Finding An Edge Rush
March 16th, 2017
Talks Bucs draft.
While Joe is focused on running backs and wide receivers in the draft because Joe is fully convinced the Bucs will draft at those two positions next month (who and what round is a different story), that doesn’t mean other areas of the team should be neglected.
And, yes, the broken record of the past 10 years continues: still no double-digit edge rusher.
Yes, the Bucs drafted Noah Spence last year and while Joe just loves Spence’s desire and heart and he flashed promise, he did have offseason shoulder surgery. Who knows if he can bounce back?
Jacquies Smith? C’mon. Is anyone really banking on this guy? Kind of hard to make an impact if you can’t stay on the field much less get on the field. That’s just the cruel, harsh reality of the NFL.
So, yeah, a double-digit edge rusher is still a need. Friggin’ still! Though, not quite as critical as in years past.
This led BSPN’s Todd McShay to discuss the Bucs drafting an edge rusher in a recent BSPN podcast. He and helmet hair Mel Kiper discussed draft options.
“There is a decent amount of depth at edge rusher if [the Bucs] were looking for one, they could probably find one,” McShay said. “I’m not sure how late in the draft you are able to get one that is going to make a huge difference in getting to the quarterback.”
Would Bucs AC/DC-loving general manager Jason Licht play poker and hope Takkarist McKinley or Charles Harris slips into the second round ,or does Licht roll the dice and take a chance that Tim Williams doesn’t turn into a gun-totin’ version of NFL suspension king Josh Gordon?
March 16th, 2017 at 4:12 pm
They are looking at some prospects that should be drafted 2-4 round.
Trey Henderickson.Tahoh Kpassagnon,Jordan Willis
March 16th, 2017 at 4:14 pm
Keep an eye on Haason the kid from Temple. Looks like a lil Simeon Rice
March 16th, 2017 at 4:15 pm
I really believe the Bucs need to find another edge rusher before a RB. I know the Horde (i.e. JBF commentors) will jump on my case over that but I think a stud edge rusher is more important than a stud RB at this point. You can find great RB talent in the 3rd and 4th rounds. Keep building from the inside out.
March 16th, 2017 at 4:19 pm
D-rome. Dunno if it is more important, but the draft is definately deeper at rb than edge rusher. Not many outside of the guys expected to go 1-2 round.
March 16th, 2017 at 4:19 pm
Or we could trade down a few spots and take TJ Watt/ Hassan Reddick.
Heck if Taco Charleton is there at 19, you take him without hesitating.
March 16th, 2017 at 4:25 pm
To be the no. 4-5 DE??? Please…. Get real
March 16th, 2017 at 4:26 pm
Really Joe? Every comment I make is being moderated? I mean I know we have a difference in opinion on some things, but really? I never say anything offensive or inflammatory.
March 16th, 2017 at 4:42 pm
I’ve seen us linked to having interest in Jordan Willis out of Kansas state and the dude seems like he could be a nice addition to our DL rotation. In other news, I really dislike the fact DEs are hardly referred to as DEs anymore and “edge rushers” to me are allowed to suck at the other aspects of defensive ends job if they can breach the edge. Take Gholston for example, playing the run and setting the edge as well as he can at times he’ll give reps up to a Jacques Smith (who’s as big as an LB) but can run around a OT/TE because he’s quicker though he’s disadvantaged on the first few downs when/if the chains move. To me, the good & great DEs are disruptive regardless of offensive playcall.
March 16th, 2017 at 4:54 pm
Why is no one talking about us and TJ Watt!? He’s JJ watts brother for crying out loud! I would not cry if we took him in the first.
March 16th, 2017 at 5:06 pm
Drome
Youre right the game is n always be won up front. Of course theyre not “sexy” picks tho. Not many want to mock a DL or OL in the first with so many good receivers and rbs available, including myself. It wouldnt hurt my feelings if they found a great lineman in the first round or two. Id much rather envision more weapons for winston tho! Yes this draft is deep at rb and receiver but lets get real, the best ones go early. Whoever we pick im all in. Go bucs
March 16th, 2017 at 5:30 pm
Trench warfare
March 16th, 2017 at 5:37 pm
Agreed SoCalBucsFan i like all of those picks esp Jordan Willis. This guy could be a sleeper.
March 16th, 2017 at 5:38 pm
Blake it’s his censoring software that’s why you’re under moderation. I’ve had the same problem today even tho I posted comments yesterday without moderation
March 16th, 2017 at 5:40 pm
Big question. What do you look at? The defense has been a constant 3rd down to 1st down give away. But then no good if the offense can’t stay on the field or score. I do guarantee this. It is year 3 and if they don’t get to the playoffs the fangs are going to come out. And not just “but all we need is”.
March 16th, 2017 at 5:40 pm
I would like them take Charles Harris at 19.Then a rb,wr.
March 16th, 2017 at 6:07 pm
Haha…. this is funny! All the experts on these comments acting like they know all the great steals for teams and who they should pick. We’re all fans and have our opinions. I do, but it cracks me up. If you go and look at the last 15 or so years you have a lot easier time seeing players at rb who have had succes more at the top of the draft more then on the d-line. Sure there are the rbs near the last rounds who made it, but it’s a lot easier to find the busts on the d line vs rbs. It’s hit or miss friends. I’d say even with the Bucs issues at d-line picks, I’d take a chance on rb. Gotta get the guy who can move the chains. Just my opinion. It’s just funny how everyone thinks they got it figured. I know I don’t, but I’d like that guy we can rely on to help move the rock. We’ll get that guy who can get after the qb. It can’t last forever. We’ve just had a bad run.
March 16th, 2017 at 6:07 pm
The fact that – Hassan Reddick is a former Safety is very intriguing.
Especially when you take into account – how he’s excelled at both Leo & Mike.
He’s a rare talent.
One minute he reminds you of Von Miller @Texas A&M.
His down field thumper still is reminscent of Lavonte David@Nebraska.
Then on the other hand his coverage skills over the Tight End – reminds you of K.J. Wright during his time @Mississsippi St.
I don’t see how this kid would ever come off the field.
There’s so many ways – that you could utilize his MANY talents.
Like I said —he’s a rare breed.
Don’t get me wrong – I still would go with Evan Engram in the 1st round.
Cause of the matchup nightmare he bring to the offense.
But- If Licht drafted Reddick – at 19.
I wouldn’t be the least bit upset.
March 16th, 2017 at 6:09 pm
Unless an elite prospect falls in our laps @19
Either Prospect – would be a welcomed addition
-Evan Engram
-Charles Harris
-Hassan Reddick
March 16th, 2017 at 6:10 pm
**His down field thumper style is reminscent of Lavonte David@Nebraska.
March 16th, 2017 at 6:16 pm
If tacos there at 19 I would grab him but that’s just my opinion and opinions are like assholes everyone’s got one
March 16th, 2017 at 6:40 pm
this team is looking more and more like its being built to be a 3-4 team. Jaques Smith and Spence are ideal outside linebackers in this system. GMC, Gholston, Ayers and Baker could be 3-4 DE. Baker can slide to NT on Passing downs. This would help the edge rush tremendously
March 16th, 2017 at 7:00 pm
At Blake. Joe has already told me he has no interest in upgrading his censoring filters. They are very outdated. For example try typing s.n.o.o. k without the periods and spaces.
March 16th, 2017 at 7:08 pm
Would rather have that Anderson kid from Bama. He was a machine in the championship game
March 16th, 2017 at 8:07 pm
Anderson will be long gone! (Probably)
March 16th, 2017 at 8:15 pm
If Cook, Williams, Davis, OJ Howard and McCaffrey are off the board (certainly possible) and DE-Barnett somehow falls to #19 (which is not that likely)- I would definitely be up for drafting Barnett in the 1st at #19.
March 16th, 2017 at 8:16 pm
Wont hate a DE pick
March 16th, 2017 at 8:29 pm
Licht always seems to go all in on one side of the ball or the other.
Years 1 and 2 were almost all offense. With Kwon sprinkled in there because he was so high on their board they couldn’t refuse him.
Last year was almost all defense. I wonder if licht will continue this type of trend. Or if he is at the point that BPA is in play and whoever is there is who we draft regardless of position, need, or side of the ball he plays on.
I see the Hawley signing as licht preparing the team like there is no draft. He isn’t going to rely on a draft pick to fill a need. And he will just take the best player available. The holes we had in years past have been filled. There is no absolute need at this moment. We have a solid starting 22 right now, any draft picks that contribute to the team will just be the cherry on top.
I can see him leaning towards adding to positions that have an aging player currently in the spot. Like he has done in the past. But I think at this point with our roster we can use upgrades every where, and our “old guys” aren’t really old. Except Grimes maybe. But he probably has a few years left if he wanted to keep going.
March 16th, 2017 at 8:49 pm
TruBucFan just proved he is…
He just dropped the mic…
Well done sir. Well done.
March 16th, 2017 at 8:58 pm
Some of the edge rushers I like unfortunately have big question marks. Tim Williams and his multiple failed drug tests will drop him to Day 2 and even then is he worth the risk? Tak McKinnley needs shoulder surgery and he is super raw from a technique standpoint. And Carl Lawson couldn’t stay healthy in college which is never a good sign.
One guy that I’ve seen mentioned in a few comments on here that I don’t like for the Bucs is Hassan Reddick. That would be one of the few guys at #19 I would be disappointed with, along with Malik McDowell.
March 16th, 2017 at 9:35 pm
Malik McDowell, Joe….kid could be as good as Garrett…
March 16th, 2017 at 9:49 pm
Wise words Pickle. Wise words.
March 16th, 2017 at 9:56 pm
That has crossed Joe’s mind. At least adding more players where they can play some 34.
March 16th, 2017 at 10:07 pm
Draft TJ Watt at #19 and you don’t have to worry about 1 DE spot. I personally think Spawn will be just fine. Those 2 paired together for the next 5 years sounds like a dream come true.
March 16th, 2017 at 10:09 pm
Smith said last season he doesn’t want to run just 1 specific offense. He wants the ability to matchup with each team however we can play them best. Versatility is the key and that’s the guys we have been going after.
March 16th, 2017 at 11:01 pm
SoCalBucFan nailed it with the first comment…love those three guys as Day 2 guys.
Tim Williams? At the combine, that dude looked like he has DeSean Jackson’s build…I can’t see him playing defensive end in a 4-3.
March 16th, 2017 at 11:15 pm
Take note that Licht has addressed the pressing need issues in the first week of free agency. That puts him in the catbird seat come draft day, where he can take the best player that’s still in the board.
March 16th, 2017 at 11:52 pm
I’d pass pass pass pass on taco. I’d rather take haason reddick. He reminds me of Leonardo floyd. He’s super fast chases the ball carrier no matter who or where the ball is. He’s undersized but he’s a damn good pass rusher.
March 17th, 2017 at 6:13 am
What’s all the nonsense about TB NEEDING a double-digit sacker? Yeah, the DL for the Bucs in the late 70s-early 80s (Selmon, Logan) and late 90s-early 00s (Rice, Sapp) was really fun to watch, but that entire era led to one Super Bowl.
How many consistent double digit sackers has NE had in the last decade? And how has that worked out for them? Sacks don’t translate to playoff wins, if they did, it would have been Arizona vs Denver in SB LI. As we all know, neither of last year’s conference sack champs even got a wild card slot.
INTs translate to much more effective defensive stats, and result in more wins, than sacks. We’ve had enough defense in TB since 1976. Let’s go get some more offense!
March 17th, 2017 at 7:49 am
great point,Jp4.We have not had much success drafting an edge rushing DE
in our history.Another point from an injury standpoint,much better chance of
DB being a more consistant contributor,since many DE’s get injured more often.
March 17th, 2017 at 11:15 am
Question is..Who is going to be there past pick 17 or so. The 4 good ones will probably be gone..or not? If one of’ems there, We should go DE with our 1st pick. Pass rush guys. It makes all the difference for our Bucs. We witnessed this up close the 2nd half of last season.
March 17th, 2017 at 4:43 pm
Mike Johnson: TB finished tied for 9th in sacks (with PIT & WAS), just 10 sacks below the leader (ARI). On the other hand, of the top 12 offenses in 2016, 7 of them qualified for the playoffs! SB LI featured ATL (2nd in total offense) vs NE (4th in offense).
The NFL is no longer a league where ‘defense wins championships’. Over the last 10 years, offense has become king. Bucs should draft TE, WR, maybe RB (if the right one is available) in the 1st round. Hopefully, Licht is more qualified than either of us to draft players. HE needs to know what this team needs most.
March 17th, 2017 at 5:08 pm
How do you think a play that ends in an interception starts? It usually is caused by pressure on the QB. Rarely does a QB with no pressure throw an interception. These guys are just too good to just make bad throws on their own. You have to force them into bad situations and make rushed, ill advised throws. While sacks are great for the stat line, it is really QB pressure that is the biggest factor for winning games. Consistently get a QB off his mark and playing faster than he is comfortable with is a huge key to succes for any defense. As bucs fans we see it plenty with Jameis. Give Jameis time and he can slice and dice, put pressure on him and he has to rush throws and usually ends up throwing it high. (See cowboys game last season)
Look at that saints game where we had like 6 sacks on brees and terrorized him all game, he had the worst game he’s ever played against the bucs, usually he is throwing for 80%, 350 yards and 3 or 4 TDs. But that day we got to brees and we were able to force him into bad situations. Give me a solid pass rush and the INTs numbers will come naturally. With no pass rush, a QB isn’t forced into bad situation and he is free to pick apart the defense. Games are won and lost in the trenches.
March 17th, 2017 at 5:16 pm
If you want to win a championship, you need both a great offense and a great defense. It is nonsense to think otherwise. Look at the saints, constantly the #1 pass offense in the league, yet lately they haven’t done jack with that all mighty offense. Because their defense is horrendous. You can’t play one side of the ball and ignore the other, both sides and special teams need to be on point to win a championship.
Patriots always have a good offense and a good defense. The panthers had a good defense and a good offense the year they went to the SB. The Seahawks had great defense and a good offense. The broncos great defense, good enough offense.
Look at the teams that lose the Super Bowl and lose playoff games. Packers, good offense, bad defense. Falcons, good offense, bad defense. Cowboys good offense, bad defense. See the trend? You need BOTH to win a championship.
March 18th, 2017 at 6:22 pm
Trubucfan22 – likes to write novels…doesn’t matter how many words you write, it won’t MAKE you right, or prove your case.
Sure, you need good offense AND defense. Bucs defense is good enough, the offense needs work.