The Sorry State Of The Bucs
December 20th, 2017
Chucky represents playoff hope.
Yes, it was quite a scene Monday night at the Den of Depression when Chucky was rightfully inducted into the Ring of Honor, a move befitting the greatest coach in Bucs history.
It also reminded Joe just how dreadful this Bucs franchise has become since Chucky left. And leave it to of all people BSPN to point out how bad things are.
Since Chucky was jettisoned on that fateful Friday night in January 2009, only two teams have a worse record than the Bucs. And as Joe is quick to point out, only the brutal Browns have a worse home record than the Bucs and that’s by just one win!
Den of Depression, indeed.
Who knows if Chucky will return to coaching or not? Who knows if he will coach the Bucs next year? There first has to be an opening. But the graphic below demonstrates why so many folks are smitten with the potential return of Chucky. It’s the only hope of consistent winning and competitive football many fans have ever experienced.
December 20th, 2017 at 12:12 am
No way he comes back, but damn I wish he would.
December 20th, 2017 at 12:14 am
One constant since Gruden left: fire the coaches and clean house every couple of years! Stop the insanity!
December 20th, 2017 at 12:22 am
I’m totally against it but what do we got to lose?
December 20th, 2017 at 12:29 am
You are clamoring for a guy that us barely out the .500 range. Hell bring Dungy back with a far better record and the ability to build a team.
December 20th, 2017 at 12:33 am
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I believe Chucky has told the Glazers that he will take the HC job … but only IF they give him a fully guaranteed SIX YEAR contract worth a minimum of $45 million AND give Jameis a five year extension THIS OFFSEASON so that he is guaranteed to have Jameis for all 6 years (the 4th year of his rookie deal next season plus the five extension years) AND agree to spend heavily in free agency (unlike the first time he was Bucs coach when the Glazers were extremely stingy).
People need to remember that Chucky had a winning record with GARAGE QBs for the most part and severe salary restrictions put on his GM … if he’s going to take the job this time around, imo he wants the team to spend to the hilt and stock this team with talent and I don’t blame him.
Also … some Bucs fans whine about his post-SB record … but remember he didn’t get TWO #1 and TWO #2 draft picks because of the trade … those were the #21 and #53 picks in 2002, #32 in 2003 and #33 in 2004 … you know who was on the board at those picks? See below:
2002 #21: ED REED, S
2002 #53: BRIAN WESTBROOK, RB
2003 #32: AQUAN BOLDIN, WR
2004 #33: JARED ALLEN, DE
Just imagine what kind of a DYNASTY the Gruden Bucs could have had with the two future guaranteed HOF’ers in Ed Reed and Jared Allen, a borderline HOF wide receiver in Anquan Boldin and a very solid all-purpose RB in Brian Westbrook!
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December 20th, 2017 at 12:42 am
That graphic is an idiotic and pointless comparison.
Chucky’s post-Superbowl winning percentage was .469 which is worse than mediocre…
The fact that the subsequent coaches presided over even worse records does not in any way logically support the idea of rehiring Chucky. I’d prefer hiring a coach that would give us hope of something better than Gruden’s 7 year winning percentage of .509.
The legend of Chucky is much greater than the reality… by a wide margin.
December 20th, 2017 at 12:49 am
@NFLNut-
If Chucky’s (and Bruce Allen’s) overall draft record was any indicator, they would’ve probably blown it and not picked Reed, Westbrook, Boldin, or Allen.
In the 5 years after the draft penalties, there was ample opportunity to build up the roster… but he didn’t, so that whole idea of being crippled by the trade is B.S. He was not even a decent talent evaluator.
You say: “People need to remember that Chucky had a winning record”
We remember that his record overall was .509, which isn’t special, it’s mediocre.
Nostalgia is all the Chucky thing is… Desperate fans trying to catch lightning in a bottle.
December 20th, 2017 at 1:01 am
^ You may be right … I never watched the Bucs back then … it just seems to me that any coach who misses out on TWO #1s and TWO #2s in a 3 year span AND has owners that put a hard cap on free agency spending is playing from behind the 8-ball, no?
It’s kind of like Marvin Lewis … I’m not a “fan” of Marvin but the record he has with that asinine franchise and cheap owner is actually pretty remarkable when you think about it … they could and probably should be worse than the Browns but are infinitely better
I just think that just as one most take “situation” into account when evaluating players, one should do the same thing when evaluating coaches.
December 20th, 2017 at 1:25 am
I feel bad for you bucs fans that can’t move on from the past and thrive in the offseason hype like a school girl swooning over Winston’s jock. You are setting yourselves up for a huge let down yet again. Gruden not returning is gonna crush your overzealous offseason dreams again and put the next HC in a hole from the beginning. Bucs fans need some smelling salt and a slap in the face. Gruden aint coming back and stop wearing Alstott and Barber mesh jerseys with holes in them from bankrupt Sports Authority that you bought in 2000 to games in 2017 you look stupid and outdated on TV.
December 20th, 2017 at 5:13 am
Youve gota find the right coach before you keep him longer than 2 years. Duh. From 7-9 to 4-10. What do some of you guys want another wasted year and a 2-14 third year before he gets fired. My goodness open up your eyes. Game planning, time management, basic math, patty cake training camp, who to start…i mean the list goes on n on but I gota get ready for work, go to the job I dont suck at. These coaches are baaaaaaaaad.
December 20th, 2017 at 6:38 am
I agree with Darin, these coaches don’t get the most out of these players whether that is X’s and Os or motivating them and the Glazers see that, history has shown that Glazers will not tolerate it, keep on searching until you find the right Guy.
December 20th, 2017 at 6:44 am
Like john wick, I think he is “most definitely back.”
This year or next (cause not sure if son is senior in high school now or upcoming year – cause once all kiddies out of house , its game on. )
I’m sure glazers has talk with him Monday night.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:05 am
Loved him when he was here, appreciate the success he had. He won’t be back and I am glad. We need stability and continued rebuilding. Chucky would become frustrated with this process and I’d rather remember him as a winner. Keep Koetter, keep Licht, add talent and continue rebuilding.. Another manor change would be disastrous.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:09 am
NFLNut Says:
December 20th, 2017 at 12:33 am
*********************
I believe Chucky has told the Glazers that he will take the HC job … but only IF they give him a fully guaranteed SIX YEAR contract worth a minimum of $45 million AND give Jameis a five year extension THIS OFFSEASON so that he is guaranteed to have Jameis for all 6 years (the 4th year of his rookie deal next season plus the five extension years) AND agree to spend heavily in free agency (unlike the first time he was Bucs coach when the Glazers were extremely stingy).
People need to remember that Chucky had a winning record with GARAGE QBs for the most part and severe salary restrictions put on his GM … if he’s going to take the job this time around, imo he wants the team to spend to the hilt and stock this team with talent and I don’t blame him.
Also … some Bucs fans whine about his post-SB record … but remember he didn’t get TWO #1 and TWO #2 draft picks because of the trade … those were the #21 and #53 picks in 2002, #32 in 2003 and #33 in 2004 … you know who was on the board at those picks? See below:
2002 #21: ED REED, S
2002 #53: BRIAN WESTBROOK, RB
2003 #32: AQUAN BOLDIN, WR
2004 #33: JARED ALLEN, DE
Just imagine what kind of a DYNASTY the Gruden Bucs could have had with the two future guaranteed HOF’ers in Ed Reed and Jared Allen, a borderline HOF wide receiver in Anquan Boldin and a very solid all-purpose RB in Brian Westbrook!
I couldn’t agree with you more NFLNut! I did see it and live it and let me tell you it was AWESOME!!! The vibe and culture of this team and in this area was electric when we got Jon and even more when they won the Super Bowl! These are legitimate reasons for not having a better record/success after the Super Bowl, I don’t care what any jacka$$ on here says. And do me a favor, STOP with the Tony Dungy crap! He NEVER won anything in this town, he was hard headed and wouldn’t change his ways or coaching staff even after the Glazer’s told him to and that’s why he was fired……RIGHTLY SO! If he’s such a great coach and defensive genius, why did it take him 5 YEARS to win a Super Bowl with an already made hell of an offense with the Colts? He had Peyton Manning in his prime, Edgrin James, and Marvin Harrison. All he had to do was put together a defense, which he had pieces of it already in place. And by the way, he had NOTHING to do with getting the HOF core of our defense…….Warren Sapp, Derrick Brooks, and Jonh Lynch were drafted by Rich McCay and SAM WYCHE. I respect Tony for what he did bring to our team, but make no mistake it was Jon Gruden that got us over the hump to win a Super Bowl with his offense and the players HE BROUGHT in here! BRING JON BACK!!!!!!!
December 20th, 2017 at 7:11 am
Dungy 54-42 (56.25% winning percentage) > Chucky 50.89% winning percentage. We were used to winning for over a decade. Now that seems like so long ago.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:11 am
Dungy 54-42 (56.25% winning percentage) > Chucky 50.89% winning percentage. We were used to winning for over a decade. Now that seems like so long ago.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:15 am
Why would we want Gruden? We know most Buc fans think of themselves of being “lovable losers”. Let’s just take another crap shoot coach and hope it all works out…after all….a couple more years and Jameis will be a FA, we will have another fired coach and by that time, we can start all over again. And when I look at my Packer fan friends, I feel so badly for them… usually having to cheer your team all the way to January…much disinterest in the draft as they always draft so low in the rounds. Poor guys…their seasons out of the Playoffs are about as “normal” as our playoff appearances are.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:16 am
Gruden coming back will not change anything. Our problem ever since Malcom Glazer got ill is not having good ownership. Now the Glazer family is nice people but at the end of the day, they DON’T CARE.
You need ownership who is passionate and committed to winning! Sure anyone can make money and be great in the community, but WHO CARES. We want WINNERS!! People who want to win! People who care!! It all starts at the top.
Unfortunately owning an NFL team is something you don’t give up unless you’re forced to, so I don’t foresee an ownership change in the next 10 years at least.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:18 am
Joe:
1 You have to fire Dirk and his staff. (Keep Jason L.)
2 I believe you have to trade (hate saying this) GMC and LVD someway make this trade turn to a extra 1 and 2 extra 2s.
3 Pay Harbrough whatever he needs to leave
4 Hire Rex Ryan as d coordinator
5 Sheldon Richardson (sea) Trumaine Johnson (CB rams) Dontae Poe (atl)
6 Arden Key DE 1st LSU Mike McGlinchey OT 2nd 1st ND Jaire Alexander CB, Louisville 2nd Harold Landry DE 2nd BC
Give Harbrough a gem in the 3rd Rasheed Penny RB San Diego State.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:19 am
Joe:
1 You have to fire Dirk and his staff. (Keep Jason L.)
2 I believe you have to trade (hate saying this) GMC and LVD someway make this trade turn to a extra 1 and 2 extra 2s.
3 Pay Harbrough whatever he needs to leave
4 Hire Rex Ryan as d coordinator
5 Sheldon Richardson (sea) Trumaine Johnson (CB rams) Dontae Poe (atl) Andrew Norwell (guard Carolina)
6 Arden Key DE 1st LSU Mike McGlinchey OT 2nd 1st ND Jaire Alexander CB, Louisville 2nd Harold Landry DE 2nd BC
Give Harbrough a gem in the 3rd Rasheed Penny RB San Diego State.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:21 am
Actually Bucutoo. That was the “unusual decade”. The Bucs are the NFC Browns…. lets be honest about it. One good decade out of four….pathetic is the only word that describes that. And we are left to argue whether Dungy or Gruden is the best coach. But this year, we have cheer…the Packers will finally be playing two meaningless football games after a Decade….poor guys. And just think about it…if you include pre-season in our total games, how many of our games haven’t been meaningless, with draft considerations excluded. Maybe about a third?
December 20th, 2017 at 7:28 am
Just think about that guys…let it sink in….if you include pre-season four games, and about three or four games at the end of the normal year in the history of our franchise, over a third of the games we have played in our history have had no meaning in the context of playoffs or championships. They have eventually been for talent evaluation and jockeying for draft position. Just hit me this morning. Wildly pathetic.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:31 am
Let’s bring back Schiano…..he kicked Freeman’s a$$ and he will do the same for Swaggy, Martin, TJ Ward and Tmax.
December 20th, 2017 at 7:38 am
Symptoms and signs of a sick diseased Buc sheep
*posting about jim harbaugh being tampa HC. WTF! why would harbaugh come to a losing irrelevant sports city like tampa? Again WTF!
* posting a ex hc coach like rex ryan humble himself to become a defensive coordinators…again WTF!
December 20th, 2017 at 8:03 am
You know what I never hear anyone say when talking about Gruden?
He shouldn’t have been fired to begin with! Yes, I said it! Gruden should STILL be coaching this team.
For those with short memories, he was fired after CONSECUTIVE 9-7 seasons. The “purge” of iconic players didn’t occur as many fans think it did. There were HUGE cap issues surrounding this team because of the acquisitions of Simeon Rice, Keyshawn (A-hole), and Gruden himself. Couple that with the picks the Bucs gave up for Key and Gru.
For Keyshawn, in addition to his salary the Bucs traded 2 first round picks in the 2000 draft. For Gruden, the Bucs traded their first and second picks in 2002, first round pick in 2003, and a second round pick in 2004.
Now, someone please tell me about Gruden’s inability to develop talent because it looks to me like he was never given the opportunity until 2005.
For more history, in 2008-09 the year they jettisoned coach Gruden, the defense was giving up 30 points a game in December. Why is that stat important you ask? Well, Monte Kiffin announced his imminent departure to join his son Lane in college football. Kiffin’s defense was almost solely to blame for the 4 game losing streak which led to Gruden’s departure.
Now, do we have any more revisionist history that needs to be addressed?!
I’m not exactly for bringing back Gruden per se, I’m not exactly against it either.
December 20th, 2017 at 8:06 am
Whether you like, love or hate Gruden he is one of the most knowledgable X’s and O’s coaches on not only offense but defense as well. One thing every player under Gruden would say is he had us prepared on game day. Other teams may have out played us but almost never out coached. If you remember Gruden in his Last years as a Raiders coach took Dungy’s Bucs team to the wood shed like 44-10 and this was with Sapp, Brooks ,Lynch, Barber, etc….
December 20th, 2017 at 8:37 am
Should have never been fired in the first place
December 20th, 2017 at 8:47 am
Bucfanman… Thank You…how soon they forget. And how they have forgotten what it means to be a team really competing for the ring. Instead, they would grasp at straws and wild dreaming. Don’t know if Gruden would take the job….but to have an offensive system and coach that is a proven quantity…wouldn’t that be refreshing?
December 20th, 2017 at 8:49 am
But Jay…he wasn’t easy for the players to get along with. Some really didn’t like him. He would have never won a popularity contest…and isn’t that really what it is all about?
December 20th, 2017 at 8:53 am
GRUDEN! GRUDEN! GRUDEN GRUDEN!
December 20th, 2017 at 9:06 am
And we haven’t seen anything yet….wait until Joe or the other working professionals on this board goes to the “teach in” classroom in their neighborhood to talk to the little kiddies about broadcasting and website development and such, and half the kids in the classroom have on Jacksonville Jaguar jerseys, hats, etc…
December 20th, 2017 at 9:13 am
Bucfanman
Also remember that when the defense collapsed those last 4 games that Monte had pretty much handed it over to Raheem who was thought to be the next defensive coordinator
Also, the NFL had a salary ceiling but no floor, so the Blazers close the checkbook as they were still arranging some of their financing for ManU and reorganizing their debt. Gruden had no money to get the players he needed.
Also, the Bucs were already suffering from the traded away draft picks from the Keyshon Johnson trade
December 20th, 2017 at 9:22 am
Brian- I remember there was quite a rift between Jon and Monte during that span. It was rumored that Monte simply quit attending meetings.
I mean think about what effect trading FOUR 1st round picks and TWO 2nd round picks over a four year span has on a franchise. That’s 6 potential starters. Let it soak in, SIX.
And the cap! Why do you think he targeted older veterans? Hint: $$$ (Cheap!)
December 20th, 2017 at 9:28 am
I pray no Chucky but all coaches in the bldg need to be replaced
December 20th, 2017 at 9:34 am
My man Chucky has a nose for them little..nice lookin honey’s huh? Initially I wanted Gruden back But..I have rethought the process. Unless he’s changed, I don’t see him developing a lot of good young players from the draft. Gruden luvs vets. And would bring in a lot of guys rather long in the tooth. Not so sure that would be good for us. I just know one thing…Our Bucs will never reach that so called..Promised land under Koetter and Pressbox Smitty. Thats a fact!! Hell, even Gruden would be better than these clowns.
December 20th, 2017 at 9:50 am
Every team is different. You guys claiming Gruden isn’t the answer pointing at his .509 record need to take off your Buc blinders and remember he had a career in Oakland before he came here.
He had that team as a legitimate contender. Don’t know his record there don’t care…….Point is that he has an ability to get his team playing at a champoionship level. That’s why I would welcome him back.
December 20th, 2017 at 10:03 am
NFLNUT
You Didn’t watch the Bucs back then???? Then how are you such a Gruden expert?
Some people smfh.
December 20th, 2017 at 10:36 am
and to people who complain about 57-55 that was w/o a franchise QB
yes the whole dam league passed on aaron Rodgers even Gruden said he should of drafted him
I think that is why most haters cant stand him cause they haven’t forgiven that
SORRY NOT SORRY …that under gruden we never sucked enuff to get a #1pick that deems taking a QB obvious
LOL SMH
December 20th, 2017 at 10:37 am
if he made chicken spit out of simms and Garcia what would he do with Jameis……
you haters I tell you smh
December 20th, 2017 at 10:39 am
and that 9-7 record we give koetter SO MUCH credit for came with a much weaker schedule
AND
the D holding 8 teams to 20 or less sometimes single digits….but for 3 years the offense cant average more than 20
that kills any koetter argument
December 20th, 2017 at 10:40 am
Gruden career record 95-81
Dungy career record 139-69
Pewter pirate dont say you have respect for TD and then say he never won anything in this town… He took us from bag over our head fans to respectability, no easy feat for the laughing stock of all pro sports.
December 20th, 2017 at 10:53 am
JimmyJack Says:
December 20th, 2017 at 9:50 am
Every team is different. You guys claiming Gruden isn’t the answer pointing at his .509 record need to take off your Buc blinders and remember he had a career in Oakland before he came here.
He had that team as a legitimate contender. Don’t know his record there don’t care…….Point is that he has an ability to get his team playing at a champoionship level. That’s why I would welcome him back.
Exactly JimmyJack, he had two teams in that Super Bowl…..TWO!!! The Oakland Raiders had the number four total and passing offense in the league in 2001 and number two total offense and number one passing offense in 2002……all because of JON GRUDEN!! For crying out loud he made Rich freaking Gannon a league MVP! Rich Gannon was a journeyman quarterback before Jon coached him. And don’t give me this, well Bill Callahan was their offensive coordinator in 2001 and their head coach in 2002…….Bill Callahan is a putz. He’s an offensive line coach, that’s it. It was Jon implementing his offense and calling all of the offensive plays. I just don’t get some of you out there. Stop being influenced by Gruden haters and just do some research and look at the FACTS.
December 20th, 2017 at 10:59 am
If Jon wont come back to coach Winston after seeing the great game he played, he won’t ever come back.
Winston plus Gruden would equal championships,
Look what the man did with Rich Gannon. Total journeyman before Chucky got him. The quick west coast passing game is perfect for Jameis.
A very long shot unfortunately. Thanks for running him out of town you morons.
December 20th, 2017 at 11:00 am
Pirate/ Nate
Here’s a few facts for ya
With the 4th pick in the 2007 NFL Draft, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers selected Gaines Adams, DE, Clemson
Other Notable Choices before next pick: FS LaRon Landry, RB Adrian Peterson, ILB Patrick Willis, RB Marshawn Lynch, CB Darrelle Revis, OLB Lawrence Timmons, SS Michael Grifin, WR Dwayne Bowe, FS Brandon Meriweather, FS Reggie Nelson, ILB Jon Beason, DE Anthony Spencer, OT Joe Staley, and TE Greg Olson
With the 37th pick in the 2007 NFL Draft the Tampa Bay Buccaneers select, Sabby Piscitelli, SS, Oregon State.
Allen and Gruden, not a clue in personnel decisions
December 20th, 2017 at 11:04 am
Jmarkbuc Says:
December 20th, 2017 at 10:40 am
Gruden career record 95-81
Dungy career record 139-69
Pewter pirate dont say you have respect for TD and then say he never won anything in this town… He took us from bag over our head fans to respectability, no easy feat for the laughing stock of all pro sports.
So f@$king what?? Did he win a championship for the Bucs……….HELL NO!! I respect the man for who he is as a man and how he did take us out of being the laughing stock of the NFL. But he WOULD not win a championship here because of his stubborn ways and not cutting ties with Mike Shula and bringing in a legitimate offensive coordinator. Tony was not going to to it here. Hell like I said before, it took him FIVE years to win a championship with an already made awesome offense. I don’t care about the win/loss record, I care about championships. I was sorry to see Tony go the way that he went (very sh#tty of the Glazers to do him the way they did, but that’s the Glazer way) but he had to go. And I for one was ecstatic when we got Jon to replace Tony.
December 20th, 2017 at 11:05 am
PP99…very true….I’m not saying that Gruden would make a good GM. But he did get everything out of a team that it had in them. And honestly, Koetter hasn’t. And regarding the way they played Monday…great to see. But anyone think that part of that might not be that they were “playing for Koetters job”? That they were playing to the National Audience?…For respect from other past and current NFL players on the sidelines and at home watching them? Better still, you might ask yourself why it took a Monday night game to motivate them to play that way?
December 20th, 2017 at 11:11 am
Jmarkbuc Says:
December 20th, 2017 at 11:00 am
Pirate/ Nate
Here’s a few facts for ya
With the 4th pick in the 2007 NFL Draft, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers selected Gaines Adams, DE, Clemson
Other Notable Choices before next pick: FS LaRon Landry, RB Adrian Peterson, ILB Patrick Willis, RB Marshawn Lynch, CB Darrelle Revis, OLB Lawrence Timmons, SS Michael Grifin, WR Dwayne Bowe, FS Brandon Meriweather, FS Reggie Nelson, ILB Jon Beason, DE Anthony Spencer, OT Joe Staley, and TE Greg Olson
With the 37th pick in the 2007 NFL Draft the Tampa Bay Buccaneers select, Sabby Piscitelli, SS, Oregon State.
Allen and Gruden, not a clue in personnel decisions
Hey genius, you do realize that the Gains Adams pick was a MONTE KIFFEN PICK!! That’s right, the Glazers told Jon that he needed to draft a DE. That it was Monte’s turn to get defensive players. I agree that Allen is clueless and that he had the GM job because of who his father was. Sabby Piscitelli was an awful pick, I agree with that. They were trying too hard to replace John Lynch……which is impossible to do.
December 20th, 2017 at 11:13 am
Given 1 or 2 more seasons Dungy would have won a superbowl here, maybe more than one, and we wouldn’t be the dysfunctional franchise we are now.
People say Gruden shouldnt have been fired after a 9-7 season. Tony was fired after a playoff season…who does that??
December 20th, 2017 at 11:15 am
So you are saying the GM and HC dont have final say on first round picks?
December 20th, 2017 at 11:15 am
mark2001 Says:
December 20th, 2017 at 11:05 am
PP99…very true….I’m not saying that Gruden would make a good GM. But he did get everything out of a team that it had in them. And honestly, Koetter hasn’t. And regarding the way they played Monday…great to see. But anyone think that part of that might not be that they were “playing for Koetters job”? That they were playing to the National Audience?…For respect from other past and current NFL players on the sidelines and at home watching them? Better still, you might ask yourself why it took a Monday night game to motivate them to play that way?
I totally agree with you. I don’t want Jon to be the GM, I want him to coach and only coach.
December 20th, 2017 at 11:16 am
Jmark….better stop while you are ahead. We wouldn’t have won a SB with Tony here. He was a great coach and a great guy. But we absolutely couldn’t get over Philly… With the O we had, they had our number. All that would have happened is that we would have seen the window close on the careers of at least a couple of our players with no SB to show for it.
December 20th, 2017 at 11:19 am
Jmarkbuc Says:
December 20th, 2017 at 11:13 am
Given 1 or 2 more seasons Dungy would have won a superbowl here, maybe more than one, and we wouldn’t be the dysfunctional franchise we are now.
People say Gruden shouldnt have been fired after a 9-7 season. Tony was fired after a playoff season…who does that??
Who would do that…..the Glazers. Brother, Tony would not have won it here…..NO OFFENSIVE COACHING WORTH A DAMN!! It was Tony’s time to go, there’s nothing you can say to change my mind about that. We’ll just agree to disagree.
December 20th, 2017 at 11:20 am
mark2001 Says:
December 20th, 2017 at 11:16 am
Jmark….better stop while you are ahead. We wouldn’t have won a SB with Tony here. He was a great coach and a great guy. But we absolutely couldn’t get over Philly… With the O we had, they had our number. All that would have happened is that we would have seen the window close on the careers of at least a couple of our players with no SB to show for it.
Exactly!!
December 20th, 2017 at 11:22 am
And guys, I’m telling you… the Florida market has a strong team in the area. Jacksonville isn’t going away. We need the Bucs to get better…now…to defend this turf and fan base. Little billy isn’t a thirty year Buc fan, and if they stink, you could see what happens in northern Illinois…. there are almost as many Packer fans as Bear fans. But we don’t have a city the size of Chicago, where we can lose a third of the fans without being hurt.
December 20th, 2017 at 3:34 pm
Jmarkbuc,
I NEVER claimed to be a Gruden expert … not even close.
I certainly watched the playoffs and SB and have seen Gruden coach many times, I was simply saying I didn’t religiously watch the Gruden-Bucs the way I have watched the Jameis-Bucs for 3 years.
One doesn’t need to be a “team fan” to be able to think logically, do research and come to sensible conclusions … and that’s what I do.
December 21st, 2017 at 6:39 pm
Tony Dungys biggest problem is the same problem Jameis faces with Wekcome Back Koetter……….don’t make any mistakes on offense. Koetter is coaching the competitiveness out of Fameis trying to turn him into a pure pocket passer which he isn’t and making him second guess tucking the ball and running. I believe he has put a certain amount of uncetainy in Jameis game that he never had before. I think Gruden could really coach the daylights out of Americas qb so even some of his haters will call him a superstar.