Hall Of Fame Chance For Charles Sims?
July 3rd, 2014
A local beat writer and a national analyst weigh in. Photo courtesy of Tampa Bay Buccaneers.
The discussion of why Tampa Bay drafted rookie running back Charles Sims in the third round is one that might last a while. Simply outlined, the Bucs had strong running backs depth before the pick, and selecting a back that early — in a position that has been greatly devalued in the draft — was an eyebrow-raiser.
There’s even been heated debate of the motives at JoeBucsFan.com headquarters.
Three important things are known.
1) General manager Jason Licht says every last key staff member at One Buc Palace was on board, happy and pleased by the successful targeting of Sims, and every other offseason move.
2) Licht also has stressed “value” repeatedly, how he’s a running a value driven personnel operation.
3) Doug Martin is a great talent, and he was healthy and the No. 1 running back through all spring practices and minicamps.
As Joe’s written previously, Joe believes Sims was brought on board to limit Martin’s carries and preserve his career. However, many other running backs could have filled that role, guys off the street, guys on the roster, or a much later draft pick. The third round was an awfully high pick to be a backup running back in an offense that was — and is — desperate for more offensive line talent.
So why the relatively huge investment in Sims?
Bucs beat writer Rick Stroud hopped on SiriusXM NFL Radio recently for chat with weekend host Howard David, who’s called many NFL games during long career.
David thinks Sims has Hall of Fame talent in his body and the Bucs were big winners in the third round. Stroud agreed.
“I think they got themselves a steal here. I don’t want to give him the bust into Canton just yet, but I think he’s got a chance,” David said.
Stroud was all-in with that take.
“He has a real chance. And you know Spencer Tillman, the guy that’s the Bucs running backs coach, you know, he kind of found Matt Forte, as well,” Stroud said.
“You bring in a new coaching staff, and they just wanted something a little different. This guy’s 6 foot. I mean, he’s a bigger back, but he’s so versatile. I mean, he’ll play as much slot receiver, maybe, as he will at the running back position. But he’s still got plenty of ability to run the football. So It’s rare to find guys who are natural catchers of the football out of the backfield.”
Stroud went on to say his analysis of Jeff Tedford’s offense at “Cal” leaves him to believe Sims is the ideal fit for the Bucs offense.
So where does that leave Martin? Frankly, it leaves Martin exactly in the situation he should be in — serving as the No. 1 back with a talented young guy breathing down his neck for carries.
Sims, for sure, will get a massive load of work in preseason. Joe wants to see what that looks like before using “Canton” and “Sims” in the same conversation.
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:24 am
Joe, how are his hands when you watch him catch passes in practice. It’s pretty easy to tell if a guy is a natural pass catcher or not. I’m just wondering because I read that article that said his hands weren’t that great, now I’m reading he has hall of fame potential. Which one is it in your opinion from what you have seen?
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:40 am
We seem to have some really great talent at the ALL the skill positions. I just hope that Oline and Tedford can get the job done. And we will find out soon enough, because our defense is going to be good and if the O can’t score Bucs fans will be screaming.
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:42 am
Spin it anyway you want, it was not a position in need. If you consider RB depth ( & then O-line depth ), it makes it harder to justify. Unless you have him graded as an elite prospect – I wouldnt have done it.
Hope he is who they think he is though – Go Bucs!
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:45 am
and this is the point when you relize there is nothing to talk about untill training camp . WOW !!!!!!
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:47 am
I hope this works out. Would rather have gotten a guard or tackle in the third. I sense a lot of swing passes to him to blunt the interior rush sure to come through the sieve that is our interior line.
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:52 am
Watch this kid’s highlights and tell me he’s doesn’t look like a wide receiver… GREAT HANDS!
Go Bucs!
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:54 am
People don’t draft need anymore. bowers was need pick, clayborn need pick Gaines Adams Brian price needs picks. Derrick Ward was a need signing. You have to draft BPA, players get hurt too frequently and coordinators are in and out to draft based on need and scheme fit. For all we know our line could be set with the additions we made(I doubt it) but if it is and we added a dimension with a RB despite lack of RB need then boom that’s how you win. Stock loading talent. God sakes Michael Bennett wasn’t much of a need for Seattle
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:56 am
I’d love it if he’s right but… it’s a rookie in July that we’re talking about here so maybe they should chill out on their analysis.
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:59 am
@Rls_buc At the time we had Sims drafted, we had two running backs nursing injuries suffered from the year before, with the only healthy player being a free agent that somewhat panned out. You would call that position rock-solid? Even if so, Tedford’s offenses have typically carried two backs, with one typically being more of a pass catcher than the other. Sims is necessary for Tedford’s offense and you will see lots of production out of him. Just watch.
July 3rd, 2014 at 12:21 pm
The impact isn’t on Martin…..we had James or Rainey to give him a rest….the impact is on James or Rainey….possible trades.
We really need a slot reciever and we may have found one in Sims….Herron too.
Sometimes its the crazy-ass picks that turn out like gold!!!
July 3rd, 2014 at 12:22 pm
Sims’ career in college: 5,573 rushing and receiving yards, 51 touchdowns! The guy is a playmaker on an offense now that sorely needed more.
According to NFL.com: “BOTTOM LINE on Sims; Athletic, competitive, tough, upright slasher who is an asset as a receiver — hands rate among the best on a RB in recent years. Cannot project as a bellcow, but offers playmaking ability as part of a tandem in a zone scheme.”
July 3rd, 2014 at 12:22 pm
I think we gotta bigger Sproles
July 3rd, 2014 at 1:14 pm
Sims is a reciever that can run……
July 3rd, 2014 at 1:17 pm
Having so many quality RB’s is a problem that every teams wishes they had.
I just hope we find a way to keep all five, even if we have to sacrifice our specialist long-snapper. Teach Dietrich-Smith to long snap. It would be a shame to lose one of them to a division rival. We have never had this much quality depth before at RB and after last year it proved you can’t have enough either.
July 3rd, 2014 at 1:29 pm
Sims is a running back that can receive. Don’t be fooled. Wait and see!
July 3rd, 2014 at 1:50 pm
Sims brings versatility as an athlete, I don’t think his drafting was an indictment against Doug Martin who should indeed spearhead our rushing attack, nor do I see it as a sign of any displeasure in our other RBs. I think it’s not stated enough that Sims, aside from being a benefactor of Dana Holgersom’s warped(in a good way) offensive approach, was also recruited as a WR(which explains his hands). I see Sims as a swing player, in the fashion of a guy who has the measurables to be a threat to defenses from multiple positions wether it be in the backfield/lined up as a Slot WR in a way Martin/Rainey/James may not pose that same threat.
July 3rd, 2014 at 2:04 pm
Keep this in mind….. we were the worst offense in the NFL last year.
The consensus amongst the experts is that we picked up an elite talent in the 3rd round. A playmaker who can give us another dimension of offense is not a position of need?
July 3rd, 2014 at 2:08 pm
Viewed his film and this Kid has GREAT hands and receiver instincts and the footwork of a running back. He’ll be DANGEROUS from anywhere on the field.
July 3rd, 2014 at 2:09 pm
Expect a lot of 2 back sets where he swings to the slot.
July 3rd, 2014 at 2:20 pm
Those saying it wasn’t a position of need are right, and that’s one of the reasons I love the pick. Great teams don’t reach for need. They draft BPA and get great long term value. Love the pick.
July 3rd, 2014 at 2:23 pm
Our offense will sport Jackson, Evans , ASJ or Wright, with a two back set including Martin & Sims…. Pair that with an already talented defense & steady QB play. This will be an exciting year of bucs football.
July 3rd, 2014 at 2:35 pm
Soooo… the preseason crack pipe is fired up I see.
July 3rd, 2014 at 3:33 pm
Joe
Please tell me if I have this correctly, we drafted a HB, who is now the largest on the team, the size of a normal receiver, with the speed of a little guy trackster, and the hands of an all pro, who can play either as a back or slot receiver with the three really big receivers and people are wondering why we drafted him?
Well for starters, who is going to cover him and for want of a better term, the Forest? Remember there is another back or TE or even another slot receiver out there. Did I miss something?
July 3rd, 2014 at 4:09 pm
@andres… A lot of us are smoking the Super Bowl crack pipe.
July 3rd, 2014 at 4:56 pm
How can anyone even conceive of bringing up HOF for any player before they’ve ever played a game in the NFL? I mean, it’s nice that somebody thinks highly of this guy we drafted… The rest is craziness.
July 3rd, 2014 at 5:11 pm
IMO, Sims will be a bigger version of Percy Harvin… Just Watch. We are so stacked this year other than OL… (but we may still sign someone in FA and/or a couple guys could step up… Kadeem Edwards is super smart & guys like that tend to learn quickly.) #TRUTH
July 3rd, 2014 at 5:13 pm
I’m definitely smoking the Superbowl crackpipe!!!! #WEARESOSTACKEDDONTHATE
July 3rd, 2014 at 5:16 pm
@ JOES
Am I wrong about Edwards ? ^^^^^
Joe loves the enthusiasm, but let’s see the guy hit somebody. Let’s seem him move our backup defensive tackles off the ball in training camp before going bananas. lol. –Joe
July 3rd, 2014 at 6:07 pm
@Drew I’m burning the 8-8 stash this year.
July 3rd, 2014 at 6:27 pm
The Cliffnotes version Sims = Giovanni Bernard. He will almost assuredly be a good change of pace #2 RB for the Bucs and probably a good #3 RB in most Fantasy leagues. Good pick, great if Martin gets hurt
July 3rd, 2014 at 6:29 pm
Tampabaybucfan Says:
July 3rd, 2014 at 12:21 pm
… And that’s why they draft value instead of need. If Sims blows up, they’ll all say Jason Licht is executive of the year… And all the people who whined that we didn’t overdraft an offensive lineman in round 3 will be eating crow.
July 3rd, 2014 at 6:49 pm
I feel like I’m a very logical optimist though, Joe….
July 3rd, 2014 at 7:08 pm
Rick Stroud is a twit.
To even talk hall of fame before the kid takes a season snap is complete idiocy. We SHOULD be talking about Doug Martin, not a 3rd round rb whose success is all talk.
The way Tampa fans forget about players and mention all the talent in a rookie class is stupid. Talk about the talent that has taken snaps. Don’t give credit to draftees that have not.
July 3rd, 2014 at 7:24 pm
They were just saying that it’s possible that Sims has the type of talent, athleticism, & skillset that they could envision someone making a hall-of-fame-caliber career with…. It’s just bcuz Sims is ridonkulously talented. 8^D amn that kid is a homerun hitter….
July 3rd, 2014 at 8:49 pm
I just believe a draftee has to prove himself. Earn respect. Not on of our rookies hae yeat, and they won’t do it this year.
Say, for example, Evans has 1200 yards receiving. Great. He’ll still have to prove it wasn’t a fluke like…say…Michael Clayton.
Meanwhile, we have established starters, other than GMC and LVD who are getting no credit by fans.
It’s that old Chaos Fan mentality. Constand change (chaos) is believe by many to make the team better. That is not the case. It takes time for new players to gel. Time that Chaos Fans don’t have the fortitude to give.
Fans wanted McCoy gone. Fans want Foster gone. Fans, this off season, wanted Vincent Jackson and both our kicker and our punter gone.
Chaos Fans.
Make the players earn their spots and praise before you start cutting proven ones. Common sense.
July 3rd, 2014 at 8:50 pm
Omg, my tablet hacked up those words, lol.
July 3rd, 2014 at 8:52 pm
@Joe
I would really prefer NOT to see “The power of the pu$$y” ads when I come here. Promoting porn books.
July 3rd, 2014 at 9:32 pm
lol, uh, everyone has a chance to be a hall of famer. Stroud is a genius!
July 3rd, 2014 at 9:38 pm
Pretty sure advertisers just take the information that you’ve been searching and display them as ads on various websites that you visit. I doubt Joe has any control over that. Might want to cut back on the porn lol, or clear cookies.
As for Sims, I cant wait to see what he can do. My guess is that he will play mostly on third downs, seeing how he is a good blocker and receiver. Other than that, It should still be the Doug Martin show. We’ll see. This off season is painfully slow.
July 3rd, 2014 at 10:06 pm
The SEC wanted Edwards but his grades were too poor, so likely he isn’t that smart. That’s likely why they are teaching him only one position. The smart new lineman is 315 lb Chase Daniel who will be able to step into any position on the OL. Watch him play Center on the second OL in preseason. There is a good reason Licht didn’t spend the third pick on an OL. He knows you can develop great linemen from walk ons and we have the Coaches to do it. Lovie had a terrific RB that tore up our defense in London. The RB Coach picked him and he was looking for a clone of him in the draft and he found Sims to be that clone. That is the real reason they took Sims and he will be right in the backfield with Martin and I believe he will outshine Martin. They will need Rainey and Mike as the backup tandem. I think Lovie is hoping Demps will be a clone of Hester and can also play a role like Sproles. We are fortunate!!!
July 3rd, 2014 at 10:28 pm
Well said, owlykat… I just hope we have an OLineman or 2 who develops into a solid starter relatively quickly.. Patrick Omameh might be good, too… As for our offense, we have so much talent. If our OLine is decent at all, I seriously Don’t know how anyone will have a prayer of stopping us.
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:13 pm
They Like him. They like him a lot. And when they see something they like. They go for it.
July 3rd, 2014 at 11:20 pm
Andrew 1 busted Bonzai for visiting porn sites! Oops! Andrew is right. Ads are driven by products you’ ve search for or websites you’ve visited.
July 4th, 2014 at 12:54 am
Best thread in awhile!!! LMAO!!
July 4th, 2014 at 6:37 am
As for porn and ads… I’m not buying into the cookies thing. I think these ads are completely random. Right now, other than an ad for whey protein, there isn’t a single ad on either side of the page of anything I’ve ever looked for. And as for whey protein, the only way tracking cookies could’ve tracked me on that would be if they tracked me all the way to Walmart.
I live in DC and I’ve been in Sarasota for the past two weeks (and will be for 4 more) and I’ve seen ZERO difference in the ads here, meaning that they aren’t even based on zip codes of internet providers. It’s completely random.
July 4th, 2014 at 6:40 am
owlykat Says:
July 3rd, 2014 at 10:06 pm
The SEC wanted Edwards but his grades were too poor, so likely he isn’t that smart. That’s likely why they are teaching him only one position. The smart new lineman is 315 lb Chase Daniel who will be able to step into any position on the OL. Watch him play Center on the second OL in preseason.
———————————————
Bro, Chase Daniel is a backup QB for the KC Chiefs, used to be Brees’ backup in NO, and started for Missouri in college. Maybe you mean, Jace Daniels?
July 4th, 2014 at 8:28 am
Potential HOF’ers on our roster: GMC, LVD, (maybe a few others who are thus far unproven)…. Potential Probowlers on our roster: VJax, Doug Martin, Charles Sims, ASJ, Mike Evans, Tim Wright, ATV, GMC, LVD, Michael Johnson, Clinton McDonald, Mason Foster, Mark Barron, The Hawk, Johnathan Banks, maybe a couple others…. We are so stacked, people. We have like 10-15 potential probowl-caliber players.