Ronde Barber Not A Hall Of Famer?
October 9th, 2010
Look out. Pat Yasinskas, NFC South writer for BSPN.com, has been talking to people.
And Yasinskas is learning that his network of NFL “coaches, players and personnel people I talk to” doesn’t think Ronde Barber is a Hall of Famer.
In a mailbag offering for his Disney outfit, Yasinskas writes he personally doesn’t think Barber is Hall of Fame material, either. Heck, he’s not quite sure John Lynch gets in.
Kristen in San Diego, Calif. writes: It sounds like Chad Ochocinco respects Ronde Barber as if he was a Hall of Famer. Why don’t you think he will end up in the HOF? Personally, I think he is great.
Pat Yasinskas: I think Barber has been an excellent player for a very long time. I might be proven wrong down the road, but the coaches, players and personnel people I talk to don’t think Barber’s a Hall of Famer. They view him the same way I do, as a guy who has had a very good career in a system that was perfect for him. Besides, I think some Tampa Bay fans need to be a little more realistic in what being a Hall of Famer is really all about and how the system works. To date, the Bucs have one Hall of Famer, Lee Roy Selmon. He’ll be getting some company very soon. Derrick Brooks is a slam dunk the moment he shows up on the ballot. Warren Sapp will get in as well. That’s two guys right there from an era where the team won precisely one championship. They were not the Pittsburgh Steelers of the 1970s and that will come into play when that age of Buccaneers comes up for Hall of Fame consideration. You’re not going to see a crop of five Bucs from that time period go into the Hall of Fame. John Lynch? My guess is he’s got a chance and will probably get in after a period of time. Barber and Mike Alstott are the other two guys that some Tampa Bay fans talk about as potential Hall of Famers. I think they fall into the same category — guys with very nice careers, but not quite Hall of Famers. Should we throw Simeon Rice into the discussion, too?
As usual, Joe and Yasinskas live on different planets. The fact Yasinskas isn’t sure Lynch gets into the Hall is enough to make Joe wonder (again) what Yasinskas is doing on gamedays. Remember, this is the same guy who wrote Derrick Ward played pretty in Miami during the Bucs preseason after Ward had 12 carries for 20 yards and two fumbles.
Regarding Barber, he’s the got the numbers, the name recognition, the ring, and widespread respect. He’s no first ballot Hall of Famer, but it would be surprising if he doesn’t make it one day.
October 9th, 2010 at 9:41 am
I feel like im either the biggest homer ever, or i’m taking crazy pills. First and maybe only corner in the 500/20 club. #2 in defensive TD’s, 20/20 club, 5 pro bowls, 3 all pro, Superbowl ring, CLASS. How is he no first ballot?
October 9th, 2010 at 9:51 am
I agree! I’ll have to start with Class and add that he is the ultimate team player. Longevity, Pro Bowls, Super Bowl, NFL Records, etc….. He is the ultimate professional! The NFL should be praising players like him for not only how the represent themselves, but how they’ve represented the NFL.
October 9th, 2010 at 9:53 am
If you have to think about it, he’s not a first ballot. Simple as that.
Guys that defined an era/franchise are guys that go first ballot.
I think Barber/Lynch has a slight shot at making it one day, if you think otherwise you are a homer. Barber from a statistical standpoint and Lynch from his reputation.
Brooks was a modern day Jack Ham and Sapp was an unbelievable player and his reputation is legendary, guys like that get ingrained in people’s memories.
October 9th, 2010 at 10:11 am
He deserves it just for running that ball back on McNabb………………along with the Congressional Medal of Honor.
October 9th, 2010 at 10:22 am
If Ronde doesn’t make it (eventually) it will be a slap in the face. The guy has done a few things no other corners in the league had been able to do!
October 9th, 2010 at 10:43 am
Yasinkas is a hack
p.s.
@eric
There’s no such thing as the “Congressional Medal of Honor”. It’s just the Medal of Honor. Common mistake by people who often don’t know what they’re talking about.
October 9th, 2010 at 10:45 am
How could a guy that is the only CB in NFL history to have 25 sacks and 25 Ints not be a HoFer? He has played in every single game since 1998. Never missed a game. Not one. Has 1027 tackles, 39 Ints, 11 defensive TDs….and I’m somehow suppose to buy that none of this matters because Barber is just a system guy? The dude is 5’10” 185lbs and has managed to be a top CB every year for over a decade, and is still going strong at age 35.
Here’s a big FU Pat Yasinskas, you gutless hack.
October 9th, 2010 at 11:08 am
I find it rather annoying when a writer believes a player was good only because of the system he played. The fact is Ronde makes plays and has been extremely durable. For a CB who was excellent playing in a zone defense is somehow a negative, or he wasn’t quite as good as a CB in a 46 defense. Finally, the Bucs have did play quite a bit of man coverage during the “Tampa 2” days.
I guess Joe Montana shouldn’t be recognized as one of the greatest QBs of all-time because he only played in the West Coast offense, which was perfect for him.
October 9th, 2010 at 11:42 am
troxell8t8:
Well put.
Barber did what he was asked to do and did it quite well. What exactly is the problem with that?
Blaming a guy’s “system” is a cop out.
October 9th, 2010 at 1:00 pm
Joe- exactly right. He became perfect for the system! Lots of people played a version of the Tampa2! Mist teams struggled beacause they didn’t have a cornerback LIKE RONDE! Someone who blows up the Run, and can still shut down the passing game? Most teams WISH they had a Corner back with those diverse skills!! I think Ronde changed the posistion. After Deon Sanders, CB’s didn’t think that tackling was part of there job description. Ronde, with his blitzes and run support, absolutely changed the Cornerback profile.
October 9th, 2010 at 1:15 pm
Um….how the hell can John Lynch not get in?? He went to 9 Pro Bowls, he was a key member of one of the best defenses of the decade. He won a super bowl also. And only did he win it, him and the defense gave the Raiders a complete ass whooping!
October 9th, 2010 at 1:42 pm
As for Barber, I think when you look at the stats you see a hall of fame player. He’s the only CB in history to have at least 20 sacks and 20 ints. And pretty soon he’ll have his 40th. I think people have forgotten about Barber because of the season he had last year, but if he keeps up the great season he’s currently having right now, people will remember him again and be reminded of what a great player he is. If he could get back to the Pro Bowl again, man that would be something!
As for Simeon Rice, I think the chances of him getting in are slim. But when you look at the fact he had over 100 sacks in his career, it’s not an easy decision. Simeon Rice wasn’t with the Bucs for that long either. If he had arrived here much earlier…say in the 90’s, it probably would’ve been different. Honestly, I don’t know how he only went to 3 pro bowls in his career. 122 sacks people!!
And finally, the A-Train! I think he should definitely be in the hall of fame. I’ll explain why.
The thing that separates Alstott from other fullbacks is that he could do it all. Usually a fullback’s primary duty is to block to provide space for a running back and Alstott could do that very well. Not only that, but he became known as a punishing runner that could gain yards and level defenders downfield. And when he trucked defenders, he completely owned them!! It was fun watching him play and I think he should be a hall of famer for sure. I can’t think of any fullback’s like him. We need another Mike Alstott!
October 9th, 2010 at 3:17 pm
This all goes back to the “No Love for the Bucs” syndrome. Too many sportswriters, sportscasters and the remainder of the free world, just flat out hate the Bucs. Except Regis Philibin, I think he liked the Bucs, but it could have been a crush on Jon Gruden. This may just be a matter of unwarranted hate and not a matter of merit. Hell, even the local writers that cover the Bucs hate them. They hide it from time to time, but as soon as things start to go south, they bash them harder than the National Media who just choose to ignore them. The charge is usually lead by Martin Fennelly(Superhack) Roy Cummings(Closet Queen) and Ira Kaufman (HOF Voter/Buc Hater). The Bucs have been playing against a Stacked Deck from Day 1. That which doesn’t kill you makes you stronger.
October 9th, 2010 at 4:50 pm
Hello guys. I am an avid reader of this website. I decided to respond because I think this is a great subect of discussion. Joe I hope you create more blogs like this one. Over the next 3-7 years we are gonna be in some heated debates over which of our Bucs players should be in the Hall of Fame or not. I can’t wait actually!
Here is my initial future Buc hall of famer list:
1) Derrick Brooks
2) Mike Allstott (based on him being a full back who could also run the ball)
3) Ronde Barber (his stats go along with his big plays and longevity)
4) John Lynch (went on to play well with Denver when everyone thought he was done)
Maybe Warren Sapp… I think Warren should get in based on his ability to disrupt the offenses regardless of total sacks as a DT. I would vote Warren in.
You guys mentioned Simeon Rice. IMO by the numbers he should get in. I loved Simeon. Its too bad it had to end the way it did, because that guy averaged 12+ sacks a year!!! Completely underated Buc. The guy may have been one of the most important Bucs. He was a QB sackin Machine.
My other personal favorites, non hall of famer Bucs who deserve love:
Brian Kelly (underrated)
Shelton Quarles
Warrick Dunn
The Original Dexter Jackson
Dwight Smith
Al Singletary
Joey Galloway
Ike Hillard
Jeff Garcia
Martin Gramatica
Josh Bidwell
Notable Buc contributer both past and present who was very underrated:
Mr Steve White
October 9th, 2010 at 4:54 pm
Oh how could I forget Brad Johnson.
October 9th, 2010 at 5:24 pm
We had a top 10 defense for a decade because we had a team full of HoFers. While they might not all be first timers, Brooks, Sapp, Lynch, and Barber should all get in eventually without a doubt.
When you ask random fans from around the country to name the 5 best fullbacks of all time, Mike Alstott’s name will come up everytime. I really can’t imagine how he could be passed over either.
Simeon Rice is #16 all time with 122 sacks, plus he was rookie of the year, had three probowls, and a super bowl ring. I think he has a decent chance.
October 9th, 2010 at 5:33 pm
Can anyone name a list of CB’s that they think are for sure HoFers from the past decade or so? I think if we could look at a list and rank them we can measure how Ronde will do.
P.S. Yasinskas is always the first guy to jump on the bucs in a negative light, what a jagoff for a guy who lives(d?) in Tampa.
October 9th, 2010 at 7:11 pm
It’s too bad he has to end his career playing for that idiot Morris.
Sad.
Looking back kinda glad Brooks didn’t have to suffer through it.
October 9th, 2010 at 7:31 pm
Alstott should not even be mentioned. For everyone making a huge deal about Barber’s numbers, Alstott’s are average for a runner.
There were a ton of guys like him in NFL history. You can’t look at him as solely a Fullback, he was just a big back that played FB and was not even good at it.
JD, moot point. If the Top 5 at every position had to make it, where are the kickers? Punters? Long snappers?
October 9th, 2010 at 7:59 pm
Eric- just a memory refresher, as you are showing your age! If Gruden had not been FIRED( ah, I loooove writing that!!), Ronde said he would have retired, as GRUDEN SUCKED, and had lost the teams respect. Last year, Ronde said that Raheem Morris is a GREAT coach, and he would Retire if Raheem wasn’t retained!!! Ronde is a hall of Fame player, and Obviously one of the most intelligent! Oh, Eric, did I mention- GRUDEN SUCKED! I know you alzhimer dudes live in the past, but we WISED UP, and FIRED GRUDEN! Take yer Meds and move on
October 9th, 2010 at 8:22 pm
Captain Tim,
Actually I am sure Ronde would have benefited from participating in yet another Division Title or Super Bowl run led by Coach Gruden.
As it is no one in his own town is watching him play.
very sad indeed. Hard to make the Hall of Fame that way. Need to be part of games that mean something. People will forget the greatness he achieved with Gruden.
October 9th, 2010 at 9:06 pm
Joe, aren’t almost all HOF careers based on the scheme they are playing in? Hell peyton Manning is based on passing, 6:03:17 PM was based on LB’s and so was 55! If some one excells it’s based on the player, scheme and moment, and Barber has proved and excelled in all of them. Pat is a jacka**.
October 9th, 2010 at 9:38 pm
Tim, your shtick is getting old fast. I know you think it’s funny saying Gruden sucks, but it makes you sound like a bitter drunk that can’t let it go. STFU already.
October 9th, 2010 at 9:46 pm
Greatness- wow the Alzhimers is FULL blown! Ah, Eric, .500 is greatness! Unless you love to wallow in the Sea of MEDIOCRITY! Which, based on your never ending whining for ” The Midget Master of Mediocrity”, you certainly must. The only thing Great about that Lil guy was watching his lips tremble a’s he announced he had (FINALLY) been fired, the watching as he rolled outta one Buc Place- headed north( ahh, the memories!!). He did an Ok job letting Dungy’s team win the SuperBowl, but he let the team fall to pre Dungy era Ruin! With no Clue how to maintain a sucessful franchise. I know that neither Ronde, Nor any player he coached here, misses him or has anything good about him! Eric, your image of his is totally delusional. Cry all you want, the truth is that he was a .500 guy, who couldn’t coach young players OR Draft.
October 9th, 2010 at 9:48 pm
Delusional:
eric Says:
October 9th, 2010 at 8:22 pm
Captain Tim,
Actually I am sure Ronde would have benefited from participating in yet another Division Title or Super Bowl run led by Coach Gruden.
October 9th, 2010 at 9:53 pm
BigMac- you STFU. I’m responding to Eric’s never ending Whining about a coach we fired 2years ago! Which he’s been crying about since I started Posting here Months ago!!!! You wanna jump to Erics or Grudens defense, then you are as delusional a’s he is! Or meybe you think Gruden DIDN’T drain this team of talent??? Then you and Eric stay up tonight making up the List of all the All Pros he drafted in his 7 years here
October 9th, 2010 at 10:05 pm
@Capt.Tim
You know, Eric and others may go on and on about Gruden sometimes, but yet it seems like you’re always the first one in line to bash him. Eric didn’t mention one thing about Gruden on this thread before you made a Gruden hate comment directed towards him. I’m a Gruden fan also, but I’ll admit he wasn’t the greatest coach. My god, give the guy a break. He brought the Bucs their only SB championship and was fairly successful here in Tampa. He’s not as bad as you think he is. Enough already.
October 9th, 2010 at 10:10 pm
Division Titles 2002, 2005, 2007, and winning season 2008. Oh and a little thing called the SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONSHIP also.
Lets see Rah top THAT!
LMAO.
Oh and Gruden has had many players selected to the pro bowl, and likely a few Hall of famers too………….he made really good players great – ask Brooks.
Capt. Tim, list of Rah’s accomplishments please? LMAO.
October 9th, 2010 at 10:47 pm
People need to remember Lynch went and put up several more Pro Bowl years as a Broncos defensive leader. Without those years, he wouldn’t be a Hall of Famer I don’t think.
Rice faded too far too fast to be Hall of Fame.
I love Alstott but he wasn’t utilized very often under Gruden’s offense, and his career numbers and Pro Bowls suffer for it. He might get in but I don’t think it will be first ballot at all.
Warrick Dunn might make it at some point, even as a Veterans Committee selection. He put up a solid career over a long period, and I am sure his work outside of the game won’t hurt either.
Hate to say it but in some ways Yasinsky is right that the only surefire Hall of Famers we have coming up are Sapp and Brooks. Barber might make it in as his career numbers are pretty nice, system or not (every team has a “system”, does it not? So every player who stays on one team is a “system” player…)
October 9th, 2010 at 11:29 pm
Tim, you’re losing what little credibility you have and you sound like a drunk. And your last comment was even worse than the previous one. Wake up and quit being a hater that calls others haters. Your call bud, if you want to stick with it, go ahead but it doesn’t make sense. Gruden was good coach. Many of the draft prospect or FA signings had Bruce Allen signatures on them. Look at Allen now in Washington. His moves thus far have been eerily familiar to his M.O in Tampa. Washington is heading down the same dead end street. Was Chuckt perfect? Hell no. Did he win a superbowl? Yes. Was it luck or a fluke? No. He may have won his first with Oakland if not for the bad Brady call. To say that Gruden sucked as a coach shows a serious lack of understanding the game.
October 10th, 2010 at 1:09 am
I am not even going to touch the Gruden topic It is time to let that subject die.
I do enjoy debating Hall of Fame credentials. It is always fun to get into a debate on certain players. I hate the whole “he’s a system player” garbage that sports writers throw around. You could basically say the same thing about Joe Montana. He played most of his career in the West Coast offense. Doesn’t that make him a system player? I am certainly not going to deride Montana for that.
I think Barber should get in. He has done things that no other CB has done. He has 13 TDs, 25 sacks and 39 picks. He is also a 5-time Pro Bowler and 3-time First-Team All-Pro. All these stats are impressive and should get him in. He also has the longevity that voters look fondly at and he’s well liked. That should not be discounted because voters are humans and they can easily vote against a person just because they don’t like him. I seem to recall Zimmerman saying he would never vote for R. Moss because of the Raiders debacle (Fortunately for Moss, Zimmerman isn’t on the HOF panel anymore, but you get the point).
Brooks is a definite first ball HOF to me. No argument at all can be made against him. I also think Sapp will be a first ballot HOF. Lynch should get in as well. He was a great S for a long period of time.
S. Rice is a close call. I think voters might just see him as a pass rusher and not a complete player. And his attitude wasn’t the best, so that could hurt him. I don’t think he will get in.
M. Alstott has no shot of getting in. His numbers just aren’t good enough. He barely rushed for 5000 yards. The TDs scored are impressive, but just not good enough. Don’t get me started on the Pro Bowl and All-Pro selections. He got many of those just because he was listed as a FB. I realize he is very popular in the area. He was a very good player, but he just isn’t a HOF. I love Alstott. His running style reminded me of Csonka. Alstott was always more popular than Brooks here. It really doesn’t take a rocket scientist why this was. This issue always fascinated me.
Why do people always overlook Steve Young as a Hall of Famer for the Bucs? This ticks me off. The guy played here for 2 seasons and he was the team MVP in ’86. The Bucs can certainly claim him as a Hall of Famer.
And Randall McDaniel also played for the Bucs for 2 seasons. He started every game in those 2 seasons and he made the Pro Bowl his first year here. He is also a Bucs Hall of Famer. So Pat and other sports writers should say that the Bucs have 3 Hall of Famers.
October 10th, 2010 at 3:01 am
Barber is who he is because of Monte Kiffin….he was the one that figured out how to use him.
Last year when we did not run the “Tampa 2” he struggled, but in Nov and Dec when we switched back and Raheem (a Kiffin disciple) took over defensive play calling he was his old self again…and now we have 2 wins that don’t happen if not for him…
The guy revolutionized the way you play corner…the coner blitz has never ever been ran as effectively with any other corner ever !!
October 10th, 2010 at 5:47 am
BigMac- if Eric wants to sing Grudens praises to piss me off, or I want to point out Grudens mediocrity to piss Eric off, we will !! And have, for months on end now- like an old married Couple, this one won’t end because of outside “assistance”! But your good samaritian efforts are duly noted and appreciated!
October 10th, 2010 at 5:59 am
You are all starting ta piss me off now, teaming up on me and interrupting an on going 8 month fight!!! Eric is a lawyer, and a big boy! He doesn’t need you running ta his rescue!! If he did, he wouldn’t throw that dart at me everytime he’s bored- lmao! He and I will continue this until a)Raheem wins a SuperBowl- at which time I proclaim( loudly) victory!! Or B) Raheem is fired after achieving no success- at which point I will be subjected to anecer ending stream of “I told you so”- arrgh !! In the mean time, that Dart good fly from either direction, with predictable results! If you are really tired of reading the Gruden debate( which apparently Eric and I are not! ) try just skipping our post if you see the word “Gruden” in it. That way you’ll be spared another session!
October 10th, 2010 at 7:39 am
And just so you kids know where this fight is at, if Eric posted tomorrow that he has reconsidered, and agrees that Gruden should have been fired, I would immediately post B.S., and begin arguing what a huge mistake firing the best coach we ever had was. I would probably claim that we would be a contender this year if Gruden was still here!! Most of the time, this is about the Bucs. For a few of us, this occasionally is just the oppurtunity to keep our mental Fencing skills up ta snuff! If you read Erics post, he trolls the articles, and chums the waters, justseeing if there is someone worth arguing with! I personally doubt that he’s that enamored with Gruden- but it is the magic button on here! The rest of can lighten up:)
October 10th, 2010 at 12:56 pm
Too bad a good topic was ruined by this Gruden stuff. Gruden had really nothing to do with this. I don’t personally recall Barber saying he was going to retire if Gruden returned. Barber actually defended Gruden, so that is a bunch of hog wash.
Everyone does have good points about Gruden. He was a good coach. He does deserve credit for the SB win. But he hadn’t won a playoff game since the SB season. Those are the facts. The division titles are nice, but you have to do something with them. Gruden did lose 4 straight games in gruesome fashion. To lose to Oakland at home in unacceptable. The Bucs should have made the playoffs plain and simple. M Kiffin does deserve a lot of blame with the collapse as well. It was time for Gruden to go. The Bucs should have though hired someone a lot more experience than Rah. I will never get that.
Bruce Allen is doing some of the same things he did here in Wash. That is very clear. That was a horrible call that Oakland got that got the ball rolling for Gruden to come here. NE should have lost that game pure and simple.