Lovie: Glennon Needs Pocket Mobility
February 21st, 2014
The Buccaneers’ fearless leaders, Lovie Smith and Jason Licht, praise Mike Glennon for being a steadily improving rookie with a great work ethic and strong throwing skills. On the other hand, they won’t dare call Glennon their starting quarterback.
Some Bucs fans inexplicably think that’s normal, despite the fact 14 of 16 starting quarterback jobs in the NFC already are established without controversy.
Yes, only the Bucs and Vikings have QB questions in the NFC.
Joe had a candid chat with Bucs quarterbacks coach Marcus Arroyo about Mike Glennon, and now Lovie is echoing an area of Glennon’s game Arroyo also says needs improvement.
“Mike’s the first to tell you he needs to work on mobility in the pocket,” Lovie said yesterday on NFL Network.
Yes, Glennon, for a pure pocket passer, isn’t silky smooth in the pocket like Falcons star Matt Ryan is. Glennon doesn’t step up and side-step very well. And, like Ryan, he doesn’t move out of the pocket with ease, though he was better than expected.
Glennon very well could win the starting job come September, but Joe believes that would mean another Bucs QB has underperformed. Joe can’t imagine the Bucs go to training camp with Glennon as the most talented quarterback — raw talent — on the roster.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:11 pm
Think most logical people would agree with you..
February 21st, 2014 at 1:12 pm
I don’t know where the controversy is, except for your man love of Manziel.
Lovie said he can win with Glennon, but he wants competition. Lovie does not want to determine his future (anointing Glennon the starter a la Schiano / Freeman) on a limited amount of work.
If he and the GM believe they can upgrade this position or bring depth then then will. Simple as that. And I trust them more than past talent evaluators.
And you don’t think there is a QB controversy in Dallas? Obviously you are drinking the Jerry Jones Kool Aide.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:17 pm
And I quote from Lovie Smith about the QB position, “If you ask me would you like to upgrade the position? I’m not running around the question. That’s a yes, too.” I think that says it all, they are clearly looking for an upgrade over Glennon.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:31 pm
Yes they are looking for an upgrade…. Nobody has ever disputed this.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:32 pm
Can we get an updated photo? That helmet Glennon is wearing is so 2013. Jeez get with the times.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:36 pm
@ Coach Fan
Ok… then why is the MGM so adamant that he starts when the bucs obviously want to replace him? get over it people, the bucs dont want him as their starting QB.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:43 pm
Nobody is adamant that he starts. Only that he is given a fair chance to start.
The dispute is how do we go about upgrading the position. Most want to trade up. My opinion is that it’s better for the team overall to stick with Glennon for another year, see what you have then make your decision next year on a QB.
Build the team up around him.
As far as what Lovie said, its laughable that you are taking something so generic and making it mean only what you want it to mean. Yes the Bucs are looking for an upgrade and competition which I believe will come after round 1 in the draft.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:51 pm
Generic? if they want an upgrade, why would they wait another season to even think about upgrading the most important position in football? chances are they will take a chance on someone else before they start Glennon. Mostly likely imo a veteran. That is the way I see it.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:53 pm
I still contend that the time to trade up is next year (if necessary) There will be several teams at the top of this year’s draft picking QBs and some later in the draft. Many teams already have a solid QB…..yes we will probably have a pick around 20 (hopefully) instead of 7…..but there are several QBs coming out next year including Mariota, Winston, Hundley and more.
We should also have our full compliment of picks next year.
Bringing in a FA or later round draft pick to compete with Glennon is essential and if Glennon wins the job, he will get a chance to gain more experience with different coaching and more weapons.
If he doesn’t succeed….there is always next year’s draft.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:54 pm
No way in hell would Lovie or any other coach limit their options by flat out publicly saying Glennon will not be our starting. They wouldn’t back themselves into a corner like that. That is why you got to read between the lines a little bit.
February 21st, 2014 at 1:55 pm
i kinda like logan thomas in the later rounds
February 21st, 2014 at 2:04 pm
“Some Bucs fans inexplicably think that’s normal”
It’s absolutley normal for a new head coach to want to see what he has before naming a 2nd year QB his starter.
Why on earth would a new head coach name anyone not named Manning, Brady or Brees a starter before he has had one mini camp?
That would be ridiculous.
I for one think Glennon will win the job but that doesn’t mean I think he shouldn’t have competition.
There are 5 players on this team whose jobs are safe…Mcoy, David , Revis , Baron and Goldson. Those are the 5 guys that Lovie mentioned by name last night on NFL network as being the solid base of the defense…you can prob add VJax to that list as well.
Anyone else is going to have to compete including the QB.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:07 pm
sorry glennon, you cant go out and get pocket mobility…..i thought that word functional mobility was the silliest word made by nfl analyst so far, dysfunctional mobility is more like reality and if you think about it, he was training like everyone else working on his 40 time and still ran a 4.94 which means he’s actually slower than that….but i’m honestly hoping he puts on some bulk and improves his quickness because that would give him much favor and consideration in their eyes but he’s probably at one buc place sucking up instead of going somewhere improving his game….if he works on his quickness and footwork he’d with some added muscle he’d probably make a big jump
February 21st, 2014 at 2:09 pm
First, I think Detroit and St.Louis, as well as Phoenix, Minnesota and the Bucs are actively looking. There are (or should be) questions in Chicago and Dallas. There are problems that outsiders can see in New York and Washington, though those teams prefer not to see any trouble. So spare us the line that Tampa Bsy is so unusual in its lack of a firm “franchise” qback.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:09 pm
he’s already smart right, he’s not tim tebow so his mechanics are that screwed up because their better than jf5 but he’s just slow and goofy looking, add more weight and speed and i’d be more at ease…im tired of cringing everytime he takes just like when vick gets hit but cringing for different reasons
February 21st, 2014 at 2:11 pm
Generic? if they want an upgrade, why would they wait another season to even think about upgrading the most important position in football?
—————————————-
Your only seeing your side of it. Your assuming they are without a doubt looking for a new QB so your attempting to put 2 and 2 together. That’s not how it is.
The reality is nobody has any clue what the new coaching regime thinks about Glennon. So saying we want to upgrade in that sense is very generic as I am sure they want to upgrade a dozen other positions as well. Will they? We will see. As I said, I think it will be after round 1.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:12 pm
peyton manning = zero mobility. not comparing , just sayin’.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:13 pm
@Couch Fan Says:
“…Nobody is adamant that he starts. Only that he is given a fair chance to start.
The dispute is how do we go about upgrading the position. Most want to trade up. My opinion is that it’s better for the team overall to stick with Glennon for another year, see what you have then make your decision next year on a QB…”
Ok, PLEASE answer this question. I have asked it before and NONE of the MGMers will respond.
So, lets say Glennon gets another year and he fails. HOW do we get a franchise QB then??
FA: this year is typical, no one is trading away franchise QBs – Vick is the best there is to offer
Draft in the Middle Rds: Even Seattle’s gm is quoted as saying they got ridiculously lucky. A team could draft a QB in the middle rounds for years and not get as lucky as Seattle did.
Move up in the draft: If Lovie does what we think he will, the Bucs will go not much less than 500 for the foreseeable future. If we can’t afford to move up this year at the 7th spot, how do we move up when we are at 15???
February 21st, 2014 at 2:14 pm
@bucray1 Says:
peyton manning = zero mobility. not comparing , just sayin’.
@Couch Fan
What is this if it is NOT a comparison???
February 21st, 2014 at 2:15 pm
Further, wasn’t the puppy braying at this time last year when Schiano announced there would be competition at q-b? That was taken as insulting to the Sleepy One. I believe #8 expects lots of competition and is working to fight off the others and win the spot. Hope the others are too.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:19 pm
What Couch is saying:
If Manziel or Bridgewater falls to pick 7, sure pick him if you believe they are an instant upgrade. Bringing in competition is a must. Of course you want to have someone ready in case Glennon flops. Trading up is just plain stupid, we don’t have many draft picks. Why not build an elite team around Glennon, than if he plays bad, no excuse and quarterback becomes the number one target in 2015. Not to mention the qb class of 2015 is looking pretty damn good. So why not upgrade the team around the qb now giving Glennon a legitimate shot and at the same time making it easier for the next quarterback should Glennon not step up and play. Glennon will most likely be on the roster in 2014, as a starter, who knows, but it will not be given to him. The best scenario is to get a qb in the later rounds, bring in a vet and tell Glennon to go out and win the job. Unless a Bridgewater falls, which is highly unlikely at this point
February 21st, 2014 at 2:19 pm
“but he’s probably at one buc place sucking up instead of going somewhere improving his game”
WHAT is that buclyfe?
a guy can’t introduce himself without being a suck up?
I will agree the tone of Lovie’s statements do reflect him wanting and upgrade, if others will agree the best way for him to get value from pick #7 (if he were to trade back) would be for him to use the “impression” that he wants a qb. this would make anyone trading behind us and neding a qb nervous and willing to give up some picks to get the qb we might supposedly want. savvy?
February 21st, 2014 at 2:20 pm
@harry
Only way in my opinion to ever get a real franchise QB is in the draft. That’s the only place I would look for 1.
I have no problems with the Bucs trading up for a QB. I just dont think THIS year is the year to do it. And it has nothing to do with the QBs coming out this year. I, happen to like Manziel myself.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:21 pm
Answer to Harry from a non-mob member: the majority of the top a-bs seem to come after pick #12. Brady, kaepernick, Wilson, Brees, Rotesberger etc . A high pick just ensures the player will be featured for a long spell.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:23 pm
My best reading between the lines has the bucs taking Carr at 7.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:23 pm
@ Coach Fan
I’m all for giving Glennon a fair chance to start next season, I can agree with you on that. But I’m curious, do you think that if we drafted a QB in the first round that Glennon would get a fair shot? imo unfortunately no. You said draft a QB after round 1, and if that is the case then he probably will get a fair shot. But if your looking to upgrade the position, then why not take one of the best QB’s in the first round. taking a QB in the second or later rounds is a half-hearted attempted at an upgrade. I guess what we dont agree on is to what extent the bucs are willing to take make an upgrade. I say go all in, given the importance of the position.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:23 pm
Mr Glennon is to slow and not mobile , cant throw on the run to his left and is not accurate on throwing the long ball . He will always be the 4th best qb in our own division. The position is to important so the bucs must make every effort to find their man as it starts with the qb
February 21st, 2014 at 2:24 pm
Spot on Touchdown Gus
February 21st, 2014 at 2:25 pm
And what if there is a run on the position this year — if Borthles and abridge water and Manzell are all gone, do we reach for Carr? If he is out, for Garrafalo? Wouldn’t ‘ all those be better than. #8? When does hope give way to reality?
February 21st, 2014 at 2:25 pm
6-10 (my 2014 Bucs prediction to date)will land the Bucs around the 8th or 9th spot. There are 3 teams that need a QB prior to the Bucs picking at 7. Yet some people think the Bucs actually have a shot at nabbing 1 of the only 2 QB’s worth trading up for. I call that either childish or delusional.
Again 3 teams that need a QB badly are picking ahead of the Bucs.
Let me repeat, for the slow people.
3 teams that need a QB badly are picking ahead of the Bucs.
3 teams that need a QB badly are picking ahead of the Bucs.
3 teams that need a QB badly are picking ahead of the Bucs.
3 teams that need a QB badly are picking ahead of the Bucs.
3 teams that need a QB badly are picking ahead of the Bucs.
Now read that sentence over and over until you people understand that the Bucs don’t have a prayer of moving up and getting a”franchise QB”.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:28 pm
A lot of people are talking about getting a quarterback next year because the prospects will be better. That is the exact same thing people were saying last year. Problem is like this year some kids don’t come out or they get injured or a number of things happen. I believe if the quarterback is there this year that the brain trust believes is their franchise quarterback I have nonproblem with them trading up. Do what you have to to get the best guy possible.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:29 pm
We need an upgrade
he is immobile
were looking at QB in first round
All said by the man’s head coach!
February 21st, 2014 at 2:29 pm
@Andrew 1
I would normally say go all in as well at the QB position. But I just dont see a reason to do that just yet.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:30 pm
@Harry —
Most top level q-bs come after the top of the draft. Think Brady, Bree’s, Kaepernick, Rothlesberger, and Wildon. Didn’t Green Bay get Rodgers late in the 1st?
A high pick means a big investment, not necessarily a big return.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:31 pm
“Glennon Needs Pocket Mobility”
Exactly what I said earlier today.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:38 pm
Glennon’s mobility is’nt great, yet it can and will improve with better OL protection. In a poster’s recently submitted article rating the QB’s, Glennon was rated 18th. It stated he had the ability to sidestep or evade the rush. To me he had trouble moving to his left under strong pressure. He will improve no doubt, IMO. I still like his chances to be the starter with all competition. If not, next man up.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:38 pm
Ok Harry, here’s yor answer. Btw I’m not MGM. If Glennon fails then we would be in the same boat we’re in now. If he has success then we made a steal in the draft. Fact is that nobody knows. But suggesting we trade the bank for an unproven QB is even worse. Think about it…… Let’s stay we trade up and get one of these so called franchise QBs and then they fail. I do believe that puts us in more of a hole then we are now do to lost picks and lost talent. I think staying at 7 getting a great talent and use a later pick for a so called franchise QB. Nobody, not one of these QBs in this draft should be in the 1st. Too many questions on them to just have that so called franchise QB status put on them
February 21st, 2014 at 2:47 pm
People that call other people suck ups for doing basically what’s expected of them are usually the losers in life that think they got passed up for a promotion cuz they didn’t kiss ass. Its the same liberal crap Obama wants every one to believe. If you got passed up you got screwed no matter how lazy you are. If out working the room is sucking up then I want suck ups to fill this roster.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:55 pm
If there is one of those top QBs the bucs really want in this draft who they think will be good, then get him, that’s all I’m saying. There is no doubt that would fulfill the upgrade that they are seeking. If not then pick up a veteran, draft one in the later rounds, and have those two compete with Glennon for the starting job and may the best man win. That might not be an upgrade to the QB position, but it may be the option we take.
February 21st, 2014 at 2:57 pm
Hope they sign one in FA and draft one as well and have all three compete for the starters job. Make a decision by week 4 of the pre-season and cut one or place one on the practice squad.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:00 pm
@Mike:
“…Ok Harry, here’s yor answer. Btw I’m not MGM. If Glennon fails then we would be in the same boat we’re in now…”
No, and that is exactly my point. We will not be in the same boat.
Most in here agree that the draft is the only place to get a franchise QB; and I will add most, who have a clue, know that the odds go up exponentially if you draft one using a high 1st rd pick (like where we are now at 7). I read a really well done analysis that said historically, QBs drafted with a top 7 pick had around a 50% success rate where as outside of that top 7 pick was like a 15% success rate.
Most in here believe, as I do, that Lovie and Co, in their worst year will win at least half their games. That puts us drafting in the middle of the round. If we can’t move up now bc it would involve trading too many picks, HOW do we trade up next year when we are picking at #15???
February 21st, 2014 at 3:03 pm
^^^ what chefpaul said!
February 21st, 2014 at 3:04 pm
@Mike:
“…Nobody, not one of these QBs in this draft should be in the 1st. Too many questions on them to just have that so called franchise QB status put on them…”
Says who??? EVERY analyst, EVERY mock has at least 3 QBs going in the top 10. Where did you come up with this?
February 21st, 2014 at 3:04 pm
@Buc1987. We get it. Three teams ahead of us will most likely draft a qb, that still leaves two options.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000313170/article/top-5-2014-nfl-draft-prospects-by-position-quarterbacks
The three picks will most likely be Bridgewater, Manziel and Bortles. That still leaves Mccarron and Carr. If the Bucs evaluate the remaining two and decide not to draft then we will see what happens. I would like to see them draft a TE or OT-OG.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:05 pm
glennon is a pocket statue! he is inaccurate on long passes and where is it said that he is intelligent…just from the Geoffrey fan club.
need a qb this year. there are more than 3 that are better prospects than glennon was/is. there are no good to great qb’s coming free in freeagency this year or the next 2. next year everyone things we will pick in the teens which will be too late. also, mariota sucks, Winston might stay in, so that leaves hundley and there are always teams lookin qb at the top of the draft.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:05 pm
@chef paul Says:
“…People that call other people suck ups for doing basically what’s expected of them are usually the losers in life…”
Amen brother!
February 21st, 2014 at 3:06 pm
Next year is next year. I dont worry about that sort of thing because none of us know what will happen next year. I think its wrong to assume that we will win at least 8 games and will not get this chance again.
If you are right about Glennon and our offense wont improve from last year then there is no way we win 8 games. Dont care how good our defense is.
I typically am all for moving up, but usually you need a reason that year to move up. I dont see that reason this year to do it. There is value at #7 and somebody will be there that can help us immediately.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:10 pm
how is getting a qb in the first of a good qb group not value compared to the third qb taken, in the 3rd round even, in a very poor qb draft?
February 21st, 2014 at 3:12 pm
@Harry —
We have seen that analysis. It is statistically suspect for several reasons. For one thing, more than half of the BEST current quarterbacks fall outside the top seven. If you want a good q-back, your analysis suggests there is a 50% odds of getting one in the top seven. If you want a GREAT q-b, the odds are 70% after the top seven. Kurt Warner, for instance, was far more productive than almost any of his contemporaries.
Of course, it takes guts or more to play a later pick in place of Alex Smith — the team has so much invested already. But the results, on average,
February 21st, 2014 at 3:13 pm
Joe, do you even remember Ryan as a rookie? The happy feet under pressure?
The quickest way to solve the “pocket mobility” issue is with a stout, better OL…
Additionally, I’m willing to bet that the marching orders to ALL Buc QB’s under Schiano is “run and incur the wrath.” Freeman was definitely mobile, and even HE looked frozen in the pocket.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:13 pm
But the average return is higher on a later selection.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:13 pm
Because nobody will be there at 7. You would have to give up to much to move up to get the guy you want. That’s not value, thats a risk of gigantic proportions.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:14 pm
Simple…. They’re gonna be drafted just like past drafts. If a team needs it bad enough then they take the hit. If it works it works, if not they’re right back where they started. Buffalo, Browns, Jax, Raiders come to mind instantly. I no no part of that scenario. So yes QBs are always taken in the top 10 but not always worth it is my point. But I think you missed my point. My point was if we go that route and lose more picks, then we’re in a bigger hole then we are now. If Lovie and staff feel there’s a chance at 7 on a QB. Then I won’t argue cause that’s what they get paid to do. I just think its not wise to lose more picks on a chance. Do you at least see where I’m coming from now?
February 21st, 2014 at 3:15 pm
I think couch gets what I’m saying
February 21st, 2014 at 3:21 pm
Yup I get it Mike. I think the difference between us and them is that were not willing to take the risk this year. They want to take that risk just to take it because, we might not be in this position again.
That can work but it can also cripple our team for years if you are wrong. Sometimes you have no choice and have a choice, I don’t believe were at that point yet.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:21 pm
Sometimes you have no choice and have to go after a QB.*
February 21st, 2014 at 3:23 pm
@Lou
“…But the average return is higher on a later selection…”
I’m sorry, but that is just ridiculous
February 21st, 2014 at 3:23 pm
the risk of gigantic proportions is staying with the weakest area on the team.
also, @lou,
alex smith was injured and kaepernick got hot. having to decide whether to stay with a hot hand is a coach’s decision that is made many times throughout the year.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:26 pm
“Ridiculous” is not an argument.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:28 pm
@Couch Fan Says:
“…Yup I get it Mike. I think the difference between us and them is that were not willing to take the risk this year. They want to take that risk just to take it because, we might not be in this position again…”
Agreed. See CF, we agree on some things.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:30 pm
And I don’t see QB as our weakest area. He’s average at best but not the weakest part of our team. I’ll hit on OL/DL all day with this
February 21st, 2014 at 3:30 pm
saying “But the average return is higher on a later selection.” is not an argument either. what is your basis? just your opinion? if it is your opinion, then “ridiculous” is just as valid.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:31 pm
@Lurker —
It does happen. Brady over Bledsoe. Kaepernick over Smith. Philadelphia last year, St. Louis years ago. But it is rare, as few bench q-bs perform and fewer coaches leave them in.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:34 pm
I would say spending a third round pick and choosing the 3rd qb taken in a poor qb draft compared to high draft picks, big money free agents, and big money on players does make it our weakest area.
also, the oline and dline can be addressed in free agency this year and drafted next year. qb cannot be addressed in free agency this year or the next 2-3 years.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:35 pm
It just all depends on what a person perceives to be more of a risk. Staying with the uncertainty of Glennon, or selling the farm to get one of those top QBs who many think are more talented than Glennon. It’s a tough situation either way.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:36 pm
@Lou. Says:
“Ridiculous” is not an argument.”
No, the statement was ridiculous: “…But the average return is higher on a later selection…”
Ok, you say that the expert opinion of my analyst is “suspect”. So lets keep it out of the “argument”. Using YOUR theory that there is a “higher return on a later selection”, then why are GMs trading up to draft a QB instead of trading down? Why is there so much value in a higher draft pick? Teams don’t give away their top draft picks to trade down, do they?
That is what is ridiculous.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:38 pm
What good is a franchise QB if the line plays like ours did? Not even sticking up for Glennon here, but our line played terrible and would make it hard on any QB in that situation. Mobile QBs tend to get hurt on the account of poor pass protection not just due to the run first mentality. Offense should always start at the line. They’re responsible for our QB and RB. Without a strong line it doesn’t matter who you have
February 21st, 2014 at 3:44 pm
so a qb who can escape is less-valuable or less-needed than a pocket statue with poor oline play?
February 21st, 2014 at 3:47 pm
“Says who??? EVERY analyst, EVERY mock has at least 3 QBs going in the top 10. Where did you come up with this?”
For a long time just last year, Geno Smith was projected as #1 overall. It means absolutely nothing. Maybe it’s because they know that desperate GMs reach for QBs every year.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:47 pm
I kin of agree with you on that Andrew. I’m not sold on Glennon, but I think he has room to grow. On the other hand moving up and losing picks on a chance is beyond me. We’re all gonna debate this till FA and the draft. My only point to trading up is that none of us know if its a home run or just a lose of more talent due to lost picks. With the QBs in the draft I’m just not sold on them
February 21st, 2014 at 3:48 pm
I feel a better qb will make up for poor line play, poor receivers. heck, our receivers bailed glennon out just as much as they dropped passes. I also feel that any number of qb’s available in the draft this year have skills that glennon will just not be able to acquire e.g. escapability and accuracy.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:48 pm
Kin= kind
February 21st, 2014 at 3:49 pm
The more I hear Harry’s arguments, the more I want Jake Matthews.
and Mike gets it. This is weak QB year.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:51 pm
Next year is a deep qb class. And the bucs will have more picks to play with
February 21st, 2014 at 3:51 pm
people want to give up picks and move up for clowney, but that is not near a homerun either. I just have to believe that the lovie licht show have a plan.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:51 pm
And I agree lurker I just don’t see moving up to get one as a good idea. There are several that rate out better then Glennon that we don’t have to move up and lose for
February 21st, 2014 at 3:53 pm
And no I wouldn’t give up picks for JC either. At 7 we can grab a really good talent and lose nothing on chance
February 21st, 2014 at 3:54 pm
And Matthews is a beast! BEAST I SAID!
February 21st, 2014 at 3:55 pm
how is next year’s qb class better? none are a guarantee. Winston might stay in college again. mariota sucks and folded plenty this year. hundley?
every year something happens and people surprise. johnny football was all the rage last year, though I still think he is good. people rise and fall. next year will be new flavors.
February 21st, 2014 at 3:57 pm
I dont really want to move up for anyone this year. My personal choice is Watkins but I just dont think he’ll make it to 7. Would love to see a trade down. This is suppose to be a deep draft and were down 2 picks already.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:02 pm
@ODB
Hey buddy, I just paid you a nice compliment in another section as to your comments being intelligent. Then I come in here and read that I should ignore draft analysts, scouts, general managers who get paid millions per year and instead come in here and get advice from you, Lou and Mike as to why and when QBs get drafted where they do, huh?
Wow. Come on ODB, you are smarter than that.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:05 pm
BRING ON THE COMPETITION!!!!
WHAT? ARE YOU SCARED????
I”M NOT?????
GET OVER IT????
UNLESS THEY DRAFT A #ONE PICK, GLENNON WILL GET HIS SHOT!!
ALL OF YOU ANTI – GLENNON WIPES NEED TO CLEAN OUT YOU EARS AND QUIT SAYING THINGS THAT ARE NOT TRUE.
BRING IT ON!!!!!!!!! ….BRING IT ON!!!!! IS THAT LOUD ENOUGH FOR YOU???
February 21st, 2014 at 4:08 pm
I thought Freeman and Dominick sucked for years.
How about you?
Last year around this time, Geno Smith was slotted no. 1 overall and Ryan Nassib was a first rounder. How’d that work out?
February 21st, 2014 at 4:09 pm
i’d love Watkins too. awesome bowl game. i don’t think we should trade down, unless it is to get a qb and pick up a 2 or 3. then trade the 2 and 3 and move back into the first.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:10 pm
The Bucs could just be using the QB 7th pick as a smoke screen to get someone to want to trade picks with them so they can move down in the 1st and still get a quality pick and also pick up additional picks in the 2nd, 3rd, etc rounds.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:11 pm
So Harry, with guys they say getting drafted in the 1st are automatically good then is what you’re saying? Enlighten me cause I’m not catching on to what you’re saying. Cause my point was that teams in true dire need of a QB tend to reach which was my point why some QBs go high. I even gave teams that came to mind just over the past few years. So why would you give up picks if there’s no Luck in this draft? That would be like saying last year you wanted Smith but we lost our 1st round pick with Revis
February 21st, 2014 at 4:12 pm
but last year was a horrible qb class. what expert said it was a good year for qb’s? most said it would be 2013. and we get the 3rd qb and took him in the third round in that poor qb draft.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:13 pm
“Cause my point was that teams in true dire need of a QB tend to reach which was my point why some QBs go high.”
Bingo.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:14 pm
I would be content with that scenario
February 21st, 2014 at 4:18 pm
It could be a smoke screen, but the team that really needs a QB that’s behind us are the vikings, which is only 1 spot behind us so how much could you really get in return. Other than that its titans at 11, or the jets at 18.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:28 pm
@ODB, Mike
Mike, if you want to annoy me, put words in my mouth, that will do it. I never said anyone is “automatically good”, now did I?
Of course teams reach for QBs, and they reach for need positions. What is the most important position in the NFL? QB. Yeah, of course they reach. And Why? Best analogy I can think of is the NBA Cleveland Cavs. What was the team worth when Lebron was on it? what do you suppose it is worth now.
So yeah, teams reach. Is Teddy or Johnny the top rated player in the draft? NO, Clowney is. So why would a team draft say Teddy over Clowney? Because to be great the team needs a good QB, not Schaub, not Henne, not someone who is average; doesnt have to be great, but has to be good.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:30 pm
btw OBD, I honestly don’t recall Smith being anywhere near #1. I think you are wrong about that. I remember he was projected around 20+/-, but not in the top 10.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:30 pm
chef paul Says:
February 21st, 2014 at 2:47 pm
People that call other people suck ups for doing basically what’s expected of them are usually the losers in life that think they got passed up for a promotion cuz they didn’t kiss ass. Its the same liberal crap Obama wants every one to believe. If you got passed up you got screwed no matter how lazy you are. If out working the room is sucking up then I want suck ups to fill this roster
______________________________________________________________
Sounds like you’re engaging in ignorant stereotyping. People getting passed up is not always due to laziness on their part. If you want to criticize the President, go to a political blog.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:34 pm
ODB, update. I checked it out. I was wrong. Walterfootball had Smith at #6, I guess they did not talk with you, Mike and Lou, LOL
February 21st, 2014 at 4:40 pm
I’m just having a simple conversation here. If you think I was trying to annoy then you’re wrong. Would kinda be like me saying why the crack about where QBs fall that you hinted towards me? You asked a question I gave an answer. That’s why I simply asked you to explain what you were saying because what I understood is what I typed. It’s nothing personal, just a question. Maybe you should read the entire statement and then you wouldn’t think I was putting words in your mouth
February 21st, 2014 at 4:42 pm
First. I agree with Lovie and Joe (holy coe) that Glennon’s lack of mobility is my biggest problem with him. Stepping up or to the side can be worked on, but alluding the rush is a problem.
However, as I’ve preached, we can’t give away 2015 & 2016 1st round picks to move up 5-6 picks (ala Redskins) Is Bridgewater/Manziel a sure-thing franchise qb? No. If they don’t pan out, you are screwed for next 3-4 yrs.
Glennon deserves the shot. Draft Bridgewater/Manziel if at #7 (but they w ve gone top 3). Bring in FA as competition
February 21st, 2014 at 4:44 pm
These arguments are exhausting! Glennon will have a shot at the starting QB position regardless if they draft someone or go the FA route, if they’re smart.
If he’s smart, he’ll hone his craft
I promise you this, we will have an opening day starter! I think that’s about all that we do know!
Go Bucs!
February 21st, 2014 at 4:44 pm
Pete Prisco of CBS sports in February 19 @#1
Mel Kiper had Geno @ #4. Todd Mcshay had Ryan Nassib @# 8 in their final mocks.
No one had EJ Manuel in the first, and he was the first QB taken.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:53 pm
@Oil Derrick Brooks Says:
“…Pete Prisco of CBS sports in February 19 @#1
Mel Kiper had Geno @ #4. Todd Mcshay had Ryan Nassib @# 8 in their final mocks.
No one had EJ Manuel in the first, and he was the first QB taken.”
Hey, I said I was wrong, lol. I should also say I am a proponent of moving up in the draft for a franchise QB “IF” Lovie and Co feels there is a QB worth making this move for. NOT if Harry feels Teddy is great or Johnny. Because I am not even up to the level of the Pete Priscos, Todd Mcshays of the world. I am not like some on here that “know” so-n-so is the best thing ever; I don’t claim to “know” Maziel is the answer or anyone else. But if they are, lets go after them.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:54 pm
Ok, Mike, then we are good, no problems man.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:57 pm
@Couch Fan Says
“…Nobody is adamant that he starts.”
Actually, that’s not true. There are several people around here that insist he starts. You may not be one of them, but “nobody” covers everyone.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:58 pm
“Mike’s the first to tell you he needs to work on mobility in the pocket,” Lovie said yesterday on NFL Network
I have said this all offseason on these threads, very glad, Lovie and Licht (as seen by Joe(s) article on Licht about Glennon needing to compensate for his lack of to succeed) feel the same way lol.
February 21st, 2014 at 4:58 pm
one man’s trash is another man’s treasure…
February 21st, 2014 at 4:58 pm
beauty is in the eye of the beholder…
February 21st, 2014 at 4:59 pm
I would like to remind everyone that if the Bucs draft a quarterback at 7, that doesn’t mean Glennon will not be starting. It is a myth that a highly drafted QB always starts.
Many sit for at least part of a season, or even a full season.
And if Mike Glennon is good enough, he won’t lose his starting role.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:02 pm
Fair enough Harry. I truly wish this were that deep QB year. I guess after being tortured for 5 years after reaching for Freeman, I’m extra sensitive.
Probably the funniest thing is without seeing what Tedford has planned, we are all basically guessing (I mean more than usual).
February 21st, 2014 at 5:03 pm
lurker Says:
“I just have to believe that the lovie licht show have a plan.”
Ya think?
February 21st, 2014 at 5:09 pm
TRADE UP
Nab Bridgewater or Bortles
OR
Nab Carr later, not sold on the G kid
February 21st, 2014 at 5:11 pm
I tend to think bojim. is that a new concept to you?
February 21st, 2014 at 5:14 pm
If you were going to trade up for a QB this year, I would hope its for Manziel or Bridgewater. Bortles or Carr would make me puke.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:18 pm
of course with 2 first names maybe that is a rhetorical question.
ps that means you don’t have to answer.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:24 pm
Screw Manchild
Did not say trade up for Carr, we would actually pick him up later.
When all is said and done I believe Bortles will have proven himself in the NFL.
Just my opinion.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:25 pm
BuccaneerBonzai Says:
I would like to remind everyone that if the Bucs draft a quarterback at 7, that doesn’t mean Glennon will not be starting. It is a myth that a highly drafted QB always starts.
Many sit for at least part of a season, or even a full season.
And if Mike Glennon is good enough, he won’t lose his starting role.
________________________________________________
Again, that is BS! Don’t insult us. If they draft a 1st round QB, HE WILL START REGARDLESS, and Glennon can only look good in practice and hope to be traded, or else capitulate and hope he could get another shot someday.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:29 pm
Perhaps he will, I dont know much about him other than he’s only had 1 good season in college. So your countering a risk(by trading up) with another risk. I would rather go with Manziel Or Bridgewater. Bortles very weil could be a great pro but not worth such a high pick at this point imo.
Looks like the majority of us would be good with Bridgewater though.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:37 pm
Been saying Trade up for Bridgewater all offseason.
Tis a stretch but i think he’s one of the more solid prospects to come out since Luck.
Again just my opinion, we shyould take advantage we are in such a great position while we have the shot.
Who knows when we’ll be this high again.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:42 pm
Atlanta just threw out there that they’re not against trading up in the draft from 6. That’s straight up bait right there
February 21st, 2014 at 5:43 pm
I think Tedford can develope Jimmy “G”. He can be had in the 2nd round and wouldn’t get the automatic start, but he would provide MG8 competition. Then bring in a young veteran like Tim Tebow, who has had some recent success, and could also vie for the chance to start. and then also be content on playing a backup role. Or we could go old Lovie guy veteran Rex Grossman. Anyone but Mike “Tiny Hands” Vick. The human T.O. machine.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:45 pm
PR, you would really give away draft picks for a QB that isn’t Luck? There’s a ton of good players in this draft. Look at my earlier statement. Not trying to change minds, but what QB do you think is gonna be that great with a line that can’t block?
February 21st, 2014 at 5:47 pm
need a qb in the first. if a qb-needy team such as Cleveland, Oakland, or Jacksonville pass in round one they will pick one ahead of us in round 2. if one doesn’t fall and Watkins is gone, trade down for an extra 2 or 3 and draft carr, garopolo, whomever. use the 2nd and the extra 2nd or 3rd to move back into the first.
I believe if they wait until the second round, we will miss on the top qb’s. I don’t think McCarron has the goods and Murray is injured. hell take a qb in 1st and murray in 4th. since the glennonites think he has value, trade him…lol. but they will get no takers, not even the jets or bills.
February 21st, 2014 at 5:51 pm
I would for Bridgewater yes
February 21st, 2014 at 5:57 pm
@SAMCRO Says:
“…Again, that is BS! Don’t insult us…”
holy cow SAMCRO, easy man. Do you have your I LOVE GLENNON! undies in a bunch? A little MG8 love weggy going on?
February 21st, 2014 at 6:00 pm
@Mike
Just wanted to say maybe I was short with you and I apologize if I was. It appeared to me you were quoting me on something I didn’t say and ppl tend to do that a lot in here, so maybe I was a little sensitive about it.
February 21st, 2014 at 6:28 pm
RG III was the 2nd pick in the first round in 2012. Washington traded THREE 1st’s and a 2nd rounder to move from 6th to 2nd in that year to draft him. The first three picks were turned into 7 players for the Rams, including three defensive starters, as well as the 2nd best rookie rusher with over 800 yds. The last pick is Washington’s 2014 first round pick, which just happens to be second overall in this year’s draft. For all you who want to move up in the draft to get a “franchise” QB, it seems the best way is to trade all of your premier picks for your franchise QB, and just wait a couple of years when you are then drafting at the top. Simple really! The only problem I see is that the pick at the top of the draft now belongs to the team you were foolish enough to trade with in the first place. Sounds like a plan!
tickrdr
February 21st, 2014 at 6:33 pm
@tickrdr Says:
Thank you for offering your plan to get a franchise QB….
February 21st, 2014 at 6:35 pm
We know you wrote it… lol
And yes a potential franchise QB such as Bridgewater is worth that risk IMO
February 21st, 2014 at 6:49 pm
@Harry:
You saw my numbers from the research on ALL of the first round QB’s over the last 20 years. I’ll try to post that research on the higher drafted ( picks 1 thru 7 and overall #1’s) tonight, but the numbers are not all that great, even for those premium picks. For instance, taking ALL of the seasons played by the 13 QB’s chosen #1 overall (not just their ROOKIE seasons) in the last twenty years, there were only about 40 of 106 total seasons where the QB rating was more than MG8’s rookie season, and if you take away the 14 seasons belonging to some guy named Peyton, that doesn’t leave too many seasons for the remaining 12. The numbers are even worse for the number of seasons where the first rounder threw for as many as 19 TD’s in a full season, let alone in just thirteen games. So even if that first round qb cost just ONE first round pick the risk is quite high. What is the risk versus benefit of spending three of four premium picks to move up?
tickrdr
February 21st, 2014 at 7:03 pm
The higher the risk the greater the reward
PRBucFan
February 21st, 2014 at 7:20 pm
also, Washington was in competition. st.louis will not get that this year. also, it doesn’t have to ne the 2nd pick.
keep your research to yourself…snore…it doesn’t mean a thing. all the coaches have to do is watch his film. numbers can be skewed and misleading. 19 touchdowns in 13 games, wow. and the team still lost.
February 21st, 2014 at 7:36 pm
Your forgot to sign off Lurk
PRBucFan
February 22nd, 2014 at 1:23 am
Hey Joe…as a hypothetical, and a very possible one…if the Browns draft manziel, will you be rooting for the Browns and Manziel? You’ve already lost all cred IMO, and don’t see how say can say you wont be rooting for Manziel, and hope to have a sliver of cred left. You’ve made your position crystal clear, and I cant wait to hear your excuses…by then you will be a punchline!!!
February 22nd, 2014 at 8:46 am
Trade up?
Really?
Does anyone remember how screwed the Bucs were for several years after the trade to get Gruden?
There is a difference in trading a high pick for a proven (although hurt) Revis than a complete crap-shoot unknown…which is what the draft largely is: a crap shoot…
QB is not a position of desperation for the Bucs. There are numerous larger holes to fill.
February 22nd, 2014 at 9:57 am
the biggest hole is qb, an area of weakness at the most important position.
February 22nd, 2014 at 9:59 am
also, so you wouldn’t trade picks for a superbowl, ala gruden?
February 22nd, 2014 at 10:57 am
lurker, the pieces are not in place like when the trade for Gruden was made. And while that trade brought a SB, it also lowered the talent of the team for years.
IMO, the biggest holes on the Bucs, in order:
DE
OL
WR
TE
CB
QB
Some can be addressed in Free Agency. But the draft will be important.
I’d like to see Matt Schaub as a June 2 signing to address QB…because I think he’s history in Houston…
February 22nd, 2014 at 12:57 pm
@cobra
So nice to hear a voice of reason from the OTB!
@Harry
You know that is not my plan. I’m just pointing out how the risk of moving up does not equal the potential reward. Now I know that many are going to respond that the reward of getting a potential “franchise” QB would be worth any price. I just posted how one recent scenario worked out. But, as an example, how any of those same people sold their house in order to buy Powerball tickets? I’m not sure of the exact number, but I’ve heard that the reward could GREAT!
Tickrdr=TCN
February 22nd, 2014 at 1:42 pm
I was just pointing out that you were upset we traded for gruden… however, that trade got us a superbowl that might not have happened otherwise.
February 22nd, 2014 at 5:01 pm
I disagree
With this team all we need is the QB, the DE is coming in FA.
PRBucFan = PRF
February 22nd, 2014 at 8:30 pm
Personally I’m hoping Licht plays it if a stud defensive guy (Clowney, Mack, etc) isn’t at #7 he tries to trade a few spots back in the draft and pick up a 3rd rounder in the process. Pick up best available need in round 1 (I don’t think that is a QB, but if they believe it is then so be it) and bolster the spots we can all agree are lacking (TE, DE, etc) and maybe draft a QB in round 2 or 3 or 4 (wherever the best value ends up being). Bring in a vet (not named Mike Vick) in case the nay sayers are right and Glennon isn’t the guy. As already pointed out if Glennon tanks then you put the vet in, salvage what you can of the season, and draft a QB next year (probably a somewhat high 1st round pick if that’s the scenario that plays out). On the other hand if Glennon does well like those of us in MGM believe than we didn’t waste a pick this year on a position we didn’t need. Seems like the safest play for a 1st year GM and a coach who’s only one year removed from being fired from his HC last job (in part because he couldn’t hit it right on a QB).