Is Bucs Offense Killing Quarterbacks?
November 7th, 2014
The offense under Marcus Arroyo is very basic, said NFL Films analyst Greg Cosell.
Joe knows what a hand grenade in a china store it was when Tampa Bay offensive coordinator Jeff Tedford had to step aside due to his health issues. All the work done from the moment he was hired, through OTAs and minicamps and training camp. and then preseason, and poof, all gone.
For folks who think it is no big deal, it is a major deal.
In stepped Tedford’s lieutenant, Marcus Arroyo, who has scant experience as an offensive coordinator, all at second-rung college programs.
One could say the Bucs offense was doomed as a result.
One person who thinks the Bucs offense is a quarterback killer is noted NFL Films analyst Greg Cosell. He recently appeared on WHFS-FM 98.7 to talk Bucs and had unnerving words for the Bucs’ offense.
“I am not there every day. I don’t know what they teach,” Cosell said. “I don’t think this passing game as a whole that there is a lot to it. I think it is fairly basic and elementary. There is not a lot of combination routes and principles and concepts. They really put a major burden on the quarterback. The receivers have to win on the outside versus man coverage. They don’t help them as I said with bunch, stack, various concepts to help the pass game, to help receivers. You don’t see that on film when you watch the Bucs offense.”
Now this doesn’t mean quarterbacks are not at fault. Cosell, who is a big Mike Glennon supporter, stated how Glennon blew two potential touchdown passes to a wide-open Mike Evans that would have given the Bucs leads.
On the bright side, Cosell raved about the play and development of Evans and said he is now the Bucs’ go-to receiver.
November 7th, 2014 at 2:33 pm
This offense hasn’t been too overly complex to figure out.
Ask any defense we have played
November 7th, 2014 at 2:35 pm
Marcus Arroyo…..the coach perfectly positioned for the “tank mob”….you couldn’t have a better/worse OC if you want to lose.
So now, all we need is for Evans to get on board (with the other deliberate tankers) and drop a few passes!!!
# 1 pick or bust for all you losers!!!
November 7th, 2014 at 2:36 pm
Someone has to. Our defense sure isn’t.
November 7th, 2014 at 2:38 pm
Shut your face with that tank job jibber jabber
November 7th, 2014 at 2:40 pm
I mean, is it really that hard to accept that maybe we’re really that inept and can’t win when we’re trying?
November 7th, 2014 at 2:43 pm
Shiano was a terrible coach for the Bucs for 2 seasons and Lovie with his (Shiano) “STUDS” are terrible but getting better on defense and Bucs fans are clamoring for Lovie’s head. Look there are either trolls from chicago who just hate Lovie or 1 to 2 people with multiple names commenting on here. Because some commenters are arguing about who did a better job coaching a terrible team and developing a back-up quarterback.
November 7th, 2014 at 2:43 pm
A shiny new QB to compliment my man Mike Evans….then build up that line and watch out NFL!
I’ll be cheering for a Bucs win this Sunday….
If they don’t get one…then ALL bets are off after that. I will go into full loser mode at 1-8 and pray for more losses to pile up.
YES this is the LAST game I’m rooting for a win this season unless they win.
November 7th, 2014 at 2:44 pm
Espo,
I agree. The Bucs aren’t good enough to tank. They’ll lose just fine on their own play.
November 7th, 2014 at 2:46 pm
If they lose this Sunday…the next game my wife will try to give me high fives when they score and I’m going to leave her hanging.
It’s as simple as that.
November 7th, 2014 at 3:05 pm
I would say that the OC/QB coach isn’t experienced enough to be able to call a complex play.
#Tankforthelosers
November 7th, 2014 at 3:07 pm
@ Espo
As long as there are “fans” that hope we lose….I’ll be there to call them the “TANk MOB”…..and LOSERS”
How ’bout a poll from Joe……simple question…
Do you want the Bucs to dilberately lose games so they can secure a better draft position…..YES or NO?
And, I agree….they are perfectly capable of losing without trying to lose….
November 7th, 2014 at 3:15 pm
My wife over hears a phone conversation between me and a buddy discussing josh coming back as QB. she says “The guy who played the first couple games? I remember you yelling and cursing his name alot”
Yeahhhhh I am sooo excited for sunday!!
November 7th, 2014 at 3:18 pm
If you suspect that or want that, what’s the point in being a fan? Why watch? Why check this website? Why own or wear a Bucs shirt? Just find another team or forget football altogether. As a recent poster mentioned, hockey is getting more exciting to watch with all these grab-ass 2 hand touch rules. If you actually want us to lose then please don’t get back on the bandwagon next year or the year after or 2025 or whenever we start winning again.
November 7th, 2014 at 3:21 pm
And that was not directed at you, TBBF, the “you” is for ppl who actually feel that way. When we’re winning, they act like they represent everything that is Buccaneer fandom.
November 7th, 2014 at 3:26 pm
Mike Glennon is better than Andy Dalton. Yet, the next time the Bengals play Andy Dalton will be their starter. It should be the same with the Bucs and Mike Glennon.
Mike Glennon had a down game last week there is no question about that. However, there are starting QBs out there who are still starting that have had far worse games.
If there’s one positive thing to say about pop-star GM Mark Duminick is that he didn’t give Josh Freeman the $100 million too soon. The Bengals did that with Dalton and now look at them.
November 7th, 2014 at 3:26 pm
@ Espo
Thanks….it just isn’t in my DNA to want to lose….I can’t help wanting to win and really don’t understand the rationale of those who call them “meaningless” games.
Isn’t the entire purpose of competion to wanna’ WIN?
November 7th, 2014 at 3:36 pm
Scenario A. We end up with a high enough draft pick to select Mariotta. He turns out to be mediocre at best for us.
Scenario B. We win enough games to take us out of ‘position’ to be able to select Mariotta. He becomes a beast for whichever team drafts him. We swing and miss on yet another DE…
November 7th, 2014 at 3:41 pm
@ Walter White
Scenario C
We selevt the best Olineman available…..he’s with us for 10 years….unless, of course he’s another Kenyatta Walker.
Scenario D
We trade for extra picks hoping the law of averages blesses us with at least one good player out of the bunch……
November 7th, 2014 at 3:42 pm
Walter White must be getting high on his own supply.
November 7th, 2014 at 3:44 pm
Walter White does bring up a valid point in that the Buccaneers organization as a whole is not very good so a talented player would not thrive here like they would in other organizations.
November 7th, 2014 at 3:48 pm
Lovie Smith’s Marcus Aroyo is just like Tong Dungy’s Clyde Christiansen.
No excuse for handing over an NFL offence that has above average skill position players to a small time college QB coach.
Bring in an NFL experienced former OC as a consultant like Butch Davis was brought in to help Shiano so at least the offense gets some help.
There’s been a big drop off in Vincent Jackson’s production and focus catching the ball. Maybe as a veteran he’s not buying into Arroyo’s play calling.
This team is built to throw the ball up high and downfield. When you see Jackson running short slants in tight areas he doesn’t get the job done. He hears footsteps and has been dropping those even when Glennon made a good throw. He’s had at least 5 or 6 drops where the ball hit him in the chest but he felt the defenders behind him and didn’t catch the ball with his hands.
Also why is Jenkins not running vertical routes, he’s another one that should be getting one on one and running down the seams instead of running sideways.
Buc offense on paper should be much better than what we’ve seen this year.
November 7th, 2014 at 4:03 pm
@ed really good analogy but we do pass more.
It has something to do with it if Glennon was on the Patriots he would be a stud or saints? Ummm no. That basic offense had a lot if opportunities for Tds last week remember why we were kicking or attempting fg’s??
November 7th, 2014 at 4:08 pm
What’s the difference if we have the lead, the defense is just going to give up the lead aka saints aka vikes aka Browns aka ……
November 7th, 2014 at 4:20 pm
awesome to listen to greg cosell thoughts.
November 7th, 2014 at 4:20 pm
wasn’t this the same thing we heard about “Sully’s Offense” last season..basic, old concepts, recievers have to win on the outside…So basically this seaon has been all about, “Meet the new boss, SAME AS THE OLD BOSS.” Wow.
November 7th, 2014 at 4:24 pm
whats complex. clog the LOS for the RB or drop back and release your blocker to the QB on passing plays.
November 7th, 2014 at 4:42 pm
Man, this talk of draft position is really starting to get on my nerves! We have half a season to go people. If you’re rooting for a 1st overall pick or are worried about winning too many games to get Mariotta or Jameis, you are not a Buc fan and should really just shut up. Is it frustrating? Heck yeah! But to infer that you would rather watch the Bucs lose to gain draft position is pathetic. Many of you asked for this…fire Schiano, get rid of Revis, and on and on…Now, with the realization that they suck, you want to jump ship. Someone posted here recently, ” a true fan couldn’t root for another team if they tried.”
If you are a “true fan” there should be no talk of draft until the end of the season. We know what we need. An informed fan should see that easily. What we need is improvement, not “tanking”. If improvement means we win 6 games and miss out on Jameis then so be it. At least we’re improving. If we try and still fail then at least we tried.
What type of person roots for failure?!!!
November 7th, 2014 at 5:02 pm
That’s not news. The offense doesn’t look too much different than last year’s which was saddled with the same observation. No combo routes, not much motion, no bunch sets, etc. What’d you expect? It’s probably helped Evans a little bit because without a ton of combo routes, there probably isn’t nearly as many option routes either. It’s simple, it has most likely made Evans’ transition much easier… it’s probably been easier for Glennon to grasp it considering he is in his 2nd season with the 2nd OC (technically he’s had 3 OCs in 3 seasons-college).
November 7th, 2014 at 5:18 pm
What type of person roots for failure? Uh, the ones who are so sure about Winston’s greatness and can’t miss ability to lead the Bucs to Super Bowl glory. The ones who want all Buc losses from here on out to secure the first overall pick in the 2015 draft. That’s who gets excited with every Bucs loss. You could also throw in those that hate Lovie and his seeming ineptness. Those wanting goose eggs for Bucs wins is a bigger crowd than you think. I can’t blame any of them, the team has been horrible from top to bottom and there is only so much disappointment fans can deal with before massive pushback. The criticism is all warranted.
November 7th, 2014 at 5:22 pm
Have the Bucs ever had an offensive coordinator that any other team coveted. Nope. Gruden was the brightest OC the Bucs ever had. Offense has never been a priority in One Buc Place.
November 7th, 2014 at 5:23 pm
@bucsfan37
Winston couldn’t hold Luck’s water bottle in any QB category. It wouldn’t even be a debate especially when you compare maturity and smarts.
November 7th, 2014 at 5:24 pm
Actually to add, can’t wait to hear his Wonderlic score in the offseason. I think he has the tools from a physical standpoint but so did Jeff George, Jenarcus Russell, etc
November 7th, 2014 at 5:35 pm
i’m a fan and i say lose em all for a #1 qb. we wouldn’t be in this position if we grabbed one last year instead of a wr.
i can talk draft all i want because the games suck! glennon sucks. lovie sucks, and did in chicago. lovie is atrocious at personnel decisions.
November 7th, 2014 at 5:35 pm
bufanman…I think what you meant is that we’re not emotional suckers…the season is GONE…the ONLY thing to look forward to is an opportunity to be in freaking control for a change with the first overall pick…if that offends you…so what…
November 7th, 2014 at 5:37 pm
ps the draft is hope and there is no hope left this season. we are finding ways to lose.
November 7th, 2014 at 5:43 pm
Meaningless games = you play to go to the playoffs anything else is just BULLSHYTE after that.
Yah I’m less of a Buc fan, because I want to go the playoffs next year.
The season is LOST, but Go Bucs!
Tell you what if they lose this Sunday…which they will. I promise not to even watch them the rest of the season. There problem solved.
November 7th, 2014 at 5:45 pm
Dang it I’m on a different computer…forgot to throw the Jameis after my name. Sorry Joe.
November 7th, 2014 at 5:46 pm
Sorry Joe. I forgot the ForJameis after my name. I’m on a different computer.
November 7th, 2014 at 6:04 pm
#1 pick, or any pick, won’t guarantee a playoff run. Might as well hope we win the game in front of us.
November 7th, 2014 at 6:42 pm
a new qb woulda put us in better position to win than either we have now.
November 7th, 2014 at 7:00 pm
The new NFL is a quarterback league with all the rules set up for Madden-style scoring to appease the fantasy football crowd and if you don’t have an above average QB your team is going to lose. I don’t understand the sentiment that you’re not a true fan if you’re already looking toward the draft because news flash this season is, for all intents and purposes, OVER. Professional sports are about winning championships and if you’re not competing for a title what are you really doing.
I’m a Bucs fan, even though sometimes I wonder why, but the rest of the games this season are meaningless from a fan’s perspective and the draft is all we have to look forward to with hope. As far as the tanking issue I don’t think it matters because I have little faith in the Bucs management to pick the right guy. Having the first overall pick or one in the top five doesn’t guarantee an elite player but it greatly increases the chances.
November 7th, 2014 at 7:46 pm
Espo…and for what? To be 2-7. To be proud of that? No thanks.
I suffered through my fair share of losing as a fan since 87. I’m used to it and you guys should be too by now. What’s another 8 more games of losses to me mean? It means same old Bucs oh well, can’t wait for the draft.
We’ll see how many “true” fans are still in the stands by halftime this Sunday. If they even show up at all. I’m telling you, I had season tickets last season. If I had them this season, I wouldn’t go at all. YES it’s that bad on my end, I don’t know about the rest of you. Apparently your content with the meaning less 2-7 or the 2-10 down the road. Get excited when they go 2-10 rah rah Go Bucs hurray were 2-10 and I REALLY hope they win another game. Whatever get out of here with that nonsense….
I ran into a guy that was a Buc fan for 20 plus years the other day at Publix and we got to talking while line. He said last season he gave up and he’s no longer a fan anymore at all. YES it’s THAT bad for some people.
November 7th, 2014 at 8:06 pm
Talk to jimmy johnson who tanked a losing season to get draft picks and when he got the guys he wanted he won the superbowl.. He braged about it on the pregame show a couple of weeks ago..
November 7th, 2014 at 8:23 pm
I noticed this trend around the fourth or fifth game of the season and commented on it out here. Just like I noticed many of the so called Buc fans like Buc1987 always posting negative comments and never really appearing to be a fan at all. Same with a number of people out here who were calling for Lovie’s job after the second game of the season/ I really doubt if 40 percent of the people who post out here have ever gone to a Bucs game or are really Bucs fans. Like most people who can post anonymously, they generally just say things to annoy people because it brings them some sort of joy in their sad pathetic lives.
November 7th, 2014 at 9:09 pm
I am really hoping that lovie told tedford to take the year off…we are not going anywhere this season get healthy and your job will be here next year. We need tedford. When he left all hope was lost for me before the season even began. I still had a glimmer of hope in the beginning but this season has been a joke. The colts tanked to get luck and I dont see many indy fans crying abouy that season anymore. Sure luck could have been a bust but they took the chance. All I know without a doubt is that without either Tedford or a damn creative offensive minded playcaller we are screwed every year until it happens. The players are trying but lovie obviously has a path he is following. The path to the draft.
November 7th, 2014 at 9:57 pm
How about we get a quarterback under center before we call the offense a quarterback killer. Josh Mccown is who he’s always been and glennon is doing the same crap New did last year. We don’t have an nfl starting quarterback mr cosell
November 7th, 2014 at 10:30 pm
drdneast…F and U
November 7th, 2014 at 10:54 pm
drdneast Says:
November 7th, 2014 at 8:23 pm
“I noticed this trend around the fourth or fifth game of the season and commented on it out here. Just like I noticed many of the so called Buc fans like Buc1987 always posting negative comments and never really appearing to be a fan at all.”
You sir are a first rate, race card pulling jack ***. This country needs less of people like you pulling the race card out every time someone doesn’t like something a black coach does.
For the record seeing how I might be perceived as an automatic racist. Tony Dungy is one of my hero’s and I want Jameis Winston to be our QB. That must make me a racist.
@Joe….he started this shyt and I’m sorry. You know how big of fan I am by now. Most of your regulars know this as well. Nothing bothers me more than a race card puller. Especially when it’s not warranted.
drdneast…don’t call out my name in a post and question my fandom for this team. I was here before you. People like yourself spew your race card crap on these pages and expect credibility. People like you make sick.
I suppose the GOP won like mad on Tuesday because they are all a bunch of racists that hate Obama for the color of his skin. Mia Love in Utah (black republican) she must be related to uncle Tom right? Tim Scott in S.C. (black republican) He must be uncle Tom’s nephew right?
November 7th, 2014 at 11:04 pm
wwwhhhhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat???!!!
buc1987, what did i miss?
November 7th, 2014 at 11:07 pm
lurker… on these here pages about a week or so ago. drdneast said that he noticed quite a bit of comments that were borderline racist towards Lovie Smith.
No one else ever saw them.
Especially Joe or he would have quickly taken them down of course.
November 7th, 2014 at 11:14 pm
So I won’t TOLERATE such a person like THAT questioning my fandom.
My GAWD. Me?
Really? Of all the people that get singled out… I get singled out as not a true fan…. Grrrrrr nothing pisses me off more than such talk.
I did it last season to a few people in here…then I soon realized how WRONG it is.
I would NOT comment soooooooooo damn much if I wasn’t a true fan. You may bleed pewter and red, but I bleed creamsicle orange. Take that to the back!
November 7th, 2014 at 11:18 pm
So I won’t TOLERATE such a person like THAT questioning my fandom.
My GAWD. Me?
Really? Of all the people that get singled out… I get singled out as not a true fan…. Grrrrrr nothing pisses me off more than such talk.
I did it last season to a few people in here…then I soon realized how WRONG it is.
I would NOT comment soooooooooo damn much if I wasn’t a true fan. You may bleed pewter and red, but I bleed creamsicle orange. You can take that to the bank!
Don’t EVER question my fandom. Ever!
November 7th, 2014 at 11:22 pm
Damn I got the double post all because I clicked my browser back when I noticed I typed the word bank wrong and tried to fix it but it was too late…ok I’m done for the next hour on JBF.
Have fun my FELLOW Buc fans!
November 8th, 2014 at 12:26 am
When you have 3 6’5″ receivers and a swiss cheese offensive line you don’t need to complicate things. With Sims coming back you will see a more complex formations to get him in space. Lane will be back too and he will occupy respect from LBs in misdirection plays. Ifcthe oline holds up we may put up 35-40 points.
November 8th, 2014 at 1:01 am
Oh Matt. God Bless your soul. Ya see TBBF there are still homers out there.
November 8th, 2014 at 12:14 pm
Buc1987ForJameis Said:
So I won’t TOLERATE such a person like THAT questioning my fandom.
__________________________________________________
What are you going to do about ? Type in caps? That’ll teach em.
November 8th, 2014 at 3:06 pm
The oc has no concept of play calling in the nfl. Glennon had no time in the off season with a oc mclown had very little and are qbs are showing how lovie experience could be not the best reputation with oc in the nfl could be a drag. Reason cali and the oc we were supposed to have parted was because of health issues just saying.