Josh Freeman’s Last Stand
July 20th, 2013
Adam Schein
Popular sports radio personality Adam Schein seems to like the Bucs. He’s fond of Bucs rock star general manager Mark Dominik and admires Greg Schiano.
Quarterback Josh Freeman? Schein loves his tangibles but can’t buy in based on the last two years of Freeman’s play.
Joe vividly remembers mid-season last year, Schein stated that while Freeman may be a better quarterback, he trusted Christian Ponder more. Sure enough, shortly after Schein stated this, Freeman melted down and vanished when his team needed him the most, while Ponder, with his Vikings squad on the cusp on the playoffs, rose up with probably his best two games of the year and got his team into the postseason with solid performances against playoff teams, on the road at Texas and hosting Green Bay.
In an NFL.com column rating the most important player on each team, Schein went with Darrelle Revis over Freeman, in part, because Schein believes Freeman’s days in Tampa Bay are numbered.
Over the past two seasons, Freeman just hasn’t resembled the clutch Ben Roethlisberger clone we saw in 2010. And I think this year — a contract year — will be his last as the Bucs’ starting quarterback. I know they like rookie Mike Glennon, and rightfully so.
Despite Freeman’s yo-yo play, Tampa can win games if Revis is healthy. The Bucs’ pass defense was horrible last year; now, with Revis and Dashon Goldson on board, it can be a strength. Can Revis get back to the level he was playing at pre-injury, when he was the best corner in the NFL?
Joe can’t totally agree with Schein. Is Revis important? He sure is. But if Freeman has a repeat of last year where he tossed nine picks in his last three games (four of which came against the putrid Saints’ defense), it’s awfully hard for any team to overcome that.
Joe has stated this time and again: If Freeman has a fine season and the Bucs make the playoffs, then he will return next year. No doubt about it.
July 20th, 2013 at 12:05 pm
I’m tired of talking about if’s. Can’t wait for training camp to get here. Playoffs or bust!
July 20th, 2013 at 12:13 pm
What is this open season on freeman with the critics?
Wonder if anyone evaluates them.
Tired of hearing the BS with Josh, let him play, then the critics can comment.
Stop with the speculation and let them play.
I love to see the critics get judged about their posts. Oh if you are not right, your FIRED. Sorry writers.
July 20th, 2013 at 12:21 pm
Can’t wait for Freeman to put the critics to bed. He finally has a complete team around him. Time to get to work.
July 20th, 2013 at 12:25 pm
Look, the same can be said about all players on all team at all pro sports, if you don’t produce, your gone. Next story please. What’s happening in training camp? That’s what I want to hear about.
July 20th, 2013 at 12:34 pm
A slumping Freeman > Christian Ponder
Vikings – Adrian Peterson = 0-16
July 20th, 2013 at 1:22 pm
Journalists are going to write about current events and people in the news. And if there’s any controversy, it’s icing on the cake. Freeman is always going to be a page one topic as long as he’s a Buc. If he wins, they are going to question if this year was a fluke and can he do it again. If he loses, they will remind you that we should have seen this coming as he was a loser coming out of college.
Because we’re Buc fans, it seems like they’re picking on us, but all is fair in love and war. They’re also asking if Flacco is just another Dilfer and can he do it again; if Peyton Manning has anything left in the tank; if Brady can carry the Pats with all of their troubles; if Philip Rivers just a shell of his old self; if Romo or Stafford is worth the contracts they just got; if Matt Ryan, up next for a big contract will ever win more than 1 playoff game; if Chicago has given up on Jay Cutler; if Brees is starting to fade with 19 INTs last year; and even if golden boy Aaron Rodgers will ever get the Packers back to the promised land – and on and on and on!
You get the picture. It’s just journalism. It’s what they do. It’s what they always do. So give’em your best Bronx cheer today and wait until tomorrow, you will get to do it all over again!
July 20th, 2013 at 1:31 pm
It all starts with the reads. Freeman hasn’t been good in this department. He hasn’t sped up to the game yet. Hopefully some continuity and a boatload of talent around him will help him in that regard.
Either way, he doesn’t have to be super, just solid. And catch a little luck and not have his line decimated by injury.
July 20th, 2013 at 1:35 pm
Hopefully the rest of the team will be able to drag the D-line and JFro-6pak to the playoffs.
July 20th, 2013 at 1:47 pm
John,
The only BS is letting Freeman continue to skate as starting QB for the Bucs. It is now or never for Freeman.
The final show down, will he or won’t he?
July 20th, 2013 at 1:49 pm
Walter,
Don’t discredit Jared Allen # 69 DE for the Vikings, he might be one of the best DE’s in the league.
Ponder found a way to win games, when his team needed him most.
Has Freeman done that? Nope! Hot and cold, on and off.
Freeman has 43 TDs- 39 INTs since his 2010 season. Oh, it feels like it happened so much longer.
I hope he makes it happen this year. 5 year rebuild is about all the fans should have to endure.
July 20th, 2013 at 1:50 pm
It just seems that JF (The Sporadic Kid) is in over his head…. His body of work to this point as a whole would suggest he MIGHT be a good backup {depending on the time he is needed to step in as Qb whether he plays as good JF or bad}…. I sincerely doubt he remains a Buc after this season…
July 20th, 2013 at 1:53 pm
If Freeman plays exactly as well as he did last year, the Bucs are a 10-6 team and he gets a new contract. (That’s the Revis/Goldson effect.)
If he regresses, well…
July 20th, 2013 at 1:56 pm
Fatmosh,
^^^
Nope, we were 7-9 last year, after a 6-4 start we lost 5 straight games, before the Falcons gave us an easy win (because they had nothing to play for).
Freeman can’t throw 9 INTs down the stretch, with 4 of them against the 2nd worst pass D in the NFL last year.
Playoffs should happen this year, if they don’t, I am looking right at Freeman/Dom.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:00 pm
He had two bad games last year where he committed most of his turnovers for the year. Take AP out of the equation in Minny and Ponder never gets there. Give the Bucs a better secondary last year and Josh got us there.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:05 pm
@stevek
Lol ponder didn’t lead them anywhere.
Peterson did.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:12 pm
stevek, SHHHHHHHHHH,… PLEASE !!!!!!!
July 20th, 2013 at 2:19 pm
@SteveK
Christian Ponder final 4 games:
60/99 630 yards 4td 1 INT
Adrian Peterson final 4 games
114 att. 651yds 5 tds (4 rush, 1 rec.)
Yeah, Ponder REALLY lead that team. XD
Shut your mouth.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:20 pm
@stevek
What do you say about those elite QBs who also threw 4 and 5 ints in a game last year.
Brees 5
E.Manning 5
M.Ryan 5
Tom Brady 4
Why should you’re expectations for Josh be more than what you’d expect from these guys? C’mon lighten up. Do you think the Saint fans were calling for Brees’s head? Josh lost two games on his poor performance last year and he committed the majority of his ints in those two games for all season.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:23 pm
@stevek
What do you say about those elite QBs who also threw 4 and 5 ints in a game last year.
Brees 5
E.Manning 5
M.Ryan 5
Tom_B_rady 4
Why should you’re expectations for Josh be more than what you’d expect from these guys? C’mon lighten up. Do you think the Saint fans were calling for Brees’s head? Josh lost two games on his poor performance last year and he committed the majority of his ints in those two games for all season.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:32 pm
Walter,
Can we look at Josh Freeman’s last 3 games of the 2012 season next to Ponder?
Ponder: 4 TDs – 1 INT
Freeman 2 TDs- 9 INTs
Freeman needs to be better, better like he was in 2010.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:33 pm
@Buc’n Junkie
If Josh had ever won anything before, then those interceptions would be a lot more stomachable. Like a proven winner in those guys you are comparing him to.
Theres a big difference between winning while turning the ball over and losing while turing the ball over…. Just sayin…
July 20th, 2013 at 2:36 pm
By the way, thanks for brining stats to the argument, Walter.
Just came across this pretty little Freeman factoid:
Josh Freeman’s 39 INTs the last two years is an NFL worst over that time.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:37 pm
@Buc n Junkie
SteveK thinks Freeman has to be the best QB in the league at ALL TIMES in order to earn a new contract. Haha he thinks Manning’s and Brady’s grow on trees, and that Mike Glennon would be better because he’s “smarter.” (I don’t know how he would know whether or not Glennon is smarter than Freeman. Maybe he’s racist.)
July 20th, 2013 at 2:41 pm
Buc’nJunkie,
3 of the 4 QBs you mention have SB rings.
The only who doesn’t is Matt Ryan.
Ryan has been better than Freeman, to this point, and he has continued to get better as he has accrued more time in the league.Contrastly, Freeman peaked in 2010, and has not been as good since.
Matt Ryan was the #2 rated player in BSPN’s “Top 25 of the NFC South”. Freeman was 25th ranked.
I don’t have expectations for any other team, but my Bucs.
Freeman needs to step up, I hope he can, I just have some doubts.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:41 pm
@steveK
I’ll take 2012 Freeman over 2012 Ponder any day of the week. At least Freeman moves the ball and puts up points. Ponder isn’t even a game manager. He’s kinda useless really. Ask Vikings fans who they would rather have lol the answer is Freeman, and it’s not even close.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:43 pm
I’m a pretty big FSU fan and I was shocked when Ponder was drafted so high. I never thought he was all that good. I still don’t think he is. However once again I will say. I think this will be Freeman’s best year yet. So if I’m right then my TV might survive another year without me wanting to throw my remote through it. The past 2 years I feared for the health of my TV. Joe is right “if Freeman has a fine season and the Bucs make the playoffs, then he will return next year. No doubt about it.” You can bank on it.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:46 pm
So if Josh gets to the playoffs this year and next year he happens to throw 5 ints in a game, that’s ok? Because he’s a proven former playoff QB? So if Ponder has 2 games this year where he throws more than 4 ints in a game it’s ok? Oh yeah, he’s a proven winner. Makes a lot of sense to me. My point is that they are not all perfect, and Josh will also have bad games.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:47 pm
As far as Ryan goes. He has 3 weapons that are better than anything Freeman has to work with. Julio Jones, Roddy White, and Tony Gonzales. I’d take those 3 over Jackson, Williams, and Stocker. Not making excuses for Freeman it’s just my opinion.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:49 pm
Stevek just won’t admit that sometimes it’s not the QB that leads the team to the playoffs. He’s trying to make it seem like Ponder was the driving force behind the Vikings! Hahahaha
No one is buying that filth Stevek, no one. XD seriously, get a clue.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:50 pm
Lets get off this Freeman discussion untl there is something new….like after or during the Jets game!
How about giving it a breather?
There are so many other topics like Myron’s progress etc.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:50 pm
I also think were going to split with ATL again, split with N.O. and sweep the Panthers. Oh season please get here SOON!
July 20th, 2013 at 2:57 pm
Walter,
No sir, Ponder was not the “driving force”, but he also wasn’t the “demise of a season”.
Freeman’s inconsistent play has been tremendously hurtful to the progression of this team the past two years.
BUC1987,
Jackson, Williams, and Martin are no slouches, couple that with the one of the best O-Lines in the NFL, we got expectations.
Can our QB get it done? Remains to be seen. Less 3 and out, consistent play, and an offense that can consistently keep us in a game.
It seemed like last year, our offense, either lit the world on fire or SUCKED.
July 20th, 2013 at 2:58 pm
@Tampabaybucfan
I can’t help it, these idiots want to spread lies and filth on this thread, making crazy claims like “Ponder found a way to win when his team needed him! Has Freeman done that? No!” Even though we’ve watched Freeman lead us to 4th quarter comebacks multiple times last year, only to watch the D choke in the final moments while Freeman is on the sideline. Ponder didn’t LEAD anything, he didn’t even throw as many times as Peterson ran, or for as many yards as Peterson gained, or throw as many tds as Peterson scored in the final 4 game stretch that earned them a playoff spot, yet somehow PONDER lead the team???????? That’s a JOKE!
July 20th, 2013 at 3:09 pm
@Stevek
Lol so because Ponder didn’t have two 4int games, he wasn’t the demise of the season???
6 games under 150yds
3 games under 100yds
4 games with more Ints than TD’s
5 games with no TD’s
9 less tds than Freeman
1,100 less yards than Freeman
Only 5 less ints, only 75 less pass attempts
Bottom line, Freeman can actually lead a team to victory, Ponder can only hope to not screw a game up.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:10 pm
I see no mention of anyone saying Ponder led his team anywhere. In fact the only thing that was said is that “Ponder found a way to win when his team needed him most” which is exactly what he did….
You seem to have a bad habit of that Walter.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:13 pm
Finding a way to win = handing the ball off to Peterson. Can’t dispute that now can you?
July 20th, 2013 at 3:14 pm
@Couch Fan
That statement itself is a LIE. He never “found a way to win.”
He just handed it to AP.
I could do that.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:15 pm
Walter,
Quote me: “Ponder found a way to win when his team needed him most.”
Freeman won us 11 games out of the past 32…. 2 of those wins were “gimmees” at the end of the year, when we have nothing to play for and our divisional rival has already punched their tickets to the playoffs.
You are aware that there is a Super Bowl played each year, right? 😉
July 20th, 2013 at 3:16 pm
I’m of the opinion that the talent around him is so Elite that it is going to be very hard for Freeman to tank our season.
It would take a pretty bad version of Hyde showing up to have that kind of impact lol..
July 20th, 2013 at 3:17 pm
That’s not finding a way to win. That’s letting someone else do the work while idiots like you somehow decide that Ponder deserves credit. XD
July 20th, 2013 at 3:17 pm
Walter,
You are lying to yourself.
Ponder won more games than Freeman last year. Ponder “found a way” more often than Josh.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:18 pm
PRBucsfan,
LOL I hope you are right!
July 20th, 2013 at 3:19 pm
@Tampabaybucfan
I don’t think anybody here wants to rehash the same ol same ol about Freeman. ….but, … it just so happens to be the topic of this article.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:19 pm
Walter,
Ponder’s 2nd year as starter was last year, which yielded playoffs.
Freeman’s 2nd year as full time starter, he took us to 4-12, after a 4-2 start. We went to London that year and lost every week.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:21 pm
Coach Schiano wants a pocket passer, and Freeman is at his best improvising, rolling out of the pocket, or taking off running.
He is gun shy of any pressure, and we are a vertical passing team that requires a QB to stand tall under pressure, then unload the ball.
Schiano has him scared shitless, to be himself, and it shows.
Tampa will not be his final stop, in the NFL.
Instead of adapting the offense to Freeman’s many strengths, our control freak coach, and his yes man offensive coordinator have insisted that Freeman adapt to them.
It looks like Freeman will be another Ex Tampa QB who will go on to a less controlling coach, and maybe prosper.
LOL, it is much like Steve Young, years ago. He left Tampa, and went on to become Steve Young, in an offense that correctly utilized his talents.
I am not saying “Freeman is the Shit”, because he leaves much to be desired as an NFL QB at times.
But I think he is Gun Shy, here in Tampa, and afraid to be himself, because of Schiano.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:22 pm
@stevek …I did’nt say they were slouches, I was saying that Ryan has better weapons around him. I’m quite happy with Jackson and Williams as I’m sure many fans are. Would I make the trade str8 up for Gonzo, White and Jones for V Jax, Williams and Stocker. YES I would. Would you?
July 20th, 2013 at 3:22 pm
@Stevek
What’s your point dude? Freeman is playing on a garbage team. Lets face it, this team has been complete crap until last year, we got Josh some nice weapons in Vincent Jackson and Doug Martin, to pair with Mike Williams. Now he FINALLY, FINALLY has a respectable D (on paper), so lets see how this season goes. If we don’t make the playoffs this year, go ahead and blame Freeman, I will too. But I’m not gonna blame him for not taking a 4-12 team in 2011 to the playoffs in 2012 with a new HC, new OC, and a decimated O-Line. I’m not that crazy.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:23 pm
btw Joe posted a new article about Martin 5 minutes ago….maybe we can get off this topic for a bit and take a look.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:24 pm
@stevek
I hope I am right too :/ …
lol
July 20th, 2013 at 3:28 pm
No 1 man can take a team to the playoffs. Remember “It’s a team game”? The same excuse you all use for Freeman. Well it applies here to. Ponder may of not did much in stats to win the game… but he didnt lose the games either, which is why they went to the playoffs. It wasn’t all AP.
Now with that being said, I’d rather have Freeman. The good Freeman is much better than Ponder.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:33 pm
@Couch Fan
The good Freeman CAN win games by himself.
The good Ponder doesn’t screw the team over.
The bad Freeman throws lots of INTs
The bad Ponder is NON-EXISTENT, might as well not even suit up.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:33 pm
The one thing that we all can agree on.
This could be “Freeman’s Last Stand”
I want to win! So since, at this point, we have no choice on who gets us there. We need to suck it up and force ourselves to believe that Freeman can get it done. At some point we need to put our differences aside and rally together for the common good. No matter how much some of us are weary of this franchises commitment we can say they have lately been building something special. Even realist can’t really deny that.
July 20th, 2013 at 3:38 pm
@Buc’n Junkie
“Freeman’s Last Stand in a Bucs Uniform”
Regardless of what happens, he’s starting at QB in the NFL next year.
Heck, maybe even with the Vikings lol
July 20th, 2013 at 3:49 pm
Walter,
Starting QB doesn’t mean Playoff QB, only 12 of those each year.
Can Freeman be a Top 12 QB by season’s end?
Just win baby!
July 20th, 2013 at 3:56 pm
@Stevek
Just because a QB is in the playoffs doesn’t make him a top 12 QB. Ponder is not better than Freeman, Brees, Newton, Romo, Rivers, Roethlisberger, etc.
You’re making yourself look SOOOOO stupid.
July 20th, 2013 at 4:05 pm
@buc’n junkie.. Even realist can’t really deny that.
Oh yes he can and he does daily or have you not been paying attention?
July 20th, 2013 at 4:43 pm
He has stated many times that he thinks the Bucs are going in the wrong direction.
Every once and a while he mentions that Revis and Goldson or Martin will drag Freeman into the playoffs though. Which makes him so wishy washy.
He doesn’t like 80% of the team but yet somehow the Bucs are going to drag themselves across the finish line and into the playoffs. Wishy washy.
Then the next post will be about how the Bucs will finish 3rd in the South.
Wishy washy.
July 20th, 2013 at 4:53 pm
Freeman lacks the intelligence to be an NFL QB. The guy is STUPID!
July 20th, 2013 at 5:51 pm
That’s because everyone sits here and thinks Freeman’s stats trump all. Guess what ? Ponder played his best when his team needed him too. Freeman crumbled under that pressure.
Everyone wants to place 100% blame on the secondary. In my eyes what I saw it was both the secondary and Freeman’s inability to execute and convert. He looked down right awful the final 6 games.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:02 pm
Okay Chris….but the Eagles game I blame on Schiano and the playcalling in the final minute forty to go. It did seem like Schiano was learning as he went along in a lot of games last year.
As far as Freeman vs the Bucs secondary. I’d go with 20% Freeman 80% secondary in my eyes of course.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:25 pm
Bucfan1987 ,
Dude freeman completed 40% of his passes against one of the worst defenses in that eagles game. When I went back as watched it I counted 6 balls thrown into eagles defenders hands that were dropped. Our defense held its own to a certain point. Te offense couldn’t sustain drives or move te ball. What kick started the scoring? A muffed fumble by Philly inside the 5.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:26 pm
Granted these are nothing but the good highlights of Freeman 2012, but how can one watch this video and say get rid of this kid he sucks?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20O5gtEM_Zo
July 20th, 2013 at 7:33 pm
After watching freeman from 2012 my honest opinion , there is over a 60% chance mike glennon is our starter after the bye week. I just don’t think he’s a consistent starter. I think he’s te guy that drags our team down.
I 100% hope I’m wrong. But as an honest person , and realist ( unlike bucfan1987) I honestly cannot say freeman will be the guy that takes us to the playoffs. This is a strong contending team around the qb. This bucs team is a qb away from winning the division year after year. Freeman isn’t the answer.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:35 pm
Buc1987 Says:
July 20th, 2013 at 7:26 pm
Granted these are nothing but the good highlights of Freeman 2012, but how can one watch this video and say get rid of this kid he sucks?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20O5gtEM_Zo
Bc he looked good in 5-6 of the 16 games of the year. That’s not going to get you anywhere.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:42 pm
You are flat out WRONG! 60% chance Glennon will be the starter by the bye week. Your also a liar because you never looked at the video. Because I just got done watching it for the time I posted it, and it still was not done playing. STOP LYING! WOW you are definately getting a copy and paste for your foolish comments. I’m saving your shyte to a folder for the bye week to make you look like the fool you are. You make a post 8 minutes after I post the video. What a clown. 60% chance…ok robert I mean Chris whatver you say.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:45 pm
Your comments are so wrong there EPIC and have to be saved.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:46 pm
Oh I’ll also save my response to your foolish comments too.
July 20th, 2013 at 7:57 pm
Dude I didn’t watch the video. I actually watched the nfl 22. The video access you watch on nfl.com where you can see the full games.
What you sir posted was a you tube video composed of Freeman’s good throws highlights.
Please shut up. Their is a reason that SEVERAl analysts,scouts and former coaches have all been consistent on their scouting report on josh freeman. However you see something everyone else doesn’t.
July 20th, 2013 at 8:02 pm
Btw what position and how far did you go in football that you know so much about Freeman’s ability!? You act like we’re all freeman bashers and haters. You are 120% wrong pal. It’s called honest analysts. What we see. I don’t sit here and make excuses as to why josh played bad. Sure he was in a new offense. But so was Matt Ryan , Sam Bradford, Ben Roethlisbuerger and rookie qbs Andrew luck and Russell Wilson. They didn’t complain. They excelled.
I hope freeman proves me a d everyone else wrong. I’m a die hard buc fan. But I’m not gonna be a homer like you buc1987 and act like freeman is better. To me from watching the film of all games , Freeman’s stats were very misleading. Too many jump balls our Wrs one. Jackson and Williams bailed freeman out often winning the battles with the DBS. That doesn’t always happen. Josh didn’t anticipate well either. Couldn’t throw a wr open nor look defenders off
July 20th, 2013 at 8:09 pm
^^^ another Gem of a comment for saving!
July 20th, 2013 at 8:14 pm
Got anymore ammo to make you look like a fool for later on in the season. Anymore several expert’s analysis to go by for me? or scouts analysis for me? Please make that a 70% prediction by the bye week go ahead I mean why stop at 60% with all this analysis to back it up.
July 20th, 2013 at 8:33 pm
Ya know what I’m going to stay off this site until the season starts. Our fan base is surrounded by morons. It’s almost like a 50-50 mix now. 50% morons and 50% of fans that actually have a clue and don’t listen to all the so-called “experts”. You know those same “experts” that said in 2010 that Freeman was going to be a star. Where are they now? Oh yeah there bashing him. So were they all wrong about Freeman back then or are they wrong now? I don’t know maybe let Chris figure it all out. See everyone around September 8th.
July 20th, 2013 at 11:44 pm
OK, I skipped most of the rant. I know what most of it is. I did scan through and see Ponder’s name and laugh at anyone thinking he’s done anything to garner a win for the Vikes.
I did also look enough to see that Freeman apparently threw away our season with 9 INTs in the last 3 games. Let me correct people there first. We finished 7-9. If we had won those two 4 INT games, we’d have been 9-7. That was not good enough to make the playoffs anyway… the season was lost BEFORE those two games.
I also noticed stevek picking stats from the past two years combined to make points about Freeman. Let me say this… 2011 DID happen, we all know that, the stats were bad for him and for the rest of the team. If you actually go back and watch that season, you’ll find the defense was SO bad against the run, and we were always SO far behind in the first half, that we had no chance to win games even with a Madden Football All-star team playing. So, combining 2011 and 2012 does make Freeman look worse, but there would be questions about Mike Williams as a WR if you combine his 2011 numbers and 2012. Aqib Talib got toasted all year in 2011, looked like an undrafted rookie free agent. It’s probably best to forget 2011 and move on. That wasn’t Freeman’s fault alone and anyone putting that on his shoulders should get their own head examined.
If anyone actually thinks the Bucs have a BETTER chance of winning THIS year with ANY other available QB than Josh Freeman, I’d really like to know. Do you honestly think Glennon is the better answer for this year without having ever seen him take a snap in the NFL (by the way, they had his game against FSU on ESPNU today, and he was horrible that game until the 4th quarter when his defense really bailed him out and gave him the opportunities to win the game). Is there a FA QB available that is better than Freeman we can bring in THIS year? If not, then we’re stuck with Freeman, like him or not. We’re all gonna have to either hope for the best and hope the Bucs win WITH Freeman… or hope they lose, yank Freeman, start Glennon and maybe we can get a top 10 draft choice next year to get our next “franchise” guy.
July 20th, 2013 at 11:48 pm
@Chris
At this point “Who Cares” …he either puts it together this season or he’s a goner next year. We all get it!!
But the facts are right now: Josh Freeman is the starter
So you either root for him now, or continue to root against him.
Rooting against him is akin to saying you’re a Buc fan but secretly hoping that they lose just so you can say you were right further down the road.
I’ve put all my differences aside and I am 100% in Josh’s corner this year, for now..
July 21st, 2013 at 12:04 am
lol@ this toolbag liking Glennon.
July 21st, 2013 at 12:04 am
Chris: have you also watched the All-22 of the NCAA games and analyzed Glennon? Because he wasn’t all that good, and it’d be a stretch to see him as the starter at any point, much less a “60% chance after the bye week”.
As for your analysis of his throwing jump balls to the WR, did you also look (since you have the All-22 access) to see where the defenders were? Was there a LB underneath? A Safety over the top? Double coverage? Were all WRs covered and the only option was to throw it up and give the WR a chance to go up and get it? I’ll tell ya, I’ve also watched the games (over and over again) and a huge number of those throws the “WR bailed him out” by going up for a jump ball, it was the only place he could throw it with a chance of the ball being caught. In that sense, it was a perfect throw and a great catch.
And lastly, to the belief that these analysts actually “know anything” and that’s why they’re bashing Freeman…. these are the same guys that said Cam Newton had a chance to lead the Panthers to a Super Bowl last year (finished 7-9), that think Romo deserves his contract extension (finished 8-8, no playoffs and 2nd most INTs in the league behind Brees), and the same experts that typically had the Seahawks picked 3rd in their division AFTER the preseason when Russell Wilson did so well, typically had the Redskins as 4th in the division even with RGIII, thought the Eagles might actually win the division, etc, etc, etc. I could pull this “analysis” from every site around… NFL.com, ESPN.com, Bleacher Report, Walter Football, Pro Football Talk, etc. They all guessed, very few can even say they hit on 50% of their “analysis”/prediction.
July 21st, 2013 at 12:56 am
Man I don’t think any of you read what’s written.
1. I’m not hoping josh fails not rooting against him. I’m simply stating the facts. In 10-11 games of the season jos freeman was NOT a good qb. That 5-6 game stretch he had 17 tds ad racked up a high percentage of his yardage. The other 10 games: he combined for 10 tds to 14 INTs.
After the Carolina game we were top 5 in scoring and total offense. Not sure the exact number but might have been higher than 5. Not going to research right now. We finished the final 6 games averaging 18 pts per game.
The first 4 games our offense mustered barely 20 points a game and that’s bc we had 34 points in te giants game.
2. I’m rooting for josh to turn the corner. I’m a die hard buc fan since I started watching football. He’s got a ton of physical talent. But he just seemed confused too many times. Too hesitant. Not confident and made poor decisions. The way defenses mixed in a lot of zone disguises. What made me think he had a hard time reading defenses is he tried attacking cover 2 schemes and cover 3 schemes down the side line deep. You can’t do that. Attack the seems. Too many times you see josh neglect the other half of the field. He can’t go through reads and progressions quick enough. Won’t come off the first read. Too much tunnel vision.
His stat line read 17 INTs. But he had many balls (ie 6 dropped on the eagles game) he got away with. And I mean a lot of balls throw. Could have been even worse.
3. Everyone on here keeps saying the only bad games he had were the two 4 int games. Well that’s just not true. He looked bad against phi, no, atl,stl Denver. He had a few good moments in the finale but what should have been a runaway victory josh threw a pick that gave the falcons life in that game similar to the giants game earlier in the year.
I’m just making my predictions here. I just don’t see the confidence. Te poise. The decisiveness. And consistency. Doesn’t look defenders off not anticipates well.
The film doesn’t lie. For some reason ppl who speak the honest truth on here get bashed. I hope I’m 120% wrong. That means bucs win the divisions. But I’m not going to hold my breath either based on why I’ve seen the past 2 years.
July 21st, 2013 at 1:28 am
I don’t understand why people repeat the same things over and over and over lol
Look guys everyone is to blame on our team for our collapses these past two season and the reality of the situation is no matter how much people defend or deny Freeman has no blame or less of it he’s going to and is held liable for them.
That’s just how it is. If we succeed he’ll be given credit.
July 21st, 2013 at 2:05 am
Expert after expert after expert says the same thing. But Joe and the Freeman homers also have excuse after excuse after excuse. Let another analyst for all of you Freeman apologists to hate.
July 21st, 2013 at 2:16 am
Chris, you are wasting your time with Freeman homers like Buc1987 who has proven time and time again that she is madly in love with Freeman.
July 21st, 2013 at 2:41 am
Simple truth… can Freeman improve? yes, he can.
I’ve seen Freeman look exceptional in wins last year.
I’ve seen Freeman look average at best in wins last year.
I’ve seen Freeman look exceptional in losses last year
I’ve seen Freeman look average at best in losses last year.
I’ve seen Freeman (and the offense) put us in a position to win enough games last year to make the playoffs (Giants, Skins, Saints, Eagles, Falcons)
I’ve seen Freeman just look horrible in games that made no difference to our playoff situation (Saints, Rams)
I’ve seen him be average, but in a position to win, yet we’ve lost.
I’ve seen the team look horrible, Freeman (and the offense) come back late despite a slow start, and we’ve still lost.
Truth is, Freeman can be great and win games for the Bucs at times. Other times, we need the team to step up and win games. Sometimes the team just needs to hold the lead they’ve got. Not excuses for Freeman or the losses. Simply the truth that the team, with a lead in the 4th, should win the game and more often than not (last year) didn’t do that. That falls on the entire team, not one man. I blame that on the coaches (play-calling, conservative approach, etc), the defense (not holding a lead), the offense (not getting 1st downs to sustain drives and run out the clock).
I’ve shown time and again how the team was not that bad on 3 and outs. How many 3rd down conversions were Freeman’s success, and how many 3rd down conversions had nothing to do with him. This is not a defense of him, nor an excuse, simply the truth. I do think he needs to improve this season, I also think he has a 2nd year in the same system which should help. He has a 2nd year with mostly the same WRs which should help. The core of our O-line is returning, which should help. Our secondary is improved, which should lead to more defensive stops and help. Schiano and Co. are in their 2nd year, which should help. So, am I optimistic for this season and for Josh Freeman’s success? Yes, I am. And I believe, with good reason. He’s shown he can be the guy (more than just 6 games) and just needs a little support from the rest of his team to take it to the next level and make believers out of all the doubting fans.
July 21st, 2013 at 2:42 am
^^^^^^^look you fuking idiot, if you haven’t already figured it out by now these so called “experts” are usually wrong. they dont know a damn thing about the bucs and people stupid people like you take their word for it. whether you believe it or not we are going to be good. go ahead called me a “homer” as well, I consider that a compliment. so stfu and go root for the falcons. you wont be missed.
July 21st, 2013 at 2:43 am
that was meant for Mean D
July 21st, 2013 at 3:07 am
Im drawing the line in the sand, you are either with us or your against us. so for people like mean D, robert, and bucs realist are not on the same side of the line as the rest of us bucs fans. you arent real bucs fans and the rest of us know it. either get on board or get out.
July 21st, 2013 at 3:46 am
@j. &walter. Where did this Sh!t about racism come from. U need to leave that damn stuff off this board.
July 21st, 2013 at 6:31 am
Haha Andrew, just bc we have an opinion of what we see tells “you” we’re not true bucs fans? I think you skip over everything and everything that is posted.
Also, to sum up my opinion on Glennon: I never said he was the answer. Simply put, if your starter (Freeman ) is struggling after the bye week, if you have a viable option with the talent to become a starter (like Glennon), you turn to him. We turned to Josh in 2009.
Look, Josh has the talent to be a to 10 QB in this league. It’s between the ears that seperates him from the others. He can make jaw dropping throws one series, then you’ll go WTF is doing the next couple drives. There are times he looks like Roethlisbuerger, and others Mark Sanchez esque.
If he finds consistency, and can some how put it all together, I’d be more than satisfied. However, you look at his inconsistencies and what he does wrong, and what he’s been like as a QB for 4 years, you suddenly think, is this automatically going to be corrected in 1 off season?
Year after year, you hear the same thing, even coming out of k-state. 1. Needs to correct and work on consistent footwork. 2. Accurracy 3. Needs to go through progressions quicker. Tendency to stare down first read too often 4. Indecisive. Doesn’t anticipate well and will wait for the Wr to come open rather than throw him open.
That was the scouting report on Freeman coming into the NFL and what I’ve seen after 4 years in the league. Those are everything he needs to work on and also, get better at pre-snap reads. ALWAYS struggles against the zone coverages.
July 21st, 2013 at 6:35 am
Andrew,
you can bash the “experts” all you want. But when someone like Jaws, who’s one of the more respected qb analyst out their, says the same thing repeatedly, you and other buc fans let the homerism get in the way.
Bill Cowher has said the same thing. Is he a moron? He also said Freeman can take that next step, but needs to be more consistent.
I’d really like to hear Kurt Warner’s take on Josh Freeman. Even Jim Harbaugh, one of the better QB guru’s and scouts out there
July 21st, 2013 at 7:36 am
^^^^ all of us know Freeman’s shortfalls. We’re here we’re living it but no matter how much smart guys like you want to keep telling us the same crap over and over, the fact remains that Josh is the starting QB until Schiano says so. So until then, and it could happen after the bye, there ain’t a damn thing we can do about except put away our brilliant minds and rally behind Josh.
July 21st, 2013 at 7:45 am
^^^ Which is exactly what I am and will do. Always have been a Josh Freeman fan. Seems like a stand up guy off the field. It pains me to see him struggle on the field.
July 21st, 2013 at 3:54 pm
Chris your fine, don’t let anyone here try and make you feel as if you HAVE to believe in every single player on the team or lie about how you may feel about a certain player.
Blind support is not “fandom” either. I understand what your saying and it’s not like your bashing Free blindly either.
Like myself I want Free to be that guy, I want him to succeed for the Buccaneers sake but even with all that I just don’t trust Josh and I honestly to this point do not believe in him. I hope he finally sheds the Jekyll/Hyde act and turns the corner but I’m not “expecting” anything from him.
I however believe in our Organization and immensely so in Schiano/Dom and in what they are doing, so I still trust that we might just have a special season this year. The “team” they have put together is just so talented that we might go far places even without my belief in Freeman or even if he doesn’t have an eye popping season.
July 21st, 2013 at 11:09 pm
^^ Agreed. I’ve had my likes/dislikes in Mark Dominik. The 2010 Draft was definately one of them. I wanted them to go the route, after McCoy, to get Dunlap and Golden Tate in roudn 2, and Alterraun Verner in round 3. I actually called Mike Williams in round 4.
Enough of Dom though. I’ve likened his moves lately. I wasn’t that big of the Goldson signing because I was all over Vaccarro as a FS prospect, who I think is better than Earl Thomas. However that 1st round picked landed us Revis, so I’m content.
I think Greg Schiano is going to be a great coach in the NFL. I hope despite the end result of this season, he’s still with the Bucs. He’s got us moving in the right direction. I think it’s going to take more than 2 years to rid the entire Raheem staff and build the depth he wants. Have to remember, Schiano was hired late, so his entire scheme/staff wasn’t exactly what he wanted in terms of first choices in assistants/Scheme. This year will be more telling. However it does ride on Josh Freeman. If he’s not that franchise QB, Bucs as an organization can continue to build around the Qb position until they find one they like, whether it’s Glennon or one in the 2014 draft.