The Glazer-Licht Talent Argument
January 13th, 2016
What if Johnthan Banks, Sterling Moore and Alterraun Verner are, in fact, a solid stable of young cornerbacks that was simply misused and deflated by Lovie Smith?
Joe wouldn’t bet against that.
And it seems Jason Licht and Team Glazer might feel the same way. Former Bucs quarterback and current BSPN analyst Trent Dilfer made a very simple comment yesterday on WDAE-AM 620. He said Team Glazer and Licht obviously felt Lovie had more talent than his 6-10 record reflected.
In Dilfer’s mind, that’s the only core reason a team would fire a coach after two years.
Maybe it is that simple. Perhaps Team Glazer was advised that its defensive talent was not the kind of mess that should allow a 70 percent completion rate by opposing quarterbacks, and the worst third-down defense in a 20-year history of Bucs football.
As Licht said after Lovie was fired, three home wins in two years was enough patience. Under Lovie, the Bucs had a consistent knack for losing at home, which is inexcusable for any coach.
This whole line of simple thinking offers a lot of hope. The Bucs could be primed for rapid, significant improvement under the right head coach.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:07 am
Glad to see I’m not the only one who thought the DB scheme and coaching were horrendous.
Folks say the Tampa 2 needs a great pass rush to work, some truth to that statement for sure. But the Tampa 2 died when safeties could no longer slobberknock receivers over the middle, and that has nothing to do with a pass rush. Teams made a living throwing over the middle in Lovies scheme…
John Lynch would never have made All Pro in today’s NFL, and Dexter Jackson & Dwight Smith would be unknowns.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:10 am
Keep banks resign Moore drop Verner and spend his cash wisely on safety play like idk maybe Eric berry and qupson from Cleveland than hopefully we can either trade up or pick one of the top 3 corners n the draft Hargrove or the Florida state cb or Clemson cb. Hell we have 50 mill n cap so if we can pick up a safety or two and a Mario Williams I don’t understand how we can’t COMPETE!!!
January 13th, 2016 at 10:13 am
@joe… Plz list your top 5 candidates and top 5 worst
You’re around one buc place and I know you have a scoop, I’m closer to Times Square and I’d trade every light bulb for a Joe list
January 13th, 2016 at 10:15 am
I really think we would have one or two more victories without the four game suspension of Kwon Alexander.
I also believe than you can go all season long with a secondary being destroyed game after game with 3 DB s coaches and so on.
Lovie was the head coach, is a defense minded coach and we never saw any improvment all season long.
Everybody would have understood a struggling offence but nobody can excuse a struggling defence, especially like this one.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:21 am
Janoris Jenkins is worth a sniff this offseason.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:25 am
BucNasty, Don’t forget we desperately need a DE or 2 for that matter. Maybe another WR too. There are plenty of areas we could upgrade on. Let’s hope the next DC can make the most out of what we have or will have. GMC isn’t getting any younger and seems to get hurt a lot.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:26 am
Joe, the answer to your opening sentence is draft pass rush all day long!
January 13th, 2016 at 10:27 am
Lets get a D-line and lets find out!!!!
January 13th, 2016 at 10:32 am
Hiring Jim Schwartz as the new Defensive Coordinator
&
Donnie Henderson as the new Defensive Backs Coach – should remedy the problem.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:34 am
Need an alpha dog on the d-line. Preferably an end. Someone who wants to hunt.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:38 am
Hiring Schwartz as the new DC. Should attract free agents to be
LDE Mario Williams
&
SLB Nigel Bradham
*2 Key Free Agents that will immediately upgrade the unit
January 13th, 2016 at 10:40 am
Scheme, scheme, scheme!! Either the Bucs are the worst at evaluating DB talent on the history of the NFL or there were serious flaws in Lovies Defense.
I say you keep all three, Banksy has playing shown flashes that he can play in the past and Verner was solid before coming here.
You don’t want to let a guy like Moore go and start balling on another team when you could’ve signed him to a relatively inexpensive contract.
Then you take Vernon Hargraves or the CB from FSU (name escapes me) with your top 10 pick and maybe a project in the later rounds, sign one or two solid free agents and you’ve got yourself a nice training camp battle.
At that point it all comes down to who you get as D coordinator. Another poor defensive scheme and you could have 5 all pro’s and still be screwed.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:42 am
I’ve been saying the same thing Joe. We have a lot of talented players. Former pro bowlers, and guys who have gotten a ton of production in other defenses. Lovie couldn’t maximize the talent he had. Going into this season the defense had good expectations. We ended year 1 on an up tick with frazier’s defense. Then Lovie took over the defense and it got worse. With better, more experienced players. That is just inexcusable and the biggest reason Lovie got fired. The talent that licht and lovie accumulated are good enough to have a solid defense. It still needs a dominant DE, but it has a lot of good pieces. A 4-3 DC could come in and have instant success with these players here.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:43 am
Does the fact that nepotism is the only reason our DB coaches got their jobs…two of Lovie’s sons? Seriously I’ve seen more good businesses wrecked when the loving parents tried to force feed their children into positions for which they were not truly qualified.
BTW..@Cobraboy and the many others. I hate to be a nit picker.. I completely understand your point when you say John Lynch couldn’t play in today’s NFL. You’re observing that the rules have changed dramatically and I take your point!
The only area of disagreement we have is Lynch. I think Lynch was a great athlete..remember MLB wanted him desparately too!
I think the proper way to state that is John Lynch would have had to change his game dramatically. Lynch was also a very, very smart player…he would have figured it out and still been a great player. Cam Chancellor isn’t having any problems with the new rules and neither would Lynch.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:44 am
Yeah, I don’t think they were interested in letting Lovie’s loser a** blow up the entire secondary for the third time in three years.
He proved that he and his idiot sons were incapable of coaching up decent to good players.
Bye…
Enjoy your $10 MIL!
January 13th, 2016 at 10:45 am
Follow that up by signing either…
Cornerbacks
• Janoris Jenkins
• Trumaine Johnson
Rams can’t afford to sign both. Especially with all the players – they have hitting the market.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:48 am
0-16 jim schwartz? Idk about that one guys. Even if his defensive schemes are decent, going 0-16 is just pathetic. Even Lovie could get 2 wins with no OC and worse qb’s than he had.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:54 am
Gotta agree with stpetebuc. Lynch wasnt a head hunter. He layed some devastating hits, but i dont really recall him doing a lot of helmet to helmet type hits. He wasnt dirty. Just a hard hitting bad a$$. And like st pete said. Lynch was exceptionally smart. He would have figured out how to make impact plays without breaking the rules.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:54 am
That was Rod Marinelli.
January 13th, 2016 at 10:55 am
Trubucfan22
0-16???
You must be talking about Rod Marinelli (2008)
The guy Schwartz replaced.
Go back and review the time he spent in Tennessee & Buffalo
Remember the scheme he implemented in Tennessee – helped Verner become an ALL-PRO.
January 13th, 2016 at 11:00 am
Same aggressive 4-3 scheme Greg Williams employs in St. Louis/LA.
Hence the reason why I listed
Cornerbacks
• Janoris Jenkins
• Trumaine Johnson
January 13th, 2016 at 11:01 am
That makes alot of sense.
Verner – Pro Bowler and valued CB before Lovie.
Banks – Highly talented, young promising CB. Shut down Calvin Johnson in Man coverage
Moore – Consistent performer for Cowboys and performed decently DESPITE Lovie.
This arguement does not stop at CBS
Barron – Pro Bowler once leaving Lovie
Goldson – Bigtime Playmaker once leaving Lovie
LVD – Performed well DESPITE Lovie, but undeniably had better years under Schiano (ew)
January 13th, 2016 at 11:02 am
Oh my bad lol. Still dislike him for some reason tho. Haha
January 13th, 2016 at 11:05 am
Lovie had Goldson and barron, and made them look like scrubs. ditching them for mcdougald and chris conte? What the fock man!
January 13th, 2016 at 11:07 am
Lol
January 13th, 2016 at 11:09 am
Well maybe, just maybe,the great talent from the Super Bowl days will get credit for being the reason the Tampa 2 worked.I always hated hearing that about Ronde,Brooks etc. I think they would have been great in almost any system, Kiffin and the Tampa 2 got far too much credit
January 13th, 2016 at 11:36 am
Inclined to agree with that assessment
January 13th, 2016 at 11:54 am
Some of you guys don’t remember Lynch that well.
He did, indeed, lead with his helmet very, very often and that is where he earned his reputation.
Certainly he was a smart player, no doubt, and possibly my ATF—I wore his jersey on game day.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=002GdXzylPY
January 13th, 2016 at 12:04 pm
Lovie’s secondary was a ball of confusion all season. How many 12 yard cushions on 3rd and 8 do you have to see. Look for a Banks resurgence, he’s the most talented DB on the roster, by far.
January 13th, 2016 at 12:06 pm
Pass rush don’t mean squat if you can’t stop the short dinks and dunk slant routes. Out of Johnthan Banks, Alterraun Verner and Sterling Moore the only one I would keep would be Moore. What a disappointment second round draft pick Banks has been. Other than his four INT last year the guy gets constantly beat and can’t tackle. Verner on the other hand can tackle and is better than Banks in coverage but those game killing penalties, I can do without. We need to draft a CB in round one and get the best available in FA. Clemson CB Mackensie Alexander will be there and we should jump on him. He is a bit undersized (5-10 195) but so is Rivas (5-11 198) but his in your face attitude makes up for it. Only 35% of passes have been completed against him and he can tackle. Then grab Baylor DE Shawn Oakman (6-8 276) in the second and West Virgina SS Karl Joseph in the third. Watch the film on him. Unbelievable hitter.
January 13th, 2016 at 12:07 pm
It was cleae as day to see that lovie had no idea what he was doing on defense. I am SOOOOL glad he is gone orherwise we would have lost some more good db talebt like barron and goldston
January 13th, 2016 at 12:32 pm
I think Dilfer’s comments were the consensus among fans and ownership. The short passing game makes the D-line far less effective because the ball is out faster. The line backing core needs to be skilled enough to cover the quick slants across the middle and the DB’s have to use bump coverage at the line not play off 5 yds on every play. Lovie’s system never used this tactic to slow down this type of offense.
January 13th, 2016 at 12:49 pm
StPeteBucs I guess Lovie wasn’t the only coach trying to help his son. Father son coaching combination in the NFL and that’s just this year not counting the past.
Bengals Marvin Lewis (head coach) Marcus Lewis (defensive assistant)
Chiefs Andy Reid (head coach) Britt Reid (quality control)
Rams Jeff Fisher (head coach) Brandon Fisher (assistant secondary coach)
Patriots Bill Belichick (head coach) Steve Belichick (coaching assistant)
Seahawks Pete Carroll (head coach) Nate Carroll (assistant WR coach)
Vikings Mike Zimmer (head coach) Adam Zimmer (LB coach)
Vikings Norv Turner (offensive coordinator) Scott Turner (QB coach
January 13th, 2016 at 2:12 pm
HC Won’t be DK guys you’re all sadly mistaken if you think it would be .
If he was gonna be HC he already would have been and we as a team would be focusing on defensive coordinators and Other staff hirings ! He may just want money after all he didn’t go too San Fran on a interview for HC if he wasn’t trying too leave or get more $ . Clearly is looking out for himself . I don’t blame him , but if he wants too be HC he needs too tell Licht and the team . These little games don’t work . I really don’t want the Tampa 2 as our scheme anymore or any of our DBs at all. It’s not gonna work. We need a man coverage secondary unit . . Maybe we should switch too a 3-4 scheme as well . Kwon and LVD in the middle with new cbs on the outside would be nice . Sometimes you just gotta switch the scheme up so QBs and OC actually have too try something different too beat you. How many years have we been in the 4-3 scheme and Tampa 2. Licht ran the 3-4 in Arizona and it’s worked there for years . Lot of teams use the 3-4 and I can understand why. Time too switch it up guys . Von Miller, Janoris Jenkins , Eric berry , Alexander from Clemson .