Ultimatum!
August 3rd, 2012
Bucs offensive tackle Jeremy Trueblood was forced to take a seven-figure pay cut or lose his job.
Yes, Joe likes Bucs rock star general manager Mark Dominik. This is no secret to Joe’s readers.
That, however, doesn’t make Dominik a deity. And Joe will also point out Dominik’s flubs. Don’t believe Joe? Who exactly was the first media outlet in the Tampa Bay area to raise a red flag on the signing of The Great Lumpkin, which meant Cadillac Williams would (and did) walk away?
That would be Joe. So for those who call Joe a Dominik apologist, you may want to walk away from your cocktail of choice.
The signing of The Great Lumpkin wasn’t the only head-scratcher signing last year. When offensive tackle Jeremy Trueblood, coming off a less than stellar season, was signed to a nice chunk of cash, Joe thought that was odd, too.
But it was widely believed and reported that Davin Joseph, a close friend of Trueblood’s, was willing to sign with another team if the Bucs parted ways with Trueblood. Well, Joe thought that keeping Trueblood was a whole lot better option than losing Joseph.
It seems the Bucs have since had second thoughts on Trueblood. Per Scott Reynolds of the Pewter Report, Trueblood was given an ultimatum by Bucs management just before training camp opened:
Take a $1 million dollar pay cut or hit the road.
Trueblood, writes Reynolds, took the slash in pay.
On the eve of training camp, starting right tackle Jeremy Trueblood got a call from the Buccaneers requesting that he take a $1 million pay cut or that he would be released. Trueblood is in the final year of a two-year deal that he signed last August that was worth $10 million, including a $5 million base salary in 2012.
The Bucs’ second-round pick in 2006 was actually slated to make $6 million this year because he earned an extra $1 million due to a contract escalator that kicked in due to his 2011 performance. But general manager Mark Dominik went to Trueblood and essentially forced him to take a pay cut to a $4 million base salary – but still retain the $1 million escalator – or that he would part ways with the veteran right tackle.
“It is what it is,” Trueblood said, acknowledging the pay cut. “It’s football – just part of the business of things. I’ve seen worse when you get a call the day before camp.”
In short, Trueblood is now playing for his job. Benched in 2010, Trueblood seemed to rebound last year, but let’s be honest, pass blocking is not Trueblood’s strength.
Joe expects Trueblood to have a decent year. The Bucs are expected to be a run-oriented offense, which is right up Trueblood’s alley.
If he should slip like he did in 2010, it’s a good bet 2012 will be Trueblood’s last in a Bucs uniform.
August 3rd, 2012 at 4:03 pm
Despite the first year under Rah when Trueblood had all those penalties, he has not been that bad. With that being said, I had an interesting idea. Otah was just released from the Panthers yesterday. Now I know he’s hurt and probably wouldnt be 100% for a while, if he ever is again. However if he does return to pre-injury form the guy was really good. Would it be such a bad idea to sign him and when he’s healthy put him on the right side? Or maybe switch Penn to the right and slot otah in on the Left?.. Could be an interesting idea.
August 3rd, 2012 at 4:21 pm
$4 mil…steal! LOL if you want a stiff zombie. Best thing to happen to Stiffblood is when Peppers signed with the Bears. His best block is when he gets over powered and twirled around and tries to use his back/arse to block.
I will be happy when this hack is off the Bucs.
August 3rd, 2012 at 4:22 pm
You LIKING Dom is a joke. That is kind of like saying a meth addict likes meth. You have an insatiable obsession to do anything to get you some Dom.
Calling another man a “rock star” who as accomplished any level of success in his profession is as suspect as it is adolescent. My daughters use that term to describe pop culture celebs.
Nobody gets excited when Dom comes around but you. Seen the stands lately?
The sole Lumpy example is ludicrous. You are talking about a GM who has made dozens if not hundreds of idiotic moves and you cite one disagreement with him as a basis to say that you are objective.
Just out of curiosity: how many pro bowl players has your “like” acquires? Playoffs? Wins out of 48 attempts? Number of head coaches going into season 4? Wasted Free Agent contracts? Poor draft picks?
Rock Star, Like! LMAO
August 3rd, 2012 at 4:23 pm
has not . . .
August 3rd, 2012 at 4:43 pm
Thomas 2.2, why don’t you and Dominik get a room already?
August 3rd, 2012 at 4:47 pm
Should have had a talk with Mr. Quincy Black as well.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:10 pm
Thomass
Pro-Bowlers? Do you even watch the Bucs?
Give them a friggin chance. You probablly dont know since you come across as anti-Buc but Sapp, Alsott, and Brooks went after thier third year, Ronde Barber and John Lynch thier fifth year, hell, even LeRoy Selmon didnt go til his third year. So, please shut the F up about Dom and his pro-bowlers!!!
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:14 pm
BTW:
If anyone in history deserves a pay cut it’s DomDom. If he didn’t push his coworkers under the bus, like RahRah and Hickey, so frequently he would probably be back to trading cards or Glazer honey-dos by now.
Then again, I know the Glazers and Schiano have neutered DomDom quite a bit already and that may have come with a pay cut as well. Isn’t he the lowest paid GM in quite some time anyway?
Whatever he makes is too much.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:15 pm
More appropriate question 2.2 is why do you care so much what Joe thinks about Dominik, or what he calls him? You are obsessed with what Joe thinks all the time aren’t you? Should we all have to go through you before we assign nicknames to people? You’ve got some serious issues that may require counseling.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:18 pm
Joe, you know that compared to all the rock-star’s moves. You actually brought up two of his better moves.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:20 pm
And now he pushed Raheem under the bus? The same Raheem that you have on numerous occasions called the worst coach in the history of the NFL? Now you are defending him? You just love to hate on people. Now that Raheem is gone, all of a sudden you are anti-Dominik. Funny how you never mentioned this intense hate for the guy when Raheem was coaching. So now you love Schiano, yet hate Dominik. Something tells me that anyone who pans out is going to be a result of excellent coaching by Schiano, and anyone who doesn’t is a result of a terrible GM. And of course this draft was 100% Schiano, as I’m sure the Glazers didn’t allow Dominik to do anything, trusting in a first-time NFL coach coming from college to be in complete control of an NFL draft. You need to put down the potion and come back to reality.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:22 pm
with the first pick in the 2013 nfl draft, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers select…..Jake Matthews OT Texas A&M
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:24 pm
9 Pro Bowlers from first 3 rounds of 2009 draft. Zero Bucs.
10 from the first 3 rounds of 2010 draft. Zero Bucs,
5 in the first 2 rounds last year. Zero Bucs.
Let’s look at our 2009 and 10 2nd rounders: Winslow (gone); Benn (near bust); Price (bust). Swings and misses.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:29 pm
blah, blah, blah
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:32 pm
Hawaiian:
Are you really suggesting that Dom has done a good job? Want to go back over his record.
I will never back off Rah being the worst head coach that I have ever observed. But you know it is possible for them both to stink – you know. There is no applicable rule of mutual exclusivity.
But many authorities noticed how DomDom got real quiet and began to do create some distance between him and rah during the 10 game losing streak.
Rumor has it that Dom got pressure for not knowing about red flags on Price, he blamed Hickey and a west coast scout who got canned.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:35 pm
Dom is a star because he has made several “splash” plays. Problem is he’s made some stinkers too. But like many a young star, he too is new to his position at this highest level and has a learning curve he must go through.
Now entering his fourth year he should be making less stinkers and more splash plays. Otherwise the premature criticism by the clueless across these forums will begin to hold more merit. Personally I like Dom. His pluses far outweigh his minuses to date.
Fortunately the whiner fans don’t run the team so we’ll get to see how things unfold under this new head coach. I like their chances going forward.
Go Bucs.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:35 pm
2.2 has a point.we passed up or failed to draft alot of quality players,let others walk(anderson??new england cb) for example.it all rides on this year for him.free,blount,gmc all need to live up to expectations
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:40 pm
Thomas is clueless when it comes to this pro bowl nonsense. Of course it takes time for players to develop and get to pro bowl level. As a poster, I’d have to consider Thomas a ‘bust’. He’s had plenty of time to develop and he is still showing absolutely no potential.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:44 pm
If any of you were told in January 2009 that:
After 3 years the team would be 17-31, never better than next to last in the div., ending with a 10 game losing streak, many lopsided blowouts, no draft picks clearly established, many deaft picks wasted, no pro bowlers acquired, and rebuilding with a new coaching staff again – every single one of you (except a lusty Joe who calls that rock star material lol) would have called that record a terminable failure.
Don’t lower your expectations it causes failure.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:45 pm
Thomas:
Where in anything that I wrote could you possibly gather that I suggest he has done a good job? Read it again and again, and let me know. Idiot! But if you really want to know how I feel, I feel that the jury is still out. We’ve had some injuries to some high draft picks that are completely out of his control, but at the same time do need to stay healthy for Dominik to deserve to keep his job. In the end, the success of Freeman will make or break him. If Freeman has another 2010 type season and becomes an elite QB, then our team will be successful and Dominik will be a good GM. If not, you will be right about him. I don’t really care about your stupid Pro Bowl stat. Even though I love the Pro Bowl and I go every single year, it’s nothing more than a popularity contest. I would, however,be willing to bet we get a few in this year. Hopefully the team will be busy that week (one can dream).
Obviously it’s possible they could both stink, but where was all this hate last year? You were awful quiet and Dominik. Everything was Raheem’s fault. How quickly your tune changes. And you wonder why you are the most disliked poster on this board? Really?
As for him creating distance between himself and Raheem, why would that shock anyone with a brain. When you are the boss and your employees aren’t doing their job, yet you know you can’t fire them yet, what else would you do? Would you expect him to back him up like he believes in him? I’m 100% confused by your logic on that one.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:46 pm
Don’t worry 2.2,
We drafted a pro bowler this year:
Barron, Martin, or David.
I like their odds of 1 probowl amongst the crew.
Hell, maybe “Games Missed Constantly” will be in the probowl this year? I like his chances if he can play 16 straight without landing on IR.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:48 pm
Northend:
it didn’t take over 2 dozen players from the last 3 drafts to develop into pro bowlers. Some, Eric Berry, Andy Dalton and Patrick Peterson on less than great teams.
Some in the division: like Jimmy Graham and Cam Newton.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:52 pm
A decent year in 2008 followed by a huge drop and steadily declining performance. Over the last three years, Trueblood just might be the worst RT in the league. Then again, the last three years Raheem Morris was HC and Greg Olsen was the offensive play caller. I hope it was more due to the coaching/playcalling than Trueblood because either way, he is on the team for this season.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:55 pm
I agree with you Steve on this year’s picks – but those were clearly Schiano picks.
I hope that you are right on Gerald. Schiano thinks he can develop him, maybe he can.
Hawaiian: Gru and Allen, for all of their flaws, were loyal and men who would not cave in to Glazer pressure and go cheaper to save one of their own hides. But I guess they weren’t rock stars? Most of what else you say is pretty reasonable. I agree the franchise hangs on Free, if my eye for talent is solid, I see greatness in him – but last year fractured my confidence in that.
August 3rd, 2012 at 5:55 pm
Just calling Raheem the worst head coach ever is absurd. He didn’t even make the top 10 on NFL.com’s list of worst head coaches ever. Hard to put a coach who had a 10-6 season on the list of worst coaches ever.
August 3rd, 2012 at 6:05 pm
Thomas…you can’t seriously think that Schiano called the shots at this years draft. No one could be that stupid. You don’t turn an uproven, first year HC loose on the draft and say “go for it”.
August 3rd, 2012 at 6:07 pm
Bobby,
We went 10-6 in 2010.
We received laughable opposing QB matchups.
It was a fluke.
Easy to put the 2011 coached model as “top 10 worst coaching efforts”. We gave up, plain and simple.
Matt Forte raped our D in London, and we never bounced back.
August 3rd, 2012 at 6:14 pm
2.2 my point exactly.Berry and Grahmn were two players i was thinking of.we wasted picks on benn,stocker,allen,price and the like.Claiborne is legit as is williams.I do think we scored with our top picks this year.
August 3rd, 2012 at 6:16 pm
Bobby, I bet Schiano had a say. You give that guy the power, and roll the dice when the previous model was unsuccessful.
Schiano has an eye for talent. He is a student of the game.
Let Schiano acquire talent trough his “eye”, and let Dom write paychecks. Dom is awesome at #’s and working the draft board.
August 3rd, 2012 at 6:22 pm
Mark Dominik = Rock Star .. fact
August 3rd, 2012 at 6:31 pm
Bobby:
How many NFL coaches have their team so grossly unprepared that they were down 42-0 before halftime?
Even RahRah admitted 2010 was “smoke and mirrors.” they repeatedly drew team’s with their best qb out, sometimes best 2. That created a flukey schedule and you and everyone else knows it. Plus it was sandwiched by 3-13 and 4-12. Impressive.
August 3rd, 2012 at 7:04 pm
Neil Hornsby of FootballFocus was in town today; he ended his practice report: ”Now, if there were no other options that might make sense, but a certain part-time, 6-foot-9 guy with solid grades throughout 2011 is available. Right now Demar Dotson is replacing the injured Donald Penn at LT (and doing a good job of it from what I saw in the pass protection drills), but once Penn returns why wouldn’t you let Dotson have a go at RT?” I’d say, It depends on the scheme they plan to use primarily–if a ”man” blocking method, D.D. probably lacks the power to play the spot. But his nimble feet could fit in well, run-blocking in a zone.
BTW–Hornsby said VJax had the ”…. best performance by any receiver I’ve seen to date in training camp,” after eight camps.
August 3rd, 2012 at 7:33 pm
You got to give it to him, Thomas 2.2″ is on a roll. Maybe rolling toward a cliff, but he is on a roll.
How many Monster Energy drinks can one person chug in a day. Wow, don’t go for the 5 Hour Energy next. Smoke a bowl, chill out, and let it just happen. You might just enjoy the new show, kiddo.
August 3rd, 2012 at 7:38 pm
Isn’t about time for another Gerald McCoy article? I could use a good laugh as Thomas 2.2’s head explodes for the umpteenth time.
We’re so close to the Season starting, I can taste it. Nothing is going to rain on my Parade. No Debbie Downers, Haters or Nothing. I’m freakin stoked, and still in awe that Joe got to meet Rachel Watson without injury.
August 3rd, 2012 at 8:05 pm
Only a private encounter with DomDom would cause him injury.
August 3rd, 2012 at 8:08 pm
I am thrilled for the new show, I think free, Martin and VJ, Clay, Lavonte and Barron will be good – in time. It’s the old show and the spin on those responsible that pisses me off.
Things like 17-31 rock stars. You can’t be a rock star without at least 1 hit song.
August 3rd, 2012 at 8:58 pm
Love your attitude Big Mac!!! Right there with you brother!
August 3rd, 2012 at 9:21 pm
I am so satisfied thus far with our coahing staff. They are seeing things that are reality and not talking fast sounding like a broken record. So no more playing hard, smart, and fast. Trueblood is a good 2 rated player but we can stand to improve at that position and I love that I am seeing what I have been begging for internally.
August 3rd, 2012 at 9:23 pm
I must say,I do not see whereby Dom has garnered this superstar rep; he certainly has wasted a lot of Glazer money on failures the past couple years, & he seems hell-bent on over-paying average (or worse) performers.
But that is not the topic of this thread.
August 3rd, 2012 at 9:40 pm
Dom has won them all sure, but who gives a $h!t? He is learning and getting better IMO. I personally like the Rockstar moniker and think it fits. I believe there is a certain amount of luck involved too, in drafting players. It is hard to predict the future and if Dom could hit on every pick, he’d be running for president instead of being the Bucs’ GM.
I am about the least perfect person in the world (unless I’m shooting) and I hate to criticize a person unless I have walked in his shoes. Being an NFL GM has to be an extraordinarily tough job. As much as I like to think I know, and I don’t, I could never do the job. What I do admire about The Dom is that he always keeps his chin up and maintains a positive outlook. I really think he will get us where we want to be, and we could do a lot worse than him.
Matt Millen comes to mind. he was a great player and everyone thought he would be a good GM, but he was the worst ever, and it wasn’t a lack of football knowledge. Take a look a Bruce Allen, he is pulling the same has been crap he pulled here. RGIII may be the real deal, but he gave up the farm, and all his other guys are 10 loss cast aways. I really like our chances and the past is in the past.
August 3rd, 2012 at 9:41 pm
…hasn’t won them all. LOL I swear I’m sober.
August 3rd, 2012 at 9:50 pm
now 2 thomases? to go with 2 joes. this makes sense now to get people posting on their site! this makes sense if contrived, but very sad if these 2 thomases are real.
they have to be contrived with lines like ” if my eye for talent is solid…”.
lol, a lonely poseur of a fan that thinks he has football acumen.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:00 pm
rays win for 5th shutout since july 19.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:02 pm
Joe here,
@lurker – Please don’t bring back the Joe-is-Thomas consipiracy theories. They were wonderfully dead for a while. … First, Joe has no time or desire to play wacky fan. Second, if Joe had all that time to play Thomas 2.2, Joe would just write more posts, which drive a lot more traffic than discussion.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:13 pm
Joe, can Dominick cut his salary? I know that he is one of the lowest paid GM’s n the league, but he is being way overpaid. I would love for someone to tell me what great success that was beacuse of our GM?
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:13 pm
apologies, joe. it is just hard to come to terms at times with the negativity of these people and the trolling they do. i understand the differing opinions but it is extreme with some posters.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:18 pm
I am absolutely certain that Dom was the player in this draft. Schiano even said so. Mark Barron…Dom. LaVonte David…Dom. Martin…maybe a bit of both of them but brilliant trading by Dom to acquire the ability to move back into the first round and get him. Carl Nicks and Vjax…Dom. So how was this Schiano’s draft???
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:20 pm
I find it ironic that a poster with a screen name of “lurker” calls someone else a troll, although I do agree with you. I think T2 found some Zanax and why his rant has tapered off for the evening.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:22 pm
people do not know the circumstances or situation that dominick is working under. i do not think he has been horrible. there is not one gm, nay, one person, who has not made mistakes. some decisions might be questionable, but i believe dominick and the glazers want a winning team on the field.
also, dominick has 2 pro bowlers: vincent jackson, carl nicks
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:22 pm
BigMacAttack, I recall when Dom re-upped Clayton w/out ever giving a call to Devery Henderson, who re-signed w/ the Saints for less. I myself wanted Linval Joseph instead of Price in the draft, & I am a layman.Let’s not forget Nugent & that Bills LB etc…… A GM’s JOB is correctly predicting the future regarding personnel. I want to know what Dominik has done RIGHT to have garnered this reputation. Signing Koenen last year is the best move he has made, AFAIK.The jury is still out on everyone else.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:24 pm
GO rays, I agree with bigmac no one is going to rain on my thoughts on how the bucs are going to do 11-5.
Tampaaaaaaaaa Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaay
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:24 pm
Another thing dummy 2.2 If this was Schiano’s draft then why weren’t the other drafts Raheem’s? It seems awfully convenient that the one draft you like is all of a sudden Schiano’s. Don’t forget…It was Dom that found Schiano so you should admit…Dom IS a rock star because you love Schiano. Right???
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:26 pm
Bobby, I agree with you about the Draft. I think that Shiano told Dom he wanted Goode and Tandy but that Dom made the moves and stayed true to his Draft Board. I think Dennis Hickey also plays a major role with Dom.
Hawaiian Buc, I always enjoy your rants too, and good luck finding logic in the middle of complete chaos. There may be a mathematical explanation that we keep missing.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:29 pm
@bma
via urbandictionary.com
lurker: A lurker is someone that follows the forum but doesn’t post
troll: One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument
and/or
A member of an internet forum who continually harangues and harasses others. Someone with nothing worthwhile to add to a certain conversation, but rather continually threadjacks or changes the subject, as well as thinks every member of the forum is talking about them and only them. Trolls often go by multiple names to circumvent getting banned
ps unless you were referring that i am posting at all, then it is ironic.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:33 pm
I’m just confused.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:33 pm
Mike J, I don’t totally disagree with you, but I do believe Dom is getting better. Price had excellent draft grades and was a beast in college. It is somewhat of a crap shoot and who could have predicted Tom Brady, arguably the worst athlete ever would have turned into the QB he is today.
I think Dom called the Draft, but now that they are on the field, Schiano is calling the shots about who goes and when. Not that there isn’t discussion, maybe even dissent, but I believe Dom is giving Coach all the rope and support he needs. I believe if Schiano told Dom to trade GMC tomorrow, he would do it, but that ain’t gonna happen. GMC is going to wreak havoc and collect the bounty on Drew Brees.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:44 pm
lurker, thanks for that, I was confused and am not too urban. I was looking at bongs the other day, and they’re all glass, which is okay, but they have these indentions on all sides now to keep bongwater from splashing in your mouth. The problem is they are a pain to clean, so the kid at Rocketman says “well I have cleaner you can buy to get that right out”. I said but damn that’s expensive, what happened to a 3 second burst with a waterhose on a straight tube? He said he never though about it like that and do you want to buy it? I said no because I don’t even smoke anymore, I was looking for a new hat. I guess maybe I was confusing the word “lurk”. I have heard guys called lurks that hang around when not really wanted. I do think the Troll definition was dead nuts.
August 3rd, 2012 at 10:53 pm
By the way, if Yasinskas is to be believed, the ‘ultimatum’ made Trueblood’s 5 million (this season) fully guaranteed. He really isn’t ‘playing for his job’ because now they cant just cut his ass without eating all the money.
August 3rd, 2012 at 11:03 pm
bma, hth. also, thanks for the story.
i usually lurk, reading most things, and rarely post. obviously i am posting more. perhaps i should change my name.
August 3rd, 2012 at 11:07 pm
poster…lurker
August 3rd, 2012 at 11:08 pm
>>>
August 3rd, 2012 at 11:17 pm
perhaps to dr. paul bearer!
“i’ll be lurking for youuuu”
August 4th, 2012 at 9:11 am
Lol that’s what I thought when I first read your name..I wonder who on this board even knows who Dr. Paul Bearer is. Without googling it. That.was a great flashback. Thanks.
August 4th, 2012 at 10:25 am
Joe calls me whacky fan, yet he nicknames the 17-31 GM a rock star.
I think virtually every article appearing on this blog for 3 years has been whacky.
Wasnt the proprietor trying to sway public opinion that we had a head coach that was legit and good for the franchise for3 years? Pretty damn wacky!
August 4th, 2012 at 11:53 am
thomas,
you and your drivel are whacky. this is a fan site and the proprieters show support for the team.
this is about a professional sport, arguably a kids game where men get paid ridiculous amounts of money to trash their bodies. at least in roman times the games weren’t expensive!
pro sports from top to bottom are whacky!
August 4th, 2012 at 12:19 pm
That is true lurker. I just get don’t like spin bc it causes the fan base to not recognize problems that if fixed would make the team better, I.e. replacing RahRah with Schiano, Blount with Martin, THC Jax with Barron and Benn with VJ.
August 5th, 2012 at 7:47 am
Thomas2.2 Says:
August 4th, 2012 at 10:25 am
Joe calls me whacky fan, yet he nicknames the 17-31 GM a rock star.
.
Joe should nickname you “D!ck”
😛
August 5th, 2012 at 7:55 am
I asked this before and never got an answer…but here goes again. Can you name the successful draft picks made by the last 3 Bucs GMs?
Clearly, Bruce Allen sucked at it. But it could be argued that Allen was a good GM. He got us out of cap h3ll.
So, what about McKay? How long has Dominick been a GM? 3? 4? years? What successful picks did McKay make in the same ammount of time?
I would say that Mark Dominick is nearly having the same or better success as McKay did.
August 5th, 2012 at 10:23 am
Pete, WTF?
Your almost last comment was your shortest ever, but absolutely your best ever.