Jameis Watch: “Coddled Quarterback”
January 12th, 2015
Crab-legs-stealing, BB-gun-shooting, obscenity-hollering, Heisman-Trophy-winning, former national champion Jameis Winston, the pride of Florida State University, continues to look like a much better quarterback prospect than Mike Glennon and Josh McCown.
It’s Joe’s daily nugget on the Jameis Watch, celebrating the best quarterback to wear No. 5 ever in the state of Florida.
Joe’s thanking his maker today that the Bucs have the No. 1 overall pick in the 2015 draft.
The difference between No. 1 and No. 2 is massive.
Don’t think so? Consider the chatter in Tennessee. Longtime columnist David Climer is pleading with the Titans to play a great game of pretend and convince the world they want Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota, so the team can trade down after the Bucs pick their preferred QB.
And at that point, they would need to put on their best poker face and fool everybody else at the table into believing they’re ready to go all-in on Winston.
With so many needs at so many positions, the Titans desperately want to secure more draft picks. To accomplish that, all they have to do is fool one team that truly covets Winston (Buffalo? Washington? Houston? The Jets?) into making a trade.
Maybe you think the Titans should bite the bullet and pick Winston, banking that his pocket presence and alpha-male leadership will turn him into the next big thing.
Good luck with that.
Winston is a coddled quarterback. And this franchise has some history — bad history — with coddled quarterbacks.
Joe takes issue with Climer saying Winston was “coddled.” Jiminy Christmas! Winston started as a redshirt freshman and completed 25-of-27 passes against Pittsburgh, hardly a slappy opening-day opponent. That launched Winston into the national spotlight, en route to a Heisman Trophy and a national championship.
“Coddled?” Really?
Keep in mind that before Winston’s redshirt freshman football season, he was busy playing baseball for Florida State as a true freshman, meeting the demands of two programs. And he was known for riding his bicycle to class.
It’s hard to make a case that Winston was coddled more than any other stud QB in the country.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:19 pm
He is coddled. FSU will do anything to protect him; he can do no wrong.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:22 pm
Well Joe certainly coddles Jameis
January 12th, 2015 at 1:25 pm
Coddled or not Winston should be our pick at number one.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:26 pm
Jesus. Joe if you don’t think Winston isn’t coddled, I don’t think you know what the word means.
Dude has been probably the most coddled player in all of sports so far in his career.
Do not want. I wonder if the glazers are going to hire a full-time babysitter for jameis Winston next year and sign them to a contract so he doesn’t do something stupid.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:30 pm
The word he was looking for is “enabled”……Winston’s bad behavior came as a result of Jimbo looking past bad deportment and that’s expected. Winston earned him a fat raise…..
If a non-starter was doing some of the Jameis “stuff” he would probably have been disciplined more or perhaps even dismissed from the team.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:37 pm
Coddled, “to treat indulgently, to baby.” Sure seems to me that this has been the approach of Winston’s coach from day 1. A pro coaching staff will make demands on him and make him accountable. Let’s be honest, it’s just as difficult to assess whether he’s got sufficient character and judgment to make it as a PROFESSIONAL as it is to assess Marcus’s adjustment to a pro set offense. It’s a wash. Take the quarterback with 4 interceptions over 1,000+ throws. Don’t be short sighted and impatient. That’s what cost the Buccaneers Steve Young, the only Pro Bowl, Hall of Fame quarterback ever to wear a Buccaneers’ uniform. A lot of excuses have been made for Winston’s performance in the Rose Bowl. But just look at the QBR ratings in that game: Mariota 89-Winston 49.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:40 pm
Let’s see.
High profile, long drawn-out, rape allegation. Check.
Shoplifting arrest. Check.
Standing on a table and shouting obscenities. Check.
Sounds like the new face of the NFL to me. Goodell must be salivating. And to think he could be wearing a Bucs uni.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:41 pm
He was “Coddled” in the fact that he would have been arrested a couple of times if he weren’t the QB at FSU.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:41 pm
Only 100 more Jameis articles to go! Can’t wait for Jameis the pop warner years, when young Bobby Bowden saw him throw 50 yards!
January 12th, 2015 at 1:42 pm
LOL………….Joe is taking it on the proverbial chin for this humdinger
January 12th, 2015 at 1:43 pm
buddah Says:
But just look at the QBR ratings in that game: Mariota 89-Winston 49.
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You’re right, Winston it is.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:43 pm
Lol Carl
January 12th, 2015 at 1:43 pm
just say no to the rapist
January 12th, 2015 at 1:44 pm
The kid was suspended for uttering a naughty word. Is that coddled?
He’s been drug through the mud for having the nerve to take the wrong girl home. Is that coddled?
He was suspended for the remainder of the baseball season for walking out of Publix with $20 of merchandise. Is that coddled?
He had his coach threaten to bench him in front of the entire nation during the most important game of his life. Is that coddled?
January 12th, 2015 at 1:44 pm
Hey Casual Observer you forgot shooting bb guns/vandalism.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:45 pm
gatrbuc, what exactly should he have been arrested for?
January 12th, 2015 at 1:47 pm
Creamsickle you need to just start working for Joe.
You Know for a fact that he would have been arrested for the BBgun/vandalism if he werent Famous Jameis and Im sure the Rape investigation would have taken place quicker and with more outside sources if he weren’t Jameis.
If you think that there is ANY way possible that you can make me believe that a guy who stands up in the middle of the Cafeteria and yells what he did in the MIDST of a Rape investigation is the guy I want to get behind then you are mistaken
January 12th, 2015 at 1:50 pm
You forgot the claims that will come out …
after Jameis has money
January 12th, 2015 at 1:51 pm
Not the first time I have read he was coddled. The question has also been brought up “how will he do without Jimbo”. I guess we will find out next year if he is a bust or not.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:51 pm
gatrbuc, he should have been arrested for a bb gun fight? Are you freaking serious? First of all, you need to get your facts straight…there were plenty of kids involved in that bb gun fight and not a single one was arrested. Only one of them was named Jameis Winston.
I’ll just take your post as an admission that you were lying when you said Jameis should have been arrested
January 12th, 2015 at 1:52 pm
He was handcuffed, but they never said he was arrested for the BB gun incident.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:52 pm
If you look in the kid’s history he constantly had to move around the state of Alabama because ” trouble followed him”. I like his skill set but I see too much potential for trouble.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:53 pm
Dude you mean to tell me that YOU and I can go out and cause 4200 dollars worth of damage and NOT Get Arrested????? Where the F do you live?
January 12th, 2015 at 1:55 pm
Lovie, Licht and the Glazers all know that the vast majority of Bucs fans do not want Winston to be drafted here. When you have the #1 pick in the draft you have to be 100% positive that this is your guy without any concerns, reservations, worries or variables, and they just can’t feel that way about Winston. With the #1 pick you just can’t “roll the dice” and take a chance. It sets your franchise back another 5 years if you miss
January 12th, 2015 at 1:55 pm
I live in one of the most Gun friendly states in the country in Montana but I got a $250 citation for letting my son fire a bb gun into a huge dirt mound inside the city limits. Take your dam rose colored glasses off man
The guy is a head case. He has entitlement issues and problem with authority. Those things dont typically get better with new found wealth
January 12th, 2015 at 1:56 pm
There is just one thing that keeps popping up in my head when I read an article about Winston and baseball, and that thing is Jason Licht saying we want players who eat breathe and live football. To me that’s a damning statement towards Winston. No way in hell Licht takes a guy number one that isn’t quite sure if he loves baseball or football more.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:56 pm
Some of you guys are clueless. All sport stars/famous actors/musicians are coddled. Get a clue please!!!
January 12th, 2015 at 1:57 pm
He was suspended for standing on the table this year, for a huge game. That’s consequence. Anyhow, all star athletes are coddled by the logic of this article. It’s not an FSU thing, it’s an athletics thing.
January 12th, 2015 at 1:57 pm
Are you going to post any Jameis or Mariota articles pointing out the dreadful track record of Heisman winning QBs?
January 12th, 2015 at 2:01 pm
Heck no bucrightoff. It is going to be a Jameis lovefest up in this biotch for the next four months
January 12th, 2015 at 2:02 pm
Just like it was a Johnny part timer love fest last yr
January 12th, 2015 at 2:03 pm
gatrbuc, it’s obviously just the UF education showing itself here so I’ll forgive but just as an FYI:
A citation is not the same as an arrest.
You also need to start being honest about what this incident was. It was him and a handful of his friends having a bb gun fight and some of the bb’s broke windows.
You make it sound like Jameis dressed in all black, said to himself “eff the world” and started shooting gas tanks hoping they would explode.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:08 pm
Jimbo, over the last 2 years has called in Bo Jackson, Herschel Walker and Charlie Ward to mentor Winston and they each said that he was hopeless and they could do nothing with him. Not just immaturity, also bad character
January 12th, 2015 at 2:08 pm
Hey Creamsicle. I could buy and sell you a few times with my UF education so why dont you just sit your little sporty self down.
The citation was for shooting pellets into a worthless mound of dirt
If I were to have caused any property damage I would be arrested and you would too. He wasnt
Why is that so hard for your small brain to comprehend
January 12th, 2015 at 2:09 pm
Funniest article you’ve written yet Joe, what’s next, will he be knighted or will he become a saint. He will likely be a god when this is over because there’s months before the draft.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:10 pm
You would probably stand up and yell F her in the P in the middle of your rape investigation too
smh
January 12th, 2015 at 2:10 pm
Heisman trophy has nothing to do with NFL performance from a forecasting perspective. It’s a really silly argument that keeps getting brought up for some reason. Mariota or Winston won’t get drafted because they won the Heisman, they’ll get drafted because they’re good football players.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:12 pm
Creamsickle….I can’t wait until the Buc’s pick him so you can get your daughter all liquored up and send her out on a date with that animal. The fact that the idiot known as the guy doing Winston’s hearing stated “it was a he said, she said event.” Basically, Winston and the two animals who video taped the event all refused to answer ANY questions, destroyed the evidence (video) that would have proven she was consenting, and basically were shield by every North of Tampa for all crimes committed while at FSU!
If the Rapist Winston truly was innocent, do you really think they would have destroyed the video tape of the attack? All he had to do was show it to the Prosecutor and he could be proclaimed innocent. There is a massive difference between FSU covering it up, Tallahassee PD refusing to investigate for two years, major violations of NCAA & Tilte IX rules and Winston being proclaimed innocent.
Jimbo Fisher simply conspired for 2 years with FSU and TPD to string out the ordeal until Winston’s 3 years in college were up. Let me know how your daughter makes out on that date!
January 12th, 2015 at 2:13 pm
I have a question for Joe “get off my Mic wire”,
If the bucs draft winston are you still going to calling him a Crab-legs-stealing, BB-gun-shooting, obscenity-hollering, Heisman-Trophy-winning, former national champion or are you going to get rid of this lame intro thing?
January 12th, 2015 at 2:15 pm
Nice Jo mama
January 12th, 2015 at 2:18 pm
Jameis will settle down once he has a little money…..
January 12th, 2015 at 2:18 pm
He may be coddled in Tallahassee but anyone that can continue to win, when seemingly the whole world is against you, is pretty damn tough. I’ll take that coddled QB all day every day and twice on Sundays.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:19 pm
We can only hope Joe has better luck picking women than college QB’s
January 12th, 2015 at 2:21 pm
“Jameis will settle down once he has a little money”
LOL
he’ll settle down when he gets jail time
January 12th, 2015 at 2:22 pm
Jameis is just your typical self entitled millennial who thinks hes above the rules. His off field behavior confirms this. No NFL team is going to coddle him the way FSU has. Karma will get him. Unless he matures ten fold between now and week one its all going to come crashing down on him. It always does.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:26 pm
Winston will be the MVP of the Florida Prison League. Maybe they will remake the “Longest Yard” series and call it “The Longest Yard – The Winston Years”
January 12th, 2015 at 2:34 pm
@Patrick I don’t know if you are being misunderstood in your post or just being downright dishonest. Bo Jackson said he was done helping Winston. Walker has no connection and only stated that he would not give Winston his vote. Charlie Ward said he was frustrated but only because Winston keeps doing dumb stuff. Nowhere did he say Winston was hopeless. He actually said Winston was “a good dude” with a “good heart”. If you are going to quote people, use what they said and be accurate so other people don’t start spouting the same garbage.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:41 pm
Hats off to Joe for printing a negative (sort of) report on Winston……Thought this was going to be about Mariota because there was a news report that the Oregon “Mellennials” were treated differently by their coaches….not as much screaming….
January 12th, 2015 at 2:41 pm
JFat Says:
January 12th, 2015 at 2:10 pm
Heisman trophy has nothing to do with NFL performance from a forecasting perspective. It’s a really silly argument that keeps getting brought up for some reason. Mariota or Winston won’t get drafted because they won the Heisman, they’ll get drafted because they’re good football players.
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What’s silly about it? Did you know Heisman winning QBs have 4 playoff wins in the last 30 years? And one of those is Tebow playing an unprecedented 9 men in the box, and another is Cam against the worst QB to ever play playoff football in Lindley. And it’s not a small sample, 30 years is a while. For whatever reason, guys who win the Heisman do not perform anywhere close to an elite level in the NFL.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:42 pm
@Luther
Just saying verbatum what I heard from Chris Landry a while back. I guess you are more informed than he is
January 12th, 2015 at 2:42 pm
Jameis Watch: tired and boring
January 12th, 2015 at 2:43 pm
“And at that point, they would need to put on their best poker face and fool everybody else at the table into believing they’re ready to go all-in on Winston.”
Which would mean Climer believes the Bucs will take Mariota at #1…..that would make at least two of us…..
January 12th, 2015 at 2:45 pm
FSU fans crack me up. Keep telling yourself rape is okay as long as its not proven. The comparison of Winston to Mariota is like comparing johnny Manziel to Russel Wilson.
@creamsicle
“He’s been drug through the mud for having the nerve to take the wrong girl home.” thats a priceless quote. “taking the wrong girl home” hahahahaha. Thats what you call it now….taking the wrong girl home.
Your honor I didn’t rape that woman right there I just “took the wrong girl home”
Judge “well, in that case, your dismissed”
January 12th, 2015 at 2:47 pm
“Mr. Patrick Says:
January 12th, 2015 at 2:42 pm
@Luther
Just saying verbatum what I heard from Chris Landry a while back. I guess you are more informed than he is”
Then Chris Landry is an idiot. How you described it is inaccurate on multiple levels.
Which is not surprising, considering how many people are lapping up and regurgitating unconfirmed media headlines without trying to confirm if any of it has a bit of truth.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:50 pm
“Jeff Says:
January 12th, 2015 at 2:45 pm
FSU fans crack me up. Keep telling yourself rape is okay as long as its not proven.”
Winston haters crack me up, because it’s like they have never seen women who falsely claim rape. Save your indignity for Brian Banks. Attitudes like yours is why he spent over 5 years in prison due to a liar.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:53 pm
Not really my business if he’s coddled. The point here is whether he is good or not. Same with Mariota.
If both are, then take Mariota, because he’s the better leader.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:57 pm
Joe did you even read the whole article?
“Winston has been protected by the Florida State administration in general and Seminoles coach Jimbo Fisher in particular. His off-field behavior is a red flag. Winston seems to think the rules don’t apply to him.
Beyond that, his second-half meltdown against Oregon in the Rose Bowl raised issues about how he might perform in the NFL when things get tough.”
That’s what he means by “coddled”. I’m not sure I understand your definition at all.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:58 pm
@Patrick I love listening to Landry mainly because I just like listening to anyone talk football, but he makes strange remarks sometimes. He is a scout and scouts make mistakes. Winston may be undraftable for some teams but we can’t afford to not pick him. We have sucked for a very long time and I just don’t think Mariota makes the throws needed in the NFL. I really like the kid a lot but I wouldn’t bet my job on him making it in the NFL.
It’s like picking a mutual fund, nothing is guaranteed but you certainly want to make your picks based on the performance markers that you have on hand. Mariota is like the Bond market, very reliable and safe. Winston is like a Growth Fund, risky but the return is so much higher.
January 12th, 2015 at 2:58 pm
Winston is 100% coddled, by facing almost no consequences for his laundry list of incidents.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:03 pm
Seems opinions range from Pro Bowl regular to another version future star of “the longest yard”, with a former FSU athlete, Burt Reynolds stepping aside from the part of “Paul Crewe”, Winston taking the real life role of a incarcerated star QB, and the rest of the team being made up of real life convicts.
The former would be great, but the later might nearly destroy the franchise.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:07 pm
bucrightoff Says:
January 12th, 2015 at 2:41 pm
Did you know Heisman winning QBs have 4 playoff wins in the last 30 years? And one of those is Tebow playing an unprecedented 9 men in the box, and another is Cam against the worst QB to ever play playoff football in Lindley. And it’s not a small sample, 30 years is a while. For whatever reason, guys who win the Heisman do not perform anywhere close to an elite level in the NFL.
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Here is a stat for you as well:
Since 1950, 27 quarterbacks have been selected as the Heisman Trophy winner. Of those 27, only 20 started at quarterback in at least one NFL game. Among those 20, only four quarterbacks have a winning record in the NFL (regular season). Robert Griffin III is the only Heisman winner with a career passer rating over 90 in the NFL (90.8). Since 1950, the combined NFL winning percentage for quarterbacks who won the Heisman Trophy is under .500 (480-501-4, .489).
Which Heisman Trophy winner had the most career passing yards in the NFL? Not Roger Staubach (fourth), Jim Plunkett (third) or Carson Palmer (second). It’s Vinny Testaverde, who had 46,233 passing yards — ninth-most in NFL history — over the course of 21 seasons.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:14 pm
love and done
Not a Winston hater dude. Wife went to FSU. But you guys are absolutely delusional about this kid. Oh, wait I forgot, he must be a great kid because he rides a bike to school and only stole $20 worth of food. You’re right, there is absolutely no pattern to his behavior, Im just a Winston hater right. We all have to be winston haters if we find his behavior ridiculous and unacceptable. Thats fantastic logic
January 12th, 2015 at 3:15 pm
Good stuff Skyline.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:17 pm
@Jeff
If you were a starand you were getting stuff for free, you would absolutely take it. hell I would to. Get off that high horse and come on down here with the rest of us.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:17 pm
^Those numbers are revolting. What is it that makes Heisman winning QBs so bad in the NFL? Certainly worth pondering (FSU pun!).
January 12th, 2015 at 3:20 pm
@Jeff,
You were specifically commenting on rape. I don’t think he raped anyone. Now it’s a “pattern”.
OK.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:22 pm
I hope that none of the people spewing this vitriol ever get accused of something publically, then having never convicted, have so many people continue to treat them as if they’ve been proved of wrong doing. The video probably was deleted because a year had gone by and it perfectly reasonable to do that, it’s at least as reasonable to assume that as it is anything else. Also, this didn’t become a story until Jaimes was a Heisman candidate because the girl and her lawyers didn’t contact the press for that entire time… If this terrible thing had happened to me or my loved ones, I wouldnt wait until a year later to contact the press. Maybe that’s just me though? Not saying that I know the truth, but all the people that have heard the facts of this case have decided not to charge him or arrest him. Theyre certainly more informed than we are.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:23 pm
COuch
High Horse? Ha! Dude, you just proved my point. Its sad that the kid doesn’t have the foresight and mental capacity to understand what was at stake for him. And to all us “haters” thats the most concerning part. This isn’t about me, never was never will be. Get a stronger argument besides “if everyone is doing it”
January 12th, 2015 at 3:27 pm
Winston was a phenom last year, but he looked only slightly above average this year. Mariota is the superstar QB in this draft.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:30 pm
Literally the only fan base that wants to draft Winston first is the Bucs, every other QB needy team’s fan base wants nothing to do with him..
January 12th, 2015 at 3:31 pm
@Jeff
Where in the world did I say “everyone is doing it” ? That doesn’t even make sense. Taking my words completely out of context.
I said YOU would do the same in his position (take free stuff, not stealing) and so would any one else. Read slower but yes I understand this is the most concerning part to you because on the field he is a winner and you can’t hate on him for that.
January 12th, 2015 at 3:40 pm
flmike, actually the only fan base that wants Winston is the FSU fan base.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:03 pm
@bucrightoff –
It’s silly because a trophy sits on a shelf. NFL QB’s who’ve won the Heisman aren’t at a disadvantage because of it. The award doesn’t make someone a worse NFL QB, it just means they had a really good year in college. They don’t have to play their NFL career with the trophy dangling from their neck.
The stats you are looking at are just a sub-set of the overall picture. MOST Quarterbacks that get drafted…don’t win playoff games, have short careers, sit on the bench. Playoff caliber QB’s are hard to come by in general, trying to pin it to a yearly award is …silly.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:04 pm
@flmike
Joe’s own poll showed that the vast majority of Bucs fans DO NOT want Winston to be drafted here. Which shows that the vast majority are smart
January 12th, 2015 at 4:31 pm
For all you Mariota fans, you need to go to draftbreakdown.com and pull up the tape for both QBs. After you watch that, then come back and tell me who you would draft. I saw a ton of bubble screens and shallow crossing throws and Mariota hit a ton of those. Throws over the middle is where he had lots of trouble. Say what you want about Winston, he consistently had to make those throws during the game.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:33 pm
Well our OC has sufficient ties to the Oregon staff to learn all about Marcus.
Hopefully he will light it up tonight.
You know it isn’t outside the realm of possibility that he might not declare if the Ducks were to lose the game.
He might be the type that would want to stay to finish the job.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:42 pm
Mariota has the type of character, values, intelligence, work ethic, and physical talent that L &L look for when adding guys to our team. Indeed, there are other talented guys in the draft, but none that excel in all areas of evaluation the way that Mariota does.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:44 pm
There is a huge possibility that Lovie, Licht and the Glazers are not totally sold on either one of these QB’s. That’s when things will get interesting
January 12th, 2015 at 4:45 pm
McCown is also a high character guy. I really like the guy, that doesn’t mean I want him at the helm. Separate personality from play on the field and look at the tape. Tape don’t lie, Winston is the better QB and it isn’t close.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:45 pm
Luther,
After watching this tape on Winston http://draftbreakdown.com/video/jameis-winston-vs-florida-2014/ I wouldn’t take him. His bad mechanics were exposed by Florida.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:54 pm
Don’t you think the posing in on this article & others prooves the point….the point that we just can’t take the gamble of drafting Winstion….and I doubt the Glazers do….
We will not be able to rest easy at any time…..much less the off-season….for fear of what may happen off the field with Winston.
I said before…..and, after 34 years with me, has become a huge Buc fan…..she said it will be like waiting for pap smear results if we draft Winston.
January 12th, 2015 at 4:57 pm
Go look at it again Skyline. Also look and Mariota’s games. I saw Winston throwing off his back foot when he had pressure in his face. He had lots of preassure all game and I saw mixed coverages and DBs peeling off man into zone. Yes, they mixed up a lot coverages but when he had a clean pocket, he made excellent throws. Again, I say that Mariota isn’t asked to make very many of those throws. We are all assuming that he will be able to do it since he is such a nice guy and works hard. Tebow is a nice guy and works hard, now his a terrible TV announcer to go along with being a terrible QB.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:02 pm
JFat Says:
January 12th, 2015 at 4:03 pm
@bucrightoff –
It’s silly because a trophy sits on a shelf. NFL QB’s who’ve won the Heisman aren’t at a disadvantage because of it. The award doesn’t make someone a worse NFL QB, it just means they had a really good year in college. They don’t have to play their NFL career with the trophy dangling from their neck.
The stats you are looking at are just a sub-set of the overall picture. MOST Quarterbacks that get drafted…don’t win playoff games, have short careers, sit on the bench. Playoff caliber QB’s are hard to come by in general, trying to pin it to a yearly award is …silly.
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Actually it’s not particularly hard to figure out why Heisman winners struggle more than other QBs in the NFL. Heisman winners are almost always coming from the best team or close to it; at this point it’s almost a default best player from the best team award. So these guys are basically used to playing on a team at least 3 levels above the average college team, one with few to no flaws and with a schedule that generally has 6-8 automatic wins on it.
But it doesn’t work like that in the NFL. There are no stacked teams or anything close; there are maybe 2-3 automatic wins in a season; and there are realistically only 3 levels of competition period as opposed to 6 or more in college. There is more adversity, more losing and less talent for these guys in almost every case. So these guys generally come from near perfect settings and then have to go into often the exact opposite setting. It’s not all that surprising why they struggle so much.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:19 pm
You guys are under the mistaken belief that the bucs are going to just accept the image of Jameis Winston as has been presented by the New York Times and BSPN.
They won’t, as they should not. They need to conduct a thorough review of the kid on their own, to find out what kind of character he actually has – from people who know him.
Totally hate a guy you have never met. Its ridiculous. Over college pranks.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:20 pm
As for the “BB Gun Fight”……to me, its not whether or not there should be jail time or a citation or even getting away with it…..
EXCUSE ME!!!! Is that not reckless behavior?…..I thought we had paint guns….video games etc….but BB Gun Fights? Can’t someone put out an eye?
Maybe I missed something here….is this what you do these days?
January 12th, 2015 at 5:25 pm
To say that Winston has been coddled while at FSU is a gross understatement. The authorities have thrown up a shield around Jameis to protect his alledged actions from being prosecuted. This is not the first time sports participation has trumped legal justice.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:26 pm
as is every Big Man on Campus QB at every major program. You could argue that Mariotta is “coddled” on account of not being entrusted by his coaches to run a big-boy offense that can translate to the NFL.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:27 pm
Luther,
Tebow is a nice guy and works hard, now his a terrible TV announcer to go along with being a terrible QB.
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Well, Tebow had bad throwing mechanics as well and the NFL types thought they could correct it. They couldn’t, which is why Tebow doesn’t play anymore. He should have never played QB and people knew that from the day he was being drafted. I thought he would have made a fine TE, but he was dead set on being a QB and it didn’t work out for him.
Winston has some bad mechanics when it comes to throwing. Analyst have said and fans have said it. It isn’t just one person out there saying Winston has problems throwing the ball or reading under neath coverages.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:27 pm
There were lots of BB gun fights when I grew up and I know a lot of guys that did it. Very stupid looking back on it but it happens. I’ve never had anyone shoot at me personally but I don’t bat an eye when I hear that guys play around like that, especially jocks.
Like Eric said, the Bucs should and will do a background check on him, probably more than I had for the Military and all of my jobs combined. If he is our draft pick, I will be extremely happy.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:28 pm
I used to be in BB gun fights, but I didn’t do it around buildings and I didn’t cause $4,200 in damage either.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:28 pm
Im ready or “MARIOTA” watch tonight. Took time off from work just to see him again we could “possibly” draft him. I wasnt impressed with him the 1st half against Fl St., but he seemed to calm down in the 2nd….still, too much running though that may only work his first 2-3 years in the NFL.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:28 pm
Of course I was in middle school at the time as well. So yeah.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:29 pm
“Winston’s throwing mechanics are sloppy. And that’s putting it nicely. His feet are sloppy which causes his entire lower body to be sloppy and also his entire upper body. He gets away with this because he has such a strong arm and is still consistently accurate. With some discipline in his mechanics, Winston could become an even better thrower and more consistently accurate with the football. When Winston misses he misses high, especially to his right. He has a tendency to drop his throwing elbow when throwing to his right and causes a lot of his balls to sail because his hand dips below the football at the release instead of staying “on top” of it. This happens less when he throws to the left because the motion of throwing to the left naturally slots his elbow in the right position and he’s less likely to let it sail.
Under pressure, Winston’s mechanics get even sloppier. He does a good job of moving within the pocket but it takes considerable effort to move his big frame around and he’s not as precise or subtle in his movements as he should be. Winston shows a strong ability to handle edge pressure, it’s just the pressure up the middle that tends to cause his decision making to implode.” –NFL Philosophy
“Winston can and often reads through a full progression and does so with good efficiency. He can determine his first read and come off it quickly if the defense shifts. He’s always aware of where his receivers should be and does a good job of moving his feet with his eyes so that he can pull the trigger and deliver the ball with quickness and accuracy. Despite all of that, Winston actually has the same issue with underneath linebackers that Mariota has. Sometimes he’ll be so focused on the routes that his receivers are running that a linebacker from across the field can sneak under a throw. This is something he has to improve on.” –NFL Philosophy
January 12th, 2015 at 5:30 pm
Skyline, Winston was still healing from a high ankle sprain he suffered in the Syracuse game. If you look at his socks you’ll notice they look different because he has a guard and an additional sock on his right foot. (the same foot he often avoids putting pressure on throughout that video)
He threw 12 of 19 INTs while playing injured. Call it an excuse if you choose to, but those are the facts.
If you want a better representation of his mechanics, watch him when he was healthy. He was hurt during the Syracuse game and the brace came off for the GT game.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:30 pm
Joe.
Are you gonna have a Marcus Mariota open thread tonight?
January 12th, 2015 at 5:30 pm
also, if “coddling” is an institutional act, how is it Jameis’ fault that others are insulating him from the consequences of his alleged actions? my favorite take thus far is that Jameis is guilty because the police botched the investigation. do you think Jameis called the station and said “hi this is Jameis Winston. you haven’t heard of me but i will lead your team to a national title next year. i had an incident with a young woman tonight, can you take care of that for me please?”
he didn’t have a say on whether an investigation that could potentially exonerate him (or incarcerate him) was handled in a manner acceptable to the accuser or the courts. so to say he is coddled because he was not punished for something he may not have done is a logical black hole.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:35 pm
BB gun battle. Oh the inhumanity of it all.
I used to have a sling shot. I guess I should go turn myself in.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:38 pm
Skyline Crew for Mariota or Winston Says:
January 12th, 2015 at 3:07 pm
bucrightoff Says:
January 12th, 2015 at 2:41 pm
Did you know Heisman winning QBs have 4 playoff wins in the last 30 years? And one of those is Tebow playing an unprecedented 9 men in the box, and another is Cam against the worst QB to ever play playoff football in Lindley. And it’s not a small sample, 30 years is a while. For whatever reason, guys who win the Heisman do not perform anywhere close to an elite level in the NFL.
***************
Here is a stat for you as well:
Since 1950, 27 quarterbacks have been selected as the Heisman Trophy winner. Of those 27, only 20 started at quarterback in at least one NFL game. Among those 20, only four quarterbacks have a winning record in the NFL (regular season). Robert Griffin III is the only Heisman winner with a career passer rating over 90 in the NFL (90.8). Since 1950, the combined NFL winning percentage for quarterbacks who won the Heisman Trophy is under .500 (480-501-4, .489).
Which Heisman Trophy winner had the most career passing yards in the NFL? Not Roger Staubach (fourth), Jim Plunkett (third) or Carson Palmer (second). It’s Vinny Testaverde, who had 46,233 passing yards — ninth-most in NFL history — over the course of 21 seasons.
———————
The Heisman thing is a curse… and if you believe in curses, not you, Skyline, I mean anybody, then you’re an idiot. It’s a statistical anomaly. You know, before 2009, the team that won the Super Bowl had never lost to the Buccaneers during the regular season. There are many reasons for anomalies like these. A large percentage of these statistical exceptions is because of WHERE a player gets drafted. It doesn’t matter who a dude is or what he can do, if he was drafted by the Browns of the 2000’s, or Bengals of the 90’s, or Jets…, or a few other teams that had horrible stretches of football, then there was no saving those teams.
Another reason for Heisman winners having limited success is that often times, Heisman winners are simply the most important player for a ridiculously good team. Ty Detmer, Gino Torretta, Charlie Ward, and Danny Wuerffel come to mind. Granted, Charlie Ward was really good, but many of the others were simply caretakers/point guards for exceptionally talented teams.
As for Mariota winning the Heisman, that doesn’t diminish his chances of being a great pro, what diminishes his chances of being a great pro is that more than 60% of his passes are thrown 9 yards or less beyond the LOS and that the run-spread offense of today is on par with the triple option wishbone attacks of the 70’s, 80’s and 90’s as far as developing QBs for the NFL.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:42 pm
@Skyline, this is from the same article – “Don’t let the numbers fool you. Winston is one of the best NFL quarterback prospects I’ve ever evaluated on the field.”
Read the whole thing, don’t just cherry pick. He certainly had some things to say about Winston that I thought was accurate but he had real concerns about Mariota as well.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:42 pm
Coddled? Are you kidding? ALL Division one football players are coddled. None more so than QB’s. This is hardly unique to FSU!
Marcus Mariota has also been coddled. That’s the point!!! it’s not being coddled it’s how you handle the coddling. Mariota has done so with grace and dignity and the realization that he has won the ovarian lottery…he recognizes his good fortune. Jameis not so much. When Derrick Brooks told Rick Stroud that he needed more time to consider the #1 pick and wouldn’t yet sign off on Jameis that spoke volumes to me.
This is not an FSU-UF thing. Wonder how Urban Meyer, one of the three greatest coaches in college football today feels about coddling Aaron Hernandez? How did that work out for Urban or Bill Belicheat.
BTW I’m not suggesting that Jameis will kill somebody or turn out like Hernandez. Simply that Jameis has done nothing that indicates he is aware of what it takes to be the “face of a franchise”. He may have brought a national title to FSU but he’s also tarnished the image of the school in the process.
Mariota will NOT do that.
But I’m cool with whatever Koetter and Lovie decide. Mariota..Jameis or Andrus Peat at LT or Williams for our lame edge rush or trade down for more picks.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:45 pm
It will be interesting tonight to see how Mariota does without some of his weapons….2 WRs & TE…..
I will be looking to see if he has to carry the offense by running more often….
I said this of the Orange Bowl & it goes for tonight…..we shouldn’t judge these two QBs on one, or in this case, two games….>Good or Bad, its their entire body of work coupled with their potential that should be the determining factor.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:47 pm
God I am so sick of all of you bitter (Gator/Cane) Winston Deniers.
I’m just tired of hearing your constant nonsense. Please, shut it.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:52 pm
Cane here…not much doubting Winstons on field abilty…HUGE questions investing the #1 overall pick due to his trail of character issues….
January 12th, 2015 at 5:54 pm
@Kalind on April 30th at about 15 minutes after the draft starts, you may be really sick. Get your Dramamine and castor oil ready because Winston will be the pick.
January 12th, 2015 at 5:56 pm
I did read it. However, some if you think he has no flaws. I posted bad thongs, but there were good things I posted as well. Such as his progression reading. Maybe you should read everything I posted instead of cherry-picking.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:00 pm
If we take Peat it would because we trades back to number 29. Or traded up. We might get him in the second.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:04 pm
Skyline
Can I get a link to the “bad thongs” now that what I call interesting reading. Lol
January 12th, 2015 at 6:20 pm
@Skyline
What mocks have you been reading? I’ve seen Peat as high as three and as Brandon pointed out most of them have him going in the top ten. Out of the first round would be a huge steal because next to QB’s and stud DT’s, OT’s are the hardest to find.
I’m just tired of hearing your constant nonsense. Please, shut it.
Kalind. One man’s nonsense is another’s wisdom in this debate. Get used to it. The reality is that statistically neither of these QB’s is a shoe in and in fact they both would be projects. But I get that we have to roll the dice sometimes.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:23 pm
Without an unfounded rape accusation who knows if we hear about any of this? The soda and BB gun stuff could have been reported before the rape story, but it wasn’t.
It has to make you wonder, doesn’t it? How much stuff happens and never gets reported. Nobody wanted to talk about BB’s and soda until the “big BS” broke, lol. Then it was a story.
Do you really think Jameis Winston is the first football player to quote crude comedy on campus? He’s the first one to be sold out by his fellow students on twitter, but that doesn’t sound like coddling to me.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:24 pm
I want Jameis to coddle me.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:27 pm
Be careful 87 or you might get what you wish. Although in fairness that is one accusation I haven’t heard hurled against Jameis. Are you suggesting he swings both ways? LOL
January 12th, 2015 at 6:28 pm
The Bucs will do their due diligence over the off season to determine who they feel is the best choice. We can argue and debate until the choice is made but it is futile. At the end of the day, it is the job of the staff to decide to go with Winston or Mariota. Heck, they may even trade down or pick a DE or OT 1st. All of this debating and ridiculing each other is not going to have any bearing on what the Bucs choose to do. This is the fun part of having the 1st pick. For everyone who takes the time to post informative nuggets, thanks. To those who get into pissing matches….well I guess that is at least entertaining. At this point in the debate as I have posted previously, I have no clue what they should do. Whatever they do needs to be epic though.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:32 pm
StPeteBucsFan …I’m suggesting I’ve suffered long enough as a Buc fan and need to be coddled by Jameis while I sit in the stands and watch him play.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:48 pm
Just jerking your chain a bit 87. 🙂
January 12th, 2015 at 6:49 pm
Stpete
“Are you suggesting he swings both ways? LOL”
I knew there was something about him that reminded me of Freeman.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:50 pm
Oh I forgot about the putting soda in the ketchup cup at Burger King.
Total menace to society.
January 12th, 2015 at 6:50 pm
Do you guys actually think that Lovie would start a rookie QB no matter who it is? No way
January 12th, 2015 at 7:02 pm
Stpete, I saw him in the 20s. If he moved up I didn’t see it. Of course those were before he declared.
January 12th, 2015 at 7:05 pm
Latest mock from SBNation has Peat at 17. So he moved up some, but not top 10.
January 12th, 2015 at 7:08 pm
@rayjay1122
Don’t you know that you are a buzz killer……spewing out rational thought to all of these rabid fans hungry for a fix?
Of course this decision will be made after unbelieveable Bucs due diligence….probably the most in Bucs history…..it will start with Koetter & end with the Glazers.
For all we know…Koetter came in and said…..”you guys have your QB if he is coached properly…..in the right scheme and protected well”.
That could have given them all they need to decide to trade down….maybe twice
….but that is purely speculation as is all of this!!!
January 12th, 2015 at 7:23 pm
Hey, will there be a gamewatch, open thread for Mariotta, our other potential #1 pick?
January 12th, 2015 at 7:23 pm
The Heisman Jinx is laughable. These are the same guys who would wager on a football game by calling a psychic. Roger Staubach and Jim Plunkett had reasonably good careers I would say and a Cam Newton is far from finished. And, of course, on the non-qb list would be Tony Dorsett, Marcus, Allen, and Tim Brown among others. How many non-Heisman QBs have been drafted early and not made it. Also, what’s the percentage of busts coached by FSU’s coach including when he was at LSU?
January 12th, 2015 at 7:32 pm
Heisman Jinx is stupid. Either you have 1st round grade or you don’t and guys like Tebow did not and should not have been in the 1st round.
January 12th, 2015 at 7:36 pm
Go Marcus.
January 12th, 2015 at 7:36 pm
@ Lurker
Where are you……Lurking?
January 12th, 2015 at 7:55 pm
Imagine the shock & disappointment if we here:
“With the first selection in the 2015 NFL Draft the Tampa Bay Buccaneers have traded with the New York Jets…the Jets have selected Marcus Mariota, Quarterback from Oregon.”
Just sayin!!!
Then we find out we get their 1st, 2nd & 4th this year and next year’s 1st & 3rd
January 12th, 2015 at 8:12 pm
Winston was at Lakewood Church today in Houston Texas. Had a pic taken with pastor Joel Osteen.
What a jerk……
January 12th, 2015 at 8:41 pm
Eric
You’re totally missing the point. Perception is reality. Jameis may be the kindest cuddly thing since a roll of Charmin but that’s no longer how people view him.
As for what the rest of us have done as young people..the rest of us didn’t have the guarantee of multimillion dollar contracts on the line..
You’d be far better trying to claim that Jameis has been chastised by ALL these mistakes and is ready to turn over a new leaf. People are willing to give a second chance it’s America. Of course in Jameis case it would be a 2nd..3rd and 4th chance.
Assume he was innocent of rape. I can buy that. I get the crab legs as a misunderstanding…the wrong Publix manager instead of the FSU jock sniffer..no biggie…AND I could get past the cursing of the “funny” internet hoax but NOT when you and by proxy your entire program are under the cloud of a rape investigation.
I was NEVER that damn dumb. If a girl had charge me with rape I certainly wouldn’t have shouted the crap he did in public. It’s just horrid judgement that scares us. He may be a good kid but he just doesn’t get it.
Did you read Stroud’s interview of Derrick Brooks. Brooks would not endorse Jameis claiming he needed more time for the decision. That speaks volumes to me.
January 12th, 2015 at 9:25 pm
Perception is almost never reality. That is the point
Perhaps people would have needed more time with brooks, since he was in trouble for taking free stuff at FSU.
The horrid crap is a repeat of a utube video. If you were 18/20 you would get it.
But let Brooks get to know him and I’d let the decision rest with him. I’m confident he would come to understand it is all a witch hunt.
January 12th, 2015 at 9:30 pm
” it is all a witch hunt.”
I give up Eric. LMAO
January 12th, 2015 at 9:52 pm
Isn’t it cute that Eric and Joe share the same man-crush
January 13th, 2015 at 6:21 am
Coddled as in, you try firing a bb gun on a college campus and see where you end up.
January 13th, 2015 at 1:50 pm
To the dopes who continue to post their displeasure for more articles about Jameis, what the hell do you want Joe to write about? It’s January and we have the number 1 pick and need to decide between two QBs. Mariota or Jameis…that’s all I want to read about. Keep them coming Joe.
January 13th, 2015 at 5:15 pm
smh…you guys are still perpetuating propaganda. What in the world makes JW a thug? Someone with a brain PLEASE explain how you came to this conclusion about him. Coming from my city, I know PLENTY of thugs and Jameis wouldn’t last a day. Is he immature? Sure. What guy his age isn’t? But to paint him as a criminal is in fact criminal. NONE of us have a first hand account of some of the things he’s accused of so condemning him is silly honestly. Someone show me his rap sheet and I’ll shut up…. I’m waiting
January 13th, 2015 at 5:16 pm
me too NJBucFan… me too