Welcome Back, Doug Martin
October 2nd, 2017
Arguably the worst full-time rusher in the NFL last season has returned from a drug suspension to the Buccaneers’ roster – at full price.
Running back help has arrived!
And you thought going all-in on Nick Folk to boot a game-winner last night was a ballsy gamble.
On face value, Martin earning the blessing of winning head coach Dirk Koetter and Jason Licht to return is rather simple: the Bucs need running back depth and Martin could provide it along with a deep knowledge of Koetter’s offense. Fair enough.
However, Joe firmly believes Licht, Koetter and far too many fans are expecting the good and special version of Martin, the running back seen in 2012 and 2015, not the guy who showed up in 2013, 2014 and 2016.
Odds are slim that good Martin shows up. And this questionable gamble on Martin is exacerbated by his one month layoff from football, the result of serving the remainder of his four-game suspension and a surprise Hurricane Irma bye week.
Months ago, Joe estimated there was about a 15 percent chance of Martin returning after his suspension. Then, after fifth-round pick running back Snoop McPlaybook Jeremy McNichols didn’t make the roster and the Bucs didn’t find a veteran running back they liked on the street, and Charles Sims had a rough rushing start to the season, Joe wrote that Martin had a 50-50 shot of coming back.
And here we are.
Joe is rooting for Martin (like Joe does all Bucs not named Jerramy Stevens) and Joe would love to be wrong about Martin here. But Joe dislikes this low percentage call by Koetter and Licht.
Last night, Dirk Koetter proclaimed “you play the percentages” when queried on why he entrusted the game to Nick Folk’s shaky leg. Well, Joe thinks the percentage play on Martin was to say goodbye, or to bring him back at a rock bottom salary.
First, Joe doesn’t subscribe to the pretend-2016-was-a-bad-dream philosophy enjoyed by many Bucs fans. Martin’s 2016 film was ugly — 144 carries of mess.
Second, Martin, 28, is injury-prone and might have battled motivation issues during his career. While many fans insist Martin indeed has been affected by questionable motivation during his three poor seasons, Joe will not go there on a guy without proof. However, remember, it was Licht who publicly suggested Martin might be the type of player who needs “a carrot” to perform well.
Personally, Joe thinks any football player who might “need a carrot” is a guy who doesn’t love the game enough to be relied upon. Teams invest millions of dollars on personnel staff to weed out college players who are lacking in desire — rightfully so.
Football-wise, and very simply stated, Joe doesn’t consider Martin to be a good or reliable running back. Oh, he’s got skills, but Joe finds little evidence that Martin is a better choice now than Jacquizz Rodgers. And that brings Joe to how Martin might be used by Koetter.
Whether Martin can succeed as a part-time back is a total unknown. He’s never done it. Many running backs cannot thrive without steady carries, and Martin always been known as a guy who needs a lot of touches to find a rhythm.
From Joe’s vantage point, Martin is not as good a pass blocker as Rodgers or Charles Sims. Both have been exceptional in that area this season. So add that for Koetter to consider in the Bucs’ pass-friendly offense.
Also, salary spent on Martin this year (about $5.5 million remaining) represents cap money the Bucs can’t rollover and spend in free agency next year, to the best of Joe’s knowledge. So Joe would have much preferred to see the Martin gamble include a significant pay cut. That would have been ideal and mitigated the dice roll. But hey, it’s not Joe’s money.
Joe’s guessing the Bucs thought the “carrot” Martin could use now is keeping his big contract. Joe would understand that thinking. The Bucs also knowingly overpaid Alterraun Verner and Vincent Jackson last season. That didn’t work out but it speaks to a pattern.
Joe is not blasting Licht for keeping Jackson and Verner on the team; Joe believed they were worth the 2016 financial gamble.
Martin and his history? They are not.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:11 pm
Could this article be any more negative….
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:12 pm
Everyone knew he was coming back..except Joe lol smh
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:12 pm
Run his a$$ into the ground and have Rodgers spell him. We have 10 days off after Thur night. Closest thing to a bye week we will have. GO BUCS!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:13 pm
Joe, its time to give up your personal crusade on Martin, you were wrong, just admit it, move on and hope we get the good Martin.
You so badly want to say I told you so that I imagine the article has already been written and you’re just waiting for Martin to get injured or have a bad game.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:13 pm
The unapologetic Joe’s can’t admit they were wrong and way off all along… Surprise, suprise. But I certainly don’t see how continuing to bash Doug Martin just to frame an “I told you so moment” helps anyone? When he runs for 100 next week, I hope you could finally admit how foolish it was to type all the things you have about Doug
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:14 pm
At full price…no repercussions other than NFL mandated 3 game suspension? We should all be so lucky at work. 😉 I hope he ball’s out then.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:14 pm
Could have drafted Co…ooops…nevermind
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:15 pm
No personal crusade on Martin. Joe’s written that before too many times to count.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:15 pm
Wow Joe You are way off on this one. Martin will not be a part time running back in a committee. He will get the majority of carries Thursday night. And rust? He’s a professional football player who’s healthy and rested. While Rodgers did OK yesterday, remember it was a horrible Giants defense he ran against. Oh and I love the way Rodgers got caught from behind by a fat man…
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:15 pm
this is not about Rodgers, who i think doug is an upgrade over even if not at 2015 levels. it is about the gap in expected effectiveness between doug and the likes of Peyton Barber and Charles Sims. How can that be a low percentage bet? he doesn’t have to outsnap the year-to-date starter unless he earns it. in the meantime, they feel like he is less of a giveaway coming out of the huddle than either our passing down specialist or our fringe “power back”, and that is a win schematically while Koetter and opponents figure out which Doug Martin they are dealing with
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:17 pm
Man I Hope. the entire organization makes a Big deal out of this game.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:17 pm
Those making a run at Joe are blinded by the 2 very good years vs 3 bad and an absolute letdown last year when the Bucs needed him most. Licht rolled the dice and lost. The cost is full price for a RB who’s inconsistent at best.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:17 pm
Joe, the Bucs were never going to let Martin go. Especially after not picking a rb high in the draft and, like you said, mcnichols turning out to be a dumb douche. He was always coming back and it isn’t a big gamble. Sure he isn’t cheap but look what we have on the roster, quizz had a good game yesterday but he isn’t the answer. Martin has by far the most talent and I believe he’s truly hungry to prove he deserves the starting job. I will be majorly bummed if we don’t see a lot of him Thursday night. Go Bucs!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:19 pm
Told ya so.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:19 pm
I love the bold predictions Joe, but next time you do one make sure it’s based in reality and not in the reality where you end up with Rachel Watson.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:20 pm
Joe did Doug run over your dog? Were you both at the grocery store at the same time with only 1 six pack of beer left on the shelf and Dougie beat you to it? He will have a killer rest of the season far better than any running back currently on our roster. Give the man a chance dude.
Your reading skills must be diminished. Joe is rooting for Martin. It’s all spelled out above. Joe is certain there have been Buccaneers that you did not think were solid players worthy of their role. It’s nothing personal whatsover. This is no different.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:20 pm
the only person who would try to spin doug’s return as a problematic event is someone who has a bit face and credibility riding on a prediction of dramatic failure for the player in question. it’s hard to conceive of anybody who has watched the bucs non-doug-martin rushing attempts in preseason and the regular season painting doug’s return as a potential setback of some kind
Yet another reader with poor reading skills. If you’re going to attempt to read between the lines, which is never necessary here, then at least get it right. Joe has nothing riding on anything typed here. If you’re looking for Joe to be disingenuous with readers just to make them happy, then you’re at the wrong website. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:22 pm
WOW!!!! I have not seen a back hand like that since Martina Navratilova!!!!!!!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:23 pm
Thursday Night Lights !!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:24 pm
Regardless of whether or not fans are expecting the 2012 and 2015 version of Doug Martin to show up, what are opposing teams expecting? It just seems that defenses are blitzing, Remember the Titans-style, and daring Jameis Winston to throw. I hope that Martin’s addition makes them think twice about this. For the passing game to work, the Bucs need a legitimate running attack.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:25 pm
I hope we can get Alan across onto the PS though I hate to lose Austin Johnson.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:25 pm
Lmao you were so wrong and you cant admit it! It was so obvious he was coming back when they didnt draft an early running back.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:25 pm
Wait so what are the outside chances Doug Martin will be on this team after his suspension is served? Still like 0.0278%?
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:26 pm
ahhh joe the moment has arrived where you finally have to eat the crow… everyone else saw this coming except for you for some odd reason… you really thought we were gonna go a full season with our no name running back group? glad to have him back let’s out last year behind us and hope for the best for martin and hopefully for his sake he has a huge chip on his shoulder to prove that he was worth the contract he was given and indeed one of the top 10 backs in the league. i still just find it hilarious how joe swore martin wouldn’t be back even after waiting til the 5th round in the draft to finally pick someone
Reality and what you have typed do not go hand in hand, but thanks for reading. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:27 pm
After reading this trash I might just be done with Joe.
Good luck out there. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:29 pm
Buc Believer- Doug got Rachel Watson’s number, too! Lol
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:29 pm
Doug Martin is clean, in-shape, and motivated. We will pay him to play this season, but the guarantees in his contract moving forward were voided by suspension, meaning it will not affect salary cap next year (assuming we renegotiate or decide to part ways with him). This is a HUGE win for the Bucs.
WELCOME BACK DOUGERNAUT!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:30 pm
I love Joe but this is the one time where its obvious that you cant admit you’re wrong.
Im sure if we could have traded up for Cook then Martin wouldnt be here but that didnt happen and the team instead got behind Martin.
Yes he stunk last year but now its 2017 and I want my team to win and like it or not Martin is the best option we have at RB.
Embrace it and move on instead of waiting to say I told you so if he fails
Look, you and many others seem to be requesting that Joe not have strong opinions, highly educated opinions and ones often fueled by information Joe can’t type here. But forgetting about that, for 10 seasons Joe has commented on coaches and players — from the top to the bottom of the roster. That’s not about to change, and Joe’s not backing off what’s typed above, which perhaps you didn’t actually read. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:32 pm
Martin will screw bucs and teammates after all he is more consistent sucking than producing. These types of moves by bucs are exactly why they have spent a better part of a decade in the basement…
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:32 pm
At the very least I think he’ll be better than Jacquizz, as long as he stays healthy. Praying for 2012/2015 Doug.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:32 pm
Uuuuuuggh. Will you let everyone know how wrong you were after Thursday night when Doug goes of for 100+ yards Joe? F-NE!!! GO DOUGIE!!! GO BUCS!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:32 pm
@johnnybuc
For Bucs fans who live in reality that was the most telling sign all offseason that Doug was coming back. The Bucs didn’t bring in any free agent backs, and then waited until the 5th to draft one, then when practice started Doug was running with the 1’s. What more proof did they need?
I’m a Buc fan first and Doug fan second and won’t ignore the bad season even though Joe says you can’t blame a player for injuries yet he holds those against Doug. As long as the Bucs get the threat of a competent run game it will help Jameis and this offense more than having Rodgers and Sims as options.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:33 pm
I admit Joe that I sometimes get tickled with your word choices. “Welcome Back Doug Martin” followed shortly thereafter by “Worst full-time rusher in the NFL last season” then “Odds are slim that good Martin shows up” followed by “Martin’s 2016 film was ugly — 144 carries of mess” and culminating with … “Joe is rooting for Martin.” Not a doubt in my mind Joe: Doug Martin feels the love.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:34 pm
Joe, what are the chances Doug plays a meaningful amount of snaps this week?
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:34 pm
@ alanbucfan
You sir have the comment of the day lol
For those who missed it, it’s in the archives and a classic. Rachel Watson did request to meet Joe at training camp a couple of years ago and a lovely chat ensued. She even posed for a picture with her daughter on JoeBucsFan.com. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:35 pm
Wow Joe! Everyone knew Doug was coming back except you. If the Bucs didn’t bring Doug back then they were basically putting the middle finger up to the 2017 season… Don’t bring Doug back after ignoring the need of a running back till round 5??? Right. It was clear on draft night that Doug was coming back. For the sake of a successful season let’s hope he can stay healthy and if nkt maybe trade a late rounder for Powell on the Jets.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:35 pm
I’m thinking there has to be something with Doug and a female family member of Joe… the hatred run so deeps.
Look, Rod, please don’t make things up. Last time Joe will ask. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:36 pm
come on Joe, this the same old talking points you’ve used 1000 times all summer to make your case, and now you are pissed because you guessed wrong. This team needs RB help and Doug provides that. He’s going to be a beast on thursday night football and there’s nothing you can do about it.
Rodgers is fine. my car is fine. my t-shirt is fine.
Martin can be a game changer, the Bucs have to give to him the ball.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:36 pm
Doug will get most of the carries Thurs night. Rust? No. Fresh legs baby!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:38 pm
Ha, most of you posters have already written the obvious for me. It seems like Joe wrote this article a few weeks ago in anticipation of the inevitable and tweaked it along the way as needed to add color and additional negativity. And that first sentence – really? Is anyone who reads this blog unaware that DM had a bad year and is returning from a drug suspension?! Well color me informed! FFS… but wait, there’s more! That negative Nancy opener was followed by the likes of:
– Odds are slim that good Martin shows up [we shall see]
– Joe first estimated that there was a 15% chance DM returns
– Then that turned into a 50% [I’m guessing now Joe would estimate that there’s a 100% chance he returns]
– Joe is rooting for Martin! [er, you’ve really been convincing us of this the last few weeks with your positive DM takes]
– Martin is injury prone [um, like half the squad]
– Joe doesn’t consider DM to be a good back [well, the “winning” head coach and “AC/DC loving” GM obviously disagree]
Anyway, that’s enough of that. Welcome back DM. Prove us wrong.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:39 pm
Joe I read the entire article and yes have a strong opinion but at the same time admit when said opinion is wrong
again love your content and opinions 90% of the time but this falls into that 10% where you’ve let personal feelings spill over into your content
“Spill over” LOL Look, Joe has no problem sharing personal feelings. Joe’s been doing that since Day 1 of this website. And you’ve seen that since the first day you started reading here. It is not on Joe that readers don’t believe Joe’s dislike of Doug Martin the 2016, 2017 football player is just that — about football. If it was personal, Joe would be happy to share. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:39 pm
Wonder if the Glazers (who sign his checks) think that?
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:39 pm
I don’t believe that they’ll just plug Martin back in as the starter on Thursday. I think Rodgers starts and they use Doug in relief. That may change by the time the next game rolls around in 10 days, however.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:39 pm
Truly Joe, why all the drama. Let’s just pray that we get the good Doug and roll on….Go Bucs!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:41 pm
You are asking the wrong person. Ask Martin and/or the Bucs why the drama. Last week — hell, months ago — Koetter could have ended any and all speculation by saying one word: “Yes.”
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:43 pm
I just said I think Joe… I’m just trying to figure out the deep seeded hatred and where it comes from is all.
Again, there is no hatred. Ever watched a player in Bucs history you thought was washed up, or didn’t like his game, or preferred someone else on the roster? Of course you have. That doesn’t mean you hate the guy. Joe has never ripped Doug Martin personally and has no reason to. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:46 pm
Trade him to the Vikings for Dalvin and a kner brace.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:47 pm
All Joe is doing here is being consistent in his opinion. His biggest mistake was to ever put odds to his return; and instead just make it plain as day Joe doesn’t want Martin back on the team; because that’s basically the opinion he’s sharing today which is consistent with the one he’s always had.
Regardless of him returning or not – Joe’s opinion is Joe’s opinion.
I have never personally thought of Martin as anything better than a top 10ish back even when he’s at his absolute best. Even in his best seasons he was extremely inconsistent week to week and typically had 2-3 huge games that made up like 40-50% of his 16 game stats.
He sucked last year and it wasn’t just health. Dude couldn’t follow blocks or read a play to save his life. His vision was sh1t. Maybe its returned – and he did look better in preseason; but right now there is no point in trying to say “Told ya Joe” imo.
Bump this if Martin is actually successful and leading this teams running attack and doing it well throughout the season. At that point maybe it’d be time to bring up eating crow.
Thank you. Joe put odds on it in order to provide clarity for readers. Simple as that. Backlash from those numbers is and was irrelevant to Joe. Hopefully, as Joe wrote here, Martin shocks and is a beast and the Bucs made the right move.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:48 pm
After the suspension, I figured Doug was gone. But, now that he’s back? I’d give him the rock, as a starter, and see which Doug we got.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:51 pm
It makes zero sense to cut Martin without a replacement on the roster….that time has passed.
Martin should be given a chance to earn his salary…..the decision to change his deal can come after that if necessary.
I find it interesting (and my reading skills are quite good) that now Joe’s answer to our running game is on Rodgers, someone who couldn’t make the Bears final 53.
Awesome history twisting there. Joe wrote over and over and over again how the Bucs needed to draft a No. 1 running back this year. Dalvin Cook was on Joe’s list, as was Kareem Hunt and Perine (now of the Redskins) — three guys Joe wrote about a lot. Ok. So the Bucs drafted Snoop McPlaybook and it didn’t work out. Bad move in a deep draft class for RBs. Jacquizz Rodgers is a short term answer, as Joe has written. That doesn’t change, but Joe won’t ignore Rodgers’ success over two seasons (behind what many Martin defenders allege is a bad offensive line). Reality on the field says Rodgers has been better than Martin. Should Joe pretend otherwise? Yes, Rodgers was cut by the Bears. Ok. That doesn’t take away from what he has produced. Joe has never advocated that the Bucs stop running the football. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:51 pm
I gotta give it to you joes, you know you’re gonna catch crap for this article but you still posted it. I’ll give you that… 15% chance martin stays on the team after 5th rd pick jmac was picked. That couldn’t have been any more off base (ok, you were right by 15%). You were spot on with the 50/50 claim, just should’ve used it when jmac was drafted. We all know where you stand with martin. We all get it. You don’t care for the dude due to his history. Just sucks because (I think) we all predicted this article just like how we predict tmaxi will always have something to say about gmac, martin, etc. I’m not saying I would leave your site for this, but when I can predict an article coming, it just makes the site that much less fun to be on or visit. But like I said before, kuddos for having the sack to post it! 🍺 Here’s to martin and his hopeful success
Really no “sack” involved. Joe goes with the flow without regard to getting blasted in the comments (as long as those comments don’t misrepresent, or are malicious attacks against Joe’s credibility. Joe literally has typed 30,000 posts since starting this website, more than nearly all other mainstream outlets combined. If a handful are predictable to regular readers, then Joe’s all good with that.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:51 pm
My Lawd they’re hammering you Joe. I thought the article was great. You defended your point perfectly while knowing you had to. Good job.
Look out here comes another hammer….
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:52 pm
I think the fact that Doug went to rehab, stayed clean, and focused entirely on football for this entire time should be a positive thing. He’s a solid back that will keep the defense honest with explosive play capabilities. This only makes the Bucs better.
Joe’s said all summer he wasn’t coming back, and designated Dalvin Cook to be our savior.
Well, seeing as how that turned out, I like Doug’s upside
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:54 pm
Well, he’s the best back on the roster even though Quizz has been having some good games. He’s just a better runner. He gives the Bucs a legit threat of a run-game. 5’6″ Rodgers ain’t scaring nobody! No offense!
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:54 pm
“Pretend if you wish that running back Doug Martin isn’t battling hard for a roster spot. But he is . . .”
https://www.joebucsfan.com/2017/08/judgment-night-doug-martin/
“But this post isn’t about Martin and his very long odds of having a football job in Tampa this fall. It’s about McNichols.”
https://www.joebucsfan.com/2017/05/he-has-that-fire-inside/
“As Joe has stated, don’t lay a nickel on the table that Martin returns for 2017. Martin has a lot of obstacles to overcome, both on and off the field, before the Bucs bring him back. One of the biggest is that heavy contract of his.”
https://www.joebucsfan.com/2017/06/under-pressure/
“So that brings Joe to Doug Martin. If Koetter believes what he said in February, then it sure seems like he would be very hesitant to insert Martin as his go-to running back in Week 4, when Martin’s drug suspension ends. If the Bucs are, say, 2-1 and have run the ball reasonably well, then why would Koetter want Martin in the mix?”
https://www.joebucsfan.com/2017/10/welcome-back-doug-martin/#comments
“Joe hates to type the following: relapses happen.
Joe thinks Koetter is being bluntly honest. To pencil in Martin on May 18 as the No. 1 back once he returns from his three-game suspension is at best premature — so is considering him a lock for the roster come October.”
https://www.joebucsfan.com/2017/05/yet-to-be-determined/
Appreciate the time and effort, Tino. Thank you. Joe always stands behind all work written here. Joe has no problem being wrong. Also, covering sports (just like life) is a free-flowing thing. Yesterday’s reality is not today’s. Yesterday’s truth has a new gray area a week later. A July opinion is usually worthless in October. Again, thanks for your impressive effort. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:54 pm
87
Sucking up to Joe?……time in cooler has softened you.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:55 pm
@ joe,
A lovely chat ensued, but did you get the digits? Lol
Didn’t ask. She is a married woman who admitted being flattered by Joe’s attention. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:57 pm
TBBF…ha ha ha ha I call it like I see it. I knew the attacks would come if Martin was brought back and I think Joe handled it pretty well. Just calling it…
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:57 pm
Look at it from Martin’s point of view…..he screwed up….now has been given another chance with a full ride…….he should be very grateful to the Bucs for this opportunity. If that isn’t motivation to do well, I don’t know what is.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:58 pm
Like it or not, Martin is the best, most talented runner on the Bucs team.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:00 pm
This has got to be the most idiotic article you guys have ever written. Do you think at all before you post?
Why cut Doug? Name one reason… Quizz killin it? Tons of depth? We’re over the cap? Ummmmm…. the answers are no, no… and no.
Why cut Doug? What do they gain by cutting him? Give a reason. Now give a reason what they might gain by keeping him…..
This upside here is WAY higher than the down side.
Love the site but man… sometimes you’re just full of yourself and put 0 thought whatsoever into these posts….
Clickbait?
Look. Joe wrote very clearly (and near the beginning of this article) that on face value, bringing back Martin is understandable because he could provide quality depth and he knows the system. Simple as that. However, Joe believes it runs a lot deeper than that, hence the remaining 400 words. Great you like Doug Martin the running back. You are not alone. Joe has given great detail above. Really nothing to explain. And if you think a “Welcome Back, Doug Martin” on the day he returns is “clickbait,” then Joe doesn’t know what to say.-Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:00 pm
Wow someone sounds extremely salty because they were wrong and truth is he can be trusted more than anyone else. Good day against the Giants isn’t enough considering they came into this game with the worst rush defense in the league at least Martin will be taken seriously
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:02 pm
Speaking for Pablo
“Pablo loves Martin, the Muscle Hamster…Pablo’s muscle isn’t a hamster, it’s an anaconda. Now that Dougie is straight, Pablo has lost his molly connection.”
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:03 pm
If he stays healthy, i think he’ll be at a minimum as good as Rodgers and if he’s dialed in he’s proven to have Pro Bowl talent. No other back has that type of upside on our roster.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:05 pm
I’m always amazed at how two reasonable people can look at the same set of facts and come up with such very opposite ideas.
This is pretty much how I figured this would play out months ago and I didn’t see how it could turn out any different short of Doug coming in out of shape or a relapse in drugs or something like that. I don’t understand the whole “restructure” aspect as he would have to first be a UFA. If the Bucs want to gamble losing him to save a million then well.. IDK. It isn’t my money so its easy to say. He didn’t have to first be a UFA if the team agreed to a restructure. There is no waivers for a guy of Martin’s tenure.–Joe
The only thing I was dead wrong about was that I really figured McNichols was a lock to be on the team at this point. (think that was a mistake by the front office and I go on record with that but hey)
I always considered Martin a bonus, not a necessity and that is why he isn’t a gamble. What roster player are you gambling on losing in place of Martin? Alan Cross. Ok, wouldn’t have been my first choice as Luke Stocker now has to take over that spot on blocking downs, but Brate’s much improved blocking makes that more feasible.
I hear Joe’s argument on this and don’t think its personal like most of you, I just believe he is incorrect (as he believes the same for me).
Based on what I saw in the preseason, I think the good Doug Martin is back. Good Doug Martin can win games for us.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:09 pm
And if he’s just here to ….take the money and NOT run….that would NOT surprise me either. Apparently no one’s worried about that…but I am.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:09 pm
Hoping for but not really expecting 2015 Dougie. Kareem Hunt > Justin Evans! SMDH. 2018 draft MUSTS:DE, RB EARLY!!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:11 pm
Joe.. whats the record of replies for a non open thread? I would say this has a 15% chance of beating it. 😉
No clue, and Joe really doesn’t care about comments. Only about 3 percent of readers take the time to look at them (far, far fewer actually comment) and Joe doesn’t write for comments. No point. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:11 pm
Man, you are such a hater.
Pretty simple…the years where he has struggled, he has had issues with drugs and injuries. He’s drug free and healthy right now. So what’s your problem?
No problem at all, and not hate at all. Spelled everything out above. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:12 pm
tnew,
Re your first paragraph. Happens everyday in courtrooms across America! Some win, some lose. This time Joes lose!
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:16 pm
@Kenny
You shoot right to the point like a diamond bullet.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:16 pm
Joe Joe Joe – Snoop McPlaybook? really you we all over this guys jock as soon as he was drafted. Everyone BUT you were really questioning the call to draft him but you jumped all over it with positive spin and at the same time beating the hate-on Martin-drum and we’re supposed to think you’ve been impartial judge here? Say wha!?
Excellent take. Of course Joe was eager for Jeremy McNichols to pan out. Joe is Buccaneers fan, and a proud one, too. And Joe was hungry for a running back through the draft. “All over this guy’s jock” well, that’s a stretch. Like every other fan, Joe was eager to see what he could deliver. It’s like that with every draft pick every year. Joe isn’t hating on Martin, with “hate” as most people define it. Seriously. It’s almost silly. –Joe
You made your points and there are some really good points, but why not just wish him well, as a person? Joe felt know need to wish him well today, considering Joe already wished him well when he left on suspension, and Joe wrote above that Joe is rooting for Martin. It’s right there. Bucs win and Joe wins, personally and professionally. –Joe
GMC gave him a bear hug when he came into the locker room today. Jameis practically started singing, “you are the wind beneath my wings” when asked about the hamster’s return. That’s a tight group and JW will get him moving or he’s out. But until then you should be supportive instead of back handily snarky. Welcome Back, Doug Martin (sarcasm) LOL … Sorry, but Joe does welcome back Martin.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:17 pm
You can spin stats, percentages, and whatever else any way you want, but the fact with Doug is this:
When he is healthy for a season, he is one the top running backs in the league.
And he was clearly the best RB we had in preseason.
There is no reason to think he hasn’t been training and staying in shape, unless he doesn’t want to have a job next season. He has to know this is his last year with the Bucs, just like everyone else.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:19 pm
Told Ya Joe.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:20 pm
I don’t think Joe was making a prediction…he wrote way to many words to simply “predict” Doug’s release.
I think Joe was trying to make it happen. For what small influence a local beat writer can have, I think that was Joe’s aim. Joe doesn’t like Doug Martin, that much we know.
Now this is the most ludicrous thing Joe has read here in a long time. No. 1, this whole thing would have been a non-story if Bucs officials simply had said Martin would return after his suspension. It is the Bucs, not Joe, who chose to keep the suspense going, starting with Dirk Koetter’s response to NFL Network’s Ian Rapoport back in March at the NFL Owners Meetings. In reality, Bucs officials took this down to the 11th hour smartly and cautiously, though you wouldn’t believe that if you listened to other Bucs media. …Joe has zero influence on Bucs personnel decisions and moves. Joe gets to talk with Team Glazer and Bucs officials, but Joe’s head isn’t that big, nor has Joe consumed that much vodka. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:21 pm
“the Bucs need running back depth” – LOL yea Joe, I’m sure Martin will be either 3rd or 4th on the depth chart – (eye roll)
“Odds are slim that good Martin shows up” – How slim? 15% Bahahahaha
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:22 pm
Doug is the Bucs best RB! Welcome back Doug ….show up Thursday Night and show them haters…you been working out and your ready to take back the number one spot!
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:27 pm
Martin’s 30 for 30 after he relapses will be far more entertaining than his soon to be failed return
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:29 pm
Maybe I missed it, but who are we dropping to add Doug to the active roster?
On a side note, if we are looking to address rb in the draft, I’d like to get some Nick Chubb, I think his hands will translate great to the NFL.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:30 pm
Here’s all I read:
Blah, blah, blah, personal vendetta…
Blah, blah, blah, negativity, “Den of Depression”, more negativity…
Blah, blah, blah, witch-hunt, blah, blah, blah…
Doug did or said something to one of the “Joes” behind the scenes that has created the worst riff I’ve personally ever seen between a local journalist and local player ever in any sport.
Sorry, Tony, you don’t get to make things up. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:31 pm
Why cut Allan Cross of all people?
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:31 pm
It’s laughable to me there are people out there who think Doug Martin is going to rush for over 1000 yards this season.
I don’t understand the Doug Martin love from many of the same people who bash GMC. Name one season Doug Martin has been a part of where the Bucs had a winning record.
I won’t hold my breath.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:35 pm
Joe will get a subtle victory this week, though. There’s very little chance that the Bucs will just hand Martin 20 touches on a short week against the Pats. I’m sure Quiz Show will get equal or more touches this week and next week we can read all about a full blown committee and a lack of conviction of the Buc’s coaches in making a decision and how Martin can’t even fend off a guy the Bears cut last year.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:37 pm
He didn’t have to first be a UFA if the team agreed to a restructure. There is no waivers for a guy of Martin’s tenure.–Joe
Understand that Joe, but that isn’t pertinent to his argument. This has nothing to do with waivers. Waivers has never been mentioned in any post I’ve ever written about Doug Martin. The only reason this type of restructure would happen is if the Bucs offered more guarantees up front. I don’t expect any player or agent to willingly accept less money. Why would he or his agent restructure out of the deal to go to another one year for less money without shopping around first? There are many reasons (Joe has limited time now) but the agent is free to talk to any team at any time. Shopping isn’t limited to when a player is cut. And the results of that shopping could lead a player to accept a restructure vs. a negative alternative. –Joe The Bucs can’t tear up his deal and restructure to a team friendly deal and hold his rights. Both sides would have to agree to a restructure to avoid him being a UFA, like the Sweezy deal. His new deal has appeal to both sides.
I don’t hold it against Martin for not being altruistic about his contract. I hold it against him for getting involved with drugs that affected his play and got him suspended, just like I hold it against Kwon Alexander and Tanard Jackson.
To me this is basic logic. If the Bucs would’ve wanted to restructure, it would’ve happened long before now and it would be a clear indicator that they see Martin in their future for a few years down the road.
If there is a restructure it will most likely happen after the season. The problem is he will have to play well for this to be a desire from the Bucs to add on guaranteed money, something I would not do. Unless he goes completely off, he will be cut at the end of the season and the Bucs will at that point most likely part ways.
If he goes off, well then things will be interesting.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:38 pm
D-Rome,
Do a little research and look at the Bucs’ record last season when Martin played and when Martin did not. You’ll be very surprised.
Regardless of his stats, teams respect the run more when Doug plays and it opened up the offense a bit more. Wins and losses matter. The Bucs had a much better record when Martin played last season than when he did not.
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:39 pm
BigHog, I’m with ya!
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:39 pm
Finally my day has come! Not gonna let you of the hook this easy, Joe.
You are lieing to us about the dates at which you accepted Doug Martin was coming back. There are no lies here whatsoever other than yours. The actual words Joe wrote are available for all to see. You are reading between the lines and making statements of fact through your assumptions. That is why the remainder of what you wrote has been deleted. Go back and look at what Joe typed here and and don’t make assumptions or ascribe motives. If Joe writes “Joe thinks” that doesn’t qualify as something typed as fact. C’mon, man. If you’re bitter enough to call Joe a liar, then don’t read the website. Joe provided some links here for clarity, not to try and dupe anyone. Look, Joe has nothing to hide here on Martin. Just like Joe had nothing to hide from thinking Myron Lewis was a bad choice for the roster, or Mike Jenkins or Tim Jennings. Lot of you take things way more personally than Joe ever will. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:41 pm
That’s some real bitterness expressed over being wrong from Day 1.
Martin was never *NOT* going to be on the roster after his stint in The Cooler.
I saw the tape, too, Joe. I dispassionately watched and charted EVERY carry he made in 2016. I know how to watch tape as it got me through grad school. The OL was abysmal for Martin in 2016. And when in the game Martin faced stacked boxes on a HUGE majority of the snaps.
Yes, there was some “bad tape” on Martin in 2016. Too bad most of it had little to do with Martin. You seem to ignore the important stat I charted with my own eyes: Doug Martin was first hit by defenses at least 1yd. behind the LoS on 43% of his carries. Seems PFF stated the Bucs led the NFL in that category in 2016. Yeah, he might have missed an occasional hole, but I doubt 95% of NFL RB’s could be successful with that stat.
You’ve complained about how much pressure Winston was under in 2016. Guess what? The same crappy OL that almost got Winston killed in 2016 is the same crappy OL that blocked for Martin.
Joe never lobbied this offseason for an overhaul of the offensive line, other than a new center. It wasn’t a crappy O-line and Joe never stated as such. They were a big reason Jameis racked up yardage with a second-rate receiving corps. It’s nice to hear of your film study, but it is meaningless to Joe. –Joe
The real question for me is not his skill. It’s his health. If there is a knock on the guy I’d make is he’s been hurt way too often: shoulder, ankle, knee, and hammy…
Joe, to quote Bill Clinton, “You better put some ice on that.”
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:53 pm
“Look, you and many others seem to be requesting that Joe not have strong opinions, highly educated opinions and ones often fueled by information Joe can’t type here. But forgetting about that, for 10 seasons Joe has commented on coaches and players — from the top to the bottom of the roster. That’s not about to change, and Joe’s not backing off what’s typed above, which perhaps you didn’t actually read. –Joe”
thats great Joe, but “highly educated opinion” is not how wed refer your constant negativity about Martin during the offseason up to today. We all had eyes to see the way Martin was moving during the offseason, and it was pretty obvious to all of us except you, that 2017 wed be getting the good version of Martin back. All of us speculated that wed draft an RB early and move on from Martin, but after the draft passed, the writing was on the wall. To remain stubborn and write articles insisting Martin is most likely not returning as a Buc after his suspension was undoubtedly going to come across as a personal vendetta to all your readers.
Now this is a great example of a respectful, appropriate and non-malicious reply. … As far as moving in the offseason, Joe doesn’t recall Martin moving poorly in 2013, when he came out and was poor before getting hurt 125 carries into his season. Again, Joe just can’t write here and worry about how things “come across.” Joe writes clearly, and reading between the lines is inevitable. If Joe were worried about public opinion, this site would have been shut down after six months. Joe has been called an idiot and accused of all kinds of nonsense since Day 1. Comes with the turf and the willingness to be straight with readers — correct or incorrect. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:56 pm
Can’t wait to hear all the entertaining excuses for the Gerbil when he screws the team yet AGAIN…
The law of averages is not on the side of the low standard fanboy nut huggers
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:57 pm
[b] I don’t think Joe is a “real” Buc fan [/b]
That’s comical. Joe isn’t just a fan. Joe is a hardcore fan. Perhaps the hardest of the hardcore. Joe would never tell another fan how to be a fan, or judge their fandom expression (unless it involves cheering for a Bucs opponent). That’s the beauty of sports fans; there are many types and many ways to go about it. Anyone reading here regularly knows this is an all-consuming way of life for Joe. Frankly, Joe could easily get a job, make more money and still be a huge Bucs fan. But Joe continues here, with a goal (among many) of making fans more passionate, which is great for the entire organization. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:00 pm
Joe just accept it that Martin is back. Of course Joe accepts Martin is back. Might want to re-read above. –Joe
Can’t wait for your post when Martin has a bad game… Martin is 1000000% better then any other back on the bucs roster. Like I said before if the bucs weren’t going to bring back Martin they would have brought in a free agent or been far more dedicated then a 5th round pick with zero explosiveness… nuff said.
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:02 pm
Keeping Martin was the right decision and not cutting his salary was the right choice as well…not only for Martin but the message it sent to his teammates. Sending Nick Folk out for the winning field goal was, again, a clear message to him and his teammates…this is what makes a group of players into a team and a team that can count on each other. Another note: Right Guard Sweezy is having a great year so far another one of Joe’s whipping boys coming on strong.
Sweezy was not a whipping boy. Joe was simply highly skeptical of the regime bringing back an offensive linemen coming off back surgery and an entire missed season, practice and all. Joe’s a big Sweezy fan, wrote a fun nugget about him earlier that you won’t see anywhere else.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:06 pm
The one thing I absolutely do not understand are all the personal attacks on Joe accusing him of all manner of things instead of what he’s actually done.
Joe HAS NEVER made his posts personal about Doug…and in fact during the most personal time in Doug’s tenure with the Buc’s Joe took the high road and said first concentrate on Doug’s health. He wished him well in rehab on the only personal note I’ve ever detected from Joe about Doug.
Now Joe and some of the rest of us have taken the time to post Doug’s record.
When you suck 60% of your career anybody who posts your actual results is by definition making a negative post because Dougs career has been negative for three years and positive for two. You can believe what you want. Perhaps Doug has had an epiphany and will be back to his “good” form, He IS a good RB when healthy…not great but we obviously can use another good RB.
This didn’t require much thought because there is basically only upside with little to no downside. We didn’t have Doug anyway so if he’s solid it’s all good.
It’s like finding an extra player.
This comes right out of the Dirk Koetter school of player management.
“You can never have too many good players!”
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:07 pm
Bill b
The only message sent to teammates by bucs bringing the Gerbil back was its OK to screw your teammates… This is a classic example why the bucs spend the majority of the time in the basement
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:07 pm
Martin’s return could help the defense against the Patriots. The Bucs have no pass rush and Tom can light up any secondary if he has time in the pocket. The Bucs will need to control the clock and keep Tom Brady off the field. The best way to do that is with a running game. Welcome back “Don’t Call Me Muscle Hamster.”
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:13 pm
I will defend Joe on being a fan…..(not sucking up 87)…..
Any fan is entitled to their opinion on a player’s value/non-value to the team…..opinion on their prospects for success etc.
A true fan will set all that aside and root for any & all players on the Bucs roster to succeed as Joe has with Martin.
I will question a “fan” who is continually negative about a player in spite of evidence to the contrary.
How on earth could Joe not be a fan….I’m sure he/they eat, sleep & breathe Bucs.
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:13 pm
The key question: is Doug Martin better than the RBs we have on the roster right now?
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:14 pm
@BaldBuc … “Trade him to the Vikings for Dalvin and a knee brace.” Just read that Dalvin Cook blew out his ACL & will have season-ending knee surgery. Not cool.
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:14 pm
Vikings probably wish they had Doug Martin, now that the Apple of Joe’s eye, Dalvin Cook, is done for the season with a torn ACL……
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:14 pm
It’s clear film study is less important than an agenda. At least we know.
There’s no agenda dude, nor is it anything personal. Why would Joe care about anyone’s film study, including PFF, without the background to know exactly what went into it. Regardless, Joe’s personal assessment would take precedence here, which is why it’s called JoeBucsFan.com. You seem to fall into the crowd who yells “agenda” when someone doesn’t agree with you. Joe really doesn’t get that. If Joe had an agenda, Joe would be happy to write about it here.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:22 pm
Why, Joe? Because YOU stated he had bad film. I merely stated I charted EVERY CARRY the guy had in 2016. I know how to chart film. I did it when I cut up 16mm film and spliced it together for coaches. I saw the film. If you didn’t see what was on the film, then you don’t know what to look for.
Look, this isn’t a pissing match. If you want to publish your findings somewhere, Joe is happy to share it on Twitter. Joe watched plenty of film as well (certainly not every snap on All-22 focused on Martin) and Joe ran various plays by accomplished professionals. Those folks agreed with Joe on all the specific plays shared on Martin and Joe has had many discussions with ex-players and other personnel people. One, a former running back, would shock the crap out of you based on your comments. Agree to disagree here. Not sure why this gets personal. It’s certainly not on this end. Joe’s not telling anyone not to like Doug Marin. –Joe.
Sorry, but Martin’s poor 2016 was a result of some horrendous blocking. Winston may have put up good numbers in 2016, be he about got killed in the process. Putting up big numbers does NOT mean the OL was effective. That;s a deflection a casual fan may buy. I won’t, “dude.”
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:38 pm
you either care enough about the efficacy of your takes to see some relationship between them and the credibility of your buccaneer insights (reasonable and expected) or you are a stephen a smith (a pot-stirrer and traffic-monger, which you insist you are not, and i believe you) type media presence. so which is it?
saying that your wrong takes sting you and are a bad look is not a judgement. it is an observation evidenced by your reactions and your readers’ long memories when it comes to some of the shoddier drums you’ve chosen to bang. you’ll never fully escape things like the Johnny Football obsession, because anytime you are convinced something will\should happen people will remember the other times you insisted you something would\should happen.
You’ve really got Joe all wrong. Joe doesn’t hide or want to escape from wanting Johnny Football and eagerly wanting/demanding the Bucs draft a QB in 2014. Why would Joe hide from any take? Joe is pleased that readers care enough to keep a scorecard. –Joe
to wit, i kinda suspect you have already written up a “gloat” post ready to go up (pending edits related to how\why it happened) should doug succumb to ineffectiveness, injury, fresh suspension, or some other misfortune. and you wouldn’t be human if some part of you (not the bucs fan part, i’m sure) didn’t want to be right about something you’ve been going on about very publicly (and very alone) since the suspension emerged
Again, you’ve got Joe pegged backwards. It’s fun to be right, sure, but even when you’re right — or wrong — many people won’t believe the reality in whatever direction it goes. Joe isn’t here to be right or wrong or liked or despised. Joe has learned from Day 1 here, and from working as a newspaper reporter with a published email address and phone number in the days when newspapers were king, criticism and slanted realities are always there to slap you in the face daily. Either you care, or you don’t. Joe really doesn’t. However, Joe the business owner always cares about being misrepresented, as any business should be.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:44 pm
Welcome back, your drugs were your ticket out
Welcome back, to that same old place that you laughed about
Well some names have all changed since you hung around
But those dreams have remained and they’ve turned around
Who’d have thought they’d lead ya
(Who’d have thought they’d lead ya)
Back here where we need ya
(Back here where we need ya)
Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back, welcome back
Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:46 pm
Help us Dougie-Wan-Kenobi, you’re our only hope (to have a badass running game)
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:49 pm
lol like hell you would like for him to succeed ahahaha.
Would love it. If you were a fan you would understand that.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:49 pm
Bravo joe , bravo . Way to find something to stir the pot … this year was martin . Previous years was glennon mob . Then there was johnny manziel . I say next year will be …
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:50 pm
I DID share it with you guys via email, Joe. You got the info first. Your response: yeah, but he missed a hole against N.O.
Want me to post the email conversation?
I don’t get anything from PFF. I did it myself with my own eyeballs.
It’s not a pissing match because I have 1st hand facts and data on my side. Every snap of #22. It there any better method to determine what happened than watching ALL his film and dissecting it?
You’re welcome to post anything you’d like that doesn’t misrepresent Joe. Joe gets a lot of email daily and responds to 90 percent of it. Really have no recollection, although Joe does remember the snap against the Saints that resulted in a safety. That was one of several Martin film examples Joe shared with film gurus. Player evaluation is subjective, which is why it’s so difficult and why teams invest millions into it and fail repeatedly. So even the alleged black and white is up for debate. One great example is Ira Kaufman’s neverending work on talking to NFL insiders and ex-coaches, players even other Hall of Famers, for their Xs and Os takes on John Lynch and Ronde Barber. If Ira ever chose to share the differences publicly in opinion, it would make one hell of a story. Just recently, a very known name made it clear to Ira in an Xs and Os conversation that Ronde Barber is nowhere near worthy of the Hall. Joe just heard audio interview yesterday. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:50 pm
what makes the “doug martin is done in tampa” angle seem like such a personal mission (not personal as in “i dislike doug martin and want him out” but personal as in “i don’t see how i could possibly be wrong about this and i’m battling a tide of blindness\stupidity”) is the fact that it stands in opposition to everything most bigtime bucs fans and everyone inside the building seems to have observed. i’m not talking about the coachspeak around his role, i’m talking about the praise that nobody hesitated to give when asked “how does doug look?”
i’m sure there are knowledgeable guys out there who say that doug was just a crappy runner last year, but unless they were heavily focused on bucs football they probably are basing their analysis on a small portion of what doug and the rest of the backs did last year
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:50 pm
I said it all offseason – if Martin comes back healthy and recovered from his addiction, he’ll be back with the team. Joe continued to pump nonsense about unloading him regardless.
Regarding the “motivation” issues Joe alluded to, I think this is covered under the issue of addiction. Odds are good that there’s a correlation between his motivation and addiction issues. If the addiction is dealt with (as it appears it is), then the motivation problem is probably not an issue. So, there we have it. Joe’s reasons for dumping Martin make no sense. Now, if he had shown up out of shape and didn’t look ready to play, then no one could fault them for dumping Dougie, but that’s not the case.
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:53 pm
Stick to your guns when he proves you wrong will ya?
Better than suddenly turning up positive pieces about a guy we know you never believed in no matter what you claim lol.
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:58 pm
DBrooks55 Says:
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:00 pm
———
Wtf is this? Million and 1 screen names and he picks that one. Smh.
BUT ALLEN CROSS THOUGH…..
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:04 pm
I’m confused. I’m sure I read here multiple times since the end of last season that Doug Martin was not going to be a Buc after he served his suspension. If he is definitely not going to be a Buc is he still a Buc?
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:04 pm
Just want to see PBarber get 20 plus caries two games in a row……… I know it won’t happen but would like to see it. Def think he is the best runner of the group !!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:05 pm
I won’t be surprised if Alan Cross is back on the practice squad, and prolly at decent $$$ that would prevent poaching…
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:06 pm
Boy, what a linguistic trip this one has been. Go Bucs!! BTW, how is the krewe feeling over the LV carnage today?
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:09 pm
Joe’s,
Since the beginning your site hit the net, you guys have provided the best source of football information and provide fans to communicate not only directly with you but with other fans. Every person has the right to express their feelings. It is a shame that fans except you to agree with them. Please keep up the hard work and sharing your feelings and inside knowledge. We all should be lucky to have a source such as joebucsfan.com. Most NFL teams do not have a dedicated fan, reporter who spends his career finding out information for us fans. Thank you, please keep running the website as usual. Don’t conform to random people that don’t know anything, but somehow still form illogical thoughts
That was nice. Joe thanks you for your patronage. Joe will continue to be right and wrong and everything in between, just like every fan in the stands or at the bar — and nearly every personnel man in the NFL. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:12 pm
One game Peyton Barber will explode
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:16 pm
You all are bashing Joe WAY too hard on this one. I believe it’s very clear there’s no personal vendetta here. Personally after the mcnichols debacle I’m happy to have Doug back, but all along logic and numbers have said the odds were stacked against him. When you actually read what Joe has written (and not just in this article, but many, many before this) it is pretty damn easy to see where he’s coming from. As a fan that’s excited as hell to have Martin back, I haven’t been able to disagree with anything Joe’s written. Keep up the good work Joe! Best bucs reporting there is out there, regardless of what these folks think.
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:29 pm
HAHAHAAHAH JBF wrong once again, you guys are tools and always will be.
Always comical to be called a tool by someone who seeks out the tool’s opinion and hard work. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:31 pm
WOW!!!!
That pissed off a lot of people for some reason.
Some of them trash McCoy, a perennial pro bowler, but just pointing out the facts of Doug Martin‘s career has them calling for Joe‘s head.
SMH
Like Joe, I am rooting hard for Doug Martin, but I’m not counting on it. The reason is the fact that sometimes he is not motivated.
I think that speaks to when he gets injured it takes a long time to come back, lack of motivation.
This organization has made it a priority to draft people who love football and are captains of teams or squads. Think Kwon Alexander and JW.
Martin is not that.
But…. damn I’d love for him to look like he did a couple years ago.
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:42 pm
WOW… the comment sections on this site are great and this post doesn’t disappoint. PROPS to the Joe’s for doing serious work defending them-(him?) selves here, not many venues out there that would be willing to do that..
That being said, I think a majority of us knew Doug would be back and it was just a function of the process that the Bucs were holding that info close to the chest. However, it is perfectly ok ( and I am glad they did) that the JOE’s took and opposite/unpopular view to the contrary. It adds buzz to the site and I have no reason to believe that they don’t truly believe it was a long shot for Doug to make the time.. to accuse them of anything else is ludicrous, they clearly have WAY more access to the team than a typical fan does..
A few things though Joe:
1.) The structure of Doug Martin’s contract (per Spotrac) negates the “gamble” argument in bringing Martin back. We are only on the hook for his base salary this year (its the smallest he got over the 5 years) and he no longer has any guaranteed money. If he sucks this year, the team can walk away this offseason. The $5,764,706 he is due to earn is well worth the shot at top five RB from this point forward that he presents.
Sure, if you believe that shot exists. Joe does not. That cash now can’t rollover to next year’s cap, as Joe explained above. Really think the Bucs could have got this done for a $2 million.–Joe
2.) I personally LOATHE when y’all say things like “…… often fueled by information Joe can’t type here.” That sounds like such a cop out (and a tad self aggrandizing) and I think you all are way better than that. If you can’t tell your loyal readers information you have obtained pertaining to the team then please don’t allude to it like we are all a bunch of schmucks, its irritating. Look, it’s very rare that Joe does that. Very rare. Sometimes it fits and needs to said when it’s an important reality. But Joe gets it, and Joe doesn’t like typing that. –Joe
Go Bucs!
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:54 pm
Welcome back Dougie go Bucs!!! Go kick some shady Brady ass!
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:04 pm
Thank you Jason. Appreciate the thoughts.
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:38 pm
I hope Martin works out….if for aome reason he. Doesnt I would offer Detroit a 5th rnd pick for Zach Zenner. Dude balled out last season when he got snaps and hes buried on he depth chart.
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:38 pm
WHAT JASON SAID!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:42 pm
Personally I believe that our Muscle Hamster is just one lucky dude. My guess is that the Buccaneers were well aware of Dougies “problem” long before we ever were and his promises to kick the habit never materialized. If it weren’t for OJ. Howard falling to us unexpectedly, other team needs, and our present weakness at that position he would not be again on this team. I think Joe was right….Mr Martin is just one lucky dude.
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:45 pm
I’ll bet the biggest WELCOME BACK was from coach KOETTER
*rimshot*
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:47 pm
get it?
get it? Welcome Back Kotter the TV show w Gabe Kaplan…?
Funny, right?
No?
OK FINE!
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:49 pm
The one point that has mostly been missed is how Doug’s teammates feel about his return…..in particular Jameis. I would be willing to bet that it is being met with overwhelming enthusiasm.
That, alone will help.
I will remain optimistic until it’s proven otherwise.
October 2nd, 2017 at 7:52 pm
^^^^ Excellent observation….keen insight !
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:05 pm
Howard Cosell Says:
get it?
get it? Welcome Back Kotter the TV show w Gabe Kaplan…?
Funny, right?
No?
OK FINE!
Well played and well done. Not lost on those of us longer in the tooth. My guess is that most posters are too young to remember the show or even you, Howard Cosell ( love the toupee, by the way. )
Lots of pent up demand to tell the Joes’ I told you so on this one. So many things fell Martin’s way…namely bringing in no competition ( what if Licht had snagged Cook in a trade up…what then?!) At any rate…in the words of Gene Deckeroff in the 2002 NFC Title Game “You go Joe, you go!”
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:11 pm
LOL! Before I even read the comment section I KNEW Joe would be salty by this news as soon as it crossed my phone this morning.
Joe wasn’t going to pass on the chance to keep the record straight in these comments. Joe enjoys interacting with readers when time permits, which isn’t often enough. You should see the comments that don’t make it through the hate filters. Good golly! as Gene Deckerhoff would say. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:17 pm
Any Bucs woes this year thus far — and it’s still real early — have been on defense. Vikings game was horrible, but you could attribute poor showing to Flu bug and injuries. Team got so far behind, whole game plan went out the window. No running game problems here. No running game period because they were getting their doors blown off. Rodgers was solid, with flu, 1st game. Or 2nd game, actually, as 1st game was postponed. And that was against Dolphins, where Quizz might have gotten 100 + yards easily against sad Fish D-fense. So 2nd game — he gets TD and runs hard. Against tough D, btw. Then the blowout in Minny. Then this past week, where he was fine. Better than fine. He was really good. And caught 2 great screen passes/runs. Martin is fine addition. And no reason to hate on the guy. But we could use a pass rush, a shotgun snapper, a kicker, and a healthy LB a lot more than another RB.
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:24 pm
Well said captain big (MF) stick
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:24 pm
ROTFLMMFAO. Joe you are defending yourself A Bit too much eh? It’s all good though. I still luv ya and the Site!
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:43 pm
Thanks to the Joes for keeping us informed. I remember the dark days during an offseason when there was nothing to read in the newspapers for days on end. Seems like some just want to attack the Joes. Lots of us do appreciate everything you guys do. Keep up the good work!!!
Glad Doug’s back and I hope he knows how player friendly management is being in not cutting his salary. We won’t take the chance in resigning him when his contract expires but feel he is going to ball out this year. Looks like he has his vision back as well as his speed. Go Bucs!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:47 pm
Gameday in 3 days. Who even cares whose right or wrong. Sometimes I think a few select fans that comment here are trying to overcompensate their fandom to make up for a lack of girth.
October 2nd, 2017 at 8:54 pm
Full price? For a guy that only performs 40% of the time? Rip off.
I do not trust Drug Martin. I’m sure he’ll be a bust again.
October 2nd, 2017 at 9:02 pm
I do believe on the Ira podcast this offseason, after the Bucs took McNichols, that one of the Joes said there was NO chance Martin makes the team. Perhaps I remember it incorrectly, but the way I recall it there was no hedging, it was spoken in absolutes. The reason I recall this is because how momentarily shocked Ira sounded. Ira himself said he thought it was unlikely Martin was back, but he left the door open, then one of you jumped on him for even that. Again, going by memory, so maybe I’m wrong. Anywho just thought I’d share.
Also Joe as said before I appreciate you having opinions and not being some boring source of news like say Greg Auman whose writing nearly puts to me sleep it’s so dull. Why you choose this hill to fight on I’ll never quite understand, but it is what it is. So now you get beating for it, to me that’s the fun part of anyone who takes a strong opinion about anything. You get to say I told you so when you’re right, and you get to be fodder for critics when you’re wrong.
Hey I said Roberto would come back strong this offseason and win the job and be here for a decade, I was completely wrong. Of course I just comment here so no one really cares, but just saying, even someone as great as myself can be wrong. It happens.
Rarely, but it does happen.
October 2nd, 2017 at 9:17 pm
“Would love it. If you were a fan you would understand that.–Joe”
That’s cute jajaja
October 2nd, 2017 at 9:18 pm
Why do any of you take digs at Joe? I don’t get it … if you don’t appreciate the articles, leave the site.
Anyways … what I’d like to know is if Martin can be let go at the end of this season without any financial repercussions for the Bucs, or is he also under contract or have some sort of “partial guarantee” for next year?
October 2nd, 2017 at 9:32 pm
Sorry. That’s false and baloney, too. –Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 9:34 pm
….and he’s clean and ready to contribute. ….this may workout for us …hopefully Doug feels a little remorse and wants to make a concerted effort to silence is biggest critics. Let’s hope so …we are 2 -1 with a bruised ego Patriot team coming in and we could use Doug’s fresh legs!
October 2nd, 2017 at 9:41 pm
I’ve never seen joe respond to so many comments. This is hilarious!!!
October 2nd, 2017 at 9:43 pm
In the end it doesn’t matter if Doug does good or bad this year. It simply can’t hurt to give him a shot. The worst thing that happens is the glazers lose some pocket change. Is this really what the Joe’s are griping about? A billionaires pocket book? If it ends up being a waste of money, oh well. I’m sure the glazers will still be able to feed their kids with the left over they have after paying Martin. Meanwhile Doug has a chance to help this team. I don’t care if it is just a 25 percent chance he does good. Any chance to make this team better should be explored.
Joe is all about spending Team Glazer’s loot and exploring every opportunity to win, but that doesn’t mean high-fiving every decision. Joe routinely is a strong advocate of exploring players the Bucs never look at. Never hurts to bring guys in for a workout and an interview. Regarding Martin, the money spent on him (or any guy on the roster) is money that can’t go to someone else next year — or in a trade this year — since the cap money can roll over.–Joe
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:04 pm
Doug is in total control…if he produces as the best RB on the roster his contract is safe…but dollars to donuts RB will be taken high in 2018 draft…McSnoop pooped his pants ….GM folded his 2017 hand….Run Doug run !
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:08 pm
The Best DE on the board better be the first Rd. choice for us Altered.
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:14 pm
I didn’t say 1st I said high…DL or DB with 1st would be my gamble…but that is a long long way off…sure would like a big starting RB hammer added in 2018…
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:15 pm
Smoke some bud and chill da f out Martin is the man going nowhere …
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:19 pm
Will all the Dalvin Cook die-hards please stand up? Wouldn’t that include No. 3?
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:28 pm
Me too ALtered.
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:34 pm
Let’s just put personnel preferences in perspective and all agree that we need a new… President.
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:50 pm
Dilly Dilly !!
October 2nd, 2017 at 11:14 pm
I think this is Martin’s prove it year. Since I believe he can be cut with no ramifications, he will get this year to show which Martin he really is. We essentially have him on a week to week basis at this point.
October 3rd, 2017 at 12:03 am
Honestly, why was this article even titled “Welcome Back Doug Martin”? You literally back handed the guy in every negative aspect that you possibly could. I guess the joke is that the article title is also a backhand? You’ve clearly had issues with him and Spence through every article coming into this season, so no surprise I guess. I’m not saying that I don’t agree with some of the comments, but I think the focus is clearly biased heavily on one side. When Doug is playing at his best, he’s a beast. He’s looked to be in that form again in training camp and preseason. So let’s try some positivity because even though I like Quizz, our run game needs a serious boost. And this could be just what we need to allow the offense to really take off.
The headline is welcome back Doug Martin because he returned to the team today and Joe — and most Bucs fans — would like to see him tear it up on the field.–Joe
October 3rd, 2017 at 12:20 am
Douggieeeeee!!!!!!!
October 3rd, 2017 at 12:21 am
I have liked Martin in past. But why does it need a boost? Seems great to me, as long as Sims stays off the field.
October 3rd, 2017 at 12:21 am
Give Quizz the rock 25 times. That’s the only boost it needs.
October 3rd, 2017 at 12:23 am
Doug Martin is gonna take that ball and run wild
October 3rd, 2017 at 12:24 am
White House needs a boost. Bucs need healthy Linebackers, a better Kicker, and someone who can deliver a shotgun-snap. And some better play-calling in the Red Zone.
October 3rd, 2017 at 12:31 am
I have enough experience with drug addicts to hope for the best but to expect the worst. I hope Doug comes back and he is better than ever, but I expect to see the player we saw last year.
October 3rd, 2017 at 1:04 am
I laid out a mild mannered, non profane counter argument to Joe’s post and he deleted it lol.. Why refute a good point when you can eliminate it?
For real though man that’s a weak move. It was anything but “mild mannered.” You opened by calling Joe a liar. It’s there for all to read. The remainder of what you wrote was false and malicious and you are welcome to clean up the remainder of what you wrote and re-post. Couldn’t be more simple. –Joe
October 3rd, 2017 at 1:13 am
You stupid dudes, lay off Joes, this website is theirs, don’t come here if you dont like what Joe puts up for us, who cares if Joe is wrong or not about DM22’s coming and going, we are here for Bucs gossip/info. Thanks Joe for putting up a really decent website for us.
stupid dudes: STOP AGGRAVATING JOES AND FOK OFF!
October 3rd, 2017 at 1:38 am
Cute cover-up Joe
October 3rd, 2017 at 2:47 am
Awww 87″ Your comment is gone 🙁 Twas funny though def made me chuckle.
On Topic though
BET Doug will bounce back with something to prove to the haters.
October 3rd, 2017 at 2:58 am
“”Lot of you take things way more personally than Joe ever will.” – Joe
Still replying to people who disagree at 1 am 😂👌
Joe replies to those who misrepresent Joe’s work, positive, negative or otherwise. Long-standing tradition here. And Joe responds on various topics when time allows.–Joe
I’d post it again Joe but I dont copy/paste my comments after I post them for later reference lol. Sorry calling you a liar triggered you, The only thing that “triggered” Joe was your lies and misrepresentations.–Joe
I really didn’t mean to roast your character and imply you lie often, I should’ve said what you said was inaccurate in this case and maybe I’d be less moderated 👌 Even though it really wasn’t inappropriate ijs..
October 3rd, 2017 at 3:18 am
Sorry Joe you were wrong on this, check all the PODCAST from end of season, it was your soapbox for almost all of them. Could barely get through one without reporting and predicting Martin will not be on team “no chance”. Maybe you stuck to you guns so you can one day say ” I said it first, you heard it hear first to report,” and get accolades,
The podcasts are there to be heard, as were Joe’s appearances on the Steve Duemig Show. Joe was very consistent and detailed on the Martin discussions and in expressing a projected likelihood/unlikelihood of his return. Joe’s disinterested in accolades. For every accolade, there’s someone calling Joe an idiot, and vice versa. Joe’s accolades come in the continued growth of the website, which dominates local Bucs coverage by any measure.–Joe
October 3rd, 2017 at 6:36 am
Joebucsfan aka DougMartinHatersUnited.com going to be butt hurt when the Muscle Hampster gets unleashed!
October 3rd, 2017 at 6:49 am
Rodgers over Martin? this article just further confirms my thoughts on the Joe’s common sense right there LOL
October 3rd, 2017 at 6:56 am
Go Joe!
You’re the man! I appreciate all that goes into your stories, and you’re one of the few media providers who has ethics and doesn’t twist things to fit a narrative that leads to more clicks.
Let’s hope Doug Martin has a good rest of the season and helps us get to the playoffs.
Joe, I know all the comments that are out of line can be annoying, but damn if it’s not grade A entertainment reading the posts and your responses while drinking my coffee.
October 3rd, 2017 at 6:59 am
I hope the team keeps running Rodgers . Loyalty matters and respect for your team . 22 suspended for faking a drug test is unacceptable besides playing like crap most of his career here . So he had a couple of good years ….he also had several crap years and at least one due to his own selfishness . Should have let him go . I hope the team finds a solution next off season .
October 3rd, 2017 at 8:35 am
Martin > insert any other RB name on Bucs roster.
I hope it helps open the play action pass to DJAX v NE.
October 3rd, 2017 at 9:00 am
Wow, 172 responses to this article. I haven’t read any of them and I am just curious if anyone has mentioned the fact that the Joe’s predicted it was 50/50 about a week ago. LOL. I am going to guess that approximately 168 of the comments above referenced this.
Epic example of not reading the post, either. –Joe
October 3rd, 2017 at 9:20 am
Doug is gonna prove all the haters and the media wrong. Oh it’s gonna be glorious 😀
Joe is in damage control right now as you can tell by all the replies to the peasants. “Damage?” LOL–Joe Kinda funny to see from a different perspective. I prefer to eat my crow BBQ.
Douggieeeeeee!!!!!!!!
October 3rd, 2017 at 9:38 am
Joe the Martin negativity that oozed out of that article made it clear you hate the fact that he is back with the team. I don’t think you have an agenda, you just don’t think he is an asset. Based on what I saw in the preseason I am holding out hope that he plays like he did during his good years.
October 3rd, 2017 at 2:23 pm
It gets worse for The Joes: not only is Martin with the team at his full salary but today he’s getting the majority of first-team reps.
Forget the “no way he’ll not be a Buc”, first-team reps are a long way from “50/50” from even last week.
Now Martin has to prove his worth on the field, so Hope Springs Eternal for the Martin Hate Mob “I told you so’s”…
I expect a stacked box with Evans getting doubled Thursday night. Could be a field day for Humphries and the TE’s.