“He’ll Make Any Team A Good Football Team”
December 17th, 2014
Gerald McCoy hasn’t made the Bucs a good football team.
Warren Sapp didn’t make the Raiders a good football team.
No, an individual player really doesn’t drive a team to the winning side of the ledger — unless he plays quarterback.
Lovie Smith talked about Aaron Rodgers on Monday night, via the Buccaneers Radio Network, and the Tampa Bay head coach delivered a very telling quote.
Speaking of Rodgers, Lovie said, “He’ll make any team a good football team.”
Man, didn’t that just capture the essence of what Bucs fans desperately crave? They want a franchise quarterback. Because a franchise QB is a game-changer. It always has been, and it always will be, even more so in the modern NFL.
The Bucs need a quarterback with the potential to the best in the NFC South. That has to become priority No. 1. Look what happened when the Bucs got silly at the position in March, and then ignored it in May.
December 17th, 2014 at 2:18 pm
Tick Tick Tick, The Bucs are on the clock with yet another chance to change the course of past Bucs futility.
December 17th, 2014 at 2:24 pm
Thank you Lovie, Captain Obvious!!!
Doh!!!!
December 17th, 2014 at 2:30 pm
We’ll find a way to screw up and lose a chance at the 1st or 2nd pick in the draft. Both QB’s (Mariota & Winston) will be gone and our trade value for the 3rd overall pick will be modest. So we’ll probably end up drafting a OL higher than they deserve to go or end up dropping down in the draft to pick up a 2nd round pick. I know I’m being a pessimist, but the way this franchise has been going lately, why should I expect otherwise?
December 17th, 2014 at 2:30 pm
nah joe. I think it’s you that craves a franchise QB.
I would be happy with another Brad Johnson or Jeff Garcia.
Real football players and real men. I don’t an RGIII who just want to throw his team under the bus while getting endorsements and losing.
Russell Willson, hell yeah. Luck, hell yeah etc…..but not some crap leg stealing, accused rapist, pellet gun tottin numb nuts.
I know it get’s clicks, but no thanks.
December 17th, 2014 at 2:33 pm
Nothing like a franchise QB. Unfortunately, the point many of you miss is that there probably isn’t one in this year’s draft. Just because you have two heavily media hyped QB’s doesn’t make them No. 1 pick worthy just because they are the top two rated QB’s in college.
Manuel looked good in the last meaningless quarter of a game against the Bills. But when the Bengals had to prepare for him he looked worse than Josh McCown.
Stop slobbering and drooling over these guys, they both have serious flaws.
And if you continue to lust after them, get prepared for two more losing seasons.
December 17th, 2014 at 2:41 pm
Ohhhhhhh how I long for stable dependable Brad Johnson or Jeff Garcia. Russell Wilson, who I believe Mike Glennon beat out in college, was I think taken with a 3. Colin Kapernick, who was once the media’s favorite flavor of the month, was taken with a 2.
Stop drooling and slobbering, Joe. Didn’t you want the Bucs to take Manzell as well. Hell, Glennon looked better in his first start than Manzell did in his.
December 17th, 2014 at 2:46 pm
Lovie can’t and wont poorly develop a qb, just like he’s never properly developed a competent OL!
Don’t risk it Glazers!!!
December 17th, 2014 at 2:48 pm
Winston is the football player we need. The off the field issues are unsettling, however Warren Sapp came with some baggage too. He worked out just fine. Say what you will about Winston off the field, he’s polarizing and everybody has an opinion, but the guy is a superb leader when it comes to football. He leads in the locker room, on the field, and he imposes a standard of excellence on his teammates like few others do. He’s exactly what we need “IF” the focus is football.
December 17th, 2014 at 2:54 pm
I agree with most of you that Mariota is overrated. I just don’t see what everyone else sees about him. To me, he’s a system QB. Shoot, Even Mark Sanchez is looking good in that system. I think Winston is as talented as it gets. Yes, yes, his off-field antics… so what. Either way, both of them have to better than McClown and Gumbi
December 17th, 2014 at 2:59 pm
@ddneast
All excellent points. But I think you must concede there is the POSSIBILITY that either Jameis or Marcus or both could turn out to be far better than either Jeff the rubber band armed Garcia or Brad Johnson who got the very most out of his limited ability.
I can see Marcus Mariota as a cross between Kaepernik and Rodgers. I lean more towards Rodgers. Rodgers is the best QB in the game IMHO. He can run as EFFECTIVELY as anybody. Not as powerfully as Cam or Kaepernik but more EFFECTIVELY. Rodgers is smooth as silk when he does cross the line of scrimmage, just as importantly Rodgers has a great sixth sense when he moves in the pocket.
Jameis COULD be a far better passing version of Cam Newton. Powerful kid who can drag tacklers with him.
BOTH of the Heisman’s COULD turn out to be worthy of the pick. Alas they could also turn out to be total busts.
Again I would be comfortable with whatever decision the Bucs make if they get #1…Jameis..Marcus or trade down to pick up a bushel of picks to fill in lots of glaring needs. What I’m NOT comfortable with are the people making that decision.
I’m not sure I trust Lovie anymore than I trust the guys posting on this board. And he’s supposed to be the professional not us.
December 17th, 2014 at 3:04 pm
“Even Mark Sanchez is looking good in that system.”
Nate that’s the point! How many pro offenses are now going to the spread offense. Be honest. You’re like the rest of us and you haven’t seen Mariota nearly as much as Jameis because of the time difference and the fact he’s playing out West. Mariota is not simply a system QB.
But even if you think that watch Sunday’s game and see whether or not GB spreads the field against us. Watch the Patriots…any number of teams and you’ll see that the “system” may actually be the future of pro football. The standard “pro set” with the QB under center is becoming less and less fashionable.
New rules demand a new approach and the innovative minds like Kelly, and even old minds like Belicheat are adapting.
Did any of you ever stop to think that the “spread offense” may actually BE the pro set of the future.
December 17th, 2014 at 3:07 pm
I used to be a “defense wins championships” guy. Now I’m convinced you must have a top QB. He doesn’t have to lead the league in all the numbers, but he has to be a playmaker – Russell Wilson is a great example. I don’t think you can win big games with Brad Johnson or Trent Dilfer types any more… But I still love defense and I like the idea of being a defense-first team.
December 17th, 2014 at 3:21 pm
@StPeteBucsFan Yes, I’ve considered that NFL teams are leaning more towards the spread offense. If L&L decide to go with type of offense then Mariota is your guy. I have actually watched a number of Oregon games. That is why I am not overly impressed with him. If you didn’t watch him, you would look at his numbers and think he’s Micheal Vick with a Payton Manning arm. He’s not. Dennis Dixon put up big numbers too. Like I said… It will be interesting what direction we go with our OC… that will be the difference. I didn’t say Mariota was straight garbage, I just think he’s not as good as everyone is making him out to be. His 38 TD’s to 2 INT’s is not what you’re gonna get in the NFL. Again tho… He’ll still be far better than anything we have right now.
December 17th, 2014 at 3:24 pm
FYI…The last 3 superbowl winning teams ran traditional pro-style offenses.
2014 – Seahawks
2013 – Ravens
2012 – Giants
December 17th, 2014 at 3:27 pm
Yes, Russell Wilson gets rushing yards but they are usually from broken pass plays not scripted QB runs… for the most part Seattle runs a ground and pound west coast type of offense.
December 17th, 2014 at 3:37 pm
The greatness that is Darron Thomas (2010 & 2011 Oregon QB) went 30TD/9INT in 2010.. and 33TD/7INT in 2011. Chip Kelly’s system makes everyone look like a superstar! LOL
December 17th, 2014 at 3:42 pm
@Nate
Again all good points and Dennis Dixon? Ouch. That makes me afraid to draft either of them.
I’m truly torn. IF Chip Kelly offered multiple picks to the Bucs so that he could take Mariota I’d be glad to pick up a bunch of picks…but then on the other hand I’d think…wow if Kelly wants him that bad does he know more than we do.
The one comfort I take is that if we do take one of the Heismans we won’t get blackmailed like the old days before the CBA put that rookie cap in there. At least won’t be on the hook for a kings ransom.
Again the thing that frightens me most is who is making the decision. If it was Licht and he was all over the phone talking to his buds I’d feel a lot more comfortable than Lovie having any input. And again I really like Lovie as a person. As a coach…meh…as a talent evaluator yeccch!
December 17th, 2014 at 3:56 pm
Lei Chip Kelly offer us his one, Nick Foles and a 2. Foles is a drop back pocket passer with good footwork and arm. That is a trade I could droll and slobber over.
December 17th, 2014 at 4:02 pm
from where the Eaglets are picking, Chip would have to give up this years #1 and next years#1 along with Foles (who’s hurt) and Sproles
December 17th, 2014 at 4:03 pm
Yes, Warren Sapp smoked some herb in college. Wow, a college kid smoking grass in college, there’s a headline.
I could careless about Winston’s other various college antics, but the rape allegation truly bothers me. Something happened that night but none of us will really know.
The question you have to ask yourself is, “if the girl was really as drunk or drugged as she was supposed to have been, would you have had sex with an incapacitated girl.”
Even if she got herself that drunk, would you have has a sexual liaison with her or do you think anyone should have, regardless of their station in life.
December 17th, 2014 at 4:09 pm
Remind me again of
ONE Oregon QB from Chips genius system that has succeeded in the NFL?
Mariota doesn’t have the arm.
No thanks.
I say we get the first pick, trade out, get as many picks as possible.
Stick with McCown and Glennon for next year.
Then, let Glennon take over for his 4th season, with his 3rd round salary,
while we build the roster around them for the next 2 years.
I say save the money on QB’s for the next two years, as we sign David and fix our DE and OG situation.
December 17th, 2014 at 4:10 pm
I really do think Glennon can be the next Brady.
But he needs a run game and time to pass!!!
December 17th, 2014 at 4:13 pm
There is a difference between a “spread” offense and the various QB option runs we’ve seen in recent years.
We’ve seen all kinds of teams run spread formations, the Broncos, Pats, Packers, and Saints all do it without asking their QB to run much. What about the teams that do ask their QB’s to run like Mariotta does at Oregon? Obviously the Eagles have, the Panthers have, and especially the Redskins prior to this year. Vick, Foles, Cam, and RG3 have all been hurt as a result. The system works, but at the NFL level, you’re begging for injury.
My question surrounding Mariotta is how will he perform in an offense that doesn’t feature an option running game? The threat of those plays changes things and I think it’s close to being proved that spread and tempo works, but option/read running is a short lived system.
December 17th, 2014 at 4:31 pm
@ddneast,
I agree that outside of the rape accusation, Winstons issues are fairly minor. Any accusation of rape should be taken seriously. For the sake of simplicity I’ll summarize what I know about it. First she claimed she was hit on the head, then she claimed she was too drunk to remember, then she claimed she was drugged. Examination of her the night of the incident offered no evidence of a physical struggle (particularly a blow to the head), toxicology showed no drugs in her system with a blood alcohol level of .04. That’s half the legal limit to drive. She has since claimed that the results were tampered with, which is hard to imagine since the tests were administered a month before she identified Winston.
At the end of the day, none of her 3 different stories are supported by evidence. Oh yeah, I forgot, her friends who were with her that night claim she didn’t appear impaired. Unfortunately, having no evidence to support her claim(s) doesn’t mean it still didn’t happen. There is a reason he was never charged, hopefully anybody reading this has a better understanding of what that reason was.
December 17th, 2014 at 4:33 pm
Draft report on Brady:
“Tom Brady Positives: Good height to see the field. Very poised and composed. Smart and alert. Can read coverages. Good accuracy and touch. Produces in big spots and in big games. Has some Brian Griese in him and is a gamer. Generally plays within himself. Team leader.
Negatives: Poor build. Very skinny and narrow. Ended the ’99 season weighing 195 pounds and still looks like a rail at 211. Looks a little frail and lacks great physical stature and strength. Can get pushed down more easily than you’d like. Lacks mobility and ability to avoid the rush. Lacks a really strong arm. Can’t drive the ball down the field and does not throw a really tight spiral. System-type player who can get exposed if he must ad-lib and do things on his own.
Summary: Is not what you’re looking for in terms of physical stature, strength, arm strength and mobility, but he has the intangibles and production and showed great Griese-like improvement as a senior. Could make it in the right system but will not be for everyone.” -no source because it is old.
December 17th, 2014 at 4:33 pm
Draft report on Brees:
“Negatives… Plays in the spread offense, taking the bulk of his snaps from the shotgun… Tends to side-arm his passes going deep…Lacks accuracy and touch on his long throws… Seems more comfortable in the short/intermediate passing attack…Does not possess the ideal height you look for in a pro passer, though his ability to scan the field helps him compensate in this area…Will improvise and run when the passing lanes are clogged, but tends to run through defenders rather than trying to avoid them to prevent unnecessary punishment.”
December 17th, 2014 at 4:39 pm
Draft report on Rodgers:
Rodgers, although drafted in the first round by the Green Bay Packers in 2005, went 24th overall after falling down many teams’ boards. TheBigLead.com dug up a story from the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel looking at pre-draft scouting reports on Rodgers. In hindsight, quite a few teams got it wrong on the 2011 NFL MVP. “I think he has a good chance of being a bust. Just like every other (Jeff) Tedford-coached quarterback,” one NFC scout told the Journal Sentinel’s Bob McGinn. “Thing I struggle with him is he gets sacked a lot. He doesn’t have great ability to change the release of the football.” Another scout was even harsher. “He’s a system quarterback,” an AFC scout told McGinn. “3-, 5-, 7-step guy. Can’t create on his own. Panics under pressure. Gets flustered easy. I don’t think there’s a quarterback in the draft worthy of a first-round pick. I’m dead serious. None of them are worth it.” Another evaluator compared Rodgers to quarterbacking luminaries such as Kyle Boller and Joey Harrington. Of course, it’s easy to dump on really smart football guys with the benefit of hindsight. The Packers no doubt were patient and did a good job of developing Rodgers. The player gets credit for furthering his development, too. But looking back on it now, those reports couldn’t look any worse.
December 17th, 2014 at 4:39 pm
I guess my point is…shut up with all the stupid gimmick offense, spread offense BS. Otherwise these guys would have never been drafted.
December 17th, 2014 at 5:30 pm
Just like Josh McCown!
Just like QB of the future, Mr. Mike Glennon!
Hopefully you get it right this next time Loves.
December 17th, 2014 at 5:45 pm
Bill, he averages 8 carries a game. I think Mariota will be fine not running.
December 17th, 2014 at 5:48 pm
Rodgers is a legit star QB and future HOFer. Would be nice for the Bucs to have one of those….
I wish the Bucs had tried harder to sign Drew Brees in 2006. If Jon Gruden had Drew Brees – the entire history of the Buccaneers over the last 9 years would have been different and likely would have involved another Championship or 2. Oh that’s right I forgot. That was during the 8 year period when the Glazers refused to spend $ to improve the team.
Joe – I’m trying to figure out what the attached picture has to do with this article.
December 17th, 2014 at 6:20 pm
@Skyline Crew,
8 carries = the number of times he actually ran. How many times did he hand the ball off and expose himself to getting hit?
My point is that the “threat” of running the option/read runs thins a defense and makes the passing game easier. Mariotta has had that systematic benefit at Oregon. He won’t have it in the NFL, unless his team actually uses it, in which case I’ll expect him on the sideline soon.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not knocking the kid. We’d be better off with him than what we have now, but I suspect his transition to the NFL game will be tougher than some other QBs (particularly Winston).
December 17th, 2014 at 7:50 pm
He doesn’t run the option that much. That was the point of my post. He is usually passing and not running. I didn’t see him run the option against Arizona. He did typical zone read runs with the RB, but what QB doesn’t. He stays in the pocket and goes through his reads. I think he will be fine. My only knock on both WBs is that they both won the heisman.
December 17th, 2014 at 7:59 pm
@Skyline
Thank for that post. Couldn’t agree more. I think all this about the “spread” and “systems” is overblown just like you.
I think what people are missing is this difference. Some QB’s tend to run first and then look for the pass. Other QB’s like Rodgers CAN run very effectively and always looks downfield first.
I think Mariota is certainly smart enough, and Jameis too for that matter, to become a pass first run second QB. But it’s nice that BOTH of these guys can run when forced. That’s precisely what MG8 can NEVER do.
RGIII was always to quick to look to the run. That’s on him not the system.
Look at Kaepernik. I thought his first year he too was too quick to run but Harbaugh seems to have calmed him a bit. He runs less and not out of a sense of panic or giving up to quickly on his receivers.
December 17th, 2014 at 8:35 pm
Agreed, RG3 is a run first QB, which is why it is hard for him. Mariota doesn’t do that.
December 17th, 2014 at 9:15 pm
Would trade Aunt Geraldine for Rodgers any day. Even with the garbage OL the YUCS have.
December 17th, 2014 at 9:28 pm
Good luck with that Ray. Rodgers is my favorite player in the NFL and I’m a freaking Bucs fan! IMHO he’s the best player in the game right now. JJWatt fans might object but a DL simply can’t impact a game like a QB.
December 18th, 2014 at 11:26 am
Cam Newton, Drew Brees, Matt Ryan.
I’ll just leave those here
Continue with your argument.