Was Koetter Desperate?
October 14th, 2017
Revealing words.
Browsing through Friday’s quotes from winning coach Dirk Koetter’s presser before the Bucs jetted to the desert, one particular statement caused an eyebrow to raise on Joe’s forehead.
We all knew when running back Doug Martin finished his suspension that Martin very likely would have no more than a part-time role for the Bucs when they hosted the Belicheats.
Martin had not practiced full-contact football for a month. So only the demented or the most dedicated drunks expected Koetter to go full-blown Bum Phillips and have Martin tote the rock 35 times like Earl Campbell last Thursday night. Both before and after the game, Koetter has repeatedly stated Martin was not completely in football shape. Koetter added on national radio that Martin was “gassed.” Even Martin admitted he was cashed.
Why is Joe rehashing this? Well, read Koetter’s words from yesterday when asked if guys coming off injury will be “limited” after so much time off.
“Limited is a relative word,” Koetter said. “Again, these guys are professional football players. Nobody’s going to get medically cleared if they’re not ready to play in the game. That’s a medical decision and if guys are cleared, if they’re cleared to play, then they are cleared to play. If they’re on the 46, they gotta be ready to play the whole game.”
Yet Koetter went out of his way for days to defend and explain how Martin was not ready to physically play a whole game just last week. What gives?
Well, Joe has a thought: The Bucs’ rushing attack had been so putrid through the first three games Koetter was desperate to get Martin back on the field to add a jolt to his offense. Even knowing Martin wasn’t fully in football shape, Koetter was banking the rushing attack with Martin only getting a handful of touches was better off than depending on Jacquizz Rodgers and Charles Sims to provide a balanced attack against the Belicheats.
October 14th, 2017 at 4:03 pm
Why are you still calling this guy “winning” coach? He hasn’t even won the division!!!
October 14th, 2017 at 4:19 pm
Because he has a winning record.
October 14th, 2017 at 4:39 pm
Goodbye, Tony. Your malicious attitude and commentary is not welcome. Just find a new website. What’s the point? The irony of your BS is astounding. –Joe
October 14th, 2017 at 4:39 pm
Steve, I’ve got to admit, I thought this article would be grasping at straws. You’ve got a good point. The only thing I could think of in Koetters’ defense is that before the game Koetter didn’t expect Martin to get gassed. If Koetter is the straight shooter we know he is, it’s the only explanation.
October 14th, 2017 at 4:44 pm
I’m going to say it’s different because main is a running back, we’ve had Peyton Barber on the active roster for several weeks without seeing him on the field. Must be easier to hide a running back than a line backer or safety.
October 14th, 2017 at 4:59 pm
Tighten up buddy don’t be negative if you speak life you will receive life so let him call koetter winning bucs coach
October 14th, 2017 at 5:06 pm
Not sure i trust the Joe’s to opine on anything related to Martin. After all, they have maintained that the Bucs would cut him.
October 14th, 2017 at 5:15 pm
Nothing worse than having players on the roster that can help solve problems but the professional coaches don’t use them …………. Koetter before long Licht will give you that directive ……..
Dirk I would like to see Barber get 5 to 8 touches on Sun and be utilized in goal line and short yardage. Thanks , JL
October 14th, 2017 at 5:18 pm
Bucnut2, just like we shouldn’t trust your “impartial” opinion of Winston. While I disagree with Steve’s take on Martin, it holds more weight than your opinion of Winston. At least Martin has more of a sample size and Winston is still the 2nd or 3rd youngest starting QB in the league.
October 14th, 2017 at 5:20 pm
Haggins, the only reason for that, that I can give, is that Barber must not be showing up in practice.
October 14th, 2017 at 5:31 pm
Bucnut2, the reason I defend Winston so much is because, while he is not without faults, is already the best QB we’ve had. Stop looking at Winston through the Brady/Rodgers glasses. He will never be that accurate. What he will do is make the throw that 90% of QBs wouldn’t even attempt. We’ve seen that he’s good enough to win 9 games with a Defense that was horrible for half a season. Don’t be upset with what we don’t have, be happy with what we do, which is above average QB who’s only 23. Even if he’s only “Joe Flacco” good , I’ll take the one ring. Get on board and go for the ride. Winston gives us hope until he proves otherwise. If that happens, I’ll say that you were right. It doesn’t look like Mariota would have been a good choice over Jameis. We know what the best ability is.
October 14th, 2017 at 5:40 pm
Koettrer wasn’t “desperate” Joe – but he knows Martin is easily the most talented runner on our team and wanted to get him as many touches as made sense considering the 5 week lay off.
Martin had 13 rushes and 3 pass attempts. Sounds about right. Couple or few more wouldn’t have hurt but we were passing a lot in the 2nd half.
October 14th, 2017 at 5:45 pm
“we all knew Martin would have aore than part time role seriously? You said a 15 percent chance and that Martin may have 6 or 7 snaps. Are you just becoming more and more deranged
Might want to work on your reading skills.–Joe
October 14th, 2017 at 5:55 pm
I agree Pick but I think Koetter may be feeling the stress since he is The offensive mind in charge. Koetter has all of the proverbial chess pieces. He should be doing better IMO
October 14th, 2017 at 6:02 pm
Defense- lets be honest, JW played very pedestrian during the Bucs winning streak last year and played horribly when the season was on the line in Dallas and NO. We need to start thinking doubt an Andy Dalton type of career for him and need to forget about all of the “weapons for winston” talk. We have invested a TON of money and draft picks to support JW and the bottom line is he is an average NFL QB. We need to three things:
1-draft and invest in defense til our unit is top 5 in the NFL
2-draft O-line and RB to take the ball out of JW hands
3-turn JW into a Brad Johnson type of game manager
We will NEVER consistently win by putting this team on JW’s back.
He is an ELITE leader and AVERAGE QB
October 14th, 2017 at 6:03 pm
Koetter is desparate because other than Martin, our other RBs won’t gain a yard that the line doesn’t give them, and even then, they have to make the hole last just a bit longer. Our other RBs are so slow hitting the holes it’s plainly visible to people without a professional eye.
The Bucs really should have drafted Mack in draft.
October 14th, 2017 at 6:09 pm
And Bucnut2, you really are not wrong. I guess since he’s young (age wise), there is a chance JW will develop a more consistent accuracy, but on the flip side he’s a 3 year starter at this point and there hasn’t been much progression since the beginning of year 2.
I guess the good thing is unless he regresses, he’s good enough to be a solid mid-tier starter, but I just see elite now or in the future. Hope I’m wrong.
October 14th, 2017 at 6:11 pm
Then why was Martin not able to play the full game — and Joe fully and totally believes Koetter when he was talking about Martin and not being in game shape.
October 14th, 2017 at 6:13 pm
No one was worried about martin coming back until hurricane Irma, only then did we realize the bye week would only allow 3 days back until his first game instead of 6.
October 14th, 2017 at 6:24 pm
Doug did get a little gassed toward the end of the 1st half, but looked like he was ready to play more in the 2nd than he did. I don’t think he should have had 30 touches, but he prob could have handled another 4-6 touches.
Koetter pretty much abandoned the run in the 2nd half, anD I think the talk about Martin is being used to divert attention from the play calling.
October 14th, 2017 at 6:26 pm
Like I said yesterday…these guys are professional players and they need to man the you know what up and play if they are claiming to be ready…but that’s ok if people get all pissed because I said Geraldine rubbed off on them
October 14th, 2017 at 6:28 pm
Even gassed still better than any rb out there. Nuff said
This should be more about his backups. They gotta make every opportunity useful
October 14th, 2017 at 6:29 pm
Bucnut2 You really are quite annoying with your bashing and minimizing of Winston’s talent. It’s far to early to categorize Winston as a average QB. Winston has shown flashes of brilliance and also shown flashes of bad play. What I’m trying to say it’s way to early to pigeon hole Winston into any category. By the way i thought the win in KC last year Winston played great. PS a good consistent running game makes all QB’s look better.
October 14th, 2017 at 6:35 pm
If wanting your best RB on the field as much as you can is desperate then so be it. However, I do agree with Tony. According to a majority of posters we have a bunch of bums and the worst coaches ever.
October 14th, 2017 at 6:37 pm
We had 43 offensive snaps in the 2nd half, not including punts.
We ran the ball just eight times…
October 14th, 2017 at 6:54 pm
Laughable those of you that call JW a game manager like Brad Johnson and call him pedestrian. What are you watching? In 3 out of 4 games, he has no INTs and is on pace to have 4,000 yards for each of his first 3 seasons. He has not missed a start, and if Cam Brate catches the TD right in his hands, we likely beat New England. Sure, he isn’t perfect, but to not see that (at age 23) he is gonna be a beast is really shocking. He has had sh&t for a running game and few real threats to throw to until this year. As the season progresses, we will be that “team nobody wants to play”. GO BUCS!!!
October 14th, 2017 at 7:29 pm
I would not say Koetter was desperate. But Martin is the man and Koetter knows it. When Dougie is playing well, we are almost impossible to beat. So what coach would want him back on the playing field ASAP. Even for tomorrow we all all hoping Martin rips it up. If he does…victory is ours.
October 14th, 2017 at 7:38 pm
I think this shows Koetter does not have much faith in Rodgers, Sims and Barber in running the ball, which is odd considering Rodgers was coming off a pretty good game and the Patriots rush defense was about as bad as the Giants.
I said over and over prior to the Pats game that Martin would not in “hitting shape” and would likely split the carries with Rodgers. Martin did more of less what I expected but Rodgers and the rest of the backs were non-existent in the running game.
October 14th, 2017 at 7:39 pm
Koettwr saying Martin was gassed isnt the same thing as saying Martin was unable to play. Bucs should have had 12 extra points on the board and Koetter was obviously playing it safe with his Bell Cow. Martin could have played the entire me and the results would have still been a loss in the end.
Nothing to worry about here
October 14th, 2017 at 7:41 pm
Look how long it took Bell to get in shape after holding out all offseason and training camp
October 14th, 2017 at 8:47 pm
We have 2 and 1/4 years of evidence on Winston and there is nothing other than expectations and his college career that point to him being elite. At this point he is what he is, average. I would love to be wrong about this because I am a 30 year buc fan.
October 14th, 2017 at 8:50 pm
doug martin is a joke and will screw this team over just like he has more than he has been productive. the blind and ignorant martin fanboys are laughable jokes simple as that. conveniently they forget the bad and only remember the mediocre. they are same losers who consider dungy’s underachieving pathetic two play off wins in 6 years “the glory years”. no standard losers. martin is a proven unreliable POS that will cost this team games and the playoffs this year just like he did last year. can’t wait for his relapse. the 30 for 30 will be much better than his career highlights that is if ESPN does not go out of business. gmc, martin, lvd, dotson are nothing more than nice guy losers who either have forgotten how to win or just rather lose and drive to the bank… there is a reason all those stars you losers worship have been in the basement their entire careers…. LOSERS all of them… wake up people
October 14th, 2017 at 9:05 pm
I think the “gassed” excuse isn’t just that, an excuse. Martin hasn’t been with the team the past 4 weeks. He wouldnt have hadn’t any updated playbook or had practiced any of the new stuff installed over the last 4 weeks. He was behind. The guys injured are in the building, in the meetings. And usually on the sideline at practice. So they are mentally prepared when they’d are cleared to play. I don’t think Dirk trusted Martin to come in with 2-3 days of prep to throw him out there in 2 minute or hurry up offense situations. Sure Doug was a tired after carrying the entire offense in the second quarter. But to say he couldn’t run in the fourth quarter because he was tired is a BS excuse. The offense wasn’t ready to give Martin full playing time with the limited time he had to prepare. Not to mention Doug usually doesn’t do the hurry offense. His hands suck (see Thursday) so it wouldn’t be using your best players in that situation. I don’t understand the infactuation or excuses of saying Martin was gassed, of course he was. All players are. Every player fights through fatigue especially late in games. It’s a poor excuse.
October 14th, 2017 at 9:24 pm
Have come to the opinion recently that some Bucs ‘fans’ seem to be anything but that. Tmaxcon, why even bother commenting on JBF or any other Bucs sites if you’re against literally E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G. GMC, Jameis, Lavonte, Martin, Dotson … the list just goes on and on … you seem to dislike them all. You’re certainly not alone though. Lots of others, including myself at times, get down on certain players … or coaches. But I think that one word … H-O-P-E … defines most real Bucs fans. We may be critical of various players and/or coaches, but most still have some degree of H-O-P-E that it’ll all come together (sooner rather than later … hopefully). Perk up tmaxcon; Bucs have potential, they’re just not playing up to that potential just yet.
October 14th, 2017 at 9:50 pm
Hey did anyone ever start the GoFundme for tmax?
I mean if there was ever someone in need of getting laid… lol.
No one has forgotten the bad years tmax, but he did happen to be injured each of those. To say he was only average the other 2 years is beyond dishonest. He was actually a top 3 running back. Of course it’s convenient for you to leave out the facts and just bluster through with your emotion and misguided opinions… seems to be an epidemic in this country as of late.
October 14th, 2017 at 10:27 pm
Don’t think it is an excuse whatsoever — and this is coming from someone who doesn’t trust Doug Martin at all.
Players work out year-round. Go look at the videos on Jameis’ Instagram account what he goes through. Same with GMC and many others.
After the first training camp practice with pads, these guys are shot. There really is a major difference from working out (no matter how hard it might be) and full-contact football practice. It’s like combining boxing with a demolition derby.
Maybe a receiver could get away with it. Maybe, just maybe, a corner. But a running back? Nah, way, way different than anything done in a gym or anywhere else.
October 15th, 2017 at 1:37 am
It really doesn’t matter how much anyone can trust Doug…he just needs to bring it now, no matter the reason as long as the Bucs reap the benefits…Go Bucs!
I really think needed to be away fromt the team and he will show up for them…that is the difference in now vs then!
October 15th, 2017 at 6:56 am
Guy was involved all of camp and you are telling me he can’t stay somewhat game ready in a month away from the team? No contact blah blah, these guys hardly get contact outta games in this league now. It’s bull. I have no doubt he was gassed after the one drive where he got the rock like 8 times and scored…. he was fine in the 2nd half … no doubt about it.