Jameis & The Power Of NFC South
February 14th, 2017
Rising.
Interesting piece here concerning the Bucs and the NFC South.
Jonathan Jones of SI.com types that if NFL folks haven’t come to appreciate the NFC South, then they are living with their heads buried in the sand.
Specifically, the NFC South is a must-watch for fans who enjoy quarterback play.
Two of the four NFC South teams have competed in the Super Bowl the past two seasons. Obviously the Panthers and Falcons both lost, but their teams are well positioned to remain relevant in 2017 and beyond. Tampa Bay was still in the playoff hunt in Week 17 (although barely), and there’s little question that no division has better quarterbacks from top to bottom as the NFC South—the division boasts the reigning NFL MVP in Matt Ryan and the previous one in Cam Newton.
I wrote during the season that the NFC South is the poor man’s AFC West, but I believe it’ll be even better in 2017. Atlanta will want to avenge that horrendous collapse, the Panthers will bounce back from 6–10, Drew Brees and Sean Payton will want to make a run in what may be their final season together and if Jameis Winston can be more accurate, the Bucs could win the division for the first time in a decade.
Here is the thing: Does anyone think for a second if the Bucs weren’t trolling in dingy velvet-lined lounges in Vero Beach and in local medical transportation service offices for wide receivers, then America’s Quarterback, Pro Bowler Jameis Winston, would have had a completion percentage just a few points higher?
Could it be that future Hall of Famers like Freddie Martino (and his Band of Renown) and Bernard Reedy have trouble finding work in the NFL because they might have trouble holding onto a football, or getting separation or, you know, running correct, sharp routes?
Joe remembers last year asking Bucs offensive coordinator Todd Monken if timing between a receiver and a quarterback was a crutch. Monken emphatically stated no described how developing timing and a rhythm between a quarterback and a receiver is critical to a passing game.
Want Jameis’ completion percentage to improve? Get #WeaponsForWinston and watch.
February 14th, 2017 at 11:16 am
Long long time reader here at JBF. First comment ever. Jameis can’t get a pass every time he’s criticized. He DID miss passes to open receivers last year. Offensive woes cannot all be blamed on OL and WR corps. Great QBs have made lesser receivers look like HOFs before. So in this article I agree jameis has to work on some of his throwing skills.( it’s ok to criticize the messiah )
February 14th, 2017 at 11:23 am
I don’t have so much problem with his accuracy as his ball security. I suspect that will improve in year 3
February 14th, 2017 at 11:46 am
@Joe
I have no problem with Martino and Reedy “dropping pass and not getting separation” as they were about 7th, 8th, 9th and/or 10th on the depth chart!!
I do have a problem with AH11 and CB84 being the 2nd and 3rd passing option and not getting separation!!!!!
The Buc Realist Says:
September 23rd, 2016 at 2:34 pm
Bucs Nfl Draft 2017 WR, TE, Safety!!!!
February 14th, 2017 at 11:49 am
Oline cost us production on offense far more than the obvious lack of talent in the depth of the receiver position. Ignoring this observable fact only serves to run cover for the man responsible, free-pass Jason Licht. Fix the oline and you fix the offense. Fix the GM position and the rest will follow.
February 14th, 2017 at 11:51 am
Freedy Martino takes a lot of heat on this site for being a nobody, but damn he got open… it’s not his fault the ball was delivered 5 feet over his head. Same goes for sheppard.
February 14th, 2017 at 11:54 am
So far as his accuracy, I think he has been told to throw high because of his tall WRs. It paid off a lot with Mike Evans. Vincent being injured didn’t help though.
I agree we need WR depth. I do think we’ve already replaced Vincent Jackson, but we still need a speed guy and more quality depth. I’m a lot less concerned about RB this year…though I know there are some fans who want their favs in Tampa.
I disagree with J0E on the defense though. I DO NOT think it is good enough to win a championship. I think it needs at least 1-2 more pieces, and I think that is just as important, if not more so, than offense.
Why? Because we got a winning season because our defense covered for Jameis’ mistakes. He’s still going to make mistakes because he’s young. Therefore, we need to compensate for it.
I love Robert Ayers attitude, I really do…but his production isn’t good enough. That’s fine, because Noah Spence is there, but the other side is useless. And we need a DT next to McCoy who can stop the run and collapse the pocket.
If I had to name all the spots on the team that need addressing, I would say these:
WR #2, #5
RB #3 (this year)
Right Tackle
Center (if Hawley not resigned or not fully healthy)
DE
DT
S (if our guy is not resigned)
K #2 (Competition)
Probably the lines and WR are the most important spots.
February 14th, 2017 at 11:57 am
DallasBuc Says
“Oline cost us production on offense far more than the obvious lack of talent in the depth of the receiver position.”
I agree. And frankly, I don’t see how some people don’t get that.
February 14th, 2017 at 11:59 am
I’m not sure if people are ‘misremembering’ but on countless occasions Jameis would scan the field and nobody would be open. Then he would scramble and often times find someone. Wouldn’t it be nice if Mike is seeing bracketed coverage that our other receivers are open because they are in single coverage.
February 14th, 2017 at 11:59 am
I’m okay wit criticism as long as it’s not the only thing coming from you. Those of us that are high on our young QB know he’s not a finish product. Some poster’s critic’s seem to be on the side of negative without any mention of anything positive. I find that peculier at best because what we be with the previous alternative???
February 14th, 2017 at 12:02 pm
On the heels of what Dallas said, this mock draft has us going OL in the First. I don’t believe that will happen because Licht already invested 2 2nd rounders on the OL. More important is what how this guy views our OL
“The Tampa Bay Buccaneers aren’t pressed to upgrade offensive tackle, but the opportunity to add the top left blind-side blocker should be in consideration. The franchise can decide to go into next season with Donovan Smith and Demar Dotson as its starters, but Smith did not play well in 2016.
The second-year left tackle was called for the second-most penalties among offensive tackles and surrendered 13 quarterback hits last season, per Pro Football Focus. He also allowed 41 quarterback hurries. When the team is trying to build around Jameis Winston, the young signal-caller needs to remain upright for the offense to succeed.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:03 pm
The O line was asked to pass block far more than they were assembled to do from a schematic standpoint. This group is a run blocking o line. Asking them to do otherwise more often than not will spell danger no matter high great the weaponry or the quality of dept is. What part of that can’t you understand.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:06 pm
And all those penalties and QB hits and hurries can be reduced how??? Running the football more that’s how. But y’all don’t care about a healthy running game,ys figure we can just get by with any ole RB from the later rounds.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:12 pm
You can call it the 4 verticals all you want. Ima call it what it truly is a playaction offense. Therefore it more important to have a run blocking oline which we have more so than a pass pro o line.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:14 pm
OL, the backend and our WR are the weakest areas of the team, licht has screwed the #1 thing he needed to accomplish…PROTECT THE FRANCHISE, PERIOD…he has failed to do that…protect him and then sprinkle in some weapons for jameis…NOS BOS…i love the cook call but licht needs to keep jameis up…don’t ever forget that undrafted phenom David Irving and that hall of fame game he played against the bucs in the palace last year…licht your lucky jameis could walk after that game
February 14th, 2017 at 12:22 pm
I want y’all to go in your mind and look at the physical makeup of each of O linemen. These dudes are built to be firing forward at the snap of the ball. That’s why DM had so much success in 2015. Sweezy’s first words to the Bucs media “I live to run block”. That’s why they went an got him.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:24 pm
I’m talking bout folks crying and complaining about Fameis moaning and groanin about the O line. We ain’t suppose to be dropping back 30+ times a game man.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:28 pm
I disagree. I thought our Oline looked much better in pass protection than they did in run blocking.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:28 pm
Nosbos- how can you say this oline is built for run blocking? They had what two 100+ rushing games this year? That’s atrocious no matter who is in the backfield. Oline was blown up run play after run play, game after game. Let’s not rewrite history. There’s enough of that going on in the real world right now.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:29 pm
Here’s where I chuckle. Oline struggles, little running game, one sure fire nfl caliber target, (I believe that Jameis is making Humphries, Brate et al look better than they actually are) and yet every day on every offensive related article, people are so quick to post we see how Jameis is the one with shortcomings. Guys, I’m not saying he’s perfect but he’s so far down the list of concerns on offense its not even funny.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:31 pm
Continue to Build a Wall: move Marpet to center and Build from there, everyone should be put on notice that the Wall will be Built! But not in Mexico…dumb ass!!
February 14th, 2017 at 12:33 pm
How easily folks forget Stewart McClown.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:34 pm
Did you really just quote IR Sneezy? So funny…
February 14th, 2017 at 12:39 pm
Blake is right that pass pro was better than run blocking but still nothing to be proud of by any means. Winston was a magician back there avoiding the lousy blocking play after play.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:49 pm
The pass pro was better really??? Dot was a penalty every other drop back. And Cherilus don’t get started.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:52 pm
This group will thrive when they are doing what they were intended to do with someone in the backfield worth doing it for. You don’t think them dudes knew DM had issues??? You don’t think dudes realize CS be tipping. H3ll why Quizz averages what they were during running plays??? Maybe they knew he would hit the d@$! hole.
February 14th, 2017 at 12:59 pm
Everyone here knows that JW was drafted to be the franchise QB but the hypocrisy on this board is insane. In one breath you give JW a pass for making some of the biggest bone head moves (ex. just dropping the ball without getting hit) you will ever see on a football field and give him a pass because “oh but he’s so young.” In the next breath some of you are ready to cut our LT because he gets a penalty or misses a block. Someone else said JW makes Cam B and A Hump the receivers they are. I see it the other way around. Rarely if ever does JW put the ball where it needs to be. These guys and especially ME13 are making circus catches which means no YAC almost constantly. I’m not trying to bash our QB I just think some of you need to open your eyes and see Americas Pro Bowl QB for what he really is at this point.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:00 pm
tnew, How right you are. Certain people on this board only want to harp on Winston’s lack of so called accuracy as the main reason the bucs fell short of the playoffs. I say if they didn’t have Winston the bucs would have been fighting for the right to the number one pick in the draft. They need to stop holding Winston to the standard of a 10 year vet. Give him time and weapons and he will be one of the leagues best.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:02 pm
Play calling didn’t help.. just sayin’. Very Vanilla. No designed roll-outs, no swing passes to slow the pass rush, very few screen passes. This will improve as well this coming year. I believe Dirk didn’t trust ANYONE, including Jameis. BTW at least 4 of his INT’s were directly the RB or WR’s fault, but they go on JW3s stats. I agree with Big Hog and Dallas, Get a true LT (Ramczyk) and move D Smith to RT, he could be all world at RT. Again I think Cook and Mike Williams will be gone at 19.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:07 pm
NOs-Bos- I like Quizz but his big game came against San Fran. Everyones big game comes against San Fran. We need him and he does hit the hole hard, but our running game was atrocious.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:16 pm
JJ I 100% agree with your play calling comment. But I think D Smith needs to get one more year at the LT spot to see if he progresses to where he needs to be. This year will tell the tale for him.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:23 pm
See guys I am all for Jamies getting more accurate, but there is no way for any of you to know if the routes were run at the correct depth which will effect what the throw location looks like. If the route is run just two yards short the pass appears to be high when in reality if run properly would have been right about the face mask. Again not defending Jamies here, but as someone who has thrown a football for most of his life the route accuracy is just as important as the throw accuracy, even more so on the highest level in the world.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:29 pm
captjimbo I believe both Brate and Humph made one circus catch a piece this year. Please get your facts straight if your going to call someone out. And if those two were so dynamic then why were they both walking the streets, especially if they can make a QB look good, like you state. Come on man we have one drafted receiver that played last year any real snaps and you people are on our quarterback for accuracy!?!?!? Get the man some help and btw he didn’t seem to miss many throws to Evans, what maybe 10-12 all year, I wonder why??????
February 14th, 2017 at 1:32 pm
JJ i was talking about Sims. My bad bro.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:36 pm
Excuses….excuses….I’m still waiting….
February 14th, 2017 at 1:37 pm
I just wonder would they be happier wit Josh McCown.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:39 pm
OAR you can wait til ya neck bust I bet you wouldn’t have seem 9 and 7 wit McCown. And a lack of offensive weapons. Lets name them how many QBs around the league would’ve made our cast look good??? Wit a marginal run game at best. Maybe Rodgers.. Who else???
February 14th, 2017 at 1:48 pm
It’s not just the poor play of the WRs. It’s a combination of things that makes a good offense. Playcalling, Protection, QB performance, Running game, Blocking, Etc.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:53 pm
And continue telling me someone will be long gone. Like being 19 means anything to GM that gets busy on draft nights. Go right ahead, we’ll see what pops comes draft night. Funny thing is so many claim its a bad idea to go RB in the first,I guess GMs around the league feel differently huh. They’ll jump when so many here say that’s not the way to go. That’s funny to me. My open offer will apply to you all all summer long. Just holla at me.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:55 pm
I recall far more running plays stuffed behind the line than I do pass play plays where Jameis had 0 time to throw. Sure, Jameis got pressured and hit. But that tends to happen on 5-7 step drops where the young Qb maybe holds onto the ball too long.
Agree with u bout cherilus but he’s an old man who saw limited play (thank the lord).
February 14th, 2017 at 1:57 pm
Welcome to Tampa Mr. Dalvin. Y’all can eat ya hearts out draft night. With all this bickering going on seems like to me a star runner could solve a whole lot of these so called problems. Small crease and 70 yards later ain’t nothing but a thang.
February 14th, 2017 at 1:58 pm
Yea Blake makes me wonder how Quizz kept getting up thru there..
February 14th, 2017 at 2:01 pm
And again if a young QN is getting hit a little to much would it not make sense to get more explosive in the Backfield. A big time TE would be nice no doubt but do TEs or number 2 WRs really take pressure off a QB??? I know what does..
February 14th, 2017 at 2:05 pm
When the TE can pass block like a left tackle you bet he takes pressure off. You know what else helps young Qb’s not get hit? Receivers getting open.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:06 pm
I appreciate every post on this here thread today. All its done for me was highlight how much more of a greater need to this team DC truly is.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:07 pm
But Blake SLuke Stocker on this roster and is known for pass pro. Why are we complaining about our QB getting hit???
February 14th, 2017 at 2:11 pm
Ron Rivera said we may need to look at acquiring a RB to take some of those hits off Cam. I think we should be thinking the same. Me personally some guy in the later rounds won’t cut it. I would rather a weapon that would strike fear. But that’s just me bro.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:15 pm
You dont have to be a 1st round pick to be talented. Why does where a guy is drafted matter?
February 14th, 2017 at 2:15 pm
@captjimbo-You are not allowed to criticize Jameis here. If the throw is high or behind the receiver it’s their fault. If a pass is intercepted the receiver ran the wrong route or is too slow. If Jameis fumbles it’s the play callers fault for not calling a more creative play. If the Bucs lose because of Jameis turnovers the defense should’ve caused a turnover themselves to stop the other team.
If you say Winston needs to work on his accuracy and turnovers you aren’t a real fan no matter how much you spend on season tickets. Saying oh it’s ok to call a young inconsistent qb a “franchise qb” is like saying the chef who undercooked your meal and gave you food poisoning should run his own Kitchen.
Some of the FSU fans need to take the blinders off and stop making themselves look foolish
February 14th, 2017 at 2:16 pm
Number 1 Luke stocker is/ was known for his skills as a run blocker.
Thats why Coach K used him predominantly as a Full back. And Luke stocker is notoriously injury prone.
Number 2 Jameis gets hit because for the most part none of his receivers can get open. And all the ones that can do it slowly.
Thes fastest guy we had last year that was actually productive was Hump. And lil homie ran like a 4.51
February 14th, 2017 at 2:17 pm
They say my O line can’t blink worth s@$!,I say maybe we need a star to run the football. They say Fameis miss to many throws,I say maybe we need star to run the football. They Fameis takes holds on to the football too long thusly taking unneeded hits,I say maybe we need a star to run the football.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:17 pm
Nos- I cannot stand Sims. Sorry, I think he is injured to often for not playing much, He cannot or will not run straight forward. He doesn’t see the hole and then dances through it. His pass catching is okay but he cost Jameis 2 ints this year, one was a game changer that cost us a game. He cannot return kicks which was attempted early in his career. IMO, he should be off the team, a FA back from a small school can do what he does and will want it more. Just my Opinion.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:18 pm
Hey Tony anyone who has been on this site for anytime knows you are MM lover so anything you say is just you trying to prove you were right, which by the way you are not.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:19 pm
Pop I’m saying get the baddest RB you can get. Be it in the 1st the 2nd the 3rd I could careless. As long as his name is Dalvin Cook.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:20 pm
J J that’s why I can’t see how people are willing to go into 2017 with him as a feature.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:22 pm
Tony I just gave my theory on how all that could be reduced. See my 2:17 post.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:23 pm
Who on here ever said they want Sims as a feature back? LOL. Passing on a RB round 1 doesnt mean keep what we have.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:24 pm
Blake that is why I hold the RB spot at a higher regard than most round here. Exactly what you just said bro.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:26 pm
I just feel like if theirs a bonafide threat in the backfield the playaction would help even slow guys get open. All they need is one step most of the time.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:27 pm
Hey Tony I’ll just wait for you to point out all the passers who threw for 4,000 + yards in their first two years with one drafted WR, and spent one of those years behind two rookie lineman and the other year with a street free agent as his number 1 running back. When you find that guy get back to us and tell us all about him. News flash no one is perfect, the point of this article is that Jameis and this entire offense would be better if their was more talent on it. But of course you are your boy are just going to say wow look at all those high throws. Well what about the plays where there was no blocking and he got out of it to make a big play ie Chicago. OR how about when no one is open and he squeezes a ball into a tight window on 3rd down to extend a drive like against Seattle. See all you want to do it look for things that are not perfect instead of seeing what’s right in front of you which is a player that can get better but is doing historical things with little talent around him. Oh yeah and turnovers are not all the QB’s fault like the TWO that bounced off of Charles Sims hands this past year or when Jamies gets his arm hit as he is throwing but again you just say he committed x amount of turnovers when they are not all created equal. You offer zero credibility when you say stuff like that time and time again.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:32 pm
I’m a huge FSU fan and I want JW as our QB for many years to come (assuming he progresses) but anyone who doesn’t admit to JWs flaws needs to take the rose colored glasses off.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:33 pm
If those comparisons sound extreme so do well we should be happy he’s not McCown or Glennon. Yes we should but we should also expect more from a #1 overall pick rather than have FSU fans give us a list of excuses just because they are thankful he made FSU relevant again
February 14th, 2017 at 2:45 pm
Well said ndog
February 14th, 2017 at 2:45 pm
I went back to see how often Koetter’s offenses passed the ball per game to see if “We ain’t suppose to be dropping back 30+ times a game man.” is true.
07 Jags: 29.3 attempts per game
08 Jags: 33.5 attempts per game
09 Jags: 32.4 attempts per game
10 Jags: 29.3 attempts per game
11 Jags: 29.3 attempts per game
12 Falcons: 38.4 attempts per game
13 Falcons: 41.2 attempts per game
14 Falcons: 39.5 attempts per game
15 Bucs: 33.4 attempts per game
16 Bucs: 35.4 attempts per game
If you care it is an average of 34.2 attempts per game in his NFL coaching career. Its absolutely designed for 30+ drop backs.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:46 pm
Ndog- How wrong you are go back and look at the pre draft comments I was all for drafting Winston. Just because you are critical of a player doesn’t mean you are secretly pinning for a different player. You must’ve never been in the military or in a setting where you are pushed to get better as you are so accepting of the same mistakes over n over
February 14th, 2017 at 2:50 pm
So after two years in the league he throws for two 4,000 yard seasons and you are simply saying he is better than McCown or Glennon. Again he did this with a WR that had the highest drop rate in the league one year and with Russell Sheppard as his #2 WR the next year and that he is better than McCown and Glennon only? Dude apparently you don’t see the QB play around the league as there are about 9 QB’s in the league that I would take over JW (Brady, Carr, Big Ben, Russell Wilson, Eli, Brees, Ryan, Stafford, Aaron Rodgers). And news flash 4 of those are all time greats. So you are telling me after two years, and that list above are the only QB’s currently better in the league, all you can do it say negative stuff EVERYDAY!!!! To me either you are not a fan OR your love for your boy MM is blinding you.
February 14th, 2017 at 2:50 pm
I think LakelandBuc summed it up well up top. He/she said:
“It’s not just the poor play of the WRs. It’s a combination of things that makes a good offense. Playcalling, Protection, QB performance, Running game, Blocking, Etc.”
EVERYONE needs improvement, top to bottom!
February 14th, 2017 at 2:51 pm
This is just silliness. What were your expectations of Jameis? He took a 2-14 team and made them a 6-10 team with a crap defense. Now a 9-7 with no RB and one WR and one TE and a crap defense for 10 out of the 16 games. So what were YOUR expectations? Ridiculous!
February 14th, 2017 at 2:56 pm
Me personally, I think the running game is the best medicine to cure this offense. Add a couple of legit weapons and you have one helluva an offense.
February 14th, 2017 at 3:00 pm
I wouldnt take Eli over Winston. Especially if Eli plays like he did last season. That was tough to watch lol
February 14th, 2017 at 3:09 pm
I don’t need others to push me, I push myself sir.
February 14th, 2017 at 3:11 pm
@Joey- I think a good stat to look at alongside of what you posted up top would be win/loss record. I don’t know how that shakes out but I wouldn’t want to see Jameis throwing 40 times a game.
February 14th, 2017 at 3:13 pm
Tampa Tony just admit you can’t say anything positive about Winston and go to the titans board to sing the praises of MM. Being picked #1 doesn’t mean that you come out of the chute an all pro QB. It means you are a rare talent that takes time and weapons to reach the status of elite. Just ask John Elway,Drew Breeze, Eli Manning, Terry Bradshaw, Brett Favre, Steve Young, to name a few. They all struggled when they started but after a few years they became among the best QBs in the league. So i think all things considered Winston has done a great job with what he has to work with skill position wise than what your giving him credit for his first two years. Open your eyes you might be surprised how good he really is.
February 14th, 2017 at 3:14 pm
@Bucsfanman
I will post win/loss record, their rushing rank that season and who it was when I get home from work in about a half hour lol.
February 14th, 2017 at 3:18 pm
JJ if I’m not mistaken I saw 52 other guys run out on the field with JW. The only time we played well this year was when the D stepped up. You talk like JW is the only reason the Bucs have improved. He has absolutely carried his share but even Brady doesn’t win in the NFL without 52 teammates not to mention a coaching staff.
February 14th, 2017 at 3:19 pm
Expectations, how about wanting the qb to get better each week? What happened to this excellent football IQ all the scouts raved about during the draft process? It’s not showing up on the field with the constant mistakes and turnovers. Yes, you can forgive a turnover from a Hail Mary at the end of a half or if a ball bounces off a receivers hands. Unless the throw wasn’t even supposed to be made. See the Charles Sims INT in the Rams game, why did he even throw that?
If your not progressing your regressing and Jameis has a lot to prove going into year 3. Especially where other QB’s have made huge jumps from year 2 to 3. Time for him to stop apologizing for turnovers and bad decisions and play better like a real franchise qb
February 14th, 2017 at 3:26 pm
@chipbuc- ya might want to go back to th comments prior to th draft I’ve been on board with Winston since they finished 2-14. Let’s stop making excuses for a #1 overall pick and start expecting improved play and not the same dumb mistakes week after week.
I love the production we’ve gotten from Jameis with not a lot of weapons and I’m a fan of his. But there comes a time when you need to see strides made and progress. Both seasons the Bucs have teased us with the playoffs and I feel if Jameis had that clutch gene or was a bit more careful with the ball they’d have made the playoffs.
February 14th, 2017 at 3:52 pm
@ captnjimbo
Your above post about Brate and Hump making Winston was LITERALLY the stupidest comment of 2017! Pass that $hit
February 14th, 2017 at 4:00 pm
And how deep has that gotten him the playoffs Pop??? I mean I’m reading is bickering about my QB.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:01 pm
Did he draft Mark Brunell??? Or was Brunell already a seasoned vet when he got there??? Same for Matt Ryan. I’m curious.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:06 pm
Reduce the attempts add a star runner and watch the difference it makes on not only the offense the entire team. I watched Big Ben 6 TDs I think in consecutive weeks in 2015 but he couldn’t have done that in year two of his career.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:16 pm
Ok to continue off 1 of my previous posts about Koetter’s previous offenses. And for reference when I say the Run game was “led by”, they have to have 100+ carries that year.
2007 Jags: 11-5 record, 17th in Pass yard/game (208), 2nd in Rush yards/game (149.4) led by Fred Taylor and Maurice Jones-Drew (MJD)
2008 Jags: 5-11 record, 15th in Pass yards/game (208), 18th in Rush yards/game (110.9) led by MJD and Fred Taylor
2009 Jags: 7-9 record, 19th in Pass yards/game (210), 10th in Rush yards/game (126.8) led by MJD
2010 Jags: 8-8 record, 27th in Pass yards/game (192), 3rd in Rush yards/game (149.7) led by MJD
2011 Jags: 5-11 record, 32nd in Pass yards/game (136), 12th in Rush yards/game (123.1) led by MJD
2012 Falcons: 13-3 record, 6th in Pass yards/game (282), 29th in Rush yards/game (87.3) led by Michael Turner
2013 Falcons: 4-12 record, 7th in Pass yards/game (265), 32nd in Rush yards/game (77.9) led by Steven Jackson
2014 Falcons: 6-10 record, 5th in Pass yards/game (285), 24th in Rush yards/game (93.6) led by Steven Jackson
2015 Bucs: 6-10 record, 17th in Pass yards/game (241), 5th in Rush yards/game (135.1) led by Doug Martin and Charles Sims
2016 Bucs: 9-7 record, 16th in Pass yards/game (245), 24th in Rush yards/game (101.0) led by Doug Martin (kinda) and Jaquizz Rodgers
February 14th, 2017 at 4:18 pm
So when he lost the balance he had with Jimme Smith and Keenan McCardel their was a steady decline.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:20 pm
And in 2015 how many TDs did DM leave off the board getting walked down from behind..
February 14th, 2017 at 4:21 pm
@Nosbos
He made the playoffs twice as a Coordinator. 2007 Jags made it to the divisional round and lost to the then undefeated Pats. 2012 Falcons made it to the NFC championship and lost to the 49ers.
So he had a top 10 rush offense in 4 seasons and made the playoffs 1 time. He had a top 10 pass offense 3 times and only made it once.
Idk what wins and losses and playoff appearances has to do with the scheme the coordinator ran because their are other factors (defense) that factors into those things. But I’m happy to oblige.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:21 pm
Brunell was a Vet, Ryan was a rookie. A rookie that took a 4 and 12 team to 11 and 5 and the playoffs.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:21 pm
You can thank Jude adjei-barimah for us not making the playoffs. If not for that defensive holding penalty against the raiders on 4-10 we win that game. And we make the playoffs. Yes Jameis can improve. But unlike you I have no doubt that he will. I’d also add that Jameis routinely makes plays that not many others can. He turns would be sacks into big gains for us all the time. And Firmly believe that with more weapons and a competent running game, he’s gonna bring the Lombardi back to the bay.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:31 pm
I have no doubt about that Blake. I’m curious as to why many here talk as if he’s already peaked as a Professional. Congrats Matty Ice. I’m sure he had more to work with in that rookie season than Fameis had this season.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:33 pm
Trying to figure your angle Pop. So which do you feel is more important in reference to success in the playoffs??? A potent passing,a solid rushing attack or a combo of the two.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:36 pm
And when did you read me saying I don’t think he’ll improve???? I think the sky is the limit for that young man. I also believe a potent running game would work wonders for his young career. Same way it did for Ben,Russell and asortment of others.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:39 pm
I have a question Pop. Currently in moderation.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:42 pm
I will answer it when it shows up. And I don’t think anybody is arguing that a running game will not help Winston out. The main debate is where do you find the RB.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:43 pm
ME GOAT, I was just trying to make a point. That point is JW is very inconsistent and very inaccurate at this point. And if you want to talk about dumb stuff lets talk about your moniker ME GOAT. As much as I love having Evans on this team he will never, ever in a million years be able to hang with Jerry Rice or Lynn Swan or Calvin Johnson or I could go on for a long list. He does kind of remind me of Hines Ward and if he can reach that plateau we should be happy.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:44 pm
And to think many mocks have us taking a DE with the first overall. SMdH..
February 14th, 2017 at 4:46 pm
Lol i was talking to tony there Nos. Forgot to.@ him
February 14th, 2017 at 4:48 pm
OMG that has to be 2nd dumbest comment from same individual in 2017. ME is not a barn burner but he can stretch a defense in ways we never saw Hines Ward do. Recheck MEs rookies highlight reel homes. And are you Nostradomus reincarnated. How can you oredict his career after three seasons???
February 14th, 2017 at 4:49 pm
☺okay bro.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:52 pm
You might wanna check his early numbers dude. They’re better than a number ofc those dude you listed after three seasons.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:55 pm
But Blake didn’t you hear the reason we did not go 16-0 is because Jameis is horrible and just turns the ball over all the time. This is all according to Tennessee Tony of course.
February 14th, 2017 at 4:59 pm
I’m talking bout you ain’t never seen Hines Ward go up an Moss that ball like ME do every season. Not to take away from Hines he was a good football player but ME ceiling waaayy higher.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:02 pm
The resin Tony won’t endores Mariota on this site is because the kid is injuriy prone. Bad news for Mariota is this injuries keep happening to his lower extremities. Soon his best attribute an ability to run might be null and void. Still not sold on him being able to read defenses.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:03 pm
Winston had over 4000 yards. Find another excuse. This one is old. What you want 5,6, 7000? And he will never take you to the SB anyway. Your Odds this year are 33 to 1.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:08 pm
@captndild0
U should prolly check his first 3 years in yards and tds and rank them against the greats. He checks out pretty well.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:09 pm
@Nosbos
Ideally a combo of the two, but if you look at all the teams that are having success, a lot of it is because of strong QB play. The run game has been reduced to a more complimentary role in offenses than the focal point of offenses. The only team off the top of my head that is primarily a run offense is Minnesota and their offense isnt good at all lol.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:13 pm
I think Mariota is a good QB with a high ceiling. Obviously the injuries are a concern, but when he is healthy he is great for that offense. Personally I dont think Mariota would’ve fit Koetter’s offense. There is a lot to like about Mariota’s game tho.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:26 pm
Ndog man you have one of the worst reading comprehension deficiencies I’ve ever seen. Get some help
February 14th, 2017 at 5:30 pm
I can’t argue that Pop but when your QB is young in his career that running game is a must. Without it Teddy B wouldn’t have made lady season. And was a kick away from advancing. See me personally I’m in no rush for Fameis to look like Brady,Brees,Ryan or Rodgers. He’ll get on that level in due time.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:32 pm
-I meant made the playoffs last season. D@$! swype function
February 14th, 2017 at 5:37 pm
@Nole- I won’t endorse a non Buc qb as I’m only a fan of the Bucs. The little I’ve seen of Mariota he’s looked good, but he’s a qb that fits a specific scheme and can’t stay healthy.
The jury is out on both he and Jameis in my view. Jameis has excellent pocket presence and leadership but is streaky with his accuracy and turns it over too much. Mariota from what I’ve seen is very accurate, uses his mobility to throw open receivers but like stated before can’t stay healthy and doesn’t seem to elevate those around him to be better. Year 3 will be very telling for both of these QB’s I’d love to see Jameis take a Andrew Luck/Carr year 3 jump but it’s gonna take a lot of work from him
February 14th, 2017 at 5:42 pm
I kinda feel like people are jumping the gun a little bit. Yes he was a 1st overall pick and yes we say franchise QB. And in aware that Ben and Russell won big early but they had the pieces to do so. Top rank defenses and stout run games. When finish the portrait we’ll taste that success. I believe if the cards are played right this off season we’ll be there. Everyone has they’re particular beliefs as to what those cards look like. However they may look come next season I test assured that the product will be dangerous for opposing teams in 2017.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:45 pm
Tony I won’t sit here and lie and say Fameis doesn’t throw an occasional pass that makes me say what the h3ll was that. I just see plays that me say OMG as well. I see enough of the latter to have complete confidence in my going forward.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:57 pm
@Nosbos
I agree that an effective running game will not only be great for Jameis’ growth, but also for the team as a whole. Once FA starts and we get closer to the draft it will become more clear what our biggest need actually is then we can start making accurate predictions of what positions to fill and when to fill them.
When I talk about the draft and mention players, I’m just giving alternative options. So when I mention other RBs I’m not saying that he is better than Cook or that I would rather have him over Cook. I’m pretty much saying if we don’t end up with Cook this is a guy I think can have success for us.
I’ve been starting to pay more attention to guys that are in that round 3-5 range for all positions just because everybody focuses on the top players. That way I personally can feel like (and this is an example) “Ok Curtis Samuel just went before us, hopefully we can get Player X instead”. I just try to keep myself informed on as many guys as possible and then I can come on sites like this and throw out a name or 2 for people to look up and see for themselves.
February 14th, 2017 at 5:57 pm
Joeypoppems, some excellent points about Koetter’s offenses with the Jags, Falcons & Bucs. Despite having several years of either top-10 passing game or Top-10 running games Dirk only made the playoffs twice in 10 yrs. Not always, but for the most part SB winners have been fairly balanced offensively & defensively. Like you said at 4:21PM, “there are other factors (defense) that factor into those things.”
February 14th, 2017 at 6:01 pm
@Defense Rules
Exactly, that is why I would still like to see some high draft picks (round 1 or 2) used on defense. Get another young, talented player to add to our young, talented nucleus. I still believe in the “Defense wins Championships” saying so I would like to see ours keep being built through the draft.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:03 pm
nosbos, Actually the dumbest comment ever on this site may be DC will be a Buc. He won’t be there when we pick.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:04 pm
and thanks for correcting my typo in your quote. Its really bothering me when I see it lol
February 14th, 2017 at 6:20 pm
Or he could throw less interceptions….That would improve more then just passing accuracy. There’s a saying, they are what they are and Jameis was terribly inaccurate in college and has been the same in the pros. His strength is reading coverages, knowing where to go with the play, and busted protection where he’s on the move. He’s a poor mans Rothlisberger. Weapons will improve any offense but Tom Brady is out there making undrafted lacrosse players look like seasoned veterans.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:27 pm
We’ll soon see now won’t we. I mean you being the Nostradomus of JBF why don’t you go ahead and relay to us the whole draft.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:30 pm
You sound very stupid saying Fameis was terribly inaccurate in college. If that was case why weren’t the talking heads making a big deal about it. I recall the int thing but never inaccracy.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:36 pm
Pop feel what you saying about alternatives. And trust me I won’t jump out any windows if we don’t draft Dalvin. I’ll become the biggest fan of whoever we do draft. Its just my personal opinion that having a player that dynamic in backfield makes selling the playaction all the easier. Not to say he wouldn’t work with other RBs I just have this notion in my head of D qtrs literally having to gamelan to stop him thusly opening up other areas of the offense. But again if that doesn’t happen I’ll be rooting forever like crazy on Sundays like I usually do. Be giving myself headache s@$!.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:38 pm
Joeypoppems, this year more than any that I can remember I’m really torn on how Bucs can best use our draft picks. Just about everyone sees what our needs are on offense (WR, RB, TE, OLine), but there doesn’t seem to be much consensus about our defensive needs. I’m hoping that FA clears all that up though. Out of our 7 picks, defense will probably only get 3 of those (maybe only 2).
Bucs desperately need a DT who can plug the middle (especially on running downs) … getting someone like Dontari Poe in FA (he’s still young) would make my day. Also need another DE who can (1) pressure the QB, and (2) play the run … Calais Campbell would be great for a bridge, but would prefer to use a high draft pick on Taco Charlton or Malik McDowell or Derek Barnett depending on who’s there (in Rnd 2).
Obviously we need to pick up at least 1 safety (preferably 2 … 1 in FA & 1 in the draft). Lots of good safety talent in the draft (not-so-much in FA it looks like). Personally think we can find one in the draft in rnds 3-5 who’d work out fine for us, but probably not to start in 2017. Wouldn’t hurt one bit to draft a LB also since Darryl Smith will probably retire either this year or next. Hmmm, could say the same about a CB I suppose. Obviously we need more draft picks.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:46 pm
Captnjimbo all upset that he looked stupid. Go check those ME13 vs Jerry rice first 3 years of their career. Tell me those aren’t comparable. I’ll do it for u. JR= 3575 ME=3578 TO=2553 RM=4163. More yards than the 2 Of the 3 best all time. He has less tds than Rice or Moss in that span. Completely comparable, so don’t u ever $hit on ME13 by saying he is at best a slot receiver. Lol two UDFA made a #1 overall pick. That statement lost u any credibility you thought u carried.
February 14th, 2017 at 6:59 pm
I’ll take J rice ALL DAY LONG!
February 14th, 2017 at 7:10 pm
@Defense Rules
Completely agree with you. I have no idea as of now how the draft can shake out. I tried to take a shot at predicting all 7 rounds and FA yesterday. I had 3 defensive players in the draft like you said. I think I said sign Campbell, Garcon/Britt, Steven Hauschka, Quintin Demps, and a few of our own FAs as well in Gholston, McDougald, Quizz, Akeem Spence, and Shep. Then in the draft I went:
1) Derek Barnett, DE
2) Alvin Kamara, RB
3) Fabian Moreau, CB
4) Carlos Henderson, WR
5) Eddie Vanderdoes, DT
6) Michael Roberts, TE
7) Jerry Ugokwe, OT
I later conceded that a Safety in the 3rd over a CB is fine. I chose CB for when Grimes is gone probably after this season, but I guess Ryan Smith can earn a shot at that job potentially.
February 14th, 2017 at 7:11 pm
Wow jimbo what a statement… Lemme guess you’ll take Barry Sanders over Quizz, and Joe Montana over Jameis.
Would I be correct in assuming you would take Ray Lewis over Kwon too?
February 14th, 2017 at 7:43 pm
I must say. Football is gone and boredom has set in. However I am rarely bored when I come here to read comments 🙂
February 14th, 2017 at 7:45 pm
Newsflash, Winston will never be the most accurate QB in the league, and he doesn’t have to be. I find it funny that a lot of you guys on here do nothing but complain about Winston, when we have seen trash at the QB spot for most of the Bucs existence. I, for one, WILL be disappointed with bad throws, but I know I’ve seen MUCH worse throws by our QBs for my WHOLE LIFE, and I will NOT call for Winstons head every time he throws a pick. He will improve, and even if he doesn’t, he still good enough to get us into the playoffs, where even INT Eli won 2 rings.
February 14th, 2017 at 7:50 pm
Dirk Koetter wasn’t the Falcons OC when Matt Ryan was a rookie. Mike Mularkley was the Falcons OC for Matt Ryan first 4 seasons in the NFL. And they never was worst than 9-7. When Dirk Koetter took over in 2012, they went 13-3 while still using Mularkley offense. Then in 2013-2014 they went 4-12 and 6-10 after Koetter installed his “Vertical Offense”.
February 14th, 2017 at 7:52 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_325PYlkPGo
I think we can all agree that as long as Winston doesnt do this then we will be Ok lmao
February 14th, 2017 at 7:55 pm
Joeypoppems, you found a couple of guys I hadn’t even considered. DT Eddie Vanderdoes is especially intriguing IF he’s truly bounced back from his ACL tear ( http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/eddie-vanderdoes?id=2557982 ). Hopefully Bucs get to see him in action some before the draft. I like both Barnett & Kamara (even though he didn’t have many yds at TN). Still want a safety in rnds 3-5 though.
February 14th, 2017 at 7:59 pm
https://www.joebucsfan.com/2015/08/calling-george-warhop/
February 14th, 2017 at 8:05 pm
Captnjimbo
Also Lynn swan NEVER cracked 1000 yards. Only 5000 CAREER receiving yards. Lol. I don’t care if he played in a different era (cuz I already know that would be your first rebuttal) if u care about that you shouldn’t have stupidly compared them. Calvin Johnson thru first 3 years has almost 600 yards less, and 6 less tds. Hines ward first 3 years =1556 and 16 less Tds. I just DESTROYED your entire argument.
February 14th, 2017 at 8:09 pm
LakeLandBuc, 2013-2014 results not very encouraging. But then, he did lose Turner & plugged in Steve Jackson (worn out by that point in his career). Turner was a beast in 2010 & 2011 under Mularkey (average 1,350 yds/season), but not-so-much in 2012 under Koetter (800 yds). They played ‘RB-by-committee in 2013 & 2014 with Jackson & Rodgers (plus Freeman in 2014) and rushing offense plummeted. Looking at what Maurice Jones-Drew did in Jax under Koetter, looks like Coach does a lot better when he has a true bell cow running the ball than when he has to rely on RB-by-committee.
February 14th, 2017 at 8:27 pm
@Defense Rules
Vanderdoes participated in the Senior Bowl practices so they saw him live and in person. And I also like Carlos Henderson a lot. Similar to Corey Coleman last year. Although I think he raises his stock to a round 3 pick after his 40 time (projected to be sub 4.40).
And about Kamara, his lack of production is the intriguing thing. He had a really small workload at Tennessee. He was part of a committee like other RBs in this draft, but it was almost like Tennessee kept him on a pitch count. He only has 210 carries in his 2 year career (6.2 yards/carry). Dalvin Cook had 288 carries this past season alone. To me that can be looked at 2 different ways.
Either 1) It can be questioned if he can handle a full workload at the NFL level since he didn’t in college. Or 2) He didnt have many carries in college so there is less wear and tear on his body and more “tread on the tires”.
I think he is really talented as a runner and a receiver so I might be biased or at least hoping it is #2 lol
February 14th, 2017 at 8:29 pm
I do need help Tony, I need help trying to figure out what your watching to think that our QB is so terrible that all you do is rip him at every turn like everyone else on the team is perfect. News flash we all see your comments and you can sit quietly through an entire game and boom Jameis makes a mistake and guess who is the first to comment. That’s right good old Tampa Tony to tell us we will suck till Jameis is the perfect player. Bro we all see it each week so you can say you like him and blah blah blah but all we have to do is use our memory and it is clear you have a dislike for him regard less what you say.
February 14th, 2017 at 9:13 pm
This Gators BBall team is Sneaky Guuud
February 14th, 2017 at 9:23 pm
ndog, he’s helpless. I gave up on him. Any body that’s watched ANY football can see what kind of QB Jameis is going to be. Didn’t they say Peyton had a high football IQ? He couldn’t have. He threw 43 int’s his first two seasons. How dumb were those experts? He never should’ve seen his 3rd season. Hell, Elway, Brees, Montana, etc all must’ve sucked as well. But at least Jameis had two better initial seasons than those bums. Maybe Tony’s right. He’s got no future. The writing’s on the wall. LOL
February 14th, 2017 at 9:26 pm
I just been patiently awaiting you to bust back GOAT. That’s what I’m talking bout my G.
February 14th, 2017 at 9:28 pm
Saw Jameis damned near pitch a perfect game at Pittsburgh. Anything but inaccurate that night. His very first college game, too.
February 14th, 2017 at 9:34 pm
GOAT its currently in moderation when you see it tho. SALUTE. Dallas my bad bro I didn’t mean to disregard your comment my girl got running round all over town. My thing is if they were bad in 2015 I would feel what you’re saying about the O line. A falloff like that on line season makes me scratch my head for more than one reason. To be honest I kinda feel ot was purposeful. That won’t go over well here but hey its my sentiment man.
February 14th, 2017 at 9:39 pm
@nosbos
lol I gotta handle business
February 14th, 2017 at 9:43 pm
Personally I wish we could find ourselves one of These again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGgjpeTUrs
February 14th, 2017 at 9:46 pm
I wish YAC was an official stat when Big Mike played.!!!!!
February 14th, 2017 at 9:47 pm
An
The FBI/he is a thing of the past. They don’t make em like that no more.
February 14th, 2017 at 9:48 pm
Stupid auto correct ! Lol
Sb
The FBI/hb is a thing of the past. They don’t make em like that no more
February 14th, 2017 at 9:51 pm
Oh I know ME. I know. But one can be nostalgic.
February 14th, 2017 at 9:52 pm
If we could ever generate a stat of Yards After Second Contact then Alstott would prolly lead the NFL Ever!
February 14th, 2017 at 9:57 pm
Sadly he won’t make the HOF. It is said that most voters see him as a rb not a fb. And he doesn’t have rb hof #s. it’s is truly a shame
February 14th, 2017 at 10:04 pm
Question keeps running through my mind: Which weapon … WR, RB or TE … would have the most pronounced impact on the Bucs offensive output in 2017? A stud RB could touch the ball at least 300 times in a season (run & pass) plus see a bunch of other snaps for pass protection, decoy, etc. A top #2 WR would probably be targeted 75-80 or so times but would have to be accounted for every time he stepped on the field, potentially impacting both the run game & the passing game for other players. Pretty much the same thing with an excellent TE who may get targeted almost as many times (say 75-80), but could get lots more snaps if he’s an excellent blocker and thus impact the run game and short passing game. Tending to lean towards the RB though in terms of offensive impact right now, if in fact he’s a true bell-cow.
February 14th, 2017 at 10:23 pm
IMO Defense, our biggest need is WR2. Jameis has proved that he can win with ‘depth’ and no stars beyond ME. A legit 2 keeps Hump and Brate on the field at the same time without the Defense’s ability to double ME.
Our OL was better at pass protection than run last yr. Way too many run plays that were losses due to Interior pass rush. If we had put Dallas’ OL in front of Jameis, Doug, and Sims last yr I assure you the numbers would be drastically different.
I am ALL about me some Marpet and I believe that Smith has had his problems but what OL doesn’t as a rook and soph trying to protect the Franchise. I think though if we somehow land another Anchor on the OL our run game and passing attack will grow. I am however a Dinosaur that believes that the Best Teams have great Lines.
February 15th, 2017 at 5:16 am
SB … “I am however a Dinosaur that believes that the Best Teams have great Lines.” Sounds like we’re both dinosaurs SB. The battles are won in the trenches.
February 15th, 2017 at 6:06 am
WR depth has zero to do with off target passes
February 15th, 2017 at 1:26 pm
Goat you totally miss the point. Honestly I don’t really care about stats what I care about are rings. And yes I know CJ doesn’t have one. Don’t take it the wrong way I’m ecstatic that we have JW and ME. Mike has gone above and beyond and I’m hoping Jameis can be the guy we all hope he can. JW has done well his first couple of years but he has to clean up his decision making and protect the ball better if he’s going to lead us to the promised land. Jpop, the video you posted is exactly what I’m talking about. That and we also have to score in the red zone.
I guess maybe I just look at things in a different light than some do. When you’ve been rooting for a team as long as I’ve been rooting for the Bucs I’m hesitant to proclaim ME GOAT and that JW our savior. No one wants a consistent winner in Tampa more than I do as I’ve stood by the Bucs through thick and thin (more thin than thick) since the early 80s. But at this point what I see is a team moving in the right direction that hasn’t won anything but a few games. You guys can have the stats. Until we start winning division/conference and SB titles I won’t be satisfied with with gaudy stats from anyone on our team. I’ll be cheering on the Bucs as hard as anyone this year but I won’t watch the games with blinders on. If JW or anyone else is choking I’ll call them out.
nosbos, every site has a guy like you. Keep it up, it’s very cute.
SB, I agree with your last post. It sounds like you played some ball a some point.
February 15th, 2017 at 3:09 pm
Don’t have time to pull up the actual stats, but I’m pretty darn sure no division in the NFC has been more represented in the conf. final than the south going back to 2002, and starting with the Bucs. GO BUCS!!!