Jameis Watch: “The Spat”
January 6th, 2015
Crab-legs-stealing, BB-gun-shooting, obscenity-hollering, Heisman-Trophy-winning, former national champion James Winston, the pride of Florida State University, continues to look like a much better quarterback prospect than Mike Glennon and Josh McCown.
It’s Joe’s daily nugget on the Jameis Watch, celebrating the best quarterback to wear No. 5 ever in the state of Florida.
You saw it. Joe saw it. Everybody saw it. As Florida State was starting to melt down in the second half of the Rose Bowl against Oregon, on the sidelines, Jameis Winston was so worked up, Seminoles coach Jimbo Fisher said, per the lip-readers, “If you don’t calm down I’m going to bench you.”
For the Jameis haters, it was yet another example why Bucs coach Lovie Smith should settle for lesser talent in the draft. For those who like animation on the sidelines, it was a reason to draft Jameis.
To some NFL types, the spat was nothing whatsoever and no reason not to draft Jameis, per Jim Corbett of Florida Today.
“It’s a small piece of the evaluation,” Senior Bowl executive director and former Cleveland Browns general manager Phil Savage said in a text. “They (Winston and Fisher) go at it like that every day in practice and games.”
“That exchange doesn’t factor because that stuff happens all the time,” six-time NFL executive of the year and current ESPN and SIRIUS NFL Radio analyst Bill Polian said. “The only reason people take notice of it is because the cameras are everywhere. … That’s no issue at all. They had a rough time protecting him, and that’s the problem.”
Look, how many times have you heard fans whine that Lovie is stoic on the sidelines? And people are going to whine because a quarterback has passion and emotion on the sidelines?
As former Bucs quarterback Shaun King, one of only three Bucs quarterbacks to lead the Pewter Pirates to an NFC Championship game, would say, “Child, please.”
January 6th, 2015 at 9:50 pm
This team needs passion more than anything. We’ve been missing it since Sapp has been gone. Evans has that same streak in him, and Lovie wasn’t afraid to draft him.
January 6th, 2015 at 9:53 pm
@geno
Agree 100%
January 6th, 2015 at 9:54 pm
He has been kicked out of practice he is an idiot does that crap all the time classless
January 6th, 2015 at 9:54 pm
Good God you talk tough when you have no one in front of you . Mariota is definetly more, way more talented than Wunston. So your theory is because a dude plays under center and plays in a a pro system he has more talent. Wow !! You’re making yourself look desperate and stupid . Look at all the stats that breakdown both QBs and it’s not even close who has more talent. Mariota is best athlete by far and has all the numbers to show who’s the best. No doubt the experts, the big dog, sal, and everyone else (minus the 2 or 3 you have to dig around to find) Mariota is the QB that will drafted by the Bucs. Then your boy will wuss out and not even enter the draft. Many believe this will be the case anyway since he won’t be drafted number 1 and has so many issues off the field that he will stay in school and try to be picked number 1 next year. He needs Mariota out of the way to be number 1 and even him and his dad know this..
January 6th, 2015 at 10:06 pm
Rather have a qb that fights on the field than cries in the press conference. Just saying.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:08 pm
Gooberville, agree with you.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:09 pm
@joe
Back to that last Sal Palaotonio article means we’re looking to trade out of the number 1 pick right?? That had to be the worst planting of a story I’ve ever heard. Could we be anymore obvious? We suck at everything smdh
January 6th, 2015 at 10:10 pm
Savage is running the senior bowl and broadcasting because he thinks like this. EMPLOYED NFL GM’s will not take the chance or they’ll get burned. See Johnny F
January 6th, 2015 at 10:17 pm
Joe, why did you not quote Polian comments about Winston not having he NFL ready skills many claim he does. Polian basically said he cant make of the throws, doesn’t go through progressions and doesn’t have great pocket presence. HE is not as NFL ready as many say.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:19 pm
@bucnut2
And mariota is??
January 6th, 2015 at 10:21 pm
@Nybucsfan. Say something new. You’re getting annoying. And put periods in your comments. You type like a child and that reflects your “nana nana boo boo” type comments.
Also, to say Mariota is way better than Winston is a lie and you look dumb yourself. They both have their strengths and weaknesses and at best Mariota and Winston are just as good. Winston is a notch below Luck as a passing prospect so you’re basically saying Mariota is more of a can’t miss than Luck. I understand if you like Mariota better but don’t say things are blatantly incorrect just bc you don’t like the guy as a person. That’s desperate and stupid.
At the end of the day either one will be an major upgrade. Mariota has concerns translating to the nfl and Winston has concerns with making on the field. Tough decisions.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:23 pm
Joe…
“For the Jameis haters, it was yet another example why Bucs coach Lovie Smith should settle for lesser talent in the draft.”
Were you planning on announcing the results of the “Poll”?……or do you just assume that everyone is aware that JBF readers would prefer to draft Mariota over Winston by a 2-1 margin.
Is it possible that many of us are not Winston haters….but simply disagree with you that he has superior talent?
January 6th, 2015 at 10:24 pm
Yeah, maybe we should try to trade down with Tennessee and select Winston with the 2nd pick?
Why you ask?
Because all the way up until draft day, providing they both declare, Winston will always be consensus #2. Especially if Mariota carves up Ohio State. booyah
January 6th, 2015 at 10:29 pm
@SAMCRO
Joe thinks we needed to tank the last game in order to be able to pick Jameis because of Jameis’ “superior talent”
Wow….sure am glad we are able to beat all those other teams to him!!!
January 6th, 2015 at 10:29 pm
I want Marriotta simply because he is less thuggish, hasn’t been accused of rape and hasn’t been caught on video shop lifting.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:33 pm
“less thuggish” smdh. You’ll are so sad. Winston is thuggish because he’s black right?? Smh
January 6th, 2015 at 10:34 pm
I want Mariota because I’m one of the very, very, few that actually think he has superior talent to Winston and would be a better QB for the Bucs.
Very, very, few means 67%
January 6th, 2015 at 10:34 pm
Yeah having a loudmouth who thinks jumping on a table and screaming F her in the pssy is really somebody to bring some passion to the table.
You have two good QB’s both judged as talent worthy of a top pick. One of them is a poster child of immature bad behavior and bad decisions.
And when some of this overflowed to the football field with horrible decisions and interceptions what did the Jameis apologists come up with…oh he had horrible freshman receivers who couldn’t run proper routes and made Jameis look bad.
How about telling that to Rashad Greene THE ALL TIME LEADING FSU receiver. Or to Nick O’Leary FSU’s all time Tight end. Horrible stupid receivers who after three years of great success suddenly failed their senior years and made poor Jameis look bad.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:35 pm
Winston’s throwing mechanics are tebow-ish… long windup (like a baseball pitcher) saying he’s a notch below luck is absolutely ridiculous. All personalities aside, mariota makes much better decisions, has better pocket awareness and is overall a better package on the field. Saying Winston is a notch below Luck as a passer is a lie.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:39 pm
Can anyone point me to a Mock Draft that has us picking Winston?
Surely, if Joe’s opinion is shared by experts there has to be some.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:40 pm
Those who like Jameis will call this “passion”
Those who don’t will call him “incorrigible”
They will point it out as a long list of behaviors that they never did
Some would even classify him as a thug, like they did Richard Sherman
I wouldn’t mind Sherman in the Bucs defensive backfield
January 6th, 2015 at 10:41 pm
Winston hasn’t announced his entering the nfl draft as of yet. I think he is waiting to see what mariota says first. mariota is projected as the #1 overall pick. mariota might stay in college (one more year of eligibility). then Winston would have to be the bucs pick. Winston might decide to stay in school and come out after next year if mariota decides to play in the NFL.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:42 pm
@Gooberville: Just because MM runs faster, it does not make him a better talent for NFL. It isn’t just the system he plays in that helps Winston, he plays it in a very advanced level, almost as good as Luck did in Stanford. You watch other top QB prospects of near future like Connor Cook and Hackenberg, they look extremely raw compared to Winston. I think you lack objectivity and are letting off the field concerns of Winston cloud your assessment of him on the field. He is far superior to Mariota, it isn’t even a question.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:42 pm
@StPeteBucfan
He still threw for 350 and none of it was in garbage time because he was yanked. He moved the ball up and down the field. He can’t control is playmakers ball securing problems. The fumbles occured after they picked up 1st down yardage in plus territory
January 6th, 2015 at 10:50 pm
@ iamkingsu & St. Pete
While it is interesting to debate the two QBs performances in the Rose Bowl…..I am convinced (good or bad) that it makes little difference to the decision makers.
They will be looking at the entire body of work and especially looking at talent that transfers to the NFL
January 6th, 2015 at 10:50 pm
Gooberville guy site the big dog as an expert in favor of Mariota. I think it is safe to say Winston is the smart pick here!
January 6th, 2015 at 10:52 pm
Winston plays with the game with passion,and fire Those are winning traits in my book.
Tom Brady passionate, Peyton Manning passionate, Phillip Rivers passionate
January 6th, 2015 at 10:52 pm
Posey
Agree with Jameis windup. Some of his supporters blame that on his 98MPH fastball and baseball and believe somebody will straighten that out when he hits the NFL.
I haven’t seen quite enough of Mariota. Only one full game the other night and so of course the rest has been highlights. So I haven’t seen all the passes he may have overthrown or underthrown but I have seen his arm strength on tape and I’ve seen him fire the ball 20 yards into the endzone while on the run and hitting an NFL sized window between two defenders to get the TD.
I’ve seen him do this more than once on highlights. Can he do it regularly in the NFL. That of course is the question.
I feel like Mariota already has a much quicker release and this is one of the reasons he CAN throw so well on the run and doesn’t NEED a perfect pocket from which to pass.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:53 pm
Again, suggesting luck and Winston are close to each other as college prospects is rediculous and down right incorrect.
January 6th, 2015 at 10:55 pm
Since Joe mentioned Shaun King….even briefly!!!
“Shaun King, one of two Buc Quarterbacks that lost a NFC Championship Game when his defense gave up 11 or fewer points.”
January 6th, 2015 at 10:57 pm
I want Winston, but i think he’s going back
January 6th, 2015 at 10:58 pm
Winston’s arm talent is on par if not better than Luck’s coming out of Stanford. Luck could only dream of throwing with the same anticipation as Winston while he was at Stanford. Experts would never admit it because they have certain vendettas against him because they don’t liked him as a person
January 6th, 2015 at 10:59 pm
@ lovethepewter I’m pretty sure I never said he was kicked out of practice before. Im pretty sure the post is about his attitude. So if you find what I say annoying please feel free to pass it over. Clearly you don’t read what I say never said Mariota is way better than Winston. His numbers are better than Winston and that’s true. What I say is Winston has a bad character and that’s also true. I do think Winston will be a bust in my opinion he is way over rated. P.S. Thanks for the English lesson periods are on the top of my list when typing on my phone. Hate to look like a child.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:00 pm
I disagree with Polian…it’s actually very rare for a head coach to tell his star QB that he will bench him in the middle of a game. I get the impression that Fisher is ready for Winston to move on. Just another bullet point on a list of reasons why Winston can be the next Leaf.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:01 pm
@TBBF and iamking
TBBF is right. I’m not making my decision about Jameis on the bowl game although it’s clear to any but the most biased Jameis lovers that he melted down and lost his infamous icy composure. If you can’t see that then you’re hopeless.
Did the rest of the team melt down around him. Absolutely. Did the best WR in FSU history (statistically at least) and the best TE in FSU history have games just as bad as Jameis…YES.
WTF is with you people? Seriously? When FSU screws up thanks to Jameis moronic interceptions..I watched ALL of Louisiville AND All of Florida with parts of three other Jameis games….and then they make a remarkable comeback it’s because of Jameis great leadership, poise and skills.
When the entire team blows up from the head coach down to the ballboy nobody questions where was the leadership from the QB position. Oh that’s right he was busy “making a play” and going all Josh McCown. Or he was arguing with his coach, or he was berating a receiver.
So when FSU wins it’s TOTALLY because of Jameis the almighty. When they not just lose a game but get CRUSHED because they melt down and lose any sense of poise…it’s EVERYBODY else’s fault but Jameis. You guys are hopelessly lacking in any sense of objectivity. At least some of you and you know who you are.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:01 pm
Winston has a long wind up but it’s a short follow threw so it’s not as bad as people will make it out to be
January 6th, 2015 at 11:02 pm
*through
January 6th, 2015 at 11:09 pm
I have never seen Brady, Manning or Rivers in a fight with the coach on the sidelines.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:14 pm
Sapp was the same way coming out of college. He’s got character issues he will b trouble. Look how that turned out. He and brooks put the fire into that defense. With winston and evans that would put the fire into our offense
January 6th, 2015 at 11:14 pm
I’m still waiting for someone who can point me to a Mock Draft that has us picking Winston….
January 6th, 2015 at 11:15 pm
The question you’ll really want to ask yourselves is Can Mariota throw the football at all? The biggest thing I took out of the Rose Bowl was when Mariota was backed up before the half in an “obvious” passing situation and made a horrible read, throw etc. He also sailed a few over the heads of receivers when they were wide open in the middle of the field.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:17 pm
Haha sorry nybucsfan only the first part was for you and disliking him as the media portrays him even though you’ve never met the guy. Hence why I separated the paragraphs. The second was for people claiming Mariota is far more talented than Winston.
Classic victims of the talking heads.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:21 pm
I wish we took a guy from a Florida school but it’s not happening. It’s not. Mariota is graduating Winston is not. Much higher chance of Winston returning and almost no chance of mariota returning. Let’s get some coverage on Mariota HE IS bucs news and it’s time to get the fans excited about him!
January 6th, 2015 at 11:22 pm
@iamkingsu, I liked the passing play when MM double pump and looked off the defenders on that touchdown around the end of the 3rd quarter.. he can throw
January 6th, 2015 at 11:22 pm
Mcshay has already said winston is better NFL prospect than mariota. To me it seems if mariota top wr is cover he looks to run. The defenses in the NFL r a lot quicker than the ones in college. He won’t b able to outrun NFL defenses
January 6th, 2015 at 11:23 pm
If Joe can basically ignore his own poll results and continue pro Jameis articles and not put forward anything similar for Mariota is puzzling.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:24 pm
At this point last year all the mock drafts had Bridgewater going first in the draft.
Meaningless.
its a process. Combine. Pro days. Individual workouts. Input from the new OC. Background check.
Winston throws like Tebow??????? Cmon now that is rediculous. The guy makes fabulous throws Tebow couldn’t make in his wildest dreams.
Might be a nut job, but he sure as heck can throw.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:25 pm
@soggy
You’re talking about the fake bubble screen?? Lol That’s how the play was designed. They baited them with the quick screen all game. He did nothing on that play
January 6th, 2015 at 11:28 pm
@iamkingsu, Looked like something to me and the scoreboard..
January 6th, 2015 at 11:29 pm
iamkingsu Says:
^^^^ Thank you for speaking for me in here!!!!!
January 6th, 2015 at 11:29 pm
I believe most pro Winston fans are missing the point about his off field issues. As fans they have the luxury of ignoring them or minimizing them while assuming the talent level is so much greater it’s worth the risk….The fans can take the risk, the players & even the coaches can take the risk……the owners cannot and will not take that risk.
Anyone who is responsible for a large multi-billion dollar investment is not going to take that gamble. If they choose Mariota and somehow he doesn’t develop into a francise QB and Winston does for another team….they will still be able to justify the decision….and they will be perfectly OK with their choice at the time.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:34 pm
His and Lovies personalities will not mix, sorry. This is a non story anymore. No way we take this kid. To many off the field questions. WE DO NOT NEED A JAMARCUS RUSSELL 2.O!!!!
January 6th, 2015 at 11:36 pm
@ Greg
Todd McShay has Mariota going to Bucs in his Mock Draft……
Find me someone who has Winston other than Joe….
January 6th, 2015 at 11:45 pm
Mcshay last mock was n December. He said today that winston was better prospect than mariota. Plus like someone else just said bridgewater was projected first this time last year. I use to b anti jameis but after watching him play and the fire he has about him that’s exactly what I believe we need.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:49 pm
@mike30 no prob
January 6th, 2015 at 11:50 pm
He likes Winston but still mocks Mariota to us….and will still mock Mariota on his next one….IMO…
My point is that regardless of what experts think….the believe we will take Mariota….and the reason is they believe we rank Mariota higher either on talent or character or both….
January 6th, 2015 at 11:52 pm
@jonny2.3.. Go read the Ted Miller article on ESPN and then come back and tell me you have a clue what you’re talking about. Not only can Mariita go down as the best in college history but of the others before him is the most NFL ready. I do not see articles about Winston like this. End of discussion as to who has the more talent. And don’t comment until you read the article.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:52 pm
The only way Winston will be playing pro ball in Tampa is for the Yankees. I have read comments that as usual have to lead to race as an issue. Who the hell cares what his skin color is. He is human like the rest of us. He just happens in my opinion to not be the best choice for the Bucs. He has too much of a bust risk due to his behavior and carelessly handling the Football. I just see Mariota who also is not Caucasian by the way, as the safest choice with a higher ceiling. So can we please for once get past the race issue. This is 2015 and everyone in this country has the opportunity to have success and also everyone has to suffer the consequences for their behavior. I do not think the term Thug means a person is associated with a certain race but more of a behavioral status. I also know that racism will always be brought in to the discussion because it is convenient and some people want to continue to judge others by their skin tone and not by their character. SMH sadly.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:56 pm
The NFL just went through an awful year with off-field issues….primarily domestic violence….the coaches & owners are going to scrutinize every pick to the max. The Bucs have made it a mission to get rid of Talib, Wright (Eric), Blount, Williams….and drafted fairly clean players. Our off-field issues were minimal.
Jameis Winston would be very wise to sit it out one more year anc keep his nose very clean. The heat will be off somewhat and the comfort level for him will be much higher.
January 6th, 2015 at 11:57 pm
@rayjay1122, Right on man..Some people just have to throw the color in there..lol
January 7th, 2015 at 12:02 am
I also read an article that said the bucs were sold on winston but not is availability. Then read one that said the weren’t to sold on mariota. There was even one that said we were high on hundley. I honestly wouldn’t mind taking williams or Gregory 1st and getting qb n the 2nd or trading back into the end of the first for one
January 7th, 2015 at 12:04 am
@TBBF
Agree for all the reasons you mentioned that the Glazers are simply not going to sign off on a Jameis Winston pick. It’ll be like that scene from the Godfather after they try and assassinate the Godfather and the oldest son Sonny (Jamee Caan) wants to immediately go on a murder spree and kill rival families for vengenance.
Tom the Consigliere chastises him and says..”Sonny you’re making it personal…it’s just business.”
Anybody waxes poetic to the Glazers about “Famous” Jameis and that’s what they’ll hear. You’re making it personal, it’s just business. It would be HORRIBLE business to risk so much on Jameis. It’s just that simple. Follow the money.
If they pick Mariota and he’s a bust that’ll be bad but there’ll be no lingering bad taste because the fans will love Mariota personally. If they draft Jameis and he does ANYTHING off the field the hot white light of bad publicity will be very damaging to the Buc brand.
January 7th, 2015 at 12:05 am
@rayjay1122 and soggy
Miss me with all that holier than thou crap. Do you’ll consider BeRoethlisberger a thug?? Go ahead and lie and say yea
January 7th, 2015 at 12:08 am
@iamkingsu, Back off..
January 7th, 2015 at 12:10 am
Mariota has one more game….and its huge on the big stage….if he does well…..great….if he fails….I fear Buc fans will unecessarily sour on him.
My feeling is that either way a person of his character will be able to move on positively….if his team loses, he will simply try that much harder to achieve a championship in the NFL.
January 7th, 2015 at 12:12 am
Yeah we traded talib for 4th and he’s been good and n the playoffs ever since. Blount hasn’t been n trouble then again he’s playing in the playoffs too. Williams was n buffalo and they were closer to the playoffs than we r. And I don’t even know why we signed wright he was on detroits terrible secondary Dom should have known better
January 7th, 2015 at 12:15 am
Humans who inflict violence on others for personal gain or entertainment are Thugs regardless of race. I am stating facts and not being holier than though. You have a brain so use it. How about looking up the word thug in Wikipedia. I bet it does not say anything about skin color. Quit being a hater. Or just keep hating. Do you dude.
January 7th, 2015 at 12:17 am
@soggy
Exactly like I thought. Do not “so callled” call someone out and not expect me to . respond. So just keep it light and about football
January 7th, 2015 at 12:21 am
@ iamkingsu, everybody can see what is written here, Where did I call you out? I just said MM can throw..
January 7th, 2015 at 12:22 am
@rayjay1120
Definition and intent when you use a word are 2 seperate things. Lets get back to football though
January 7th, 2015 at 12:26 am
@greg I really have to question those articles as they are from guys that keep posting pro Winston articles. Funny because the writer I keep getting that info from only posts pro Winston articles and ones that down Mariota. Funny but I think other national outlets would have posted that info, I cannot find it only finding these types of articles from guys aligned with FSU. When I hear it nationally and
January 7th, 2015 at 12:27 am
From a reputable source I will believe it. I have not even seen Joe mention it.
January 7th, 2015 at 12:27 am
I am cool with keeping it about Football. But to answer the question. No I do not think Winston or Roethlesberger are thugs. I do think they have both made some poor choices though. Peace.
January 7th, 2015 at 12:35 am
Joe posted article that said bucs were high on hundley a while back and the one was by Gil Arica the bucs writer from scout. He said lovie told him he was extremely impressed by the NFL type throws winston made at the rose bowl
January 7th, 2015 at 12:35 am
@@iamkingsu, I missed your racist comment about being black, Now I get it,
January 7th, 2015 at 12:39 am
Like I said local guys that support local players. Gil Garcia also said Winston would say he was going back to school today and also said Koetter was the bucs pick for offensive coordinator. So im not exactly sold on his sources. Also I haven’t heard Joe run with the Lovie like Winston news. And you know Joe would have done a Jameis watch on it the minute he caught wind of it.
January 7th, 2015 at 12:40 am
I would be shocked, SHOCKED if the bucs didnt draft Mariota. Personally I think Winston is the better QB, maybe not the better person, but definitely the better QB. You take away all of Winston’s off the field issues and he’s the unanimous number 1 pick in the draft. Still think we should take Winston but the pick is going to be Mariota. Dont necessarily agree with it, but Ill be rooting for Mariota all the same.
January 7th, 2015 at 1:02 am
@soggy cool I’m off of that topic though
January 7th, 2015 at 1:08 am
@iamkingsu, Me Too..Peace man..
January 7th, 2015 at 1:09 am
@everybody
Off topic I’m not trying to tell anyone what to do but can you’ll go to NFL.com and vote mike Evans ROY? No one outside of bucs fans is going to do so. So lets give national media a reason to talk about the bucs this off-season
January 7th, 2015 at 1:15 am
Nybucsfan Says:
January 6th, 2015 at 11:09 pm
I have never seen Brady, Manning or Rivers in a fight with the coach on the sidelines.
_____________________________________________________________
http://youtu.be/Uu9TKEKia9s
Now you have.
January 7th, 2015 at 1:20 am
Nybucsfan Says:
January 6th, 2015 at 11:09 pm
I have never seen Brady, Manning or Rivers in a fight with the coach on the sidelines.
______________________________________________________________
You must’ve missed Brady’s blowout with Bill O’Brien. Being pro-Mariota and anti-Jameis is fine, but the things you in particular say to justify your argument are quite comical.
January 7th, 2015 at 3:53 am
Mariota’s numbers are largely inflated by Yards after catch.
so please look it up. Also 60% of Oregon’s pass plays are a type of screen plays.
other 30% are based off play action.
if it works great.
but have any1 really looked at the “running QB’s” in the nfl….
RG3 Bust, Vick never finished a full season, Cam average, Crappernic got the SB but looked like crap this season …. pun intended.
I wish the bucs would every pick this up coming draft for Luck but I will settle for Jamie’s
Bcuz he’s “Luck” like. Also style of play should keep him healthy for a full season behind our GARBAGE OLINE. just my view on the 2.
January 7th, 2015 at 3:57 am
Sorry for misspellings^^^^^^
few to many beers/shots
Drink problem thanks to Team Glazer
January 7th, 2015 at 5:28 am
Bucs fans who happen to be gator fans need to check themselves.
Warrick Dunn was a Buc, Derrick Brooks was a Buc, Warren Sapp was a Buc, Brad Johnson was a Buc. —- Reidel Anthony and Jacquez Green were Bucs too. Erict Rhett was a Buc.
Damn it people, the best years the Bucs ever had were “based” around the in-state rivalries.
As a Nole fan, draft Jameis, he’s really fucking good!
January 7th, 2015 at 5:30 am
The bottom line is really no one knows for sure who will ultimately be better, Winston or Mariota. Winston’s style of play seems NFL ready but if Mariota can convert his style of play to the NFL he might be the smarter pick. Just a word of caution though too much of a good thing might end up not being a good thing. A 2-14 team is very irritating to be part of. Can Winston’s passion be appropriately contained and positively expressed or will he have a melt down on the field or on the sidelines where either Lovie, or the league may end up suspending him? Once again if Winston can grow in this area, he might best be our pick. If not the talented milder mannered Mariota would be the better choice.
January 7th, 2015 at 7:22 am
Too much of a distraction and would undermine whatever discipline is on the team. What happens when he continues with his antics? Bench him? Does he look like the type that would accept being benched and not throw some sort of a tantrum? The guy is a spoiled brat and will cause problems wherever he goes.
January 7th, 2015 at 7:57 am
iamkingsu Says
“less thuggish” smdh. You’ll are so sad. Winston is thuggish because he’s black right?? Smh”
No. He’s thuggish because he IS THUGGISH.
Quit being racist.
January 7th, 2015 at 8:40 am
Lol NYbuc you tried in your post above but you still missed two periods. Sorry but when you don’t understand basic grammar it is hard to take you seriously. No offense.
January 7th, 2015 at 8:50 am
I believe Mccown started over Glennon because his escapability from a collapsing pocket.Unfortunately he turned the ball over under pressure too much.Winston’s fumble was reminiscent of some of Mccown turnovers.
The bucs gave up 49 sacks last year.Whatever QB we pick will be under
siege. It will be difficult for a pure pocket passer to succeed over the next
couple of years while O line is rebuilt.
January 7th, 2015 at 8:51 am
We get it there are plenty of Jameis and Mariota fans. They’re both good, they both have some concerns. But can we please stop the Andrew Luck comparisons? I’d be happy enough if we draft either but neither one of these guys is on Luck’s level. Luck had the best of what both of these guys bring coming out of college: Accuracy, Speed, Arm-strength, quick release, pro-style experience, no off-field issues, winner.
Mariota will work if we have a running game and use play-action and a few read option plays, I like what they do with Dalton in Cinci, I think a system like that would work well for him. He doesn’t have to run often, or in to traffic, but having that threat there is a nightmare for defenses. There is some concern that he hasn’t really worked under center and he doesn’t really have to throw in to tight windows often, but why throw in to tight windows if you have an open receiver? Quick release, good at avoiding the rush and damn good throwing on the run. He throws a lot of bubble screens but that is a pretty common play in the NFL. My biggest concern with him would be if we have an OC that wants to keep him in a standard pocket, he needs to be running a lot of bootleg, play-action and spread/shotgun plays. I also think Mariota would bring a more exciting style of offense to TB, something we’ve never really had before.
Jameis has a bit more toughness and grit I think, better arm strength and a style that would fit most offenses a bit more seamlessly. I like the “dog” in him too, I think the guys in the locker room would appreciate his attitude/edge, even though there are some off-field concerns. He does tend to take a bit too long in the pocket and his delivery is a concern to me, that long backward wind up is a sack fumble in waiting. People thought they could teach Tebow to throw with a quicker motion too, but that doesn’t change easily. I also have a bit of concern with his regression this season, the dramatically increased INT’s and lower completion % are a concern for me, I also watched the game vs FL and he looked pretty damned awful. Mariota’s stats have improved across the board each year, Jameis had a great freshman year and fell off quite a bit this year, that’s a red flag for me. It tells me either the off-field drama got to him, or he just isn’t as good as he looked in year one. I also have a daughter and it’s hard to root for a guy who stood on a table and said what he said. I won’t go in to the rape allegations because it hasn’t been proven.
January 7th, 2015 at 9:05 am
DB55 Says:
January 6th, 2015 at 10:06 pm
Rather have a qb that fights on the field than cries in the press conference. Just saying.
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I finally agree with something you said.
I’d rather have a fiery player that truly cares than a guy that looks like he took 10 sleeping pills like Mariota. Granted, Mariota had little reason to be upset and the majority of the mistakes made in that game were his own, but his rep is that of being very quiet.
January 7th, 2015 at 9:28 am
I am sorry race has ever been injected into the conversation about Jameis.
Newsflash. Marcus Mariota is NOT white.
I’ll concede that “thug” has become a loaded word similar to “boy”. It HAS been used by many many in a racist manner. Doesn’t mean everybody who has used it means anything offensive. When Howard Cosell said look at that little “monkey” run he was able to avoid getting slayed by the PC police for his use of “monkey” because his past reputation, his treatment of black athletes long before other broadcasters gave him credibility as not being a racist.
I do not accuse anybody who uses “thug” as being a racist. I would explain to anybody who cares however that if you use that word it has not developed “racist” connotations. Our language is living and growing and changes. We may not like all the changes…but they exist. Gay meant something totally different when I was in grade school. Boy is a loaded word.
Just sayin’ that “thug” has become a loaded word and code. Probably be more effective to describe Jameis with more accurate terms…like immature, self centered, and simply ignorant.
I do not believe that Jameis race has anything to do with his behavior. I also do not believe that Jameis race is primarily driving this negativity. Yes there are always a few racists but this is just Johnny Football the sequel. Many people simply do not relate that well to self centered punks.
Which brings up another question. PUNK is still a non racial term right?
January 7th, 2015 at 9:29 am
Oops typo…thug HAS developed racist connotations.
January 7th, 2015 at 10:01 am
I think Winston should stay another year and work on his QB mechanics. He also needs to work on his off field issues. However, he has been out of trouble since he was suspended for a game. If he works on his mechanics he will be even better next year. He can come out this year, but he will still have to work on those mechanics. I would rather he work on his mechanics in college than on our team. Problem is our QB coach sux. Other problem, we don’t have an OC yet, which in turn could give us a new QB coach. So I guess I will hold that opinion until things change at the coaching level. However, I’m still in favor of Mariota over Winston at this point.
January 7th, 2015 at 10:02 am
This is also from your article Joe.
“”The buzz meter on (Winston) will be gigantic. It’s one of those deals where you might get a guy who is immature. But everybody who is going to think about drafting him better have people talking to psychologists and so forth to make an educated evaluation.”
And that has far more to do with the other allegations that have dogged Winston during his time in Tallahassee.
“It’s a small piece of the evaluation,” Senior Bowl executive director and former Cleveland Browns general manager Phil Savage said in a text. “They (Winston and Fisher) go at it like that every day in practice and games.
“(Winston’s) immaturity off the field and lack of judgment in social settings are more troublesome.”
January 7th, 2015 at 10:19 am
Okay, I tried typing this 3 times on my new tablet, but the new auto refresh function in the android browsers keeps erasing it every time. So now I’m on my laptop (rant over)
Leading up to the Rose Bowl, during the week prior, I watched three games of Winston and three games of Mariota. While watching those games, I took notes, areas of concern for each quarterback.
I also determined to be objective going into the Rose Bowl, not to hold off the field issues against Winston. In fact, check all my previous posts, early on they were a concern (month ago), but in the last month I have not really mentioned those issues much, if at all.
So here is my evaluation.
Winston
Going into the Rose Bowl, I was watching for certain things from Winston. I had concerns about his wind up, his posture while passing, his pocket presence, his progressions, speed of release and leadership. Also, I wanted to evaluate the offense, see if it was truly NFL ready.
Wind up – It’s not an illusion. He isn’t quite as bad as Leftwich or Tebow, but he’s alarmingly close. Given his baseball background, I believe this is the contributing factor. I also have my doubts that it can be de-programed since he has it in both sports.
Posture – He places his weight improperly while passing the ball. This was consistently the case throughout the 4 games (3+Rose Bowl)
Pocket Presence & Release Speed – Winston holds onto the ball too long because he is very slow going through progressions. Watch him closely. He does not do it by instinct, and he rarely reacts quickly. His progressions are almost forced. This is alarming to me, because in the NFL, he will not have the time he has in college. Expect a lot of sacks and fumbles. He’s a statue in the pocket as well. Bad instincts for moving around.
Stares Down Targets – Winston consistently stared down his targets. Every play. Not once did he fool the defense with his eyes. Yes, he would stare, glance once to another target and then stare back at his WR.
Leadership – Okay, this is a big one. I was hoping he would lose the Rose Bowl because he was undefeated. No one had ever seen how he handled the adversity of losing, and I wanted to see how he did. Being undefeated is well and good, but that doesn’t happen in the NFL. What I saw was alarming. He consistently acted like a child, pointing fingers and screaming at his teammates. He blamed EVERYTHING on them. Even if it was their fault, which was the case at times, that is not leadership and we all know it. He screamed at his coach. Yes, it is claimed that happens all the time. That doesn’t make me feel better. In fact, it raises more red flags.
When he finally got himself under control, he gathered his offense and tried to give them a pep talk, but it was too little too late. You could tell by their expressions that he had alienated them with his behavior. That’s what we can expect if he comes to Tampa.
The Offense – Not as NFL style as people claim. There were often 4 WRs on the line. We rarely, if ever, see that in the NFL. I suspect this is because of his weakness in the pocket and scrambling. He cannot buy time, so they have to give him as many options as possible.
Mariota
After watching three games, I went into the Rose Bowl watching for several things. I wanted to see him under center. I wanted to see if his pocket presence was a fluke from the other games, because it seemed better than I’d heard. Progressions. I wanted to watch his accuracy on short, medium and long passes. I wanted to watch how he scrambled left (blind side). Would he throw on the run well? And Leadership.
Under Center – I did not see him under center once during the 4 games (3+Rose bowl). This is an area of concern, especially if we keep EDS as center, because EDS often botches long snaps. There is no sugar coating this fault. We don’t know if he will adjust to being under center because we have not witnessed it. Neither do we know that he will not adjust. It’s pure guessing.
Pocket Presence & Release – Throughout all 4 games, he remained mobile in the pocket. More than that. He had good instincts as to where to move in the pocket most of the time. He did not have a “run first” attitude like people have claimed. In fact, this was not the case in any of the 4 games. I suspect people pointing at “run first” have not done their research. He has a short, high release. This is a good thing mostly. He could get a little more range if he needed to by lengthening the occasional wind up slightly (not as much as Winston).
Progressions – Mariota detractors claim he does not go through his progressions. This is not what I witnessed in the 4 games. I saw him instinctively go through them very, very quickly. This, I believe, is a bi-product of the Spread Offense. Instead of having a set target, he has several options on each play. To me, this would play into the new NFL Offenses…the ones that are fast-paced. We heard Fast-paced coming into the last season, but it never materialized. With Mariota it would.
Accuracy – He plants his feet properly and he throws. there were a couple floaters that could have been picked off by a pro, but for the most part he was very accurate. What detractors pointed to as inaccurate was mostly ball placement to reduce risk of interceptions. He laid the ball right where it needed to be, consistently. Not every time, but consistently. This points to an instinct that many college QBs do not have. Winston has shown no sign of it. I saw Winston drop the ball right in the prime pick area several times throughout each of the 4 games. Mariota did not go deep much. I think he has the arm, but the accuracy was 50-50 throughout the 4 games on deep passes. Short to Medium were mostly spot on.
Scramble Left & Throwing on the Run – Out of 4 games, I saw him scramble left maybe 7 times. Only 1 or 2 during the Rose Bowl. Of the 7, he scrambled once, through the ball away twice, had one incompletion and the rest were completions (3). I think that’s reasonable because he made 3 of 4 attempts. It may not be his strength, but he can grow into it. Scrambling to the right and throwing on the run Mariota was deadly accurate…even across the field.
Comments
After objectively watching 4 games of each, I came away liking Mariota. I don’t usually watch college ball (boring; hate the rule differences), so I really did not have a bias. I will say this…I was bored watching Winston more often than I was watching Mariota.
Winston looks like Sean Kings younger brother, from the face to the gut. Which also is another similarity to Byron Leftwich.
Mariota has an incredible hand off. One thing that has bugged me of late (and winston is also guilty of this) is quarterbacks not “selling” the fake hand off. Mariota sells every play. The defense honestly could not tell who had the ball. Heck, he fooled me several times. To me, if you are going to fake a hand off, you need to fake the fake just as well. Do it consistently as though you are selling it or you will not fool anyone. Mariota excels at this.
So I’m now favoring Mariota, and these are the reasons why. Simply put, Winston is a bill of goods that is deceptive. Mariota, you know what you get and the deception is that he’s better than advertised at his supposed weaknesses.
January 7th, 2015 at 10:30 am
Skyline
Agree completely. Another year in school would be great for Jameis on many levels. Yes he could improve his delivery. He could cut down on his interceptions. FSU will be LOADED with stud athletes next year so he’s assured of playing for a good team. That’s all on the field.
Off the field it could be huge and it might make Jameis actually seem like what his proponents are suggesting. He’s just an immature kid who has made a series of bad decisions.
The sexual allegations obviously suck a lot of the oxygen of the debate. But put that aside. What bothers me the most about Jameis is that I had to use the word “series”. I’m almost more alarmed that after all he’d been through with the allegations he was too stupid to keep his nose clean. I get the crab legs. It was an understanding between FSU players and suckup Publix jock sniffing managers. That’s common. I get how a kid can party and make a sexual mistake and perhaps be taken advantage of by a gold digger. I could get by all that.
But after all that, in an era of cellphone video of EVERYTHING…what kind of cement head would get up in public and scream obscenities about fing a girl in the pssy?
No it’s not that the screaming of obscenities by itself would be such a big deal, but coming when it down right in the heat of investigations about sexual misconduct makes me wonder WTF is between Jameis ears other than cement.
January 7th, 2015 at 10:33 am
Thanks again tampabaybucfan…I love it every time Shaun King is referenced.
Jameis is junk…Mariota is mediocre.
January 7th, 2015 at 10:37 am
@Bonzai,
Agree on Winston’s pocket presence, staring down receivers, and throwing mechanics. Have state that before. Also, I agree with the yelling at players and such, however, I have seen him on several occasions talking to his player after a mistake when walking off the field or taking the blame for throws that he overthrew or underthrew. He doesn’t say it, but he would look at the receiver and then tap his chest taking the fault for it.
For Mariota I agree on several points especially the progression reading and not being a run first QB. The fact that Oregon is usually snapping the ball at or before 10 seconds really doesn’t give him time to read a defense, but he does it after the snap and adjusts from there. I think he has the capability to read a defense pre-snap, but haven’t seen much of it as the play comes from the sideline. As for under center he has been practicing that in the off season and during the season after practice. Will be interesting to see him at the combine to see how it translates. My knock on Mariota is that sometimes he throws across his body. He makes it work a majority of the time, but sometimes it does cause him to sail the ball or float it up there. I did not like some of the floaters he threw in the Rose bowl game, but not sure if he was trying to put touch on it or not. He does have a quick release and some zip on it. I think he will improve more with a good QB coach in the NFL.
January 7th, 2015 at 10:40 am
@BucBonzai
The best post I have read on this topic. Sorry Joe but yes better than yours as well.
You actually took the time to do the research and paid attention. I’ve only seen highlights and the Rose Bowl when it comes to Mariota. I’ve also been prejudiced by the fact that Jim Mora and others keep comparing Mariota to a faster Aaron Rodgers and so that was planted in my mind and I’m a HUGE Rodgers fan.
And so when I watched I saw exactly what you said…
He had good instincts as to where to move in the pocket most of the time. He did not have a “run first” attitude like people have claimed.
He moves gracefully and effortlessly and yes he does seem to have that sixth sense that QB’s have along with the ability to keep eyes down the field even under pressure and on the run. And so to me he looked like…Aaron Rodgers.
All QB selections are a crap shoot. All investments have risk. The efforts of all good investors is to maximize return while minimizing risk. Both of these young QB’s show some promise but one also brings unneeded risk. Why take the chance? He’s not THAT good!