“I Thought We Were Past This”
October 4th, 2016
Back to square-one.
Sunday night when Dirk Koetter said for all to hear he was “very concerned” with the turnovers created by America’s Quarterback, Pro Bowler Jameis Winston, Joe had an immediate follow-up question.
JoeBucsFan.com: Is Jameis regressing?
Dirk Koetter: He’s not regressing.
That’s good to know. Since, Koetter said he is confidence Jameis will turn things around, much like he did last year.
However, yesterday in his day-after presser, Koetter seemed frustrated by Jameis and, if Joe didn’t know better, it sure sounded as if Koetter was describing a regression in Jameis’ development as an NFL quarterback. Consider Koetter’s words when asked how Jameis can cut down on the turnovers?
“At that position, taking care of the football is No. 1 priority and like I said, I thought we were past this and I was confident we were past this, but we’re struggling with it right now and we’ve got to fix it.”
Koetter later explained Jameis tries to do too much because he is such a warrior. It’s in his DNA. If that is true, using simple math should cut down on the pass attempts. Problem is, without Doug Martin, there is no threat of a rushing attack and Jameis and the Bucs have little alternative than to throw the ball. And defenses know it.
October 4th, 2016 at 9:03 am
Smh. Right the ship Dirk or walk the plank
October 4th, 2016 at 9:04 am
3 drafts away from being 10-6
October 4th, 2016 at 9:08 am
Jameis is starting to get comfortable playing at the NFL level. He learned last season how to play at the stripped down level very well.
To continue his development, he has to continue to push towards playing at an elite level. Since his brain has experienced everything it needs to learned to be elite, he isn’t going to be able to execute 100% of the elite status. By playing as elite of a game as possible, even if it results in errors and turnovers and losses, means that Jameis is getting the required learning that he will need to have to be elite in a couple years.
Right now, as a Forever Buc Fan, I am glad to put up with the pushing of Jameis, because I know that in a couple years, the pushing will result in him becoming the greatest quarterback of all time.
However, the defense is about 100x more concerning to me.
October 4th, 2016 at 9:09 am
forcing the ball to Evans in double coverage when there was a wide open check down is classic Jameis
October 4th, 2016 at 9:13 am
Jameis was at his worst, for sure. But it was one game. Jameis is going to be great. But we need a running game or we are way too predictable and a great D like the Broncos have can stop that easily. Simple as that
October 4th, 2016 at 9:13 am
Winston needs to work on his accuracy, decision making and seeing the field better. Would be best to start Glennon and give Winston a break.
October 4th, 2016 at 9:15 am
1 WR and no run game this whole season!!!
NFL draft Bucs 2017 Wr, TE, and safety!!!!
October 4th, 2016 at 9:15 am
We all knew that was going to be an ugly game when the schedule came out, long before we knew anything about going in to it with no running game and Jackson deciding he didn’t want to play receiver anymore. Yeah, he threw too many interceptions. Most other QBs would too if they were thrust in his position of having to drop back and pass on nearly every single down. Everyone in that stadium and watching on TV knew what was happening every time he got under center but he still showed more fight than anyone else on that team and now he’s being excoriated for doing what we should be praising him for. He called for the ball from Sims because he wouldn’t let the play die, he threw in to tight windows, he fought through behemoths trying to take his head off to try and extend the plays. Yeah, he screwed up a few throws. I’m not upset about it at all. I’m more upset about Sims trying out for dancing with the stars before deciding to run up field every time we try to hand it off. If he’s afraid to hit the hole then we need a new RB back there. It’s not rocket surgery. We can’t have a lopsided offensive strategy like this and expect to do anything worth watching.
October 4th, 2016 at 9:16 am
Have to say, this schedule has been way worse than I thought it would be. Thought the Rams would give us a break, but there D is about as wicked as Denver’s. Monday night could be very interesting. We have no running game, but the Panthers don’t have much of a secondary.
October 4th, 2016 at 9:25 am
@Dr. Lob..where do you people come from? Like what world do you live in?
October 4th, 2016 at 9:35 am
Destinjohnny Says:
October 4th, 2016 at 9:04 am
3 drafts away from being 10-6
________________
That’s been the slogan here since 2005.
October 4th, 2016 at 9:40 am
The turnovers are inexcusable and putting the team in too many bad situations but as a coach Dirk need to figure out how to throttle back what he’s asking of a 2nd year QB if he sees him struggling. I was curious to see how things would play out this season without Lovie forcing him to run the football. Matt Ryan was a 3rd year pro by the time Koetter got to Atlanta so he may have been more ready to carry a team without a running game at that point in his careet but Jameis clearly isn’t so it’s up to the coach to see that and adjust. We don’t want a Blaine Gabbert situation.
October 4th, 2016 at 9:43 am
Koetter suffers from foot-in-mouth- itis
last week it was culture club now he is going to moonlight as a busdriver and driver over his players
NEWBIE has to learn what to say to the press and what not to say and stay in the lockeroom…. Koetter the clown is bringing the circus to 1 buc place
1 of the worst things to see in all sports is when the players and coach fight and tear up the team
Jameis has to be better in decision making however
does it benefit and help jameis mechanics if he is getting the crap beated out of him running around and trying throw from his backfoot and throwing hail marys in the last 2 out of 3 games at the end
actually it is proven that some QBs mental game shattered from too much sacks/physical punishment in there eary development
Koetter is inconsistantant and lacks common sense and these qualities are a must to be a head coach
**Tip to Koetter. If Jameis gets injured for the year from an injury that was caused by your doing…you gone…just sayin
October 4th, 2016 at 9:47 am
If Sims can’t run it Karlos Williams is available until Doug comes back.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:10 am
Jameis had great protection in the Rams game but overthrew open receivers and made decisions with the ball
The protection broke down against Denver but he still turned it over and made bad decisions.
Yes, Jameis is a QB who needs a run game but at the same time true franchise type guys can still play well even when a d makes your offense one dimensional. Because, of the poor decisions and in accuracy teams are gonna make a inconsistent QB beat them since they know he will make mistakes
Dude needs to show off some of that supposed high football iq and stop costing this team games
October 4th, 2016 at 10:14 am
Karlos Williams will face a suspension when he signs so no to that.
I’m glad Koetter calls out his players. Josh Freeman got Greg schiano canned when he basically went AWOL on the team and had to compensate starting mike glennon too soon.
Koetter isn’t the problem. The players are. I don’t care who your coach is. Some of these guys just lay down and quit. Alexander and Jameis bring that leadership attitude. Jameis is a guy who gets in players faces but his play isn’t there right now.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:16 am
What is reducing pass attempts going to do? I’m not complaining but I recall picks very very early in multiple games.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:20 am
Listening to local sports talk, it is amazing to me how fast people are turning on Jameis and Koetter. Koetter is a NEW head coach in this league, with coordinator and head coaching duties with a QB 20 games into his career. Be patient! We’ve played some of the best defenses in the league thus far, we are missing our probowl RB, and V-Jax didn’t show up on the field till last Sunday. There are plenty of winnable games left on the schedule. I am giving Koetter (and Jameis) this year to figure it out. Jameis is hitting a little sophmore slump, which is typical. Teams now have a seasons worth of film on him and all of off-season to study his tendencies. He will have to adjust, and he knows that. He is the first guy each and every interview to say “he has got to get better every day” and he has the work ethic to pair with his sense of reality. He is NOT like Cam or RG3 in their second years where they thought everything that they did wrong was someone else’s fault. Support Jameis and Koetter through this bumpy time fellas!
October 4th, 2016 at 10:25 am
Koetter playcalling is worse this year than last year
That 3rd and 1 at the 50 yard line was a huge play of the game
There was 3 defenders waiting for tippy toes …and everyone knew that vall wasnt going to work
Koetter cant beat the man coverage with his playcalling
Its not part of his offense scheme and he doesnt have the players to beat it
The good thing is most of the teams have the defenders in all 3 levels like denver
We should move the ball against carolina pass defense if jameis has time
October 4th, 2016 at 10:27 am
Posted this elsewhere and thought it was pertinent to this thread:
You have to walk before you run. JW is putting up big numbers at a time when his peers were chasing sorority girls and cheerleaders. He is already the unquestioned leader in the clubhouse. He is doing the little things that you expect of THE GUY – like rebounding from an INT by leading the team on a 13 play TD drive against the best defense in the league – but he is not doing it consistently. That is a sign of youth and inexperience. He might never fix it, but he sure might, and at 22 years old (given all of the other success, leadership, and work ethic that is OBVIOUS), you give him that opportunity.
There are growing pains with ALL young QBs, but particularly those who are shouldering the entire offense, like JW has been doing since Martin went down. All these last few games prove is that he is not ready to do so against the best defenses in the league YET.
We all want to hold JW to the bar set by the best of the best – the “franchises” like Brady, Manning, Roethlesberger, Newton, etc. – because that is the bar for real and lasting success in this league. I’d suggest that it is not fair to do that to a 22 year old getting ready to start his 20th game. I’d also suggest that the fact that we are holding JW to this standard after 20 games (at 22 years old) would suggest that we have a potentially rare talent behind center and are just being impatient with his development.
The jury is still out, and will be for a couple of more years given the state of the rest of the roster, but any reasonable evaluation would conclude that he has done more to prove he may develop into that guy than disprove it at this stage.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:45 am
With no running game and just one WR threat, few QB’s in history can completely carry a team on his back.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:47 am
VJax is more of a problem that Winston is.
The guy has become invisible.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:51 am
My thoughts are this: we are 1-3. The teams we have played have a combined 11-4, the only team with a losing record is the Cards at 1-3, a team many predicted to be in the Super Bowl. Does it suck? Oh hell yeah. We ain’t even in the same league with these teams. (maybe, just maybe the Rams are better than we thought or the Cards are not as good as everybody thought. Maybe.) This is going to be a suck of a season. First year for coaching staff here. We expected and hoped for better from all including Famous Jamies, but let reality set in. We are easily a year away from relevance more likely 2. Still will always love my Bucs even though it feels like after every game me and Mr. Jack Daniels get to know each other better, especially when i have to deal with all the Steeler fans and crap.
Go Bucs!!!!
October 4th, 2016 at 10:56 am
Its ok to get mad as fans. Just look at these comments. Seems everybody except for the ones getting paid, know how to fix things. Im not giving up on Jameis or Koetter or this team, but I am going to temper my expectations for now.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:56 am
Nope. jameis is the biggest problem right now. To many turnovers giving the opponent short field position to the end zone. He;s doing it quite often now. Our Defense is really not that bad. But when you turn it over to them in their territory, most teams are gonna take advantage. Without McCpy this week, somebody has got to step up. Don’t see it happening against the Panthers.
Its all on Jameis. Cause teams now know our run game is average..at best. meaning he’s gotta throw a lot. And Jameis has been off..way off.
October 4th, 2016 at 10:57 am
Joe
“Problem is, without Doug Martin, there is no threat of a rushing attack and Jameis and the Bucs have little alternative than to throw the ball. And defenses know it.”
Thats just not true. Almost everything I’ve seen since Jaquizz Rogers has gotten here has been pretty good. Not Doug Martin good but I really like him and feel he has not gotten enough touches.
October 4th, 2016 at 11:18 am
@Chris
http://www.cbssports.com/fantasy/football/news/karlos-williams-suspension-complete/
October 4th, 2016 at 11:33 am
I like how we just dismiss all of Jameis’ issues so nonchalantly but lament that VJax is “invisible” or Martin is fragile. The blame lies squarely on a QB who’s not seeing the field. Don’t give me “he’s competitive” BS. He is flat out not getting it right now.
Before I go on, I want it on record that I think he’ll be that franchise guy. He is clearly still learning and is likely to have some bumps and bruises along the way.
That said, this team is not good enough to overcome turnovers. He has to be more careful with the ball and he has had those opportunities. He’s just not getting it done. VJax was wide open on that ill-advised toss he made to Evans in double-coverage so don’t give me “invisible”.
Like any young player he needs to continue working to get better. He’ll be fine as long as he does a better job of taking what the defense gives him.
Lets not get enamored with the “he’s a gun-slinger” mantra. Right now he’s a turnover machine.
October 4th, 2016 at 12:17 pm
Waterboy
That’s why we always in last place. You can’t sign a bruiser with pass catching ability in TB if he smokes weeeeeeeeeed. That would be unchristianlike, golly gee beaver.
And of course, it makes total sense to sign some bum from Cleveland rather than bring back AJ Francis who played well in the ps. But what the hell do we know? Same story as Incognito, heathens need not apply.
And as for the running game, per last night it sure looked like Bobby Rainey could have stepped in for Martin, no problem. But Rainey sucked, Charles Sims much better.
Do yourselves a favor and call Karlos Williams, Mike Williams, Ray Rice and Greg Hardy (barf) at this point might as well let the inmates run the asylum.
October 4th, 2016 at 12:23 pm
@DB55- I liked Rainey. He just seemed to be able to produce when called upon. Sims is OK for WHAT he is. He’s a 3rd down pass catching RB.
You HAVE to have a run-game in this league………………drop mic, exit stage right!!!
October 4th, 2016 at 12:40 pm
jameis has regressed plain and simple….regardless of doug, it seems the whole offense has taking a step back along with the defense….even in week 1 and half way thru week 2 when doug was playing the run game was struggling and it has continued….GO BUCS!!!!
October 4th, 2016 at 1:22 pm
Jameis has not regressed. Jameis has no running game and a defense that will not be able to keep him in games. His heart is smothering his brain. He knows he shouldn’t be forcing these passes but he’s trying to make something happen since the rest of the team has failed to make something happen. In 4 games, this defense has created no pressure and forced only 2 turnovers. Jameis needs to improve his play. I don’t argue that but I’m far more concerned with this pathetic defense and Mike Smith’s ability to formulate a defense that works than I am with Jameis. It’s easy to put blame squarely on the QB. It comes with the territory but it is misguided. We have a real chance this week to show our mettle and get a win in Carolina. Carolina is ripe for the taking. Both teams need this win desperately and it would be nice to see our Bucs play a complete game and get it. We shall see.
October 4th, 2016 at 1:29 pm
I would respect some of these people’s critiques more on jameis if they all weren’t the same ones who didn’t like him to begin with.
No running game with only good one WR against the best defense the NFL has seen in years. Simple as that.
I think the Bucs should have started J. Rogers the last 2 games but I understand and respect Koetter’s loyalty.
October 4th, 2016 at 3:06 pm
Most of the people turning on jameis probably wanted mariota…he looked good enough last year for people to think we already turned the corner and were going to be fighting for a wildcard spot and they forgot/or didn’t care that the schedule for this season is twice as hard as last year
Plus this board is all bucs fans obviously and tampa fans in general only support teams when they are winning
October 4th, 2016 at 3:46 pm
Sean/Stanglassman- Fans can’t be critical of Jameis poor performances? He was awful! Did you see the game? How about the Cardinals game?
You might want to take off those crimson and gold colored glasses for a second. He needs work. Just like ALL 2nd year players need work. I will stop short of saying that he lost 2 games on his own but only because it’s a TEAM game. We can’t afford to have our QB throw interceptions with a suspect defense and NO run-game. You can’t be critical of one and not the other.
October 4th, 2016 at 4:09 pm
Glad to see some people on here have common sense. Sunday was brutal to watch, no doubt. But you would all be lying if you didn’t get excited when Jameis led that super smooth td drive right after that pick to tie the game at 7. The guy is going to be a top 5 QB within a few years. Be patient. I still would t be surprised if we end up at or close to .500 this year. Defense looked a lot better last week till they wore down in the second half. I honestly was surprised we hung close for the whole first half with how many of our key players were down or went down with injury. Four games into the season isn’t time to give up.
October 4th, 2016 at 5:27 pm
that defensive performance vs the broncos was smoke in mirrors…similar to the 10-6 season under rah…..GO BUCS!!!