“I Like What Doug Is Doing”
October 8th, 2014
The whispers are everywhere. Hushed in tone yet laced with concern if not fear. “What has happened to Doug Martin?”
Martin was one of the prized jewels of the 2012 draft. He was so good as a rookie, he made the Pro Bowl. It appeared the Bucs may have a dominant franchise running back.
Martin’s numbers have consistently and surprisingly slipped since his rookie season, when he rushed for 4.5 yards a carry. After five games this season, Martin is averaging a pedestrian 2.5 yards a touch.
Wednesday, acting offensive coordinator Marcus Arroyo came racing to Martin’s defense when he was peppered with questions about both the running game and Martin.
“I like the things Doug has done,” Arroyo said. “Doug is creating some things and has done some things hard. Our run game has to improve overall, our staff believes that. That starts with us. We have to find out what it is to get us back on track in the run game and it will be finer points. Detail those things and execute-wise. At the end of the day it is about executing the scheme. One guy doing his job and the other 10 following suit. We need to find ways to run the ball and we are all in that together. It has to [be better].”
Arroyo later stated he was firmly in Martin’s camp.
“I like how hard he works,” Arroyo said. “I like how hard he runs. I like how he is trying to find ways to get it done. He has zero flinch. He’s a team guy. I like those things.”
As much as Arroyo said he likes Martin, he is also a believer in fellow running back Bobby Rainey.
“I have no problems giving Bobby the ball,” Arroyo said.
Something just doesn’t seem right and Joe cannot put a finger on it. It’s not like the Bucs’ front line is horrid like it was in August. There have been holes for Martin to run through, he just hasn’t taken advantage of opportunities, for whatever reason.
To be fair, in the Saints game, Martin saved Mike Glennon’s neck. Saints defensive coordinator Rob Ryan sent the house with blitzes of every sort, and often Martin picked them up.
Martin saved Glennon a lot of cash on his life insurance premiums.
October 8th, 2014 at 4:14 pm
Great block on the passpro.. But the run stats SUCKS
October 8th, 2014 at 4:18 pm
If only the Bucs would stop running 90% of the time on 1st down, perhaps they would get better results. Try a short pass on 1st down occasionally to at least make the defense stop filling the box with 8 every time.
October 8th, 2014 at 4:27 pm
2.5 YPC isn’t pedestrian, it’s absolutelt awful. 3.3 is pedestrian. Line deserves some blame to be sure but he just doesn’t look the same as he did in 2012.
October 8th, 2014 at 4:27 pm
That was the old Dungy method: run, run, pass (incomplete), punt.
Wondered if he would dismantle the Colts offense when he arrived, but htye didn’t let him touch it.
October 8th, 2014 at 4:36 pm
Of course, if they don’t hand the ball off, the per carry is taken from a small sample. Martin has just 37 carries. That’s 7.4 per game. Rainey isn’t much better with 47 @ 9.4 per game. All of the games (except, of course Atlanta) have been close enough to try establishing a run game. They are making it ‘look’ like the run game is a secondary concern with this offense. If so, then this trend will continue. When Sims returns, let us see if anything changes.
October 8th, 2014 at 4:36 pm
Here’s a fun fact: Martin has gained a total of 2,004 yards in his 25 game career. That means that almost 13% of his career total are from a single game against Oakland. Take that game out of the equation and his career YPG drops from over 80 to 73.
October 8th, 2014 at 4:54 pm
@BucFanInArkansas
Did you really waste time figuring that out?
October 8th, 2014 at 5:01 pm
A running back is only as good as his line in front of him.
Wanna know why his numbers are down?
Look no further than the line in front of him lol.
Doug Martin hasn’t changed as a person or a runner. So if he’s not as good as 2012 then look at the line this year. Duh!!
No running back can succeed if the line doesn’t do it’s job.
And maybe not running on 1st down every single damn time. Everyone has bitched and moaned about the O-line and it is getting better but far from where it needs to be. But then turn around and say what’s wrong with Martin?
Hellllllllooooooooooo? Anyone home? The run game and O-line are pretty much tied at the hip. And one is healthy and the other is “figuring” it out. So hmmmmmm real hard to figure out genius.
October 8th, 2014 at 5:03 pm
Well, yes, I figured it out, but to characterize “doing math” as a waste of time seems a bit over-the-top. What can I say, math is my thing.
I recalled reading a season preview (Grantland maybe?) that mentioned that Martin’s overall numbers were somewhat skewed by that single game (25 carries, 251 yds, 10+ YPC) given his limited sample size. I found it interesting, anyway.
October 8th, 2014 at 5:07 pm
i don’t think we employ enough run defense beaters. part of that is the inexperience of the QB\”OC” combo. there is stuff going on pre-snap that veteran QB’s and coaching staffs would be able to respond to better at the line of schrimmage. right now it’s hard enough for us to get the play called in the huddle off on time….
October 8th, 2014 at 5:15 pm
joe often talked about doug martin being traded during the nfl draft last spring. it is a good thing the bucs kept him around. he did help out with the blitzes against the saints.
he also made an effort to catch several screen passes.
last year it was said he couldn’t catch passes. I think he has
proved them wrong to some degree.
October 8th, 2014 at 5:30 pm
Okay, I think the more knowledgeable fans have gotten the picture. The Bucs run on almost every first down and when they do, it’s usually done in a fashion if just trying to jam Martin up between the guard and the tackle.
I saw 8 in the box constantly on first down against the Saints.
I charted the plays Sunday so I will have an accurate count on what the running on first down percentage was.
Add to the fact we have very little deception in our running game also adds in the difficulty of trying to establish a running game.
You don’t need an NFL brainiac as a DC to figure this team out. Just grab some beer bellied Pop Warner coach with visions of being the next Vince Lombardi in in his alcohol soaked brain and that will be good enough.
Is this what Jeff Tedford imagined would happen with his new and improved scheme.
October 8th, 2014 at 5:49 pm
Play calling, play calling, play calling. Doug looked pretty great when they got him the ball is space in the Saints game. Pretty sure the play got called back due to a penalty though.
October 8th, 2014 at 5:55 pm
How much of an enhancement to this site would it be to add a “thumbs up/down” feature to comments? There are some very informed fans on here. It would be interesting to see the general consensus on some comments.
October 8th, 2014 at 5:56 pm
So I guess this it huh? We’re gonna go with Arroyo for the rest of the season?
October 8th, 2014 at 5:57 pm
Joe
Why don’t they use the pass to open up the run game instead of trying the run to open up the passing game? And please try running somewhere but between the tackles and some play action.
October 8th, 2014 at 6:08 pm
Doug Martin was successful in 2012 because we often used the PASS to open up the RUN. The threat of Vincent Jackson and Mike Williams down the field allowed for a lot of room in the middle for Doug Martin to work with. And we all know how good he can be in the open space.
It’s no coincidence Freeman’s 4000 yard season corresponded with Marin’s stellar season.
October 8th, 2014 at 6:10 pm
@OB
I agree. What is there to lose? Pass to set up run. Lovie has got to learn to be flexible. All this being said, defense is still the problem. Offense will evolve if Lovie stays out of it
October 8th, 2014 at 6:20 pm
Ppl keep saying it’s the lines fault. Funny in 2012 he gained most of his yards running behind the great wall of jamon Meredith,Ted Larsen,Jeremy zuttah with demar and dpenn on the flanks..
So that oline was better then the one assembled now?? I’m not so sure. Something is missing in Dougillacs game some fans see it joe sees it and the coaches and organization saw it with drafting Charles Sims in the 3rd. You don’t draft a situational guy at rb in the 3rd round if your that confident. We had Bobby and Mike James who both did good things the year prior. Maybe dougillac isn’t that good in a zone scheme maybe his vision has dropped since 2012(which I believe it has).
October 8th, 2014 at 6:31 pm
Thank you BucFanInArkansas! I’ve been saying that for years! Martin is a 1 game wonder! Take away the big game against Oakland in 2012 and the garbage stats that he put up against Atlanta the final game of that season when they were resting their starters for the playoffs and he hasn’t done anything in the NFL.
October 8th, 2014 at 6:43 pm
I’m on lovies side of the argument here. The what ifs n the would’ves doesn’t hold any water. Vjax played better than our rbs played, better than our o line n opened up the passing game for glennon as well as our other receivers. Dropped passes happen to everyone. Penalties too but penalties are the easiest to avoid. As professional players lovie shouldn’t have to waste a practice discussing penalties. If u are out of position or moving when ur not supposed to then obviously u aren’t focused. Dropped passes will lose u a down but never cost u yards. Penalties can wipe out ur big play push u back demoralize ur unit’s confidence n change ur entire game plan for that first down. Penalties have long been the achilles heel for tampa n THAT is sickening. Some of u say we don’t have the talent to be a great team but that is a lie! This team easily loses confidence in themselves when they’re in the dirt. Fighters like glennon collins dotson vjax david mccoy n I’ll also add verner have to jumpstart this team. I’m sure there are maybe a handful of others but most noticeably its those guys. Theres gotta be communication in that huddle like hey I’m burning this dude in my route or I can handle this dlman run it on my side. The coaches can only observe what is going on. Maybe that’s why drew brees offense is so fluent. No lie at all I feel more comfortable with glennon at qb than any qb that’s played for tampa since brad johnson or jeff garcia. Mccown can’t play but he sure can coach like a mf lovie will keep glennon at qb for the season bet that. To everyone saying glennon is or was stiff in the pocket watch the seahawks game of last year then watch the super bowl. Schianos stunts didn’t always get sacks but they got pressure. Maybe a stunt on Michael johnson n mcdonalds side would cause some sacks. Anyways sorry fr the rant/vent but its been built up. Also when charles sims comes back I hope lovie doesn’t try to get more conservative trying to have confidence in him running the ball. Add him to our passing game we’re getting established n ease his carries in there. Gotta spread that defense out to be successful in the run game. Last one, I get the feeling I was wrong about mike Evans predraft we might have the next megatron!!!
October 8th, 2014 at 7:13 pm
Mike James needs the rock. Behind a bad O-line I believe he is the BEST bet to fetch us decent yardage. He is a friggin bruiser with better vision than Martin. I hate how he has become a non-factor after a few carries against St. Louis where Aaron Donald completely owned our All-Pro Logan Mankins and made TFLs right after the ball was handed..
October 8th, 2014 at 7:19 pm
The Gulch must be watching a different game from the one I see.
October 8th, 2014 at 7:22 pm
Buc1987 Says:
October 8th, 2014 at 5:56 pm
“So I guess this it huh? We’re gonna go with Arroyo for the rest of the season?”
Can’t really do anything else. If they bring someone in, they’ll need to learn the playbook/terminology and players (strengths/weaknesses). It would be late in the season before he would be effective. This is the best course and we may discover a new talent of Arroyo by the end of the year.
@BucFanInArkansas
Don’t stop with the ‘math’ just because some people can’t do it or are intimidated by it. Stats are one of those things that are useless and yet fun to play with.
October 8th, 2014 at 7:24 pm
Doug has always been vastly overrated here. We fed him the ball a gagillion times in 2012, both with pass and run. His total yardage reflected that. Even in 2012 though, his per carry yards were vastly inflated by a couple of really good games that disguised a relentlessly average per touch performance.
October 8th, 2014 at 7:37 pm
When the other team knows easily it is a run play and most of the time it is the same “up the gut” run and that it is highly probable that Glennon isnt going to audible out of the play called, it makes for some tough running regardless of who is in there.
October 8th, 2014 at 8:17 pm
@Delson …GREAT rant thanks for spilling it on JBF!
I agree with many of the things you said. Good thoughts man.
October 8th, 2014 at 8:57 pm
If our offense wasn’t so d**n predictable and we didn’t run all the time on first down, Doug Martin would be getting better stats, we are NOT a team based around the power run, If we were a team that was built for power smashmouth football, then we could run on first down frequently
October 8th, 2014 at 11:06 pm
Switch it up to throw off the defense!! #genius
October 9th, 2014 at 9:28 am
What games are you watching Joe? How many gapping holes have you seen? This line is horrid at run blocking and the play calling is just as bad from a run perspective. The holes are basically non-existent and how many outside runs have you seen to give Martin space? My god, he gets hit taking the handoff more than any back I’ve seen this year. If you are going to write about how bad Martin is at least be accurate and give the line and play calling an equal share of the blame. Not like Rainey has done anything with his carries the past two weeks either.
October 9th, 2014 at 10:05 am
So Joe, you bitch about running on first down, but then wonder where the running game is… you want your vanilla to taste like cherbert…NO!
October 9th, 2014 at 11:17 pm
If you actually look back at the saints game, Doug did a pretty good job making the best of our terrible run blocking. He almost never has a clean back field to work in. There is always 1 or 2 guys in the backfield, right in martins face as he receives the handoff. He fought out some tough yards and made some great effort plays.
With how bad this Offensive line is at run blocking, it’s surprising Martin or any rb gets any positive yards.
And to add that his blitz pick and pass blocking has been superb. Which really makes up for any blame martins gets for the lack of run production.
October 10th, 2014 at 10:24 pm
Trubucfan22 Says:
“And to add that his blitz pick and pass blocking has been superb. Which really makes up for any blame martins gets for the lack of run production.”
You don’t really mean that, literally. Because if he can’t run, being “superb” at picking up blitzes does NOT make it a wash. It just makes him one-dimensional and the defense will know what’s coming. The run game may be none/part/all of Martin’s problem. We don’t know for sure. I DO know that Rainey doesn’t seem to be having nearly as much trouble, and he’s running the same plays… behind the same O-line.
Just sayin’.