerely doubt a team in position to draft Barkley or Chubb would pass on them and trade down…….
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:25 am
@El_Buc941 … “actually if you get Saquoan and become a top 3 power offense and can actually score points then our defense could stay put!” That’s EXACTLY what Licht banked on these past 2 years by focusing on offense to the detriment of the defense. How’d that work out for us?
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:28 am
Over/under on articles about the Bucs needing a running back or how bad our running backs are (or were) = 5 per week
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:33 am
As much as I want the Bucs to draft Bradley Chubb, I just don’t think the Bucs are in a position to give up any picks in the first three rounds.
If Chubb is not available at 7 the Bucs could go with Minkah Fitzpatrick or Derwin James. Both would dramatically improve the secondary on day one.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:34 am
“When was the last time we traded up in the first round to grab someone we wanted? I truly can’t remember, so it’s obviously been a while. ”
Kenyatta Walker…………LOL…..
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:40 am
Trade down for a LT and DE with the second pick you acquire. There are plenty of good RBs near the front of the Second Rd. Get a starting Center with the Third Pick, and a 250 lb DE near the start of the fourth Round. Fill your CB, Safety, and stud DT in Free Agency. Within the last three rounds get Florida’s Placekicker and two fast backup players who are good tacklers for Special Teams and backup duty. Install a 3-4 aggressive Defense with the new DT as your nose Tackle and use McCoy as the 3 technique on one end and our tall Michigan State DE as our five technique on the other end. That should make us instantly competitive next year.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:54 am
Offer WR Jackson and a late round pick to Cleveland to swap picks.
If we could acquire the #4 pick, then DE Chubb or RB Barkely will be there.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:58 am
Offer TE Brate to swap picks with Cleveland’s #4.
That will net us either DE Chubb or RB Barkely.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:00 am
do not trade up!!!!!!….Cleveland will screw up….someone will fall to us!!!!!…GO BUCS!!!!
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:00 am
Neither one is gonna be available at pick 7 but as many have stated here, Bucs cant afford to move up unless someone gets traded like throwing in Djax into the deal. I still say this draft has to be all defense and grab a RB, DL and OL in free agency.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:05 am
I’m in the trade down camp. Draft clelin Ferrell and Guice
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:07 am
I like Licht on his draft choices. I even liked the Power move to get Agaryo(one of few that would say that, it didn’t work out. It happens. Deal with it).
If the dude decides Chubb is worth a trade up I’ll support it.
The only thing that worry’s me about this years draft is that Licht is drafting for his job and not necessarily for the future of our team. I’m nervous that may lead him to make a poor decision like not snagging Nelson if that’s the BPA.
While our Oline isn’t the biggest need our guard play is currently taken a nose dive and guard danger sure is a need.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:12 am
I live in Steeler country and Brown country and Penn State country.
The Browns have less holes than Bucs. They just need a QB.
The Browns have a ton of picks this year and they do not need anymore. They have a lot of good young players across the team. They have a good defense and decent OL. They have good RBs and drafted TE Njoku last year. What the team needs is more veterans in skill positions like WR.
Offer WR DJack AND HIS 2018 SALARY to Cleveland for swapping picks #4 and #7
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:17 am
Name the last Penn State RB to be any good.
This guy didn’t even get 100 yards in most games.
Elliot benefits from best OLINE in game also , we far from that.
Rather get other need before him.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:23 am
PA……IMO it might be very hard for the Browns to turn down a chance to walk out of the draft with a franchise RB and QB.
Of course Both the Giants and Colts are looking for a RB so the Brown would have to select Barkley #1. So that means the only way they do that is if they have two QBs rated almost the same or have a good inkling who the Giants will take and wanna gamble on their QB.
Those first four picks could go so many directions. This will be a very interesting draft.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:25 am
The Truth……For What its worth I was saying the same thing about Penn State receivers and was laughing at the hype surrounding the Godwin selection.
Just a lil truth for ya.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:31 am
NO TRADE UP!!! There are guys in the top ten at every position we need (Chubb, Barkley, Fitzpatrick, Nelson) that look like they could play very good ball in the NFL and a very good chance of having at least one of them falling to us at #7. IF ANYTHING MAKE A MAJOR TRADE DOWN GETTING US ANOTHER SECOND AND THIRD ROUND PICK.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:33 am
C’mon Joe, give me a little credit for saying that about Julio on this site more than a few times, you don’t have to call me by name, but at least say one of your readers. I would only trade up for Chubb, not Barkley, I think there are other RB’s in this draft that are going to do well in this league.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:36 am
WE TRADED UP FOR A KICKER
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:37 am
@ aego,
Bucs traded back into the first round for Doug Martin, initially that worked out pretty good
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:46 am
Barkley is overrated. Take Guice in the second round and he will be the truth. Chubb if he falls to us in the first which I think its gonna happen. If not, trade back and go after davenport or key.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:52 am
@ Jimmy Jack
I completely understand everyone’s concern about Barkley not having some 100 yard games. I get it. I really do. In fact, the Talking Heads will make a giant deal about it and show Barkley slide a little in player rankings.
Having said that, I watched those games and understand why it happened.
Penn State began to force Barkley to be the entire offense and points production. The defensive opponents literally just spied 2 defenders on Barkley or completely shifted their defensive scheme on Barkley. Once Penn State adjusted back to using him in a more balanced offense, his numbers went back up.
In an NFL offense, Barkley will be able to be both a top RB and a threat with play action. Play action combined with NFL good pass catching receivers will keep the defense honest and allow Barkley to excel in the NFL
Another argument to the statement of sub 100 yard games. OJ Howard was not used much as a Receiver at Alabama, but he has great hands and will be a huge threat as a receiver in the NFL. Barkely can do everything. He can be a 3 down back. He is a bruiser of a RB, he is shifty in open space, he is a great pass catcher, he is amazing at Pass-Pro, and he can return kicks.
All of those things make him more valuable in the NFL. All of those attributes easily negate a couple sub 100 yard games.
NFL teams have a dedicated player for 3rd down back, short yardage back, scat-back, and more dedicated RB labels. Barkley can do all of those things at an elite level. That is what makes him superior than other college rushers who have more yards per game.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:53 am
We have marginal run blockers. The worst if not close to it.
And we also have the worst defensive line in the nfl
So……. Let’s draft a running back with a high first round pick….
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:56 am
For you dudes saying not to trade up you just can’t say that with conviction.
SAY Chubb or Barkley go on to play HOF careers? Would you trade up for that? Of course you would.
It all depends on the evaluation. If they think either of those guys will be that type of generational player they should try to trade up.
You just can’t say they aren’t that good. Nobody truely knows.
What matters most is the evaluation. If you wanna say with conviction they won’t be that great then put in the work that those who evaluate do. Start watching film from these guys for at least five hours a day every day. Then be prepare to study every measurable that’s out their during the combine and get ready for 12 hour days worth of evaluation as the draft nears…….I’m just guessing at how much time they put into evaluation but I’m sure it’s something close to that.
Just let these guys do their jobs and we can guess and second guess after. Then we’ll see how it plays out.
And yes it’s fair to have an opinion they shouldn’t trade up. But if they do don’t go nuts. Believe that traded up for good reason and be prepared to cheer on on shiny new rookie.
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:58 am
And they also have a team of evaluators….It’s not just one guys opinion
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:04 pm
Trade up for a RB?
Trade up for a single DE?
Those who are ignorant of history are doomed to repeat the worst parts of it.
Barkley looks sensational. He is not going to fix the Bucs, especially if they have to give up a ton of picks to get him. Chubb is terrific and I hope he falls to 7. But trading up is a baaaaaassad idea. Why?
The Bucs need so much more and it has never worked out for them historically over the past 15 years when they’ve drafted a RB high or put all of their hopes into a single DE. The Bucs just don’t have the coaching track record at these positions.
The Bucs need to take multiple shots at the D-line. They also need to take multiple shots at the O-line as well to truly fix the running game. My hope… they bring in 8 new faces on the lines to compete with the incumbents and fortify the trenches. The Bucs need to ADD picks to do this – not trade up.
Fix the trenches, fix the Bucs!!
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:05 pm
The team needs to trade a couple of player’s and get more picks
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:25 pm
If the last few drafts have shown anything, it’s that there is value at the RB position in the middle rounds. Bucs have too many holes to fill at OL, DE, DB, to waste on trying to move up for anyone! If anything, trade down and get another puck or two.
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:34 pm
I agree Jimmy Jack.
We need to bring in more blood to the DL.
I think injuries and DM22 had more of an impact on the horrendous running game than actual problem without OL needing massive upgrades.
No matter whether the Bucs are #1 in sacks in 2018 or not, the Bucs need to find solutions to bring in more talent to the DL.
I think there will be Defensive Linemen who are to be had in the next couple months. I think Bennett does get released. I think DT Poe is obtainable. I think Vernon could be had with a Trade including DJack and a paid in full salary. There are possibilities out there.
I think we are going to see some players released from teams and I think Licht will make some moves. He can’t afford not to at this point.
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:34 pm
Trading up for Barkley, no way. Trading up for Chubb, hell yes. I would offer our 1st next year to do it. This guy is a machine who lives football.
I think Indy takes Chubb at 3 so he won’t be available at 4 to make a trade.
We just need to take Nelson or Payne and be done with it since Chubb won’t be around
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:35 pm
Off the field?
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:38 pm
@JimmyJack,
Excellent post! 100% agree.
For those that say the Bucs need so much more, I ask you this: were you saying that going into last year? None of us were. So who is to say that getting a game changing player or two isn’t all we need? Getting that 10-15 sack guy could have been the difference in us being able to close some of those games out where our defense couldn’t hold. Maybe getting the Zeke Elliott type RB keeps pressure off Jameis and our offense explodes as a result. You simply don’t know. The fate of a team can change very quickly in the NFL, and there are many many examples of 1 or two guys doing just that. You can get average players anywhere. I want superstars.
January 23rd, 2018 at 12:45 pm
I’m starting to hop on the Vea bandwagon if Chubb isn’t there then trade down grab Vea… guy is a freak athlete especially with his size
January 23rd, 2018 at 1:53 pm
Granted as kid Franco Harris & Curt Warner were some of my favorite running backs. But lets not forget Penn St.’s “cursed?” past Top 5 Running Backs.
Top 5 Drafted – Penn St. Running Backs (Bust)
• Blair Thomas – NFL Draft: 1990 / Round: 1 / Pick: 2
• Ki-Jana Carter – NFL Draft: 1995 / Round: 1 / Pick: 1
• Curtis Enis – NFL Draft: 1998 / Round: 1 / Pick: 5
Honorable Mention: D.J. Dozier (14th), John Cappelletti (11th)
January 23rd, 2018 at 2:45 pm
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WHAT IS THIS INSANITY I’M READING?
TRADE UP TO #4 FOR BRADLEY CHUBB? UM, NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If Chubb hasn’t been drafted in the first 3 picks, he will almost assuredly be there for us at #7, so why in the world would we trade up to #4?
Listen, if the Browns take Saquon at #1 like I expect, there either going to take a QB or Minkah at #4 as pretty much everyone expects.
That leaves only the Broncos and Jets ahead of us and neither of those teams needs to take Chubb and there is basically zero buzz that either of those teams would consider taking a DE with their first pick. They both need QBs and CBs and the Broncos could also really use an OT and the Jets another safety.
So, again, if Chubb isn’t taken by the Colts at #3 it’s a good bet he’ll be there for us at #7, so NO TRADE-UPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And, if you’re saying we should trade up to #4 for Saquon … not going to happen. I’d say there is a 75% chance the Browns take him #1 overall … if they pass I’d say there is a 50% chance the Giants take him at #2 overall … and if they pass I’d say there is a 75 % chance the Colts take him at #3 overall … and if they pass I’d say there is a 100% chance the Browns take him at #4 overall and would NOT trade down with us.
IN CONCLUSION:
1. If the Bucs want to be guaranteed Saquon, they’d need to trade up to #1 … and that would be INSANE for a team with as many holes as the Bucs,
2. If the Bucs want to be guaranteed Chubb they’d have to trade all the way up to #3 and that would also be INSANE for a team with as many holes as the Bucs.
Just stick at #7 and hope Chubb falls … if he doesn’t you can still draft MINKAH FITZPATRICK who is being compared to a mix of Jalen Ramsay and Jamal Adams, and QUENTON NELSON who many think is better than the Cowboys Zack Martin and can be an ALL-PRO (not just “Pro Bowler”) as a rookie and is considered the “safest pick in the draft” … and if you really don’t want either of those guys, then TRADE DOWN with the Bills and take maybe a poor man’s Bradley Chubb and a poor man’s Quenton Nelson in Sam Hubbard and Billy Price, or a stud DT and SS like Viti Vea and Ronnie Harrison, etc.
Personally, I think the draft will unfold as follows:
Browns: Saquon Barkley
Giants: Josh Rosen
Browns (trade up with Colts): Sam Darnold
Colts: Bradley Chubb
Broncos: Josh Allen
Jets: Baker Mayfield
Bucs: Minkah Fitzpatrick or Quenton Nelson or a TRADE DOWN
HOWEVER … all it would take for Chubb to fall to the Bucs is for the Browns and Giants to pass on Saquon at #1-2 as I think the Colts then take him at #3 which would lead Chubb falling to us at #7 … I think it’s highly unlikely though.
ALSO … the possibly STROKE-INDUCING situation would be that my top 4 holds true but that the Broncos get Cousins in free agency (highly possible) and therefore take Quenton Nelson at #5 … and the Jets decide to take Minkah at #6 to pair him with Jamal Adams and give them the most talented safety duo in NFL history … and it has been reported the Jets have strong interest in Minkah.
If imho ALL of those things happen, Saquon, Chubb, Quenton and Minkah will ALL BE GONE by the time the Bucs draft at #7 … and if THAT happens, Licht MUST trade down as there just isn’t anyone else worth that #7 pick to the Bucs … not Ardey Key, certainly not Marcus Davenport, not Joshua Jackson, not Derwin James, nobody!
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January 23rd, 2018 at 2:50 pm
I would be very wary of drafting this or any RB in the top 10. But trade UP in the top 5 of the 1st to get a RB??? Are you insane Joe???
It would cost our (high) 3rd and 4th rd picks to move from #7 to #4.
Only player in this draft worth doing that for is Chubb. (and only because the Bucs are so desperate for even a decent DE with no options in FA and few in this draft).
The wise thing to do is take the highest rated player on your board at #7 who WILL be a fantastic prospect no matter what. That would likely either be Nelson or Minkah. Both play positions of “need” for the Buccaneers.
The best case scenario would be a trade down to collect extra high picks.
Trading UP from such a high pick already – especially for a RB – just seems like a really really REALLY bad idea.
I don’t believe that most people (including whichever Joe wrote this) understand how valuable this #7 overall pick is. This pick is worth more (point value/draft equity wise) than the Buccaneers 2017 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks combined.
We got OJ Howard, Justin Evans and Chris Godwin with those picks last year – and someone is going to try and say one good RB prospect is worth more than all 3 of those talented players??? With a a straight face??
There are some really good RBs who will be available top of the 2nd round this year. Even most any RB we would choose from the 3rd or 4th round would be an upgrade to what’s currently on the roster.
January 23rd, 2018 at 3:10 pm
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GREAT NEWS GUYS … Josh Allen came out and said he wants to be a Brown and a scout told MMQB that there is “no way the Browns pass on him” … so, it looks like a good bet that Saquon is going #1 and Allen #4, which will push Darnold down and I don’t see anyway he makes it past BOTH the Broncos AND Jets, so … while Chubb will still probably be taken by the Colts at #3, BOTH Minkah Fitzpatrick AND Quenton Nelson should be on the board when we draft at #7 … happy times!
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January 23rd, 2018 at 3:40 pm
If the Bucs just said screw it, we’re going all in on offense since the defensive guys aren’t there – and free agency is a bust with no real corners or DE’s available – I’d be totally in favor of just doubling down on offense again. If Dirk coaches like he did in the last few games of the season where he wasn’t ultra predictable and the Bucs can get some better o-line play, they really could move into that top top tier of offenses. Sure, I don’t think the Bucs would get far in the playoffs if they made it there, but just being in the playoffs would be such a huge boost to the franchise that they can deal with building a deep playoff run roster going forward.
So sure, if you want to really do something different, load up the offense even more and just try to outscore people. Dirk and Licht have one year to get it done – and a rookie RB can start from day 1 – where as a rookie DE can take a year or two to develop.
January 23rd, 2018 at 3:41 pm
@NFLNut,
Not sure if you realize this, but trading up can be done by other teams besides the Bucs. Another team can and will leap in front of us to get Chubb if he’s not taken in the top 3. He will not make it to 7 unless he has a horrible combine and/or gets arrested. He will never, ever, be there at 7.
January 23rd, 2018 at 3:46 pm
I suspect both B.Chubb & Barkley to be off the board at #7…& if there’s 3-4 QB’s taken in the top 6…(which I expect to happen as NYG/CLE/DEN/NYJ all have a QB need)… I’d be working the trade lines with Buffalo to flip the #7.
Under that kind of scenario, I’m guessing MIN 3 QBs: Rosen/Donald/Allen or maybe Mayfield will gone thru 6picks..leaving Rudolph & Jackson (maybe 1 of Mayfield/Allen) as the only remaining 1st rnd QBs – with CIN/AZ/JAX/NE & BUF all looking early to draft at QB.
A fair ask to move BUF up to #7 would be for BILLS #21, #53 & #56 in the 2018 draft.(#7 = 1500pts…#21-53-56 = 1510pts)
Again, under above scenario, Bucs GM/FO could really re-stock the cupboards at all the areas of need in this draft (or shuffle an extra trade piece in the 2nd to net more picks in 2018/2019)…With the current $$$ CapSpace & after cutting ties with: Sweezy, Swaggy & JuiceGerbil…Bucs will have more than enough to cover the extra 2018 picks contracts/bonuses & go get a piece or 2 from the FA market.
January 23rd, 2018 at 3:59 pm
catcard202 – If the Bucs traded back from 7 to 21st, they’d have to get both of Buffalo’s 1st rounders out of it, no matter what the trade point chart says. Also in that case, if there was one QB left that all these teams want, they should be able to get quite the haul if there was a bidding war taking place.
January 23rd, 2018 at 4:10 pm
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Hawaiin Buc,
I disagree with you entirely.
NO TEAM is trading up into the top 4 to get Chubb … it’s not going to happen imho as the price would be far to high for a DE, and because the top 4 teams won’t want to trade down.
So, that leaves the #5-6 slots for another team to leapfrog the Bucs to nab Chubb … and I just don’t see that happening, especially as there is a good chance that both the Broncos and Jets will draft a QB and neither will want to trade down and risk missing on that QB.
Also, the teams right behind us (Bears, 49’ers, Raiders, Dolphins, Bengals, Redskins) have primary needs other than DE, so I don’t see them moving ahead of us to nab Chubb.
That means the EARLIEST PICK the Broncos or Bucs could get if they trade down would be from the Packers who hold the #14 pick … and I do NOT think either the Broncos or Jets want to move all the way down from #5 or #6 to #14 as they could definitely miss out on a QB or even the top 3-4 guys on their draft board!
So … NO … I don’t see any team leap frogging the Bucs to nab Chubb and I still maintain that if the Colts don’t take him at #3 there is a very, very good chance he drops to #7.
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January 23rd, 2018 at 4:14 pm
Munch- @ #7, there will be more than 1 QB left that’s worth 1st rd consideration… Negotiating #7 for both BILLS 1st rd picks (21 & 22) seemed excessive & unlikely that Licht/FO could pull it off that kind of deal, unless there was a bidding war…JMO, but I’d gladly take 21/53/56 for 7..Especially knowing the Bucs need more than a few upgrades to contend for the NFC South/Playoffs.
I see the team needs as: Edge-DE/OT/G-C/1t DT/SS/RB/CB/K/RS & LB depth…Will take an exceptional draft/FA signing period to cover all those needs.
January 23rd, 2018 at 4:25 pm
Rod Munch,
Your take on just drafting all offense again would be, um, well, WILD … but who knows, Licht and Koetter might just do that … we’ll find out on draft night.
If they do, I’d go:
1st: Quenton Nelson
2nd: Derrius Guice
3rd: Frank Ragnow (the O-Line is now SET other than a developmental RT)
4th: Nyheim Hines (Tarik Cohen 2.0 … the RB corps is now set & dynamic)
5th: Deontay Burnett (the WR corps is now truly 5 deep & LOADED)
6th: Desmond Harrison (a developmental RT with 1st round talent!)
2nd 6th: Best QB left & develop him to flip for a higher pick down the road
January 23rd, 2018 at 4:32 pm
I think I’d rather have Sony Michel than Chubb… And after the 1st round…
January 23rd, 2018 at 5:11 pm
No trade up. Chubb or Duncan, maybe Minka or trade down. If those three are gone then the axioms of math say that a coveted QB (I didn’t say “great QB” or even “good QB” just “coveted QB” ). I’d love to get a 19 first rounder from either Buffalo or Jacksonville (would need their 20 first rounder also). Both teams think they’re super bowl contenders with a QB upgrade, but a tougher schedule and a regression to mean in terms of injury luck could see both teams at the top of the 19 draft.
January 23rd, 2018 at 5:12 pm
Should be “coveted QB is still on the board.”
January 23rd, 2018 at 5:24 pm
Cleveland has made changes,
GM. John Dorsey
HC. Hue Jackson
OC. Todd Haley
DC. Greg Williams
I love what they have done to their Staff
January 23rd, 2018 at 5:26 pm
WHO IS “DUNCAN”??????????????????????????
January 23rd, 2018 at 6:31 pm
Barkley would have an immediate impact. We would no longer be one dimensional which would make the online better. Sustaining drives would make the defense better. He is a Barry Sanders / Bo Jackson freak. I’m sure Licht and koetter have big enough balls and aren’t concerned about mortgaging the future that won’t include them anyways if there isn’t an immediate impact
January 23rd, 2018 at 7:06 pm
Bucs needs in order of importance:
Def End(s)
Def Tackle
Guard
Center (move Marpet back to guard)
Cornerback
Running back
If running game blocking isn’t stressed and executed , then running back won’t matter much. Seems to me Barber did decent job when OL executed. Bucs OL needs to be able to control line and impose will, not just protect Jameis. SMH if Bucs don’t take a lineman – offensive or defensive , in 1st round.
January 23rd, 2018 at 7:13 pm
Great posts everyone. I loved reading everyone one of them.
January 23rd, 2018 at 7:36 pm
NFLNut – To be clear I don’t think the Bucs would do that, but if they have to win this year, Cubb is off the board, there isn’t anyone on defense that is worth spending the pick on and the offers to trade down aren’t there, then the idea of loading up the offense and saying screw it, we’re all-in on just outscoring people and will try to duct tape something together on defense – well, it would be an interesting team to watch. Teams like that almost always die in the playoffs, but hey, if we’re worried about getting into the 2nd round of the playoffs, that’s a huge step up from where we are now.
Again, I don’t think that’s a legit option, just playing a what if scenario. Also I like your picks – and gambling late in the draft on a QB that you try to develop to flip later, it’s a good idea and beats the wasted yearly FB pick that Licht goes with.
January 23rd, 2018 at 10:42 pm
@ NFLNUT and all other great posters in this thread
I absolutely love all this draft talk and possible draft outcomes in comparison to all the negative idiot fans who still talk about drafts 5-10 years ago. Let’s keep talking about these players.
I believe if Chubb makes it past the Colts then he will fall to #7. No team will leapfrog us for Chubb and no team ahead of us has the desperate DE need.
I still believe The Colts will take an OT (OL). Luck has been injured 2 years in a row. If that happens again, the Colts will be rolling the dice and drafting a QB in 2019. The Colts must protect Luck.
Trade Down scenario:
I am perfectly fine with trading down If Chubb, Barkley and Nelson are gone. But I want DT Vita Vea. His stock will rise to a top 10 pick if he isn’t already a top 10 pick.
A monster DT next to McCoy would do wonders to the DL. Licht can focus on DE with the additional pick (or 2 or 3 picks),
FA acquisitions focus on DT Poe, possible DE trades, and signing CBs
January 23rd, 2018 at 11:09 pm
I emphatically state beforehand that I do not want to be right on this, but the Chubster, fitzpatrick, Nelson, Barkley (barring a small miracle) will not be around at 7. Agree with Hawaiian Buc 100%, would rather have one superstar player at one of those positions of need than have two marginal players. we have enough marginal players on this roster and it’s getting us NOWHERE!!
January 24th, 2018 at 12:01 am
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PA Privateer,
Thanks for the kind words.
However … are you saying you absolutely would not be happy with Minkah at the #7 pick?
Rick,
You say Chubb, Minkah, Saquon and Quenton will ALL BE GONE … what’s your top 6 picks look like, as I only see ONE scenario where they are ALL off the board and that’s as follows:
Browns: QB or Saquon
Giants: QB or Saquon
Colts: Chubb (the ONLY team ahead of us that will take him imho)
Browns: QB, Saquon or Minkah but Saquon MUST be off the board by this pick
Broncos: Quenton Nelson (the ONLY team ahead of us that takes him imho)
Jets: Minkah or a QB but Minkah MUST be off the board by this pick
Bucs: ALL 4 guys are gone so we TRADE DOWN
^ The above is the ONLY realistic scenario I see playing out that would leave us with none of our top 4 guys to pick from …
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