Koetter Demise Chatter Disturbing
November 11th, 2017
Sad doom talk.
It really isn’t that bad if one thinks about it.
Yeah, Bucs fans had high expectations. Coming off a fun “Hard Knocks” series and the additions of DeSean Jackson and O.J. Howard, Bucs fans had playoff hopes dancing in their heads this August.
Joe is sure Bucs coaches did too. But as the losses have piled up, as players expected to be performing at a high level have under-performed, Bucs fans have grown so bitter they have begun hollering for a coaching change.
Even national talking heads have picked up the baton. The most curious/sad is the notion which has been pushed by former NFL executive Michael Lombardi, that Team Glazer has already made up it’s mind; that winning head coach Koetter is a dead man walking and Team Glazer will hire Chucky. This is, well, curious.
Joe is willing to bet Lombardi does not have the ear of Team Glazer. And given Lombardi’s past association with Chucky, what initially seemed like a plant to Joe now sure smells like Lombardi is hatching a whole lot of wishful thinking disguised as serious chatter in an effort to land a job.
But let’s be honest here, if the Bucs had a kicker and the defense could make one play, just one flipping play late in Buffalo, the Bucs are 4-4. Before the season, if the vast majority of Bucs fans knew the team would be 4-4, not one would suggest Koetter should be gone.
Has Koetter made mistakes? Of course he has, and he is the first to say the buck stops with him because he is the head coach. He says it often.
If, before the season, you could look in a crystal ball and know that, say, America’s Quarterback, Pro Bowler Jameis Winston broke an ankle; the season was lost. Bucs fans would be saddened and disappointed, sure, but they wouldn’t rail for Koetter’s ouster.
Yet, here we are. Jameis is hurt and who knows how long he will be out or if he returns this season at all.
Folks like to say Koetter is all but gone because Team Glazer has an itchy trigger finger based on how quickly Raheem Morris, Greg Schiano and Lovie Smith were jettisoned. To compare Koetter to those regimes isn’t just apples and oranges, it’s apples and oranges and cherries and peaches.
Schiano and Lovie never had winning records.
Schiano’s team thoroughly imploded in his second year and he damned near had a palace riot on his hands in addition to the MRSA. Lovie was supposed to be a defensive guru and his defenses weren’t just awful, they were also unprepared (Tennessee Ready, anyone?). The defensive collapse in December 2015, when the Bucs were in a wild card chase, losing to horrid teams proved to be Lovie’s final undoing.
That’s not even factoring in the nonsense Joe heard from multiple off-the-record sources (including players) both then and since what was going on inside the walls of One Buc Palace. And that’s just what Joe knew about. Let’s just say a lot of folks on staff enjoyed collecting Team Glazer checks.
Schiano often said in his final days, and since he left Tampa Bay, Team Glazer gave him an edict to clean up the locker room, which Morris allowed to turn into a mess. That, just as much as a 10-game losing streak, did in Morris.
Koetter, unlike Schiano and Lovie, has a winning season. Koetter, unlike Morris, Schiano and Lovie, does not have two losing seasons. Koetter, unlike Morris, does not have a locker room full of bad dudes and awful influences.
Joe’s not saying Koetter is a lead-pipe lock to return next season. How he handles the team in the next eight games will say a lot. Somehow helping defensive coordinator Mike Smith settle down the defense in road games would be a huge boost. But to say Koetter is already gone because Morris, Schiano and Lovie had short tenures is not fair to Koetter, nor to the Bucs.
Jameis getting hurt may be a game-changer.
November 11th, 2017 at 12:08 pm
Joe, you need to add the KA58 injury effect as well!!!!! The 2 leaders are both hurt and missing time now!!!!!! When they are hurt and playing bad, it is not easy for them to be the leaders that they are supposed to be!!!!!!!! I expect the coaches to be here next year, as each has shown enough flash and ability to cover up deficiency on the roster on their side of the ball!!!!!! It would be hard to find 2 better X’s and O’s coaches to upgrade from them!!!!!!!
And that C on GMC93 should be ripped off right in the locker room!!!!! Unless it stands for “Complacency” or “Coward”!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Go Bucs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
November 11th, 2017 at 12:10 pm
Koetter has to win 3 or 4 more games this year to save his job. And a blowout means he’s definitely gone. But a Koetter coaching change is imminent. Say what you want. Them Glazers will pull the plug. Y’all knows the pattern. And the team just looks down. So do the coaches. Koetter looks like he’s gonna cry during press conferences. And ole smitty can’t wait to return to his perch in the press box. After all the HBO hype? Our Bucs deserve every bit of critcism they get.
November 11th, 2017 at 12:15 pm
You could have all 53 players line up at the door to Joel Glazer’s office demanding Koetter (and/or Jason) be fired or they walk .And Joel would say to them: “Bye.”
We know the Glazers don’t fire mid season. We also know they try new types of people based on the disaster du jor. Need to get over the top to win a SB? Bring in Jon Gruden and mortgage the future (and they did that for sure). Need to be rid of coaches who talk and act like they own the team? Bye Bye Jon. Hard financial times? Get yourself a Raheem. Drug and police problems? Bring in Shiano. Appeal to nostalgia and bring back old fans? Hello Lovie. Do we know of any perrenial winners who can be the guy for all these things? Well, there is Belicheat. But he’s busy.
Surely the Glazers have learned for the past decade you can’t just change coaches and GMs every two years unless what you have is really, really bad AND there is no one else better. Yup, it’s bad now, but I pin half of this on the players and half on the HC and GM. And it might be temporary–fixable with a few player and position coach changes. The outbrief from Jason and Dirk to Joel and Bryan is key. I keep thinking Raheem and his 10-6 year followed his demise the next with a 4-12 record and team that quit playing at all–blow outs every game…like this year. And they started 4-2 that year. But seriously, no one thought the 10-6 Bucs were legit–and they weren’t. Us fans hoped, and certainly went with it.
Koetter’s seat is warm after this year no matter what. But it’s not hot enough to fire him yet–even if they lose out. And no, Gruden isn’t ever coming back, folks. Give Koetter and Licht two more seasons to get to the playoffs. Anything else is hasty. I much will hinge on how Jameis does next year. Yup, sucks to have to wait…again.
November 11th, 2017 at 12:18 pm
So now we are making excuses for Dirk with the “what if” game? This is an extremely tired narrative for TB fans.
Between Dirk and Licht they have this team losing games in the same manners and they are not putting an improved product on the field. They made their offseason mission an effort to supply weapons for Winston and it blew up in their face. These guys don’t know what the hell theyre doing.
November 11th, 2017 at 12:19 pm
Anybody see Jason Licht?
Did I miss Jason Lichts’s vote of confidense annoucement of Koetter during this losing streak?
“I was peeking thru Hooters front window and I saw….
manboobs Jason Licht wearing a Hooters girl outfit smooching all over Jon Gruden….Licht wasnt wearing a bra”
Kobe Faker
November 11th, 2017 at 12:21 pm
WTF dude
November 11th, 2017 at 12:24 pm
I can understand the sentiment of worrying about the constant coaching changes biannualy but that simply can’t hold you back when the management is running your team into the toilet.
November 11th, 2017 at 12:52 pm
This team should ALL-OUT TANK the rest of the way … Saquon Barkley or Bradley Chubb AND Jon Gruden/Harbaugh/Arians could have this team 12-4 next year!
November 11th, 2017 at 12:53 pm
If the team starts playing good ball for a stretch at the end of this season and gets at least 4 Ws out of the next 8 games – I believe Dirk Koetter will still be the Bucs HC next year.
If the sh!t show we’ve seen the last 2 weeks continues – especially on offense – then coach K is likely gone…
November 11th, 2017 at 1:10 pm
Koetter has lost this team, I don’t care what the players say verbally, their play on the field says it all. His gameplans aren’t working. He hasn’t been doing a good job of capitalizing on our players strengths, or hiding their weaknesses.
And for some reason, he shows a reluctance to stick with what’s actually working. O.J. Howard has been criminally underutilized this season Case in point, after having an absolutely monstrous day vs the Bills, we haven’t seen much of him since. You drafted the guy in the 1st round for a reason, he is a match up night mare that can be absolutely deadly in the short and intermediate game, but we don’t send him out on routes nearly enough.
I like Koetter the guy, but he’s in over his head. He is clearly just another Norv Turner/ Wade Phillips type of guy. Really good as a coordinator, but below average as a HC.
November 11th, 2017 at 1:30 pm
Realist. Good post from you but please explain how you have the gall to call McCoy a coward? One thing I do know is true heroes and leaders of men are very careful with that word. Expect more. You are better than that.
November 11th, 2017 at 1:41 pm
Say what you want..We take a major beatdown before seasons end and..Koetter has the moving van at his residence.
November 11th, 2017 at 1:46 pm
@NFLNUT
Agree with you man. Saquon Barkley entices the heck out of me, most national scouts are declaring him the most talented Running back prospect since Adrian Peterson. And having a legitimate running game would help make life a whole lot easier on Jameis.
But at the same time, Bradley Chubb is probably the best edge rusher in next years class, and we are in desperate need of any kind of pressure from the edges.
Right now I’m leaning more towards Barkley, but would understand taking Chubb, or even trading down for a kings ransom from one of these over-achieving, QB needy teams like the Jets.
November 11th, 2017 at 1:51 pm
@Reach87
I am so glad that you ask!!!!!!! Now I will explain it to you!!!!! I was talking in the concept of “leadership”!!!!! How often has GMC93 had the “C” on his chest and this team quit???????
I know he danced thru all offseason and training camp, But did he get into other players faces when their were bad practices?????
Has he called a players meeting ever, because he thought “effort” was lacking?????
That “C” means he should be the leader of a group, and he has not done that!!!!!!!!! I see him first in line if their is an interview or camera, but no-where to be found when it comes to leading other players!!!!!!
I know he works out hard, but that just makes him a “example” not a “captain”!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GO Bucs!!!!!!!!!!!!!
November 11th, 2017 at 2:07 pm
Dirk Koetter was the OC of that ” Terrible Offense” that lost the final 4 games in 2015. I don’t count last season as a winning season, Carolina ” tanked” the last game. And the Bucs still barely won it. The Million Dollar Question: Why hold on to Dirk Koetter?
November 11th, 2017 at 2:12 pm
I know the defense gets the blame for the 2015 meltdown
2015 Final 4 Games
0-4
Offensive Stats
PPG 17.75
Turnovers 8
November 11th, 2017 at 2:38 pm
Seriously Realist? “You need to add the KA58 injury effect as well!!!!! The 2 leaders are both hurt and missing time now!!!!!!” That’s your concept of ‘leadership’? Jameis & Kwon? You didn’t hesitate to dump on GMC, by Jameis & Kwon get passes because of injuries?
Leaders aren’t ‘anointed’ because of the position they play. I’ve been privileged to follow & work with some truly outstanding military leaders in my life (some of whose names you’d probably recognize), and they were the type of leaders who you’d follow anywhere. They all had a lot of traits in common, but the two most pronounced IMO were that they were highly focused & highly competent. They were highly focused on mission accomplishment … losing in combat isn’t an option. They were also highly competent … you’d follow them anywhere because you knew they were going to be ‘right’ 99% (plus) of the time.
Jameis & Kwon are two fine young men with lots of talent, but ‘anointing’ two 23-year-olds as team leaders is a big part of our problem right now. Neither is ‘battle-tested’ yet, both seem to lose ‘focus’ too easily, and neither is performing exceptionally well on the field thus far this season. Drew Brees? Luke Kuechly? Yup, battle-tested. Jameis & Kwon? Not at this point. I guess I’m ‘old school’ Realist: Leadership is a great responsibility … It’s earned, not ‘anointed’.
November 11th, 2017 at 2:47 pm
Joe- there have been many closed coaches doors around one Buc place lately with private phone calls going on. This current STAFF knows that DK isn’t cut out to be a Head Coach & he’s lost them. They are already making calls & putting feelers out for their next jobs. It’s being talked about openly who will be the next head coach? And who can maneuver & put in a good word for some current assistants. Tampa Bay you got what you wanted the Hard Knocks drama, the free agent of Jackson who was a bad apple everywhere else & a Coach who’s arrogance is unjustified cause he’s never won anything. Who’s carrying a Big Stick now??? Funny we don’t see any of those little postgame speeches on Buccaneers.com anymore.
November 11th, 2017 at 2:57 pm
How will we know when Team Glazer will fire Coach Koetter? Only after they sign him to a long-term contract. The Glazers love spreading their loot around, paying coaches and players not to work. #PaidFloridaVacation
November 11th, 2017 at 3:02 pm
Joe that commentary has no credibility. He’s saying it because he’s trying to get a job? I doubt this guy has to come out and attack someone to get a job that’s a horrible take. The Glazer’s have a front row seat so do they really need to listen to radio chatter to know the guy is in over his head? They’ve witnessed this with schiano and Raheem and Lovie so it’s not like they can’t see the same pattern. Being a great coordinator is not good enough if your title is head coach and you can’t get your team to execute
November 11th, 2017 at 3:15 pm
Realist I agree. Nobody besides jameis comes down on players in any manner and he’s 23. That’s lichts fault. I think this team Kay be missing Daryl smith personally
November 11th, 2017 at 3:35 pm
Defense Rules Said:
“… ‘anointing’ two 23-year-olds as team leaders is a big part of our problem right now. Neither is ‘battle-tested’ yet, both seem to lose ‘focus’ too easily, and neither is performing exceptionally well on the field thus far this season. Drew Brees? Luke Kuechly? Yup, battle-tested. Jameis & Kwon? Not at this point. I guess I’m ‘old school’ Realist: Leadership is a great responsibility … It’s earned, not ‘anointed’.”
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👏👍
November 11th, 2017 at 3:37 pm
Jameis, Lavonte, Kwon all were and are hurt. You tell me before the season that they’d miss games, I’d say the season was over.
Good news is that we’ll get a good draft pick, and Licht will have another offseason to address our line issues. My hope is that the Glazers don’t waste all this just to bring in an ESPN personality that didn’t want Adrian Peterson or Aaron Rodgers.
November 11th, 2017 at 3:43 pm
What chance is there to get Bill Polian to unretire to GM and hire Harbaugh?
McKay / Harbaugh?
November 11th, 2017 at 4:30 pm
Woulda coulda shoulda
Fact is they are 2-6
November 11th, 2017 at 4:34 pm
Woulda coulda shoulda
Fact is they are 2-6 not 4-4
And they have looked like the worst team in the NFL
November 11th, 2017 at 4:38 pm
Trade Winston for cousins and higher Gruden and Rex Ryan
November 11th, 2017 at 5:03 pm
H
November 11th, 2017 at 5:25 pm
Buddy:
You would know what coaches are discussing on their phones, how exactly?
November 11th, 2017 at 6:14 pm
Buddy:
Those Buccaneers.com locker room posts only happen after we win. We haven’t won a game in over a month, five straight losses, that’s why you haven’t seen any of those “Big Stick” speeches young Sir. Bucs fans know this.
We win Sunday, one will be posted shortly after.
November 11th, 2017 at 7:36 pm
Holy cow folks. Dirk Koetter has finished one season…with a 9-7 record. His season now sucks at 2-6 so far and there is plenty of problems to go around–and not all on him. Yeah, he’s accountable. As are the other coaches, GM, teacm captains, and players. Remember those who thought Ron Rivera needed to be fired after he turned in 6-10, then 7-9, ahead of three division titles in a row and a trip to the Super Bowl?
How is it last year this Bucs team was rallying pretty well around the coaches, enough to sweeten Smitty’s contract to keep him on? What changed things? Again, I’m back to they brought in some new pieces that felt they were bigger than the team. And neither DJax, Swaggy, and TJ Ward have made a bit of a positive difference, and indications I’ve seen are the opposite. None of them are a positive influence on anyone, and they sure haven’t played to their pay. All three of them will likely be gone next year….or attitude-adjusted.
He11, it might even turn around last few games this year. I’m not optimistic it will as I don’t think we’ve quite bottomed out yet, but I think it’s too early to boot Koetter with one WINNING season on record. How all these guys, players and coaches alike, handle themselves over these miserable last two months will say who they are. Given the NO game, some of the alleged leaders of this bunch aren’t doing too well in face of losing.
November 11th, 2017 at 7:40 pm
This team is not 4-4 and they looked like crap before jameis got hurt, like they say next man up. I wouldn’t mind keeping Dirk if they get rid of Millivanill/wham loving,pass rushing hating,Sweezy,baker loving Jason Licht.
They need someone who knows how to build a team.
November 11th, 2017 at 8:38 pm
Yeah, maybe good coaches are set up to fail here, I mean if you can come in coach the Buc’s to two winning seasons, then your Hall of Fame worthy. Seems like we could use some change at the top of the organization, something like what the Jag’s did this offseason bringing in Coughlin. It’s just like rinse, wash, and repeat with the Buc’s, need to try something new.
November 12th, 2017 at 12:15 am
I don’t want to see him go either. And sure, Jameis’ injury may just be his ace in the pocket when it comes to saving Koetters job.
But I am sure glad Jameis is on the sidelines for a few games. Watching him was getting painful !!!
November 12th, 2017 at 5:03 am
What happens if Fitz comes in and wins the next 3 games????
Very possible
It sure doesn’t look good right now but….that is why they play the games!
November 12th, 2017 at 7:22 am
@JayBuc Boi~I didn’t realize you were on the team? You said “we” 3 times in you comment. What a joke, you’re just a another homer Superfan who thinks they have a idea about what’s going on inside that building. I know exactly how, when & even WHO posts those videos.
@Joe~I spent 15+ years working for that org. Yes, i started at the original One Buc not One Buc Palace which you have so wrongly named it. The current One Buc isn’t quite what you see and the people who work there know what a bad building it actually is. Very cheaply built. So I still have more then a couple people telling me how bad it’s gotten. Arguments & discussions at the top levels have been going on for weeks about how to proceed since DK isn’t getting the job done & lost his own staff. How fun & awkward is it gonna be to see JGruden go in the ring of honor & Dirk walk out after halftime of a game the Falcons will be drubbing him & hear the Buc fans chanting for JG. Glazers might want to pull the cord before that PR nightmare on MNF.
November 12th, 2017 at 8:58 am
Roy, good post. Realist, the question was about calling McCoy a coward. You know that. Probably know you went too far there too, based on your choice to ignore the question. Reflects very poorly on you.
November 12th, 2017 at 9:37 am
1 more year
November 12th, 2017 at 10:51 am
Last yr is last yr, and that’s what kept you employed this yr. And this yr is what is supposed to keep you employed next yr. What has Koetter done this yr to secure his job for next yr. And Joe, pls, not the “what if” game.