Overall Guard Plan Won’t Change
August 10th, 2014
Joe hears the roars from Bucs fans yearning to see Tampa Bay swing a trade for holdout 49ers guard Alex Boone.
It ain’t going to happen.
The Bucs went into the 2014 season without a desire to invest a lot into the guard position. They even dumped proven serviceable young, versatile guard/center Jeremy Zuttah and his roughly $4 million salary.
Even with departed guard Carl Nicks’ health as a massive question mark, general manager Jason Licht and Lovie Smith made a statement during the NFL Draft. They didn’t snag a guard until the fifth round, Kadeem Edwards out of Tennessee State.
The big-picture plan is very clear to Joe. And it doesn’t include putting a significant investment into the guard position now, unless there’s some sort of incredible value on the market. Boone does not represent that value.
The Bucs likely would have to cough up a draft pick, and pay Boone a lot more than the $4 million a season he finds unacceptable in perennial power San Francisco. Also, Boone is a right guard, and left guards are a little more important given their pass rush role.
Yes, this is Joe’s opinion, but there’s absolutely no reason to believe the Bucs will make a panic move and trade for Boone.
The Tampa Bay scouting department is not doubt dialed into who else might be available as starting lineups become clear and rosters pare down across the NFL. There will be guards to be had, and hopefully the Bucs will snag someone who can compete a little better than what fans saw Friday night.
August 10th, 2014 at 1:20 pm
If the Bucs don’t improve their guards, they should at least keep a priest on staff to perform last rites on McCown. And maybe Glennon as well. It’s the right thing to do.
August 10th, 2014 at 1:21 pm
The big-picture plan is very clear to Miguel, L&L think they have one “honeymoon season” to tank and get the top rated QB (Winston) in the draft next spring.
Oh Boy!!!
Here we go again.
August 10th, 2014 at 1:23 pm
Well, I for one was as distraught as any Bucs fan with our O- line performance. However, to me Jacksonville is much like we are, in a similar rebuilding process, with the main question marks on offense, but let’s not forget they are in year number two with Gus Bradley. For us not to expect their defense to be pretty good this year might be forgetting Bradley’s prior work with the reigning Super Bowl winning defense.
August 10th, 2014 at 1:26 pm
Explain to me how this is any different than Dominik refusing to acquire a viable TE last year. I’m all for Lovieball but let’s not forget that he’s not a great evaluator of O-linemen.
August 10th, 2014 at 1:27 pm
Why not Richie Incognito ?
August 10th, 2014 at 1:42 pm
Put Pamphile at LT and move Collins to LG
August 10th, 2014 at 1:48 pm
I understand they are not going to spend the mega money at Boone. I understand a little less that Incognito will not be considered. I don’t understand at all how they think the current plan will work. And I don’t believe they will snag anything better than what we have when rosters are pared down. The teams that drafted guards this year in the first 4 rounds (Texans, Raiders, Panthers) had bad Olines last year, so how does that help to bring in their castoffs?
August 10th, 2014 at 1:53 pm
I don’t know what is worse the oline situation or the QB situation but the HC/GM are directly responsible. Will will not win any games with this garbage lining up every week. I don’t care how good Lovie thinks his defense will. Offenses around the league and in our division are way to good and potent that a great defense still needs a productive offense to compete. I still can’t believe the starting QB job was handed to that loser McCown. Lovie’s judgement on this matter is reprehensible and most of you fans bought this BS and thought he was good. When does a terrible QB for 12 years suddenly become good?…when Lovie says so? Fans are as ridiculous as the HC and media for not shining more light on it. So obviously laughable.
August 10th, 2014 at 1:54 pm
At least it will be fun to watch the defense this year. And I will leave the room to go make margaritas when the offense takes the field – but I will have to hurry bc they won’t be on the field very long…
The sad part is we really will have no idea if Tedford, McCown, Evans, ASJ, Wright, Martin, Sims, etc. are good, bad or ugly bc of how awful the Oline will be
August 10th, 2014 at 2:03 pm
This is more “smoke” than that which is coming out of Tony Stewarts camp…..
August 10th, 2014 at 2:05 pm
Hey come on, they told us we want to be a win now team, Joke or what? This O-line needs guards not hope that somebody steps up, even if they did we have no depth..
August 10th, 2014 at 2:18 pm
THIS ISN’T AN ATTACK, JUST A DIFFERENCE OF OPINION
@Joe
A 27yr old dominate (RG) that can play (LT/RT) doesn’t represent value?
August 10th, 2014 at 2:22 pm
Has any member of the media directly asked Lovie or Licht about the possibility of Incognito? If Lovie is such a great leader (and I think he is) than can’t he handle someone like Incognito and keep him in line? I’m sure he will be on his best behavior to get back in the league, and keep him on a short leash.
August 10th, 2014 at 2:22 pm
@Joe
Would trade for Boone in a heart beat-One of the best zone blocking RG’s in the game. Sure after a breakout 2012 year (+22.9 overall grade *PFF), Alex Boone took a step back in 2013 (-1.9). T-34th of 59 guards in Pass Block Efficiency.
But-
As it stands right now we have
2015-$33,044,215
2016-$69,716,144
That’s before extensions, rollovers, cuts, etc. Plenty of space to front load his contract extension w/ guarantees -like we typically do
August 10th, 2014 at 2:22 pm
“Why not Richie Incognito ?”
Because he’s a human piece of trash and Lovie is building a roster with chemistry.
August 10th, 2014 at 2:23 pm
DallasBuc, are you trying to create some new dialect or what?
Even though I had to sift through that embarrassing representation of the english language, I do agree with you that our OLine sucks bigtime; but we honestly can’t judge McCown or any of our other skill position players yet because our OL was so horrible. We better start a different guard tandem this week or I might totally flip out.
August 10th, 2014 at 2:27 pm
You may be right JOE, from the tampa tribune 1-23-14
Whoever those players prove to be, the Bucs are not likely to spend exorbitantly for them. Licht shares a philosophy with Smith that calls for spending wisely in the free agent marketplace.
“We’re going to supplement our roster through free agency, but we’re going to look for value,’’ he said. “Our philosophy is to build through the draft. That’s where we find our stars.”
August 10th, 2014 at 2:28 pm
Glad–actually ecstatic–that this won’t happen. The big picture and long term won’t happen. Everyone wants to play general manager and coach. Relax. Trust these guys until they show they can’t be trusted. We have McCoy to sign and others as well. If there has to be a weakness, I can live with this one and will wait to see if these guys can be coached up and, in fact, is that performance was an anomoly.
How about some talk about how great our defense played . How many 3 and outs from the opposition. More posts on the guards will increase the boredom.
August 10th, 2014 at 2:30 pm
English is not a language spoken around these parts. Only enraged sputtering.
August 10th, 2014 at 2:32 pm
Boone only makes 2 million a year not 4 million that is why he want a new deal
August 10th, 2014 at 2:35 pm
This is getting boring…..everybody agrees (and that’s very rare) that we need significant help on the Oline……..so let me stir this up.
Our Oline just needs a couple more games to gel…..don’t panic (says Lovie)….our starting Guards are on the roster now! We will be just fine. (I don’t really beileve all that, but wanted to present the other side)
August 10th, 2014 at 2:35 pm
I just think they need to roll with the young guns at G (Edwards and Omameh) just let them learn as the starters the rest of preseason and get the experience
August 10th, 2014 at 2:36 pm
So your gonna build the draft, after you completely overhaul the roster through free agency?
August 10th, 2014 at 2:41 pm
“As we said before, we’re always looking to improve our ball club,” Smith said. “If there’s someone out there that can, we’re looking at them. But we feel comfortable with the guys (we have). Again men, don’t overreact is what I would say.”
Hey Lovie, there are two guys that can improve it – Boone & Incognito, they are available and you have the money.
Read more here: http://www.bradenton.com/2014/08/10/5295908/commentary-should-tampa-bay-bucs.html?sp=/99/217/#storylink=cpy
August 10th, 2014 at 2:42 pm
@Tampabaybucfan
Agreed..
August 10th, 2014 at 2:43 pm
*So your gonna build through the draft, after you completely overhaul the roster through free agency?
August 10th, 2014 at 2:45 pm
Nice to see that everyone can predict the future. Yes our O-line performed horribly but it’s hardly written in stone that these are the starters and the roster in done. Nobody knows how our team will perform yet….NOBODY. The defense could suck for all we know. We thought it was going to be great last year with Revis and all and look what happened. I think it will be top 5 but we don’t know until we actually play football and gameplan. That was all just non scripted “Let’s find out who can run and pass block”. None of Tedfords offense was implemented. It’s an evaluation period and things will get adjusted. Now, if we still perform like that on week 3 then we have the right to panic but not right now.
August 10th, 2014 at 3:07 pm
I sense a bit of Father Dungy stubborn with Lovie.
That line is a big bowlful of suck…..
August 10th, 2014 at 3:11 pm
Panic! Panic! Panic!!
August 10th, 2014 at 3:11 pm
Well if they are not gonna change “their plan”….what is “their” plan…I realize it is a secret…and they didn’t tip “their” hand Friday Night……this must be a really good “plan”…is it as good as the “Tedford” secret plan ?…..
August 10th, 2014 at 3:13 pm
Buc the haters- yeah I rushed through that last post a bit but it is not nearly as bad as you say. Just an opportunity for you to take a cheap shot on me. Feel better? Don’t bother to address the content of my statement or acknowledge that the BS you have been peddling all off season about how great that loser McCown is has now so clearly made you look foolish. As if it were possible after your embarrassing IQ self-glossing episode! You wizard!!! Please tell us more about how spectacular McCown and our offense is? I want to see you tell us again more about how we are going to be the best offense in the league, win the division, go to SB and all the rest of your divine premonitions! You are THE biggest joke on this site besides your man crush McCown!
August 10th, 2014 at 3:16 pm
If what you say is true then JOE.. hes not open to all options.. because as espn reported a trade for a low mid round pick next year for a guard wouldnt definitly help this team…
August 10th, 2014 at 3:19 pm
Kenyatta Walker ain’t walking thru that door to help our O’line…oh wait, that’s actually a good thing!
It’s still preseason and we shouldn’t panic after a few series by the first stringers.
August 10th, 2014 at 3:21 pm
@ Joe Buc….. It’s 4 mill for two years the 49ers owe him. Would be a great investment to trade for Boone. No line….another losing season.
August 10th, 2014 at 3:27 pm
Winston won’t be coming out until 2016. I don’t know why people keep saying we will draft him next year.
August 10th, 2014 at 3:29 pm
Looking closely at our o-line play from Friday, even though Collins gave up two sacks (one was really a coverage sack) he looked decent and so did Dietrich-Smith and Dotson. The problem is that Cousins and Meredith are not starting OG’s. In fact they may not even be backups on most NFL teams. They were getting tossed around like rag dolls. That’s where our problem lies.
I’m willing to give L&L the benefit of the doubt that maybe those two were given the first start because of their veteran status and to give them enough rope to hang themselves in a starting role and give credence to them being benched, but that the OG’s that they truly believe could start are further down the initial “depth chart” (Omameh, Daniels, Edwards).
Now over the course of the next two games if those other OG’s look similar to Cousins and Meredith I’d say we are in big trouble. Real big trouble. But I’m going to let those next two games play out before passing judgment on this issue as a fan. After all it was only the first preseason game and I know L&L have a plan in place. I want to see what that plan is and not give in to the sky is falling mentality of most Bucs “fans”.
August 10th, 2014 at 3:33 pm
Db, I was just busting your chops, bro (for all your cheap shots about my obvious typos). Please un-bunch your panties. I do admit that I’m a bit less confident after seeing that garbage OLine play, but McCown’s performance friday doesn’t mean he’s not going to be a stud this year. There’s no way our offense can do anything great without solid Oline play, but they could still do better than that with an actual gameplan & scheme implemented. And fyi I’m only a joke to you, Lightningbuc, and maybe Buc Realist. 3 of the most negative people on here
August 10th, 2014 at 3:44 pm
@ A-Train
Interesting article you posted. According to the article, our offensive lineman were intentionally left to fend for themselves in order to see how they would respond individually. Here’s the quote for Lovie
“You want to put guys on an island to see how we could perform one-on-one, and we got beat a few times, especially inside at the guard position,” Smith said. “But we got beat on the outside also, too, by some of our better players. That will just kind of get their attention a little more.”
So from Lovie, the offensive line struggles in that game was all according to plan. I dont know how much I believe that, but if it is true then our o line should greatly improve once they are allowed to play as a unit. There might be some hope after all.
August 10th, 2014 at 3:46 pm
Get Incognito that dude would be remorseful and hungry and ready to go to war for the fans and his 52 other teammates… and i am pretty sure ryan mallett and/or kirk cousins will be available come offseason because glennon IS not the future
August 10th, 2014 at 3:49 pm
Jeremy Zuttah sure does look good right about now. He was versatile and way better than anyone we hv right now. That was deplorable!!! McCown falls apart w pressure on him. Napolean way more decisive w the ball.
August 10th, 2014 at 3:54 pm
Not sure what is worse Evan Longoria or the bucs OL both seem to be season killers
August 10th, 2014 at 3:54 pm
All, I see is BLACKOUTS once again!
August 10th, 2014 at 4:06 pm
Chris@Apple Roof Cleaning Says:
August 10th, 2014 at 1:27 pm
How thick is your skull? They’ve made a point of removing turds from the roster. What indications do you have to make you think they would want to bring on that asswagon? Why do people kvetch over things they know are not going to happen? Get over it!
August 10th, 2014 at 4:16 pm
What qualifies Incognito as a “turd”? Because he was outed doing something that went on in 31 other NFL locker rooms until this case was made public because Martin was a baby. Pretty sure NFL’s hard knocks covered the dolphins that season and that never came to light during that seasons show. Only thing that year was ochocinco. Incognito did not beat his wife and then get a standing ovation upon return, he did not drive drunk and kill someone and be allowed back for the “shield” he did not run a dog fighting ring and many more… but he is blackballed? SMH
August 10th, 2014 at 4:25 pm
Can we forget Incognito, please? The dude is a cancer. Its times like these that you sit back and realize the magnitude of natural selection. Some of us are geared to be/do great things. Like be an astronaut, or fighter pilot, or general manager of a pro football team. The rest of us cant make decisions under pressure. Your ready to bring in perhaps one of the top 10 NFL players with bad reps as a fix all for a young and inexperienced o line. What then? It would be like having Trueblood in there all over again. Whats that? Another 15 yard gain negated by a hold, another false start? Oh, fighting again, cause he cant handle smack talk.
Gimme a break. If the decisions around this team were left to some of the fans, this team would go under in a hurry. So shut up and let the coaches coach and lay your little heads down on your little Bucs pillows tonight and thank God that we finally have a good GM and a good coach looking over our ball club.
August 10th, 2014 at 4:29 pm
Why not bring back Davin Joseph if he is available..He is a better option than are current starting guards!!!
August 10th, 2014 at 4:29 pm
Yeah, he’s being blackballed for being a giant a$$h0le. Pass.
August 10th, 2014 at 4:31 pm
Brian Says:
August 10th, 2014 at 4:29 pm
1) He’s on the Rams
2) He’s NOT better than what we have on the roster. Omameh, Edwards, Daniels all are young and talented and will play well for us. Joseph is on the downside of his career.
August 10th, 2014 at 4:38 pm
Is Lovie worried more about having a winning season or having a team full of choir boys? The reward far out weighs the risk. He will come cheap and is a good Guard and if he shows his ass, he can be booted off the team with a minimal loss. It’s not like we can’t use him.
August 10th, 2014 at 4:39 pm
couch fan: EXACTLY
August 10th, 2014 at 4:40 pm
No one here was in that Dolphins locker room. There are two sides to every “story”. Incognito would be a good fit at a good price. Bring him in for a look.
August 10th, 2014 at 4:49 pm
I really find it funny that you can beat up women and murder people and still play in the NFL but you damn well better watch your mouth and not say anything mean or you’ll be black balled right out of the league. Lol
August 10th, 2014 at 4:52 pm
Couch Fan: That stuff went on in 31 other locker rooms and Im sure the dolphins pouncey was the worst of the antagonizers but incognito was quiet…. Ray Rice got a standing ovation? He knocked his friggin wife out???
August 10th, 2014 at 4:54 pm
Yup. I am also positive much MUCH worse things are being said down on the field during games. Just makes no sense.
August 10th, 2014 at 4:57 pm
Lovie and the OL is like maddon and why he keeps running balfour out there
August 10th, 2014 at 5:00 pm
bucd up: a legitimate GM would have gone and made sure the prized free agent? our QB would be protected… aint happening…… its ok 6-10 will now be 2-14 with ugly ass unis….
August 10th, 2014 at 5:03 pm
Everything comes down to whether the NFL can be sued or not. Hard hits to the head; yes. Bullying fellow NFL players yes. Murdering, DUI, Drug use, Domestic abuse, Stealing, Guns, Knives, Speeding, NO! Can’t sue the NFL you are all good, but take away NFL Money and you are black balled. Sorry the NFL won’t take chances with Incognito. You think no other team out of 32 wouldn’t at least try him out?
August 10th, 2014 at 5:05 pm
bucnjim sad but you are spot on…. who was it just recently thar tweeted out his $20k dinner bill w teammates…still goes on… its nfl fraternity stuff
August 10th, 2014 at 5:14 pm
Anybody wonder why Incognito is unemployed? It’s not just the Bucs that think he’s a turd. If you have a good locker room vibe, you don’t bring in a piece of dung like Incognito unless the dude can make a huge difference. He can’t. I don’t think he’s being blackballed. I just think he’s not that good and teams don’t want to deal with his crap. He’s not worth it. Pretty simple.
August 10th, 2014 at 5:18 pm
Logic and reason will get you nowhere on this site, sir.
August 10th, 2014 at 5:21 pm
If HC is asking us to be patient now, what will he be asking in January? To take down the billboards on Dale Mabry? Looks like a very very long season … again.
August 10th, 2014 at 5:35 pm
incognito was a pro bowler his last season? Ya but martin is employed friggin kafka is employed and not tim tebow? People get blackballed unless you beat your wife smoke weed kill someone beat up someone at a club, fight dogs, just dont do pranks…. hard knocks had a few years ago a rookie that got taped to a goalpost… and ppl laughed…. not anymore in this PC world
August 10th, 2014 at 6:08 pm
Joe Says:
“…Anybody wonder why Incognito is unemployed? It’s not just the Bucs that think he’s a turd…”
Logic and reason will get you nowhere on this site, sir.
__________________________________________________________
Here is logic and reason: Barring a trade for a player like Boone, which they seem dead set against, can someone explain with specifics how our OG situation is going to be fixed this year?
L&L did not do a great job “rebuilding” the Oline from last year – IMO, I would take last year’s line, so far, over this year’s. When I look at what teams drafted OGs (Texans, Raiders and Panthers) this year, their castoffs are not going to be any help at all. Is Lovie saying they are going to “coach-up” players that have been medicre, at best, for years and now they are going to be Pro Bowlers? So my point is our choices are very limited. Incognito represents not only the best option as he is a good OG and he would play for Vet Min, but one of the very few options available to the Bucs. So its easy to criticize, but I was taught to present better options if I am going to knock someone else’s ideas – I guess I missed that.
August 10th, 2014 at 6:19 pm
Incognito isnt the answer, if he was he would be on a roster. He’s a sh!t head that causes trouble everywhere he goes.
Its probably a good thing that we have two dozen TE’s on the roster because we will be in a lot of max protect two TE sets.
August 10th, 2014 at 7:59 pm
And people are still panicked after one preseason game. Ready to sell the farm to get another guard. Ready to run the GM out of town cuz he’s not a real GM (obviously, since he didn’t do things the way I wanted — boo hoo). There’s a lot of crying babies out on these here interwebs that need to get a little perspective about their football team after ONE, yes ONE, preseason game.
August 10th, 2014 at 8:10 pm
ya one preseason game that looked like spit… we should want and EXPECT a super bowl caliber team every year or why are we fans to cheer for the 2 wins…20 plus years of sucking makes people want more than arena league OL and qb play… stevie wonder could see that friday
August 10th, 2014 at 8:25 pm
I guess for some that name calling and stupid comments is much easier than contributing intelligent info.
August 10th, 2014 at 9:16 pm
There is no intelligence in b*tching and moaning about the guard position after one preseason game. They still have time to give more work to Daniels, Edwards, and Omameh, and those guys have talent. Frankly, I place a lot more faith in Lovie and Licht than I do the whiners on the googlenets. They have their eyes wide open, they work with these guys every day, they’re aware of what’s available, and they’ve projected who might be available from other teams at cutdown time. There is time. Is it the biggest question on the team? Of course it is… but some of you people are insane with overreaction. It’s so predictable too.
August 10th, 2014 at 10:25 pm
Right guard seemed pretty important Friday night, seeing as how ours got dusted just about every play in the first quarter. I think sticking a tackling dummy there might have been more effective. Don’t kid yourself Joe, if we don’t bring in at least one new guard, we won’t win three games this year. We weren’t exactly playing the best defensive line in the league either. No excuse for that Garbage.
August 10th, 2014 at 11:37 pm
Have you ever been in an NFL locker room?
Or eased dropped o you 14 son, with his friends?
The dolphin linemen stood up for incognito- not the sissy boy.
Incognito’s former teammates stood up for him.
Martin wasn’t capable of handling the normal( albeit outrageous) way that young testosterone raging men talk to each other.
Take a look a Roger Godells NFL. Tons more penalties. Hitting a QB is almost always a foul. Almost every hard hit is a foul. Touching a WR is a foul.
He wants to accentuate the kicking game( allegedly to attract soccer fans)
Defense is to be minimized.
Every play is going to be a passing play.
Michael Sam is a hero- cause he kissed his boy friend. He is the hero of the league.
Incognito is a Villian, because Martin is mentally weak.
That’s the NFL future- because that’s what they’ve decided you want!
No hard hitting, very little Defense. Pretty boy QBs throwing every play to prima Donna WRs, scoreboard like a pinball machine.
Lots of delicate souls, skiipping to the sidelines to kiss their boyfriends.
And lots more Kicking- cause if there is one salvageable part of Football to them- it’s kicking- then meybe we’ll finally get in line- and start loving Soccer!
Yuck
I’ll take Incognito. Thank you
Martin is in San Francisco now. He should find it easier to get along
August 11th, 2014 at 12:27 am
^^ Dude, you’re a phucking neanderthal.
August 11th, 2014 at 12:44 am
Lol this is one time I agree with Tim. People need to quit being so damn sissified. Words dont hurt anyone. You got all kinds of criminals in the league that have done much much worse and they are glorified. Incognito says a few bad words and people are crying like girls. How is Joe calling Incognito all these names any different than Incognito himself? How is it ok for all you people to call the man names but pretend your so much better than he is? Get out of here with that stupidity.
August 11th, 2014 at 1:08 am
Can we jusg please get a offensive guard.. once mccown gets knocked out what more of a reason will we need.. the season will be over..
August 11th, 2014 at 1:08 am
Orca- and damn proud of it.
August 11th, 2014 at 1:10 am
Now run off and go kiss a soccer player or something
August 11th, 2014 at 1:17 am
Wow. Just wow. [SMH]
August 11th, 2014 at 3:28 am
Damn- sounds just like one of my girlfriends!
‘Cept there is an occasional “oh God” in between them “Wows”
August 11th, 2014 at 3:49 am
I think hard hits should get you sent to the Probowl, not the commissioners office. John Lynch, Jack Lambert, Mike Singletary wouldn’t be allowed to play in today’s softie NFL
I think a great defense is as much fun to watch as a great offense. Especially when they play in Tampa!
I think WRs should have to play against a defensive back. Not get a free” untouched ” trip down the field every time. Otherwise, they are track stars- not football players. You can barely touch them with the rules today.
I would rather see teams go for two, than watch kickers kick longer extra points. Kicking a ball doesn’t excite me. I miss kickoffs. But not because if the kicker.
More fouls makes a worse game. Now they want penalities on every passing play- plus reviews from NY.
And I don’t need to see a player of limited skills- getting more air time than many superior players- just because he kissed another guy on national TV. I don’t really wanna see anybody wrapped up in a lip lock. It’s Football!! Not the damn dating game!
I realize that all of the above makes me a Neanderthal.
But wait til they are done reshaping the NFL in their own image.
It’s hard to destroy something as popular as the NFL, but it can be done
And Mark Cuban isn’t the only one worried it will happen
August 11th, 2014 at 11:19 am
You keep going – it doesn’t make you look any more intelligent. You’re blurring lines between a few unrelated issues. But apparently you have some issues around masculinity. I suggest therapy.