Team Glazer Not In Firing “Mindset”
October 14th, 2015
Lovie Smith’s scalp was saved by the Bucs beating the Jags.
Joe has written previously that Sunday’s win over the jughead Jags likely saved Lovie Smith’s job with the Bucs.
For if Lovie had pushed his home losing streak to 11 games by falling to the dregs of the NFL, combined with overall futility and grotesque swings and misses in free agency, he would have been hard-pressed to climb out of that hole.
Well, Joe is not the only one who perceives Lovie would have been in deep s(p)it losing to the Jags. Appearing on Miller and Moulton on WWCN-FM 99.3 in Fort Myers, Woody Cummings of The Tampa Tribune suggested losing to the Jags would have triggered such fan unrest, it would have been like a scene out of “Blazing Saddles.”
“The win over the Jags was] big in so many ways, especially being right against the bye,” Cummings said. “The biggest thing to me is this: it calls off the dogs. Had they lost this game, obviously, if you lose to Jacksonville at home, all we are going to hear from media and the fans for the better part of two weeks, if not all of two weeks, is that Lovie Smith has to go.
“Well, this calls off the dogs. They would have stormed One Buc Place with pitchforks and torches and all of that. The hunt would have been on for Lovie Smith’s scalp. This kind of calls off the dogs and to be honest, I don’t think that is in the mindset of the Glazers at this point. I really think that the Glazers believe that Lovie Smith’s tenure as coach – now bear with me on this – is now, that it begins this season. I think that everybody looks at last year as you bring [Jason Licht and Lovie] in and trying to take a team that was clearly not very competitive and needed a lot of work and they went out in free agency and brought in a bunch of guys that they thought were the best they could possibly get at certain positions. Some of them might fit; some of them don’t. But they were trying to be competitive last year, do something to show fan base they were trying. …
“I think that the Glazers look at it as, ‘Now, this is where we begin to evaluate Lovie Smith. This season.’ I think they throw 2-14 out and they are looking at Lovie Smith now.”
Cummings went on to say it is his belief that Team Glazer is “fairly pleased” with the progress the team has shown this season.
There are many ways to look at this philosophy but Joe will choose just two:
Lovie needs wins. Simple as that. If this team finishes, say, 3-13, Joe believes Team Glazer would explore all options. That would be two consecutive seasons worse that the two previous coaches Team Glazer launched.
Why would Lovie be so special that he gets extra rope for doing a worse job than guys fans couldn’t wait to run out of town?
As far as Lovie’s initial roster allegedly being barren, well, Joe can’t go there. Many key players who had good games Sunday were here when Lovie arrived. Jeremy Zuttah could have started for this team. So too could have Donald Penn. Both deemed unworthy by Lovie.
And you simply do not just let a future Hall of Famer in his prime walk out the door without some form of compensation. Yes, Joe is referring to Darrelle Revis. Like the Bucs couldn’t use him now?
(To demonstrate how twisted some Bucs fans are, to this day there many fans that want to pistol-whip Dominik for releasing Derrick Brooks who, Joe might remind folks, never played another snap in the NFL. Yet Lovie runs off Revis — in his prime — and gets a complete and total pass from those same fans. Guess it helps to be a disciple of Father Dungy.)
In the immortal words of Raheem Morris, “I will tolerate you until I can replace you.” This just in: The Bucs haven’t replaced Revis.
To hear more from Cummings, click here.
October 14th, 2015 at 7:45 am
I don’t see how beating the worst team in the league would get the dogs called off. Lovie is a terrible coach and should be replaced at the end of the season. Whatever record the Bucs finish with I think Lovie has already showed he’s not a very good coach.
October 14th, 2015 at 7:48 am
So a 2-14 season where the coach basically totally turns over the entire roster to get a bunch of his guys in is basically thrown away? Yeah as much as Lovie has to go, it’s the Glazers that really need to go. They really don’t care at all about this team or winning. Bucs are their cash cow, MUFC has all their money tied up but the Bucs make money off the TV deal alone. They’re going to milk this baby dry until the sell or move the team. Fans are in for a rough ride.
October 14th, 2015 at 8:00 am
Lovie should just pull a Spurrier and resign to save himself the embarrassment of having top 5 picks in consecutive seasons. He sucks, bad.
Que his family, friends and neighbors coming to his defense in 5,4,3,2,1…
October 14th, 2015 at 8:22 am
So, you all want to get rid of Lovie… and then what? Leave it up to the Glazers to hire the right guy to come in here to right the ship? 4th time’s the charm, right? That will mean another roster overhaul to get the guys that the new coach wants. That will mean all of the defensive players we’ve brought in will be learning a new system. Assuming we don’t bump Koetter up to the HC job, it will mean a whole new offensive system for your new #1 overall QB.
I’m just as tired of Lovie’s style of coaching as the rest of you. I think it’s weak and a loser’s mentality. I also realize that there has to come a point where we let a coach actually start building something. I’m onboard with sticking with Lovie through the end of next season and then, if we’re still not making progress, give him the boot and bring in Kyle Shanahan
October 14th, 2015 at 8:35 am
It’s always amusing to see the wildly emotional reaction so many fans have to situations like this. So, Lovie should go now? Who will his replacement be? Hire another college coach like Schiano and hope he’s the next Bill Walsh? Fans were screaming for Chip Kelly (who turned Tampa down) a few years ago, but how many fans would be screaming for him to be fired, now? His team has won exactly as many games as the Bucs have this year, and he has had one more year in Philly than Lovie has had in Tampa.
I’m not saying Lovie is “my Vince Lombardi”, but the system of ‘hire ’em for 2 or MAYBE 3 seasons, and if they don’t get us to the playoffs, we start over with someone else’ has not proven at all effective. Dan Snyder has yet to learn this.
If you stepped into Doc Brown’s DeLorean & ran it up to 88 MPH, then asked Browns fans back in 1993 what they felt about Bill Belichick, you know what the answer would be. Ask them if they want Bill Belichick back, now, and you know the answer would be different. Even with 4 losing seasons out of 5, Belichick built the core of a Browns team that went on to win the Super Bowl as the Ravens in 2000. I’m NOT saying Lovie is another Bill Belichick, either, but the point is, this is the reality of the ‘win now or die’ attitude surrounding the NFL. Unless a coach has his team going deep in the playoffs every year, fans want him gone. Unless the team has a decade long streak of winning seasons, the fans call the owner an idiot.
Give Lovie a little time. Bucs have already won as many times in 5 games as they won all last season, and would have a winning record now if it weren’t for a certain awful kicker. If the team has not improved by the end of the season, then it’s time to evaluate. In the meantime, just try to relax and enjoy the games.
October 14th, 2015 at 8:39 am
Josh McCown looks pretty darn good with an offensive coordinator it would’ve been interesting to see how many more games they would’ve won last year with an OC.
October 14th, 2015 at 8:44 am
@Waterboy – I’m not sure I buy off on that. I get your point and I think you’re right that we certainly would have done better. However, I think the way it turned out was for the best. It put us in position to land our QB for the future, two solid Olinemen and a very promising MLB. McCown might have done well for us last year and maybe even this year, but we would have had to draft a QB at some point and, from what I hear from college fans, there aren’t any transcendant talents out there right now
October 14th, 2015 at 8:46 am
Def no Lovie fan, not a fan of conservative coachea who can’t out scheme a rookie or backup QB. But I’m all for giving him until the end of the season to show some real progress.
If no progress hire a offensive forward thinking coach who doesn’t need 5 years to show progress.
October 14th, 2015 at 8:55 am
Hey, why all the bad words for Lovie? Dude’s on the rise and might actually win 5 games this season!!
Celebrate, Celebrate……Dance To The Music!!!
October 14th, 2015 at 8:56 am
Jp4- no one is saying playoffs or bust. We as fans and season ticket holders just need progress and not to see the team giving up (week 1) or getting blown out as much as they have.
I’m all for giving a coach time if you see he’s developing players and making progress. This team is still committing lots of penalties and turnovers. Last week was Lovie’s first turnover free game as a Bucs coach. He’s won more games at Ray Jay as a Bears coach than a Bucs coach.
It’s not in reasonable to fire him after 2 years of he isn’t making the team progressively better and that’s all I ask as a paying season ticket holder.
October 14th, 2015 at 8:56 am
Phil Says
“I don’t see how beating the worst team in the league would get the dogs called off.”
The “dogs” were never on so far as the Glazers are concerned.
I’ll say it loud and clear…
The Buccaneers could lose all their games from here on out, and Lovie Smith would still be here next year.
You may not like it. You may refuse to believe it. But that’s how it will end up, if the Bucs go 2-14 again.
I fully understand cutting Revis. That man is WAY overpaid for the level of production he provides. Hall of Famer? I doubt it. His stats are nowhere close to Barbers…and Barber hasn’t even made it yet.
Penn? Zuttah? Well, look at the offensive line now and tell me it was a complete mistake to get rid of rapidly aging players that you eventually replaced.
And guess what?
Dominick was right to cut Brooks too. I mean, come on! The announcers during games were LAUGHING AT BROOKS because he was having trouble keeping up with the younger players. IF it was a mistake, if Brooks had more gas in the tank, then why didn’t he keep playing? Because his time had come. Even Brooks admitted it later.
So, I completely disagree with all of Joe’s points on this matter. Lovie is not going to lose his job if he goes 3-13…or if he goes 2-14. He’s safe for at least one more year.
And that’s all he needs to turn this team around. One defensive draft and a year of development for the offense.
That’s what the drones cannot grasp.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:00 am
Tampa Tony Says
“Jp4- no one is saying playoffs or bust. We as fans and season ticket holders just need progress and not to see the team giving up (week 1) or getting blown out as much as they have.”
Well then…you’ve gotten what you want.
They were only blown out the first game. Since then they have been in every game. And the NEVER gave up, not even in the first game. They still tried. But even if they had in that game, they have not since.
So, according to your standards…Lovie is safe. Thanks for playing.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:01 am
@Waterboy
I caught a glimpse of McCown playing Sunday…and he threw a pick within 2 minutes of my tuning in.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:04 am
Buccaneerbonzai- want to put money on that? I can’t remember ANY coach surviving back the back 2 win seasons. No coach is that safe!!!
That would mean he didn’t even match Schiano’s last year in TWO years, please put your money where your mouth is. I’ll say I hope 2 wins doesn’t happen, but this insane thought process that Loser Lovie is safe no matter what is hilarious.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:08 am
Bonsai- Lavonte said himself they have up in Week 1, they got blown out in Week 4 at home as well. In Week 3 the defense got beat by a backup QB. People moan about the missed kicks but Lovie’s bad player decisions kept that kicker on the roster in back to back weeks. Flip that and if the Texans kicker makes his kicks the game isn’t as close.
This defense is still garbage and Lovie’s conservative nature is keeping possible points off the board. Hope he turns it around as I hate losing, but it’s not promising
October 14th, 2015 at 9:12 am
The Bucs have settled for mediocrity for most of their existence. Get with the program. It’s a lifetime journey.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:13 am
BuccaneerBonzai Says:
October 14th, 2015 at 8:56 am
I fully understand cutting Revis. That man is WAY overpaid for the level of production he provides. Hall of Famer? I doubt it. His stats are nowhere close to Barbers…and Barber hasn’t even made it yet.
________________________________________________________________
You continue to prove a staggering lack of intelligent analysis. Good lord.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:24 am
@bucrightoff
Saying that doesn’t make it true.
Why should Revis make the Hall of Fame? Make your case. Because I can name multiple CBs that never made the Hall of Fame who showed better results over their careers.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:27 am
@Tampa Tony
They did not get blown out in week 4. It was a two score game. That’s not a blowout. A blowout is losing by 4 touchdowns like in week one. Or even 3 TDs.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:28 am
And to deny that our kicker made the difference in the game is stretching it.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:30 am
Tampa Tony says:
‘It’s not in reasonable to fire him after 2 years of he isn’t making the team progressively better and that’s all I ask as a paying season ticket holder.’
I don’t disagree, TT, but it’s the level of success fans seem to be demanding that is the point of contention. There is no question in my mind that the Bucs are much better now than they were last year. Unless the wheels fall off, I think we’ve seen significant progress, Lovie just needs to start turning that progress into wins. Wins are all anyone cares about, anyway.
BuccaneerBonzai says:
‘So, according to your standards…Lovie is safe. Thanks for playing.’
Exactly! Everyone can agree that if the team improves, Lovie should continue as HC. What divides the fans is – How much progress is ENOUGH progress? If they win 6 or 7 games, no way will the Glazers fire Lovie. If they only win 4 games or less, Lovie is probably gone regardless of how much the team has improved, because again…wins are all anyone cares about.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:32 am
Results? Lol, so everything comes down to stats I suppose? So using the Bonzai logic, the following CBs are better, in some cases significantly so, than Revis
Donnie Abraham
Antonio Cromartie
Terence Newman
DeAngelo Hall
Terrell Buckley
Asante Samuel
Deon Grant
Here’s my analysis: How can you get stats when no one ever throws in your direction? Is Revis supposed to gamble non-stop and constantly play out of place to placate fans like you who only look at stats? Or is the fact he totally shuts down 1 half of the field, which can’t show up on stats, totally meaningless? Don’t bother answering, it’ll probably be a clown shoes answer anyway. Or answer and let some of us laugh, whichever you’d prefer.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:35 am
Dude, Bucs lost by 3 scores against the Panthers that’s a blowout. I probably wouldn’t give Lovie so much blame if he didn’t have final roster control. Not sure why you defend a losing head coach so adamantly, you gotta be related to him.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:40 am
Bucs lost by 14 points against the panthers. TWO TOUCHDOWNS = TWO SCORES.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:42 am
Unless, of course…you want to count the extra points as separate scores. Which I wouldn’t put past someone like The Bucs Realist. But I think you have more class than that.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:44 am
Jameis Winston
Ali Marpet
Donovan Smith
Kwon Alexander
Four rookie starters in an obvious rebuilding year. This is why Lovie Smith gets extra rope and will get all of next year.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:45 am
And no one can convince me that Revis provided $1 million of production each game he was here…which was what he got paid. He is nowhere near worth the price he gets. Not even close.
October 14th, 2015 at 9:49 am
I can’t add, you got me bonzai ha ha. Still 14 points in a league where most games are decided by one score? Loser Lovie def needs progress for me to give the Bucs my money next year
October 14th, 2015 at 9:54 am
BuccaneerBonzai Says:
October 14th, 2015 at 9:45 am
And no one can convince me that Revis provided $1 million of production each game he was here…which was what he got paid. He is nowhere near worth the price he gets. Not even close.
_______________________________________________________________
And you would be in the extreme minority. His replacements have provided 0 value and one of them is already on another team. Keep thinking dumping him was a keen, brilliant move, even as the guys they’ve brought in to replace him combined haven’t equalled half of Revis impact on a game. Keep on homering on basically.
October 14th, 2015 at 10:13 am
Lovie has NEVER won consistently and is not the guy to lead the bucs into the future.
Lovie has basically had 1 good season and he lost the big game to a mediocre coach and the biggest big game choke artist of all time in peyton manning. Dungy was right for the bucs and turned the franchise around no doubt but he is not a winner. He left at least 1 superbowl on the table in tampa and 2 in indy. hardly a winner.
Lovie is lifetime 3-3 playoff coach he won 2 of those in the super bowl year. again hardly consistent over a 11 / 12 year career. those that defend lovie simply forget history and refuse to accept that lovie is barely a .500 coach and can not beat teams with a winning record. the super bowl run he made was with the gm picking players. once lovie received full control in chicago he won 1 playoff game. there is a reason they ran his dumb arse off after a 10 win season.
If all you want is mediocrity and 7-9, 8-8, and 9-7 season with ONE and DONE in the playoffs lovie’s might be your guy because at best that’s all you can hope for. I for one want the bucs to compete year in and year out and lovie has PROVEN he can not do that….
He will save his job again this year by blaming frazier and koetter and getting 2 more coordinators in… same ol lovie throwing people under the bus to save his own arse… his track record and long list of discarded coordinators prove that. Lovie loyalists are blind and living in the past which is ironic because Lovie sucked in the past as well. Dungy, Lovie and Jeff Fischer are the three most overrated coaches in the NFL simple as that…
When lovie wins a couple of games in a row against quality opponents you can defend him winning a game against a team you should beat at home is nothing to get excited about. good win yes but, as for turning it around or to say they finally get it, I’ll wait for a string of wins and with Lovie Smith in charge that will NOT happen.
October 14th, 2015 at 10:37 am
Lovie is a career .515 coach. 85 wins, 80 losses. And, I think that’s what is going to be so disappointing to those who want him out. He’s going to do just enough to not get fired. He’s the kind of coach who will get you to 8-8, and maybe some years 10-6, and others 6-10.
Jeff Fisher is .522. 164-150. Jim Fassel is .522. I don’t think Lovie is the worst thing ever, nor do I see us turning into the Patriots. I think with a great OC, he can be an above average coach.
I’m rooting for him, simple because I am a Bucs fan, and I want the team to win.
But, as I have asked the Bucs Realist, and later have opened the floor to others, name the coach you wanted hired, who was available, instead of Lovie. It’s really easy to bitch and complain but, it’s a little harder to provide solutions. And this is coming from someone certainly not jumping for joy when he was hired.
Best case scenario, he gets us to an 8-8 team with a solid roster, and someone else comes in and takes us the promised land right away. Sound familiar?
October 14th, 2015 at 10:49 am
BuccaneerBonzai
Did you actually just say that Darrelle Revis is not a Hall of Famer? Really?
October 14th, 2015 at 11:15 am
Win two in a row Lovie and they’ll be singing your praises like a canary, in a coal mine.
October 14th, 2015 at 11:20 am
Sam Madison is a Hall of Famer 🙂
October 14th, 2015 at 11:21 am
TY Law is a Hall of Famer 2 🙂
October 14th, 2015 at 11:40 am
Same sort of flawed analysis as proclaiming McCown was the worst personnel move in team history.
The man that is offensive player of the week and ripped the Ravens up.
Pitiful.
October 14th, 2015 at 11:43 am
in someways there is progress from last year.
the OL is much better now and with rookies playing and doing well, this will get even better.
the RB situation is fine
The D front four is adequate and getting better
The main problem is the corners. scour the waiver wire. or trade.
The kicking game is now good.
That leaves the QB and it will get better albeit I do not see Winston as the
answer
Now if you can get depth you can be an 8/8 team.
And thats about the best you can expect in the next 3 years.
October 14th, 2015 at 11:56 am
Bucs still haven’t replaced Aqib Talib
October 14th, 2015 at 11:59 am
I hope Lovie wins because if he wins, the Bucs win. And I’m a Bucs fan. But I’m not a Lovie fan. How many of you Lovie apologist actually believe he will get us to the promised land? Not hope, but truly see it happening? I just can’t.
And Love, as for who might replace him, well if Lovie can’t win 9 games this year, then he would have finished with a worse record than some nobody college coach who ran a decent Rutgers team we picked up a couple years ago.
October 14th, 2015 at 12:10 pm
WalkdaPlank …I think there maybe 4-5 Lovie’s Lovers on these threads every day. So they’re just a small band of groupies…
October 14th, 2015 at 12:17 pm
BuccaneerBonzai…you’re not providing ANY reasons as to why Lovie will stay. You’re just saying he’ll remain the coach, because you said so.
October 14th, 2015 at 12:19 pm
@Walk
I was referring to 2014. Who did you want hired instead of Lovie? I was hoping for someone like Beavell (now the guy with the worst call in SB history). Or, another offensive minded coach. I was firmly in the middle on Lovie. Not the best or worst hire. Just ok. Feel the same way now. Decent. Was actually interested in what Tedford might do.
I have posed the question to the Realist but, for whatever reason, he continues to ignore me. So, I want to see who other wanted hired instead of him? I can admit, I’m not sure if Beavell would be great or not.
It’s a simple question, if you think Lovie shouldn’t have been hired, then who did you want (who was available and would take the job, meaning not Gruden)? For whatever reason, not a single person will throw out a name.
October 14th, 2015 at 12:33 pm
LWD…perhaps it’s because we don’t have a rolodex of up and coming assistant coaches in front of us. I think Josh McDaniels will get another crack at it someday. Not saying that’s who I’d want, just the only assistant coach that comes to mind. Ya see? Not a lot of Buc fans follow other teams and if they do, most don’t know any of the assistant coaches, DC’s, or OC’s names.
Once again…no I did not watch MNF on Monday. Therefore I couldn’t tell you any of their staff.
Are you asking the question for shyte’s and giggles? Because we don’t DO the hiring.
October 14th, 2015 at 12:41 pm
Lovie as a retread hire was always a very mediocre hire. But the Glazers had to hire a NFL name coach (aka a retread) after Schiano because the fans lost their isht over Schiano. Sadly it was always going to be Lovie or Whisenhunt or maybe Caldwell as our coach, no shot the Glazers were taking a chance on a Mike Zimmer or Dan Quinn or Todd Bowles. I would have been fine with any non-retread coach, ideally an offensive minded one but either of the three guys I’ve mentioned who are doing significantly better than Lovie are all defensive guys too. Just giving new guys a chance and not retreads is the way to go unless you can get an elite coach like say Harbaugh.
So I suppose it’s irrelevant who people wanted to hire. The list was the three guys I mentioned and maybe a few other retreads. Glazers were not getting adventurous or even trying something dangerous with the hire. You get what you pay for in the end. Retreads rarely work, and only really if they’ve been away from HC jobs for a while (Belichick and Carroll come to mind).
October 14th, 2015 at 12:56 pm
@Love
Well me personally, I wanted Marty. Either him or some offensive minded coach with a proven NFL offense (like Beavell or McDaniels).
Marty may have been old, but last coached his team to 15-1 and was fired for a playoff loss. I don’t think he would’ve been a long term answer, but would’ve had a better chance at turning the franchise around than Lovie.
October 14th, 2015 at 1:20 pm
I like Marty. Certainly a better coach than Lovie. But, I would have hired him after Gruden. At some point, age is an issue, simply because you have to turn around and start anew in a few years.
At some point, we all have to recognize that things changed for the worse after Malcolm’s stroke. I wish the kids would just enjoy their money or tend to their other business interests and hire a strong team president. Let that guy do the hiring of everyone else. That being said, I like Licht quite a bit. He makes mistakes (as all first timers will) but, he doesn’t linger on them.
As I said, I just want to win. I’m hoping Licht and Koetter can take the .500 ability of Lovie, and put it over the top. Just hoping for the best.
I have posted less lately because I can’t take the pissing and moaning. I don’t begrudge it, but, complaining about Lovie in every single post, in posts that don’t have anything to do with him gets old.
October 14th, 2015 at 1:40 pm
LOL I wanted Martyball too…
October 14th, 2015 at 1:57 pm
I liked Gruden last year and I like Winston moss for next year.
By the way, those comments by Cummings is a bunch of crock!
October 14th, 2015 at 2:13 pm
Considering what he was hamstrung with (worst owner in sports, RGIII), Gruden has actually done a pretty nice job overall with the Redskins. They still need a lot of work but a lot of coaches would have imploded under those conditions. On that note, Hue Jackson I think might be worth a look if Lovie gets canned. I mean going 8-8 with the Raiders has to count for something, and Dalton looks like the MVP right now. Get him and Jameis together and that might be fun.
October 14th, 2015 at 7:13 pm
bla, bla, bla
October 17th, 2015 at 11:20 pm
Buc1987 Says
“BuccaneerBonzai…you’re not providing ANY reasons as to why Lovie will stay. You’re just saying he’ll remain the coach, because you said so.”
And that’s reason enough. After all…I’ve been right more often than not…except between the months of May and April, in that order. 😉